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Suzu
10-27-2007, 12:50 AM
I sent my neocon friend a link to the "How Ron Paul Might Win" article (from Lew Rockwell site), and this was his reply:


No time to read the whole thing....

Re: "media attention that has followed for Ron Paul..." All of the traditional media that I have seen (that doesn't include the blogs that anyone can create, but only those commercial endeavors - however liberal they might be - who have real viewers and advertisers to satisfy)
categorizes Paul as either a joke, or one whose cult followers have become effective at skewing the unscientific polls to make Paul look way more popular than he really is.

Related, it has also been demonstrated that his fundraising is likewise in no way indicative of genuine support, but rather the result of lonely hearts buying their way into what they see as a social environment of kindred spirits.

What is despicable about Paul is that he knows this, but continues to foster it for his own gain, even at the expense of his poor "followers" knowing they will soon be left hung out to dry and in no way richer for the experience.

Me... I still like Mike. Well, I prefer Newt, but he ain't running.

Paul needs to stop taking those poor peoples' money, and get out of the way so the big men can do their work.

I wrote back and asked him how it has "been demonstrated". He has not replied.

Noog
10-27-2007, 12:56 AM
Your friend is a douche. That is all.

njandrewg
10-27-2007, 12:58 AM
5 bucks says his "real media" is FOX news.

amonasro
10-27-2007, 01:00 AM
"No time to read the whole thing" lol

"Related, it has also been demonstrated that his fundraising is likewise in no way indicative of genuine support, but rather the result of lonely hearts buying their way into what they see as a social environment of kindred spirits." LOLOL

Try lonely hearts who are sick of what this country has/could become.

Lord Xar
10-27-2007, 01:01 AM
wow... to me, he seems just like the 'social misfit' he is saying we all are..

wow, he seems very koolaidish.. I mean, does he know ANY of Ron Paul's stances?

This is the ignorance that MSM and pretty much all the top tier candidates hope comes to the voting booth.... scary.

ctb619
10-27-2007, 01:01 AM
your friend links you are in a cult

Akus
10-27-2007, 01:02 AM
Suzu, just move on. This reply said all that needed to be said about him. He is clueless and knows absolutely NOTHING about Ron Paul. Let him believe whatever he wants to believe.

jgmaynard
10-27-2007, 01:03 AM
I don't know how he could classify Huckleberry Hound as a "big boy" but not Ron, but apart from that...

You/We have the advantage that he is an opponent who believes we don't stand a chance. My response noadays to that: "Yup. You're right. Ron doesn't stand a chance. Keep doing nothing." :)

JM

jgmaynard
10-27-2007, 01:06 AM
...the result of lonely hearts...

ctb619: your friend [th]inks you are in a cult...

Does that make us a Lonely Hearts Cult Band??? :D

JM

Sorry, spaced multi-quoting. Deal. ;)

fj45lvr
10-27-2007, 01:08 AM
Love his close: "Paul needs to stop taking those poor peoples' money, and get out of the way so the big men can do their work."

I guess we can assume "their work" is to continue building up the MASSIVE BIG GOVERNMENT that consumes like a plague of locusts having descended on our fields????

Or maybe is refering to some more endeavors to attack weak 3rd world nations rich in natural resources and make the U.S. less secure in the process???

there is a LOOOOOOOONG Laundry list of "THEIR WORK" .......that IS THE PROBLEM. We need them to be FIRED and the company needs a "restructuring"!!!

Suzu
10-27-2007, 01:10 AM
This dude describes himself as a lassaiz-faire anarcho capitalist, he loves Ayn Rand, and he knows all of Ron Paul's stances. He has told me that he thinks RP is unelectable because he's not a smooth enough talker, and says he'd sooner vote for Hillary if RP wins the nomination because "she'll do less damage".

We've had an ongoing conversation by email/chat since the spring. I detailed more of his views in another post:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=1222

A while ago I sent him the straw poll results from the RP website and asked him what he thinks they mean. Here's what he said:


It means nothing more than when the people in the Paul cult skew the unscientific TV show phone-in polls, or they spam the political blogs, or make catcalls at debates. It's just noise. Meaningless noise from largely unsophisticated, low income people with nothing better to do in their lives.

jgmaynard
10-27-2007, 01:14 AM
Didn't Sun Tzu say something about "Never underestimate your enemies?" :)

JM

work2win
10-27-2007, 01:17 AM
Ahhh...I recognize the type...definitely has a superiority complex.

ctb619
10-27-2007, 01:19 AM
If he is a self described anarcho capitalist how could he possible assert that Hillary would do less damage? I do not understand.

steph3n
10-27-2007, 01:19 AM
I am reading Imperial Hubris now, and The Art of War, this book(AoW) could just as well be written about political campaigns. Through superior planning one can overcome superior numbers. We need to wise up and start winning more battles.

jgmaynard
10-27-2007, 01:26 AM
A faster, more mobile army with superior communication can overcome a larger, slower force. :D

JM

billv
10-27-2007, 01:31 AM
I sent my neocon friend a link to the "How Ron Paul Might Win" article (from Lew Rockwell site), and this was his reply:



I wrote back and asked him how it has "been demonstrated". He has not replied.

The "big men can do their work". Typical macho faux conservative neo-con attitude in my opinion.

Original_Intent
10-27-2007, 01:35 AM
Related, it has also been demonstrated that his fundraising is likewise in no way indicative of genuine support, but rather the result of lonely hearts buying their way into what they see as a social environment of kindred spirits.

How much do I have to donate before you guys love me?:confused:......:D

syborius
10-27-2007, 01:38 AM
I sent my neocon friend a link to the "How Ron Paul Might Win" article (from Lew Rockwell site), and this was his reply:



I wrote back and asked him how it has "been demonstrated". He has not replied.

When an individual of groupthink is confronted anger usually ensues, or in this case he was left with concocting false information that satisfy his worldview. This kind of delusional will be explaining away the next 8 years of a Ron Paul presidency.

foofighter20x
10-27-2007, 01:41 AM
I am reading Imperial Hubris now, and The Art of War, this book(AoW) could just as well be written about political campaigns. Through superior planning one can overcome superior numbers. We need to wise up and start winning more battles.

LOL...

Hate to say it, but planning cooperation here is like trying to heard cats. :p

We have a lot of smart people here. It's just a shame that more than a few of them have onery, stubborn streaks to match their intelligence.

Or haven't you noticed? ;)

steph3n
10-27-2007, 01:48 AM
LOL...

Hate to say it, but planning cooperation here is like trying to heard cats. :p

We have a lot of smart people here. It's just a shame that more than a few of them have onery, stubborn streaks to match their intelligence.

Or haven't you noticed? ;)

I am gathering my materials to be an Army of ONE in my hometown :D DVDs, slides, books.

Nash
10-27-2007, 02:06 AM
This dude describes himself as a lassaiz-faire anarcho capitalist, he loves Ayn Rand, and he knows all of Ron Paul's stances. He has told me that he thinks RP is unelectable because he's not a smooth enough talker, and says he'd sooner vote for Hillary if RP wins the nomination because "she'll do less damage".

We've had an ongoing conversation by email/chat since the spring. I detailed more of his views in another post:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=1222

A while ago I sent him the straw poll results from the RP website and asked him what he thinks they mean. Here's what he said:

No offense but this guy sounds like a serious creep.

I mean how smug can this guy really be? I never understand people who say they believe one thing and then never follow through on it.

I think he's just full of fear to be honest. He's so used to lying politicians "running the show" that he has no idea what to expect if a real human being actually gets into the white house.

Sad really.

Corydoras
10-27-2007, 02:27 AM
I wonder how someone who considers himself a social darwinist could back Huckabee.

Revolution9
10-27-2007, 02:42 AM
LOL...

Hate to say it, but planning cooperation here is like trying to heard cats. :p

We have a lot of smart people here. It's just a shame that more than a few of them have onery, stubborn streaks to match their intelligence.

Or haven't you noticed? ;)

It is a reaction to being born into a world where nobody ever had any advice worthwhile. All my intellectual heroes lved in the 14-1800's.. Except Dr Paul. And he has a stubborn streak too.. Many of his Congressional colleagues probably thought getting hs vote was like directing a cat to do doggie tricks.

Best
Randy

ConstitutionGal
10-27-2007, 03:03 AM
Suzu,

When reading your friend's comments, I suddently had a vision of a cartoon characture with its hands over its ears, shaking its head and repeatedly saying "I can't HEAR you".......

Send your friend my tag-line. I think it applies.

qsecofr
10-27-2007, 03:06 AM
It's funny how the theory changes but the basement remains. First it was a few guys spamming message boards... then a few guys spamming street corners... now its a few guys spamming donations. Pretty soon they'll be living in basements out of fear of those "few" guys spamming ballot boxes.

ConstitutionGal
10-27-2007, 03:09 AM
It's funny how the theory changes but the basement remains. First it was a few guys spamming message boards... then a few guys spamming street corners... now its a few guys spamming donations. Pretty soon they'll be living in basements out of fear of those "few" guys spamming ballot boxes.

We don't have a basement - will our votes still count? ;)

qsecofr
10-27-2007, 03:17 AM
We don't have a basement - will our votes still count? ;)

Depends, if you live in PA you'll have to find the polling center first :D

ConstitutionGal
10-27-2007, 03:20 AM
Depends, if you live in PN you'll have to find the polling center first :D

PN???? -- it's either very late or very early and I'm obviously not awake enough to get it....:confused:

qsecofr
10-27-2007, 03:26 AM
PN???? -- it's either very late or very early and I'm obviously not awake enough to get it....:confused:

haha i was just about to edit that... i shouldn't be up at 2:30AM writing stuff. Stoopid internet. PN, PA, same diff right?... right

ConstitutionGal
10-27-2007, 03:27 AM
haha i was just about to edit that... i shouldn't be up at 2:30AM writing stuff. Stoopid internet. PN, PA, same diff right?... right
Ron Paul keeps me awake at night???? :D

Corydoras
10-27-2007, 03:36 AM
He is clearly on the other side of the Chasm, as described in this thread. No wonder you are having trouble reaching him. We all have got to figure out how to get across this chasm.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=29177

Corydoras
10-27-2007, 03:44 AM
lonely hearts buying their way into what they see as a social environment of kindred spirits

Cool kids have ALWAYS been described this way by the envious and jealous and unhappy, because we're having a good time and they're not. But unlike kids in school, we're so utterly cool, we're happy to have lots and lots and lots of new people join us.
:cool:

libertarian4321
10-27-2007, 04:22 AM
You're friend is a an idiot who probably has little or no ability to form his own thoughts (hey, thats what Fox News and Rush Limbaugh are there for!).

I'll bet he loves George W. Bush, too (which would confirm my first statement).

constituent
10-27-2007, 05:44 AM
"get out of the way so the big men can do their work?"

1) has your friend been known on occasion to shell out
a couple grand and a plane ticket for a canned hunt?
'cuz that's what a line like that says to me, this guy likes
a guaranteed kill.

2) i like mike... mike? or newt? you mean the guy that
thinks the first amendment is a problem?

yea... uh, see the headspace this guy occupies. suzu,
if you need a friend, e-mail me sometime, i promise to
be much nicer and will even use proper grammar and
punctuation.

Dary
10-27-2007, 06:26 AM
...categorizes Paul as either a joke, or one whose cult followers.
...at the expense of his poor "followers"


Its not about the man, its about the message.

Drknows
10-27-2007, 06:44 AM
I sent my neocon friend a link to the "How Ron Paul Might Win" article

No time to read the whole thing....



Neocons shut off their brains when reading anything that might contradict their beliefs.

They never question anything.

Dustancostine
10-27-2007, 07:51 AM
This dude describes himself as a lassaiz-faire anarcho capitalist, he loves Ayn Rand, and he knows all of Ron Paul's stances. He has told me that he thinks RP is unelectable because he's not a smooth enough talker, and says he'd sooner vote for Hillary if RP wins the nomination because "she'll do less damage".

We've had an ongoing conversation by email/chat since the spring. I detailed more of his views in another post:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=1222

A while ago I sent him the straw poll results from the RP website and asked him what he thinks they mean. Here's what he said:

Most Rand admirers that I have talked to that do not support Ron Paul are either imperialist War Mongers in disguise or Extreme Zionist or a combination of both. I like to call them Judeo-Fascist, and it really eats them up because they know that the term is correct.

Thurston Howell III
10-27-2007, 08:08 AM
I recognize the rhetoric. It's old media.
Obviously your friend is just repeating what he's heard on TV, with no real thought of his own. It's so common, that's what we're up against, making people use their own minds.

bulloncoins
10-27-2007, 08:16 AM
I can tell your friend will not survive in the world if Dr. Paul does not become the next President. When his dollars are worthless and not just worth less, his holier than thou attitude will crumble away like his self worth.

You need better friends.

hornet
10-27-2007, 08:18 AM
Related, it has also been demonstrated that his fundraising is likewise in no way indicative of genuine support, but rather the result of lonely hearts buying their way into what they see as a social environment of kindred spirits.

$5.3 million in one Q is an awful lot of "lonely hearts", maybe we should send each other some flowers or something.......

rrt82
10-27-2007, 08:32 AM
We should focus on Ron Paul's message and lay off the insults of this guy's friend. Some people honestly believe RP is still a crazy old man just shouting randomly at people, and that's OK. The message speaks for itself. Neocons, like liberals, are not stupid they are just misguided. It's the mix of ideas though that make America great.

Do not get offended when people insult Ron Paul, get happy! People will not go out of their way to insult somebody unless they feel they are a threat. Our guy is growing nationally, get ready for the mud to be thrown in his direction. Take pride in the fact our guy is about the message and not about negativity towards other candidates running.

We need to be respectful when converting people to Ron Paul, and realize not everybody likes his message. Some people DO want more government, some people DO want us to expand our empire. They are closed off to old school ideas. These are the folks who believe the US Constitution is "not a suicide pact". Let's focus on the undecideds, and those with an open mind.

After all, imagine if you had a friend who really liked Obama, and kept pestering you to vote for him when your mind is made up for Dr. Paul.

WillInMiami
10-27-2007, 08:35 AM
You know, it's amazing how so many people have thier heads in the sand. I too have a long-time friend (since high-school) that has very strong animosity for Ron Paul. We've known each other for 18 years. He recently graduated law-school and I'm a director (IT) for a publicly traded company. We both come from poor families and I'm sure that nobody thought either one of us would amount to much of anything. None-the-less, we both rose above our positions and are considered educated and successful. He and I have tremendous respect for one another because the rest of our friends from high-school are pretty much all loosers. I say all of that to say this: Even though he has told me over the years that he respects me and looks up to me, now that I've thrown my support behind Ron Paul, he is beside himself with contempt and anger. He has ridiculed Ron Paul and his supporters and said much of the same things that you would find on Red State. Although, just a few short months ago, he thought I was right on nearly everything politically, he now believes I've lost my mind, I'm supporting a "pussie", and that we're living in a dream world set in the 1700's. He refuses to listen to reason and acknowledge that I've not actually changed my policical positions except for how I feel about our endless involvement in Iraq. At one time I supported the Iraq adventure and now that it has gone on for so long and cost us so much money and the politicians are talking about expanding the war into Iran, I believe that it all MUST end mostly because we cannot afford it and we're getting weeker every day by borrowing so much money from China (and other countries). You would think that a smart man that just graduated from law-school would be able to see the logic in my position. Nope - we get into a heated argument every time we talk about it and he regresses to calling Ron Paul names.

I just don't get it. How can people that, under other circumstances, seem so rational and logical completely regress into sputtering mad-men over Ron Paul's dedication to America and the Constitution?

Triton
10-27-2007, 08:36 AM
I sent my neocon friend a link to the "How Ron Paul Might Win" article (from Lew Rockwell site), and this was his reply:



I wrote back and asked him how it has "been demonstrated". He has not replied.Oh the pain! The loneliness! The angst! I think I will donate $100 to Ron Paul.

Ahhhh. Much better.

Diana
10-27-2007, 09:14 AM
This dude describes himself as a lassaiz-faire anarcho capitalist, he loves Ayn Rand, and he knows all of Ron Paul's stances. He has told me that he thinks RP is unelectable because he's not a smooth enough talker, and says he'd sooner vote for Hillary if RP wins the nomination because "she'll do less damage".

We've had an ongoing conversation by email/chat since the spring. I detailed more of his views in another post:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=1222

A while ago I sent him the straw poll results from the RP website and asked him what he thinks they mean. Here's what he said:

I don't understand how someone can call themselves an anarcho capitalist and support Hillary over RP. Some wire is disconnected somewhere. Something's loose. If he loves Ayn Rand - perhaps talking about Atlas Shrugged would make an impact. Who is John Galt? Why were they withdrawing from the system? Is our system broken? How is it and in what way? Is it comparable to the system in Atlas Shrugged? <-- Asking those questions and others might make the wheels start turning and perhaps that wire will reconnect. And then bringing up the comparison between people asking "Who is John Galt?" and "Who is Ron Paul?" if he becomes more receptive to analyzing might do something.

If not, then I don't know what to tell you.

paulitics
10-27-2007, 11:58 AM
\

I just don't get it. How can people that, under other circumstances, seem so rational and logical completely regress into sputtering mad-men over Ron Paul's dedication to America and the Constitution?

brainashing and classical conditioning. Where does he get most of his info from, TV, Newspapers, neocon radio? and if he surrounded by friends and associates that drink the koolaid that plays a role too.

I have the opposite problem. My friends are liberal and think we need national healthcare, higher taxes on gas, and Al Gore is right about everything. They drink the liberal koolaid. Both sides are two wings on the same bird.

A Ron Paul Rebel
10-27-2007, 12:15 PM
You'd be better off excluding these types of people from your life!

terlinguatx
10-27-2007, 12:17 PM
...

steph3n
10-27-2007, 12:18 PM
I agree with this fully, and I really feel some FEAR these terrorists, to the point of living in TERROR about the possibility. I know not all are this way, but I have encountered a few that are such cases.


You know, it's amazing how so many people have thier heads in the sand. I too have a long-time friend (since high-school) that has very strong animosity for Ron Paul. We've known each other for 18 years. He recently graduated law-school and I'm a director (IT) for a publicly traded company. We both come from poor families and I'm sure that nobody thought either one of us would amount to much of anything. None-the-less, we both rose above our positions and are considered educated and successful. He and I have tremendous respect for one another because the rest of our friends from high-school are pretty much all loosers. I say all of that to say this: Even though he has told me over the years that he respects me and looks up to me, now that I've thrown my support behind Ron Paul, he is beside himself with contempt and anger. He has ridiculed Ron Paul and his supporters and said much of the same things that you would find on Red State. Although, just a few short months ago, he thought I was right on nearly everything politically, he now believes I've lost my mind, I'm supporting a "pussie", and that we're living in a dream world set in the 1700's. He refuses to listen to reason and acknowledge that I've not actually changed my policical positions except for how I feel about our endless involvement in Iraq. At one time I supported the Iraq adventure and now that it has gone on for so long and cost us so much money and the politicians are talking about expanding the war into Iran, I believe that it all MUST end mostly because we cannot afford it and we're getting weeker every day by borrowing so much money from China (and other countries). You would think that a smart man that just graduated from law-school would be able to see the logic in my position. Nope - we get into a heated argument every time we talk about it and he regresses to calling Ron Paul names.

I just don't get it. How can people that, under other circumstances, seem so rational and logical completely regress into sputtering mad-men over Ron Paul's dedication to America and the Constitution?

parke
10-27-2007, 12:19 PM
Your friend is a douche. That is all.

x2

parke
10-27-2007, 12:23 PM
$5.3 million in one Q is an awful lot of "lonely hearts", maybe we should send each other some flowers or something.......

LMAO! Lets send the flowers to her friend instead!

RJB
10-27-2007, 12:29 PM
I'm sure he's a good guy-- as a friend of yours, but he needs to open his eyes. I have some good friends who are like him. Sometimes we'll talk politics and they agree with everything I say about RP, pretty much say they'll support him, but then a week later after watching FOX and listening to talk radio they revert back.

steph3n
10-27-2007, 12:30 PM
I'm sure he's a good guy-- as a friend of yours, but he needs to open his eyes. I have some good friends who are like him. Sometimes we'll talk politics and they agree with everything I say about RP, pretty much say they'll support him, but then a week later after watching FOX and listening to talk radio they revert back.

IMO it is best to move on, there are more fish in the sea!

jkaufmann
10-27-2007, 12:33 PM
I sent my neocon friend a link to the "How Ron Paul Might Win" article (from Lew Rockwell site), and this was his reply:



I wrote back and asked him how it has "been demonstrated". He has not replied.

My response to him (Inside my minds eye): "%uck off and die. I will do the same."

jkaufmann
10-27-2007, 12:39 PM
My response to him (Inside my minds eye): "%uck off and die. I will do the same."

Actualy, I think *my* actual response would be:

re: You know what your right. Better vote for someone with a chance to win.

***Then wait for his response, which may be something like***

--Yep. Now your catching on

***Your next response would be**

--Thats why I'm now voting for Hillary.

torchbearer
10-27-2007, 02:31 PM
When an individual of groupthink is confronted anger usually ensues, or in this case he was left with concocting false information that satisfy his worldview. This kind of delusional will be explaining away the next 8 years of a Ron Paul presidency.

+1 for being spot-on. Most people can't deal with information that is contrary to how they view the world, so they make up odd sounding excuses to explain to themselves how Ron Paul could be doing so well in a world where the media is telling them he isn't doing well...and guess what, the media is even supplying them with the excuses... and no one ever questions it, because it allows their world view to stay unchanged. It's much easier to write off Ron Paul as crazy, than to re-evaluate what is really the truth of the world around you.

Suzu- I know it will only anger your friend, but you need to tell him to wake up and stop living in a dream world, ron paul's base is real, and what the media is putting on tv is false. it is your obligation as a caring friend to tell him the truth, even if he isn't ready for it. He will thank you later.

ape
10-27-2007, 03:39 PM
Mike and Newt? Sounds like your friend has a soft spot for open border republicans.

bbachtung
10-27-2007, 03:46 PM
Just answer him: Ron Paul . . . He's Catching On!

RockEnds
10-27-2007, 04:05 PM
Suzu,

Ask your friend if by 'unsophisticated' he means the men and women who have taken up arms to protect this nation.

Then send him this article with the title:

"Nero Fiddles while Rome Burns" :rolleyes:

http://desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071027/NEWS09/710270339/-1/caucus

Then suggest to him that maybe, just maybe, we're sophisticated enough to understand we're being 'played' in Iowa!