Obama quietly erasing borders

[lynnf]

yep, just as it was pointed out in another thread...


http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=240045

...

The two documents strongly suggest the Obama administration is pursuing a stealth bureaucratic methodology to establish a common North American border around the continent, encompassing the U.S., Canada and Mexico, while simultaneously moving to erase the borders between the U.S. and Mexico as well as between the U.S. and Canada.

...

[JustinTime]

A lot of people here will be pleased, but Im not. Globalism isnt about limiting government at all, just getting a bigger, farther removed, less responsible one.

[squarepusher]

who cares about imaginary lines on a map?

[JustinTime]

who cares about imaginary lines on a map?

Its not about imaginary lines, its about expanding government to ever bigger sizes. The current US is a nightmare already, with the 'Federal' Government effectively controlling everything (its not really Federal if it does).

Id rather have more power in the hands of my city commissioners, who I can actually go visit and talk things over with, than some bureaucrats I can never hope to be anything other than a number to.

Cant you see this will not make any of us more free, but less free?

[TruckinMike]

...Cant you see this will not make any of us more free, but less free?

This is where ideology meets fantasy. What these these principled libertarians want, is peaceful anarchy (Just so happens, so do I). But until the entire world thinks like them, with the same morals as them, they had better not move to that utopian island they dream about. Why?... because the folks that don't think like them - will surround them, catch them, skin them. and eat them alive.

The open border, Principled Libertarian types are Ideologues.


ideo·logue
noun \ˈī-dē-ə-ˌlȯg, -ˌläg\
Definition of IDEOLOGUE
1
: an impractical idealist :theorist
2
: an often blindly partisan advocate or adherent of a particular ideology


FACT:
We do not live in a Republic, we live in a democracy with NO rule of law, a mobacracy.
immigration legal/illegal equals millions more people lining up to join the mob.
The mob -- People who want to rob you of everything via the government as a result of their ignorance, greed, lack of morals, and/or conditioning.


Its not hard to understand, but like the definition states they are "impractical idealists".

The sad thing is we all have to suffer the consequences of their mistakes. I sometimes wonder why they are Ron Paul supporters. When they are truly supporting The Rockefeller foundation, the Carnagie Endowment, the Ford Foundation, the CFR, George Soros, George Bush, and other Global-socialists.

signed,

Bah Hum Bug! :mad:

[RonPaulFanInGA]

http://fastactionnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/erasing_borders.jpg

[oyarde]

Funny picture .

[ClayTrainor]

If this is true, the borders aren't disappearing, they are expanding. This would only mean that they are trying to merge the farms into one bigger farm.

What are state and national borders? who owns them? How were they established? Who's deciding to change them? who decides what everybody within them does? Borders are a purely born and maintained through coercive state power, because they are based on the fallacious idea "public ownership".

You do not live in a country, you live on a human farm. You are tax livestock.

[RonPaulFanInGA]

What are state and national borders?

What separates independent, sovereign countries. The end of the jurisdiction of a country.


How were they established? Who's deciding to change them?

Wars, treaties, etc. Example: the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo was Mexico's formal recognition of Texas as part of the United States.

[ClayTrainor]

What separates independent, sovereign countries. The end of the jurisdiction of a country.

Kind of like the imaginary line that separates the jurisdiction for the guys who run New York and New Jersey in the Sopranos.



Wars, treaties, etc. Example: the treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo was Mexico's formal recognition of Texas as part of the United States.

Who owns them?

[TruckinMike]

Ok, I see its time for a re-cap...


You do not live in a country, you live on a human farm. You are tax livestock.

We know where we live. And yes, we know that we are tax livestock. The problem is that you believe that you live on cloud 9 of the of planet Libertopia. YOU DO NOT LIVE THERE. You are cattle, just like the rest of us. Thus, it is paramount that you understand this - otherwise the farm revolt can never take place. We need your help. The sheep are the biggest problem. Our issue: As soon as we start convincing the sheep about the freedom revolt -- they hear you mooing that nonsense about cloud nine and planet Libertopia, at which point, they run like mad back to the arms of the farmer. So what do you do in response? You open the neighbors gate and let a bunch of goats in the pasture! Then those hungry goats eat our grass down to the ground. We tried getting the goats to join us, but they just wanted to eat our grass. As time progresses, the grass fails, and at which point the farmer has no choice but catch some of us and sell us to the butcher. Its for the common good you know.

Arghhh!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5042/5269274555_c599d4a2e5_b.jpg



ideo·logue
noun \ˈī-dē-ə-ˌlȯg, -ˌläg\
Definition of IDEOLOGUE
1
: an impractical idealist :theorist
2
: an often blindly partisan advocate or adherent of a particular ideology


TMike:D

[oyarde]

If this is true, the borders aren't disappearing, they are expanding. This would only mean that they are trying to merge the farms into one bigger farm.

What are state and national borders? who owns them? How were they established? Who's deciding to change them? who decides what everybody within them does? Borders are a purely born and maintained through coercive state power, because they are based on the fallacious idea "public ownership".

You do not live in a country, you live on a human farm. You are tax livestock.

Tax livestock , very observant ..

[ClayTrainor]

Ok, I see its time for a re-cap...


Oh boy! :D



We know where we live. And yes, we know that we are tax livestock. The problem is that you believe that you live on cloud 9 of the of planet Libertopia.

Ad-hominem. Actually, I fully recognize that we both live in the same world.



YOU DO NOT LIVE THERE. You are cattle, just like the rest of us.

Yea, I'm tax livestock, I recognize it. You obviously didn't grasp my point, if you think we disagree here.



Our issue: As soon as we start convincing the sheep about the freedom revolt -- they hear you mooing that nonsense about cloud nine and planet Libertopia, at which point, they run like mad back to the arms of the farmer.

Right... by this logic Ron Paul should stop calling to "End the Fed", and "abolish the income tax" because it's just libertopia nonsense that'll send the sheep back to the farmer.

Secondly, I speak nothing of a "libertopia", or "cloud nine", or any sort of utopian nonsense. These are just words you're using to try and insult me. I simply don't justify the initiation of coercion, as a rational solution to anything, especially complex problems involving millions of people. Principles matter.



So what do you do in response? You open the neighbors gate and let a bunch of goats in the pasture! Then those hungry goats eat our grass down to the ground.

Utter Nonsense, and a false accusation. I completely support private property rights. People should have the right to remove whoever they want from their private property, and set up whatever kind of private property protections they feel is necessary. I also don't believe you, or anyone else should have the right to tell me who I can and can't have on my private property.

Socialized property rights, like state borders are put in place to tax and regulate the populations within. The state isn't here to protect you. Never was, never is, and never will be. They take your "grass", and redistribute it to themselves and others.



We tried getting the goats to join us, but they just wanted to eat our grass. As time progresses, the grass fails, and at which point the farmer has no choice but catch some of us and sell us to the butcher. Its for the common good you know.

Arghhh!

The goats are eating the grass that the farmers stole from you in the first place. Blame the thief.


ideo·logue
noun \ˈī-dē-ə-ˌlȯg, -ˌläg\
Definition of IDEOLOGUE
1
: an impractical idealist :theorist
2
: an often blindly partisan advocate or adherent of a particular ideology


Hey look at that, another insult! :D

"The state should own entire strips of land, in the interest of protecting our property"... "We need limited government, that doesn't grow and breed corruption"... haha, yea, that's realistic. :D

[Philhelm]

who cares about imaginary lines on a map?

It's not about imaginary lines; it's about jurisdiction.

[cindy25]

it takes a passport to visit Canada or Mexico now, until 2006 an oral declaration with no ID usually asked for, was routine

[JustinTime]

The goats are eating the grass that the farmers stole from you in the first place. Blame the thief.

Instead of merely playing a childish blame game, how about we start resisting their plans?

Im a nationalist for the simple fact that I do not like globalism, because I want government small and in-check, as close to the people as possible. I dont like huge Imperial self-styled 'Federal' governments getting bigger and bigger and more detached. I like small Republics.

Dont you see the open borders people are using the language of liberty to pull the wool over your eyes? They are merely expanding the empire, and not a scintilla of liberty will come of it.

[Lord Xar]

I think it is a fairly documented fact that one of the tactics to a globalistic goal is to erase borders. That is my main beef with many of the libertarians is that they are actually big government globalists in disguise. No borders can NEVER lead to a de-centralized, smaller government - never. They know this. To pretend otherwise is dishonesty.

The European Union is a prime example. Start with "trade" agreements, then suspensions of individual constitutions etc.. then the open borders. Bye bye.

"A nation without secure borders is no nation at all" - Ron Paul

[QueenB4Liberty]

This is where ideology meets fantasy. What these these principled libertarians want, is peaceful anarchy (Just so happens, so do I). But until the entire world thinks like them, with the same morals as them, they had better not move to that utopian island they dream about. Why?... because the folks that don't think like them - will surround them, catch them, skin them. and eat them alive.

The open border, Principled Libertarian types are Ideologues.




FACT:
We do not live in a Republic, we live in a democracy with NO rule of law, a mobacracy.
immigration legal/illegal equals millions more people lining up to join the mob.
The mob -- People who want to rob you of everything via the government as a result of their ignorance, greed, lack of morals, and/or conditioning.


Its not hard to understand, but like the definition states they are "impractical idealists".

The sad thing is we all have to suffer the consequences of their mistakes. I sometimes wonder why they are Ron Paul supporters. When they are truly supporting The Rockefeller foundation, the Carnagie Endowment, the Ford Foundation, the CFR, George Soros, George Bush, and other Global-socialists.

signed,

Bah Hum Bug! :mad:

Yeah, theoretically I'm for no borders. But not with the way things are going. Not now. A lot is going to have to change.

[ClayTrainor]

Instead of merely playing a childish blame game, how about we start resisting their plans?

Without taking the time to properly identify the source if the problem, resistance will be futile. Don't just resist the symptoms of the disease, resist the disease itself.



Im a nationalist for the simple fact that I do not like globalism, because I want government small and in-check, as close to the people as possible. I dont like huge Imperial self-styled 'Federal' governments getting bigger and bigger and more detached. I like small Republics.

Show me a republic in history that didn't grow and oppress, and i might be with ya. Im against nationalism because it relies on the same mythical "we" to justify the coercive actions of a few over entire populations. It's the same logical flaw that all forms of collectivism and socialism rely on on. There is no we, there is only individuals.

Every single attempt at "limited government" or "republics" through history failed drastically. The American "limited government" experiment, for example, has resulted in arguably the largest government in world history.


Dont you see the open borders people are using the language of liberty to pull the wool over your eyes? They are merely expanding the empire, and not a scintilla of liberty will come of it.

I think what's happening here is quite obvious to anyone paying attention.


If this is true, the borders aren't disappearing, they are expanding. This would only mean that they are trying to merge the farms into one bigger farm.

What are state and national borders? who owns them? How were they established? Who's deciding to change them? who decides what everybody within them does? Borders are a purely born and maintained through coercive state power, because they are based on the fallacious idea "public ownership".

You do not live in a country, you live on a human farm. You are tax livestock.

[romacox]

A lot of people here will be pleased, but Im not. Globalism isnt about limiting government at all, just getting a bigger, farther removed, less responsible one.

bump

[romacox]

Instead of merely playing a childish blame game, how about we start resisting their plans?

Im a nationalist for the simple fact that I do not like globalism, because I want government small and in-check, as close to the people as possible. I dont like huge Imperial self-styled 'Federal' governments getting bigger and bigger and more detached. I like small Republics.

Dont you see the open borders people are using the language of liberty to pull the wool over your eyes? They are merely expanding the empire, and not a scintilla of liberty will come of it.

bump

Keep them small so we know where they live.

[ClayTrainor]

If this is true, the borders aren't disappearing, they are expanding. This would only mean that they are trying to merge the farms into one bigger farm.

What are state and national borders? who owns them? How were they established? Who's deciding to change them? who decides what everybody within them does? Borders are a purely born and maintained through coercive state power, because they are based on the fallacious idea "public ownership".

You do not live in a country, you live on a human farm. You are tax livestock.

Bump ;)

[Promontorium]

I am glad to see some people here with rational understanding of the open-border libertarian ideal. Does the open-borderist want every city and state in America to be under federal control and federal law? No? Then you have missed everything that is wrong with expanding borders, which are the manifestation of expanding federal control. And your feigned ignorant arguments about the subjectivity of borders is meaningless. Those borders, however unnatural, certainly exist in practice. Just as the man with a gun in your face has no natural right to tell you how to act, but he's there, and saying he ain't natural won't make him disappear.


This plan needs to know this: Good Boys Eat Hot Nasty Crunchy Pancakes. Just took a Spanish final. lol. just be a smartass.

Regionally Canada, US, Mexico are "North America" however continentally North America also includes Guatemala, Belize, El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, and Panama.

[easycougar]

Regionally Canada, US, Mexico are "North America" however continentally North America also includes Guatemala, Belize, El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, and Panama.

What about Cuba and the rest of the Caribbean islands?

[ClayTrainor]

Does the open-borderist want every city and state in America to be under federal control and federal law? No?

Absolutely not. Private ownership of all property is the logical conclusion of free-market capitalism. The very idea of public/nationally owned borders is in direct opposition to this concept.


Then you have missed everything that is wrong with expanding borders, which are the manifestation of expanding federal control.

Expanding borders? I think you have misunderstood the argument.



And your feigned ignorant arguments about the subjectivity of borders is meaningless. Those borders, however unnatural, certainly exist in practice. Just as the man with a gun in your face has no natural right to tell you how to act, but he's there, and saying he ain't natural won't make him disappear.

The same logic applies with the income tax, the FED, etc. and it's still wrong to try and justify their existence.