Jeff Flake gets 100% RLC score despite voting 2 extend Patriot Act Paul & Rohrabacher @ 98

[cindy25]

Liberty Index of Congress Scores Released: Congratulations, Jeff Flake!

Since 1992, the Republican Liberty Caucus has tabulated scores from Members of Congress (both the House and Senate) from both parties. This year, we are pleased to announce that Congressman Jeff Flake scored a perfect 100-100 on both the social and economic scores in 2009. This is the first time that any member of Congress has achieved a perfect score.

Congressmen Ron Paul of Texas and Dana Rohrabacher of California each scored 98 -- both exceptional scores as well. In the upper chamber, Senator Ensign (NV) and Senator DeMint (SC) shared the top spot with a combined score of 93.

The Liberty Index is compiled from forty roll call votes -- twenty each in the areas of economic liberties and personal liberties for each chamber of Congress.

[wormyguy]

Reason why Paul and Rohrabacher didn't get perfect 100s was because of earmarks.

[Kregisen]

Fuck yeah! Flake is my congressman!! Woooo

[Sola_Fide]

Wow.

I have to look into Flake more...

[MaxPower]

If only Flake weren't an imperialist.

As for the earmarks, they're still a red-herring, and, taken in context, do not actually tarnish Dr. Paul's status as a champion of liberty.

[BamaAla]

Wow.

I have to look into Flake more...

First I've heard of him.

Great bod though...no-****.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/gallery/2009/10/09/GA2009100903130.html?sid=ST2009101101762

[teacherone]

First I've heard of him.

Great bod though...no-****.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/gallery/2009/10/09/GA2009100903130.html?sid=ST2009101101762

lol just wait till he starts talking to volleyballs.


http://reason.com/assets/mc/kmw/2009_10/flake.png

http://purposebeyondpain.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/castaway.gif

[specsaregood]

Wow.
I have to look into Flake more...

You'll be disappointed when you get to his votes before this last session of congress.

[Slutter McGee]

You'll be disappointed when you get to his votes before this last session of congress.

How so? He has been one of the most consistent and honest members of congress for years.

Slutter McGee

[Keith and stuff]

First I've heard of him.

Great bod though...no-****.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/gallery/2009/10/09/GA2009100903130.html?sid=ST2009101101762

For years people have called him a libertarian (or as close as we have in Congress). Paul and Flake have done well on the survey for years.

[klamath]

I wish Jeff Flake would have run against McCain. He could have beaten mcCain in the primaries except for his less than militant stand on Illegal immegration.

[specsaregood]

How so? He has been one of the most consistent and honest members of congress for years.

Slutter McGee

How are his votes on the never-ending wars and things such as the patriot act, fisa, etc?
For somebody like that to get 100% on a Liberty Caucus rating on social and economic issues is a joke.

[wormyguy]

How are his votes on the never-ending wars and things such as the patriot act, fisa, etc?
For somebody like that to get 100% on a Liberty Caucus rating on social and economic issues is a joke.

He's changed his mind on PATRIOT Act and the wars.

[specsaregood]

He's changed his mind on PATRIOT Act and the wars.

Let me guess, after the democrats came into power? Lame.



NO on requiring FISA warrants for wiretaps in US, but not abroad
YES on making the PATRIOT Act permanent
YES on continuing intelligence gathering without civil oversight
YES on removing need for FISA warrant for wiretapping abroad
YES on retroactive immunity for telecoms' warrantless surveillance
YES on authorizing military force in Iraq
YES on declaring Iraq part of War on Terror with no exit date
NO on redeploying US troops out of Iraq starting in 90 days


Way to change your mind after voting to make the iraq war never-ending and the patriot act permanent. Real stand-up guy he is. /s

[klamath]

How are his votes on the never-ending wars and things such as the patriot act, fisa, etc?
For somebody like that to get 100% on a Liberty Caucus rating on social and economic issues is a joke.
The RLC rates on the wars and civil liberties as well. They are against both and rate congressmen and senators by that. Jeff Flake has been the 2nd or 3rd highest rated congressman behind RP for years.

[Slutter McGee]

Let me guess, after the democrats came into power? Lame.



Way to change your mind after voting to make the iraq war never-ending and the patriot act permanent. Real stand-up guy he is. /s

I didn't say he was as good a liberty candidate as Ron Paul. I said he is consistent. And he also honest. And who cares when he changed his view on the Patriot Act? It is still popular with Republicans and changing his view does not help him politically.

As far as those Yes votes, I could find a hundred votes where he was one of only a few voting NO with Ron Paul.

Flake is one of the few people in Congress we shouldn't be going after or attacking.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

[specsaregood]

The RLC rates on the wars and civil liberties as well. They are against both and rate congressmen and senators by that. Jeff Flake has been the 2nd or 3rd highest rated congressman behind RP for years.

I stand by my statement that a guy that voted to make the Iraq war neverending and the patriot permanent to be rated 100% by the RLC....makes such a rating a joke.
It also, shows such a sad state of affairs, that those issues are completely decided now.

[specsaregood]

I didn't say he was as good a liberty candidate as Ron Paul.
I never claimed you did. You replied to me, asking as to why somebody might be disappointed. I gave some reasons why.

[klamath]

I stand by my statement that a guy that voted to make the Iraq war neverending and the patriot permanent to be rated 100% by the RLC....makes such a rating a joke.
It also, shows such a sad state of affairs, that those issues are completely decided now.
No what you are missing is the RLC rating is done every 6 months and this 100% rating for Jeff is only for the last 6 months. Over the last 10 years RP average with the RLC is quite a bit higher than Jeff Flake. RP with very few exceptions has scored 100% or the years while jeff Flake has dropped at times to 80% but which is higher than almost all other members of congress.

[specsaregood]

No what you are missing is the RLC rating is done every 6 months and this 100% rating for Jeff is only for the last 6 months. Over the last 10 years RP average with the RLC is quite a bit higher than Jeff Flake. RP with very few exceptions has scored 100% or the years while jeff Flake has dropped at times to 80% but which is higher than almost all other members of congress.

I'm not missing that fact. It just shows that he is good while in the minority party. But more than willing to wield the power of the state against its own citizens when he is a member of the party in power.

[Fredom101]

Flake voted for the war multiple times. He's for liberty? Hardly.

[klamath]

I'm not missing that fact. It just shows that he is good while in the minority party. But more than willing to wield the power of the state against its own citizens when he is a member of the party in power.
Yes but one of the least. People like McCain have come up 40 and 50% since the democrats came into power. Jeff Flake has come up like 15%. John Duncan is 2nd to RP in voting consistent.

[specsaregood]

Yes but one of the least. People like McCain have come up 40 and 50% since the democrats came into power. Jeff Flake has come up like 15%. John Duncan is 2nd to RP in voting consistent.

Fair enough.
This side discussion started because of the following exchange:



Wow.
I have to look into Flake more...
You'll be disappointed when you get to his votes before this last session of congress.

You disagree with that? That somebody excited by this news of the 100% rating, that then decides to look into his voting record is likely to be disappointed by his previous votes?

I'll believe he has changed his opinion and be impressed, if he manages to get a 100% rating now that the Republicans are back in power. Want to place a wager on whether that happens?

[klamath]

Fair enough.
This side discussion started because of the following exchange:


You disagree with that? That somebody excited by this news of the 100% rating, that then decides to look into his voting record is likely to be disappointed by his previous votes?

I'll believe he has changed his opinion and be impressed, if he manages to get a 100% rating now that the Republicans are back in power. Want to place a wager on whether that happens?
Yes you will be disapointed if this is the first you heard of Jeff Flake. I will stay impressed with Flake if he stays above 80%. There is only one RP. I haven't seen another RP in congress or anybody that matches him for integrity and views in this entire liberty movement.

[compromise]

I'm not missing that fact. It just shows that he is good while in the minority party. But more than willing to wield the power of the state against its own citizens when he is a member of the party in power.

He voted against establishing the Department of Homeland Security, got sunset provisions into the Patriot Act and attempted to amend the Patriot Act during the Bush-era. Flake was better than DeMint during the Bush years.

[sailingaway]

They don't care about civil liberties which is one reason I don't care much for RLC except for chapters that happen to BE our own folks, which then do care about civil liberties. For example, Nalle in Texas branch of RLC endorsed JOHNSON instead of Ron, and other chapters didn't endorse Ron either. Their index IGNORES votes on NDAA and the Patriot Act etc.

[sailingaway]

He voted against establishing the Department of Homeland Security, got sunset provisions into the Patriot Act and attempted to amend the Patriot Act during the Bush-era. Flake was better than DeMint during the Bush years.

But De Mint as senator voted AGAINST the patriot act and NDAA once he actually became convinced they were bad. My feelings on De Mint is he has principles and they aren't exactly the same as mine, but when he changes his mind, he means it. Flake by his earlier 'Bush era' votes clearly knew better yet when he wanted establishment support to run for Senate voted to extend the Patriot Act and on other key establishment ranked votes RLC's ranking is fine with. To me, that character aspect makes him less trustworthy than DeMint. At least with De Mint you know what you can count on and what you can't.

Also, remember that Ron made these issues POPULAR, and standing for them when the grass roots is crying for people to champion them doesn't show the same character as standing by them when they are unpopular.

[paulbot24]

YES on continuing intelligence gathering without civil oversight
YES on removing need for FISA warrant for wiretapping abroad
YES on retroactive immunity for telecoms' warrantless surveillance

- This was from a look at his voting record from specsaregood. After looking at his resume with the NSA and his extensive background in Information Technology, I wish he would have voted these down since he has the expertise to explain how far-reaching and intrusive on civil liberties these could potentially be. Let's keep our eyes on him. I will be since he is one of my Senators, the other being the famous McCain of course.

[compromise]

But De Mint as senator voted AGAINST the patriot act and NDAA once he actually became convinced they were bad. My feelings on De Mint is he has principles and they aren't exactly the same as mine, but when he changes his mind, he means it. Flake by his earlier 'Bush era' votes clearly knew better yet when he wanted establishment support to run for Senate voted to extend the Patriot Act and on other key establishment ranked votes RLC's ranking is fine with. To me, that character aspect makes him less trustworthy than DeMint. At least with De Mint you know what you can count on and what you can't.

Also, remember that Ron made these issues POPULAR, and standing for them when the grass roots is crying for people to champion them doesn't show the same character as standing by them when they are unpopular.

I agree Flake has been a disappointment on civil liberties in recent years (although he did vote No on the first NDAA 2012 votes). However, Flake consistently voted against military spending appropriations bills, even in 2011/2012, when he was running his Senate campaign.

Kucinich resolution on Libya:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2011/h412 (2011)
Flake - YES (87 Repub yes votes)

Recent military spending appropriations (war funding) legislation:

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2012/h579 (2012)
Flake - NO (70 Repub no votes)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2012/h370 (2012)
Flake - NO (only 16 Repub no votes)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2011/h418 (2011)
Flake - NO (only 5 Repub no votes - the others were Jimmy Duncan, Amash, Campbell and Ron Paul)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2012/h498 (2012)
Flake - NO (only 11 Repub no votes)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2011/h147 (2011)
Flake - NO (only 3 Repub no votes - the others were Walter Jones and Campbell, even Amash caved on this one)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/111-2009/h675 (2009)
Flake - NO (only 8 Repub no votes)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2011/h409 (2011)
Flake - NO (only 20 Repub no votes)

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/111-2010/h474 (2010)
Flake - NO (only 12 Repub no votes)

[jmdrake]

They don't care about civil liberties which is one reason I don't care much for RLC except for chapters that happen to BE our own folks, which then do care about civil liberties. For example, Nalle in Texas branch of RLC endorsed JOHNSON instead of Ron, and other chapters didn't endorse Ron either. Their index IGNORES votes on NDAA and the Patriot Act etc.

How can you call yourself a "liberty caucus" and ignore civil liberties? :confused: :mad: They should just call themselves the "club for growth caucus" and be done with it.

[compromise]

They don't care about civil liberties which is one reason I don't care much for RLC except for chapters that happen to BE our own folks, which then do care about civil liberties. For example, Nalle in Texas branch of RLC endorsed JOHNSON instead of Ron, and other chapters didn't endorse Ron either. Their index IGNORES votes on NDAA and the Patriot Act etc.

The federal RLC endorsed Ron Paul.

http://www.rlc.org/republican-liberty-caucus-endorses-ron-paul-for-president/

[unknown]

Reason why Paul and Rohrabacher didn't get perfect 100s was because of earmarks.

What about the extension of the Patriot Act.

He should be a zero for that alone.

[ProvincialPeasant]

So many uninformed idiots on him, it's disgusting. That many are only hearing of Jeff Flake NOW should disprove to everyone that politicians adopt 'liberty' positions and policies to satisfy libertarians. Libertarians are the most undependable, unsupportive base there is, unless the politician's name is Paul. Jeff Flake has taken libertarian positions across the board which have harmed him for years because he believes them, not because of RPF, DailyPaul, LR, etc.

[sailingaway]

The federal RLC endorsed Ron Paul.

http://www.rlc.org/republican-liberty-caucus-endorses-ron-paul-for-president/

after Johnson dropped out I believe. However, the chapters are very hit and miss and the lack of civil liberties in their ranking makes it absolutely useless for me personally.

[WarAnonymous]

I know I have said this on here before but the RLC also endoresed Ohio's Jim Jordan the greatest championship of Liberty since Adolf Hitler.

Pat Act - Yes
Fisa - Yes
NDAA - Yes
CISPA - Yes

Just to name a few... So I am not even sure anymore that they champion liberty so much as other things... They didn't endorse him this election, but they sent out an email after the election saying it was a victory for Liberty that he won.