TNforPaul45
04-29-2011, 09:37 PM
Hello all,
Just wanted to demonstrate some of the thinking that we are fighting on the Left when we are discussing gross federal spending on the part of our benevolent Federal leaders.
The post, by a progressive friend of mine, started like this:
He posted the following from huffpo:
hxxp: //www.huffingtonpost.com/social/The_Notorious_PDF/us-credit-outlook-downgra_n_850482_84894483.html
National Debt Increased by 75% under Bush:
2001 - $5.871 trillion
2008 - $10.640 trillion
National Debt Increased 25% Under Obama:
Jan 31st 2009 = $10.569-Tr ill i o n
Jan 31st 2011 = $14.131-Tr ill i o n
But of the $3.56-tril lio n increase, 98% was carry over from Bush programs:
Bush: $910-billi on = Interest on Debt 2009/2011
Bush: $360-billi on = Iraq War Spending 2009/2011
Bush: $319-billi on = TARP/Bailo ut Balance from 2008 (as of May 2010)
Bush: $419-billi on = Bush Recession Caused Drop in taxes
Bush: $190-billi on = Bush Medicare Drug Program 2009/2011
Bush: $211-billi on = Bush Meicare Part-D 2009/2011
Bush: $771-billi on = Bush Tax Cuts 2009/2011
Bush's contributi ons :
2001 to 2008: $4.769-tri lli o n
2009 to 2010: $3.181-tri lli o n
Total: $7.950-tri lli o n
Increase Since 2001 = $14.131 - $5.871 = $8.26-Tril lio n
Bush's contributi on: $7.950-tri lli o n / $8.26-Tril lio n = 96%
Obama only contributi on: $580-billi on = Stimulus Spending (as of Dec 2010).
Increase caused By Bush's Programs: 96%
Increase caused by Obama's Programs: 4%
To wit I responded with:
To my progressive friend:
I saw your post where you pasted the "Deficit" figures from HuffPo. I wanted to send you some info to clarify the issue.
First I want to preface with my statement that Bush's spending was abhorrent, in both defense and silly domestic programs. Everyone in the Liberty movement was appalled by it. Good riddance that man is gone. But I have to point out that Obama is on pace to outspend him by a far far margin.
First take a look here: From the Congressional Budget Office
http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/108xx/doc10871/historicaltables.pdf
Take a look at table F-1 "Revenues, Outlays, Deficits, Surpluses, and Debt Held by the Public, 1970 to 2009, in Billions of Dollars." You can see, in the 2009 line at the bottom, that Obama's Federal Yearly Budget Deficit (Not the Debt) was 1.413 Trillion dollars. For his first year. This was more than the last 5 years of Bush's spending combined. Remember, I didn't like Bush's spending either, just making comparisons.
Second, look at:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/budget/fy2011/assets/tables.pdf
Look at table S-3 "Baseline Projection of Current Policy by Category." Look at the "Deficit" line at the bottom. The Obama White House expects, and is planning into spending plans, at least a $1 Trillion dollar deficit in the yearly budget each year.
Now look at Table S-14 "Federal Government Financing and Debt" and look under the "Debt Outstanding End of Year" category at line "Total Gross Federal Debt." The Obama Administration is predicting an increase in Total Federal Debt from $14 Trillion in 2010 to $25 Trillion in 2020 (2 years past the end of his administration).
From these above, and from Obama's continued participation in Bush's wars overseas (something else the Liberty movement is pissed about), you can see that Obama is no different from Mr. Bush, no matter how much or what he says on TV. He has no plans in reducing spending or wars.
Your frustrations should not be directed at one party or one person, but at the overall entirety of the Federal Institution. It's time to send people to DC that will bring us real hope and change. And it's time to look past rhetoric, think for ourselves, not base our thought on slogans or catchphrases, and start caring about the direction of our country again.
He has not responded. I will keep this post updated with his responses. I am sure that he will be quite upset with me, linking to the Obama White House's own website and CBO figures.
Peep the figures for yourself, or please point out any errors in my logic.
Just wanted to demonstrate some of the thinking that we are fighting on the Left when we are discussing gross federal spending on the part of our benevolent Federal leaders.
The post, by a progressive friend of mine, started like this:
He posted the following from huffpo:
hxxp: //www.huffingtonpost.com/social/The_Notorious_PDF/us-credit-outlook-downgra_n_850482_84894483.html
National Debt Increased by 75% under Bush:
2001 - $5.871 trillion
2008 - $10.640 trillion
National Debt Increased 25% Under Obama:
Jan 31st 2009 = $10.569-Tr ill i o n
Jan 31st 2011 = $14.131-Tr ill i o n
But of the $3.56-tril lio n increase, 98% was carry over from Bush programs:
Bush: $910-billi on = Interest on Debt 2009/2011
Bush: $360-billi on = Iraq War Spending 2009/2011
Bush: $319-billi on = TARP/Bailo ut Balance from 2008 (as of May 2010)
Bush: $419-billi on = Bush Recession Caused Drop in taxes
Bush: $190-billi on = Bush Medicare Drug Program 2009/2011
Bush: $211-billi on = Bush Meicare Part-D 2009/2011
Bush: $771-billi on = Bush Tax Cuts 2009/2011
Bush's contributi ons :
2001 to 2008: $4.769-tri lli o n
2009 to 2010: $3.181-tri lli o n
Total: $7.950-tri lli o n
Increase Since 2001 = $14.131 - $5.871 = $8.26-Tril lio n
Bush's contributi on: $7.950-tri lli o n / $8.26-Tril lio n = 96%
Obama only contributi on: $580-billi on = Stimulus Spending (as of Dec 2010).
Increase caused By Bush's Programs: 96%
Increase caused by Obama's Programs: 4%
To wit I responded with:
To my progressive friend:
I saw your post where you pasted the "Deficit" figures from HuffPo. I wanted to send you some info to clarify the issue.
First I want to preface with my statement that Bush's spending was abhorrent, in both defense and silly domestic programs. Everyone in the Liberty movement was appalled by it. Good riddance that man is gone. But I have to point out that Obama is on pace to outspend him by a far far margin.
First take a look here: From the Congressional Budget Office
http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/108xx/doc10871/historicaltables.pdf
Take a look at table F-1 "Revenues, Outlays, Deficits, Surpluses, and Debt Held by the Public, 1970 to 2009, in Billions of Dollars." You can see, in the 2009 line at the bottom, that Obama's Federal Yearly Budget Deficit (Not the Debt) was 1.413 Trillion dollars. For his first year. This was more than the last 5 years of Bush's spending combined. Remember, I didn't like Bush's spending either, just making comparisons.
Second, look at:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/budget/fy2011/assets/tables.pdf
Look at table S-3 "Baseline Projection of Current Policy by Category." Look at the "Deficit" line at the bottom. The Obama White House expects, and is planning into spending plans, at least a $1 Trillion dollar deficit in the yearly budget each year.
Now look at Table S-14 "Federal Government Financing and Debt" and look under the "Debt Outstanding End of Year" category at line "Total Gross Federal Debt." The Obama Administration is predicting an increase in Total Federal Debt from $14 Trillion in 2010 to $25 Trillion in 2020 (2 years past the end of his administration).
From these above, and from Obama's continued participation in Bush's wars overseas (something else the Liberty movement is pissed about), you can see that Obama is no different from Mr. Bush, no matter how much or what he says on TV. He has no plans in reducing spending or wars.
Your frustrations should not be directed at one party or one person, but at the overall entirety of the Federal Institution. It's time to send people to DC that will bring us real hope and change. And it's time to look past rhetoric, think for ourselves, not base our thought on slogans or catchphrases, and start caring about the direction of our country again.
He has not responded. I will keep this post updated with his responses. I am sure that he will be quite upset with me, linking to the Obama White House's own website and CBO figures.
Peep the figures for yourself, or please point out any errors in my logic.