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SchleckBros
10-19-2011, 10:48 PM
Herman Cain is PRO-CHOICE


No, it comes down to is, it’s not the government’s role — or anybody else’s role — to make that decision... So what I’m saying is, it ultimately gets down to a choice that that family or that mother has to make. Not me as president. Not some politician. Not a bureaucrat. It gets down to that family. And whatever they decide, they decide. I shouldn’t try to tell them what decision to make for such a sensitive decision.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/herman-cain-tells-piers-morgan-that-he-is-anti-abortion-yet-pro-choice/

zHorns
10-19-2011, 10:49 PM
OMG

He destroyed himself!

moderate libertarian
10-19-2011, 10:50 PM
So soon?

I was hoping he would be around bit longer to expose neonuts under GOP flag.

sailingaway
10-19-2011, 10:51 PM
If that was from the Stossel interview, it was the most amazing thing. He went back and forth two or three times like he was deciding if he should be pro-life or pro-choice by the audience reaction. The video clip is in Opposing Candidates.

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 10:51 PM
this whole presidential thing was just an audition for Fox. but people took him too seriously! so cain said stop and used the abortion issue to end his political career. i'm sure he'll now have his chance at Fox.

Maximus
10-19-2011, 10:52 PM
Already shared on a Catholic forum. This is huge.

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 10:53 PM
Already shared on a Catholic forum. This is huge.

already on major conservative sites. cain's campaign is already over.

nbhadja
10-19-2011, 10:54 PM
Someone with a hannity forums account post it there.

sailingaway
10-19-2011, 10:55 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSGLBAinETc&feature=player_embedded#!

here it is.... enjoy....

Sola_Fide
10-19-2011, 10:55 PM
Wow. Is this as big as it sounds? Cain is absolutely done if this is what it looks like.

kill the banks
10-19-2011, 10:55 PM
I'm not running for president ~ I was just joking

freeforall
10-19-2011, 10:56 PM
Is he trying to take Paul's position in some weird and twisted way?

Havax
10-19-2011, 10:56 PM
We need to spread this everywhere. Drudge it.

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 10:57 PM
Wow. Is this as big as it sounds? Cain is absolutely done if this is what it looks like.

yep. that's what it is. i was shocked a few minutes ago. cain's political career is ancient history.

Sola_Fide
10-19-2011, 10:57 PM
Where will the Cainiacs go now? Newt?

Inkblots
10-19-2011, 10:57 PM
This is huge, folks! We need to spread this everywhere.

Also spread this clip from Cain's interview on Stossel:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=JD-sBPBzpmE

This guy appears to be pro-choice! Send this to every GOP voter you know!

Epic
10-19-2011, 10:57 PM
Cain will go down soon, the media still have Gingrich and Santorum in the bullpen. They've already used Trump, Bachmann, Perry.

Hospitaller
10-19-2011, 10:58 PM
His position is the same as pauls...

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-19-2011, 10:58 PM
Is he trying to take Paul's position in some weird and twisted way?

Absolutely. That's exactly what he's trying to do, he's just not articulate enough to understand how people would react to such a statement.

sailingaway
10-19-2011, 10:58 PM
It isn't that clear cut. The guy is a waffling moron is what he is. He ends up on the pro life side but you have to watch the process to get an idea for how happenstance that result was.

overcastpatriot
10-19-2011, 10:58 PM
Seems to be common theme with Cain... the guy has two opinions on everything. His personal/religion-dictated opinion, and what he would do or not do as President.

- He believes homosexuality is a sin and a choice, but he "respects" that choice
- He understands the frustration at Wall Street, but believes the people are as much to blame as the banks (he assigned 25% blame to both, and 50% to Obama)
- He believes government is broken, but thinks its foolish to throw parts of it out instead of trying to "fix it"
- He voted to electrify the border fence, before he voted against it (haha)

And the abortion thing. If he has personal opinions that differ from his political beliefs that's fine, but its not an effective way to campaign. He should say "My positions on #1 is x, my position on #2 is y" kind of thing. Of course, this is fine for us. Cain may end up being a flavor of the month, and nothing more. I still think he may end up getting the VP spot. But you can see the confusion cause between a guy who has two views on everything and someone like Paul who doesn't contradict himself.

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 10:58 PM
I don't know why you guys are saying "we need to spread this". It's out there. It's on the right scoop. It's on HotAir. Mediaite. It will be on Drudge tomorrow. Cain's campaign has ended.

RedLightning
10-19-2011, 10:59 PM
As confusing as the clip was, it seems to me he's against abortion...

sailingaway
10-19-2011, 10:59 PM
His position is the same as pauls...

He's making his position up as he goes along, imho. Ron doesn't.

bluesc
10-19-2011, 11:00 PM
If that was from the Stossel interview, it was the most amazing thing. He went back and forth two or three times like he was deciding if he should be pro-life or pro-choice by the audience reaction. The video clip is in Opposing Candidates.

The benefits of not having a record, you can just make it up as you go along.

This guy just fucking sucks at it.

Inkblots
10-19-2011, 11:00 PM
Here's a great insight into this from a commenter on Hot Air:
"He seems to be cautious about taking a firm stand. Just as with the Israel/prisoner release and border fence issues. He’s not quite sure which is the right answer so he switches between two.

amerpundit on October 19, 2011 at 11:47 PM"

Herman Cain: definitively NOT ready for primetime!

MJU1983
10-19-2011, 11:00 PM
Made a good Tweet: http://twitter.com/#!/mju1983/status/126885190256701441

Echoes
10-19-2011, 11:00 PM
He was already dead after his 9-9-9 plan got destroyed last nite. This is the nail in the coffin, he's gonna probably drop out before the next debate.

Sola_Fide
10-19-2011, 11:00 PM
I don't know why you guys are saying "we need to spread this". It's out there. It's on the right scoop. It's on HotAir. Mediaite. It will be on Drudge tomorrow. Cain's campaign has ended.

LoL. I like your confidence.

freeforall
10-19-2011, 11:01 PM
Absolutely. That's exactly what he's trying to do, he's just not articulate enough to understand how people would react to such a statement.

I'm not sure that it is a lack of being articulate. I think he really doesn't understand how states can govern without the federal government.

Austrian Econ Disciple
10-19-2011, 11:02 PM
His position isn't the same as Pauls. While Ron is against a Federal Law for abortion (just like every other law like murder, rape, assault, robbery, etc.), he is very much for a law making abortion illegal on the State level. Why else would he be in support of Sanctity of Life Act which would bring the issue back to the States? I bet Herman Cain has never even heard of SoLA.

eleganz
10-19-2011, 11:02 PM
lol if only he just stole Ron's decision to leave it up to the states....he would be fine.

hahahahahahaha

Karsten
10-19-2011, 11:02 PM
Ron Paul is very pro life but he believes it's a state's rights issue, not a federal issue. Similar to how murder laws should be under state jurisdiction as well.
This is in contrast to Cain who seemed to outright defend "choice"

TER
10-19-2011, 11:02 PM
Cain is done. I think he probably wants out anyway. This man is selling books and banking on a Hollywood living. Who's next? Newt or Mitt?

Sentinelrv
10-19-2011, 11:03 PM
Where do you think Cain's supporters will go?

SchleckBros
10-19-2011, 11:03 PM
His position is the same as pauls...

No it isn't.

"Not me as president. Not some politician. Not a bureaucrat... And whatever they decide, they decide."

Paul believes it is a state issue. Cain does not.

bluesc
10-19-2011, 11:04 PM
Cain is done. I think he probably wants out anyway. This man is selling books and banking on a Hollywood living. Who's next? Newt or Mitt?

Both. The establishment won't leave the anti-Romney vote to Ron.

Havax
10-19-2011, 11:05 PM
Unfortunately I can see the media trying to push up Perry again. It was astonishing how they said Perry had a good debate performance last night when he did awful. It's like they predetermined to have Perry make a comeback. Now that he will come out with some economic plan, people will give it all the media attention. I hope I'm wrong.

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-19-2011, 11:05 PM
I'm not sure that it is a lack of being articulate. I think he really doesn't understand how states can govern without the federal government.

I was trying to insinuate, that he's bad at playing in the political arena. Which is what he's trying to do right now. But I also agree he's probably clueless.

Sola_Fide
10-19-2011, 11:05 PM
Where do you think Cain's supporters will go?

My guess is Newt. Newt will get the last little media push and then he will fail and go nowhere. Then its us vs. Romney. Hopefully.

pauliticalfan
10-19-2011, 11:05 PM
How will Iowa react to this?

bluesc
10-19-2011, 11:06 PM
Unfortunately I can see the media trying to push up Perry again. It was astonishing how they said Perry had a good debate performance last night when he did awful. It's like they predetermined to have Perry make a comeback. Now that he will come out with Ron's economic plan, people will give it all the media attention. I hope I'm wrong.

Fixed.

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-19-2011, 11:07 PM
My guess is Newt. Newt will get the last little media push and then he will fail and go nowhere. Then its us vs. Romney. Hopefully.

I still don't see how Romney has any supporters. His facebook page is literally zero traffic.

zHorns
10-19-2011, 11:07 PM
Where do you think Cain's supporters will go?

Newt without a doubt. Cain supporters don't care about substance or records. It's about speeches, jokes and Pokemon quotes.

freeforall
10-19-2011, 11:08 PM
Where do you think Cain's supporters will go?

Cain has shown a strong dislike for Ron Paul. His supporters will certainly feel the same way if we are kicking them when they're down.

sailingaway
10-19-2011, 11:08 PM
Fixed.

They are pushing Gingrich next. If Perry can make a come back stealing Ron's plan they'll support Perry, likely. Wonder what Perry will substitute for the military spending cuts....

..... 'waste and fraud' I guess......

Sola_Fide
10-19-2011, 11:09 PM
I still don't see how Romney has any supporters. His facebook page is literally zero traffic.

I don't either, believe me. I think he is a very easy target.

MJU1983
10-19-2011, 11:09 PM
Newt without a doubt. Cain supporters don't care about substance or records. It's about speeches, jokes and Pokemon quotes.

Don't forget catchy, meaningless sayings and slogans for unworkable government programs.

TER
10-19-2011, 11:09 PM
My guess is Newt. Newt will get the last little media push and then he will fail and go nowhere. Then its us vs. Romney. Hopefully.

I was thinking that as well, but perhaps by the time Super Tuesday comes around, it will be Newt which will be our greatest battle. Stranger things have happened...

Either way, Cain is about done. We just raised our highest Money Bomb of this campaign, Ron just pwned the debates, he is now being attacked, which means we are winning. Great past few days, and I want to thank everyone who has worked so hard to make this happen. :)

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-19-2011, 11:10 PM
Cain has shown a strong dislike for Ron Paul. His supporters will certainly feel the same way if we are kicking them when they're down.

I would dislike Ron Paul too if i were a Federal Reserve minion, proven wrong on the bubble collapse prediction on national TV, and tried to sell a really bad economic plan that falls very short in comparison to Ron Paul's.

jonathanzx10
10-19-2011, 11:13 PM
Hold on guys, Cain is just going to spin this saying he meant it was a choice only for rape and incest.

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-19-2011, 11:14 PM
Hold on guys, Cain is just going to spin this saying he meant it was a choice only for rape and incest.

I don't doubt it. Cainiacs always give him the benefit of a doubt anyway.

moderate libertarian
10-19-2011, 11:16 PM
Where will the Cainiacs go now? Newt?

Obama?

Their positions are not that different if you drill down the BS.

akterence
10-19-2011, 11:16 PM
Cain is done. I think he probably wants out anyway. This man is selling books and banking on a Hollywood living. Who's next? Newt or Mitt?

That is exactly what I was thinking. He just wants to sell books, he never intended to actually thrive in this election. His book tour is his real goal. He is like Sarah Palin, his final goal is to become a celebrity and a personality on Fox News not the President of the United States.

freeforall
10-19-2011, 11:17 PM
I would dislike Ron Paul too if i were a Federal Reserve minion, proven wrong on the bubble collapse prediction on national TV, and tried to sell a really bad economic plan that falls very short in comparison to Ron Paul's.

I'm not defending him. I've tried very hard to see him in a positive light because my in-laws support him and I just can't do it. I'm just saying that his supporters don't want the status quo, but they don't see us in a good way. Cain's campaign is self destructing and we should simply let that happen and let his supporters give us a second look.

Lafayette
10-19-2011, 11:18 PM
As someone said in another thread "they are running out of non Ron Paul candidates".

They better slow down or they'll use them all up before Iowa.

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-19-2011, 11:18 PM
I'm not defending him. I've tried very hard to see him in a positive light because my in-laws support him and I just can't do it. I'm just saying that his supporters don't want the status quo, but they don't see us in a good way. Cain's campaign is self destructing and we should simply let that happen and let his supporters give us a second look.

Never said you were, we're in full agreement. :)

freeforall
10-19-2011, 11:20 PM
Never said you were, we're in full agreement. :)

:o

Inkblots
10-19-2011, 11:23 PM
This is such a gift.

Be sure to remind disappointed Cain supporters that Ron is the author of the Sanctity of Life Act and the only candidate with a plan to allow states to outlaw abortion, saving hundreds of thousands of lives until such time as a Human Life Amendment can be ratified.

RonPaulCult
10-19-2011, 11:33 PM
Guys I watched this on Piers Morgan tonight and I was stunned. I was shocked Piers didn't call him out on it.

He said he was pro-life - life begins at conception - no exceptions.

But that was his PERSONAL opinion.

When Piers asked him about laws he said government should have no involvement. It was 100% pro-choice sounding.

Knowing Cain he will come out and say he he didn't say it or people are confused or his usual backtracking. It's all this guy does.

But don't be so sure his campaign is over - I watched the whole damn hour of him and he is SO FREAKIN likable.

Karsten
10-19-2011, 11:33 PM
Obama?

Their positions are not that different if you drill down the BS.

You're not that far off. IF Ron Paul wins the nomination, you KNOW all the neo-cons will endorse Obama (Cheney, etc).

ShaganOverman
10-19-2011, 11:34 PM
" Herman Cain is pro-choice-life-and-choice-aga*in-and-then-life. "

Lord Xar
10-19-2011, 11:35 PM
I don't think it really matters what he says, at this point the media will not let any of these gaffs gain traction.

Travlyr
10-19-2011, 11:37 PM
If that was from the Stossel interview, it was the most amazing thing. He went back and forth two or three times like he was deciding if he should be pro-life or pro-choice by the audience reaction. The video clip is in Opposing Candidates.

Like every other issue Cain is for both sides.

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 11:38 PM
"What it comes down to: It's not the government's role or anybody else's role to make that decision. Secondly, if you look at the statistical incidents, you're not talking about that big a number. So what I'm saying is, it ultimately gets down to a choice that that family or that mother has to make. Not me as president. Not some politician, not a bureaucrat. It gets down to that family, and whatever they decide, they decide. I shouldn't have to tell them what decision to make for such a sensitive issue."

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/66432.html#ixzz1bIVVif1L

Austin
10-19-2011, 11:40 PM
Although it's a little unclear at the beginning, there's no question Cain wants abortion to be illegal. That includes cases of rape and incest.

At worst, Cain failed to take a strong stand from the beginning — but it's not the big gaffe most think it is.

EDIT: Well, I'll have my plate of crow. lpg has a nice little link above.

ONUV
10-19-2011, 11:40 PM
he's done this twice now. once on stossel and now on morgan's show. show people BOTH videos. cain can't try and wiggle his way out of this one.

LBennett76
10-19-2011, 11:41 PM
We need to leave the Cain supporters who are online alone during his downfall. They hate us already, and kicking them while they're down will NOT help Ron Paul. Step back, let them soak it in, then we'll see what happens. Family and friends though... work on them all you want. :)

SchleckBros
10-19-2011, 11:41 PM
Although it's a little unclear at the beginning, there's no question Cain wants abortion to be illegal. That includes cases of rape and incest.

At worst, Cain failed to take a strong stand from the beginning but it's not the big gaffe most think it is.

You're talking about the Stossel interview from a couple days ago. The Piers interview from tonight was a HUGE gaffe.

devil21
10-19-2011, 11:41 PM
I really wish his campaign would end over on an issue that really matters to the entire country, like economic policies. Abortion is such an emotional wedge issue it's not funny and is solely because the GOP is so overrun with evangelicals. Lots of us conservatives dont care about abortion one way or another. It's a 10A issue.

Karsten
10-19-2011, 11:43 PM
I don't think it really matters what he says, at this point the media will not let any of these gaffs gain traction.

Yeah they will. Most of the media is establishment Democrat. They don't cover Paul because they know he would trounce Obama if he were to win the nomination. But they also aren't to kind to the other Republican candidates as well. In essence we should use the "liberal media" to our advantage.

specsaregood
10-19-2011, 11:44 PM
Secondly, if you look at the statistical incidents, you're not talking about that big a number.
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/66432.html#ixzz1bIVVif1L

Did he just say its ok to legalize killing babies as long as it isn't a big number of them?

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 11:46 PM
Did he just say its ok to legalize killing babies as long as it isn't a big number of them?

NO! I'm pro-life from conception to grave! Whatever the family decides, it's THEIR DECISION!

AdamT
10-19-2011, 11:46 PM
He will just flop tomorrow and talk out the other side of his mouth about apples and oranges or some shit to cover this gaffe. Highly doubt this will be the end of Cain.

Karsten
10-19-2011, 11:47 PM
NO! I'm pro-life from conception to grave!

Which of course includes a pro-peace foreign policy :)

rp08orbust
10-19-2011, 11:48 PM
Did he just say its ok to legalize killing babies as long as it isn't a big number of them?

No, I think he's referring to the often-cited fact by pro-life people that an extremely tiny percentage of abortions are cases of rape or incest.

Karsten
10-19-2011, 11:48 PM
He will just flop tomorrow and talk out the other side of his mouth about apples and oranges or some shit to cover this gaffe. Highly doubt this will be the end of Cain.

This alone might not but he'll sink anyway since his 999 thing is being attacked.

AdamT
10-19-2011, 11:49 PM
This alone might not but he'll sink anyway since his 999 thing is being attacked.

That I could agree with.

ONUV
10-19-2011, 11:50 PM
You're talking about the Stossel interview from a couple days ago. The Piers interview from tonight was a HUGE gaffe.

cain was on stossel's show in july i think.

specsaregood
10-19-2011, 11:50 PM
No, I think he's referring to the often-cited fact by pro-life people that an extremely tiny percentage of abortions are cases of rape or incest.

I don't see how that was relevent. Is he implying it isn't worth discussing then because of the low numbers?

low preference guy
10-19-2011, 11:52 PM
I don't see how that was relevent. Is he implying it isn't worth discussing then because of the low numbers?

yeah dude it makes no sense. but it requires too much thinking for a soundbite. but the other statements will finish him.

specsaregood
10-20-2011, 12:00 AM
yeah dude it makes no sense. but it requires too much thinking for a soundbite. but the other statements will finish him.

Either that or the GOP will say how brilliant it is and officially come out of the closet as pro-choice.

rp08orbust
10-20-2011, 12:12 AM
I don't see how that was relevent. Is he implying it isn't worth discussing then because of the low numbers?

He's defending what he said out of the pro-life side of his mouth (that he's personally opposed to abortion in all cases, even in the tiny percentage of cases that result from rape or incest) before talking out of the pro-choice side of his mouth again.

Tod
10-20-2011, 12:36 AM
Ohhhhh, this is GOOD! EXCELLENT!!!! There goes the social conservative vote!

WD-NY
10-20-2011, 12:40 AM
Unfortunately I can see the media trying to push up Perry again. It was astonishing how they said Perry had a good debate performance last night when he did awful. It's like they predetermined to have Perry make a comeback. Now that he will come out with some economic plan, people will give it all the media attention. I hope I'm wrong.

They began to do exactly this today across MSNBC, CNN & Fox. It was as though a memo went out that said "Cain-Train Crashes. Prop-Up Perry In Spite of Horrific Debate Performance Like You've Never Pushed Him Before"

Thankfully for us, that dog won't hunt with GOP voters any longer... no matter how hard the MSM pushes him

Ricky201
10-20-2011, 12:49 AM
I don't understand anything of what he just said. By the way, Cain your pizza sucks!

anaconda
10-20-2011, 12:49 AM
If that was from the Stossel interview, it was the most amazing thing. He went back and forth two or three times like he was deciding if he should be pro-life or pro-choice by the audience reaction. The video clip is in Opposing Candidates.

The man is a bigger buffoon that Sarah Palin and Dan Quayle combined.

anaconda
10-20-2011, 12:51 AM
Would Ron Paul support and Amendment to the Constitution saying abortion is murder?

Feeding the Abscess
10-20-2011, 12:52 AM
Guys, don't push this.


One might wonder at this point about Paul's position on abortion to save the mother. "In all my years [as an OB-GYN], I never saw a case where the mother needed an abortion to save her life."

The congressman stated he never personally saw it, suggesting it is a rare occurrence, though he never denied the possibility. Paul's next point answers the dangling question there:

"A woman's health care should be a private matter between her and her doctor," Paul explained. "The government shouldn't get in the middle." Bottom line, if a woman really needs an abortion, so be it at least so far as the federal government is concerned.

Despite his personal feelings on abortion, congressman Paul is not in favor of federal regulation for or against it (he is against oddities like partial birth abortion, however), thus leaving the issue to the states. "The federal government has no business involving itself in abortion."

There's plenty to hit Cain with. This issue ain't it.

jasonxe
10-20-2011, 01:06 AM
^^ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Ron_Paul#Abortion-related_legislation


wiki ftw! They can try but will fail.

BlackTerrel
10-20-2011, 01:06 AM
I've said from the beginning that Cain is like Trump. He's not made for politics and he will eventually fall by the wayside. Most objective people would come to the same conclusion.


Where do you think Cain's supporters will go?

We've all but ensured it won't be Ron Paul...

kojirodensetsu
10-20-2011, 01:07 AM
Would Ron Paul support and Amendment to the Constitution saying abortion is murder?
If I remember Ron said he'd leave it up to the states to decide.

Feeding the Abscess
10-20-2011, 01:11 AM
Would Ron Paul support and Amendment to the Constitution saying abortion is murder?


The best solution, of course, is not now available to us. That would be a Supreme Court that recognizes that for all criminal laws, the several states retain jurisdiction. Something that Congress can do is remove the issue from the jurisdiction of the lower federal courts, so that states can deal with the problems surrounding abortion, thus helping to reverse some of the impact of Roe v. Wade.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul98.html

jasonxe
10-20-2011, 01:12 AM
They didn't choose us when they pick perry. They didn't choose us when they pick Cain. Why do we think they were ever going to pick us? They can hope aboard our ship and I'll give them a helping hand. But the hell if I give a damn if they don't.

specsaregood
10-20-2011, 01:15 AM
If I remember Ron said he'd leave it up to the states to decide.
Well the states would have to approve an amendment. :) I think he would sign an amendment; but that aint happening.

lucent
10-20-2011, 01:24 AM
At CPAC 2008 Ron Paul said:

"On the right-to-life issue, I believe, I’m a real stickler for civil liberties. It’s academic to talk about civil liberties if you don’t talk about the true protection of all life. So if you are going to protect liberty, you have to protect the life of the unborn just as well.

I have a Bill in congress I certainly would promote and push as president, called the Sanctity of Life Amendment. We establish the principle that life begins at conception. And someone says, ‘oh why are you saying that?’ and I say, ‘well, that’s not a political statement -- that’s a scientific statement that I’m making!“

I know we’re all interested in a better court system and amending the constitution to protect life. But sometimes I think that is dismissing the way we can handle this much quicker, and my bill removes the jurisdiction of the federal courts from the issue of abortion, if a state law says no abortion, it doesn’t go to the supreme court to be ruled out of order "

Source: Speeches to 2008 Conservative Political Action Conference Feb 7, 2008 (http://www.issues2000.org/2008_CPAC.htm)

Fredom101
10-20-2011, 01:34 AM
I'm pro choice.

Don't forget, Giuliani was pro choice, and that was NOT what did him in.
There are a lot of pro choice repbulicans actually.

I personally think it's the lowest priority issue there is.

Sola_Fide
10-20-2011, 01:37 AM
I'm pro choice.

Don't forget, Giuliani was pro choice, and that was NOT what did him in.
There are a lot of pro choice repbulicans actually.

I personally think it's the lowest priority issue there is.

Don't know how you could come to these conclusions.

Sean
10-20-2011, 01:57 AM
I'm pro choice.

Don't forget, Giuliani was pro choice, and that was NOT what did him in.
There are a lot of pro choice repbulicans actually.

I personally think it's the lowest priority issue there is.

Cain's traction is coming from religious conservatives. He is the Huckabee of the race not the Rudy. Being pro choice will take away 85% of his support. Also guarantees him as a nonfactor in Iowa and the south.

JohnGalt1225
10-20-2011, 02:50 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSGLBAinETc&feature=player_embedded#!

here it is.... enjoy....
Holy crap, I mean they say Mitt's the flip flopper. That tops anything Mitt's ever done! At least Mitt waits about 24 hours before changing his position, this man changed his position two or three times in two or three sentences.

anaconda
10-20-2011, 02:52 AM
At CPAC 2008 Ron Paul said:


I have a Bill in congress I certainly would promote and push as president, called the Sanctity of Life Amendment. We establish the principle that life begins at conception. [/URL]

Not sure what this means. Did he mean an amendment to the constitution? Or some other use of the word? Thank you for this by the way!

anaconda
10-20-2011, 02:56 AM
Oh my goodness watching Cain on Stossel was almost as difficult as watching Palin with Katie Couric. I'm sure glad he didn't ask Cain for a name of a periodical he reads regularly.

muh_roads
10-20-2011, 03:01 AM
So much flip-flop in just a few short sentences...my head is going to explode.

S.Shorland
10-20-2011, 03:34 AM
Just saw the 'apples and oranges' sketch.Romney did a great service.Even Americans will see through this twit,I really think so.

RKoho
10-20-2011, 04:33 AM
If that was from the Stossel interview, it was the most amazing thing. He went back and forth two or three times like he was deciding if he should be pro-life or pro-choice by the audience reaction. The video clip is in Opposing Candidates.

Ya I remember that interview. It was more ridiculous than his apples and oranges answer in the debate. If I didn't already dislike him at the time of the Stossel interview that messy answer would of made me cross him out there.

Someone Else
10-20-2011, 04:41 AM
Cain - wiffle waffle.
Cain - a flippy floppy.
Cain - a wet noodle.
Cain - a bump on the log.
Cain - a dead beat
Cain - a mealy-mouth, Federal Reserve ass-kissing Nazi, lukewarm milktoast hustling whore.

Cap
10-20-2011, 04:59 AM
The Cain bubble has a huge hole in it. The media can huff and puff, but will never inflate poor Herman again. This is priceless. We are watching the establishment media in full meltdown, enjoy it, savor it.

Diurdi
10-20-2011, 05:09 AM
At first I thought he meant that he personally is pro-life and does not like abortion, but doesn't want government to get involved and thus allow those who do want abortions to have them.

But then I watched the stossel clip... The guy is fucking nuts.

Johnnybags
10-20-2011, 05:10 AM
He was never a contender to begin with, just a Romney flank like the rest. Noone drawing in 2 mil and having three people in an early primary state is a contender. Made up frontrunner by the false polling aparatus and media. Once he collapses into oblivion and he will they will say Gingrich is soaring. You are watching a well orchestrated puppet show, that is how its done here. No Brute force needed just a manipulation of polls and media to get the desired result.

SilentBull
10-20-2011, 05:11 AM
Wow!! Cain must have thought it was so easy to run for president that he didn't even need any real opinions. Of course that is true for the most part as long as the media is helping you out.

jmdrake
10-20-2011, 05:50 AM
He's making his position up as he goes along, imho. Ron doesn't.

Exactly. Ron's position as stated in Liberty Defined is that the feds can ban infanticide using the "guarantee a republican form of government" clause in the constitution (Article I I think) but that the states should decide everything else. Personally Ron is not against the "morning after pill" because medically conception = implantation and not fertilization. Can kept saying "Let the mother decide" (a pro choice position) then kept waffling back and forth. At the end of the day he neither wanted to be on the "woman can choose" or the "government can choose" side. If he had just said "I'm pro life with a rape exception" and left it at that his position would have at least kinda made sense. But the claps (or lack thereof) from the audience wouldn't let him settle where he wanted to be. That's the difference between Ron and other politicians. They flip flop to the voters. Ron's constant, so we have to flip some voters.

69360
10-20-2011, 06:04 AM
Cain is making shit up as he goes.

Can't you see how he decides his position on issues? He comes out for both sides of any issue, see what the media likes, then says he was joking about the unliked position.

Strangely, large portions of America seems to have dumbed down enough for this strategy to be working.

S.Shorland
10-20-2011, 06:14 AM
Looks like RCP is going to give Gingrich a surge right now.He needs two or three great polls and he'll overtake Perry.

Captain Shays
10-20-2011, 06:15 AM
We need to spread this everywhere. Drudge it.

Post it in EVERY Tea Party website we can find! Post it in EVERY Christian forum we can find.

Captain Shays
10-20-2011, 06:20 AM
Cain will go down soon, the media still have Gingrich and Santorum in the bullpen. They've already used Trump, Bachmann, Perry.

You're so spot on but I don't know if you know just how spot on you are. Gingrich is the man we should start to focus on NOW. He WILL rise to the top before this is over. The media will make it between Gingrich and Romney. Santorum isn't going anywhere. Trust your instincts on that one. Gingrich appears to have good answers, debates really well, has experience, has a track record, has friends in high places and will soon have a bunch of money when the big rollers latch onto his campaign. We should all remember the last time when they did the flavor of the month thing with McCain appearing to go nowhere until the middle just before New Hampshire.

wgadget
10-20-2011, 06:26 AM
Some of my facebook friends like Gingrich, too. I think they see the writing is on the wall for Cain (PLUS I just posted Cain's pro-choice video for them)...BUT, one of the people there said that Gingrich has "too much baggage." That's a common phrase that I hear from the neocon talking radio heads that I listen to. I suppose that when they change their tune on that, so will the sheep.

Captain Shays
10-20-2011, 06:29 AM
Newt without a doubt. Cain supporters don't care about substance or records. It's about speeches, jokes and Pokemon quotes.

Hi zHorns, I disagree with that. I really think Cain's supporters care A LOT about substance and principles and that is why they supported him. He appeared to have substance and principles. After we feed him to our pet geese we should all go after his supporters in a friendly way and bring them into the fold. This is now fertile ground for us.

TexMac
10-20-2011, 06:39 AM
You're so spot on but I don't know if you know just how spot on you are. Gingrich is the man we should start to focus on NOW. He WILL rise to the top before this is over. The media will make it between Gingrich and Romney. Santorum isn't going anywhere. Trust your instincts on that one. Gingrich appears to have good answers, debates really well, has experience, has a track record, has friends in high places and will soon have a bunch of money when the big rollers latch onto his campaign. We should all remember the last time when they did the flavor of the month thing with McCain appearing to go nowhere until the middle just before New Hampshire.

No big rollers are going to latch on to Newt. He has way too much baggage and the only reason his awful past hasn't been dragged out is because his polling hasn't warranted it.

http://www.salon.com/2011/03/08/gingrich_divorce_hospital_cancer/

All any camppaign has to do is run a few ads to refresh people's memories of why Newt can never overcome his past.

centure7
10-20-2011, 06:39 AM
Wow, Cain really is dead. Its amazing how fast that happened. He'd probably be better off being against the Afghanistan war than for an abortion option.

dustinto
10-20-2011, 06:44 AM
Guys he was just joking (like the electric fence) unless you're into that short of thing, then he was not joking.
http://gawker.com/5851189/stephen-colbert-sizes-up-herman-cain

fatjohn
10-20-2011, 06:44 AM
Hi zHorns, I disagree with that. I really think Cain's supporters care A LOT about hollow rhetoric and that is why they supported him. He appeared to have hollow rhetoric. After we feed him to our pet geese we should all go after his supporters in a friendly way and bring them into the fold. This is now fertile ground for us.

Fixed that for ya

unknown
10-20-2011, 06:53 AM
Herman Cain is PRO-CHOICE

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/herman-cain-tells-piers-morgan-that-he-is-anti-abortion-yet-pro-choice/

Just to recap, in 2005 he said there was no housing bubble, he thinks we dont need an audit of the "Federal Reserve", he thinks the 2nd Amendment is a states' issue and hes pro-abortion...

unknown
10-20-2011, 06:54 AM
Hi zHorns, I disagree with that. I really think Cain's supporters care A LOT about substance and principles and that is why they supported him. He appeared to have substance and principles. After we feed him to our pet geese we should all go after his supporters in a friendly way and bring them into the fold. This is now fertile ground for us.

Its actually difficult to know why they support him. I've tried asking them and they dont really know...

bluesc
10-20-2011, 06:56 AM
Just to recap, in 2005 he said there was no housing bubble, he thinks we dont need an audit of the "Federal Reserve", he thinks the 2nd Amendment is a states' issue and hes pro-abortion...

He should praise Obamacare, he might gain another 5% in the polls.

Captain Shays
10-20-2011, 07:01 AM
Fixed that for ya

ROFLMAO! I like it......for the humor but I still think they want someone who has principles. Cain's supporters were just easily fooled into thinking Cain was that man.

SchleckBros
10-20-2011, 07:22 AM
Has anyone in the media even mentioned this yet? This should be headline news.

matt0611
10-20-2011, 07:23 AM
Stossel: Any cases where it [abortion] should be legal?

Cain: I don't think government should make that decision.

...

Stossel: So abortion should be legal?

Cain: No. Abortion should not be legal.

Umm.....huh?

EBounding
10-20-2011, 07:38 AM
Cain needs to take some courses in the Romney School of Flip-Flopping.

He's been devastated by the dissection of the 999 plan, this should push him over the edge.

Pizzo
10-20-2011, 07:53 AM
Cain will come out and say "I am against abortion after the mother is more than 9 weeks pregnant, the baby has at least 9 fingers, and the parents have at least 9 thousand dollars in their bank account to take care of the baby. Apples and oranges."

tremendoustie
10-20-2011, 07:54 AM
Yeah, newt's going to be the next media pretty boy.

jmdrake
10-20-2011, 07:59 AM
I don't know why you guys are saying "we need to spread this". It's out there. It's on the right scoop. It's on HotAir. Mediaite. It will be on Drudge tomorrow. Cain's campaign has ended.

Some of us thought Cain's train was derailed when he flip flopped on the debt ceiling and said "My plan won't work". I agree that this damages Cain and potentially could kill it. But it's kinda like the undead. You want to make sure that stake is fully through the heart (or the brain is shot out if your talking about zombies instead of vamps).

69360
10-20-2011, 08:05 AM
Some of us thought Cain's train was derailed when he flip flopped on the debt ceiling and said "My plan won't work". I agree that this damages Cain and potentially could kill it. But it's kinda like the undead. You want to make sure that stake is fully through the heart (or the brain is shot out if your talking about zombies instead of vamps).

Rule #2 double tap









(it's a zombieland quote, don't really shoot Cain for all the nutcases)

Steve-in-NY
10-20-2011, 09:08 AM
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/1324/cainflipstossel.png

hwm
10-20-2011, 09:19 AM
Come on, guys... pro-life and pro-choice- it's apples and oranges! We need a bold solution to abortion, and the 999 plan is that solution.

Philosophy_of_Politics
10-20-2011, 09:20 AM
Come on, guys... pro-life and pro-choice- it's apples and oranges! We need a bold solution to abortion, and the 999 plan is that solution.

+Rep for clever brainwashing.

Chainspell
10-20-2011, 09:23 AM
Its actually difficult to know why they support him. I've tried asking them and they dont really know...

ohhh seriously?? watch this!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zsr0UpVjoE&list=FLCXj2EJTt2fGgG_IefK05Pw&index=38

KingNothing
10-20-2011, 09:25 AM
So now Herman Cain says that he has a "plan to help the poor" and that he has always had it.... but he wanted to wait until everyone ganged up on him to talk about it.

dolphin
10-20-2011, 09:32 AM
Cain and Romney caught in campaign cash scandal

"Both Cain and Romney have made it a major point of their campaigns that in a time of dire economic conditions in the United States, America needs a businessman to revitalize the country and get it back on its toes. It shouldn’t come as a surprise then that these have funneled money from their campaign into their checkbooks. Maybe these two do know how to make a buck or two?"

So Cain bought his own books and funnelled money into one his companies Romney was a bit more clever and cashed out via his campaign managers business.

Epic lolz and props to RT for being the biggest nesw channel to cover it. Watch you wont hear a word about it on CNN FOX or MSNBC
http://rt.com/usa/news/cain-romney-campaign-scandal-157/

braane
10-20-2011, 09:39 AM
Cain and Romney caught in campaign cash scandal

"Both Cain and Romney have made it a major point of their campaigns that in a time of dire economic conditions in the United States, America needs a businessman to revitalize the country and get it back on its toes. It shouldn’t come as a surprise then that these have funneled money from their campaign into their checkbooks. Maybe these two do know how to make a buck or two?"

So Cain bought his own books and funnelled money into one his companies Romney was a bit more clever and cashed out via his campaign managers business.

Epic lolz and props to RT for being the biggest nesw channel to cover it. Watch you wont hear a word about it on CNN FOX or MSNBC
http://rt.com/usa/news/cain-romney-campaign-scandal-157/

So if Cains campaign wasn't over before the scandal, it's most certainly over now right? Well, not so fast. It seems nothing can stick to this guy... He will come out in the next day or two saying that "it's a lie" and these kind of questions don't "create one job". However, in my opinion, stealing from your own donors isn't a very good way to maintain their support. So it's a waiting game. We need to spread the word of this article in the biggest way.

Todd
10-20-2011, 09:44 AM
As confusing as the clip was, it seems to me he's against abortion...

That's my take. confusing...talking in circles.....makes a conflicting statement, then get's back on topic with him being against abortion. I think this isn't as big as people are thinking. Most politician talks in equivocations. That's why the average voter keeps voting for morons.


He'll be asked to clarify in the next day or two and by then will have had his campaign fix it up a bit and everyone will be like...see...there....he's pro life.

Todd
10-20-2011, 09:47 AM
Come on, guys... pro-life and pro-choice- it's apples and oranges! We need a bold solution to abortion, and the 999 plan is that solution.

It's like McCain's "9-11" all over again.

erowe1
10-20-2011, 09:48 AM
Be careful what you do with this. Cain could still say he wants to overturn Roe v. Wade and have abortion laws left up to the states, which is a stronger pro-life position than any other non-Ron Paul candidate.

SchleckBros
10-20-2011, 09:48 AM
That's my take. confusing...talking in circles.....makes a conflicting statement, then get's back on topic with him being against abortion. I think this isn't as big as people are thinking. Most politician talks in equivocations. That's why the average voter keeps voting for morons.


He'll be asked to clarify in the next day or two and by then will have had his campaign fix it up a bit and everyone will be like...see...there....he's pro life.

You're referring to the Stossel interview. The Piers Morgan interview was much bigger.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/66432.html#ixzz1bIVVif1L

osan
10-20-2011, 10:17 AM
Herman Cain is PRO-CHOICE



http://www.mediaite.com/tv/herman-cain-tells-piers-morgan-that-he-is-anti-abortion-yet-pro-choice/

I don't see this as derailing him much at all. There is a whole lot worse... like 9-9-9 nonsense and his propensity for backpedaling and bullshitting.

Get a grip. :)

erowe1
10-20-2011, 10:21 AM
I don't see this as derailing him much at all. There is a whole lot worse... like 9-9-9 nonsense and his propensity for backpedaling and bullshitting.

Get a grip. :)

Being pro-choice would hurt him far more than any of those things. It would make it utterly impossible for him to win the Republican nomination.

That said, I don't think he said anything that would prevent him from taking a state-sovereignty approach to abortion laws. So I'm going to hold off on sending stuff about this to my Cain supporting friends until I see how it plays out.

iamse7en
10-20-2011, 10:35 AM
ohhh seriously?? watch this!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zsr0UpVjoE&list=FLCXj2EJTt2fGgG_IefK05Pw&index=38

That's amazing. I had not seen that before.

anaconda
10-20-2011, 06:08 PM
I think that, in 2008, at least Palin realized she was looking stupid, and was genuinely embarrassed. Cain seems to be oblivious.

NIU Students for Liberty
10-20-2011, 06:16 PM
Seeing as how Cain is now polling 1st in Iowa, this thread is wishful thinking (for the moment). I'm just absolutely furious. Cain has next to zero organization in Iowa while Paul is only grabbing 10%. Someone please talk me off the ledge...

Captain Shays
10-20-2011, 06:26 PM
Has anyone in the media even mentioned this yet? This should be headline news.

No just the opposite. They plastered Cain's announcement that he will announce his new plan soon

devil21
10-20-2011, 06:28 PM
Just make sure that if you push Cain's questionable abortion stance as a negative that you don't identify yourself as a Paul supporter or connect it to Paul in any way. Ron's position isn't all that different though Ron does frame it as a 10th Amendment issue, and Cain did not. Let Cain hurt himself with this. Don't let Paul get hurt by association for the same reasons.

RDM
10-20-2011, 06:28 PM
Seeing as how Cain is now polling 1st in Iowa, this thread is wishful thinking (for the moment). I'm just absolutely furious. Cain has next to zero organization in Iowa while Paul is only grabbing 10%. Someone please talk me off the ledge...

Don't jump. You don't need organization when you have Fox News campaigning for you.

jax
10-20-2011, 06:30 PM
Seeing as how Cain is now polling 1st in Iowa, this thread is wishful thinking (for the moment). I'm just absolutely furious. Cain has next to zero organization in Iowa while Paul is only grabbing 10%. Someone please talk me off the ledge...

well just a few days ago, a journalist who actually lives in iowa says RP would win if it were held today. i trust people who live there over a random poll that we dont even know who exactly they polled

InTradePro
10-20-2011, 06:32 PM
Herman Cain is PRO-CHOICE



http://www.mediaite.com/tv/herman-cain-tells-piers-morgan-that-he-is-anti-abortion-yet-pro-choice/

https://www.facebook.com/THEHermanCain?sk=wall

"I'm 100% pro-life. End of Story." - Herman Cain


:rolleyes:

paulpwns
10-20-2011, 06:39 PM
Drudge did not even run the story.

Blankstare
10-20-2011, 06:40 PM
His position is the same as pauls...

Irrelevant.

tfurrh
10-20-2011, 06:44 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPKYYDefMV4&feature=youtube_gdata_player


This is better than the Stossell interview.

coffeewithchess
10-20-2011, 06:46 PM
He will flipflop out of this, just as he has on every other situation he has "misspoken" on before; he defended it on Hannity this afternoon, saying he is 100% pro-life, and believes in life from conception.

HeyArchie
10-20-2011, 06:53 PM
The Cain train is sticking around... People have apparently stopped caring about the substance of politicians and only care about their charisma. Not that this is much of a change from before, but it seems to have gotten worse recently.