Involuntary Servitude

[stizmatic]

I have a question that has been bugging me for a while.

At my school I am required to take an organizational behavior class in order to get my degree. This class is made up of half lecture and the other half is a class wide group project. The project entails forming a class organization. From there we have to pick a charity and plan/carry out specific events to raise money for this charity. If we do not participate in these events we lose a great deal of points that go towards our final grade.

My question is, can this be considered involuntary servitude under the 13th amendment. I am being forced to do work at the benefit of others. The "volunteer" aspect of a charity is torn away by this project. This is involuntary charity.

Am I nuts in thinking this?

[kylejack]

Graduating from school is voluntary, so no, I don't think I agree with your interpretation. I do think a draft is involuntary servitude, though, the Supreme Court's contrary ruling notwithstanding.

[1000-points-of-fright]

Unless you're at a public high school, I'd say you're shit out of luck. If you're at a private school or college you are there by choice.

[stizmatic]

That is where the confusion lies. I do not HAVE to go to school and graduate.

However, taken that I have already purchased the non refundable product (the class) without being provided knowledge of this involuntary charity work I think a part of it is force of labor for the benefits of an outside party.

No one is sticking a gun to my head and saying if you dont take this class you are going to die. But if I dont take this class my life can certainly be negatively effected.

[kylejack]

Unless you're at a public high school, I'd say you're shit out of luck. If you're at a private school or college you are there by choice.

Public is by choice too if he's old enough to decide to drop out.

[1000-points-of-fright]

That is where the confusion lies. I do not HAVE to go to school and graduate.

However, taken that I have already purchased the non refundable product (the class) without being provided knowledge of this involuntary charity work I think a part of it is force of labor for the benefits of an outside party.

No one is sticking a gun to my head and saying if you dont take this class you are going to die. But if I dont take this class my life can certainly be negatively effected.

Then it's "buyer beware" and you have a choice to make.

[kylejack]

That is where the confusion lies. I do not HAVE to go to school and graduate.

However, taken that I have already purchased the non refundable product (the class) without being provided knowledge of this involuntary charity work I think a part of it is force of labor for the benefits of an outside party.

No one is sticking a gun to my head and saying if you dont take this class you are going to die. But if I dont take this class my life can certainly be negatively effected.

If they did not provide the product you paid for as described, that's legally actionable. You can sue to recoup the cost.

[stizmatic]

This is taken from wikipedia: "Involuntary servitude is a United States legal and constitutional term for a person laboring against that person's will to benefit another, under some form of coercion."

I would say the inability to recieve a degree is a form of coercion. You have to understand this isnt me sitting in a class learning. I am required to go out on the weekend to events and work. We sell items, have a class bank account, and recieve funds to be given to an outside party. A party that is in no way affiliated with the university.

[kylejack]

This is taken from wikipedia: "Involuntary servitude is a United States legal and constitutional term for a person laboring against that person's will to benefit another, under some form of coercion."

I would say the inability to recieve a degree is a form of coercion. You have to understand this isnt me sitting in a class learning. I am required to go out on the weekend to events and work. We sell items, have a class bank account, and recieve funds to be given to an outside party. A party that is in no way affiliated with the university.
Why should you have to do school work, homework or take tests?

I don't think that rises to coercion. You should be able to sue to get the money back if they didn't provide the product they offered you.

[stizmatic]

School work ie. papers, readings, studying is all for the purpose of furthering my education and that reason only.

This work can be considered educational too. However, in addition to the educational aspect the fact still lies that I am doing labor that is to the benefit of an organization that has no affiliation with the University.

[kylejack]

School work ie. papers, readings, studying is all for the purpose of furthering my education and that reason only.

This work can be considered educational too. However, in addition to the educational aspect the fact still lies that I am doing labor that is to the benefit of an organization that has no affiliation with the University.
Okay. Sue them for violating your involuntary servitude rights.

[stizmatic]

Are you being sarcastic or is this a valid argument.

I don't want to make it seem that I am against volunteer work and charity. I just am against forcing someone to do it. I believe service to society should be supported to the fullest but not through force.

[kylejack]

Are you being sarcastic or is this a valid argument.

I don't want to make it seem that I am against volunteer work and charity. I just am against forcing someone to do it. I believe service to society should be supported to the fullest but not through force.

I don't think your case would have any chance of success.

[ClampIt]

I think you may be splitting hairs. Seems to me that your professor is trying to give you real experience as close as possible to the real thing on how to deal with peer groups. So if the real thing is much better instruction than a simulation, if you object to doing it for a charity, then what would you suggest? A real business or political group may not want to be a guinea pig for students and it may be impractical to try to sell green services for a profit.

On the other hand, if the course time is materially beyond the syllabus or if it wasn't disclosed in the course description, you certainly have a legitimate beef.

[stizmatic]

The project is in the syllabus but not in the course description when I registered.

I really dont plan on taking any legal action but I want to present the professor with an arguable case so that she will feel compelled to give me an alternative assignment.

[Wendi]

I am assuming we're talking about a college degree. College education is a service that you choose to pay for. If you don't like the service, don't buy it.

Sorry, I understand what you're saying and I didn't like projects like that when I was in college either, but that's how any court would interpret it.

[fluoridatedbrainsoup]

Non-profit charities are a great way to launder money.