How do People On RPF Feel About the Conceal Carry Incident (link inside)

[cdc482]

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?293475-SHOCKING-AUDIO-Philadelphia-Police-violate-rights-of-open-carrier-at-gunpoint/page5

I was disappointed by the responses given by some RPF members on this video, so I posted a reply that I thought was agreeable to most people. Instead, I have lost more faith in humanity in the discussion that followed.

This actually happened once before. But last time many people posted after me saying that they agreed, and not to worry because some RP supporters were a little nutty. As of now, it looks as though I am alone in my view, which I thought was perfectly reasonable to everyone. Please post/vote here and reassure me.

You know that feeling I am going through now? Like the feeling from reading the posts on facebook when Osama died. Like all of humanity is just not worth saving because they end up so fucked up anyway. Like Holden McCaulfield. That's how I feel right now. Help me out.

[Expatriate]

Are cops also dicks simply for open carrying?

[cdc482]

No. Because it doesn't cause a panic. It is a norm.

[LibForestPaul]

No. Because it doesn't cause a panic. It is a norm.

Why is one a norm and one not? Officers in Britain did not carry for decades.

Why am I responsible for other people's reactions? Childish as they may be?

If you or others are panicking because of legal behavior, perhaps you and others need to learn about American values.

[aGameOfThrones]

You forgot to add, 'is cdc482 being a dick'.

[aGameOfThrones]

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?293475-SHOCKING-AUDIO-Philadelphia-Police-violate-rights-of-open-carrier-at-gunpoint/page5

I was disappointed by the responses given by some RPF members on this video, so I posted a reply that I thought was agreeable to most people. Instead, I have lost more faith in humanity in the discussion that followed.

This actually happened once before. But last time many people posted after me saying that they agreed, and not to worry because some RP supporters were a little nutty. As of now, it looks as though I am alone in my view, which I thought was perfectly reasonable to everyone. Please post/vote here and reassure me.

You know that feeling I am going through now? Like the feeling from reading the posts on facebook when Osama died. Like all of humanity is just not worth saving because they end up so fucked up anyway. Like Holden McCaulfield. That's how I feel right now. Help me out.

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[Dr.3D]

Ehhhhh, what's being a dick mean?

[aGameOfThrones]

Ehhhhh, what's being a dick mean?

Making this thread?

[heavenlyboy34]

You forgot to add, 'is cdc482 being a dick'.

this^^

[Dr.3D]

Making this thread?

Sorry, but I grew up in the 60s, is being a dick the same as being a prick?

[ghengis86]

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Thank you

[Sola_Fide]

"The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." -George Washington

...

[Liberty Rebellion]

You forgot to add, 'is cdc482 being a dick'.

I would vote for that

[aGameOfThrones]

...



"The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that's good." -George Washington





Stupid Ron Paul supporter!

/s

[Expatriate]

No. Because it doesn't cause a panic. It is a norm.

Not exercising rights because they are no longer in fashion leads to those rights not being legally protected any more. If nobody was a "dick" and open carried, it would be quickly outlawed due to a lack of advocacy. You indicated in the other thread that you supported the right to OC. How then would you also support a course of action that would lead to it being outlawed?

Also, Sikh turbans and kirpans in public make many people uncomfortable, and people have been known to panic and call the police over them because they think they are "terrorists". Does this mean they are dicks for practicing their religion which requires them to wear these items?

[Dr.3D]

Wow, has RPF really changed so much since the OP was here last?

[aGameOfThrones]

Not exercising rights because they are no longer in fashion leads to those rights not being legally protected any more. If nobody was a "dick" and open carried, it would be quickly outlawed due to a lack of advocacy. You indicated in the other thread that you supported the right to OC. How then would you also support a course of action that would lead to it being outlawed?

Also, Sikh turbans and kirpans in public make many people uncomfortable, and people have been known to panic and call the police over them because they think they are "terrorists". Does this mean they are dicks for practicing their religion which requires them to wear these items?


The color of people's skin used cause immense panic. In fact, to some it still does.

[pcosmar]

Damn.
Today a backpack causes panic. A empty bag or box causes panic.
tourists taking pictures causes panic.

Do you WANT that to be the "norm" or do you want to discourage that stupid behavior?

[Liberty Rebellion]

OP, seeing a gun doesn't cause a panic in most people. In my circle of friends and relatives, most of them don't get paniced over the site of a gun

[pcosmar]

No. Because it doesn't cause a panic. It is a norm.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/Pictures/Dec05/151205police.jpg

It Is.
God help us. if that is normal and this is not.

http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/HG_growingpains_201005-A.jpg

http://www.ammoland.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Picnic1.jpg

[aGameOfThrones]

http://www.prisonplanet.com/Pictures/Dec05/151205police.jpg

It Is.
God help us. if that is normal and this is not.

http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/HG_growingpains_201005-A.jpg

http://www.ammoland.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Picnic1.jpg

Rep+

[James Madison]

...

I heard he was a terrorist and with Al-Qaeda...


/s

[aGameOfThrones]

14 trillion national debt, don't panic... It's the norm.

[cdc482]

Show me a picture of a guy carrying a gun around in a shopping mall.

Brb, I have to go eat dog feces. I heard that Congress would make it illegal if no one in the entire country did it all year.

Word of advice just because you might turn off some potential Ron Paul supporters: putting words in the mouth of your opponent and/or demonizing them is probably the best way to look stupid in a political discussion.

[aGameOfThrones]

Show me a picture of a guy carrying a gun around in a shopping mall.

Brb, I have to go eat dog feces. I heard that Congress would make it illegal if no one in the entire country did it all year.

Word of advice just because you might turn off some potential Ron Paul supporters: putting words in the mouth of your opponent and/or demonizing them is probably the best way to look stupid in a political discussion.

http://www.sohood.com/ps/observestill.jpg

[Anti Federalist]

Well, I don't have a picture, but the next time I go, I'll be sure to have Mrs. AF snap one.

Open carry of course.

Since I'm out in the woods and it takes a while to get to the mall, how about a hardware store? Gas station? Feed store? NAPA?


Show me a picture of a guy carrying a gun around in a shopping mall.

Brb, I have to go eat dog feces. I heard that Congress would make it illegal if no one in the entire country did it all year.

Word of advice just because you might turn off some potential Ron Paul supporters: putting words in the mouth of your opponent and/or demonizing them is probably the best way to look stupid in a political discussion.

[aGameOfThrones]

Show me a picture of a guy carrying a gun around in a shopping mall.

Brb, I have to go eat dog feces. I heard that Congress would make it illegal if no one in the entire country did it all year.

Word of advice just because you might turn off some potential Ron Paul supporters: putting words in the mouth of your opponent and/or demonizing them is probably the best way to look stupid in a political discussion.

Discussion? LOL

[Anti Federalist]

You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later.


http://www.prisonplanet.com/Pictures/Dec05/151205police.jpg

It Is.
God help us. if that is normal and this is not.

http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/HG_growingpains_201005-A.jpg

http://www.ammoland.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Picnic1.jpg

[aGameOfThrones]

Well, I don't have a picture, but the next time I go, I'll be sure to have Mrs. AF snap one.

Open carry of course.

Since I'm out in the woods and it takes a while to get to the mall, how about a hardware store? Gas station? Feed store? NAPA?


I'm not sure if it was you(most likely) who posted a few stories about people freaking out at malls 'cause they thought they saw a man with a gun that later turned out to be an umbrella. 'cause umbrellas are not the norm.

[pcosmar]

Show me a picture of a guy carrying a gun around in a shopping mall.



I would rather post some pick of the police State in evidence in the small community I live in.
Less than 20,000 people and very little crime (there never has been) and a growing multifaceted police presence.
Passing by the Locks I saw "security" with 12ga riot guns. This is a very new development and has no reason. There have been NO incidents to justify it.

Very disconcerting developments.

[Expatriate]

Show me a picture of a guy carrying a gun around in a shopping mall.

Brb, I have to go eat dog feces. I heard that Congress would make it illegal if no one in the entire country did it all year.

Word of advice just because you might turn off some potential Ron Paul supporters: putting words in the mouth of your opponent and/or demonizing them is probably the best way to look stupid in a political discussion.



I don't think anyone put words in your mouth, and if a shopping mall is private property it should be able to mandate any conditions it wants for entry.

Enjoy your dog feces, just make sure you don't ingest any of the far less harmful substances that have been outlawed because people panicked and it wasn't considered the "norm" to do so.

[Expatriate]

http://www.prisonplanet.com/Pictures/Dec05/151205police.jpg

It Is.
God help us. if that is normal and this is not.

http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/HG_growingpains_201005-A.jpg

http://www.ammoland.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Picnic1.jpg

Best and saddest image post ever. +rep

[Anti Federalist]

I'm not sure if it was you(most likely) who posted a few stories about people freaking out at malls 'cause they thought they saw a man with a gun that later turned out to be an umbrella. 'cause umbrellas are not the norm.

Yeah, it was me.

Those stories were out of Mass and CA, respectively.

I wouldn't try it in Mass. on a bet.

True story: I'm flying to my bro's house in FL once, about ten years ago, not too long after 9/11 at any rate.

I carried two Beretta M9s with me, locked, in checked luggage, no ammo, all legal beagle.

I get to the ticket counter, declare the firearms to the check-in broad, just like you're supposed to.

She asks to see them and confirm they are unloaded, which is also all by the book.

So I break out the case, unlock it, hold the weapon in a safe direction and rack the slide to confirm the pipe is empty.

This dizzy fucking broad does what? Screams...!!!

Jesus H. Christ!

I drop the pistol, close the case and back away form the counter, double time.

She apologizes and asks "why did you back away sir?"

Between clenched teeth and as quietly as I could, I seethed a profanity laced rant at her for about 2 minutes, the upshot of it was, "Do you realize how close you just came to getting me killed, with 10,000 cops hut hutting around just itching to blow somebody away, and you scream, they turn, and see a man with handgun out?"

Fuck.

[AFPVet]

Best and saddest image post ever. +rep

The latter two pictures are perfect examples of exercising our Second Amendment right. If we don't exercise it, we lose it!

[Anti Federalist]

On youtube, when a couple of people rate down an epic video, wits will come along and say, if it was a outstanding song for instance, that "12 people don't have ears", or "12 people would not know a good song if you hit them with the sheet music"

Well, in this thread, one person is a dick.

LoL

[mport1]

The cops like usual was the only dicks.

[Teaser Rate]

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?293475-SHOCKING-AUDIO-Philadelphia-Police-violate-rights-of-open-carrier-at-gunpoint/page5

I was disappointed by the responses given by some RPF members on this video, so I posted a reply that I thought was agreeable to most people. Instead, I have lost more faith in humanity in the discussion that followed.

This actually happened once before. But last time many people posted after me saying that they agreed, and not to worry because some RP supporters were a little nutty. As of now, it looks as though I am alone in my view, which I thought was perfectly reasonable to everyone. Please post/vote here and reassure me.

You know that feeling I am going through now? Like the feeling from reading the posts on facebook when Osama died. Like all of humanity is just not worth saving because they end up so fucked up anyway. Like Holden McCaulfield. That's how I feel right now. Help me out.

You can't lose faith in humanity just because a few crazies who believe that policemen who put their lives on the line to protect the public are actually an arm of an invading army secretly controlled by the new world order; an evil all-powerful group of men who are behind every war, financial crisis and terrorist attack in US history intent of killing us all through a police state and eugenics make stupid comments on a forum. (Even if they do happen to have a high rep)

[low preference guy]

You can't lose faith in humanity just because a few crazies who believe that policemen who put their lives on the line to protect the public

If by protecting the public you mean bullying innocents and getting cheap thrills by terrorizing innocent people like they do in raids to search for drugs, then I guess you might have a point.

[Teaser Rate]

If by protecting the public you mean bullying innocents and getting cheap thrills by terrorizing innocent people like they do in raids to search for drugs, then I guess you might have a point.

If you feel that way, then would you be in favor of dismantling the Police Department in your town/city?

[low preference guy]

If you feel that way, then would you be in favor of dismantling the Police Department in your town/city?

I would just not pretend that they can be characterized as people who "put their lives on the line to protect the public" (LOL!). Then one can start focusing in all the evil they do so that pressure is put to change their practices and ensure that most of the psychos in their ranks are fired.

[mport1]

If by protecting the public you mean bullying innocents and getting cheap thrills by terrorizing innocent people like they do in raids to search for drugs, then I guess you might have a point.

I'd say about 5% of what the cops do could be considered protection. And this protection is paid for through the theft of taxation.

With all the cop brutality and nonsense going on nowadays, I hope people finally start considering privatizing defense so we have multiple competing agencies instead of one violent monopoly.

[pcosmar]

If you feel that way, then would you be in favor of dismantling the Police Department in your town/city?

Absofrigginlutely
http://www.constitution.org/lrev/roots/cops.htm
and Cutting the Sheriff dept down to a reasonable level as well.

[Dr.3D]

Come to think about it, I have never heard of an incident where the cops protected anybody. They always show up after the fact and make a report.

[Teaser Rate]

I would just not pretend that they can be characterized as people who "put their lives on the line to protect the public" (LOL!). Then one can start focusing in all the evil they do so that pressure is put to change their practices and ensure that most of the psychos in their ranks are fired.

I'll take that as a no.

So in other words, you're fine with calling cops bullies who get cheap thrills from terrorizing innocent people, but still believe what they do is still essentially good.


I'd say about 5% of what the cops do could be considered protection. And this protection is paid for through the theft of taxation.

With all the cop brutality and nonsense going on nowadays, I hope people finally start considering privatizing defense so we have multiple competing agencies instead of one violent monopoly.

Yes, that totally wouldn't turn into a mob war.

[low preference guy]

I'll take that as a no.

So in other words, you're fine with calling cops bullies who get cheap thrills from terrorizing innocent people, but still believe what they do is still essentially good.

No. Dismantling them and having everyone rely on their own guns will be better than what we have, although not ideal.

[mport1]

Yes, that totally wouldn't turn into a mob war.

No it wouldn't. What we have now is the mob. Actually it is MUCH worse than the mob because they are seen as having legitimate authority by most people.

The books give some good examples of how private defense could work:
For A New Liberty (http://mises.org/media.aspx?action=category&ID=87)
The Market For Liberty (http://freekeene.com/2007/12/26/free-audiobook-the-market-for-liberty/)
Practical Anarchy (http://www.freedomainradio.com/FreeBooks/PracticalAnarchy.aspx)

[Pericles]

No. Dismantling them and having everyone rely on their own guns will be better than what we have, although not ideal.

"Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, for I am the most heavily armed son of a bitch in the valley"

[Anti Federalist]

You can't lose faith in humanity just because a few crazies who believe that policemen who put their lives on the line to protect the public are actually an arm of an invading army secretly controlled by the new world order; an evil all-powerful group of men who are behind every war, financial crisis and terrorist attack in US history intent of killing us all through a police state and eugenics make stupid comments on a forum. (Even if they do happen to have a high rep)

LoLz - God...it truly is lonely at the top.

[cdc482]

only 10% of people admit that it is a dick move to open carry a gun in a public shopping mall.
That's just sad.

I think you have the right to do heroine, throw out food, refuse to help the old lady cross the street and wear a Jason mask into a movie theater. But they are still bad ideas even if you have the right to do them.

I find it really creepy when people take libertarian ideals into their personal life. Even Ron Paul knows to draw a line. He personally believes that we all have an obligation to help those less fortunate, even though using force to get others to do so is wrong.

I'm done arguing, because I think I have made my point at least a couple of times. I thought Ron Paul supporters/people in general were more intelligent.
The poll results were kind of depressing, but definitely shaped my thoughts in a significant way.

You guys make libertarians look bad. Like Ron Swanson in Parks and Recreation. These are ignorant views that most proponents of libertarian don't believe. DRAW A LINE.

[mport1]

only 10% of people admit that it is a dick move to open carry a gun in a public shopping mall.
That's just sad.

I think you have the right to do heroine, throw out food, refuse to help the old lady cross the street and wear a Jason mask into a movie theater. But they are still bad ideas even if you have the right to do them.

I find it really creepy when people take libertarian ideals into their personal life. Even Ron Paul knows to draw a line. He personally believes that we all have an obligation to help those less fortunate, even though using force to get others to do so is wrong.

It is the opposite of a dick move. By carrying a weapon he is able to provide protection for himself and others. I wish a ton more people would open carry everywhere.

[aGameOfThrones]

only 10% of people admit that it is a dick move to open carry a gun in a public shopping mall.
That's just sad.

I think you have the right to do heroine, throw out food, refuse to help the old lady cross the street and wear a Jason mask into a movie theater. But they are still bad ideas even if you have the right to do them.



I find it really creepy when people take libertarian ideals into their personal life. Even Ron Paul knows to draw a line. He personally believes that we all have an obligation to help those less fortunate, even though using force to get others to do so is wrong.

I'm done arguing, because I think I have made my point at least a couple of times. I thought Ron Paul supporters/people in general were more intelligent.
The poll results were kind of depressing, but definitely shaped my thoughts in a significant way.

You guys make libertarians look bad. Like Ron Swanson in Parks and Recreation. These are ignorant views that most proponents of libertarian don't believe. DRAW A LINE.


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. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . _\. . . . . ._,-%. . . ..`

I can't stop using it.

[VegasPatriot]

Come to think about it, I have never heard of an incident where the cops protected anybody. They always show up after the fact and make a report.
C'mon now, that's just going too far. Believe me, I know there are a lot of bad cops out there. I am one of the founding members of Oath Keepers... not because I have a love affair with police and military... but because I see the need to remind police and military of their oath to the constitution. You may not want to acknowledge that there are indeed "good cops", but they are out there (ever hear of Sheriff Mack?). And we need a lot more of the good ones. That's why I support Oath Keepers.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NTvc1X6LOI&feature=channel_video_title

[Anti Federalist]

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