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View Full Version : Judge Gives 'Juror 799' Indefinite Jury Duty for Racist Remarks on Questionnaire




FrankRep
04-06-2011, 04:05 PM
http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/09/27/amd_judge_nicholas_garaufis.jpg
Judge Nicholas G. Garaufis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Garaufis), Nominated by President Bill Clinton


Judge gives 'Juror No. 799' indefinite jury duty after she makes racist remarks on questionnaire (http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2011/04/06/2011-04-06_verdict_yer_a_joke_judge_forces_woman_to_eterna l_jury_duty_after_racist_remarks_.html)


NY Daily News
April 6th 2011


An incensed federal judge sentenced a racist Brooklyn woman to indefinite jury duty on Tuesday after she trashed the NYPD and minorities.

"This is an outrage, and so are you!" Federal Judge Nicholas Garaufis told the woman, holding up her bile-filled juror questionnaire.

Juror No. 799, an Asian woman in her 20s who said she works in the garment industry, was up for jury duty in the death penalty trial of Bonanno crime boss Vincent (Vinny Gorgeous) Basciano.

It didn't take long for her to start looking worse than the defendant.

Asked to name three people she least admired, she wrote on her questionnaire: "African-Americans, Hispanics and Haitians."

When the judge asked why she answered the question that way, she replied, "You always hear about them in the news doing something."

She also declared that cops are all lazy, claiming that they sound their sirens to bypass traffic jams.
...


SOURCE:
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/2011/04/06/2011-04-06_verdict_yer_a_joke_judge_forces_woman_to_eterna l_jury_duty_after_racist_remarks_.html

sailingaway
04-06-2011, 04:08 PM
Saw that. It is a temper tantrum by the judge misusing his power. He asked and she answered. The PROPER response was to never let the woman near any jury, ever, since she couldn't pass unbiased judgment. You don't WANT someone to lie about bias on a jury questionnaire, the whole point is to ferret out any bias so you can get rid of biased jurors. Not to permanently ensconce them.

sirgonzo420
04-06-2011, 04:09 PM
Well... she was pretty much right.

Certain portions of the population tend to commit certain crimes at a much higher rate than the rest of the population.

And I have witnessed several cops doing what she described.

*waits for someone to accuse me of being a collectivist or something*

lol

t0rnado
04-06-2011, 04:11 PM
Someone forward her some jury nullification materials.

sratiug
04-06-2011, 04:17 PM
Someone forward her some jury nullification materials.

LOL. Yeah, it won't take her long to get out of jury duty.

susano
04-06-2011, 04:24 PM
Another judge who makes it up as he goes along and thinks he's God Almighty. She needs a lawyer so she can sue his ass.

BlackTerrel
04-07-2011, 12:35 AM
Well... she was pretty much right.

Certain portions of the population tend to commit certain crimes at a much higher rate than the rest of the population.

And I have witnessed several cops doing what she described.

*waits for someone to accuse me of being a collectivist or something*

lol

I'm pretty sure that's the definition. Yeah.

nate895
04-07-2011, 12:40 AM
Another judge who makes it up as he goes along and thinks he's God Almighty. She needs a lawyer so she can sue his ass.

Some judges literally think that, btw. That is the basis for common law varieties of "legal positivism," which is the basis for many of our judge's actions.

Mani
04-07-2011, 03:34 AM
What's the use of having a biased juror around indefinitely? No one is going to accept her as a juror, she will get axed out of every trial.

Is the point to make her sit in the big waiting room and then have her get called and if she gets chosen from the pool, to then get axed when they choose jurors, and then repeat indefinitely?

YumYum
04-07-2011, 04:55 AM
Saw that. It is a temper tantrum by the judge misusing his power. He asked and she answered. The PROPER response was to never let the woman near any jury, ever, since she couldn't pass unbiased judgment. You don't WANT someone to lie about bias on a jury questionnaire, the whole point is to ferret out any bias so you can get rid of biased jurors. Not to permanently ensconce them.

You make an excellent point that is so logical. Why would the judge want this woman on jury duty? That's like a court order making a bank robber work in bank security.

acptulsa
04-07-2011, 05:06 AM
If she honestly believes all that garbage she spewed, then the one bad thing in all the world she is not guilty of is contempt of that court.

But I am. Nicholas G. Garaufus is a self important meglomaniacal windbag elitist who couldn't be trusted to properly oversee a traffic court and has no business wielding the power we give to a meter maid.

tasteless
04-07-2011, 05:09 AM
I wonder if she's single.

sirgonzo420
04-07-2011, 06:38 AM
I'm pretty sure that's the definition. Yeah.

If you really are black, then statistically you are 8.3 times more likely to commit a violent crime than I am. I'm not a collectivist by merely pointing out that blacks commit crimes at a higher rate than the rest of the population. It's the sad truth, even though I wish it weren't.

I have witnessed several cops abuse the fact that they have "emergency lights" on the cruisers they drive. They will flip on the lights, speed through a stoplight, and turn off the lights on the other side.

Besides, isn't you calling me a "collectivist" a "collectivist" thing to do anyway?

acptulsa
04-07-2011, 06:45 AM
If you really are black, then statistically you are 8.3 times more likely to commit a violent crime than I am. I'm not a collectivist by merely pointing out that blacks commit crimes at a higher rate than the rest of the population. It's the sad truth, even though I wish it weren't.

All the official statistics in the world and five bucks will get you a cup of coffee.


I have witnessed several cops abuse the fact that they have "emergency lights" on the cruisers they drive. They will flip on the lights, speed through a stoplight, and turn off the lights on the other side.

And they're supposed to surprise the perpetrator by allowing him to see and hear them approach from a half a mile away?


Besides, isn't you calling me a "collectivist" a "collectivist" thing to do anyway?

'Y'all are collectivist' is a collectivist statement. 'You are a collectivist individual' is not. See how that works?

specsaregood
04-07-2011, 06:49 AM
And they're supposed to surprise the perpetrator by allowing him to see and hear them approach from a half a mile away?

Yeah, thats why they do it. please.

acptulsa
04-07-2011, 06:53 AM
Yeah, thats why they do it. please.

That's why they do it around here. When the light's red for them they're generally content to sit there and see who flies through on the yellow.

sirgonzo420
04-07-2011, 06:57 AM
All the official statistics in the world and five bucks will get you a cup of coffee.

True. But statistics aren't completely worthless. They show trends. The current trend is, is that certain small segments of the population are responsible for most of the crime. Do you disagree?


And they're supposed to surprise the perpetrator by allowing him to see and hear them approach from a half a mile away?

LOL. Usually their "perpetrators" are people with "expired tags" or people who are "speeding".

Sometimes police abuse their "authority". I have witnessed this firsthand several times. To pretend it doesn't happen is silly.


'Y'all are collectivist' is a collectivist statement. 'You are a collectivist individual' is not. See how that works?

If I called BlackTerrel "black", would that be me being a collectivist?

sailingaway
04-07-2011, 08:14 AM
If you really are black, then statistically you are 8.3 times more likely to commit a violent crime than I am. I'm not a collectivist by merely pointing out that blacks commit crimes at a higher rate than the rest of the population. It's the sad truth, even though I wish it weren't.

I have witnessed several cops abuse the fact that they have "emergency lights" on the cruisers they drive. They will flip on the lights, speed through a stoplight, and turn off the lights on the other side.

Besides, isn't you calling me a "collectivist" a "collectivist" thing to do anyway?

One of the problems with collectivism is the judgment call used to place individuals in specific groups for analysis. For example, your study looks at individuals as 'black', someone else might analyse them in the category of 'poor', or whatever.

sailingaway
04-07-2011, 08:17 AM
Yeah, thats why they do it. please.

Cops are individuals too. Their job is important, but that doesn't change the fact that SOME of those individuals are assholes. Or, frankly, that some of us here ourselves, given the ability to change a light, might on occassion use it....

Absolute power (over lights) corrupts absolutely. :p

BlackTerrel
04-07-2011, 09:46 PM
If you really are black, then statistically you are 8.3 times more likely to commit a violent crime than I am.

8.3 times more likely to be arrested.

MelissaWV
04-07-2011, 09:55 PM
Statistics are interesting, but the data's only as good as how it's organized and presented.

Men are far more likely to be rapists or serial killers. If I walked up to you, looked you up and down, and then said that... your impression would probably be that I meant it as a slight towards men, and you in particular. It doesn't change the factual nature of the stat, but the context adds meaning.

If you "point out" BlackTerrel is black in an effort to make it seem like that makes him more collectivist or racist or whatever else, then yeah, you're guilty of making an illogical leap based on your impressions and some loosely translated statistics. You are also using the metric of a random black person against yourself. That's not how statistics work. Maybe BT is an upper class guy who grew up in a stable, two-parent household and completed college... while you are a dirt poor product of a broken home who never finished high school and lives in Detroit trying to figure out how to get your next meal ticket. Would race be the deciding factor there? You'd actually be statistically more likely, with those circumstances, to be a criminal than BT.

acptulsa
04-07-2011, 09:57 PM
And you'd statistically be more likely to be represented by a public defender, too.

JCLibertarian
04-07-2011, 10:06 PM
One of the problems with collectivism is the judgment call used to place individuals in specific groups for analysis. For example, your study looks at individuals as 'black', someone else might analyse them in the category of 'poor', or whatever.

There isn't any statistical evidence of your claim that poverty correlates to higher crime rates. Appalachia is the most economically depressed region in the country, yet they have violent crime rates that are half the national average and property crime rates 65% the national average.
http://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/189560.pdf

Kiryas Joel, New York, is the poorest town(over 10,000 people) in America as per median income. It also has crime rates much lower than the national average
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_poorest_places_in_the_United_States
http://failedmessiah.typepad.com/failed_messiahcom/2009/02/off-the-mark-kiryas-joel-garden-of-eden-jewish-week-says.html

MelissaWV
04-08-2011, 05:23 AM
Appalachia also has really teeny population density, the same with the "poorest town" in America. Poverty is also not simply a result of not making a high income, but has a great deal to do with the cost of living. Make $2,000 per month in West Virginia, and you can pay your rent/mortgage, pay your car, pay your bills. Make $2,000 per month in Manhattan, and you get as far as paying your rent... perhaps. Therefore, when you get "poor" in Appalachia, you need less in savings or assistance than you would in a big, densely populated city where the cost of living is high. You also need to be working at your new job less time to start making ends meet. Even looking for a job is cheaper. With sprawling metro areas, you have places that are crumbling and still renting at a cheap rate... usually in bad neighborhoods. It's a bit of a cycle.

I would say hopelessness makes crime less abhorrent.

TNforPaul45
04-08-2011, 05:40 AM
Government official forcing a citizen to perform non-conscription labor for the state for the rest of their life. Oh well it's at least nice to see that slavery is back in style at least.

acptulsa
04-08-2011, 06:50 AM
Thank you Melissa. I was too tired to type that last night.


Government official forcing a citizen to perform non-conscription labor for the state for the rest of their life. Oh well it's at least nice to see that slavery is back in style at least.

Hah. Just occurred to me to wonder if that judge would have done that to a white person...

jmdrake
04-08-2011, 07:11 AM
If you really are black, then statistically you are 8.3 times more likely to commit a violent crime than I am. I'm not a collectivist by merely pointing out that blacks commit crimes at a higher rate than the rest of the population. It's the sad truth, even though I wish it weren't.

If you're white you're more likely to have been convicted of raping a child. And that's true even when you look at it from a per capita basis.

http://www.childmolestationprevention.org/pdfs/study.pdf

Or what about this statistic? Blacks make up 14% of drug users, 36% of arrests and 63% of those who end up in prison. And where did I get that statistic from?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8S8N2OG7sU

Freedom 4 all
04-08-2011, 07:16 AM
8.3 times more likely to be arrested.

This. It has more to do with police racism than black criminality.

jmdrake
04-08-2011, 07:17 AM
Appalachia also has really teeny population density, the same with the "poorest town" in America. Poverty is also not simply a result of not making a high income, but has a great deal to do with the cost of living. Make $2,000 per month in West Virginia, and you can pay your rent/mortgage, pay your car, pay your bills. Make $2,000 per month in Manhattan, and you get as far as paying your rent... perhaps. Therefore, when you get "poor" in Appalachia, you need less in savings or assistance than you would in a big, densely populated city where the cost of living is high. You also need to be working at your new job less time to start making ends meet. Even looking for a job is cheaper. With sprawling metro areas, you have places that are crumbling and still renting at a cheap rate... usually in bad neighborhoods. It's a bit of a cycle.

I would say hopelessness makes crime less abhorrent.

This. Plus the driving force behind inner city crime for the past 40 years has been the drug war. With the meth wars crime is rising in rural white areas of TN now.

jmdrake
04-08-2011, 07:24 AM
Thank you Melissa. I was too tired to type that last night.



Hah. Just occurred to me to wonder if that judge would have done that to a white person...

I didn't realize until just now that the jurist wasn't white.

Juror No. 799, an Asian woman in her 20s who said she works in the garment industry, was up for jury duty in the death penalty trial of Bonanno crime boss Vincent (Vinny Gorgeous) Basciano.


I wonder if she was talking in court on her cell phone? :D

See: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?283623-Asians-In-The-Library

Anyway, I agree with all who say it's beyond stupid for the judge to force someone like this to stay on jury duty when you'd want her off. Maybe he thought she was just joking and put that nonsense down in order to get off jury duty? Of course any lawyer worth his salt will strike her every time she writes that down. But she could be vindictive, say the "right thing" next time, and get on the jury. :eek:

sirgonzo420
04-08-2011, 07:44 AM
This. It has more to do with police racism than black criminality.

Really?

Even if HALF the arrests for violent crimes were false arrests, any given black man would be 4.15 times more likely than any given white man to commit and be arrested for a violent crime. Even if only a QUARTER of the arrests were valid arrests, on average, a black man would still be more than twice as likely as a white man to commit and be arrested for a violent crime.

Unfortunately, everybody is not completely the same, and on a general level, people of different ethnic backgrounds commit different crimes at different rates.

For example:


The number of rape charges per capita in Malmö is 5 to 6 times that of Copenhagen, Denmark. Copenhagen is a larger city, but the percentage of immigrants is much lower. And it’s not just the rape statistics that reveal a scary increase in Malmö or Sweden. Virtually every kind of violent crime is on the rise. Robberies have increased with 50 % in Malmö only during the fall of 2004. Threats against witnesses in Swedish court cases have quadrupled between 2000 and 2003. During the past few decades, massive immigration has changed the face of Sweden’s major cities, as well as challenged the viability of the welfare state. In 1970 Sweden had the fourth highest GDP per capita among developed countries with income about 6% above the OECD average. By 1997 it was at fifteenth place with an average GDP per capita 14% below average. Malmö has a heavy concentration of Muslim immigrants in particular. According to some estimates, it will be a Muslim majority city in no more then 10 years.

acptulsa
04-08-2011, 07:50 AM
Unfortunately, everybody is not completely the same, and on a general level, people of different ethnic backgrounds commit different crimes at different rates.

For example:

And, of course, we all know immigrants are instantly accepted and given all the opportunities that people who can trace their lineage back in country several generations get.

And we know that everything that the Swedes consider a crime Somalia considers a crime as well...

:rolleyes:

And blacks in the Old South were incapable of learning, too. Of course, the fact that teaching one to read would get the white teacher lynched had nothing to do with it.

sirgonzo420
04-08-2011, 07:52 AM
And, of course, we all know immigrants are instantly accepted and given all the opportunities that people who can trace their lineage back in country several generations get.

And we know that everything that the Swedes consider a crime Somalia considers a crime as well...

So that gives them reason to rape, rob, pillage and loot the natives of the host country?

acptulsa
04-08-2011, 07:54 AM
So that gives them reason to rape, rob, pillage and loot the natives of the host country?

No. But it sure make the temptation greater. If you have enough to eat without risking jail, that's just a bit different a situation than you don't have enough to eat.

sirgonzo420
04-08-2011, 07:57 AM
No. But it sure make the temptation greater. If you have enough to eat without risking jail, that's just a bit different a situation than you don't have enough to eat.


I'm not seeing how being hungry gives one an excuse to rape a white woman (or any woman for that matter... rape victims just tend to be disproportionately white).

Carehn
04-08-2011, 08:01 AM
Someone forward her some jury nullification materials.

Now thats sexy!

MelissaWV
04-08-2011, 06:00 PM
I'm not seeing how being hungry gives one an excuse to rape a white woman (or any woman for that matter... rape victims just tend to be disproportionately white).

Read what I said about hopelessness. When someone has much less to lose, and a life where they're unlikely to gain much of anything, crime seems more tempting. Anyone with a strong moral fiber and an ounce of sense still continues to struggle and try to get ahead as far as they can by doing things the "right" way.

This idea that certain ethnic groups are more likely to commit crimes has been debunked repeatedly, but it's the favorite of some, and will be forever.

If Muslims are so much more likely to rape and pillage, as you put it, why are we not seeing some kind of Muslim crime spree in the US? Aren't "those people" so very likely to rape white women, as you so charmingy point out? Why is it that we really don't seem to hear about some Muslim conspiracy among their upper class folks to rape and despoil at every turn?

(Rhetorical questions; I don't expect a logical answer.)

BlackTerrel
04-08-2011, 06:45 PM
Even if HALF the arrests for violent crimes were false arrests, any given black man would be 4.15 times more likely than any given white man to commit and be arrested for a violent crime. Even if only a QUARTER of the arrests were valid arrests, on average, a black man would still be more than twice as likely as a white man to commit and be arrested for a violent crime.

I am pretty sure you are 9.57 times more likely to be a douchebag than your average black man.

acptulsa
04-08-2011, 07:00 PM
I am pretty sure you are 9.57 times more likely to be a douchebag than your average black man.

I've got him closer to 11.2. Must be a regional difference.

sirgonzo420
04-08-2011, 08:15 PM
Read what I said about hopelessness. When someone has much less to lose, and a life where they're unlikely to gain much of anything, crime seems more tempting. Anyone with a strong moral fiber and an ounce of sense still continues to struggle and try to get ahead as far as they can by doing things the "right" way.

This idea that certain ethnic groups are more likely to commit crimes has been debunked repeatedly, but it's the favorite of some, and will be forever.

If Muslims are so much more likely to rape and pillage, as you put it, why are we not seeing some kind of Muslim crime spree in the US? Aren't "those people" so very likely to rape white women, as you so charmingy point out? Why is it that we really don't seem to hear about some Muslim conspiracy among their upper class folks to rape and despoil at every turn?

(Rhetorical questions; I don't expect a logical answer.)

Well... in Malmo immigrants commit more rapes than native Swedes, and at a highly disproportionate rate. That is a fact. Now, I don't think they rape *because* they are muslim, but they rape for some reason, and no matter what their reason is, I find it appalling and inexcusable.

There are bigger cities in Scandinavia than Malmo with less immigrants (more ethnic homogeneity), and the crime stats are much lower. Surely there are poor people there too, no? Poor, native Swedes, who *don't* go about raping and pillaging? And in Malmo, I don't think ALL the immigrants go out and rape and pillage, but still - immigrants are a MINORITY who commit a VAST MAJORITY of the rapes. Should it just be ignored?

Crime rates are also low in Japan, in part due to their shared culture and ethnic homogeneity.

I wish to point out that I don't hate anybody, I simply recognize facts and patterns. That is all. If every race group were equally likely to commit any given crime at any given time, I would point that out as well.

I could also point out that members of a certain ethnic background own/control a disproportionately high percentage of media outlets.

What if eskimos ran 95% of the world's gas stations... would anyone notice? Would anyone say anything; just merely pointing it out? Would it be wrong for anyone to say anything?

I think the "blame-the-victim-or-anybody-else-but-the-actual-perpetrator" and "alleviation-of-personal-responsibility-because-of-race-slash-socio-economic-status" mentalities are dangerous.

It reminds me of a white woman activist who went to Haiti to render aid and support to the haitians, and was raped by the very people she went to help. She, of course, in true liberal fashion, does not blame those who raped her, but blamed white men.


By Amanda Kijera, civic journalist and activist in Haiti

Two weeks ago, on a Monday morning, I started to write what I thought was a very clever editorial about violence against women in Haiti. The case, I believed, was being overstated by women’s organizations in need of additional resources. Ever committed to preserving the dignity of Black men in a world which constantly stereotypes them as violent savages, I viewed this writing as yet one more opportunity to fight “the man” on behalf of my brothers. That night, before I could finish the piece, I was held on a rooftop in Haiti and raped repeatedly by one of the very men who I had spent the bulk of my life advocating for.

It hurt. The experience was almost more than I could bear. I begged him to stop. Afraid he would kill me, I pleaded with him to honor my commitment to Haiti, to him as a brother in the mutual struggle for an end to our common oppression, but to no avail. He didn’t care that I was a Malcolm X scholar. He told me to shut up, and then slapped me in the face. Overpowered, I gave up fighting halfway through the night.

Accepting the helplessness of my situation, I chucked aside the Haiti bracelet I had worn so proudly for over a year, along with it, my dreams of human liberation. Someone, I told myself, would always be bigger and stronger than me. As a woman, my place in life had been ascribed from birth. A Chinese proverb says that “women are like the grass, meant to be stepped on.” The thought comforted me at the same time that it made me cringe.

A dangerous thought. Others like it have derailed movements, discouraged consciousness and retarded progress for centuries. To accept it as truth signals the beginning of the end of a person–or community’s–life and ability to self-love. Resignation means inertia, and for the past two weeks I have inhabited its innards. My neighbors here include women from all over the world, but it’s the women of African descent, and particularly Haitian women, who move me to write now.

Truly, I have witnessed as a journalist and human rights advocate the many injustices inflicted upon Black men in this world. The pain, trauma and rage born of exploitation are terrors that I have grappled with every day of my life. They make one want to strike back, to fight rabidly for what is left of their personal dignity in the wake of such things. Black men have every right to the anger they feel in response to their position in the global hierarchy, but their anger is misdirected.

Women are not the source of their oppression; oppressive policies and the as-yet unaddressed white patriarchy which still dominates the global stage are. Because women–and particularly women of color–are forced to bear the brunt of the Black male response to the Black male plight, the international community and those nations who have benefitted from the oppression of colonized peoples have a responsibility to provide women with the protection that they need.

The United Nations, western women’s organizations and the Haitian government must immediately provide women in Haiti with the funding that they need to build domestic violence and rape crisis centers. Stop dividing Black families by distributing solely to women, which only exaggerates male resentment and frustration in Haiti. Provide both women and men with job training programs that would allow for self-sufficiency as opposed to continued dependency on whites. Lastly, admit that the issue of racial integration might still need addressing on an international level, and then find a way to address it!

I went to Haiti after the earthquake to empower Haitians to self-sufficiency. I went to remind them of the many great contributions that Afro-descendants have made to this world, and of their amazing resilience and strength as a people. Not once did I envision myself becoming a receptacle for a Black man’s rage at the white world, but that is what I became. While I take issue with my brother’s behavior, I’m grateful for the experience. It woke me up, made me understand on a deeper level the terror that my sisters deal with daily. This in hand, I feel comfortable in speaking for Haitian women, and for myself, in saying that we will not be your pawns, racially, politically, economically or otherwise.

We are women, not weapons of war. Thankfully, there are organizations here in Haiti who continues to fight for women’s human rights like, MADRE, SOFA and Enfofanm.

Rather than allowing myself to be used in such a fashion, and as opposed to submitting to the frustration and bitterness that can be born of such an experience, I choose to continue to love and educate instead. My brothers can be sensitized to women’s realities in Haiti and the world over if these are presented to them by using their own clashes with racism and oppression as a starting point.

They must be made to understand the dangerous likelihood of the oppressed becoming the oppressor if no shift in consciousnesses takes place and if no end to the cycle of trauma occurs. I intend to see that it does…by continuing to live and work fearlessly with justice in mind, through the creation of a safe space for women in Haiti and by creating programming for Haitian men that considers their needs, too. Weapons annihilate, dialogue bears fruit.

It’s the fruit I’m interested in now, no matter how strange or bruised it might appear.

http://www.race-talk.org/?p=4008

Fox McCloud
04-08-2011, 09:56 PM
It sounds more like she's a misanthrope than a racist--very few racists seem to hate their own race in addition to others.

Either case, the judge should have just dismissed her and went about his business...making her show up for jury duty until further notice is just going to generate a new thing for the young lady to hate; judges and the government....and worse, it may only further entrench her ideas on the her "racist" inclinations.