View Full Version : desperate S Korea expanding length, brutality, age of draft; even Kor-Ams now targeted
cindy25
12-31-2010, 02:46 AM
http://m.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2010/12/116_78908.html
MN Patriot
12-31-2010, 06:41 AM
Gearing up for war against North Korea.
Regarding Korean unification, that would be the biggest mistake South Korea could make. Imagine all those rabid brainwashed Marxists engaging in South Korea's society? Better to keep the wall up and refuse to ever unify with North Korea, or let China have them.
Pericles
12-31-2010, 11:22 AM
Different culture. In matters of "face", what we as westerners think of as rational behavior doesn't figure into the equation.
SamuraisWisdom
12-31-2010, 11:45 AM
Gearing up for war against North Korea.
Regarding Korean unification, that would be the biggest mistake South Korea could make. Imagine all those rabid brainwashed Marxists engaging in South Korea's society? Better to keep the wall up and refuse to ever unify with North Korea, or let China have them.
North Korea isn't a Marxist state, and even if they were being a Marxist isn't a bad thing. They are a statist/fascist state with a dictator. But yes, the North Korean people are brainwashed. According to media reports with information from defectors, the North Korean people are brainwashed to hate the South and the US and also to adore Kim Jong Il. How much of that is out of fear and how much is actually legit behavior nobody really knows.
But I will say that if any of us were to support a war effort it should be against North Korea. The North Korean people have been living under brutal dictators for decades and have no chance at a rebellion. They're starving, have almost no contact with the outside world, and live in shacks for the most part. If you are any type of supporter of freedom and liberty you should be able to see that freeing those people is a noble cause.
North Korea isn't a Marxist state, and even if they were being a Marxist isn't a bad thing. They are a statist/fascist state with a dictator. But yes, the North Korean people are brainwashed. According to media reports with information from defectors, the North Korean people are brainwashed to hate the South and the US and also to adore Kim Jong Il. How much of that is out of fear and how much is actually legit behavior nobody really knows.
But I will say that if any of us were to support a war effort it should be against North Korea. The North Korean people have been living under brutal dictators for decades and have no chance at a rebellion. They're starving, have almost no contact with the outside world, and live in shacks for the most part. If you are any type of supporter of freedom and liberty you should be able to see that freeing those people is a noble cause.
Just like Americans are being brain wash to believe that terrorists hate us for are freedoms.
SamuraisWisdom
12-31-2010, 12:03 PM
Just like Americans are being brain wash to believe that terrorists hate use for are freedoms.
This discussion belongs in another thread
libertarian4321
12-31-2010, 12:07 PM
S. Korea has had mandatory service for decades. They even took men with minor disabilities (e.g. club foot) that would have kept any American out of a draft here.
This new law will affect about TEN multiracial soldiers per year.
Even the extension of the age limit will draw in an insignificant number of new people, since almost all now serve at age 19.
I doubt they will get more than a couple of hundred (probably less) new soldiers per year from this.
nandnor
12-31-2010, 01:17 PM
nvm
SamuraisWisdom
12-31-2010, 01:23 PM
Lol? Every state ON EARTH is marxist, or at least heavily influenced by marxist ideas and marxist justification for its actions.
You're kidding right? Seriously? Karl Marx wrote his manifestos in the 1800s, after most of the countries around today already existed, including the United States. Would you try and tell me that the British monarchy of the middle ages which sought to control most aspects of British life took influence from Marxist ideology? Do you even know what Marxism is?
kah13176
12-31-2010, 01:47 PM
You're kidding right? Seriously? Karl Marx wrote his manifestos in the 1800s, after most of the countries around today already existed, including the United States. Would you try and tell me that the British monarchy of the middle ages which sought to control most aspects of British life took influence from Marxist ideology? Do you even know what Marxism is?
The 10 points of Marxism:
-Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.
-A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
-Abolition of all rights of inheritance.
-Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
-Centralization of credit in the banks of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.
-Centralization of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the state.
-Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the state; the bringing into cultivation of waste lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
-Equal obligation of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
-Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.
-Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labor in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, etc.
Six of those are more or less present in the United States. Around the world, most countries have at least a few. I think he was making the point that there is very little favor left for pure free markets.
SamuraisWisdom
12-31-2010, 02:00 PM
The 10 points of Marxism:
-Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.
-A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
-Abolition of all rights of inheritance.
-Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
-Centralization of credit in the banks of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.
-Centralization of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the state.
-Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the state; the bringing into cultivation of waste lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
-Equal obligation of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
-Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.
-Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labor in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production, etc.
Six of those are more or less present in the United States. Around the world, most countries have at least a few. I think he was making the point that there is very little favor left for pure free markets.
No he was arguing that governments are leaning toward Marxist ideology as an influence, and my point is that states had already headed down that general path before Marx wrote anything.
And also, you missed a very important part of Marxism in that list, though it was hinted at by...
gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.
In the ideal form of Marxism, the government will eventually be made irrelevant and will dissolve completely. In other words, anarchy. Which is ironic because that's what many people here think of the ideal society.
MN Patriot
12-31-2010, 02:20 PM
North Korea isn't a Marxist state, and even if they were being a Marxist isn't a bad thing. They are a statist/fascist state with a dictator. But yes, the North Korean people are brainwashed. According to media reports with information from defectors, the North Korean people are brainwashed to hate the South and the US and also to adore Kim Jong Il. How much of that is out of fear and how much is actually legit behavior nobody really knows.
But I will say that if any of us were to support a war effort it should be against North Korea. The North Korean people have been living under brutal dictators for decades and have no chance at a rebellion. They're starving, have almost no contact with the outside world, and live in shacks for the most part. If you are any type of supporter of freedom and liberty you should be able to see that freeing those people is a noble cause.
Being a Marxist isn't a bad thing? OK, then... :rolleyes:
I suppose if a person wanted to voluntarily practice Marxism with fellow Marxists, go for it, but leave me out. Problem is, Marxism is a proven failure and depends on stealing wealth from free societies.
I hate to get into an argument about facts with someone who is obviously wrong, but North Korea's political ideology IS based on Marxism. A twisted despotic form of Marxism, like it has been commonly practiced, but Marxism none-the-less.
When a culture has no value or regard for freedom, like the North Korean culture has been for the last 60 years, then the people who live in that culture will not want freedom, at least in the sense that we consider freedom.
North Koreans have been transformed into human cripples, and would be a burden to any society that accepts them. I'm sure American Democrats would gladly accept them as political refugees, since every one of them would vote for the Democrats.
I would support freeing North Koreans, as long as China takes them. China has been supporting North Korea since the Korean War, so let them have them.
Inflation
01-01-2011, 01:41 PM
Regarding Korean unification, that would be the biggest mistake South Korea could make. Imagine all those rabid brainwashed Marxists engaging in South Korea's society? Better to keep the wall up and refuse to ever unify with North Korea, or let China have them.
Brainwashed, or, disillusioned?
People said the same thing about East Germans, prior to reunification. Happily, those who suffered under Marxism were the most grateful for, and productive in, a free country. They appreciate Western liberty more than the fat, lazy, West German degenerates who are happy to slouch towards The Third Path (aka The Turd Way).
cindy25
01-01-2011, 06:46 PM
until now S Korea has been phasing out the draft, just as Taiwan has. it is hugely unpopular, a burden for families who have to supplement the "pay" of the draftees, disruptive to careers, and creating a sexual imbalance ( girls continue in college/jobs, while boys waste 2 years)
the increase in the brutal basic training will only increase this burden
SamuraisWisdom
01-01-2011, 11:51 PM
Being a Marxist isn't a bad thing? OK, then... :rolleyes:
I suppose if a person wanted to voluntarily practice Marxism with fellow Marxists, go for it, but leave me out. Problem is, Marxism is a proven failure and depends on stealing wealth from free societies.
I hate to get into an argument about facts with someone who is obviously wrong, but North Korea's political ideology IS based on Marxism. A twisted despotic form of Marxism, like it has been commonly practiced, but Marxism none-the-less.
When a culture has no value or regard for freedom, like the North Korean culture has been for the last 60 years, then the people who live in that culture will not want freedom, at least in the sense that we consider freedom.
North Koreans have been transformed into human cripples, and would be a burden to any society that accepts them. I'm sure American Democrats would gladly accept them as political refugees, since every one of them would vote for the Democrats.
I would support freeing North Koreans, as long as China takes them. China has been supporting North Korea since the Korean War, so let them have them.
Calling North Korea a Marxist state is the same as calling the United States a Free Market State. I would argue like another before me that those living under a despot would be more inclined to want freedom then those who don't. How do you think we came to be as a country in the first place? It certainly wasn't because the King of England was a kind-hearted philanthropist acting on behalf of everyone's needs.
The bold part of your quote is just an awful statement. They are people just like you and me who deserve a chance at a real life. That's why this country exists. People have come from all over the world to try and do better for themselves, why should the North Koreans be any different? Because they'd vote Democrat? Wow and you wonder why some people view libertarians as heartless.
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