Red light camera company gives city of Houston ultimatum.

[Nate-ForLiberty]

http://www.click2houston.com/news/28296052/detail.html


The company that owns the red light cameras in Houston has given the city an ultimatum: Turn the cameras back on and begin issuing tickets again or face back bills of more than $20 million.

U.S. District Judge Lynn Hughes said Friday that the issue as presented on the November ballot violated Houston's city charter covering the repeal of an ordinance.

.....

Hughes said the city can keep the red-light cameras, or the city has the option of paying the company the extent of the contract.

.....

The city received a letter from American Traffic Solutions Monday with the ultimatum. The company said that if it does not receive a response from the city, it would take action to resume processing red light violations on Aug. 1.


August 1st is the deadline. Looks like they are just going to let the deadline pass. Then ATS can sue the city for breach of contract, forcing Houston to turn the cameras back on.... or something like that. This is pretty slick.

[Anti Federalist]

August 1st is the deadline. Looks like they are just going to let the deadline pass. Then ATS can sue the city for breach of contract, forcing Houston to turn the cameras back on.... or something like that. This is pretty slick.

It looks worse than that:


The city received a letter from American Traffic Solutions Monday with the ultimatum. The company said that if it does not receive a response from the city, it would take action to resume processing red light violations on Aug. 1.

My reading of that indicates to me anyway, that ATS can and will start issuing fines regardless of what the city, the cops, the people or the law says.

[Romulus]

Contracts are contracts... not to say those shouldn't be challenged in this case, but lesson to all cities who sign them.

Our town kicked out ATS as soon as the contract expired. The took down their cameras in the dark of the night and were all gone the next day. We claimed Victory here.

[Romulus]

It looks worse than that:



My reading of that indicates to me anyway, that ATS can and will start issuing fines regardless of what the city, the cops, the people or the law says.

That only works, if the people willing pay those fines, and the local cops/judges enforce them. They put a bureaucratic strain on the city, so in our case, if you didn't pay, it wasn't worth the effort to collect. ATS can go pound sand.

[Anti Federalist]

Contracts are contracts... not to say those shouldn't be challenged in this case, but lesson to all cities who sign them.

Our town kicked out ATS as soon as the contract expired. The took down their cameras in the dark of the night and we all gone the next day. We claimed Victory here.

Where is "here" if you don't mind posting it?

[Nate-ForLiberty]

Contracts are contracts... not to say those shouldn't be challenged in this case, but lesson to all cities who sign them.

Our town kicked out ATS as soon as the contract expired. The took down their cameras in the dark of the night and were all gone the next day. We claimed Victory here.

A contract is void if it is illegal.

[Krugerrand]

There should then be no consequences to an individual who simply places a plastic bag over the cameras, no?

[Romulus]

Where is "here" if you don't mind posting it?

small town MIAC state

[nobody's_hero]

Contracts are contracts... not to say those shouldn't be challenged in this case, but lesson to all cities who sign them.

Our town kicked out ATS as soon as the contract expired. The took down their cameras in the dark of the night and were all gone the next day. We claimed Victory here.

Unless the contract was nullified on the grounds that the people themselves did not support them.

If the government contracted out your labor without your input, would you see to it that the contract is voided or just be like, "Oh, well, a contract is a contract."? lol

The Houston city council should have put the idea of traffic cameras to a vote before even considering a contract. But city councilmen seem to never get input from the people before making up some new B.S. ordinance.

(I'm willing to bet that the people who own ATS either don't understand, or hate, the idea of a 'government deriving its just powers from the consent of the governed', so my argument would probably sail right over their heads)

[hillbilly123069]

Where is the company HQ's located?

[flightlesskiwi]

The Houston city council should have put the idea of traffic cameras to a vote before even considering a contract. But city councilmen seem to never get input from the people before making up some new B.S. ordinance.

qft.

[tangent4ronpaul]

There should then be no consequences to an individual who simply places a plastic bag over the cameras, no?

The British are a bit more aggressive in dealing with these things.

http://www.speedcam.co.uk/gatso2.htm

has a pic gallery of destroyed and burning camera's.

-t

[Brown Sapper]

Maybe its time the people take it a step further and take them down themselves or, at the very least, Notify the company that they are littering on our streets and will be fined $20 million dollars :D.

[Romulus]

Unless the contract was nullified on the grounds that the people themselves did not support them.

If the government contracted out your labor without your input, would you see to it that the contract is voided or just be like, "Oh, well, a contract is a contract."? lol

The Houston city council should have put the idea of traffic cameras to a vote before even considering a contract. But city councilmen seem to never get input from the people before making up some new B.S. ordinance.

(I'm willing to bet that the people who own ATS either don't understand, or hate, the idea of a 'government deriving its just powers from the consent of the governed', so my argument would probably sail right over their heads)

That's what govts do.. they are put in place to make those decisions, whether its just or not, they assume power and make the calls. This is what the council does. If you don't like it, vote out the council. Right or wrong that's how it goes.

ATS could give a crap. They will come in your town, and buy off councilmen, even current and former police chiefs to sway the public and get them installed. They don't screw around.

[Bryan]

Please do not advocate for the disregard of others property, that is against our Code of Ethics (see link in my sig). Thanks.

Based on past news reports, there was only $677,000 left and 4 months needed to cancel (per ATS own words)-- but now they want $20 million? :confused:

If Houston notified them that the contract was to be terminated then ATS needs to uphold its end of the deal of the termination, and if that means removal of equipment, then they need to- but it all depends upon the contract terms.

Whatever the case, these guys are totally out of control.

A good law would be for City Councils to be prevented in their ability to sign contracts that extend beyond their term- those should require voter approval.


Source: "According to ABC-13, Houston has filed a federal lawsuit against American Traffic Solutions over whether the city is liable for $677,000 left on the contract.
...
The contract required four months’ notice for cancellation, according to ATS."

http://www.yourhoustonnews.com/west_university/news/article_68800991-b790-5c1a-a92d-24fe85c1c89f.html

[flightlesskiwi]

A good law would be for City Councils to be prevented in their ability to sign contracts that extend beyond their term- those should require voter approval.


this is a wonderful idea. unfortunately, my city council and mayor would refute the idea on the grounds that "special elections" cost in the range of 17k$ in my town. and they'd also use the "you elected us, you should trust us, if not, don't elect us next election cycle" argument (see Romulus' argument). it's a vicious cycle. and when one (or a group of like-intended individuals) attempts to stand up for government by the consent of the people, one (or the group as a whole) is referred to as "obstructionist".

gotta love politics.