My parent's neighbor got a ticket for killing a goat in her backyard

[TheBlackPeterSchiff]

She's a Haitian woman, I dont know if it was for food or sacrifice, but it was of Haitian tradition. My mom said the other neighbors called the police after they heard the goat scream and they saw the lady hacking at the goat in her back yard. She didn't go to jail but she got a hefty fine.

What is the constitutionality of this. My parents were fine with it but I was pissed. Who the hell was she harming. Sure, the goat made noise but out side of that, what's wrong with killing a goat. My mom was like, "if she was in the country that would be fine, but we are in a city, you cant do that" Im like what's the difference. Its on her property. She wasn't hurting anybody, know she has to take time to go to court and pay a hefty fine.

[acptulsa]

So go with her, and argue her First Amendment rights to free expression of religion. Take a library book on the subject and/or some Haitians who can testify to it.

Check and see how much they might jack the court costs if you fail, first, and let her know what she's risking.

[TheBlackPeterSchiff]

I'm seriously thinking about it. But I get super freaked when speaking in public.

[acptulsa]

Judges put their robes on one sleeve at a time.

[Jay Tea]

What was the specific citation? Noise violation? Health code? Something else?

[TruckinMike]

I'm seriously thinking about it. But I get super freaked when speaking in public.

No worries... once you get started your blood will begin to flow -- you'll get in a groove. Just fill your skull with relevant facts and let loose.

Just do it!!!

TMike

[Anti Federalist]

This has been adjudicated before, in NYC IIRC.

What is the difference between that and kosher chicken slaughter?

My google fu is weak right now, but if it's part of a religious rite, it is protected.

[LibertyEagle]

I don't know, AF. Cities usually have ordinances about keeping farm animals in your backyard. Much less slaughtering them.

[acptulsa]

Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye v. City of Hialeah

Plug that in your search engine and smoke 'em, BPS.

[Anti Federalist]

I don't know, AF. Cities usually have ordinances about keeping farm animals in your backyard. Much less slaughtering them.

I'm sure they do.

But if the system is even close to working properly, an ordinance that violates the First Amendment should be struck down.

Imagine what kind of "ordinances" could be written WRT to ceremonial eating of human flesh and drinking of human blood?

[acptulsa]

I'm sure they do.

But if the system is even close to working properly, an ordinance that violates the First Amendment should be struck down.

Imagine what kind of "ordinances" could be written WRT to ceremonial eating of human flesh and drinking of human blood?

Yes, it should be excepted, if not struck down. Unless it involves harming humans--then the First has traditionally been limited.

[Anti Federalist]

Yes, it should be excepted, if not struck down. Unless it involves harming humans--then the First has traditionally been limited.

Agreed.

Not keen to see human sacrifice as "protected" speech.

But, I'm sure that in NYC this was already litigated years ago for kosher slaughter.

I know I recall reading about it somewhere.

[libertybrewcity]

Lol! I think most people would get freaked out at someone hacking a goat to pieces in neighbor's yard.

[AceNZ]

She's a Haitian woman, I dont know if it was for food or sacrifice, but it was of Haitian tradition. My mom said the other neighbors called the police after they heard the goat scream and they saw the lady hacking at the goat in her back yard. She didn't go to jail but she got a hefty fine.

What is the constitutionality of this. My parents were fine with it but I was pissed. Who the hell was she harming. Sure, the goat made noise but out side of that, what's wrong with killing a goat. My mom was like, "if she was in the country that would be fine, but we are in a city, you cant do that" Im like what's the difference. Its on her property. She wasn't hurting anybody, know she has to take time to go to court and pay a hefty fine.

Self-sufficiency in the city is not allowed. It makes for a more effective killing field in the event of food shortages.

I would get on your neighbor's side. Offer to go to court with her; maybe even make a contribution toward the fine if she loses. If / when food gets tight, she sounds like the kind of person you would want to know.

[Vessol]

I say we all slaughter goats and then dance! Or maybe the other way around?

[Live_Free_Or_Die]

If / when food gets tight, she sounds like the kind of person you would want to know.

:)

[acptulsa]

Lol! I think most people would get freaked out at someone hacking a goat to pieces in neighbor's yard.

I suspect 'most people' would refuse to move in next to a goat.

Though we have an interesting neighborhood in Tulsa, It's surrounded by the city, but is 'county land', meaning it isn't in the incorporated city itself. I've seen chickens, goats, sheep, horses and a bull in there over the years. All on half acre lots.

[BamaAla]

Lol! I think most people would get freaked out at someone hacking a goat to pieces in neighbor's yard.

Yall don't have a hog slaughtering on the first cold day of fall in Virginia? Sheesh, I thought yall were southern:p

[specsaregood]

Agreed.
Not keen to see human sacrifice as "protected" speech.
But, I'm sure that in NYC this was already litigated years ago for kosher slaughter.
I know I recall reading about it somewhere.

You sure you aren't thinking of the movie "Devil's Advocate"? It was his first case in NYC.

I still remember fondly the day when my 4month old puppy came home dragging a half-bbq'd goat leg that she had clearly jacked from some neigthbors grill.

[freshjiva]

This is one area that I am still not sure about. Where do animal rights fit into a free society? Do animals even have rights? Would a libertarian, Constitutionally-limited government permit the slaughtering of dolphins or engaging in dog fighting rings?

[Anti Federalist]

You sure you aren't thinking of the movie "Devil's Advocate"? It was his first case in NYC.

I still remember fondly the day when my 4month old puppy came home dragging a half-bbq'd goat leg that she had clearly jacked from some neigthbors grill.

LOL - yeah, when art imitates life, right...that was a voodoo case IIRC.

No, this was back in the 80s, as the Hasidic community grew larger.

Or maybe it was in Lakewood NJ.

[AceNZ]

This is one area that I am still not sure about. Where do animal rights fit into a free society? Do animals even have rights? Would a libertarian, Constitutionally-limited government permit the slaughtering of dolphins or engaging in dog fighting rings?

Animals do not have rights. Government should not be involved in protecting them. If you don't like how someone is treating them, then don't support them; don't buy their products; don't hire them; don't run their commercials, etc. Vote with your actions, not by creating laws.

[LisaNY]

LOL - yeah, when art imitates life, right...that was a voodoo case IIRC.

No, this was back in the 80s, as the Hasidic community grew larger.

Or maybe it was in Lakewood NJ.

Maybe you are thinking of Rockland County, NY. We have a few hasidic communities here and they do a chicken slaughter every year:

hxxp://failedmessiah.typepad.com/failed_messiahcom/2010/02/haredi-kapparot-operators-leave-unpaid-health-code-fines-call-health-board-antisemitic-567.html

[oyarde]

Lol! I think most people would get freaked out at someone hacking a goat to pieces in neighbor's yard.

Not if they bring me a bbq goat fajita . Tasty .

[Koz]

She shouldn't be hacking the goat, just slit its throat. Dead in minutes with little pain. Young goats are delicious. I wish I had neighbors like that. I'm the one in the neighborhood coming home with dead critters.