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Eryxis
10-27-2011, 10:29 PM
First, full disclosure and a little background. I am a pharmacist, and business owner. I own two traditional retail pharmacies (or mom and pop stores if you wish) and they wal-mart discussion thread has made me want to seek input from those I can trust to tell me the truth. I'm going to set up my situation which is similar to virtually all other small pharmacies in the country. In certain states things may be better or worse than what I portray, but this should be fairly representative. Also, I would like to state that I'm aware that the licensing system inherently makes competition expensive and unbalanced, and I wish it would disappear- it doesn't seem likely to in the near future however, so I'm living within those limitations.

OK, the general state of this industry is that you receive ~90% of your total payment from third parties (aka Pharmacy Benefits Managers or "insurance companies") and roughly 10% comes from self-pay or cash pay customers. The easy part to deal with is the cash customers. Most pharmacies make relatively good margins on these customers even with the advent of $4.00 and free prescriptions. If everyone were paying out of pocket for their prescriptions I would not be making this post.

The interesting/tricky part for me as an an-cap living in the real world is how should these third parties be dealt with. There are 3 major companies who are PBM's (Express Scripts, Caremark/CVS, Medco) and they all have been constantly reducing our reimbursement year over year, and lately, even month over month. While the contracts that I sign with them are on the face a "voluntary" transaction, they are in reality a take it or go out of business transaction. The reason they (PBM's) are willing to do this is because they are my direct competitors, and the fewer prescriptions I fill, the more they fill. They are also in some cases restricting customers from using my pharmacy at all. To put the cherry on top of the sundae I cannot collectively bargain with other pharmacies to reject these contracts in unison as that would be unfair competition. I know this has been a bit of a stream-of-conciousness post, but the few sentences I have typed are really just the tip of the iceberg. I will attempt to flesh out the problems even more, but just wanted to get the forum's feedback. I also ask myself frequently, am I obsolete, should I be put out of business?

http://www.truthrx.org/fact-sheets/ Again, in the interest of full disclosure, this is an independent pharmacy funded website (me and my colleagues attempts to turn the tide if you will), but the information on it is factual. I also, would greatly value any suggestions you may have on how to save independent pharmacy, if deemed worthy of being saved. Which I also appreciate you challenging that assumption.

Mahkato
10-27-2011, 10:34 PM
I don't know what "PBM" means.

Eryxis
10-27-2011, 10:41 PM
OK, the general state of this industry is that you receive ~90% of your total payment from third parties (aka Pharmacy Benefits Managers or "insurance companies") and roughly 10% comes from self-pay or cash pay customers. The easy part to deal with is the cash customers. Most pharmacies make relatively good margins on these customers even with the advent of $4.00 and free prescriptions. If everyone were paying out of pocket for their prescriptions I would not be making this post.


Sorry.

legion
10-27-2011, 10:42 PM
i don't think you'll find much support for prescriptions, pharmacists, or opticians here.

these things, to me, seem like historical anachronism and exist because of our outdated medical license system. in europe these positions are almost completely eliminated, and independent pharmacists seemed make their money selling skin care products.

Eryxis
10-27-2011, 10:46 PM
I agree, our medical licensing system is a disaster. I would think they independent pharmacist in europe has disappeared probably because of economic factors associated with a single payer system? I think in a totally free market, with my education, I could provide compelling value for customers (i.e. I can keep you from killing yourself). The same is true in the current market, I am just struggling with how to get paid for it.

legion
10-27-2011, 10:53 PM
I'd take a lesson from the Europeans and start selling more patent medicines, skin cremes, "homeopathy," etc. and hope people that come in for real medicine will take some fake stuff too. We're in an economic depression, so its understandable that you are struggling. Everyone is even though there is a rosy face right now in the stock market.

Eryxis
10-27-2011, 10:57 PM
I already am legion, I'd like to say I'm doing better than the industry as a whole because I am branching out into alternate income streams. The thing that pisses me off isn't that competition is driving prices and margins down, but that giant corporations are taking advantage of me and I can't fight back because I would be "anti-competitive" by collaborating with the pharmacy down the road.

amy31416
10-27-2011, 11:00 PM
I don't know if it's legal, but can you deliver? Offer something they do not, if possible. With the population aging, I think delivery could be an interesting niche. May also want to throw in the possibility of delivering not just prescriptions, but some of the other non-prescription items you sell at the pharmacy.

Of course, there are a lot of weird issues I can think of with this off the top of my head--patient has to sign, your delivery person would have to be incredibly trustworthy--meh, maybe it's not such a great idea.

Well, in the small chance that you might be able to use the notion, I'll hit post anyways.

Best of luck--that really sucks.

Eryxis
10-27-2011, 11:02 PM
Delivery is legal, already part of our offerings. However, with margins declining the days of free delivery are gone. I appreciate the idea, and yes it is a can of worms to deliver.

RDM
10-27-2011, 11:49 PM
My best advice for you is to move to a Latin American country and open a business down there in a area with a market. Little or no regulations. For example, I can go into a farmacia in the Dominican Republic and get just about any prescription I need without a doctor prescription. Only a few high risk narcotics are regulated by a doctor's prescription. Though I don't know the profit margins, I do know medical drugs in the D.R. are about 50-70% cheaper than the states.

Eryxis
10-28-2011, 08:57 PM
I am constantly harassed by these same companies I compete against, they look for typos and insignificant errors to deny payment on legitimate prescriptions after the fact, while they send patients thousands of dollars of unwanted medicine. http://www.ncpanet.org/pdf/leg/sep11/mail_order_waste.pdf Lots of this waste is coming out of the Medicare part D program and the VA mail order program (shocker I know). Definitely looking for more input here, don't be gentle.

SisCyn
10-28-2011, 09:56 PM
Your situation sounds like the same thing that happened to our local independent pharmacy. I thought he pulled a brilliant business manuver when he sold to a large grocery chain that was one of his many national or regional chain competitors. He was hired as an employee, along with all the rest of his employess. Many of these chains offer generous sign-on bonuses for pharmacists. He is nearing retirement age and its taken a huge burden off his shoulders. It is noticeable and people have commented on the change in his demeanor.

It's been good for our small town as it saved another business from closing its doors altogether. We had already lost our only grocery store, so now the pharmacy also carries some basic groceries, since the new owners are the grocery chain. There used to be 3 grocery stores in town when I was growing up, all locally owned.

I'm really sorry, but the realty is that the days of the independent is gone. There is no way they can compete with the chains.

I know where you are coming from. I work for an independent podiatrist. The insurance companies do the same thing to us, cutting reimbursement to Medicare fee scales. Then the government imposes more regulations...such as E prescribing..that if the single doctor cannot comply with, he then gets a cut in Medicare reimbursement..which it looks like we will get. I honestly don't know how long he will be able to remain independent, either.

Eryxis
10-28-2011, 10:09 PM
Oh yeah SisCyn to add insult to injury... pharmacies get charged ~$.25 for each e-script. The companies managing escribing have such a racket set up. Oh yeah I'm 29, and left Walgreens 2 years ago. The problem is that now even Walgreens is getting squeezed by these giant companies who own their own distribution systems and control the payments. Google Walgreens/Express scripts and you'll see how bad it's getting. I know I'm being reimbursed 30-50% less than WAG now, so for them to say no to going any lower makes me KNOW i'm getting screwed. The sign on bonuses are gone now in most metro areas, btw.

frag4yourlife
10-29-2011, 06:17 AM
Is pharmacy a career-field worth getting into? I was thinking about becoming either a pharmacist like you or a pharmacologist.

Eryxis
10-29-2011, 11:30 AM
frag4yourlife
Is pharmacy a career-field worth getting into? I was thinking about becoming either a pharmacist like you or a pharmacologist.

At this point it's really hard to say yes. Just like every other career out there (and actually more than most) the government, federal, state and even local, is getting into it more and more. Currently, there is an explosion in pharmacists. There are more and more schools putting out more pharmacists, while chains are cutting back on hours. Independent pharmacies are obviously struggling as well. Unless things change significantly there will be a big labor glut (my best guess), and salaries will fall too low to pay student loans (just like most BS degrees now). I have no idea about being a pharmacologist other than you work for big pharma or the government is my best guess. With all that negative, there are still good opportunities for pharmacists to make money, it just has to be a niche market.

Steven Douglas
10-29-2011, 01:20 PM
You're kind of like the State banks of yore, all of which were all taxed out of existence so that they could not compete with the Central bank. You are over a barrel because the large insurance companies (public and private, slopping from the same quasi-monopoly cartel trough) control the actual channels of payment for a decided majority. Centralization of payments would be bad enough on its own, but this is centralization via a limited number of entities acting as a cooperative, protectionist cartel that controls the payees themselves.

I wish there was an easy answer for this. The answer is actually quite simple, but most definitely not easy, and certainly not within your power to implement. Cartelization is a form of centralization, and, like the Fed itself, the more centralized everything becomes, the worse it will get for everyone. Unless and until protectionist cartelization rampant in our entire corrupt health care industry is removed, Americans will continue to pay far, FAR more for their prescriptions and other health care needs than any other peoples on Earth. This is not because people don't have insurance, but because, among other things, insurance "insures" only that the insured are insulated from what is really being paid. People who paying nothing, or nothing more than than their premiums or co-pays, do...not...care...what else is being paid, so long as they don't have to pay those high prices themselves. There are no natural market checks and balances in place - unless we are talking about checks and balances that work against "non-cooperative" independents like yourself.

BRAINSTORMING

Let's talk at some length, hopefully there is something useful here.

If I was in your shoes, I would do something truly revolutionary, and potentially profitable in ways that no large concern could replicate.

Focus on HEALTH in general, only a SMALL amount of which would be based on actual pharmaceutical needs. Let your concern not be pharmaceuticals to sell, but rather the health and well-being needs of your customers, whatever they might be, which in many cases may be two different things entirely.

#1 - Continue to sign any and all so-called "voluntary" agreements, but don't look to any of them for your profits. That is an industry that has long been polluted and corrupted with markups upon markups, taxes upon taxes, fees upon fees, and a line of middle-men, BOTH PUBLIC AND PRIVATE, all with their filthy corrupted, non-essential and non-productive hands in the pie. And they want you to behave exactly like them, so that you can "take your fair share". The nasties. However, ALL of those agreements need to remain in place because that cartel of controlling entities really do, in an artificial but very real way, control what foot traffic comes into your store. Think that Walmart and Walgreens do any differently? They offer heavy discounts on pharmaceuticals, but only as loss leaders, just to get people to come in to buy other things.

But you have (potentially, anyway) some potent advantages - things you could get away with that no Walmart or Walgreens or Safeway could EVER pull off. Your fun, your challenge, is in waxing creative, looking at root fundamentals so that you can identify these things.

What I am about to suggest assumes that the ONLY reason you even have a pharmaceutical department stems from the fact that people need to fill prescriptions, and that your actual profits come only from the rest of your store.

For example, you could offer (and be very, VERY vocal about it, along with the reasons why) ZERO PROFIT discounts for the uninsured - anyone who is forced, for whatever reason, to pay cash for their prescriptions. It's only 10% of your business anyway, but if done properly, this could have some amazingly positive (even newsworthy) effects on other parts of your business.

#2 - As the other parts of your business do well, cut everyone's throat in the pharmaceutical industry. Take ZERO net profits, other than the minimum required for pharmacy overhead, from all your pharmaceutical sales - AND TOUT THIS FACT. Tout this in all your advertising, and in your store. Let people know up front that "We will not take a profit from an already corrupted industry". Let them know that this is a community service, as well as a loss leader to you - that you are passing ALL the savings onto them, acting as middle-man on their behalf, in exchange for the possibility that they will patronize other parts of your store. In other words, BE OPEN ABOUT IT. Very transparent in everything.

Communicate with your customers. Create extremely well done posters, in your store, on the web and elsewhere, that explain everything that is happening, both to you and your customers, in very easy to understand terms; why they pay more, how they're being screwed, etc., and what you are doing to combat it. From that you can get a lot of business.

Focus on health in general, but more than that, focus on the actual needs of your LOCAL customers. Gas is expensive, and people generally don't like having to go to a laundry list of different places for their needs. Learn what is inconvenient for your customers in that area, and become convenient to them, as you stock those things in your store. For example, don't stock hardware if there's an Ace Hardware down the street or next door. But if an Ace is more than a mile away, consider stocking hardware. Get in the habit of finding out what other errands your customers have to run that day, and specifically what things they need to get from elsewhere.

MORE BRAINSTORM

Most people long for the more romantic, nostalgic parts of yesteryear. That includes how Hollywood, Norman Rockwell and others portrayed Mom and Pop Pharmacists: the malt shop connected to "the druggist" (always in the back), with hard candies in jars on long counter. Today's stores go for the sanitized look with harsh flourescent lighting and polished white tile, with wide, brightly lit and numbered aisles (don't ever number your aisles - name them only). The druggist, now a pharmacist, wears something akin to sterilized hospital garb. You could, with your license, make the Mom & Pop druggist/malt shop/whatever-you-want a full-on community reality. An experience even. If you are not afraid of theatrics, you can romance your customer base in some very cool ways that NO larger concern could ever replicate. You are the real deal. The real Mom & Pop. The Druggist (and you could even call yourself "The Druggist").

In conclusion, don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. You can "go out of" the pharmaceutical business without going out of business, and while still providing for the pharmaceutical needs of others - which are ever-present and very real. The ONLY reason a Safeway or others want a pharmacy in their store is to allow people to "kill more birds with one driving stone" - to get more people to come into their store to buy other things; the things they really wanted to sell, for which there really is a profit. Well, what they need, you already have.

More as I think of it.

Working Poor
10-29-2011, 03:57 PM
If you went with the health theme you could make smoothies with "super foods" added and sell super foods too and herbs and homeopathic remedies (which BTW are much safer especially for babies and elderly).

You could go to the alternative Drs and therapists in your area and have them write a prescription for a smoothie and help each other advertise. When I was a child our family doctor always wrote a script for an ice cream cone.

Becker
10-29-2011, 03:59 PM
I'd take a lesson from the Europeans and start selling more patent medicines, skin cremes, "homeopathy," etc. and hope people that come in for real medicine will take some fake stuff too. We're in an economic depression, so its understandable that you are struggling. Everyone is even though there is a rosy face right now in the stock market.

homeopathy is profitable in europe?

Eryxis
10-29-2011, 07:54 PM
Thanks Steven, those are some very good ideas. A little scary, as currently 95% of my gross profit comes from the pharmacy department. One of my stores is only 1500 sq ft and the other 2600 so expanding into some of the other front end stuff could be hard. One of the niches that we're developing is compounding (turning raw bulk chemicals into usable drugs not typically available from pharma). I've kicked around the idea of doing the Naturopathic Doctor thing and blending the two together. I have a colleague who is promoting his business by filling all cash prescriptions at cost + $15 for a month's supply (which is a small net profit price, but the transparency and how you embarass wal-mart and others is priceless).

amy31416
10-29-2011, 09:57 PM
+rep Steven. I like the way you're thinking on this.

Working Poor
10-30-2011, 01:52 AM
homeopathy is profitable in europe?


Europe is much more into natural healing than the uSa. They have homeopathic hospitals over there.

I use homeopathic remedies as my first approach to anytime I feel ill. The 12 "tissue salts" are an essential part of my medicine cabinet supply. I have considered becoming a homeopathic doctor. just need to get the money together for the course.

Homeopathy was developed by a German doctor. It is good stuff of course the AMA and the FDA have done as many dirty deeds on homeopathy as they can and are still working against it.

You also might want to take note that Ron strongly supports all natural healing and food and stands up against assaults on the industry. Which is one reason he wants to cut the FDA.

Here is a video where Ron makes several statements through out

http://www.winhs.org/media/media20070610.htm

MJU1983
10-30-2011, 02:04 AM
Where are you located? Are you near any hospitals or clinics?

I know there is A LOT of money in speciality HIV/AIDS pharmacies. Also, if you have a desirable location/business, I hear that big companies such as Walgreens will pay top dollar for your pharmacy. ;)

MJU1983
10-30-2011, 02:07 AM
If you haven't seen this, it's worth a watch...

Simon Sinek: How great leaders inspire action:
http://www.ted.com/talks/simon_sinek_how_great_leaders_inspire_action.html

Eryxis
10-30-2011, 09:00 AM
That is a great video. Makes me think, thank you.

donnay
10-30-2011, 10:02 AM
Second that +rep @Steven. Impressive!

Eryxis
10-30-2011, 10:45 AM
I know there is A LOT of money in speciality HIV/AIDS pharmacies.

Yes, and those companies I mentioned that control pharmacy benefits (Caremark, Express Scripts, Medco) realize this and are not allowing ANYONE but their self-owned "specialty" pharmacies to participate in providing those drugs.

Travlyr
10-30-2011, 11:05 AM
A lot of people are in the same boat. For some silly reason, I started out in the housing business. That's gone corporate. So I went into the real estate business. Country Wide Home Mortgage sent one of their vice presidents to a "free seminar" to tell us that they were broke and could no longer fund our buyers. That's gone.

Until we get honest sound money back into society as prescribed by Dr. Ron Paul, we'll have to deal with corporatism, their controls, and disappearing Mom & Pop Shops.

kpitcher
10-30-2011, 11:58 AM
Having been to the pharamacy far too much for a few sick family members it's struck me that things are godawful expensive. Now a few times the doctor knew what insurance we had (I'm in Michigan, blue cross is the defacto here, basically a monopoly) and prescribed differently because of what was or was not covered as well. Not so much generic vs label, more of similar drug vs another one. I don't know if there was any way you could expand on that, saving money is always helpful.

On a similar topic, I despise how insurance works. I had surgery and you get a bill from the hospital, another from the surgeon, another from the anesthesiologist, etc. Or my mother has had ongoing chemo treatments and it's amazing how often co-pays are forgotten about at the hospital. It'd seem like some insurance that made everything a one stop payment place - acting like a general contractor if you will - would be wonderful. Or is it just that I'm in Michigan with a monopoly on insurance so the consumer friendly stuff doesn't exist?

Eryxis
10-30-2011, 08:08 PM
Having been to the pharamacy far too much for a few sick family members it's struck me that things are godawful expensive.

Yes, and virtually all the money is going to Pharma.

KCIndy
10-30-2011, 11:30 PM
Eryxis,

How difficult would it be for you to find and order niche or hard to find products for your customers? In other words, if someone is looking for a particular brand of multi-vitamins, for instance, and can't find them in any other local store, would it be possible for you to look them up and order them on request? I know that would be a lot of work, but you might be able to establish yourself as the "go-to" store for folks who are looking for a particular hard to find product. This could be a real big selling point, especially for older folks who aren't comfortable looking things up on the internet and ordering online.

Also, are you licensed to do compounding? Have you explored any options in the area of customized formulas?

amy31416
10-30-2011, 11:35 PM
I have to wonder how much more the government will squeeze people before they'll start going the "Breaking Bad" route in significant numbers.

Eryxis
10-31-2011, 12:13 AM
Compounding is the only bright spot in independent pharmacy, but it's going down the same road of being controlled by the insurance companies. The special order deal is hit or miss. Most things that are hard to find are that way because they aren't made at all now.

Eryxis
10-31-2011, 12:22 AM
Going the "breaking bad" route ends in lots of jail time.

donnay
10-31-2011, 09:11 AM
Here is a good interview with a Pharmacist who went off the beaten path and used his knowledge to help people. In all honesty, Pharmacist know more than the average doctors out there!

Pharmacist Ben Fuchs: Disengaging from the Machine, The State Run Monster - 1/3


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAsMl5vXihw


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmynu8KgSMY&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbosCK0y4L4&feature=related

amaimbourg
10-31-2011, 06:01 PM
First, full disclosure and a little background. I am a pharmacist, and business owner. I own two traditional retail pharmacies (or mom and pop stores if you wish) and they wal-mart discussion thread has made me want to seek input from those I can trust to tell me the truth. I'm going to set up my situation which is similar to virtually all other small pharmacies in the country. In certain states things may be better or worse than what I portray, but this should be fairly representative. Also, I would like to state that I'm aware that the licensing system inherently makes competition expensive and unbalanced, and I wish it would disappear- it doesn't seem likely to in the near future however, so I'm living within those limitations.

OK, the general state of this industry is that you receive ~90% of your total payment from third parties (aka Pharmacy Benefits Managers or "insurance companies") and roughly 10% comes from self-pay or cash pay customers. The easy part to deal with is the cash customers. Most pharmacies make relatively good margins on these customers even with the advent of $4.00 and free prescriptions. If everyone were paying out of pocket for their prescriptions I would not be making this post.

The interesting/tricky part for me as an an-cap living in the real world is how should these third parties be dealt with. There are 3 major companies who are PBM's (Express Scripts, Caremark/CVS, Medco) and they all have been constantly reducing our reimbursement year over year, and lately, even month over month. While the contracts that I sign with them are on the face a "voluntary" transaction, they are in reality a take it or go out of business transaction. The reason they (PBM's) are willing to do this is because they are my direct competitors, and the fewer prescriptions I fill, the more they fill. They are also in some cases restricting customers from using my pharmacy at all. To put the cherry on top of the sundae I cannot collectively bargain with other pharmacies to reject these contracts in unison as that would be unfair competition. I know this has been a bit of a stream-of-conciousness post, but the few sentences I have typed are really just the tip of the iceberg. I will attempt to flesh out the problems even more, but just wanted to get the forum's feedback. I also ask myself frequently, am I obsolete, should I be put out of business?

http://www.truthrx.org/fact-sheets/ Again, in the interest of full disclosure, this is an independent pharmacy funded website (me and my colleagues attempts to turn the tide if you will), but the information on it is factual. I also, would greatly value any suggestions you may have on how to save independent pharmacy, if deemed worthy of being saved. Which I also appreciate you challenging that assumption.

Please don't take this the wrong way,, but, I would highly suggest you get a degree in natural supplements and change your stores to just that. It's one of the fastest growing businesses out there and people are just getting way too educated on the TOTAL DANGERS of prescription medications. You would be doing yourself and your community a HUGE life-saving favor.

enoch150
10-31-2011, 06:54 PM
I cannot collectively bargain with other pharmacies to reject these contracts in unison as that would be unfair competition.

Unionize, then hope the government tries to break it up. Get the ACLU to defend you, claiming your civil rights were violated (freedom of association or whatever) and profit at taxpayer expense.

Eryxis
10-31-2011, 07:28 PM
Please don't take this the wrong way,, but, I would highly suggest you get a degree in natural supplements and change your stores to just that. It's one of the fastest growing businesses out there and people are just getting way too educated on the TOTAL DANGERS of prescription medications. You would be doing yourself and your community a HUGE life-saving favor.

It is already in the works. I don't know if I will get the actual degree (pharmacists are actually educated reasonably well on supplements), but I am actively enhancing my natural lines. I have some phenomenal products that I'm working on converting people to. Also, virtually all people taking pharmaceuticals need to supplement to reduce or prevent side effects.

Eryxis
10-31-2011, 07:29 PM
@ amaimbourg would you have any recommendations on where to enhance my knowledge on those subjects.

asurfaholic
10-31-2011, 07:31 PM
This is probably not what you want to hear, but I know a guy who was in the exact position you are in. He for most of his life ran a successful pharmacy, and kept finding the competition bearing down on him more and more. He decided just to sell his business to CVS and take a high level position after they repeatedly pressured him to sell out or get put out of business....

He was making $90 an hour, working his own schedule and enjoying himself the last time I talked to him.

Eryxis
10-31-2011, 07:37 PM
I'm 29, not gonna work for the man for 30 years.

donnay
11-01-2011, 07:23 AM
Eryxis,

I am sure you are well aware of Codex Alimentarius then?

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul261.html


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ko3-sbUQPTU&feature=player_embedded

Krugerrand
11-01-2011, 07:40 AM
Thanks Steven, those are some very good ideas. A little scary, as currently 95% of my gross profit comes from the pharmacy department. One of my stores is only 1500 sq ft and the other 2600 so expanding into some of the other front end stuff could be hard. One of the niches that we're developing is compounding (turning raw bulk chemicals into usable drugs not typically available from pharma). I've kicked around the idea of doing the Naturopathic Doctor thing and blending the two together. I have a colleague who is promoting his business by filling all cash prescriptions at cost + $15 for a month's supply (which is a small net profit price, but the transparency and how you embarass wal-mart and others is priceless).

My dad was a pharmacist and owned a number of such small stores in the 60's. He was able to keep his business going by getting established business from nursing homes (the free delivery was big for them). He ended up selling to a a younger more entrepreneurial pharmacist in the late 80's. By this time, most of the small drug stores had been bought out by the chains. The new buyer kept things going by doing the compounding thing. He too got bought out, but for huge money.

State lottery, cigarettes, and a Slush Puppy machine added some steady cash flow.

Eryxis
11-01-2011, 08:11 AM
Vaguely familiar with it (codex), to date it has not been a big concern of mine.

Working Poor
11-01-2011, 08:41 AM
I think one of Ron's greatest strengths is in how he stands up for food and medical freedom. The FDA is crony capitzalism to the max. He is right it is dangerous to our health.

donnay
11-01-2011, 09:11 AM
Vaguely familiar with it (codex), to date it has not been a big concern of mine.

You know, that is the same response I got from a friend who is a physical therapists who is an advocate of natural/holistic/alternative meds, and she basically shrugged it off too. With the Food Safety Bill the U.S. became Codex-compliant in December 2009. It should concern people more, it is tyranny any way you slice it. As with every bit of tyranny that has been shoved down our throats, it has been done incrementally, so the pain of it doesn't hurt quite so bad. As a pharmacists I would think it would behoove you to get better acquainted with this tyranny, and you may think it doesn't matter on your end, but ultimately it will.

If you choose to go into the supplemental end of the business your going to be controlled just as bad as the pHARMaceutical control. There are lots of doctors who are against this codex-compliance because it dictates to the people what they can and cannot have. Most pharmacists that I have talked to know more about diet and nutrition then many doctors know. I was hoping that you were one them.


First they came for the Jews and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for the Communists and I did not speak out because I was not a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for me and there was no one left to speak out for me.

~Pastor Niemoller

Eryxis
11-01-2011, 09:24 AM
Don't get me wrong Donnay, I'm BECOMING one of them. It is definitely not taught thoroughly to us in school. I have sort of stumbled into the information professionally (random presenters at conferences I have been to) and then from RPF I have really seen how the control of Pharma has ruined/is ruining my profession. That's why I have said "to date". I'm definitely looking into it and this is an area where I am working to grow my knowledge. Obviously, there is some crock medicine out there, and there is a lot of stuff that pharma wants you to think is a crock. I'm working on discerning which is which. Any references are great, and the more scholarly they are the better. I feel that one thing pharmacy school did teach me is how to spot bullshit studies that don't really prove anything, the downside is it's god awful time consuming and eats a LOT of brain power.

Krugerrand
11-01-2011, 09:26 AM
Don't get me wrong Donnay, I'm BECOMING one of them. It is definitely not taught thoroughly to us in school. I have sort of stumbled into the information professionally (random presenters at conferences I have been to) and then from RPF I have really seen how the control of Pharma has ruined/is ruining my profession. That's why I have said "to date". I'm definitely looking into it and this is an area where I am working to grow my knowledge. Obviously, there is some crock medicine out there, and there is a lot of stuff that pharma wants you to think is a crock. I'm working on discerning which is which. Any references are great, and the more scholarly they are the better. I feel that one thing pharmacy school did teach me is how to spot bullshit studies that don't really prove anything, the downside is it's god awful time consuming and eats a LOT of brain power.

Please chime in on the vaccine related threads as they pop up. I'll be curious to hear your perspective.

LiveFree79
11-01-2011, 11:17 AM
These little mom and pop pharmacy shops are popping up everywhere in my area. And it's hilarious.............they are all run by Asians and they are right next to donut shops that are also run by Asians but have names like "Scott's" Donut's, or "Mike's" Donuts. LMAO! I will tell you one thing............the American people are getting screwed by what they pay for drugs. Even pharmacies are getting ass f'd by the US wholesalers. I will give you a perfect example. I can get Humatrope human growth hormone 36IU cartridges for $245 from a foreign wholesaler. I called my mom and pop pharmacy to get a price. $900!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LMAO! It was the same Lilly/Pfizer brand, forget who makes it. SAME QUALITY SAME DRUG ETC! The pharmacist was shell shocked to say the least. Then I told her where I get it from.......mind you this a country that is a modern country i.e. part of the EU and has the same standards as any developed country......................she went on her soapbox about how we have the FDA to protect us etc. etc. And it's dangerous buying drugs from foreign countries. LMAO! Americans don't even know how their government screws them over. They think they live under capitalism. Bullshit! The FDA along with our trade laws is controlling the entire pharmaceutical industry..

With my connections if I were a pharmacist I would be under cutting every damn CVS on the corner. It wouldn't be legal but hey..........what is nowadays. :)

Seraphim
11-01-2011, 12:18 PM
Someone posted a video about a DOCTOR who opened up a clinic and began REFUSING all non cash/upfront payments.

She shut down all acceptance of medicare/medicade etc.

The lack of paperwork etc freed up so much time for her that her customers pay much less out of pocket...She stated she was MUCH happier as a person and her patients benefit most from that.

I'd suggest looking into being a pharmacy that operates similarly...Accept patients who pay out of pocket.

Eryxis
11-01-2011, 07:17 PM
The problem with pharmacies is a fixed cost of goods, it's just too high, anywhere from 70-80% of revenue.

Aden
11-01-2011, 09:16 PM
I'm 29, not gonna work for the man for 30 years.

Eryxis,

If you did sell your two businesses, and paid off any debt you owe, would you have a nice stash left over? If so, you could "work for the man" and in your free time work on starting another business. What if you sold out to the big guys and used your money to start a natural food store? In every town I've lived in, whether big or small, local natural food stores do awesome. You would bring a unique experience to it too since you are well versed in the enemy's ways.

Eryxis
11-01-2011, 09:20 PM
No unfortunately, I've only been in business for 2-3 years and I'm now to the point that if I sold it then it would be worth all my time that I put into and then a little more.

Aden
11-02-2011, 09:43 PM
While driving back home from church tonight, I brought this thread up to my wife. She said that a nice niche is compounding for vets. If nobody in your area does this, you could make money doing it for all the vets. http://www.aapsj.org/view.asp?art=aapsj070229

romacox
11-03-2011, 07:37 AM
What small business owners are going through now, is exactly what farmers and ranchers experienced over 20 years ago. They warned us then that if we did not support them, we would become dependent on foreign Countries and large conglomerates to feed us, and it has come to pass. We also experience more problems with contaminated foods.

Now we face this Country becoming dependent on large conglomerates and the government providing just about everything including employment. If we do not stand with small business owners now, it will come to pass.

devil21
11-03-2011, 01:59 PM
Are you in a state with medical marijuana laws? If so, you might want to "expand" your medicinal offerings *ahem*.

Eryxis
11-03-2011, 09:29 PM
Alabama, soooo we'll be pone of the last states. However, I will be at the front of that trend.

kpitcher
11-03-2011, 09:55 PM
I know you had mentioned you offer other alternatives, here's something that happened this week that made me think of this thread. My mom is undergoing chemo treatment for ovarian cancer (going on 3 years now). She has some nueropathy in her hands, some pain. Her chemo doc, who's been doing this for decades through the local cancer center, suggested glutamine in a powder form. Went to the local rite-aid - the only pharmacies here left are chain - and of course they didn't have any. Called my chiropractor up as they carry a variety of suppliments. They had none in stock but will pick it up tomorrow from them. Just an example of failures of a local chain store that may help you.

With that said all the mom-pop stores VS megacorp chain stores is rough, no matter the industry.

Arklatex
11-04-2011, 12:24 AM
Have you considered rioting?

This is a microcosm of our entire reality. The only solution is major change.

I believe the future lies in what is right. I also believe that the cure to every disease and has been known since ancient times by a few. For instance vibration, sound will be the medicine of the future. Holistic medicine is good. Sustainable farming will be the future. It has to be.

Become independent. What do you need money for besides for paying taxes? I'd sell, use the funds to buy land and build greenhouses. Grow organic food and medicine year around. Then once the system changes over and tons of people go to jail, you'll be ready to lead.

Don't give up hope. You'll prevail someway. I think you're doing a good think by voicing yourself. Know though that its not just your industry, but EVERY industry. Our entire economy. We have had the wool pooled over our eyes. It's time for a revolution.