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Karsten
10-30-2007, 05:55 PM
Today I met a good friend that I haven't seen in a while. I told her about Ron Paul and handed her some literature. Her first question was "is he an environmentalist?" I told her to just read what I gave her, but she asked be the same question about 3 more times throughout our conversation. She is the kind of person who saves every unused napkin she can and is crazy about recycling. How do I promote Ron Paul to someone like that?

Adamsa
10-30-2007, 06:02 PM
Well, he is kind of, not in the stereotypical way. Private property rights really play into it, so yeah, no one can pollute anything they don't own, and who wants to pollute things they own?

Ron did say if there was anything that absolutely needed to be done for the atmosphere he'd find a way to do it, at the moment though he isn't a 100% believer.

Karsten
10-30-2007, 06:06 PM
Are there any good links to articles referencing Ron Paul's free market environmentalism?

freelance
10-30-2007, 06:06 PM
I would say skip it and go for the low-hanging fruit, except that a funny thing happened not too long ago. I have been trying to awaken one of my friends for years--YEARS! She's just like your friend, but I love her and her husband dearly, so I used to just close my ears and roll my eyes. Organic this, recycle that. I often just wanted to strangle her.

I tried talking to her about RP when he first announced. No luck. Well, don't you know that just before RP came to town, I got this breathless call from her and she was just gushing about RP. I laughed my ass off! The other funny thing is that I eat almost totally organic now and I recycle a bit here and there, when I remember. And, my friend may have been the one to plant the seed. I think maybe some seeds need to be planted and then left to germinate on their own.

SO, while RP is no AlGore (thank God), just plant the RP seed until some other person on here can give you a definitive answer. I really don't know how to sell his environmental stand, because it's not really all that clear to me. I don't buy all this carbon footprint crap anyway. I'll change my lifestyle just as soon as people like Exxon are held accountable for the Valdez and Dow is held responsible for Bopal. Until then, I plan on using a computer, driving a car and blowdrying my hair.

synthetic
10-30-2007, 06:06 PM
Tell her Ron wants to end these needless wars and stop the Pentagon from burning 340,000 barrels of oil everyday.

Karsten
10-30-2007, 06:07 PM
Tell her Ron wants to end these needless wars and stop the Pentagon from burning 340,000 barrels of oil everyday.

I told her that he's an anti-war Republican and she said "so?"

Stealth4
10-30-2007, 06:10 PM
He grows organic tomatos and loves the land.

Says so in one slim jim.

synthetic
10-30-2007, 06:10 PM
So?

If shes so worried about the environment and can't make the connection between the two, help her out.

The Pentagon is burning over 124 million barrels of oil a year for these wars.

WillInMiami
10-30-2007, 06:11 PM
Today I met a good friend that I haven't seen in a while. I told her about Ron Paul and handed her some literature. Her first question was "is he an environmentalist?" I told her to just read what I gave her, but she asked be the same question about 3 more times throughout our conversation. She is the kind of person who saves every unused napkin she can and is crazy about recycling. How do I promote Ron Paul to someone like that?

You can't. She's obviously a single-issue zealot and should be barred from voting if she cannot answer a VERY SIMPLE civics exam. Move on and work on "converting" someone with a brain. Don't waste your time on a simple-minded tree-hugger.

Richandler
10-30-2007, 06:13 PM
It's really hard to convey to people that the War is the single biggest problem with every issue in America. Haha. 124 million barrels of oil!

ronpaulyourmom
10-30-2007, 06:14 PM
Today I met a good friend that I haven't seen in a while. I told her about Ron Paul and handed her some literature. Her first question was "is he an environmentalist?" I told her to just read what I gave her, but she asked be the same question about 3 more times throughout our conversation. She is the kind of person who saves every unused napkin she can and is crazy about recycling. How do I promote Ron Paul to someone like that?

Tell her that if he were president every big pollutor would be in gigantic class action lawsuits because we would uphold private property laws... or something like that.

Also mention that the US pentagon is something like the 5th largest pollutor in the world? I cant confirm that number but I remember it being very very big.

WillInMiami
10-30-2007, 06:16 PM
It's really hard to convey to people that the War is the single biggest problem with every issue in America. Haha. 124 million barrels of oil!

The war is NOT the "single biggest problem with every issue in America". You're no better than the simple-minded, tree hugging zealot.

That's not to say that we should be spending so much money on the occupation of Iraq. We should not be doing so. However, there are MANY important issues facing the United States that are not at all related to "the war".

JosephTheLibertarian
10-30-2007, 06:18 PM
Today I met a good friend that I haven't seen in a while. I told her about Ron Paul and handed her some literature. Her first question was "is he an environmentalist?" I told her to just read what I gave her, but she asked be the same question about 3 more times throughout our conversation. She is the kind of person who saves every unused napkin she can and is crazy about recycling. How do I promote Ron Paul to someone like that?

she's a liberal authoritarian I guess. She wants laws that tell people what to do

I bet she's a stickler for smoking bans ;)

erowe1
10-30-2007, 06:23 PM
Today I met a good friend that I haven't seen in a while. I told her about Ron Paul and handed her some literature. Her first question was "is he an environmentalist?" I told her to just read what I gave her, but she asked be the same question about 3 more times throughout our conversation. She is the kind of person who saves every unused napkin she can and is crazy about recycling. How do I promote Ron Paul to someone like that?

I would respond to her with a question, like, "In what ways do you think environmentalism should impact federal policies?" And stay in dialog with her as she answers, for each thing she comes up with ask her why she thinks each of her ideas is more appropriately handled by the federal government than by state and local governments. Perhaps ask her, "Do you think there should be a one-size-fits-all environmental policy for the whole country? Or should each state be responsible for the environmental issues that impact it?" If she shows some receptivity to that line of argument then she's worth working on. If she is a one-issue voter who wants us to sign Kyoto, then I wouldn't waste any time on her.

JosephTheLibertarian
10-30-2007, 06:26 PM
if you're good with people:

emphasis property law

if you're not good with people:

just say "join the green party" and leave her alone

kutibah
10-30-2007, 06:27 PM
Well I am an environmentalist, but I decided to choose Liberty over the Environment. Our rights are more important for now, at least until we get things back to where they were. So try and ask her which of the two are more important to her.

ronpaulyourmom
10-30-2007, 06:36 PM
Maybe bring up the fact that Ron Paul is one of the very few people not willing to consider ethanol subsidies. That'll probably play well with her.

tiznow
10-30-2007, 06:59 PM
Today I met a good friend that I haven't seen in a while. I told her about Ron Paul and handed her some literature. Her first question was "is he an environmentalist?" I told her to just read what I gave her, but she asked be the same question about 3 more times throughout our conversation. She is the kind of person who saves every unused napkin she can and is crazy about recycling. How do I promote Ron Paul to someone like that?

have her watch penn and teller's episode about recycling on their show bullshit gotta start at the root of the problem :D

margomaps
10-30-2007, 07:32 PM
I think Ron discussed this in the Adam Curry interview recently. Google Adam Curry podcast Ron Paul and you'll probably find it.

Ron talked about how strictly protecting property rights means that nobody has the right to pollute anyone else's air, land, water, etc. He also said something that might make your environmental friend happy: he believes the federal government should stop subsidizing the oil companies, and if that happens, alternative clean energy sources will have a chance to compete.

OptionsTrader
10-30-2007, 08:17 PM
Is he an environmentalist?"

He is if your environment happens to be adjacent to a crude oil field... a much more pleasant less deadly environment for those unfortunate individuals if Ron Paul were elected. But, in seriousness, the EPA is a failure like any other unconstitutional government agency. If you want to do something incredibly substantial immediately to reduce CO2 emissions, scale back the aggressive empire, the number one fuel consumer on the planet.

Exon
10-30-2007, 08:56 PM
Here are some links:

Ron Paul's Green Record is Outstanding (http://upstreamdownstairs.blogspot.com/2007/08/ron-pauls-green-record-is-outstanding.html)

Ron Paul and the Environment (http://upstreamdownstairs.blogspot.com/2007/08/ron-paul-and-environment.html)

Interview with Ron Paul at 'Grist' magazine (http://www.grist.org/feature/2007/10/16/paul/)

Ron Paul is a very strong, if unconventional, candidate on environmental issues, and we should not sell him short! It may take some time to properly explain his position, but it is worth it.