After watching this video, anyone still wants to cut funding for NASA?

[doodle]

Extraordinary: Discovery Launch Seen from Air

http://news.discovery.com/space/extraordinary-discovery-launch-from-a-passenger-jet-110226.html

[McBell]

Yep.

[dannno]

Hehehehehheh.............yahhhh.....

[doodle]

ok , cool video though :)

[archangel689]

Yes. We need to get to get out of this gravity well and nasa is holding us back with its inefficiencies.

Granted that's awesome..... but It plays second fiddle to this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rXtG3vfAlA

The Saturn V dwarfed the capabilities of the shuttle....Shuttle was a step backwards in many ways.... They haven't build an engine like the F1s SINCE and they couldn't do it again without tons of money! Building rockets vertically! Mobile service towers! WASTES of money! The only reason we got to the moon was because it was JFKs legacy... and since he got shot no one wanted to cut space funding!


Spacex has done more with less money than nasa will ever. It's bureaucracy squanders money. Nasa should concentrate purely on research. If spacex was given nasa's budget for one year, we'd already be on mars.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCc2F8KccD4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nq8HrxfSZMc

http://www.spacex.com

[Expatriate]

If by "funding" you mean anything taken by force, by all means cut it.

As a matter of fact I'll bet if it wasn't for the various government monopolies crippling our advancement there would be a bunch of private organizations with space tech far surpassing anything NASA has ever offered.

[MaxPower]

If we're talking about tax-funding, then I imagine the desire among those who frequent this site to cut said funding is near-unanimous.

[TruckinMike]

After watching this video, anyone still wants to cut funding for NASA?

Yes.

It is justification for placing their guns to our heads --- I say NASA should be a 501c(3)(or something of that nature), Then the oooh's and ahhs can be merited. Unlike now, the ooh's and ahhh's are on the backs of men and women that labored as slaves for NASA's funding.

TMike

[Brooklyn Red Leg]

Extraordinary: Discovery Launch Seen from Air

I'm willing to bet that there are already private companies planning on their own spaceplanes (space shuttle, essentially) and they will be built cheaper and launched far easier, safer, less costly and more often than NASA's fleet.

[angelatc]

If that's the best you have....that was the final Discovery launch anyway.

[Flash]

The problem is... NASA is hurting it's potential competitors due to government policy. Thus stunting innovation.

http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=5960

[olehounddog]

Cut it long and deep.

[archangel689]

Keep in mind that everyone seems to think that nasa gets a shit ton of money.... cutting nasa will give us enough money to run the rest of the government for about a week. *facepalm*

(I'm serious and I was also serious when I said that one week of money was enough for a private company to get us to mars)

If you think that's bad, realize that Shuttle is so outdated that they can't build a new one because the contractors have went astray or bankrupt... you can't get the parts.

It was not long ago that they were looking to buy intel 8086 processors on ebay for replacement parts for the Shuttle Program! *facepalm*


Reduce NASA and make it a research and academic entity a joint university project if you will, no fed funding. You would want all nasas past research available to private companies

like the research for the Saturn V and F1 engines.....again...because its so awesome it should be posted twice...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rXtG3vfAlA


And AZ king, you are more right than you know....If we don't get off this rock we are destined to nuke ourselves into oblivion.

[AZKing]

Everything is a low priority cut to me compared to overseas spending. I would much rather give $15 billion to NASA than to middle east countries so they can kill each other.

[ammorris]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEFNjL86y9c&NR=1

After watching this video, does anyone not want to cut funding for NASA?

[archangel689]

Ummm.... so we sacrifice the freedom of space travel for the safety of staying in earths cradle?

Need I quote Franklin?

[ammorris]

I'm not saying that we should "sacrifice the freedom of space travel." I'm just saying that NASA seems to be pretty bad at it. Maybe we should give the private sector a chance.

[libertybrewcity]

I want to cut it even more now.

[archangel689]

I'm not saying that we should "sacrifice the freedom of space travel." I'm just saying that NASA seems to be pretty bad at it. Maybe we should give the private sector a chance.

Agreed. That's different. I thought you were making a justification for abandoning space entirely. Spacex already has a rocket which can take people to the space station. They just have to get through the red tape to do it.

check it out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9MaFqZUQkE

[emazur]

Ummm.... so we sacrifice the freedom of space travel for the safety of staying in earths cradle?

Need I quote Franklin?

What makes you think government funded NASA will provide a ticket for your space chariot to freedom? Government doesn't give freedoms, it takes them.

[Anti Federalist]

Ummm.... so we sacrifice the freedom of space travel for the safety of staying in earths cradle?

Need I quote Franklin?

Shit, it's government inefficiencies, bureaucracies and regulations that hold it back from the common man, much of that in the name of Safety, Hallowed be thy Name.

I can only imagine what kind of "security" bureaucracy and procedures will be in place, 100 years from now, prior to your being able to board your connecting rocket to Phobos.

I kid, because if the scourge of government is not reigned in and eventually phased out, mankind will be wiped out.

[archangel689]

Please read the entire thread before posting (I am for cutting nasa).

[Mark37snj]

Obama's war on NASA is another example of his war against America exceptionalism. He does not want us feel we are special anymore, exceptinal, just ordinary human beings, thereby worthy of totalitarian rule. He truely despises America and what we stand for. He is trying to erase our identity, history, and heritage. Why do you think he blames america first, goes on world apology tours, and bad mouths everyone who does not agree with his American-hating speeches and agenda.

[Doug8796]

I would gladly donate* my income tax (if its removed) to fund* nasa.

[devil21]

Obama's war on NASA is another example of his war against America exceptionalism. He does not want us feel we are special anymore, exceptinal, just ordinary human beings, thereby worthy of totalitarian rule. He truely despises America and what we stand for. He is trying to erase our identity, history, and heritage. Why do you think he blames america first, goes on world apology tours, and bad mouths everyone who does not agree with his American-hating speeches and agenda.

Are you sure you're on the right forum? I don't support Obama but let's not get into the false "American Exceptionalism" nonsense and "blame America" drivel. We aren't special. The only thing that makes us "special" is our ability to print money and use it to control other countries. It has nothing to do with you or I being special in any way, shape, or form over anyone else on this planet. I can't honestly believe you're a Paul supporter yet blather on about American Exceptionalism and blame America first rhetoric. Those are two things that don't get high reviews around here.

On topic: Our space program has been decent but the private sector could do it better and cheaper. There are a myriad of federal regulations working to keep space exploration the domain of government alone. You can't even get a plane off the ground without approval from the Feds. How will they react to your request to launch your own rocket and orbit your own satellite?? Or how the rocket fuel would be considered a dangerous explosive if you were in possession of it and you would go to jail.

[Mark37snj]

Are you sure you're on the right forum? I don't support Obama but let's not get into the false "American Exceptionalism" nonsense and "blame America" drivel. We aren't special. The only thing that makes us "special" is our ability to print money and use it to control other countries. It has nothing to do with you or I being special in any way, shape, or form over anyone else on this planet. I can't honestly believe you're a Paul supporter yet blather on about American Exceptionalism and blame America first rhetoric. Those are two things that don't get high reviews around here.

Good Grief dude, you got problems!!!!

American exceptionalism is nonsense to you?
Obamas Blame America for everything is nothing but drivel?
There is nothing special about America but our ability to print money?
You can't believe Im a Ron Paul supporter because I disagree with you?

Given what you just said I am not at all suprised. Hmmm...you ignore facts, resort to personal attacks, make claims that your some how the gatekeeper on issues, and others don't belong here because they don't agree with you. Can we get a mod to delete this Liberal/Progressive spy from out boards plz!!!!

P.S For the record...I DO BELIEVE AMERICA IS SPECIAL, SO WHY DON'T YOU STOP ATTACKING PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE THAT WAY, MAYBE YOU DON'T BELONG HERE, WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH ANYWAY

[Kregisen]

It still amazes me that the only reason we see the shuttle curving as it's lifting off is because the earth is rotating the shuttle is moving straight up....

[NYgs23]

Abolish the whole thing. People can go do space if and when they want to go to space. You don't need theft to do it. Again with the false assumption that if the state happens to be doing something that means only the state can do it.

[Invi]

It still amazes me that the only reason we see the shuttle curving as it's lifting off is because the earth is rotating the shuttle is moving straight up....

I know, right? That's something.



I'm for cutting spending all around, NASA is no exception.
I'm sure private citizens and businesses, given the chance, can do it better, cheaper, and faster.

[Nate-ForLiberty]

after watching the video in the OP, it feels like our attempts at space travel are feeble at best.

maybe it's just years of watching star trek. . .

[teacherone]

that's one massive carbon footprint right there...

[pacelli]

That could have been an ICBM and the people would still be amazed. Whether it is a nasa shuttle or an icbm, we cannot afford to amaze people any more.

[00_Pete]

Star Trek/Carl Sagan nerds better pay attention to what is happening in Planet Earth instead of engaging in technology/cosmos worship.

[Texan4Life]

That is pretty cool. Imagine if government didnt have space exploration by the balls... this would not been seen as amazing because it would be a lot more common.

[jdmyprez_deo_vindice]

Not only cut their funding but shut the whole damn thing down. Private industry can do this much better than the government could ever dream of and while blasting crap into space is cool, I would prefer not have my pockets picked so that others can float in space. Outside of defense purposes we have no real need for the government to blast anything into space anyway.

[00_Pete]

That is pretty cool. Imagine if government didnt have space exploration by the balls... this would not been seen as amazing because it would be a lot more common.

The only things that would survive are the things that make money (telecomunication satellites, geographical satellites for business purposes, etc). The "curiosity" stuff would totally disappear...im cool with that. Mankind will never exit the solar system or colonize anything...so...

[BlutStein]

Surprisingly NASA is the one single part of our government that I don't think should have anything cut from it. Rather sure I'm in the minority on this one though.

NASA is either the smallest government program we have or one of the very smallest ($15-17 Billion) and is the only part of our government that gives us back way more than we ever put into it. Not only do it help us further our education system with discoveries that force us to rewrite our textbooks, but they do also create thousands of technologies and patents that create spin-offs that make it into the economy. These spin-offs form companies, release new products onto the market and create jobs.

Website showing everyday items that stemmed from NASA: http://www.nasa.gov/externalflash/nasacity/index2.htm

Most people think they just run space shuttles from time to time but NASA does far more than just space and preforms research in every branch of science from Medical, to Weather to Material Engineering.

What seals the deal for me is when you compare the whole of NASA's budget for one year next to the Iraq War. Would you rather expand Man's knowledge of our Universe or pay roll maybe 2 week in Iraq blowing up children and country side.

See...I even made it really easy for you there. ;) Seriously, NASA is one of the very few things are government does correctly. I'm for private companies working in space too but while getting close, we aren't there yet and I doubt some of the for profit space companies will be doing as much medical research and helping to fund a lot of University research.

[BlutStein]

*facepalm*

Ok. So you realise that the Universe is a rather rather big and that the Earth is just about the tiniest dot possible to compare sizes with it? There is far more stuff to research and learn from out there in Cosmos then we'll ever find here. And that it is really only because of NASA that we can study our own planet to the level we can today.

Think Katrina was bad? Without NASA we would have weather satellites to study Earth's Weather, provide you with a 7 day forecast, and see Hurricanes coming a few weeks in advance. Sure you do some of that with planes, but having a camera in geosynchronous orbit is also pretty dang handy.

Like GPS? That's been a boon for getting around this rock we call Earth and satellite photos and mapping the earth's magnetic field has been pretty handy explaining how tectonic plates work, and to find old human civilizations since buried under soil or forests. If NASA goes, our ability to study and learn about the earth will take a giant step backwards.

[jdmyprez_deo_vindice]

Seriously, NASA is one of the very few things are government does correctly.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_JUKZNrYcmEg/TUSv8sENevI/AAAAAAAAAe8/OrKpwjraR1s/s1600/challenger-explosion.jpg

http://scienceblogs.com/startswithabang/upload/2009/05/remember_them_this_memorial_da/shuttle-breakup1.jpg

http://randomperspective.com/?1news142

http://blog.silive.com/weather/2008/05/tn2_apollo_13_4.jpg

Shall I continue?

Nobody will argue that what NASA does is not cool and yes lots of amazing things have been developed because of NASA but those same items would have been developed just the same for private industries as they would have been for a government agency. Just because something is nifty does not mean it is not a waste of resources. Sure, maybe it is not as much as it costs us in our lame attempt to police the world but that again is beside the point. Why should we be forced to choose between two bloated programs. I say we cut both and start saving some real money.

[erowe1]

I'm not going to watch the video. But, yeah, no matter what's in it, I'm for completely eliminating NASA from the federal budget.

If you want to keep funding it voluntarily, go ahead.

[erowe1]

If NASA goes, our ability to study and learn about the earth will take a giant step backwards.

Hogwash.

This is the typical defense of everything the government does. Some good thing now happens as a result of some government program. Therefore, if we eliminated that government program, the world would be like it is now, except without that good thing. So, if we eliminated NASA, all that capital and labor and brainpower that went into it would simply disappear, rather than be allocated in an even better way in response to millions and millions of individual arrangements made between free people pursuant to their own best interests, rather than pursuant to the central management of government bureaucrats and politicians.

If the government took over shopping malls, people like you would pop up a generation from now insisting that government shopping malls never be defunded because of all the good things about shopping malls that wouldn't exist any more if the government didn't make it happen.

[erowe1]

Keep in mind that everyone seems to think that nasa gets a shit ton of money.... [B]cutting nasa will give us enough money to run the rest of the government for about a week.

Gee, when you put it that way....

Why not just say, "Cutting NASA would only provide enough funding for each of us to slide down a razor blade into a pool of iodine one time."?

[erowe1]

If we don't get off this rock we are destined to nuke ourselves into oblivion.

So, let me get this straight.

The state has weapons that can make the world's population cower before them, and you want to be able to escape that threat, so you look to the state to give you the way to do that?

[Elwar]

I'm fine with NASA as long as it isn't funded by any money taken by force.

[erowe1]

Obama's war on NASA is another example of his war against America federal government exceptionalism. He does not want us feel we are the federal government is special anymore, exceptional, just ordinary human beings, thereby worthyunworthy of totalitarian rule. He truly despises America the federal government and what we stand it stands for. He is trying to erase our its identity, history, and heritage. Why do you think he blames america the federal government first, goes on world apology tours, and bad mouths everyone who does not agree with his Americanfederal government-hating speeches and agenda.

Fixed it.

If only it were true. Obama would be awesome.

[RyanRSheets]

I just want to know where the hell NASA spends all the money we give them. Billions of dollars a year and they haven't been to Mars yet? I mean, it's just rocket science.

[Elwar]

The federal government has as much business funding NASA as it does NASCAR.

[pcosmar]

NASA was created to employ the Nazi Scientists we rescued from legal prosecution.
It was used to showcase our Ballistic Missile Program.

Disposable one time use rockets are the absolute worst way to get into space.

De-fund it. close it. And remove restrictions on private space development.


When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me.

I followed every launch from Mercury through Apollo. Glued to the TV. I had wanted to be in the Space program. In the mid 70s I realized that there was no "Space Exploration" but only military exploitation.

As I read the "Weekly Reader" as a child, we were supposed to have 20 shuttles and a space station by the 80s. This is 2011. And I'm grown now.

[devil21]

Good Grief dude, you got problems!!!!

American exceptionalism is nonsense to you?
Obamas Blame America for everything is nothing but drivel?
There is nothing special about America but our ability to print money?
You can't believe Im a Ron Paul supporter because I disagree with you?

Given what you just said I am not at all suprised. Hmmm...you ignore facts, resort to personal attacks, make claims that your some how the gatekeeper on issues, and others don't belong here because they don't agree with you. Can we get a mod to delete this Liberal/Progressive spy from out boards plz!!!!

P.S For the record...I DO BELIEVE AMERICA IS SPECIAL, SO WHY DON'T YOU STOP ATTACKING PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE THAT WAY, MAYBE YOU DON'T BELONG HERE, WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH ANYWAY

Just callin it like I see it. All that exceptionalism nonsense is neo-con spew meant to help Americans feel like it's "ok" to do whatever the hell we want around the world and not care. Kill people, steal resources, etc. It's ok because Americans are "special". America used to be special. It's not anymore. Americans are about as far from special as we can get now. We print money, buy off dictators and supply the world with weapons that they kill each other with, usually based on conflicts that our CIA quietly started.

So how about instead of broad nonsense statements about "Blame America first" and "American exceptionalism" (which we hear those terms a lot out of the mouths of neo-cons, so you automatically sound like one), how about you go ahead and explain how you're so much better than people in other countries, solely because of where you were born?

[jmdrake]

Extraordinary: Discovery Launch Seen from Air

http://news.discovery.com/space/extraordinary-discovery-launch-from-a-passenger-jet-110226.html

Well after watching the video bellow I'm sure NASA is not necessary.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXNkUNP75-Q

[jmdrake]

I'm fine with NASA as long as it isn't funded by any money taken by force.

Yep. Make NASA have pledge drives just like PBS.

[Acala]

I grew up being enthralled by aerospace advances. When I was really little, the x-15 was about the coolest thing on the planet. Becasue it was FAST! And it went HIGH!
And it looked cool. And it WAS cool. And the guys who flew it were cool.

Then came NASA and the space program. And things just got cooler. The engineering was awesome. The human courage was awesome. The photos were awesome. The promise for the future was awesome. I loved it. And still do. NASA has done some amazing, inspiring, educational things.

But it is not within the powers delegated to the Federal government by the Constitution and it is not an appropriate reason to take money from people at gunpoint. Kill it.

Kill it and from its ashes will rise something better.

[Acala]

All that exceptionalism nonsense is neo-con spew meant to help Americans feel like it's "ok" to do whatever the hell we want around the world and not care. Kill people, steal resources, etc. It's ok because Americans are "special". America used to be special. It's not anymore. Americans are about as far from special as we can get now. We print money, buy off dictators and supply the world with weapons that they kill each other with, usually based on conflicts that our CIA quietly started.

So how about instead of broad nonsense statements about "Blame America first" and "American exceptionalism" (which we hear those terms a lot out of the mouths of neo-cons, so you automatically sound like one), how about you go ahead and explain how you're so much better than people in other countries, solely because of where you were born?

This^

Exactly how closely do we need to follow in the footsteps of the Nazis before we get it? When politicians start trying to rouse the public with empty praise for how "uber" they once were and could be again if only you will elect Newt or some other demagogue, be afraid. Be VERY f&*^%*g afraid.

But this country once WAS special. It was special because the people believed in liberty and tried to build a government that would protect it. And we were special exactly, and only, to the extent we remained a bastion of freedom in an unfree world. And as soon as we got the idea that wealth, or might, or government is what made us special, the America that WAS special died.

So remember, liberty=exceptional. Everything else, including a space program built at gunpoint, is just more of the same crap.

[TruckinMike]

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTr8-bfReWbms-DMBKoZoRvuOlr9cSqiWKca0Ni4EM3jfGYvaHGhttp://d2eosjbgw49cu5.cloudfront.net/hidden-travel-gems.com/imgname--branson_unveils_first_private_space_travel_carrier _craft---50226711--virgin_galactic_eve_air-1_w606.jpg
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His space plane has already made a flight and they are now booking passengers.


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Virgin Galactic Mission Control

TMike

[Mark37snj]

Just callin it like I see it. All that exceptionalism nonsense is neo-con spew meant to help Americans feel like it's "ok" to do whatever the hell we want around the world and not care. Kill people, steal resources, etc. It's ok because Americans are "special". America used to be special. It's not anymore. Americans are about as far from special as we can get now. We print money, buy off dictators and supply the world with weapons that they kill each other with, usually based on conflicts that our CIA quietly started.

So how about instead of broad nonsense statements about "Blame America first" and "American exceptionalism" (which we hear those terms a lot out of the mouths of neo-cons, so you automatically sound like one), how about you go ahead and explain how you're so much better than people in other countries, solely because of where you were born?

You don't have to be better than everyone else to be exceptional. And just because there are some very serious problems with the way our govement has been operating does not mean you can paint us with that broad brush you were just complaining about to paint all of america, what we have accomplished, what we stand for, the true evils we have fought against, and the good we have done for our fellow man, and just say we are not special. Our goverment is not special, but are goverments representative of their people? So are all Iranians just like their leader? Of course not, same applies with americans. The american people are exceptional, not all but alot, but not our goverment. I guess your incapable of seeing it like that. Just looking for an excuse to bad mouth everyone. Like I said, you got issues.

I wonder how much money americans donate to charities. Lets see just how unexceptional american citizens really are. http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2007/June/200706261522251CJsamohT0.8012354.html

Washington -- Americans increased their charitable donations significantly in 2006 to more than $295 billion -- a record, according to a study released June 25 by the Giving USA Foundation, which reports on charitable contributions.

The overwhelming majority of this money was donated by individuals, not corporations or foundations, according to the chairman of Giving USA, Richard Jolly. Donations from individuals, including bequests, accounted for 83.3 percent of total giving last year, or $245.8 billion, he told USINFO.

Its a NeoCon conspiracy, mass propaganda and brainwashing to control americans to get them to donate money to the needy. All so americans can be deluded into thinking its ok to blah blah blah. LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!

"All that exceptionalism nonsense is neo-con spew meant to help Americans feel like it's "ok" to do whatever the hell we want around the world and not care. " I do believe this is one of the primary complaints and a major reason for the rise of the Tea Party. Americans are against alot of what you are complaining about, but they were just not fast enough to meet with your approval. So you just condemn and bad mouth everyone...WOW

[erowe1]

You don't have to be better than everyone else to be exceptional. And just because there are some very serious problems with the way our govement has been operating does not mean you can paint us with that broad brush you were just complaining about to paint all of america, what we have accomplished, what we stand for, the true evils we have fought against, and the good we have done for our fellow man, and just say we are not special. Our goverment is not special, but are goverments representative of their people? So are all Iranians just like their leader? Of course not, same applies with americans. The american people are exceptional, not all but alot, but not our goverment. I guess your incapable of seeing it like that. Just looking for an excuse to bad mouth everyone. Like I said, you got issues.

I wonder how much money americans donate to charities. Lets see just how unexceptional american citizens really are. http://www.america.gov/st/washfile-english/2007/June/200706261522251CJsamohT0.8012354.html

Washington -- Americans increased their charitable donations significantly in 2006 to more than $295 billion -- a record, according to a study released June 25 by the Giving USA Foundation, which reports on charitable contributions.

The overwhelming majority of this money was donated by individuals, not corporations or foundations, according to the chairman of Giving USA, Richard Jolly. Donations from individuals, including bequests, accounted for 83.3 percent of total giving last year, or $245.8 billion, he told USINFO.

Its a NeoCon conspiracy, mass propaganda and brainwashing to control americans to get them to donate money to the needy. All so americans can be deluded into thinking its ok to blah blah blah. LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!

"All that exceptionalism nonsense is neo-con spew meant to help Americans feel like it's "ok" to do whatever the hell we want around the world and not care. " I do believe this is one of the primary complaints and a major reason for the rise of the Tea Party. Americans are against alot of what you are complaining about, but they were just not fast enough to meet with your approval. So you just condemn and bad mouth everyone...WOW

I'm confused. What kind of American exceptionalism are you for? Exceptionalism on the part of the American people, or exceptionalism on the part of the single greatest enemy the American people have, the federal government (i.e. what NASA belongs to). It can't be both. To be for one is to be against the other.

[Mark37snj]

I'm confused. What kind of American exceptionalism are you for? Exceptionalism on the part of the American people, or exceptionalism on the part of the single greatest enemy the American people have, the federal government (i.e. what NASA belongs to). It can't be both. To be for one is to be against the other.

I don't hold everything our goverment does at fault or should be done away with. I don't hold everybody who works for the goverment at fault or should be fired. I hold those who are responsible, the ones in charge. There are good people at NASA, there are bad people at NASA. There were good programs and bad programs. There was money wasted and money well spent. You can't just say everything NASA has done has been a waste or everyone who has worked for them are unexceptional people. Your either this-or that is not applicable here, only a Sith speaks in absolutes. There were exceptional NASA programs and people, and unexceptional NASA programs and people. Everything our goverment touches has been corrupted, no doubt about that. But that does not mean EVERYTHING is bad, or corrupted, or unexceptional. The NeoCons would love nothing more then endless wars partially enabled by a society that thinks itself so rightous and exceptional that whatever we are doing must be rightous. What I am saying is America and Americans have good reasons to feel that they/we are exceptional and that the NeoCons are trying to hijack it for their own purpose. But just because they are trying to use our pride against us to comit attrocities is no reason to go around and say we have no reason to be proud of what we are. If this was the case the Tea Party would not exist. Guns don't kill people, people kill people...pride doesn't inflict injustice, the inflictors inflict injustice. If you want to ban our pride because the NeoCons are trying to use it to harm people, then why not ban guns because the criminals are trying to use them to harm people.

American exceptionalism and pride is justified, truthful, and beneficial. It can also be manipulated, harmful, and dangerous. But I will be damned if I'm gona give up my gun because others are trying to use them to harm people, and I will be damned if I'm gona give up my American pride because others are trying to use it to harm people.

[Agorism]

hell yes we ned to cut it.

[tangent4ronpaul]

No - we still need NASA, and I'm not going to rehash why. Wh have allreay had several marathon threads on the topic.

Very cool vid of the launch!

[Kotin]

of course I still want to cut funding to NASA... what? are you saying that the private sector couldnt do this??



pshhhhhhhhhh

[erowe1]

I don't hold everything our goverment does at fault or should be done away with. I don't hold everybody who works for the goverment at fault or should be fired. I hold those who are responsible, the ones in charge. There are good people at NASA, there are bad people at NASA. There were good programs and bad programs. There was money wasted and money well spent. You can't just say everything NASA has done has been a waste or everyone who has worked for them are unexceptional people. Your either this-or that is not applicable here, only a Sith speaks in absolutes. There were exceptional NASA programs and people, and unexceptional NASA programs and people. Everything our goverment touches has been corrupted, no doubt about that. But that does not mean EVERYTHING is bad, or corrupted, or unexceptional. The NeoCons would love nothing more then endless wars partially enabled by a society that thinks itself so rightous and exceptional that whatever we are doing must be rightous. What I am saying is America and Americans have good reasons to feel that they/we are exceptional and that the NeoCons are trying to hijack it for their own purpose. But just because they are trying to use our pride against us to comit attrocities is no reason to go around and say we have no reason to be proud of what we are. If this was the case the Tea Party would not exist. Guns don't kill people, people kill people...pride doesn't inflict injustice, the inflictors inflict injustice. If you want to ban our pride because the NeoCons are trying to use it to harm people, then why not ban guns because the criminals are trying to use them to harm people.

American exceptionalism and pride is justified, truthful, and beneficial. It can also be manipulated, harmful, and dangerous. But I will be damned if I'm gona give up my gun because others are trying to use them to harm people, and I will be damned if I'm gona give up my American pride because others are trying to use it to harm people.

I still don't know the answer to my question. Which kind of American exceptionalism are you for, exceptionalism of the people or exceptionalism of the federal government?

Your earlier comment was about the latter (NASA), but your subsequent defense of it only mentioned the former.

[Fredom101]

If by "funding" you mean anything taken by force, by all means cut it.

As a matter of fact I'll bet if it wasn't for the various government monopolies crippling our advancement there would be a bunch of private organizations with space tech far surpassing anything NASA has ever offered.

Exactly! +1000

[devil21]

You don't have to be better than everyone else to be exceptional.

This is true. Don't they call retarded kids "exceptional"? "Special" too? lol


The american people are exceptional, not all but alot, but not our goverment.

See above. In this context I think the federal government is also extremely exceptional. ;)

[Texan4Life]

The only things that would survive are the things that make money (telecomunication satellites, geographical satellites for business purposes, etc). The "curiosity" stuff would totally disappear...im cool with that. Mankind will never exit the solar system or colonize anything...so...

maybe, maybe not. a lot of discoveries/inventions are made out of curiosity or even a lucky hunch. With all levels of funding. Excluding that though, imagine commercial companies wanting to build better rockets/propulsion systems/electronics, ect. for launching satellites. While this technology isn't necessarily made for space exploration, it can be adapted/modified/improved on easier than starting from scratch NASA style.

Though I think we can all agree NASA isn't anywhere near to top of the "programs to cut" list.

[spudea]

if NASA is so great, put it in the private competitive marketplace

It would probably get a lot more funding that way than having a central authority dictate its budget.

[doodle]

if NASA is so great, put it in the private competitive marketplace

It would probably get a lot more funding that way than having a central authority dictate its budget.

The risk is that opening up the competition and allowing free market enterprise into this field might diminish their "greatness".

[BlutStein]

If the government took over shopping malls, people like you would pop up a generation from now insisting that government shopping malls never be defunded because of all the good things about shopping malls that wouldn't exist any more if the government didn't make it happen.

Your reply would be correct if this weren't the Ron Paul Forum. I'm here for a reason remember? NASA does do it correctly, but I won't claim they the only ones that can...just that they currently are the only ones doing it. I'd love to have a private alternative but for $15 billion a year they are the slimmest project the government has going and the only the one that gives us back results equal to or multiple times what is paid in. Some of their discoveries are priceless.

I understand none of the arguments I put forth that are pro-nasa will work here but for the money, NASA is the only thing you can point to and say the government can do something right.

BTW the multiple space shuttle launches a year that NASA does is less than 20% of their budget, the rest is all research which you personally have benefited from whether you will admit it or not.

[mczerone]

Surprisingly NASA is the one single part of our government that I don't think should have anything cut from it. Rather sure I'm in the minority on this one though.

NASA is either the smallest government program we have or one of the very smallest ($15-17 Billion) and is the only part of our government that gives us back way more than we ever put into it.

1) Source?

2) All the more reason to allow competing private investments in the stuff NASA does. If a worthy project can make money, would it make more money in the hands of a monopolist, or distributed among competing firms?


Not only do it help us further our education system with discoveries that force us to rewrite our textbooks, but they do also create thousands of technologies and patents that create spin-offs that make it into the economy. These spin-offs form companies, release new products onto the market and create jobs.

Website showing everyday items that stemmed from NASA: http://www.nasa.gov/externalflash/nasacity/index2.htm


Edocation system embiggened by NASA? What has been learned by NASA that couldn't have been learned from private research? How many dozens of Hubble-type telescopes would have went up and actually worked the first time?

And your link has absolute crap, for a illustrative example: In the Kitchen (great UM song, btw) lists "water purification" as one of the things "NASA brought us", but the accompanying text and video explain that NASA is working with private industry to adapt previous technology to the needs of space. So not only is NASA dependent on private R&D for such basic things as water filtration, but they can't even adapt the designs on their own. And little to none of NASA's work helps, can help, or will ever help you.


What seals the deal for me is when you compare the whole of NASA's budget for one year next to the Iraq War. Would you rather expand Man's knowledge of our Universe or pay roll maybe 2 week in Iraq blowing up children and country side.

See...I even made it really easy for you there. Seriously, NASA is one of the very few things are government does correctly. I'm for private companies working in space too but while getting close, we aren't there yet and I doubt some of the for profit space companies will be doing as much medical research and helping to fund a lot of University research.

Ahh... "would you rather"... watch a Rosie O'Donnell movie marathon, or run a marathon carrying the actress on your shoulders? To answer your question, I'd rather spend my money on NASA. Which is why they should stop paying their own salaries as a cut for my support to NASA. It's called the internet. I can donate to, patronize, or buy an interest in private companies 24/7 from wherever I can find wifi. I don't need DC spending money to first take it from me, then decide how to spend it, then defend their choice, and then set up an agency to decide how best to spend it, and then actually get around to doing so space research. You advocate taking money from NASA for the benefit of suits in DC.

And you do realize that the only reason private industry isn't "there" to compete against NASA is because the govt doesn't need to worry about profit and losses in areas that crowd out competition, like buying labor, right? NASA enjoys a govt-subsidized monopoly. How do you compete against that?