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View Full Version : Gary Johnson FOX: "Surging Gary Johnson to Join Fox Debate"




D.A.S.
09-22-2011, 08:42 AM
Surging? If Gary Johnson is surging, then Ron Paul is burning up like rocket fuel...

hxxp://nation.foxnews.com/gary-johnson/2011/09/20/surging-gary-johnson-join-fox-debate

But check out this exchange below the article:


Can we take Ron Paul out and put [Gary Johnson] in? Otherwise, there are just too many on the panel.

I specifically WANT Johnson there to split up the "Let's lose the war and legalize crack" vote rather than let it unite behind Ron Paul. And I want as many candidates as possible so Mitt Romney wins.

Bruno
09-22-2011, 08:45 AM
It is sure getting easier to believe this was "all part of the plan" from FOX, Perry, and Co.

SilentBull
09-22-2011, 08:46 AM
Wow, this is actually a good strategy for the establishment. They are going to help Gary Johnson a bit, and they will make sure to ask them questions that make them appear like they are very similar candidates. I'm so sick of this. The country is going down in flames and these assholes think it's all a game.

Look for them to help him in NH as well, as we get closer to the primary.

Jeremy
09-22-2011, 08:46 AM
I wouldn't be too worried about Gary taking votes from Ron. I only know one person who supports him, and that's David Nalle, LOL!

LawnWake
09-22-2011, 08:48 AM
Gary will drop out before the primaries. Don't worry. This is a good thing.

Cleaner44
09-22-2011, 08:49 AM
It would be awesome if Gary just constantly complimented Ron and backed him up on every statement.

Article V
09-22-2011, 08:49 AM
They have to justify his inclusion somehow. Besides, it sounds like they're making fun of him too. The first sentence of the two-sentence article is:
Gary Johnson, the Republican presidential candidate who has labored in obscurity, is about to get his moment in the spotlight—for one night, at least.

D.A.S.
09-22-2011, 08:52 AM
I think if this really is FOX's strategy - to dilute Ron - it will backfire on them. Kind of like Perry shooting himself in the foot by releasing Ron's resignation letter.

Schiff_FTW
09-22-2011, 08:52 AM
Gary will drop out before the primaries. Don't worry. This is a good thing.


It would be awesome if Gary just constantly complimented Ron and backed him up on every statement.

That's certainly some wishful thinking if I've ever seen it. Johnson is supported by the beltway crowd that hates Paul.

sailingaway
09-22-2011, 08:54 AM
That's certainly some wishful thinking if I've ever seen it. Johnson is supported by the beltway crowd that hates Paul.

this ^^

Gary is perceived as pliable. Ron is 'too principled' for those who survive on cronyism.

RonPaul101.com
09-22-2011, 08:55 AM
I think having two Libertarian leaning views on the stage is a good thing; hopefully he and Paul compliment each other. The establishment keeps Santorum around just so the Neocons have yet another voice, so why shouldn't Liberty minded folks feel the same benefit from Johnson. I welcome him aboard the panel. Now we need to get rid of Huntsman and Santorum to make room.

Voluntary Man
09-22-2011, 08:57 AM
It is sure getting easier to believe this was "all part of the plan" from FOX, Perry, and Co.

what you wanna bet that one of the designer questions for Gary goes something like the following?

"can you differentiate your views from Paul's, and tell him where he's wrong and why?"

Tunink
09-22-2011, 09:01 AM
Paul and Johnson should take this as an opportunity to beat the mess out of the other candidates. Make them all look like the status quo shills they are.

acptulsa
09-22-2011, 09:05 AM
They have to justify his inclusion somehow. Besides, it sounds like they're making fun of him too. The first sentence of the two-sentence article is:

So, he's surging in obscurity. If I read this correctly, and we assume Fox to be honest, then the sum total of the 'surging' they speak of is his inclusion in a debate. Which would make it a manufactured surge courtesy of them.

Surging in obscurity. Obscurity courtesy of Fox, surge courtesy of Fox. But they don't make the news, they just report it... :rolleyes:

iamse7en
09-22-2011, 09:17 AM
Wow, this is actually a good strategy for the establishment. They are going to help Gary Johnson a bit, and they will make sure to ask them questions that make them appear like they are very similar candidates. I'm so sick of this. The country is going down in flames and these assholes think it's all a game.

Look for them to help him in NH as well, as we get closer to the primary.

+1

bluesc
09-22-2011, 09:21 AM
Ugh. Any predictions on how far they are going to go to push Gary Johnson over the next week? What do you think they are planning for Ron on Hannity tonight?

Something is gonna go down. This has setup written all over it.

Chieppa1
09-22-2011, 09:25 AM
I don't fear the MSM anymore. Maybe its just me. Bring it on. The message is winning.

Romulus
09-22-2011, 09:27 AM
What do you want to bet Gary gets questions 2 to 1 over Ron. Hell everyone will get 2:1 over Ron. And when Ron gets a question, it will be some irrelevant, Do you think we should have an Air Traffic Control system crap.

Ron needs to say and answer whatever question he wants to when called upon.

RonPaulFanInGA
09-22-2011, 09:28 AM
Exactly how is Johnson "surging"? He is destined to get about 2% in Iowa and New Hampshire and drop out, if he doesn't smartly quit before then.

turbobrain9
09-22-2011, 09:30 AM
Johnson is not dropping out until he loses in NH...so, Johnson perceivably could hurt Ron slightly in NH. Most people that I know that like Johnson, are really supporting Ron anyway because they say he has a better chance at the nomination. When it comes down to voting in the NH primary, I think a lot of Johnson supporters are going to vote for Ron anyway...at least they should...I hope they come to their senses.

Fox is actually doing the right thing here anyway...Johnson deserves to be in the debate...we decried it when FOX left Paul out before the NH primary...why should we have a double-standard here...since Johnson got in, he was going to take a small % of support from Paul anyway...

Johnson is going to parrot Paul anyway...then he is going to say two things: I vetoed 700+ bills and still won a second term in a 2 to 1 Dem state...and I started a business and sold it...

So he is simply going to butress Paul's message just like Romney, McCain, etc...butressed the FP stuff in 2008...

Havax
09-22-2011, 09:32 AM
I really hate all the Gary hate around here. I've met and talked with both Ron Paul and Gary Johnson and I would definitely say Gary was more cordial, engaging, and positive. I would chose Ron over Gary, but Gary is a great person that is very genuine and a close ally to our cause. I'm glad he's debating tonight even if Fox's intentions are perceived to be malicious.

puppetmaster
09-22-2011, 09:32 AM
Gary will drop out before the primaries. Don't worry. This is a good thing.

but they are using this to quash any momentum we are getting. it makes it easier to ignore RP in the news

Fredom101
09-22-2011, 09:32 AM
Surging? Ha! This is classic media control of elections. They certainly are doing this to try to make RP less of a factor. Remember McCain in 08? He was dead in the water. Then suddenly, he was "the frontrunner" out of nowhere! As if people didn't like McCain in October, but by November, they loved him!

Yes, everyone is jumping on the Gary Johnson bandwagon, dontcha know? Ron Paul is old news!

This strategy will certainly backfire on the PTB.

gls
09-22-2011, 09:34 AM
we decried it when FOX left Paul out before the NH primary...why should we have a double-standard here...

FOX left Paul out and included several candidates who were polling well below him. It's not even close to the same thing.

puppetmaster
09-22-2011, 09:34 AM
I really hate all the Gary hate around here. I've met and talked with both Ron Paul and Gary Johnson and I would definitely say Gary was more cordial, engaging, and positive. I would chose Ron over Gary, but Gary is a great person that is very genuine and a close ally to our cause. I'm glad he's debating tonight even if Fox's intentions are perceived to be malicious.

gary hate, get real. most here do not hate him we just are looking at the big picture and understand why paux would do this

Voluntary Man
09-22-2011, 09:39 AM
by "obscurity," do they mean, "despite a media blackout"? how have they been measuring his "surge"? have they been conducting secret/unreleased polls, because i don't recall seeing his name in ANY of the polls? perhaps, as you suggest, they are simply hoping for a surge from a candidate they were able to get away with ignoring, to detract from the surge they've been unable to stop, from the candidate they've been unable to ignore?

it is likely we are approaching a cut-off of 10% polling for future debates (imagine 2 candidates @ 23% each, & all others @ 9% each, leaving 54% of Republicans unrepresented in future debates). if the phony left/right who control these "debates" (regardless of whose name they bare: FOX/Google, etc.), can divide Paul's support enough to get him polling below 10% between this debate and the next, they can rationalize excluding Ron Paul from future debates.

it may seem like a desperate and unlikely ploy, but, from the establishment's perspective, they have nothing left to lose by admitting another anti-establishment candidate into this one debate, and possibly everything to gain. is it a long-shot pay-off for them? maybe, but their exposure on this "risk" is minimal to zero: they do nothing and Ron keeps climbing in the polls, winning a position in every consecutive debate, and continued controlled-media exposure; they do THIS, and maybe, just maybe, they get to finally wash their hands of Paul, for the remainder of this primary cycle.

what's more, if libertarian-leaning Republicans and paleoconservatives are dumb enough to take the bait, and dilute the electoral strength they've built, they will have been complicit in their own political banishment.



On a side note, is it just me, or is there something subtly obscene about the expression, "surging in obscurity"?


So, he's surging in obscurity. If I read this correctly, and we assume Fox to be honest, then the sum total of the 'surging' they speak of is his inclusion in a debate. Which would make it a manufactured surge courtesy of them.

Surging in obscurity. Obscurity courtesy of Fox, surge courtesy of Fox. But they don't make the news, they just report it... :rolleyes:

trey4sports
09-22-2011, 09:40 AM
I wouldn't be too worried about Gary taking votes from Ron. I only know one person who supports him, and that's David Nalle, LOL!


lol

Athan
09-22-2011, 09:42 AM
The socialists think it will help the front runners. It will not. It will actually help the liberty movement if Ron and Gary are there lock step defending their message. Glad to have Gary back! How about Buddy Romer or whatever his name is?

Bruno
09-22-2011, 09:46 AM
I really hate all the Gary hate around here. I've met and talked with both Ron Paul and Gary Johnson and I would definitely say Gary was more cordial, engaging, and positive. I would chose Ron over Gary, but Gary is a great person that is very genuine and a close ally to our cause. I'm glad he's debating tonight even if Fox's intentions are perceived to be malicious.

Not sure what "Gary hate" you are talking about.

Most conversation is just about whether this will help or hurt Ron, and the motives behind letting him in the debate when he is polling so low.

klamath
09-22-2011, 09:46 AM
Fox isn't doing this outta love for libertarianism. It is a lot easyer to ignore a candidate that isn't pretty consistantly in third place. It is an out and out attempt to split RP's base and send RP and GJ both to the back of the pack of also rans.

Athan
09-22-2011, 09:47 AM
Paul and Johnson should take this as an opportunity to beat the mess out of the other candidates. Make them all look like the status quo shills they are.
Bingo! Not just debate seperately, but as a Liberty force to be reckoned with!

I need to correct romeny's statement here on his comments against my opponents correct analysis that our foreign policy is infact inciting great American hatred agross the globe. And can I just say santorum is a moron to add?

turbobrain9
09-22-2011, 09:48 AM
FOX left Paul out and included several candidates who were polling well below him. It's not even close to the same thing.

Regardless of the reasons or the circumstances...both Paul and Johnson were being treated unfairly...it may have been "worse" for Paul in 2008...it is unfair to leave Johnson out of the debates considering it is early and that he is a two-term governor..lastly, they are including Huntsman and Santorum who are polling at 1 to 2%...so...

speciallyblend
09-22-2011, 10:16 AM
That's certainly some wishful thinking if I've ever seen it. Johnson is supported by the beltway crowd that hates Paul.

people are people, everyone is different as an individual! so not everyone in the beltway crowd hates ron paul

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?317531-Paul-Johnson-2012-Bring-Our-Troops-Home

Voluntary Man
09-22-2011, 10:23 AM
Surging? Ha! This is classic media control of elections. They certainly are doing this to try to make RP less of a factor. Remember McCain in 08? He was dead in the water. Then suddenly, he was "the frontrunner" out of nowhere! As if people didn't like McCain in October, but by November, they loved him!

Yes, everyone is jumping on the Gary Johnson bandwagon, dontcha know? Ron Paul is old news!

This strategy will certainly backfire on the PTB.


ironically, that was also a manufactured "surge." it was "the surge is working" ginned up non-sense, to make it seem that he was the one who could "bring our troops home with honor" (because, apparently, it's less honorable to pull out "prematurely," once aware that a wrong is being committed, than to complete the rape ...er....i mean "mission").

Johncjackson
09-22-2011, 10:55 AM
this ^^

Gary is perceived as pliable. Ron is 'too principled' for those who survive on cronyism.

There are legit differences, and supporting one over the other based on those differences is not unprincipled. There are arguable negatives for Paul depending on what principles you are supporting. That said I support Paul over Johnson.

Shane Harris
09-22-2011, 10:59 AM
they want an excuse to bring up heroine again

libertybrewcity
09-22-2011, 11:16 AM
I wonder if Gary Johnson has enough campaign funds to make it to the debate...

naw, jk, they are hyping GJ, but I don't think it is necessarily a bad thing if he is let into the debate.

ronpaulitician
09-22-2011, 11:19 AM
Glad to see Gary included. I see only positives in this, even if some may have included him hoping to accomplish something negative.

gb13
09-22-2011, 04:00 PM
If Johnson is as principled as I think he is, his presence there will only help Ron. An echoing voice for liberty could be somewhat of a boon for Ron's credibility. ESPECIALLY if Ron is on the offensive, as I hope he'll be.

Also, I think FOX knows it would be unwise to give Gary more questions than Ron Paul, seeing as how they are now being called out for their favoritism. Not that they are above that sort of thing, but I think logistically, they see the potential for it to backfire.

Romulus
09-22-2011, 04:01 PM
I bet Gary get's an Israel question... 100 bucks.... they will try to isolate Ron.