Alex Jones Crashes an Austin Libertarian Rally? What the Heck?

[AGRP]

I guess I'm late on seeing this?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdJ4zhiB2s4&feature=related

[emazur]

I don't know if crashed is the best word - he was supporting the gun rally but it looks like the people there didn't like the way he was doing it by stealing the show and bullhorning the event. I wasn't there so I can't so whether or not his presence helped or hindered the cause.

[libertarian4321]

Alex Jones is all about Alex Jones.

He'd walk over his own mother to get in front of a camera. He has no problem ruining a pro gun rights rally (it wasn't just the Libertarian Party, there were a lot of pro-gun and pro-Ron Paul speakers there).

Once you realize that, his actions are completely understandable.

[libertarian4321]

I don't know if crashed is the best word - he was supporting the gun rally but it looks like the people there didn't like the way he was doing it by stealing the show and bullhorning the event. I wasn't there so I can't so whether or not his presence helped or hindered the cause.

Crashed is a perfect word.

Several organizations organized the rally. In the middle of the program, Alex Jones strode out in front of the press, with his bull horn, and shouted over the speakers. He completely ruined the rally. When questioned by the organizers afterward, he proceeded to demean and insult them (most of whom were strong Ron Paul supporters).

There are a number of videos of this event showing Jones being a jackass.

But hey, Alex Jones got Alex Jones on TV, so he accomplished his goals.

[libertarian4321]

For those who worship Alex Jones, here's some more footage of your hero acting like a complete douchebag at that event:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntXlgYnJ_xc&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jf8n06YMI_E&feature=related

[Agorism]

I got a good laugh out of that.

[dannno]

I think AJ underestimated the amount of work the other groups had put into organizing and getting people from their groups to attend. He had put the word out himself and assumed most of the crowd was there because of him, and he felt like they were hijacking his crowd. He was wrong, he was a jackass to the leaders of the other groups and the crowd let him know it. He made a mistake, and ya, AJ likes him some attention. It works well for him and it works well for the liberty movement in general, this time it kinda blew up on him a little.

[Agorism]

Well the guys filming it certainly didn't want him there, but it's hard to tell how many people were following him or not. I really don't think he cares about that one way or the other though.

[HOLLYWOOD]

I've been in 'Battle of the Bands'... but 'Battle of the Bull Horns'? Silly stuff

All the while the lunatics in government destroys everything... except what they want for themselves.

[libertarian4321]

I think AJ underestimated the amount of work the other groups had put into organizing and getting people from their groups to attend. He had put the word out himself and assumed most of the crowd was there because of him, and he felt like they were hijacking his crowd. He was wrong, he was a jackass to the leaders of the other groups and the crowd let him know it. He made a mistake, and ya, AJ likes him some attention. It works well for him and it works well for the liberty movement in general, this time it kinda blew up on him a little.

It was bad enough that he ruined the event, but what really pissed people off is the way he arrogantly disrespected them afterward. As if everyone else was a cockroach and he was the only one that mattered.

[muzzled dogg]

i gotta send this around

[AGRP]

i gotta send this around

I guess I'm not the only one who just learned about this lol.

I remember people on this forum really not liking for something he did. I'm assuming this is it.

[Nate-ForLiberty]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TACalwg360c&feature=related

I'm not sold on the idea that he's cointelpro, but this is definitely worth thinking about.

[AGRP]

I guess Ill leave this here?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThPLwBZY6Us

It's amazing how opinions of people can change so drastically from one day to the next. Not to say I don't like him now since he's still really good, but I'll forever view him differently.

[Nate-ForLiberty]

I guess Ill leave this here?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThPLwBZY6Us

It's amazing how opinions of people can change so drastically from one day to the next. Not to say I don't like him now since he's still really good, but I'll forever view him differently.

Why would Alan Watt say this in 2006 and then repeatedly go one Alex's show and write articles for infowars?

[low preference guy]

Why would Alan Watt say this in 2006 and then repeatedly go one Alex's show and write articles for infowars?

dude, they're show business people. all this stuff brings ratings.

[AGRP]

Why would Alan Watt say this in 2006 and then repeatedly go one Alex's show and write articles for infowars?

Because it's a paycheck? The same reason why TSA agents do what they do?

And notice he only eluded to AJ (never said it was him).

[libertybrewcity]

Is this old? Didn't this happen a while ago?

[dannno]

Is this old? Didn't this happen a while ago?

Yep.

Like ripping scabs off old wounds.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct21YCEiWMM

[Humanae Libertas]

He can be an idiot at times, but he says a lot of good things. With that said, I don't trust him.

[ForeverAlone]

Alex Jones is hilarious. He trolls people in real life.

[specsaregood]

It was bad enough that he ruined the event, but what really pissed people off is the way he arrogantly disrespected them afterward. As if everyone else was a cockroach and he was the only one that mattered.

Wasn't it Catherine bleish that he was yelling at the event and said was co-intelpro on the radio the next day?

[Mach]

This was one of the things that made me look at him a different way, for-ev-er!

He is not a very grassroots kind of guy, he seems to be nothing but an opportunist.

[Todd]

Wasn't it Catherine bleish that he was yelling at the event and said was co-intelpro on the radio the next day?


When two strong attention seeking personas clash...that is what you'll get.

[Elwar]

Well, I just know that if I was in the Bilderberg group I'd be shaking in my boots if there was some guy outside of the meeting rallying people behind him to yell into a blowhorn...

...or would that make me feel safer knowing that all of the hatred was being controlled and I didn't have to worry about being over-run...

hmm

[Travlyr]

Alex Jones is all about Alex Jones.

He'd walk over his own mother to get in front of a camera. He has no problem ruining a pro gun rights rally (it wasn't just the Libertarian Party, there were a lot of pro-gun and pro-Ron Paul speakers there).

Once you realize that, his actions are completely understandable.
This ^^^

Alex Jones is a defender of liberty. He has a show and he needs ratings. He is simply boosting his ratings using controversy. He understands that if you want to be heard, get a louder microphone.

This is a bad video of bouncing sidewalks, whiners, and complainers. If you don't like Alex Jones, don't watch him. Silencing him is not a positive for liberty. I can't wait until the Alex Jones haters grow-up. Sheesh.

[Fredom101]

This is exactly why the freedom-lovers in Austin hate Alex Jones. He detracts from the message of liberty by pulling stunts like this.

Alex Jones is all about Alex Jones. How sad.

[ericsnow]

Why would Alan Watt say this in 2006 and then repeatedly go one Alex's show and write articles for infowars?

He obviously changed his mind since then.

[ericsnow]

This is exactly why the freedom-lovers in Austin hate Alex Jones. He detracts from the message of liberty by pulling stunts like this.

Alex Jones is all about Alex Jones. How sad.

LMAO at the freedom lovers in Austin hating Alex Jones when he's on every radio station in town.

[ericsnow]

This was one of the things that made me look at him a different way, for-ev-er!

He is not a very grassroots kind of guy, he seems to be nothing but an opportunist.

Look at this opportunist spewing his nonsense back in the 90s! He's just doing it all for the money!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Eh8609zteQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6orFeosRZS8

Oh wait... The content of those videos totally conflict with the theory Alex Jones is an opportunist and not a grassroots kind of guy. Alex Jones was saying the same things he's saying now before it was mainstream and before there was big business around it. Maybe he DOES care about his country and is just a little eccentric?

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Alex is a serious talk show host.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hd4zj7rbX9Y&feature=related

[ericsnow]

Alex is a serious talk show host.

You do realize every time you post an out of context video of Alex Jones you are only lending him more credibility?

[Churchill2004]

Guys, it's entirely possible that Alex Jones is both a sincere, committed anti-authoritarian who wants to educate people and a raging asshole whose net influence on the liberty movement has been at best zero, and quite plausibly well into the negative. His conspiracy obsession would be bad enough on its own, but when you add his noxious personality to the mix I don't care how many friendly Ron Paul interviews he does, the man is poison to libertarianism.

See also: Beck, Rockwell, Assange

[ericsnow]

Guys, it's entirely possible that Alex Jones is both a sincere, committed anti-authoritarian who wants to educate people and a raging asshole whose net influence on the liberty movement has been at best zero, and quite plausibly well into the negative. His conspiracy obsession would be bad enough on its own, but when you add his noxious personality to the mix I don't care how many friendly Ron Paul interviews he does, the man is poison to libertarianism.

See also: Beck, Rockwell, Assange

If it weren't for Alex Jones millions of people would still be stuck in the left/right paradigm.

[Churchill2004]

If it weren't for Alex Jones millions of people would still be stuck in the left/right paradigm.

And he's moved most of them right into the equally useless conspiracy-theory paradigm. I'd frankly rather have an unenlightened liberal or conservative than someone who's been converted to the Alex Jones school of thought and goes around making people think that's what libertarianism is.

Has Jones done some good and brought some people in the right direction? Sure. But his insanity and abrasiveness also marginalize him, and rightfully so, and that marginalization can quite easily bleed over to his fellow travelers and those who advocate the good ideas AJ has picked up on.

[ericsnow]

And he's moved most of them right into the equally useless conspiracy-theory paradigm. I'd frankly rather have an unenlightened liberal or conservative than someone who's been converted to the Alex Jones school of thought and goes around making people think that's what libertarianism is.

Funny because Alex Jones and Ron Paul agree on almost everything.


Has Jones done some good and brought some people in the right direction? Sure. But his insanity and abrasiveness also marginalize him, and rightfully so, and that marginalization can quite easily bleed over to his fellow travelers and those who advocate the good ideas AJ has picked up on.

Is Alex Jones abrasive? Yes.
Is Alex Jones insane. No.

[specsaregood]

Is Alex Jones insane. No.
Are you a doctor? A psychologist or psychiatrist?

[Churchill2004]

Funny because Alex Jones and Ron Paul agree on almost everything.



Which would be great if Alex Jones actually talked about policy issues and the evil things the government does out in the open for everyone to see, and not how the Trilateral Bilderger NWO Council is responsible for 9/11, faking the moon landings, shooting JFK, the Oklahoma City bombings, chemtrails, global depopulation, and any other endless number of real and imagined evils.

Alex Jones is probably not an anti-semite, at least I've never heard anything explicitly as such from him. But his thought patterns and the worldview he preaches is straight from the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. It's counterproductive because most people just hear the paranoid ranting and don't stop to think about whether or not he's taking a reasonable position on monetary policy or the war in Iraq. And those who do like him don't care about his positions on the issues, either. He could just as easily be a Trotskyist with the exact same style and he'd have 90% of the same followers.

[ericsnow]

Are you a doctor? A psychologist or psychiatrist?

No but I've taken psychology classes in college. If Alex Jones was insane he would have broke down from the stress years ago.

[Churchill2004]

No but I've taken psychology classes in college. If Alex Jones was insane he would have broke down from the stress years ago.

And we would be able to tell by the sudden onset of anti-social behavior, delusional narcissism, and debilitating paranoia, as these would be a stark contrast to his current behavior...

http://www.tangent21.com/templates/images/forum/s-rolleyes.gif

[specsaregood]

No but I've taken psychology classes in college.
Well clearly you are well qualified to make that diagnosis then.

[Fredom101]

LMAO at the freedom lovers in Austin hating Alex Jones when he's on every radio station in town.

Not true. He's on 1 pirate station and then he has a show on Sundays on 590 am for 2 hours, that's it. The true freedom lovers here can't stand AJ because of stunts like this.

[Tonewah]

Those who are converted from mainstream media thought by Alex Jones are like those converted by hell-fire and brimstone preachers. When the initial 'I'm-going-to-hell-tomorrow' fear wears off, they go back to what they were, or maybe even become LESS receptive to truth. That being said, I think he has some of the most interesting things to say and covers a lot more news than most media. And he DID predict 9-11 months before it happened.

If it weren't for Ron Paul, I would have never heard of Alex. I think the first I ever heard of him was when I clicked a link to his show to hear Ron Paul. I didn't like him to begin with, cutting off the radio almost every time I listened, but I've gotten used to him. He likes to be the one with the info, and feels like he has to overtalk anyone who says anything remotely related to the topics he always covers. He's a self-professed conspiracy theorist, so I always take him with a grain of salt. Its his personality that makes him aggressive and territorial about the info he disseminates.

[ericsnow]

Well clearly you are well qualified to make that diagnosis then.

More qualified than most people on here yes.

[ericsnow]

And we would be able to tell by the sudden onset of anti-social behavior, delusional narcissism, and debilitating paranoia, as these would be a stark contrast to his current behavior...

http://www.tangent21.com/templates/images/forum/s-rolleyes.gif

Anti social behavior? Alex Jones is incredibly social and loves people.

Delusional narcissism? It's called pride.

Debilitating paranoia? Yes his paranoia is so debilitating that he can host a radio show, make documentary films, do countless interviews, and raise his two small children, among many other things.

[Scott Wilson]

And he DID predict 9-11 months before it happened.


No he didn't. What he did predict that at some time in the future that there would be a terrorist attack and that the government would use this to justify laws which abrogate the fundamental rights of the people.

All those in the patriot media were saying the exact same thing from the mid 90's on. Anyone who was even mildly informed back then was predicting the exact same thing.

His predicting of 9/11 is simply another example of Alex Jones twisting the truth, exaggerating and taking things out of context in an attempt to make what he says credible.

You know what? I predict that in the future there will be another terrorist attack which will be used by the legislature to justify the increase in government power over the people.

[Scott Wilson]

If it weren't for Alex Jones millions of people would still be stuck in the left/right paradigm.

Is it better to be stuck in a false left/right paradigm or to be stuck in a lunacy/fear/sensationalist paradigm?

Alex misleads people every day.

[ericsnow]

Is it better to be stuck in a false left/right paradigm or to be stuck in a lunacy/fear/sensationalist paradigm?

Alex misleads people every day.

Examples of him misleading people?

[specsaregood]

Examples of him misleading people?

You mean like the video in this thread where he talks about how the co-intel pro people at the rally? when in fact they were known liberty activists? and IIRC even members of this site.

[ericsnow]

You mean like the video in this thread where he talks about how the co-intel pro people at the rally? when in fact they were known liberty activists? and IIRC even members of this site.

I'm talking about him misleading as far as the information he covers.

Him "crashing" a gun rally and saying the people were co intel pro is not one of Alex's finer moments, but he is human. We all make mistakes and we all lie from time to time.

[specsaregood]

I'm talking about him misleading as far as the information he covers.
Him "crashing" a gun rally and saying the people were co intel pro is not one of Alex's finer moments, but he is human. We all make mistakes and we all lie from time to time.

So you agree, he was misleading his listeners in that segment?

[Churchill2004]

"We all lie from time to time"?

Really?

I mean... really? That's how low you're willing to sink to defend this scumbag?

[ericsnow]

So you agree, he was misleading his listeners in that segment?

He could have been. He also could have really interpreted those people as co intel pro. We don't have all the details. There could be an explanation that rationalizes his behavior at the gun rally.

[ericsnow]

"We all lie from time to time"?

Really?

I mean... really? That's how low you're willing to sink to defend this scumbag?

I lie. You lie. We all do. Even if AJ flat out lied about thinking those people were co intel pro, that's one lie. And it's a lie that isn't even about the information he covers, which is what I really want you to provide me with.

[Churchill2004]

How the hell is lying about a rally he attended, and lying about those who opposed him, not lying about "information he covers"? And please don't tell me you're so immature you don't understand the difference between "everyone lies" and committing what is arguably libel on your nationally-syndicated radio show? A show were you claim to be the paragon of truth revealing the lies of everyone else?

Face it: you're trying to defend the indefensible just because he shares your political views (and mine for that matter). Just because someone is a libertarian does not make them immune from human fallibilities or from standards of moral and ethical conduct.

Jones is at best a fool, and a dishonest fool at that.

[specsaregood]

I lie. You lie. We all do. Even if AJ flat out lied about thinking those people were co intel pro, that's one lie. And it's a lie that isn't even about the information he covers, which is what I really want you to provide me with.

huhuh. he misled and lied...and furthered the conspiracy theory paradigm by making people think there are enemies everywhere. you can't even trust your local fellow liberty activists because they are obviously co-intelpro....even though it was their event he was crashing....

[TC95]

I'm talking about him misleading as far as the information he covers.

Him "crashing" a gun rally and saying the people were co intel pro is not one of Alex's finer moments, but he is human. We all make mistakes and we all lie from time to time.

His crashing a gun rally and saying people were co intel pro is what leads me to believe that HE is the one who is co intel pro.

http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo/52091/Alex_Jones_CoinTelPro_Cooper_his_competition_DEAD/

I used to think I liked the guy, but no more.

[ericsnow]

huhuh. he misled and lied...and furthered the conspiracy theory paradigm by making people think there are enemies everywhere. you can't even trust your local fellow liberty activists because they are obviously co-intelpro....even though it was their event he was crashing....

Are you doubting the fact that government agents show up to gun rallies and We Are Change meet ups?

[specsaregood]

Are you doubting the fact that government agents show up to gun rallies and We Are Change meet ups?

Nope, but pushing the thought that everybody is suspect and inproperly labeling good people, creates division and mistrust. It is exactly what a government agent would want/do. When people don't trust each other / work together nothing happens.

In this instance AJ served to cause harm.

[ericsnow]

How the hell is lying about a rally he attended, and lying about those who opposed him, not lying about "information he covers"?

Him talking about the gun rally on his show was a minuscule aside from his personal life, not anything remotely close to vital news/information.

[Brian4Liberty]

Why doesn't Alex Jones go interrupt a Move-on.org rally or a New Black Panther rally instead of interrupting a group that he says he agrees with, and would have been given an opportunity to speak if he had asked/waited like a normal human being?

[ericsnow]

Why doesn't Alex Jones go interrupt a Move-on.org rally or a New Black Panther rally instead of interrupting a group that he says he agrees with, and would have been given an opportunity to speak if he had asked/waited like a normal human being?

He should have waited but you have to consider how important every minute of Alex Jones' time is. He's the hardest working man in radio.

And it's not AJ's personality to ask for permission to protest.

[specsaregood]

Why doesn't Alex Jones go interrupt a Move-on.org rally or a New Black Panther rally instead of interrupting a group that he says he agrees with, and would have been given an opportunity to speak if he had asked/waited like a normal human being?

Good point. Because he wants those rallies to continue, but a 2nd amendment rally.....well that just can't be allowed to continue without interuption.

[specsaregood]

He should have waited but you have to consider how important every minute of Alex Jones' time is. He's the hardest working man in radio.

LOL, do you know everybody that works in radio? Let me guess, you took a class on that in college also.

[ericsnow]

LOL, do you know everybody that works in radio? Let me guess, you took a class on that in college also.

No but I know that Alex Jones puts in 12, 14, 16 hour days almost every day.

[specsaregood]

No but I know that Alex Jones puts in 12, 14, 16 hour days almost every day.

You should from here on out, be renamed "AJ-bot".

[Nate-ForLiberty]

for what it's worth....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtdJc-8Sg10&feature=related

[ninepointfive]

I haven't seen anyone mention this so here goes:

Alex did a lot to promote this rally, and in the end, Catherine Bleish who was another organizer excluded him from the very rally he promoted.
So therefore he came into the event and ruined it for them. He was a major promoter, and they snubbed him.

I saw this in another post on this forum, so perhaps someone who knows more about it can comment.

[specsaregood]

I haven't seen anyone mention this so here goes:

Alex did a lot to promote this rally, and in the end, Catherine Bleish who was another organizer excluded him from the very rally he promoted.
So therefore he came into the event and ruined it for them. He was a major promoter, and they snubbed him.

I saw this in another post on this forum, so perhaps someone who knows more about it can comment.

Uhm, I don't recall that. they knew he was coming and if you watch the videos they go out of their way to try to invite AJ up to the stage to talk.

[Churchill2004]

for what it's worth....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtdJc-8Sg10&feature=related

What it's worth is simply that there are people out there farther down the rabbit hole than Alex Jones. In the same way Glenn Beck is the intersection of melodrama and politics, Alex Jones is the intersection of conspiracy theories and politics. So it's understandable that he's not going to be into the less obviously political paranoid fantasies out there, like UFOs and astral projection.

[agitator]

Which would be great if Alex Jones actually talked about policy issues and the evil things the government does out in the open for everyone to see, and not how the Trilateral Bilderger NWO Council is responsible for 9/11, faking the moon landings, shooting JFK, the Oklahoma City ...

Guess you don't listen his program.


Alex Jones is probably not an anti-semite...

Oh, I see where you're coming from now.

[ericsnow]

I haven't seen anyone mention this so here goes:

Alex did a lot to promote this rally, and in the end, Catherine Bleish who was another organizer excluded him from the very rally he promoted.
So therefore he came into the event and ruined it for them. He was a major promoter, and they snubbed him.

I saw this in another post on this forum, so perhaps someone who knows more about it can comment.

I knew AJ wouldn't just crash a gun rally. I had a feeling he helped plan/organize it.

Another anti Alex Jones theory debunked. Are there any left?

[Churchill2004]

Guess you don't listen his program.



Oh, I see where you're coming from now.

I frankly don't see the need to spent my time listening to a man who believes in such nonsense as chemtrails and 9/11 trooferism, which is the reaction 90% of people have to someone like Jones.

And you must be either incredibly naive or willfully ignorant if you don't see the historical connections between conspiracy theories and antisemitism. For a disturbingly high chunk of these people, the "they" who are secretly running everything and destroying the world comes down to "the Jews". It's one of the ugly connotations that is inseparable from conspiracy talk, even if it's wholly unintended.

[CzargwaR]

I would steal his bullhorn and run, then mail it back to him a day later.
Fuck Alex Jones.

[ericsnow]

I frankly don't see the need to spent my time listening to a man who believes in such nonsense as chemtrails and 9/11 trooferism, which is the reaction 90% of people have to someone like Jones.

Umm chem trails are admitted...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7Hwr8D1CmM

About 9/11... two words... building seven.


And you must be either incredibly naive or willfully ignorant if you don't see the historical connections between conspiracy theories and antisemitism. For a disturbingly high chunk of these people, the "they" who are secretly running everything and destroying the world comes down to "the Jews". It's one of the ugly connotations that is inseparable from conspiracy talk, even if it's wholly unintended.

Wait so if you believe in conspiracy theories you hate jews? LMAO

That's like saying if you don't like watching the NBA you hate black people. Just asinine.

[ClayTrainor]

Alex Jones = Glenn Beck, for conspiracy theorists.

[ericsnow]

Alex Jones = Glenn Beck, for conspiracy theorists.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KUvXp1tgNA

[Batman]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/engineering/architecture/4278874

[ericsnow]

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/engineering/architecture/4278874

LOL popular mechanics.

That's like linking to media matters to prove republicans/libertarians are evil. No agendas there :rolleyes:

[AGRP]

What it's worth is simply that there are people out there farther down the rabbit hole than Alex Jones. In the same way Glenn Beck is the intersection of melodrama and politics, Alex Jones is the intersection of conspiracy theories and politics. So it's understandable that he's not going to be into the less obviously political paranoid fantasies out there, like UFOs and astral projection.

Well, he did omit several facts such as his refusal to talk about his Jesuit connections. Not to say it's bad, but it's odd when he refuses to analyze certain subjects as much as others (there are several videos on this).

I'm 100% impartial. I still enjoy AJ, but it does seem like he spins people's wheels at times. Instead of educating people about direct action that will lead to liberty, such as the 10th amendment, he spends more time talking about things like fluoride in the water. Yes it is bad, but it gets to the point when certain subjects are over-killed and productive actions/education are highly ignored.

[Batman]

LOL popular mechanics.

That's like linking to media matters to prove republicans/libertarians are evil. No agendas there :rolleyes:

So if you don't agree with it, it can't be true?

[ericsnow]

So if you don't agree with it, it can't be true?

Debunking Popular Mechanics' 9/11 Lies
http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/debunking_popular_mechanics_myths.htm

[Batman]

Debunking Popular Mechanics' 9/11 Lies
http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/debunking_popular_mechanics_myths.htm

So you're going to take the word of Alex Jones over engineers with a PhD in structural analysis. You couldn't link me to an article written directly by Steven Jones at least? The document claims traces of thermite was found in the wreckage - what I have read of Steven Jones in the past is that traces of sulfur were found. Sulfur is a fairly common element found in - among other things - jet fuel.

[ericsnow]

So you're going to take the word of Alex Jones over engineers with a PhD in structural analysis. You couldn't link me to an article written directly by Steven Jones at least? The document claims traces of thermite was found in the wreckage - what I have read of Steven Jones in the past is that traces of sulfur were found. Sulfur is a fairly common element found in - among other things - jet fuel.

Sulfur doesn't cause pools of molten lava which last for weeks. Thermite does.

I never claimed I have all the answers to 9/11. No one does. But millions of people have questions.

Check this website out.
http://patriotsquestion911.com/media.html

[Nate-ForLiberty]

So you're going to take the word of Alex Jones over engineers with a PhD in structural analysis. You couldn't link me to an article written directly by Steven Jones at least? The document claims traces of thermite was found in the wreckage - what I have read of Steven Jones in the past is that traces of sulfur were found. Sulfur is a fairly common element found in - among other things - jet fuel.

Actually, "active thermitic material" has been found at the WTC site.

http://www.bentham.org/open/tocpj/articles/V002/7TOCPJ.pdf

http://www.reopen911.info/News/wp-content/uploads/nano-thermite.jpg

[Pericles]

Maybe some of you should actually see thermite in action before making a conclusion.

Some fun loving Marines demonstrating the properties of a thermite grenade:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2289367460324643450#

[jmdrake]

So you're going to take the word of Alex Jones over engineers with a PhD in structural analysis. You couldn't link me to an article written directly by Steven Jones at least? The document claims traces of thermite was found in the wreckage - what I have read of Steven Jones in the past is that traces of sulfur were found. Sulfur is a fairly common element found in - among other things - jet fuel.

Stephen Jones is a physics PhD. And there are thousands of other masters and PhD level architects, engineers and physicists who question 9/11. So it's "taking Alex Jones word" has nothing to do with it.

http://www.ae911truth.org/

Besides, Popular Mechanics "debunking" has now been "debunked" by the final official government report from NIST which rejected the "pancake theory" PM spent so much time defending.

Anyway, check out this thread.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?272532-9-11-Experiments-The-Great-Thermate-Debate

The experimental data is in now. Testing the official story does not lead to measurable amounts of sulfur. And thermate can cut through vertical and horizontal steel beams.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d5iIoCiI8g&feature=player_embedded


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvQDFV1HINw&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

[Pericles]

The thermite point is that it is not a clean cut - it melts steel - look at the safe that got "thermited" in the video. That is what thermite does to steel and not the clean cuts shown as WTC "evidence".

[Romulus]

Nanotechnology is an amazing thing. It's unbelievable what has been done with it, and its been in use for a good long time before 2001.

[dannno]

The thermite point is that it is not a clean cut - it melts steel - look at the safe that got "thermited" in the video. That is what thermite does to steel and not the clean cuts shown as WTC "evidence".

Be sure to checkout this thread that jmdrake linked to above:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?272532-9-11-Experiments-The-Great-Thermate-Debate


Dude builds devices that cut steel beams, clean cuts, using small amounts of home made thermite...

[libertarian4321]

Is Alex Jones abrasive? Yes.
Is Alex Jones insane. No.

Alex Jones is a demagogue and an opportunist doing what he can to enrich himself. In the process, he will bring in some new people to the small government/libertarian movement (and the CT movement, which I can do without).

He's no different than Ann Coulter or Al Sharpton or dozens of others. He's less less successful than Coulter or Sharpton, but his game is the same.

The field for "left" and "right" wing demagogues is crowded and hard to crack. It ain't easy to climb over all the right wing bomb throwers. So Alex chose a couple of niche markets and became the most famous conspiracy theorist demagogue and the most successful libertarian demagogue.

Does Alex Jones believe what he says? I don't know. I imagine he believes some of it.

Then again, I'm sure Coulter and Sharpton believe at least some of what they say, too.

I prefer rational leaders like Ron Paul to bomb-throwing self-aggrandizing blow hards like Alex Jones.

The AJ's of the world can be useful from time to time, but they remain distasteful.

[libertarian4321]

Stephen Jones is a physics PhD. And there are thousands of other masters and PhD level architects, engineers and physicists who question 9/11. So it's "taking Alex Jones word" has nothing to do with it.

http://www.ae911truth.org/



Yup, in 9+ years, AE "truth" has managed to find a bit less than 1,400 people with engineering/science/architecture related degrees or professions from around the world to endorse the "truther" version of events.

I should note, however, that MILLIONS of engineers/scientists/architects in the USA alone have NOT seen fit to endorse the "truther" version of events.

I'm one of those engineers who has NOT endorsed the "truth" (as the truthers see it).

I present this only for informational purposes, though I suspect the truthers are grabbing their torches and pitch forks and getting ready to flame away...

You know how you can tell that 9-11 wasn't a government orchestrated operation? Because it WORKED...

[crazyfacedjenkins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZO8FJ3B_ECs&feature=sub

[crazyfacedjenkins]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s7-hCIixZE

[ericsnow]

out of context video

Cool video brah. Every time you post those out of context clips all you're doing is giving AJ more credibility. You're afraid to debate his integrity like an intellectual.

[ericsnow]

Yup, in 9+ years, AE "truth" has managed to find a bit less than 1,400 people with engineering/science/architecture related degrees or professions from around the world to endorse the "truther" version of events.

I should note, however, that MILLIONS of engineers/scientists/architects in the USA alone have NOT seen fit to endorse the "truther" version of events.

I'm one of those engineers who has NOT endorsed the "truth" (as the truthers see it).

I present this only for informational purposes, though I suspect the truthers are grabbing their torches and pitch forks and getting ready to flame away...

You know how you can tell that 9-11 wasn't a government orchestrated operation? Because it WORKED...

1400 is a crap load considering they have nothing to gain by coming out for 9/11 truth and a whole lot to lose, including their lives.

[hazek]

I didn't really read the whole thread but let me just say:

Don't let them win and let them divide and conquer us.

[ericsnow]

Alex Jones is a demagogue and an opportunist doing what he can to enrich himself. In the process, he will bring in some new people to the small government/libertarian movement (and the CT movement, which I can do without).


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Eh8609zteQ

Man look at this opportunist pushing his same anti globalist BS back in the 90s! What a money hungry opportunist! Oh wait!!! That's right, there was next to no money to be made off of Alex Jones' conspiratorial views back in the 90s. But hey maybe he used Doc Brown's Delorean and traveled to 2010 and saw how much money was being made off of conspiracies. He then went back to the mid 90s and started his cable access television show knowing that one day he would have a nationally syndicated radio show with millions of listeners :rolleyes:

[libertarian4321]

1400 is a crap load considering they have nothing to gain by coming out for 9/11 truth and a whole lot to lose, including their lives.

Yeah, the truthers are just dropping like flies as the new world order CFR Bilderberger illuminati black helicopter assassins pick them off, lol.

About the only thing an engineer has to lose by signing on as a "truther" is the professional respect of his colleagues.

[libertarian4321]

Man look at this opportunist pushing his same anti globalist BS back in the 90s! What a money hungry opportunist! Oh wait!!! That's right, there was next to no money to be made off of Alex Jones' conspiratorial views back in the 90s. But hey maybe he used Doc Brown's Delorean and traveled to 2010 and saw how much money was being made off of conspiracies. He then went back to the mid 90s and started his cable access television show knowing that one day he would have a nationally syndicated radio show with millions of listeners :rolleyes:

All demagogues start off small. Do you think Al Sharpton started off with hordes of followers?

[Travlyr]

Yeah, the truthers are just dropping like flies as the new world order CFR Bilderberger illuminati black helicopter assassins pick them off, lol.

About the only thing an engineer has to lose by signing on as a "truther" is the professional respect of his colleagues.
Or, you could be the first among your peers to say, "It was controlled demolition."

I was embarrassed when I finally realized that I had been taken for a ride. When I realized that building 7 was not fully engulfed in flames, then the only conclusion that I can come to is controlled demolition. It was either the fire or it wasn't. Since only one side of the building was on fire, then it couldn't have been the fire. Do you have a better explanation? Buildings just do not fall down at the speed of gravity free fall by themselves.

[specsaregood]

Buildings just do not fall down at the speed of gravity by themselves.
Exactly how fast is the "speed of gravity"?

[Travlyr]

~ 9.8 meters per second squared.

[specsaregood]

~ 9.8 meters per second squared.
Hrm, I coulda sworn that was the rate of acceleration, not speed. You sure about that?

[libertarian4321]

Or, you could be the first among your peers to say, "It was controlled demolition."



That isn't going to happen, I assure you.

Here's how you can be sure 9-11 was NOT an "inside job"- it WORKED.

In order to believe any of the many 9-11 conspiracy theories, you have to believe that the US Government, which has shown itself to be utterly inept in everything it does, was able to pull off an extremely complicated plot involving thousands of people, with complete precision and in utter secrecy, then was able to prevent all leaks for 9+ years.

The same fuck wits that print a BILLION bills (currency) before looking at the output and realizing there is a printing error and the entire batch will have to be trashed (at a cost of $100,000,000 to the taxpayer) are somehow competent enough to pull off 9-11 flawlessly?

Yeah, right.

I work with the government every day. They can't execute a contract to conduct a rather simple environmental cleanup without holding dozens of meetings over many months (or years), and involving hundreds of people. When the contract is executed, it is almost a 100% surety that the project will be fouled up one way or another- it will be over budget, will fail to meet it's goals, and will take far longer than planned.

You expect me to believe these same clowns executed the 9-11 conspiracy flawlessly?

Give me a break...

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Cool video brah. Every time you post those out of context clips all you're doing is giving AJ more credibility. You're afraid to debate his integrity like an intellectual.

Did I ever say I didn't believe Alex Jones' theory that "black people, Jews, Easter bunnies, and chupacabras run the new world order"????


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXpm_l1Lcro

[Natalie]

//

[Nate-ForLiberty]

Did I ever say I didn't believe Alex Jones' theory that "black people, Jews, Easter bunnies, and chupacabras run the new world order"????


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXpm_l1Lcro

oh come on, i don't know where the uncut/unedited version of that clip is, but i've seen it and he was talking about how his views are based on facts he can back up, not stupid myths, wise tales or whatever. He was being sarcastic. Yet you post it here as if that's that he actually believes. I'm not a rabid AJ fan, . . .

but fuck off.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

oh come on, i don't know where the uncut/unedited version of that clip is, but i've seen it and he was talking about how his views are based on facts he can back up, not stupid myths, wise tales or whatever. He was being sarcastic. Yet you post it here as if that's that he actually believes. I'm not a rabid AJ fan, . . .

but fuck off.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmxE112_Dnc

[dannno]

Hrm, I coulda sworn that was the rate of acceleration, not speed. You sure about that?

The speed of gravity is dependent on time.

[dannno]

That isn't going to happen, I assure you.

Here's how you can be sure 9-11 was NOT an "inside job"- it WORKED.

In order to believe any of the many 9-11 conspiracy theories, you have to believe that the US Government, which has shown itself to be utterly inept in everything it does, was able to pull off an extremely complicated plot involving thousands of people, with complete precision and in utter secrecy, then was able to prevent all leaks for 9+ years.

The same fuck wits that print a BILLION bills (currency) before looking at the output and realizing there is a printing error and the entire batch will have to be trashed (at a cost of $100,000,000 to the taxpayer) are somehow competent enough to pull off 9-11 flawlessly?

Yeah, right.

I work with the government every day. They can't execute a contract to conduct a rather simple environmental cleanup without holding dozens of meetings over many months (or years), and involving hundreds of people. When the contract is executed, it is almost a 100% surety that the project will be fouled up one way or another- it will be over budget, will fail to meet it's goals, and will take far longer than planned.

You expect me to believe these same clowns executed the 9-11 conspiracy flawlessly?

Give me a break...


That's a horrible argument, because for one thing it was international intelligence that pulled it off through massive compartmentalization, the planning had nothing to do with "the government", they were just some of the compartments that were utilized.

Secondly, you are trying to say that 19 guys who could barely fly small planes and liked to do drugs, party and go to strip clubs did this because of their religion, directed by a cartoon character from a cave in Afghanistan.. How on earth can you believe that this pathetic group who brought all the evidence of what they were going to do with them in their luggage that coincidentally got 'lost' could pull all of this off, but not the elite through their international intelligence wing.. that doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

[Travlyr]

Hrm, I coulda sworn that was the rate of acceleration, not speed. You sure about that?

You're right. 9.8 meters per second squared is the rate of acceleration, not speed. Good catch.

[Travlyr]

That isn't going to happen, I assure you.

Here's how you can be sure 9-11 was NOT an "inside job"- it WORKED.

In order to believe any of the many 9-11 conspiracy theories, you have to believe that the US Government, which has shown itself to be utterly inept in everything it does, was able to pull off an extremely complicated plot involving thousands of people, with complete precision and in utter secrecy, then was able to prevent all leaks for 9+ years.

The same fuck wits that print a BILLION bills (currency) before looking at the output and realizing there is a printing error and the entire batch will have to be trashed (at a cost of $100,000,000 to the taxpayer) are somehow competent enough to pull off 9-11 flawlessly?

Yeah, right.

I work with the government every day. They can't execute a contract to conduct a rather simple environmental cleanup without holding dozens of meetings over many months (or years), and involving hundreds of people. When the contract is executed, it is almost a 100% surety that the project will be fouled up one way or another- it will be over budget, will fail to meet it's goals, and will take far longer than planned.

You expect me to believe these same clowns executed the 9-11 conspiracy flawlessly?

Give me a break...

That's fine with me. It is not my intention to convince you of anything. This is just my way of letting the world know ... that I know ... buildings don't fall down by themselves very fast. I've seen barns take years to fall down. Buildings that fall down in a matter of seconds are brought down intentionally.

[specsaregood]

You're right. 9.8 meters per second squared is the rate of acceleration, not speed. Good catch.

So how fast did the building fall down? Also, how fast would you expect a building that fell NOT due to demolition to fall?

[Travlyr]

So how fast did the building fall down?It came down in about 6 seconds.


Also, how fast would you expect a building that fell NOT due to demolition to fall?If it stands for 15 years without falling down, then I would guess that it would take at least 15 more years to fall... maybe 100 or longer... I don't really understand your question.

There is more information here: http://buildingwhat.org/free-fall-collapse/

[specsaregood]

It came down in about 6 seconds.

You said it came down at the "speed of gravity". Was that statement incorrect? Because you haven't told me how fast that speed was yet.



If it stands for 15 years without falling down, then I would guess that it would take at least 15 more years to fall... maybe 100 or longer... I don't really understand your question.

Yes, let's ignore ALL external stimuli. lol

[wsc321]

Guys, it's entirely possible that Alex Jones is both a sincere, committed anti-authoritarian who wants to educate people and a raging asshole...

I appreciate the attempt at objectivity, Churchill. I think a lot of folks nowadays want to oversimplify things and pass judgment on the intent of another person's heart. I haven't listened to Alex much in a while, but I know I've been provoked to look at a number of issues I hadn't previously through his show. I think Alex was the first to get me interested in Ron Paul. I take his warnings on Fluoride seriously. His general warnings about an over-reaching government would probably do the average American some good, if only to provoke questions. OTOH, one of the reasons I don't listen more is because it is almost constant fear, doom and gloom. Mega doom and gloom.

My current opinion, however, is that Alex is sincere and a net plus. If he goes overboard sometimes... that's easy to criticize, right? I haven't seen the vids posted above yet, though - just reading through this thread.

[Travlyr]

You said it came down at the "speed of gravity". Was that statement incorrect? Because you haven't told me how fast that speed was yet.


Yes, let's ignore ALL external stimuli. lol
Yes specs. I fucked up and said it wrong. The speed of gravity is not constant.

[specsaregood]

Yes specs. I fucked up and said it wrong. The speed of gravity is not constant.

It's all good, in reality I'm just busting balls; but the thing is....you aren't the first. That is a talking point/statement I've read dozens/hundreds of times from people promoting the demolition POV. And everytime I read it I cringe; because it discredits the person's entire argument.

[agitator]

Exactly how fast is the "speed of gravity"?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Speed+of+gravity