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View Full Version : Rep. Peter King has terrorist ties himself




Knightskye
03-08-2011, 10:19 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/04/AR2011030406635.html

My guess is that he won't have to testify in front of his own committee meeting.

Hypocrisy in Washington, DC? You don't say!

FrankRep
03-08-2011, 11:04 PM
Comparing Apples to Oranges


Wikipedia: Provisional Irish Republican Army (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provisional_Irish_Republican_Army)


The Provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) is an Irish republican paramilitary organisation whose aim was to remove Northern Ireland from the United Kingdom and bring about a United Ireland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Ireland) by force of arms and political persuasion.

========


IRA vs. Radical Islam

King, then a local politician on Long Island, was one of the most zealous American defenders of the militant IRA and its campaign to drive the British out of Northern Ireland. He argued that IRA violence was an inevitable response to British repression and that the organization had to be understood in the context of a centuries-long struggle for independence.

"The British government is a murder machine," King said
...

But King sees no parallel between the IRA and violent Islamist extremism, which he describes as a foreign enemy or a foreign-directed enemy. His preferred comparison for the IRA is with the African National Congress led by Nelson Mandela; the IRA, no less than the ANC's military wing, was fighting for community rights and freedom, he says.

"I [wanted] a peace agreement, a working agreement, where the nationalist community would feel their rights would be respected," King said in an interview at his Capitol Hill office. "I felt that the IRA, in the context of Irish history, and Sinn Fein were a legitimate force that had to be recognized and you wouldn't have peace without them.

"Listen, I think I'm one of the people who brought about peace in Ireland."

Anti Federalist
03-08-2011, 11:07 PM
One man's "terrorist" is another man's "freedom fighter".

This guy is an anti freedom turd, plain and simple, and deserves not a whit of "benefit of doubt".


Apples to Oranges.


Wikipedia: Provisional Irish Republican Army (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provisional_Irish_Republican_Army)


The Provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) is an Irish republican paramilitary organisation whose aim was to remove Northern Ireland from the United Kingdom and bring about a United Ireland (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Ireland) by force of arms and political persuasion.

========


IRA vs. Radical Islam

But King sees no parallel between the IRA and violent Islamist extremism, which he describes as a foreign enemy or a foreign-directed enemy. His preferred comparison for the IRA is with the African National Congress led by Nelson Mandela; the IRA, no less than the ANC's military wing, was fighting for community rights and freedom, he says.

"I [wanted] a peace agreement, a working agreement, where the nationalist community would feel their rights would be respected," King said in an interview at his Capitol Hill office. "I felt that the IRA, in the context of Irish history, and Sinn Fein were a legitimate force that had to be recognized and you wouldn't have peace without them.

"Listen, I think I'm one of the people who brought about peace in Ireland." [/INDENT]

specsaregood
03-08-2011, 11:08 PM
On man's "terrorist" is another man's "freedom fighter".

This guy is an anti freedom turd, plain and simple, and deserves not a whit of "benefit of doubt".

yeah, that ^.

Anti Federalist
03-08-2011, 11:11 PM
His preferred comparison for the IRA is with the African National Congress led by Nelson Mandela; the IRA, no less than the ANC's military wing, was fighting for community rights and freedom, he says.

Great comparison, the ANC is an admitted communist ruling party, a member of the Socialist International, and, IIRC, was listed as a "terrorist organization" throughout the 60s and 70s.

Yup, I remembered right, ANC was considered a "terrorist group" up until 1990.

http://www.start.umd.edu/start/data_collections/tops/terrorist_organization_profile.asp?id=305

FrankRep
03-08-2011, 11:27 PM
People are acting like Peter King hates Muslims and he's anti-freedom, but looking at the statement below, those accusations are false.


Lawmaker sees threat from radicalized Muslims (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/06/us-security-usa-muslims-idUSTRE72520L20110306)

Reuters
Mar 6, 2011



"The overwhelming majority of Muslims are outstanding Americans, but at this stage in our history there is an effort to radicalize efforts within the Muslim community," Representative Peter King said on CNN's "State of the Union" program.
...

"We're talking about al Qaeda," King said. "We're talking about the affiliates of al Qaeda who have been radicalizing, and there's been self-radicalization going on within the Muslim community, within a very small minority, but it's there. And that's where the threat is coming from at this time."
...

Ellison said members of the Muslim-American community have been helpful in informing U.S. law enforcement about potential security threats within their community, but King said they had not been helpful enough, and that some imams were telling Muslim-Americans not to cooperate with the FBI.

Reason
03-08-2011, 11:28 PM
On man's "terrorist" is another man's "freedom fighter".

This.

Anti Federalist
03-08-2011, 11:30 PM
I can't believe you're defending this douchebag!!??

I'd tell anybody not cooperate with the FBI.

<<<<Looks up at browser window to see if I got redirected to Free Republic or Hot Air or some fucking thing.


People are acting like Peter King hates Muslims and he's anti-freedom, but looking at the statement below, those accusations are false.


Lawmaker sees threat from radicalized Muslims (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/06/us-security-usa-muslims-idUSTRE72520L20110306)

Reuters
Mar 6, 2011



"The overwhelming majority of Muslims are outstanding Americans, but at this stage in our history there is an effort to radicalize efforts within the Muslim community," Representative Peter King said on CNN's "State of the Union" program.
...

"We're talking about al Qaeda," King said. "We're talking about the affiliates of al Qaeda who have been radicalizing, and there's been self-radicalization going on within the Muslim community, within a very small minority, but it's there. And that's where the threat is coming from at this time."
...

Ellison said members of the Muslim-American community have been helpful in informing U.S. law enforcement about potential security threats within their community, but King said they had not been helpful enough, and that some imams were telling Muslim-Americans not to cooperate with the FBI.

FrankRep
03-08-2011, 11:31 PM
On man's "terrorist" is another man's "freedom fighter".

This.

Are members of al-Qaeda (and similar organizations) considered "freedom fighters" in your opinion?

South Park Fan
03-08-2011, 11:32 PM
If King is so scared of the radicalization of Muslims, then why doesn't he advocate withdrawal of American troops from Iraq and Afghanistan in order to eliminate a major motivating factor in encouraging resentment by Muslims against the United States?

South Park Fan
03-08-2011, 11:33 PM
Are members of al-Qaeda (and similar organizations) considered "freedom fighters" in your opinion?

That was government policy in the 1980s. http://www.takeoverworld.info/images/reagan-mujahideen_c12820-32.jpg

FrankRep
03-08-2011, 11:35 PM
I can't believe you're defending this douchebag!!??


What is Peter King doing that's so evil?

FrankRep
03-08-2011, 11:40 PM
That was government policy in the 1980s.

The Mujahideen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mujahideen) was not al-Qaeda at that time. And Yes, helping the Mujahideen was a disastrous mistake.

FrankRep
03-08-2011, 11:42 PM
If King is so scared of the radicalization of Muslims, then why doesn't he advocate withdrawal of American troops from Iraq and Afghanistan in order to eliminate a major motivating factor in encouraging resentment by Muslims against the United States?

I agree with this statement. In fact, this is the argument you should be using to prove whatever case you're trying to make.

Anti Federalist
03-08-2011, 11:42 PM
Are members of al-Qaeda (and similar organizations) considered "freedom fighters" in your opinion?

IRA, al-Qaeda, ANC and just about every other group out there has government ties.

Are some of the people within these organizations fighting for their cause? Of course they are.

To many in the fedgov, the Founders were terrorists.

But this is not about what the make up of al-Qaeda is, it is about the hypocrisy of a pro police state, pro drug warrior (except when it comes to demanding federal employees be subjected to drug tests, that he votes NO on) pro gun control (D grade from NRA F rating from GOA), would be, tin pot dictator chairing a committee that it's very existence should be affront to every freedom loving American and sitting up on high pronouncing that people had better comply with his edicts or else.

All based on fighting "terror" when it was supporting a terrorist organization that initially helped get him elected!!

Knightskye
03-09-2011, 01:06 AM
To many in the fedgov, the Founders were terrorists.

This too.

specsaregood
03-09-2011, 07:41 AM
"I [wanted] a peace agreement, a working agreement, where the nationalist community would feel their rights would be respected," King said in an interview at his Capitol Hill office. "I felt that the IRA, in the context of Irish history, and Sinn Fein were a legitimate force that had to be recognized and you wouldn't have peace without them.

"Listen, I think I'm one of the people who brought about peace in Ireland."

Sounds to me like Rep. King just made a case for terrorism. I guess sometimes it works and he is glad to have supported it.

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 07:52 AM
Sounds to me like Rep. King just made a case for terrorism. I guess sometimes it works and he is glad to have supported it.

:rolleyes: Nonsense.

specsaregood
03-09-2011, 07:54 AM
:rolleyes: Nonsense.

Are you saying that terrorism by the IRA didn't help bring about peace?

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 08:11 AM
Are you saying that terrorism by the IRA didn't help bring about peace?

Are you comparing the actions of the IRA to the 9/11 Terrorist Attacks?

specsaregood
03-09-2011, 08:13 AM
Are you comparing the actions of the IRA to the 9/11 Terrorist Attacks?

Sure, why not? What exactly is the difference?

ExPatPaki
03-09-2011, 08:45 AM
Are members of al-Qaeda (and similar organizations) considered "freedom fighters" in your opinion?

Hamas and Hezbollah definitely are freedom fighters. If anyone disagrees with that, then they are pieces of dog shit.

ExPatPaki
03-09-2011, 08:48 AM
Hey Frank, were you one of the protesters at this hate rally? Seems like you would be type of person who would yell violent epithets at children, since you are a "brave and proud" Muslim-hating American:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6t6d9YBuFM

South Park Fan
03-09-2011, 05:09 PM
http://www.indymedia.ie/attachments/jun2005/fellowtravellers.gif

Guitarzan
03-09-2011, 05:16 PM
King would have been at the forefront of the push to put Japanese-Americans in internment camps if he was in office during WWII.

malkusm
03-09-2011, 05:20 PM
He argued that IRA violence was an inevitable response
to British repression and that the organization had to be understood in the context of a centuries-long struggle for independence.

"The British government is a murder machine," King said.

------

Could easily be:

------

He argued that Islamic violence was an inevitable response to American-backed dictatorial repression and that the organization had to be understood in the context of a centuries-long struggle for self-governance.

"The American government is a murder machine," King said

Knightskye
03-09-2011, 05:33 PM
Are you comparing the actions of the IRA to the 9/11 Terrorist Attacks?

You're talking about degrees of success in terrorist attacks. This is about terrorism or not terrorism.

BlackTerrel
03-09-2011, 10:35 PM
You're talking about degrees of success in terrorist attacks. This is about terrorism or not terrorism.

Well I would argue there is a difference between targeting government officials, soldiers etc... and randomly attacking civilians, women, children - and not caring how many people died.

I was always told IRA usually called in their attacks ahead of time and wanted to "minimize deaths and maximize exposure" where as many of the attacks we see today are just designed to kill as many people as possible.

South Park Fan
03-09-2011, 10:40 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provisional_Irish_Republican_Army_campaign_1969%E2 %80%931997

This says that the IRA killed over 600 civilians.

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 10:42 PM
Peter King wanted Peace in Ireland.




"I [wanted] a peace agreement, a working agreement, where the nationalist community would feel their rights would be respected," King said in an interview at his Capitol Hill office. "I felt that the IRA, in the context of Irish history, and Sinn Fein were a legitimate force that had to be recognized and you wouldn't have peace without them.

"Listen, I think I'm one of the people who brought about peace in Ireland."


SOURCE:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/03/04/AR2011030406635.html

specsaregood
03-09-2011, 10:45 PM
"Listen, I think I'm one of the people who brought about peace in Ireland."

By supporting terrorism that killed hundreds of innocents. Proof terrorism works!

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 10:47 PM
By supporting terrorism that killed hundreds of innocents. Proof terrorism works!

Supporting the cause of an independent Ireland, not the violence. I bet you won't find him supporting any of the violence.

specsaregood
03-09-2011, 10:49 PM
Supporting the cause of an independent Ireland, not the violence. I bet you won't find him supporting any of the violence.

uhhuh, I'm sure this is a benefit of the doubt he extends to all muslim americans too.

madfoot
03-09-2011, 10:49 PM
Is Frank usually in the habit of defending statists? This guy is my representative. Believe me, he's bad.

Anti Federalist
03-09-2011, 11:17 PM
Frank, cut your losses here, this is becoming farcical and painful to watch.

The IRA was a violent terrorist group with communist leanings.

Rep. King supported them, openly, publicly and is still sounding proud to have done it.

He is now sitting on a committee that seeks to pass laws to imprison people for doing the exact same thing he did.

That is hypocrisy of the highest sort, it is completely unacceptable and inexcusable in a man in his position and power he has over all of us.

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 11:18 PM
Is Frank usually in the habit of defending statists? This guy is my representative. Believe me, he's bad.
I'm not defending Peter King.

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 11:20 PM
Frank, cut your losses here, this is becoming farcical and painful to watch.

The IRA was a violent terrorist group with communist leanings.

Rep. King supported them, openly, publicly and is still sounding proud to have done it.

He is now sitting on a committee that seeks to pass laws to imprison people for doing the exact same thing he did.

That is hypocrisy of the highest sort, it is completely unacceptable and inexcusable in a man in his position and power he has over all of us.


When did Peter King support IRA violence? I see him supporting peace, not violence.

FrankRep
03-09-2011, 11:30 PM
LOL.

I just looked at Rep. Peter King's voting record and it's pathetic! Okay, okay, he sucks.

You guys win. I'm wrong.

ExPatPaki
03-10-2011, 09:06 AM
This guy wrote a novel in which he is the hero saving America from Islamic terrorists. He wants to force his retarded fantasies on American who happen to be Muslim:

http://www.amazon.com/Vale-Tears-Peter-T-King/dp/1589790626

TomtheTinker
03-10-2011, 09:13 AM
Peter King is a hypocrite..if one can't acknowledge that fact they must be deaf, blind and dumb.

doodle
03-10-2011, 12:07 PM
"The British government is a murder machine," King said



At a time when British government has its troops fighting terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan, is it wise to post such a statement from someone with ties to terrorists?

FrankRep
03-10-2011, 12:13 PM
At a time when British government has its troops fighting terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan, is it wise to post such a statement from someone with ties to terrorists?

Corny.

Jack Bauer
03-10-2011, 12:29 PM
King is a retard.

Let's forget about his position on the Muslim community in America for a while - which is rather naive and simplistic, but instead focus on what was going on in his mind when he decided have these hearings.

Is he so stupid to not realize that the hearings would only be used by the Democrats to paint all conservatives/tea partiers/libertarians as racists with the broadest brush that ABC, CBS, NBC and MSNBC can paint with?

Is he so stupid to not realize that the hearings will be used by extremist Islamic groups to divert focus onto ordinary Muslims and gain sympathy/anonymity in the public and the administration's eyes?

Is he so stupid to not realize that the hearings are nothing but a big PR gift to his supposed political opponents?

What a fool! I have never seen political capital wasted in such a pathetic manner.

Rothbardian Girl
03-10-2011, 02:20 PM
Muslim congressman weeps at terror hearing
Controversial hearing reignites debate over how to combat homegrown Islamic terrorism
Source: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42005790/ns/politics

WASHINGTON — Minnesota Democratic Rep. Keith Ellison, the first Muslim congressman, gave emotional testimony Thursday to a House of Representatives committee hearing on radicalization in the U.S. Muslim community.

Tearfully describing the story of a Muslim-American first-responder paramedic who died on September 11, 2001, Ellison criticized New York Republican Rep. Peter King for leading the controversial hearings that have reignited a national debate over how to combat a spate of home grown terrorism.

"Mohammed Salman Hamdani was a fellow American who gave his life for other Americans," Ellison said, his voice breaking. "His life should not be defined as a member of an ethnic group or a member of a religion, but as an American who gave everything for his fellow citizens."

"This committee's approach to violent extremism is contrary to American values and threatens our security," Ellison said. The congressman tried to hide his tears behind his papers and quickly left the room after his remarks.

The senior Democrat in the House, Michigan Rep. John Dingell, urged King and the committee to ensure that their investigation would not "blot the good name or the loyalty or raise questions about the decency of Arabs or Muslims or other Americans."

King insisted the hearing was the logical response to Obama administration warnings over a very real threat.

"To back down would be a craven surrender to political correctness and an abdication of what I believe to be the main responsibility of this committee — to protect America from a terrorist attack," King said in his opening remarks.

Critics have compared the hearing to overly zealous investigations of communism in the 1950s that led to false accusations that destroyed careers.

"There is nothing radical or un-American in holding these hearings," King said Thursday.

He pointed to Americans who went overseas where they joined militant groups, the attempt by a Saudi student caught in Texas as he was trying to build bombs and the failed attempt by a Pakistani-born U.S. citizen to detonate a car bomb in New York's bustling Times Square last year.

Melvin Bledsoe, whose son, Carlos, is charged with killing an Army private at a recruiting station in Little Rock, Ark., testified about his son's conversion to Islam and his isolation from his family.

"Carlos was captured by people best described as hunters," Bledsoe said. "He was manipulated and lied to."

The Obama administration has tried to frame the discussion around radicalization in general, without singling out Muslims. King said that is just political correctness, since al-Qaida is the main threat to the United States.

Abdirizak Bihi, a Somali American from Minnesota, said his nephew, Burhan, turned radical and left for Somalia to fight with militants. In questions from Rep. Dan Lungren, R-Calif., Bihi said he had been discouraged by mosque leaders from seeking answers about what became of his nephew and others who left for Somalia. The 18-year-old died in Somalia.

"If you do that, you're going to be responsible for the eradication of all mosques and Islamic society in North America," Bihi said, recounting what he was told. "You will have eternal fire and hell."

California Democratic Representative Jackie Speier, calling the hearing a "very skewed discussion," said the panel should have also spoken to witnesses from the Department of Homeland Security, FBI and Justice Department.

U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder took a veiled swipe at King on Wednesday, saying the focus by law enforcement was on individuals rather than an entire community because "we don't want to stigmatize, we don't want to alienate entire communities."

At the White House, spokesman Jay Carney said, "We welcome congressional involvement in this issue."

"In the United States, we don't practice guilt by association," Carney added. "We believe Muslim-Americans are part of the solution."

Elsewhere at the Capitol, Director of National Intelligence James Clapper also was scheduled to address the threat of homegrown terrorism Thursday. In his prepared remarks, Clapper says 2010 saw more plots involving homegrown Sunni Muslim extremists ideologically aligned with al-Qaida than in the previous year.

"Key to this trend has been the development of a U.S.-specific narrative that motivates individuals to violence," Clapper's remarks said.

The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report.


Reminds me of why I hate when shit like this happens. It's probably the second time I've ever felt bad for a person in Congress that isn't necessarily sympathetic to "liberty" - the first being Giffords. King looks like a freaking demon. Batshit insane.

amy31416
03-10-2011, 02:46 PM
LOL.

I just looked at Rep. Peter King's voting record and it's pathetic! Okay, okay, he sucks.

You guys win. I'm wrong.

Perhaps you could consider his (and others) ideas based on the philosophy (if any) behind those specific ideas, rather than embracing or dismissing everything about a person strictly on whether or not they vote the way you like?

King's initiative here doesn't suck because he's a crappy Republican, it sucks because of the deep bigotry, the fearmongering, collectivism, hypocrisy, etc. etc. Not to mention that this will backfire in obvious and unknown ways--I can't imagine much, if any, good coming from this.

If King had a fantastic conservative voting record, would you think he was right to address this issue the way he has?

doodle
03-10-2011, 02:56 PM
..
Tearfully describing the story of a Muslim-American first-responder paramedic who died on September 11, 2001, Ellison criticized New York Republican Rep. Peter King for leading the controversial hearings that have reignited a national debate over how to combat a spate of home grown terrorism.

"Mohammed Salman Hamdani was a fellow American who gave his life for other Americans," Ellison said, his voice breaking. "His life should not be defined as a member of an ethnic group or a member of a religion, but as an American who gave everything for his fellow citizens."

Reminds me of why I hate when shit like this happens. It's probably the second time I've ever felt bad for a person in Congress that isn't necessarily sympathetic to "liberty" - the first being Giffords. King looks like a freaking demon. Batshit insane.

King looks like an idiot again.

ExPatPaki
03-11-2011, 04:25 PM
It's Peter King's Party

By RAFIQ KATHWARI (http://counterpunch.org/kathwari03112011.html)

As someone whose nephew died in Afghanistan, I am acutely sensitive to these hearings and to the shameless hypocrisy of our elected representatives.

O, the Republicans pressed all the emotional buttons: It's about CAIR, stupid. The Council of American Islamic Relations is who our enemy truly is, they said. It has multitudes of chapters in the United States, is well organized, is gaining confidence, is becoming savvy at lobbying in Washington, is solvent. O God, it can even win seats in the House — all those fearful characteristics that have made the congressional friends of Israel nervous.

They tried to link CAIR to Hamas and to the Muslim Brotherhood. They said CAIR is building a wall between law enforcement and the community, is radicalizing the vulnerable, weak-minded Muslim youth of America and delivering them into the clutches of Al Qaeda. There were too many mosques in America, they said. Islam is becoming too powerful in America. It is a grave crisis confronting us today. Out threat level has never been so high. We must form a common defense against CAIR, they said. It wants to destroy Israel.

Our beloved constitution, they said, will be subservient to Sharia. Watch out, America. The Muslims are coming. The Muslims are here. Be fearful, America, but fear no longer, for Peter King will secure the homeland, including Israel. Peter King will entrap CAIR and destroy it, earning himself a political home run. The battle has begun. This is only the first salvo.

And thus was lost a good opportunity to truly learn the truth about The Extent of Radicalization in the American –Muslim Community and Investigate the Community's Response— which is the exact title of the hearings.

Years before he flew to Afghanistan, my nephew attended a suburban Catholic High School where he wrote his first major term paper titled, History's Most Persecuted Minority is Insensitive to the Aspirations of the Worlds Most Dispossessed Tribe. I remember the long title verbatim because I was struck by the eloquence of it, by his idea of injustice, his identification with the Palestinian cause, his radicalization, if you must, Mr. Chairman.

This is not a perception. It's a reality, deeply felt by the majority of the world's Muslims, young and old, from Seattle to Srinagar, where the democratic Indians are trying to control the radicalized Kashmiri Muslims of which I am one. Ugh!

Mr. Chairman, I am merely a subject of the United States. You are a king. You sit in a high chair in an oak-paneled room under the glare of lights at my behest. You are answerable to your subjects. I must ask: Are you really serious about investigating the Muslim community's response? If you are, which I believe you are, then please be on right side of history to see the world as radicalized Muslims see it.

We hate you because you do not consider us worthy of democracy, of determining our own future; how bloody patronizing of you. You think we have for centuries been ruled by despots and so you continue to impose your choice of despots on us, while you loosen our oil spigots, arm and enrich a colonial settler state, your cop on the beat who ensures the oil flows smoothly and the despots keep the subjects quiet with the tanks and fighter jets you supply them.

Mr. Chairman, there is a symbiotic relationship between our radicalized youth and your imperialism. They feed on each other and need each other. It is the New Cold War, to paraphrase one of your pseudo-intellectual witnesses at the hearings. Since any secular, revolutionary opposition to imperial despotism, will always meet a full out suppression campaign by you, your military henchmen or your gendarme state, it's just dandy to promote shoe, underwear and flight school amateur chemistry kids as soldiers of Al Qaeda sworn to destroy America, more so now right here in the manicured homeland, working within their sleeper organizations, such as CAIR.

You call it the Eisenhower doctrine. We call it imperial pillage. Why should it surprise you when it engenders feelings of helplessness and indifference in some, and blind rage in young educated, discontent middle class or higher Muslim youth — whom you choose to dub "home-grown terrorists"— who get involved in movements opposing the status quo or fighting back against U.S. hegemony? Or, like my nephew, who found himself in the wrong terrain, at the wrong time under a wrong sky for, unbeknownst to him, a bored, young armchair pilot 11,000 miles away in Nevada rained down misery on Tora Bora, in the name of liberty.

Rafiq Kathwari, a poet, divides his time between New York, Dublin and Kashmir. He can be reached at rmk28@columbia.edu

Xavi1990
03-11-2011, 05:16 PM
Lol, Americans calling the I.R.A terrorists. This after you fought the same empire that still occupies our land, and I'm not a Nationalist but the I.R.A were not terrorists.

Read that article, King called the I.R.A a "legitimate force". Can you honestly say that an occupation of a country, blatant discrimination, gerrymandering, internment, etc were not reasons to continue the fight against the british empire?

doodle
03-11-2011, 06:11 PM
Lol, Americans calling the I.R.A terrorists. This after you fought the same empire that still occupies our land, and I'm not a Nationalist but the I.R.A were not terrorists.

Read that article, King called the I.R.A a "legitimate force". Can you honestly say that an occupation of a country, blatant discrimination, gerrymandering, internment, etc were not reasons to continue the fight against the british empire?

See from from Americans point of view for a second. Right now British troops are helping coaliton occupation forces in Iraq/Afghanistan in war on terror, is IRA helping there if they are a legitimate force?

BTW, how is Peter King seen in Dublin these days?

Xavi1990
03-11-2011, 06:48 PM
See from from Americans point of view for a second. Right now British troops are helping coaliton occupation forces in Iraq/Afghanistan in war on terror, is IRA helping there if they are a legitimate force?

BTW, how is Peter King seen in Dublin these days?

By American point of view, I presume you're talking of the Americans who believe that they're fighting wars against men who hate women in McDonalds? You can understand why people think that America was attacked because of freedom because it has been pumped into the populace of all western countries by the media. But anyone with a very limited understanding of Irish history knows what the I.R.A were fighting for. Can you tell me what you think Americans thought the I.R.A were fighting for?

King wouldn't be well known. Last time I heard of him, he was about micheal jackson or something.

doodle
03-11-2011, 06:55 PM
By American point of view, I presume you're talking of the Americans who believe that they're fighting wars against men who hate women in McDonalds? You can understand why people think that America was attacked because of freedom because it has been pumped into the populace of all western countries by the media. But anyone with a very limited understanding of Irish history knows what the I.R.A were fighting for. Can you tell me what you think Americans thought the I.R.A were fighting for?

King wouldn't be well known. Last time I heard of him, he was about micheal jackson or something.

I was refering to common perception why British and IRA may not be seen both as lefitoimate forces by Americans in war on terror.

I have read the play "Rising of the Moon" and perhaps can claim that I'm somewhat aware of Irish-British history.

Xavi1990
03-11-2011, 06:58 PM
I was refering to common perception why British and IRA may not be seen both as lefitoimate forces by Americans in war on terror.

I have read the play "Rising of the Moon" and perhaps can claim that I'm somewhat aware of Irish-British history.

This is enough you need to know. By Eavan Boland

The Famine Road
'Idle as trout in light Colonel Jones

these Irish, give them no coins at all; their bones
need toil, their characters no less.' Trevelyan's
seal blooded the deal table. The Relief
Committee deliberated: 'Might it be safe,
Colonel, to give them roads, roads to force
from nowhere, going nowhere of course?

'one out of every ten and then
another third of those again
women - in a case like yours.'

Sick, directionless they worked fork, stick
were iron years away; after all could
they not blood their knuckles on rock, suck
April hailstones for water and for food?
Why for that, cunning as housewives, each eyed-
as if at a corner butcher - the other's buttock.

'anything may have caused it, spores,
a childhood accident; one sees
day after day these mysteries.'

Dusk: they will work tomorrow without him.

They know it and walk clear. He has become
a typhoid pariah, his blood tainted, although
be shares it with some there. No more than snow
attends its own flakes where they settle
and melt, will they pray by his death rattle

'You never will, never you know
but take it well woman, grow
your garden, keep house, good-bye.'

'It has gone better than we expected, Lord
Trevelyan, sedition, idleness, cured
in one; from parish to parish, field to field;
the wretches work till they are quite worn.
then fester by their work; we march the corn
to the ships in peace. This Tuesday I saw bones
our of my carriage window. Your servant Jones.'

'Barren, never to know the load
of his child in you, what is your body
now if not a famine road? '

doodle
03-11-2011, 07:15 PM
This was interesting, pretty unusual poetry, thanks for sharing it. Had not heard of Boland before.

doodle
03-11-2011, 08:23 PM
Has anyne seen video clip of this exchnage? I can't find it on youtube.


Peter King: force behind Muslim hearings was an IRA supporter

Republican senator dismisses critics' attempts to draw a parallel with al-Qaida, arguing the IRA never attacked on US soil

But as one Democrat slyly reminded the New York Republican during the committee hearing, King too faces accusations of aiding extremist organisations.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/10/peter-king-muslim-hearings-ira-supporter


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=200FSxhwkuE


Sometimes it is hard to not admire some within democrats for their bravery.

Xavi1990
03-12-2011, 09:00 AM
This was interesting, pretty unusual poetry, thanks for sharing it. Had not heard of Boland before.

Very good poet. Poems I would recommend by Boland are: "The War Horse" and "Child of Our Time." They are all centered around Irish history and current events though. But "The Famine Road" is my favorite.

Boland actually lived in Iowa for a while.

But back to my point: That poem illustrates what it was like under the British empire. And that empire still occupies the 6 counties. Again, I'm not a nationalist or anti-English or anything, it's just a fact!