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cdc482
07-19-2011, 09:13 AM
Thoughts to add:
http://www.whatis-theplan.org/t6098-opinion-on-ron-paul#58636

ronpaulhawaii
07-19-2011, 09:17 AM
Not a member. Can you post some of the meat?

eleganz
07-19-2011, 09:26 AM
SabreNation wrote:
Not a fan.

I like some of his ideas (ending the drug war and the Fed) but, to me, they are outweighed in a big way by his ideas that seem - to me - to go against everything Anonymous fights for. Namely equality:

He's anti-Social Security - a program enacted, essentially, to battle poverty. Particularly poverty among the elderly which was a major problem in the pre-SSI days.

He wants to end the Department of Education - he favors privatizing education. Public education is underfunded and often poor but it beats the alternative for low-income families: no education. Viewing education as a right and not a priviledge is an important facet of freedom and equality. Eliminating the DoE would serve to send us backwards in time - to a period when only the rich could afford an education and the poor had ZERO upward mobility.

He opposes Medicare - See SSI. Medical care should be a right, not a priviledge based on how much money you have. Frankly, Medicare should be expanded to cover ALL American citizens, IMHO.

MOST importantly, he FULLY supports Laissez-Faire economic policy which flies directly in the face of *EVERYTHING* that Anonymous is supposed to be fighting against. No regulations, no legal restrictions. Profit is everything and greed rules all. This is the type of thought process that has gotten us to where we are today. Anyone that supports such a policy is an enemy of Anonymous, IMO.




cdc482:
You are misrepresenting his views. As someone who values freedom, Ron Paul is philosophically against social security because it is a mandatory retirement program. However, he proposes ending it for future generations and continuing the program for all those who have currently paid into it with the money that is currently being used on war.

You are also misinformed about education. I live in Pittsburgh where the cost of education is $20,000 per student, yet the level of PUBLIC education in Pittsburgh is among the lowest in the world.

As far as medicare, I see both sides. It sucks for a person to get sick, break their leg through no fault of their own (or from working hard to pay their bills) and then be unable to fix it. However, I see the same problem as with all federal social problems (besides that government is corruptible and often uses the programs to pay for war). I don't like the idea of a person forcing someone else to be a good person (using the dark side to spread the light). In fact, I think the reason charity has become such a foreign concept in America is because so many people have become dependent on the idea that the government will handle it. In the past there were many free hospitals and charitable organizations that no longer exist... These are social problems. Society must change and progress. Requiring society to be good has harsh sideeffects (like the lack of charity today) and is unethical in itself.

I also think it's unfair to describe education as the means of upward mobility, because up is relative and not everyone values education. It is unfair to force them to pay for it. Practically, watch waiting for superman. Spending has gone up since the DoE, but education levels have not.

I agree with you that economic policy is the biggest point. Most intelligent and humanitarian people agree on foreign policy, monetary policy, and social policy. The issue is always economic policy, but I think it is the same issue as social policy.
Tt is unfair to say Dr. Paul is for no regulation. For him it's all one rule that everyone must follow: life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. He believes that individuals should be free to buy and sell anything they want to whoever they want. However, it is not necessary that people value money and become greedy in a free world. Again, this is a social issue that society needs to address. Using the government to address the issue has proven corruptible (the bailout, the lack of enforcement regarding pollution, and the warfare state) But even if this was not the case, I take the same issue with it that I do with social issues (described above)

...

libertybrewcity
07-19-2011, 09:36 AM
thanks for posting

MelissaCato
07-19-2011, 09:37 AM
It's an Opinion Poll (http://www.whatis-theplan.org/t6098-opinion-on-ron-paul) asking "Is change possible within the system?"


Yes, via Ron Paul.[ 12 ] [75%]
Maybe, but not through Ron Paul.[ 1 ] [6%]
No, the system will never let Ron Paul win or Ron Paul is a phony.[ 3 ] [18%]

PastaRocket848
07-19-2011, 09:39 AM
"He opposes Medicare - See SSI. Medical care should be a right, not a priviledge based on how much money you have. Frankly, Medicare should be expanded to cover ALL American citizens, IMHO."

therein lies the problem. a lot of people just don't get the big picture. i wonder if they support slavery? they seem to feel as though someone else's labor is their "right". messed up society...

eleganz
07-19-2011, 09:46 AM
I can't believe people mistake free-market to the fascist-market we currently have. Some people still believe America it the 'freest-market' in the world.

PastaRocket848
07-19-2011, 09:50 AM
the closest thing to a free market the world has is the internet... and it's doing pretty damn well.

robertwerden
07-19-2011, 10:08 AM
I posted under the name revolution2012

Nirvikalpa
07-19-2011, 10:13 AM
There's more Anonymous RP'ers than meet the eye. Trust me.

Cowlesy
07-19-2011, 10:16 AM
they are outweighed in a big way by his ideas that seem - to me - to go against everything Anonymous fights for. Namely equality:


If these people are egalitarians, then Ron Paul is not their man.

Egalitarianism:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpQa8XQG8wU

torchbearer
07-19-2011, 10:18 AM
anyone heard of the new social media put out by anon called anon+, apparently google has pissed off anon by closing its google+ account.

Bern
07-19-2011, 10:21 AM
"... Medical care should be a right, ..."

Really? I suppose eating should also be a right. The entire food industry should be giving their products away at cost? Yes, comrade, I hear you.

Restore-America-NOW
07-19-2011, 10:21 AM
Anonymous should come out and endorse Ron Paul.

MelissaCato
07-19-2011, 10:26 AM
Good post over there Robert.


Is change possible within the system?

Yes, via Ron Paul.[ 17 ] [77%]
Maybe, but not through Ron Paul.[ 2 ] [9%]
No, the system will never let Ron Paul win or Ron Paul is a phony.[ 3 ] [13%]

Unelected
07-19-2011, 10:44 AM
I'm a member of that forum. There are quite a few libertarians there right now.

mczerone
07-19-2011, 10:52 AM
If these people are egalitarians, then Ron Paul is not their man.

Egalitarianism:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpQa8XQG8wU

"Equality" does not necessarily mean "egalitarianism." It seems that they mostly have their hearts in the right place, in that they want access to services to not be determined by privilege.

Their ideas about how to go about implementing this are what "go against everything anonymous stands for", namely freedom from tyrants.

If they listened to Ron Paul, he'd be their man.

PastaRocket848
07-19-2011, 10:56 AM
yeah... im no anonymous fan. they're busch league script kiddies yearning for attention. i doubt theyre much of a voting block, most probably arent even of age. they give white hats a bad name by trying to play the middle of the field. good thing theyre not so "anonymous" anymore and are currently being arrested by the dozens.

Unelected
07-19-2011, 11:01 AM
yeah... im no anonymous fan. they're busch league script kiddies yearning for attention. i doubt theyre much of a voting block, most probably arent even of age. they give white hats a bad name by trying to play the middle of the field. good thing theyre not so "anonymous" anymore and are currently being arrested by the dozens.

As if most "white hats" aren't skidiots either, right? It doesn't matter if they don't go to vote. It just matters that they'll vote in polls online and probably spread information about Ron Paul online too. Either ways, most of the *chan/anonymous/lulzsec losers support Ron Paul already.

ctiger2
07-19-2011, 11:02 AM
"He opposes Medicare - See SSI. Medical care should be a right, not a priviledge based on how much money you have. Frankly, Medicare should be expanded to cover ALL American citizens, IMHO."

therein lies the problem. a lot of people just don't get the big picture. i wonder if they support slavery? they seem to feel as though someone else's labor is their "right". messed up society...

Yep, Health Care and Education CAN'T be a right, otherwise you endorse SLAVERY.

The rights are: LIFE, LIBERTY and PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS. All 3 of these don't require anyone to be your slave. I'd argue you could replace PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS w/PROPERTY ie eliminate property taxes.

PastaRocket848
07-19-2011, 02:19 PM
As if most "white hats" aren't skidiots either, right? It doesn't matter if they don't go to vote. It just matters that they'll vote in polls online and probably spread information about Ron Paul online too. Either ways, most of the *chan/anonymous/lulzsec losers support Ron Paul already.

atleast the ones that aren't in jail yet (http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/07/19/exclusive-fbi-search-warrants-nationwide-hunt-anonymous/)