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View Full Version : Do you think South Carolina should make its own gold and silver coins?




Patriotxi
02-10-2011, 03:35 PM
this is a question on my local news facebook.
If you have time please help educate my fellow Southerners!
http://www.facebook.com/wspatv/posts/192377700786948 please go there and comment!

Zippyjuan
02-10-2011, 03:56 PM
If they do, are you willing to pay higher taxes to help them pay the costs of the metals and minting and distributing them?

Patriotxi
02-10-2011, 04:18 PM
thanks Zippy

dude58677
02-10-2011, 06:40 PM
If they do, are you willing to pay higher taxes to help them pay the costs of the metals and minting and distributing them?

The taxes won't be higher because the value of a dollar would be higher because it is gold and silver. On top of this, gold and silver will not exactly come from government because gold and silver can come from anywhere unlike paper money.

Zippyjuan
02-11-2011, 03:25 PM
A state government cannot print and distribute gold and silver for free. Question was should the state make their own gold and silver coins- not should they allow people to use other gold and silver coins.

Bern
02-11-2011, 03:56 PM
Article 1 Section 10:
No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; ...

The Constitution prohibits States from coining their own money. They are required to recognize gold and silver coin as legal tender.

matt0611
02-11-2011, 03:58 PM
Article 1 Section 10:

The Constitution prohibits States from coining their own money. They are required to recognize gold and silver coin as legal tender.

Yes, the state should not coin their own money, they should allow gold and silver (say gold and silver eagles) to circulate as legal tender instead.

Bern
02-11-2011, 04:03 PM
... they should allow gold and silver (say gold and silver eagles) to circulate as legal tender instead.

... and 90% silver (pre-1965 quarters, dimes and half-dollars) (http://www.coinflation.com/silver_coin_values.html) at their bullion content melt value.

Zippyjuan
02-13-2011, 01:59 PM
So a vendor will have to know the daily value of silver (or gold) and recalculate their prices daily. Sounds like lots of work (and additional costs) for businesses. Unless they go by the face value of the coins.

mczerone
02-13-2011, 02:46 PM
So a vendor will have to know the daily value of silver (or gold) and recalculate their prices daily. Sounds like lots of work (and additional costs) for businesses. Unless they go by the face value of the coins.

And they don't have to know the relative daily value of a dollar today? Yes the spot price of the coined metals would matter, but why would they change drastically and rapidly? There is more risk to businesses using cash that can be easily created, destroyed, or have it's rate of addition/subtraction to the money market throttled by fiat.

There is more stability measuring commodity vs. commodity money than there is measuring commodity vs. fiat money.

Bern
02-13-2011, 03:04 PM
So a vendor will have to know the daily value of silver (or gold) and recalculate their prices daily. Sounds like lots of work (and additional costs) for businesses. Unless they go by the face value of the coins.

When hyperinflation set in in Argentina, shop owners didn't post prices on merchandise. The prices were changing so fast that it wasn't worth the effort. Customers had to just ask, "how much" for everything.

Dr.3D
02-13-2011, 03:10 PM
If anything, the states should only allow gold and silver to be used as payment for debts. They shouldn't allow FRNs to be used at all.

Stary Hickory
02-13-2011, 03:16 PM
A state government cannot print and distribute gold and silver for free. Question was should the state make their own gold and silver coins- not should they allow people to use other gold and silver coins.

This is so silly and you constantly push this same tired line. All that has to happen is to legalize gold and silver as a instrument of trade and voila the market takes care of the rest. You act as though only the state can originate money, when it was a free market creation ages ago.

You never answer this you just keep spouting off how it is not possible...Which of course is absurd. How many people on the forums here hold gold and silver despite the laws that make using gold and silver as a trading instrument quite difficult. If the barriers were removed people will choose a stable currency that cannot be manipulated over a fiat currency that is subject to wild debasement.

It requires no additional resources on the state of South Carolina. They simply remove the federal barriers to using gold and silver as money and that is it. The rest takes care of itself.

Zippyjuan
02-13-2011, 03:33 PM
Let's consider it from a business man's perspective. If I decide to accept your offer of gold or silver coins for my products or services, I have to first be able to identify and verify the coins and their values (we could have a limited list of accptable coins for simplification of course). The value of them is an added cost. I have to recalculate my prices into the gold or silver value and post multiple prices. This mean more work and possibly more equipment and or software to buy to do all this. Once I have transactions, for tax purposes, I have to again convert my gold and silver sales back into dollars. What do I do with the silver and gold at the end of the day? Use it for change? Let's see. That shirt was $20 and your coin was worth $37.50. What was this other silver coin worth? Was this a $8 silver coin or was that an $18 one? Sell it to somebody for dollars (again, more costs)? Are you going to be able to increase my sales and profits enough to make up for the additional costs? What is my incentive to go along with it?

Business is about profit. Make it worth my while. Show how it benefits me. It is voluntary so I am not forced to accept it.

Bern
02-14-2011, 08:02 AM
zj - what makes it worth the shop owner's time is the fact that he's getting paid with a money that holds its value. Consider the tale of two shops in a hyperinflationary period. Shop A only accepts FRNs. Shop B accepts either FRNs or silver bullion (junk/90% silver, silver Eagles, generic 1oz silver rounds).

Shop A cannot post prices on their merchandise. If they did, they would have to change the prices on all items in their inventory at least once a day, maybe more. Customers have to inquire for the price at the point of sale. Clerks need to look up and adjust prices based upon the FX value of the dollar at the point in time the sale takes place (or the owner sets a value for a period of time which the clerk inserts into a formula to calculate the price). Shop A gets paid in FRNs which immediately lose value the moment the sale is completed.

Shop B cannot post prices on their merchandise. If they did, they would have to change the prices on all items in their inventory at least once a day, maybe more. Customers have to inquire for the price at the point of sale. Clerks need to look up and adjust prices based upon the FX value of the dollar and/or the value of silver at the point in time the sale takes place (or the owner sets the values for a period of time which the clerk inserts into a formula to calculate the price). Shop B gets paid in silver which maintains it's value relative to the merchandise in stock (relative to the purchasing value of the falling FRN).

In this scenario, shop B is paying themselves for the effort in transacting in silver by the cost of the value differential as the dollar drops. In a hyperinflationary period, it's well worth the shop owner's effort.

XNavyNuke
02-14-2011, 09:32 AM
So a vendor will have to know the daily value of silver (or gold) and recalculate their prices daily. Sounds like lots of work (and additional costs) for businesses. Unless they go by the face value of the coins.

For those vendors using pen and paper accounting, I can see where this might be difficult. For other, I think you could bet someone would write an app if there was a need.

XNN