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View Full Version : A Lesson about "Gun Control" from Egypt




ibaghdadi
01-31-2011, 03:37 AM
By their 6th day the demonstrations have reached a stalemate, as the masses cannot go forward and Mubarak won't step down, and the army won't intervene this way or that.

Just imagine if these masses had guns? It would have been over in a couple hours.

fj45lvr
01-31-2011, 05:35 AM
hard to say what would happen other than more bloodshed, the "fate" rests on the soldiers that would be killing for Mubarak or not... You'd like to think that the soldiers would have enough conscience to not kill people if they understood where they are coming from. Now, if those soldiers think that they are targets to be shot at they may act totally and completely different forcing them to make a decision to abandon their commanders or fire on the people.

LedHed
01-31-2011, 07:11 AM
Guns in the hands of citizens would not help this situation at all.

teacherone
01-31-2011, 07:18 AM
Guns in the hands of citizens would not help this situation at all.

tell that to the hundred dead and two thousand wounded.

hazek
01-31-2011, 07:52 AM
Do not reply to LedHed because he is a troll and has made it very clear in one of his posts that the only reason he posts here is to stir things up and get a reaction from us for his own amusement. Do not fuel it!


As for the topic, I'm 100% sure if every person on the planet was armed, we wouldn't have a single oppressive tyrannical government. As for this particular case, people can protests as much as they want but without being able to actually harm the government or being able to actually fight back nothing will change. The army will guard the government and the government will stay "in power" and those who will try to forcefully resists will get killed and eventually people will have to comply.

They are already trying to get rid of any live coverage when they arrested Al Jazeeras reporters and seized their equipment. I think their coverage has played a major major role in the army not escalating and as soon as they take care of free press, it's game over for the protesters.

Remember: The first casualty of War is the Truth.

pcosmar
01-31-2011, 08:04 AM
There are repeated messages from the area that police had been pulled from the streets (and returned as thugs out of uniform).
The people self organized into neighborhood watches, Committees or militia. They have protected themselves, directed traffic and cleaned the streets.

If people realize that they really don't need police, that they can be responsible for themselves, then perhaps the "concept' of police will be history.
It is one of the bright spots I see out of all of this.

LedHed
01-31-2011, 08:32 AM
There would be many more innocent dead and wounded had guns been more involved in this revolution, so the OP is correct. It WOULD have been over in a few hours, but probably not in the way the OP thinks.

pcosmar
01-31-2011, 08:38 AM
There would be many more innocent dead and wounded had guns been more involved in this revolution.

Perhaps, But it is guaranteed that there would be many guilty dead as well.
Something currently lacking.

I think the people are handling this well, They have remained peaceful and have shown the brutality of the state.

Koz
01-31-2011, 08:43 AM
Guns in the hands of citizens would not help this situation at all.

Pretty sure I would want to be well armed to protect my family and home in this mess.

Nate-ForLiberty
01-31-2011, 09:11 AM
There are repeated messages from the area that police had been pulled from the streets (and returned as thugs out of uniform).
The people self organized into neighborhood watches, Committees or militia. They have protected themselves, directed traffic and cleaned the streets.

If people realize that they really don't need police, that they can be responsible for themselves, then perhaps the "concept' of police will be history.
It is one of the bright spots I see out of all of this.

The police are to be redeployed today. Protesters are calling for a million man march.

pcosmar
01-31-2011, 09:26 AM
The police are to be redeployed today. Protesters are calling for a million man march.

They are neither respected nor welcomed.
And some are realizing they are not needed.

pcosmar
01-31-2011, 09:27 AM
Oops,
Duplicate
:o

LedHed
01-31-2011, 09:36 AM
Perhaps, But it is guaranteed that there would be many guilty dead as well.
Something currently lacking.

I think the people are handling this well, They have remained peaceful and have shown the brutality of the state.

"Kill em all, and let God sort em out" would not contribute to a successful promotion of democracy.

I would agree with your last statement. They are also showing a willingness to accept and trust the military which is not present for the national police, who used tear gas and water cannons in the first few days.

ibaghdadi
01-31-2011, 11:55 AM
The police are to be redeployed today.

Citizens setup neighborhood watches and militias to stop the looting, they setup barricades and armed themselves with whatever they could find. Today when the police tried to redeploy, in many neighborhoods they were not allowed back in.

In one incident a security officer started abusing people and ordering them "back home". Before Jan 25th this would have been more than normal and everyone would have complied.

Today, however, citizens rushed him, took away his weapon, stripped him down to his underwear and left him in the street.

Liberty is infectious, liberty is popular, liberty sells. And there's no going back.

VBRonPaulFan
01-31-2011, 12:27 PM
"Kill em all, and let God sort em out" would not contribute to a successful promotion of democracy.

I would agree with your last statement. They are also showing a willingness to accept and trust the military which is not present for the national police, who used tear gas and water cannons in the first few days.

You know what else doesn't contribute to a successful promotion of democracy? Letting a tyrant get away with running your life and country into the ground.

fisharmor
01-31-2011, 12:45 PM
We're only talking about the former greatest kingdom in the world, and probably the biggest economic powerhouse in the Mediterranean up through the middle ages, and I don't know any reason why it can't be so again...
... If the people there figure out the rest of the puzzle of how to get rid of bad government (which includes individual gun ownership), then it's probably going to be a great place to live.

ibaghdadi
01-31-2011, 12:52 PM
We're only talking about the former greatest kingdom in the world, and probably the biggest economic powerhouse in the Mediterranean up through the middle ages, and I don't know any reason why it can't be so again...
... If the people there figure out the rest of the puzzle of how to get rid of bad government (which includes individual gun ownership), then it's probably going to be a great place to live.

You've inspired me to mention that...

Egypt was the food basket of the Roman Empire for centuries, today it's totally dependent on foreign aid and can't even feed itself
98% of Egypt's population live on 2% of its land area (a narrow strip on either side of the Nile)
Even with all the shit it's under, Egypt is still the second largest Arab economy (after Saudi Arabia)

oyarde
01-31-2011, 12:56 PM
Pretty sure I would want to be well armed to protect my family and home in this mess.

Yes.

Pericles
01-31-2011, 01:07 PM
When only one side in a conflict has all of the guns, there are always fewer killed and wounded than if both sides were armed.

So what was the point of that?

devil21
01-31-2011, 04:24 PM
I was commenting yesterday to a friend that this sort of thing is why the 2nd Amendment was created. Notice it's ONLY protestors ending up dead? I saw graphic pictures of one protestor that was shot point blank in the head. The score would be much different and this whole thing would have already been over if the protestors were armed as well. It's easy to shoot at people armed only with rocks. Much different story when they have guns too!

On the other hand, I also suspect this is why the military is playing mostly hands-off in this whole thing. If the protestors were armed then the body counts on both sides would be much higher but likely this whole thing would have already ended with Mubarak's palace being violently overtaken and he and his cabinet executed. Gruesome? Sure. But mission accomplished and Ive seen MANY videos of protestors saying they are willing to die to end his reign.

low preference guy
01-31-2011, 04:28 PM
Guns in the hands of citizens would not help this situation at all.

yes, all those criminals wouldn't have been able to rape their victims. that would've been a lot worse!

fj45lvr
01-31-2011, 06:48 PM
when the second amendment was formulated is was soooo much easier to have parity with the gov. arms

Dr.3D
01-31-2011, 06:57 PM
when the second amendment was formulated is was soooo much easier to have parity with the gov. arms

Without government infringement on the second amendment, it would still be that way.

oyarde
01-31-2011, 07:12 PM
Without government infringement on the second amendment, it would still be that way.

Yes , and that would be a good thing .

QueenB4Liberty
01-31-2011, 07:19 PM
Without government infringement on the second amendment, it would still be that way.

This.

Pericles
01-31-2011, 11:44 PM
Without government infringement on the second amendment, it would still be that way.
Which is the way it was intended.