MasterCard DOWN: MasterCard.com Hacked By WikiLeaks Supporters With DDOS Attack

[bobbyw24]

MasterCard.com has been down since about 5 a.m. ET. According to the BBC, hackers who support WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange are taking credit.

Earlier this week, MasterCard decided to stop processing payments for the group.

Operation Payback appeared to first report the outage, which has been confirmed throughout the morning by DownForEveryoneOrJustMe.com. The group tweeted:

@Anon_Operation WE ARE GLAD TO TELL YOU THAT http://www.mastercard.com/ is DOWN AND IT'S CONFIRMED! #ddos #wikileaks Operation:Payback(is a bitch!) #PAYBACK
DDOS attacks, also known as denial of service, were used to take down WikiLeaks.org before it was forced to move to WikiLeaks.ch.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/08/mastercard-down-hacked-wikileaks-ddos_n_793625.html

[fisharmor]

Still looks like it's down 3 hours later.

Shit's gettin' real.
:)

[pcosmar]

Can't say they weren't warned.

YouTube - Anonymous to the Governments of the World - Web Censorship (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbqC8BnvVHQ&feature=player_embedded)

[jrskblx125]

I just went to it its just realllllly slow. I say hit it again lol

[speciallyblend]

so the new american war has begun War on The Internet!

America loves wars. This seems right down tyrannys aka US GOV aisle!!


the internet tubes will be shut down for freedom and liberty thanks to the us gov! sarcasm but odds are our failed gov will follow thru on my sarcasm!

[specialkornflake]

My request failed, we'd better keep checking back to see when it's back up.

[speciallyblend]

My request failed, we'd better keep checking back to see when it's back up.

banks can burn in hell for all i care bring'em down!

[specialkornflake]

banks can burn in hell for all i care bring'em down!

Then maybe you should keep checking back to make sure it's still down while I do the same to see when it comes back up!

[Jordan]

Taking down their website isn't really much of an attack. I mean, how much business really goes through Mastercard.com?

[dizi24]

Let me get this right...Mastercard is doing something these hackers don't like, so they're shutting down their websites (and trying to do so at others, and likely would cause more damage if they can)...and this website is cheering it on?

How libertarian is that? Attacking other people's property because you don't like what they're doing with it. Yep, that's real libertarian.

[Fredom101]

Boom! Goes the dynamite. :)

[RonPaulFanInGA]

Taking down their website isn't really much of an attack. I mean, how much business really goes through Mastercard.com?

Yeah. Pretty lame. What's it supposed to prove anyway? Assange is still in jail. :rolleyes:

Is this supposed to be the modern-day equivalent of actually leaving ones' house and fighting for something?


Let me get this right...Mastercard is doing something these hackers don't like, so they're shutting down their websites (and trying to do so at others, and likely would cause more damage if they can)...and this website is cheering it on?

How libertarian is that? Attacking other people's property because you don't like what they're doing with it. Yep, that's real libertarian.

Sad, isn't it?

[cswake]

When the government is lawless, so are its people.

[rp4prez]

Uh oh cyber warfare. Here comes government control to save us all. =/

[gls]

Let me get this right...Mastercard is doing something these hackers don't like, so they're shutting down their websites (and trying to do so at others, and likely would cause more damage if they can)...and this website is cheering it on?

How libertarian is that? Attacking other people's property because you don't like what they're doing with it. Yep, that's real libertarian.

Whatever, none of these huge financial institutions can realistically be considered "private" anymore after the massive bailouts that have taken place in the last few years. They're all complicit in the same conspiracy to massively rip off the American people.

[RonPaulFanInGA]

When the government is lawless, so are its people.

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

[fisharmor]

Sad, isn't it?

I'm not saying it's right.
I'm saying it's less wrong than gunning down innocent people and children without cause in the middle of the street, it's less wrong than sponsoring police boy rape parties, it's less wrong than jailing people without bail for making the government look foolish, and it's less wrong than what is going to happen to Assange in the next couple weeks.

It also underscores the irrefutable facts that government not only has no interest in protecting your property, but it also is incapable.

To date I haven't heard what Wikileaks is doing which is illegal. Until I hear what law has been broken, it means that PayPal and MC are basically picking a fight.
If others get involved in that fight, I don't care.
If they lose the fight they picked, serves them right.

[Jordan]

Whatever, none of these huge financial institutions can realistically be considered "private" anymore after the massive bailouts that have taken place in the last few years. They're all complicit in the same conspiracy to massively rip off the American people.

Two wrongs make a right?

[idirtify]

the story just made CNN

[Lucille]

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

Joe McCarth... er Lieberman (http://www.zerohedge.com/article/spirit-joe-mccarthy-lives) has been pressuring all of these firms, and they have their own agenda as well.


We have learned in the press that Senator McCarthy and his staff have been contacting various parties such as Amazon, Visa, Master Card, PayPal, the New York Times and others, to warn them in no uncertain terms of the "bad citizen" like conduct of their dealings with WikiLeaks and the potential consequences thereof.

These organizations being the spineless commercial internet animals that they are, are each caving one by one, citing well drafted excuses about violations of terms of service agreements and similar boiler plate, which as we all know, are violated by every bear that shits in the internet woods.

Oh, and do I have to tell you who are behind Mastercard and Visa? The same people losing sleep over Assange's financial doomsday hard drive. Are you wondering if those same people have any influence over a certain Swiss Bank?

[RonPaulFanInGA]

Joe McCarth... er Lieberman (http://www.zerohedge.com/article/spirit-joe-mccarthy-lives) has been pressuring all of these firms

Irrelevant. MasterCard made the final call, not the a newly-passed government law. And under what you're saying, shouldn't the DDOS attacks be against the government, or maybe Lieberman's Senate website, instead? :rolleyes:

[TonySutton]

They are just giving them lots of traffic. I thought websites desire traffic?

[Fredom101]

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

Wrong. Mastercard is part of the corporatist nonsense and is so in bed and intertwined with government it's ridiculous. An attack on Mastercard is not an attack on a private business, it's an attack on a corporation which uses fascist tactics to do business.

[qh4dotcom]

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

If they got bailed out they are no longer a private business, they are government property.

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

There is a distinction between just acquirement and ownership of property, and property. Sure, it is their property, but so is the thief who steals your wallet. No one would defend the thief and say that the wallet is now his -- that is absurd. Similarly, these banks only exist because they are the recipients and beneficiaries of stolen money. They amount of just property they own is incredibly small, and accordingly, it is no aggression to take back from the thief what is yours. These banks need to die. I do not see how libertarians can defend them!

[gls]

Two wrongs make a right?

All I am saying is that it is a little far-fetched to call it "private property" when the corporation is inextricably intertwined with the corrupt, ostensibly public monetary establishment.

Not that I would participate in the attacks (even if I knew how) but I won't be shedding any tears for them.

[specsaregood]

Yeah. Pretty lame. What's it supposed to prove anyway? Assange is still in jail. :rolleyes:

Is this supposed to be the modern-day equivalent of actually leaving ones' house and fighting for something?

I think it is more of the modern day equivalent of leaving a bag of flaming poop on somebody's doorstep.

[RonPaulFanInGA]

If they got bailed out they are no longer a private business, they are government property.

How appealing the 'Ron Paul Liberty Movement's' idea of "liberty" must look to the casual, interested observer just stumbling across this website for the first time....

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

How appealing the 'Ron Paul Liberty Movement's' idea of "liberty" must look to the casual, interested observer just stumbling across this website for the first time....

The only thing odd is your idea that the thief who has just stolen your property, now justly belongs to the thief and any resulting committment to return, or at least hinder its use is met with derision and scorn not towards the thief, but to the persons or people who were stolen from!

Remember, property ownership must be justly acquired (either title transfer (gift), trade, or original appropriation (Homesteading)). Most of the property the banks hold is STOLEN GOODS. Why are you defending thiefs?

[Pericles]

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

I agree with the principle. This is different from that principle. A DoS is non destructive. It is the equivalent of 1000 18 wheelers trying to drive down the same stretch of Interstate at the same time causing a traffic jam and your car is delayed in its journey. All perfectly within the law and no property rights are being violated.

Is it designed to send a message? You bet it is.

[Acala]

Mastercard, the banks, and much of corporate America long ago lost the right to claim the sanctity of being private enterprise. Rather, they are CRIMINAL enterprise inextricably intertwined with government thuggery, pillaging the wealth and freedom of the people. They can f*^&%$g burn to the ground as far as I am concerned.

[specsaregood]

The only thing odd is your idea that the thief who has just stolen your property, now justly belongs to the thief and any resulting committment to return, or at least hinder its use is met with derision and scorn not towards the thief, but to the persons or people who were stolen from!

Remember, property ownership must be justly acquired (either title transfer (gift), trade, or original appropriation (Homesteading)). Most of the property the banks hold is STOLEN GOODS. Why are you defending thiefs?

Correct me if I am wrong but don't you get a government paycheck?

[EndDaFed]

How appealing the 'Ron Paul Liberty Movement's' idea of "liberty" must look to the casual, interested observer just stumbling across this website for the first time....

So we should not stick to principle but to vanity for the sake of gaining a few travelers who are not like us? That does not make any sense. The result being undermining the very principles one holds.

[malkusm]

I agree with the principle. This is different from that principle. A DoS is non destructive. It is the equivalent of 1000 18 wheelers trying to drive down the same stretch of Interstate at the same time causing a traffic jam and your car is delayed in its journey. All perfectly within the law and no property rights are being violated.

Is it designed to send a message? You bet it is.

+rep for some sanity.

Is visiting a website now a crime? If no, then visiting a website 365463496834 times also should not be a crime.

[TonySutton]

A DDos is the same as a large group of people visiting a store at the same time and browsing without purchasing anything. They would fill up the parking lot with their vehicles, fill up the store with their bodies, distract employees with inquiries but without purchasing any items.

Should this be illegal also?

A store owner can ask you to leave their private property just as a website can block your IP. I do not see a problem with what Anonymous is currently doing.

[specsaregood]

+rep for some sanity.

Is visiting a website now a crime? If no, then visiting a website 365463496834 times also should not be a crime.

Thing is, in a DOS attack they don't usually visit the website. It usually has a spoofed origination IP, which makes making a connection impossible. So it isn't really a valid comparison.


A store owner can ask you to leave their private property just as a website can block your IP.
Not quite so easy when they are spoofing the origination ip.

[malkusm]

Thing is, in a DOS attack they don't usually visit the website. It usually has a spoofed origination IP, which makes making a connection impossible. So it isn't really a valid comparison.


Not quite so easy when they are spoofing the origination ip.

So it should be illegal to mask your IP, in other words? :confused:

[specsaregood]

So it should be illegal to mask your IP, in other words? :confused:

I'm not sure about illegal, it certainly is a weakness in the design of IP. All I'm saying is it is not valid to compare it to visiting a website. Because nobody actually visits the site and the intent is not to visit the site. It is nothing other than an attack on private property. It would be more akin to sitting out side your house in the bushes with a garage door opener and opening it over and over and over.

[lester1/2jr]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: don't fuck with wikileaks!

[ItsTime]

And when they decide to attack Ron Paul forums? Thats just fine and dandy?

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

And when they decide to attack Ron Paul forums? Thats just fine and dandy?

Considering that Ron Paul Forums is not an appendige of the Government, and does not rely on Government funding to run, then, I would say yes there is a definite problem. Is it that hard to distinguish just property from stolen property?

[pcosmar]

And when they decide to attack Ron Paul forums? Thats just fine and dandy?

And WHY would they do that? People do things for reasons.
Anonymous has said why they are doing what they do.
What part of it do you not understand?

YouTube - Anonymous to the Governments of the World - Web Censorship (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbqC8BnvVHQ&feature=player_embedded)

Text of the video.

Governments of the Industrial World, you weary giants of meat and mineral, we are from the Internet. The new home of social consciousness. On behalf of the future of this culture, I ask you of the obsolete past to leave us alone. You are not welcome among us. You have no sovereignty where we gather.

We have no elected government, nor are we ever likely to have one, so I address you with no greater authority than that with which liberty itself always speaks; anonymity. I declare the global social space we are building together to be naturally independent of the tyrannies and injustices you seek to impose on us. You have no moral right to rule us nor do you possess any real methods of enforcement we have true reason to fear.

Governments derive their judicial powers from the consent of the governed. You have neither solicited nor received ours. You have not engaged in our great and gathering conversation, nor did you create the wealth of our marketplaces. The rapid growth of government censorship of the Web has not escaped our notice. Cyberspace does not lie within your borders. Do not think that you can build it, as though it were a public construction project. You cannot. It is an act of nature and it grows itself through our collective actions.

You claim there are problems among us that you need to solve. You use this claim to further impose unjust restrictions on our civil freedoms and rights. We cannot allow this. We consider this your formal warning, that if you continue to impose unjust control on us, you will meet with disaster.

We are anonymous, we are legion,

We do not forgive, and we do not forget.

Expect us.

[Pericles]

And when they decide to attack Ron Paul forums? Thats just fine and dandy?

It is a risk associated with the architecture of the Internet. If enough of this stuff happens, certain networks will firewall themselves off from the rest of the NET and start inspecting packets to allow acceptable traffic in.

I have been tempted more than once to just block all of APNIC IP space for being a general PITA. Russia has been a good candidate as well.

[ItsTime]

Considering that Ron Paul Forums is not an appendige of the Government, and does not rely on Government funding to run, then, I would say yes there is a definite problem. Is it that hard to distinguish just property from stolen property?

Some people do not see it as stolen money. Some people see this forum as a threat. What makes you right and them not? (I agree with you)

DDos attacks are stupid, and really do nothing. This is just childish games.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Let me get this right...Mastercard is doing something these hackers don't like, so they're shutting down their websites (and trying to do so at others, and likely would cause more damage if they can)...and this website is cheering it on?

How libertarian is that? Attacking other people's property because you don't like what they're doing with it. Yep, that's real libertarian.

As far as I'm concerned it fits into my ideology, tit-for-tat, at least they're not fucking pacifist! I bet you're another one of those people who bitch about gun laws but would never think of using one.

[HOLLYWOOD]

so the new american war has begun War on The Internet!

America loves wars. This seems right down tyrannys aka US GOV aisle!!


the internet tubes will be shut down for freedom and liberty thanks to the us gov! sarcasm but odds are our failed gov will follow thru on my sarcasm!

here yah go: FOX NEWS / NEWSCORP is calling it, Cyber Terrorism

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Some people do not see it as stolen money. Some people see this forum as a threat. What makes you right and them not? (I agree with you)

DDos attacks are stupid, and really do nothing. This is just childish games.

No, it's actually a display of power. If they kept it up long enough, this will take away business such as online banking. You know nothing about war strategy: pick the battles you can win. I don't see you standing up with your guns to stop tyranny so maybe you should stop complaining.

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

Some people do not see it as stolen money. Some people see this forum as a threat. What makes you right and them not? (I agree with you)

DDos attacks are stupid, and really do nothing. This is just childish games.

And some people may not see 2+2=4, or will challenge the fact that I was born in 1980 (False date, but assume it was right). Opinions are irrelevant when it comes to facts. The fact is these banks are the direct beneficiery and recipient of massive amounts of stolen money printed by the FED, and given a monopoly by the Government. I would certainly not be one to defend the East India Trading Company when the Sons of Liberty dumped tea into the harbors. The property of the EITC was illegitimate, stolen, and belonging not to them. Therefore, it cannot be said to be an imposition and aggression upon the owner for he owns not that property.

If you fail to distinguish just property from property (possession), then you have no adequate means of having any coherent working system, or philosophy. Theft would not be recognized. Surely, you will agree that the person who has....taken your 20$, does not own the 20$, right?

This is pretty clear cut to me.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

And when they decide to attack Ron Paul forums? Thats just fine and dandy?

You're a threat to nobody, get over yourself.

[ItsTime]

No, it's actually a display of power. If they kept it up long enough, this will take away business such as online banking. You know nothing about war strategy: pick the battles you can win. I don't see you standing up with your guns to stop tyranny so maybe you should stop complaining.

ddos attack is not a show of power it is the exact opposite. ddos attacks are kiddie games. You do not know what I do know and what I do not know.

[pcosmar]

here yah go: FOX NEWS / NEWSCORP is calling it, Cyber Terrorism

Well of course they are.

But they have called us terrorists before. This is nothing new.

I AM Not ANONYMOUS.
I am known, My name is here. I am public.
Anonymous speaks for me.

Faux Snooze does not.

:mad:

This is just one front in a much larger war.

[ItsTime]

You're a threat to nobody, get over yourself.

wtf are you talking about?

[Pericles]

here yah go: FOX NEWS / NEWSCORP is calling it, Cyber Terrorism

A real cyber terrorist would go after links between the US and India to hit companies that outsource functions there.

A real cyber terrorist would be conducting attacks that lead to buffer overruns in anybody they targeted running a MS system.

A real cyber terrorist will impose costs on companies much greater than many of those companies think they have exposed to technology.

FOX NEWS hasn't seen anything yet.

[ItsTime]

A real cyber terrorist would go after links between the US and India to hit companies that outsource functions there.

A real cyber terrorist would be conducting attacks that lead to buffer overruns in anybody they targeted running a MS system.

A real cyber terrorist will impose costs on companies much greater than many of those companies think they have exposed to technology.

FOX NEWS hasn't seen anything yet.

Exactly, this is kiddie games compared to what could really happen. It is like Palistilian kids chucking rocks at tanks, it slows them down for a bit but then they run them right over.

In this case we will see a move to net neutrality faster, the fcc controlling the internet faster and other unintended consequences. For an act that really did nothing in the long run.

[pcosmar]

Exactly, this is kiddie games compared to what could really happen. It is like Palistilian kids chucking rocks at tanks, it slows them down for a bit but then they run them right over.

In this case we will see a move to net neutrality faster, the fcc controlling the internet faster and other unintended consequences. For an act that really did nothing in the long run.

Well you are quite full of negativity towards those actively doing something.

You have a better suggestion? Lets hear it.

The only ones I have cannot be posted., nor spoken of openly. (not kiddie games)

:mad:

[malkusm]

I think a DDoS is more akin to a mass boycott/protest outside of a physical store. Does it make shopping at the store very uncomfortable, and potentially drive away business? Sure. But as long as the protesters are not completely denying service to customers who would come in anyway, then it's not an act of aggression. Similarly, it's not like the MasterCard in my wallet can't conduct transactions because the website is down.

[aravoth]

Still looks like it's down 3 hours later.

Shit's gettin' real.
:)


http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c370/aravoth/15czo2f.gif

[ItsTime]

Well you are quite full of negativity towards those actively doing something.

You have a better suggestion? Lets hear it.

The only ones I have cannot be posted., nor spoken of openly.

:mad:

Lets not confuse my hesitation about doing this with me not wanting to do something. Im with you brother.

Just sitting back looking at this and will this do anything besides nudge us towards more government control? Could the ones carrying out the ddos actually be government officials/working on government orders?

1) Easy attack done
2) No real damage done
3) No objective met
4) TV Talking heads try to stir pot
5) Power hungry big government progressives running the policy making

:mad:

[pcosmar]

Lets not confuse my hesitation about doing this with me not wanting to do something. Im with you brother.

Just sitting back looking at this and will this do anything besides nudge us towards more government control? Could the ones carrying out the ddos actually be government officials/working on government orders?

1) Easy attack done
2) No real damage done
3) No objective met
4) TV Talking heads try to stir pot
5) Power hungry big government progressives running the policy making

:mad:

More Government is a Given. Regardless. The plans and intent were evident long,long before this.
This is mostly harmless. (non-violent) resistance and response.
It does send a message, a warning to TPTB. And it can escalate.

It would be nice if those in power would listen to the voices raised in anger before this gets bloody. But I doubt it.

:(

[aravoth]

why is it that so many libertarians these days support corporations as nothing more than "a normal" business? A corporation can not even exist without the government sanctioning them, how much money do you think mastercard has spent buying politicians and forcing lobbyist authored legilation down our collective throats?

Besides, Mastercard is a shithole company that colluded with Interpol which resulted in the seizure of other peoples private property for doing nothing more than offering cheap perscription drugs. Fuck that company.

Thank you Anonymous.


http://www.empresaexterior.us/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=34107%3Amastercard-partners-with-interpol-initiative-to-prevent-the-illegal-sale-of-prescription-drugs-and-medication-online&catid=205%3Anews&Itemid=371&lang=en

Purchase, NY, October 15, 2010 - MasterCard Worldwide recently partnered with Interpol to support the global police organization's efforts to prevent websites from supplying illegal and counterfeit prescription drugs and medicines to consumers. Named "Operation Pangea III," the week-long effort covered 45 participating countries and resulted in 76 arrests to date. Additionally, 290 websites have been shut down and nearly 11,000 packages of contraband have been seized or detained.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Lets not confuse my hesitation about doing this with me not wanting to do something. Im with you brother.

Just sitting back looking at this and will this do anything besides nudge us towards more government control? Could the ones carrying out the ddos actually be government officials/working on government orders?

1) Easy attack done
2) No real damage done
3) No objective met
4) TV Talking heads try to stir pot
5) Power hungry big government progressives running the policy making

:mad:

hmmmm, so you don't have any better ideas? Just more whining. Attacking online banking is a huge disruption, stop minimizing it. You sound like a truther who thinks the US gov needed 9/11 to take away our freedom and go to war. I have news for you, they don't need this to filter the internet. They already are fucking filtering the internet!! Where have you been for the past decade???

[crazyfacedjenkins]

why is it that so many libertarians these days support corporations as nothing more than "a normal" business? A corporation can not even exist without the government sanctioning them, how much money do you think mastercard has spent buying politicians and forcing lobbyist authored legilation down our collective throats?

Besides, Mastercard is a shithole company that colluded with Interpol which resulted in the seizure of other peoples private property for doing nothing more than offering cheap perscription drugs. Fuck that company.

Thank you Anonymous.

Exactly, it's fucking shameless. These people act like the government helps big business out of the goodness of their own hearts. Get a grip people, the corporations are the ones who pay off these scum bag politicians, not the other way around.

[ItsTime]

hmmmm, so you don't have any better ideas? Just more whining. Attacking online banking is a huge disruption, stop minimizing it. You sound like a truther who thinks the US gov needed 9/11 to take away our freedom and go to war. I have news for you, they don't need this to filter the internet. They already are fucking filtering the internet!! Where have you been for the past decade???

What are you ideas? Care to share what illegal activity you have planned on a public message board? :rolleyes:

I personally have no illegal activity planned. Ive been working in the system to change it. What have YOU done?

[Mach]

Still down. :D

www.mastercard.com/

[EvilEngineer]

Yawn... ddos are childish. If they really wanted an impact they would have figured out that servers mean nothing... storage means everything. In big data centers most servers pull their data from a SAN (Storage Area Network) or NAS (Network Attached Storage) which are completely separate machines with their own security (vendor specific). These are the weak spots... disrupting these requires outside support and takes hours or days to fix. Not to mention the security on them is a joke compared to a hardened server.

[reduen]

And WHY would they do that? People do things for reasons.
Anonymous has said why they are doing what they do.
What part of it do you not understand?

YouTube - Anonymous to the Governments of the World - Web Censorship (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbqC8BnvVHQ&feature=player_embedded)

Text of the video.

If these folks could live up to their threat it would be scary..... Nice video though! :)

[ItsTime]

Yawn... ddos are childish. If they really wanted an impact they would have figured out that servers mean nothing... storage means everything. In big data centers most servers pull their data from a SAN (Storage Area Network) or NAS (Network Attached Storage) which are completely separate machines with their own security (vendor specific). These are the weak spots... disrupting these requires outside support and takes hours or days to fix. Not to mention the security on them is a joke compared to a hardened server.

:eek:;)

[pcosmar]

What are you ideas? Care to share what illegal activity you have planned on a public message board? :rolleyes:

I personally have no illegal activity planned. Ive been working in the system to change it. What have YOU done?

What I have done has been both legal and ineffective.

Thus I am open to alternatives.
I welcome these activists that are taking a more direct action.
Though effectiveness is yet to be seen.
Can't be worse that what we have at present.

and another thought,
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=271899

:cool:

[ItsTime]

What I have done has been both legal and ineffective.

Thus I am open to alternatives.
I welcome these activists that are taking a more direct action.
Though effectiveness is yet to be seen.
Can't be worse that what we have at present.

and another thought,
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=271899

:cool:

I know youve done your part, not questioning you :cool:

[Philhelm]

What I have done has been both legal and ineffective.

Thus I am open to alternatives.
I welcome these activists that are taking a more direct action.
Though effectiveness is yet to be seen.
Can't be worse that what we have at present.

and another thought,
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=271899

:cool:

But then, when the rule of law in the U.S. has been undermined by the lawmakers, how do we truly define lawful activity?

[reduen]

Yawn... ddos are childish. If they really wanted an impact they would have figured out that servers mean nothing... storage means everything. In big data centers most servers pull their data from a SAN (Storage Area Network) or NAS (Network Attached Storage) which are completely separate machines with their own security (vendor specific). These are the weak spots... disrupting these requires outside support and takes hours or days to fix. Not to mention the security on them is a joke compared to a hardened server.

I just have to tell you that I just love your avatar. It is weird because I know I shouldn't but I just can't help it.... :cool:

[pcosmar]

But then, when the rule of law in the U.S. has been undermined by the lawmakers, how do we truly define lawful activity?
With all the questions floating around, At least this on has an answer.
Penned by wise men long ago.

--That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
:cool:

[Acala]

why is it that so many libertarians these days support corporations as nothing more than "a normal" business? A corporation can not even exist without the government sanctioning them, how much money do you think mastercard has spent buying politicians and forcing lobbyist authored legilation down our collective throats?

Besides, Mastercard is a shithole company that colluded with Interpol which resulted in the seizure of other peoples private property for doing nothing more than offering cheap perscription drugs. Fuck that company.

Thank you Anonymous.

^this

[reduen]

What I have done has been both legal and ineffective.

Thus I am open to alternatives.
I welcome these activists that are taking a more direct action.
Though effectiveness is yet to be seen.
Can't be worse that what we have at present.

and another thought,
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=271899

:cool:

I am just about there myself my man.....

[tremendoustie]

Let me get this right...Mastercard is doing something these hackers don't like, so they're shutting down their websites (and trying to do so at others, and likely would cause more damage if they can)...and this website is cheering it on?

How libertarian is that? Attacking other people's property because you don't like what they're doing with it. Yep, that's real libertarian.

I agree. A boycott is an appropriate response in this type of circumstance -- hacking is force, and should only be used for defense against force.

On the other hand, you can come up with an example of how just about any company these days has used agressive force ... especially any banking related company.

[RideTheDirt]

I agree. A boycott is an appropriate response in this type of circumstance -- hacking is force, and should only be used for defense against force.

On the other hand, you can come up with an example of how just about any company these days has used agressive force ... especially any banking related company.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showpost.php?p=3019797&postcount=56

I think a DDoS is more akin to a mass boycott/protest outside of a physical store. Does it make shopping at the store very uncomfortable, and potentially drive away business? Sure. But as long as the protesters are not completely denying service to customers who would come in anyway, then it's not an act of aggression. Similarly, it's not like the MasterCard in my wallet can't conduct transactions because the website is down.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

What are you ideas? Care to share what illegal activity you have planned on a public message board? :rolleyes:

I personally have no illegal activity planned. Ive been working in the system to change it. What have YOU done?

And we can see how effective you've been, great job tyranny is winning.

Standing down and being a good little boy who likes to get dominated while his balls are crushed accomplishes NOTHING. I've donated to numerous freedom candidates including Ron, went door-to-door canvassing for Ron over the course of several months all in vain. Democracy doesn't work, if it did they would shut down the polls.

[Vessol]

And we can see how effective you've been, great job tyranny is winning.

Standing down and being a good little boy who likes to get dominated while his balls are crushed accomplishes NOTHING. I've donated to numerous freedom candidates including Ron, went door-to-door canvassing for Ron over the course of several months all in vain. Democracy doesn't work, if it did they would shut down the polls.

QFT.

Education. Educate and live by example for those around you.

[tremendoustie]

I think a DDoS is more akin to a mass boycott/protest outside of a physical store.

The question is, who owns the area where the protest is occurring?

In this case, the store. The equivalent in this analogy would be to clone yourself thousands of times, then block the entrance to the store, so that nobody else can enter.

That would definitely be force.



Does it make shopping at the store very uncomfortable, and potentially drive away business? Sure. But as long as the protesters are not completely denying service to customers who would come in anyway, then it's not an act of aggression.


No, the key question is whether they are using private property against the will of the owner.



Similarly, it's not like the MasterCard in my wallet can't conduct transactions because the website is down.

No, but that's a different part of their business. If I block the entrances to best buy, that doesn't become non-forceful simply because their website is still up.


DOS attacks are definitely force. I think it's a stretch to say its defensive, in this case. If the DOS attack were occurring in response to a bailout, that might be a different story.

[armstrong]

QFT.

Education. Educate and live by example for those around you.

true as that may be ----Apathy is rampant---- and we know the reason for that. there is a line in the sand, with which seems nearly impossible to cross, for those who control the other side have way to much power and are very greedy.

[UtahApocalypse]

I think a DDoS is more akin to a mass boycott/protest outside of a physical store. Does it make shopping at the store very uncomfortable, and potentially drive away business? Sure. But as long as the protesters are not completely denying service to customers who would come in anyway, then it's not an act of aggression. Similarly, it's not like the MasterCard in my wallet can't conduct transactions because the website is down.

MasterCard has now reported (according to UK Guardian Newspaper.) that indeed its SecureCode processing server has also now been affected making Master cards almost impossible to use.

One thing though that needs clarification, here and for sure in the media:

DDoS is NOT hacking!!

As a matter of fact; Fox news, CNN, MSNBC, and the thousands of bloggers that are trying to "reach" mastercard.com are PART of the ongoing attack. All DDos does is overflows a given server with waaaayyy too much data for it to process at a time. Was RPF "hacked" on MoneyBomb days that caused the page to become slow or unresponsive? NO. Anyone calling these DDoS "attacks" as hacking has no clue of what they are talking about.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

For all you submissive, masochist boot-lickers, who get off by having corporate America clamp your nuts in a vice while making you eat your own shit: do you sleep easy at night knowing that all your precious "choices" folded like lawn chairs? Visa, Mastercard, Paypal, Amazon, etc. where's your free market of choices to come and save the day?

[aravoth]

I can't believe some of the shit I'm reading.

Corporations are not average businesses, as the require a government mandate to exist. A mandate, which exempts them from the same restrictions applied to smaller entities.

As to anonymous intitating force against a private property owner, so what?
You know who else was a private property owner? King Gerorge III. Am I advocating violence against private property holders in general? Hell no, but coporations are not exactly "mamma joe's donuts".

As I pointed out in a previous post, Mastercard has colluded with government institutions in order to DEPRIVE people like you and me of thier own private property. And you think that standing out in front of an office building with a sign in your hand is going to stop them from doing that?

Get your fucking permit so you can walk down the street holding a sign. Be sure to stay in your free speech zone while your at it. Hopefully a private corporation contracted by the government doesn't send in a security force to crack your head open, while congress is passing more and more legislation that fucks you over.

The government loves controlled protests.

God damn window lickers

[crazyfacedjenkins]

I can't believe some of the shit I'm reading.

Corporations are not average businesses, as the require a government mandate to exist. A mandate, which exempts them from the same restrictions applied to smaller entities.

As to anonymous intitating force against a private property owner, so what?
You know who else was a private property owner? King Gerorge III. Am I advocating violence against private property holders in general? Hell no, but coporations are not exactly "mamma joe's donuts".

As I pointed out in a previous post, Mastercard has colluded with government institutions in order to DEPRIVE people like you and me of thier own private property. And you think that standing out in front of an office building with a sign in your hand is going to stop them from doing that?

Get your fucking permit so you can walk down the street holding a sign. Be sure to stay in your free speech zone while your at it. Hopefully a private corporation contrcted by the government doesn't send in a security force to crack your head open, while congress is passing more and more legislation that fucks you over.

The government loves controlled protests.

God damn window lickers

HAHAHA!! Exactly.

[Todd]

I don't support this cyber attack. But I can't help but smile when I think that the same methods of deceptive behavior befall an organization that uses coercion when it's convenient.

[FunkBuddha]

Mastercard.com is still down. It's been down for what, 8 hours now?

[RCA]

can't say they weren't warned.



hells yeah!!!

video has been disabled on YouTube.

[reduen]

I don't support this cyber attack. But I can't help but smile when I think that the same methods of deceptive behavior befall an organization that uses coercion when it's convenient.

+1

[tremendoustie]

MasterCard has now reported (according to UK Guardian Newspaper.) that indeed its SecureCode processing server has also now been affected making Master cards almost impossible to use.


Hehe .. well, I'm definitely shedding no tears for them.



One thing though that needs clarification, here and for sure in the media:

DDoS is NOT hacking!!

As a matter of fact; Fox news, CNN, MSNBC, and the thousands of bloggers that are trying to "reach" mastercard.com are PART of the ongoing attack. All DDos does is overflows a given server with waaaayyy too much data for it to process at a time. Was RPF "hacked" on MoneyBomb days that caused the page to become slow or unresponsive? NO. Anyone calling these DDoS "attacks" as hacking has no clue of what they are talking about.

Is shopping at a store a violating of property rights? No. Is filling the store with a crowd of clones so nobody else can shop there an infringement of property rights? Yes.

Now, those who point out that mastercard has violated private property rights in the past are correct. That's the angle that's a potentially legitimate justification. The question is whether they've been aggressive to the point where their property could reasonably considered stolen.

[tremendoustie]

I don't support this cyber attack. But I can't help but smile when I think that the same methods of deceptive behavior befall an organization that uses coercion when it's convenient.

That's more or less how I feel.

[puppetmaster]

I don't support this cyber attack. But I can't help but smile when I think that the same methods of deceptive behavior befall an organization that uses coercion when it's convenient.


I do...guess I am becoming more anarchist everyday...FU bankers

[specsaregood]

DDoS is NOT hacking!!

As a matter of fact; Fox news, CNN, MSNBC, and the thousands of bloggers that are trying to "reach" mastercard.com are PART of the ongoing attack. All DDos does is overflows a given server with waaaayyy too much data for it to process at a time. Was RPF "hacked" on MoneyBomb days that caused the page to become slow or unresponsive? NO. Anyone calling these DDoS "attacks" as hacking has no clue of what they are talking about.

Not quite. They spoof the origination IP in a DDOS attack. So the server gets the request then hangs trying to open the connection to the wrong IP. This is why they are so effective, because it creates thousands of bogus requests. The server ends up spending its time responding to invalid requests that it can't answer valid ones. And since the origination IP is invalid there is no return traffic overload on the source system, so it can send out even more outbound traffic. It isn't "hacking", but it is nowhere near the same as regular web traffic.

[dannno]

Let me get this right...Mastercard is doing something these hackers don't like, so they're shutting down their websites (and trying to do so at others, and likely would cause more damage if they can)...and this website is cheering it on?

How libertarian is that? Attacking other people's property because you don't like what they're doing with it. Yep, that's real libertarian.

Actually the government pressured Mastercard to take those actions, so this is all very libertarian.

[FunkBuddha]

If I remember correctly, Anon_Operaation had roughly 4500 followers on Twitter yesterday afternoon. Now they have over 12,000. I wonder how many of those are participating in the DDOS?

[dannno]

Some people do not see it as stolen money. Some people see this forum as a threat. What makes you right and them not? (I agree with you)


Money As Debt (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2550156453790090544)

[dizi24]

Actually the government pressured Mastercard to take those actions, so this is all very libertarian.

???

So if your local government pressured your neighbor to do something, you'd be justified in taking action against your neighbors property? How does that make sense at all? Because the government is involved in someway, it automatically becomes libertarian to interfere with their property and business?

I could at least understand the logic behind the excitement if they hacked the government representative's website who pressured Mastercard to block wikileak donations. Still, the whole hacking thing is pretty immature.

[aravoth]

???

So if your local government pressured your neighbor to do something, you'd be justified in taking action against your neighbors property? How does that make sense at all? Because the government is involved in someway, it automatically becomes libertarian to interfere with their property and business?

I could at least understand the logic behind the excitement if they hacked the government representative's website who pressured Mastercard to block wikileak donations. Still, the whole hacking thing is pretty immature.

The only thing that is immature is an insane belief that boycotts will do a god damn thing, the belief that if you just tell the nice government protected corporation how you feel it will all get better.

This isn't fucking recess.

[dizi24]

The only thing that is immature is an insane belief that boycotts will do a god damn thing, the belief that if you just tell the nice government protected corporation how you feel it will all get better.

This isn't fucking recess.

Nice straw man.

[aravoth]

Nice straw man.

Staw man?

What good has any protest ever done?

We protested both wars, and still we fight.

We protested the patriot act, and they still spy on us.

We protest airport screenings, and they expand to railroads.

We protest taxes, and they increase them.

We protest inflationary practices, and they increase the money supply.

They use corporate infrastructure to expand thier power, and people in this movement stupidly believe that somehow, these "companies" are the fucking good guy?

Straw man my ass.

When would be a good time for you to start doing something other than bitching?

[JVParkour]

It is good to see you fired up Aravoth. And for good reason. Right on, man.

[jmdrake]

MasterCard is a private business that made a business decision that they had every right under the sun to make.

How distinctly unlibertarian to suggest that because a private party made a decision others don't like, that gives some people the right to vandalize their property.

I guess these guys were unlibertarian too. :rolleyes:

http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/2005_winter_spring/images/teaparty4.jpg

This isn't a libertarian movement. It's a liberty movement. I neither affirm nor disparage the actions of these hackers. But to run around talking about "tea party this" and "tea party that" while attacking what the tea party was (vandalism of private property in the name of liberty) is rather strange.

[amy31416]

If a sit-in/sign-waving/protest at a local restaurant that refused to serve blacks is legitimate (it disrupts their business, is not illegal, etc.), and is considered legitimate free-market way to bring attention to the wrongs that a business does--why is the DDOS attack wrong?

Of course, the restaurant can kick them out as they wish, and MC/Visa/Paypal,etc can start blocking IP's, but awareness has been raised--and the company can change and meet market demands, or hide under their beloved gov'ts skirts--which seems quite likely. Just as those restaurants/businesses probably relied on the cops to crack the skulls of the protesters.

[torchbearer]

mastercard is only trying to protect the source of its special favors.

[Todd]

???

So if your local government pressured your neighbor to do something, you'd be justified in taking action against your neighbors property? How does that make sense at all? Because the government is involved in someway, it automatically becomes libertarian to interfere with their property and business?

I could at least understand the logic behind the excitement if they hacked the government representative's website who pressured Mastercard to block wikileak donations. Still, the whole hacking thing is pretty immature.

If I follow the logic. It appears that if the said property is not derived through the truly "free market" by moral and legal means and is acquired by government/ private collusion, then it is not your neighbor's legitimate property.

Therefore the action taken against it is not anti libertarian.

At least that's the logic I see being used.



I guess these guys were unlibertarian too. :rolleyes:

http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/2005_winter_spring/images/teaparty4.jpg



That's a good representation of the logic.

[dizi24]

Staw man?

What good has any protest ever done?

We protested both wars, and still we fight.

We protested the patriot act, and they still spy on us.

We protest airport screenings, and they expand to railroads.

We protest taxes, and they increase them.

We protest inflationary practices, and they increase the money supply.

They use corporate infrastructure to expand thier power, and people in this movement stupidly believe that somehow, these "companies" are the fucking good guy?

Straw man my ass.

When would be a good time for you to start doing something other than bitching?

Do you even understand what a straw man is? Judging by the way you responded, by attempting to prove that "boycotts" and protests aren't working, I'm not sure you do.

[puppetmaster]

Staw man?

What good has any protest ever done?

We protested both wars, and still we fight.

We protested the patriot act, and they still spy on us.

We protest airport screenings, and they expand to railroads.

We protest taxes, and they increase them.

We protest inflationary practices, and they increase the money supply.

They use corporate infrastructure to expand thier power, and people in this movement stupidly believe that somehow, these "companies" are the fucking good guy?

Straw man my ass.

When would be a good time for you to start doing something other than bitching?
Aw c'man.....don't ruin this guys dream.....peaceful protests work he says......
:eek:

[FunkBuddha]

Sourceforge reports 5,670 weekly downloads of LOIC (low orbit ion cannon)

http://sourceforge.net/search/?q=low+orbit+ion+cannon

[dizi24]

Aw c'man.....don't ruin this guys dream.....peaceful protests work he says......
:eek:

Good lord.

[pcosmar]

Sourceforge reports 5,670 weekly downloads of LOIC (low orbit ion cannon)

http://sourceforge.net/search/?q=low+orbit+ion+cannon

Cut it. And it grows.

They shut down the Wikileaks site. Now there are over a Thousand Wikileaks sites.

And they are flirting with the Nuclear Option. (Insurance File).

Hold that Key guys. More troops are arriving.

:cool:

[HOLLYWOOD]

More on the Fascist-Corporatist partnership of Money and the US government.

http://wikileaks.ch/articles/2010/Test,32.html

United States - Visa and Mastercard beneficiaries of State Department lobbying effort
WikiLeaks Staff, 8 December 2010, 14.00 GMT
More articles ...
- U. S. Empire Secret Shopping List (http://wikileaks.ch/articles/2010/U-S-Empire-Shopping-List.html)


Visa and Mastercard both received lobbying support from the Department of State under President Obama, the latest Cablegate release reveals.
A cable from the Moscow embassy, dated 1st February 2010, details a new Russian card processing law which the embassy said would “disadvantage U.S businesses”, and urged senior US officials to take action. (click here (http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/cable/2010/02/10MOSCOW228.html)).


“This draft law continues to disadvantage U.S. payment card market leaders Visa and MasterCard, whether they join the National Payment Card System or not,” it said.
Russia was considering whether to implement a new system of card payments (called NPCS), which would create a new payment processor run by Russia’s state banks. This would then handle all processing for domestic banking in the country.


“The fees for these services are estimated at Rb 120 billion ($4 billion) annually...the vast majority of Visa’s business in Russia is done with cards issued and used in Russia; with earnings from processing going to NPCS, Visa would no longer profit from these transactions.”
When discussing possible causes of the restrictive legislation, a senior Visa employee in the country told embassy officials he believed the move was due to Russian suspicions that Visa and Mastercard passed information to the US government.
“[Redacted] believes that, at least at the Deputy Minister level, MinFin’s hands are tied. Implying that Russian security services were behind this decision, [redacted] said, ‘There is some se-cret (government) order that no one has seen, but everyone has to abide by it." “As described reftel, credit card company and bank representatives have told us that GOR (government of Russia) officials apparently assume that US payment systems routinely share data associated with payment transactions by Russian cardholders with intelligence services in the US and elsewhere.”


The embassy’s economic officer, Matthias Mitman, concluded his cable by calling for action.
“While the draft legislation has yet to be submitted to the Duma and can still be amended, post will continue to raise our concerns with senior GOR officials,” he said.
“We recommend that senior USG officials also take advantage of meetings with their Russian counterparts, including through the Bilateral Presidential Commission, to press the GOR to change the draft text to ensure U.S. payment companies are not adversely affected.”

[Acala]

Corporate America in bed with the government is an enemy of liberty. They are crushing us under a brutal, corrupt corporate/fascist global oligarchy. And I don't like them because of it.

I use Visa, Mastercard, Paypal, and Amazon. But if the Cybervigilantes burned them all to the scorched black earth I would laugh until I pissed my pants and then I would dance naked in the street for joy.

Private property is a DEAD concept in this country. Once we bring it back to life, then we can talk about it. Until then burn, baby, burn.

[FunkBuddha]

Cut it. And it grows.

They shut down the Wikileaks site. Now there are over a Thousand Wikileaks sites.

And they are flirting with the Nuclear Option. (Insurance File).

Hold that Key guys. More troops are arriving.

:cool:

What a great time to be alive, eh?

[PermanentSleep]

When would be a good time for you to start doing something other than bitching?

Right on!

[jclay2]

HAHAHAH, still down.

[amy31416]

YouTube - Hackers Take Down Matercard Website As Revenge For Julian Assange Arrest (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIp7IA6OkPc&feature=sub)

[tremendoustie]

Cut it. And it grows.

They shut down the Wikileaks site. Now there are over a Thousand Wikileaks sites.

And they are flirting with the Nuclear Option. (Insurance File).

Hold that Key guys. More troops are arriving.

:cool:

It is nice to see :D

[Pericles]

I guess these guys were unlibertarian too. :rolleyes:

http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/2005_winter_spring/images/teaparty4.jpg

This isn't a libertarian movement. It's a liberty movement. I neither affirm nor disparage the actions of these hackers. But to run around talking about "tea party this" and "tea party that" while attacking what the tea party was (vandalism of private property in the name of liberty) is rather strange.

I hear you. How rude of those patriots to destroy the private property of the East India Trade Co. just because they were the sole authorized importer of tea, and sold it at the government approved price and collected the tax on that article for the benefit of the government that granted them the monopoly.;)

[Agorism]

whats the link to the mastercard site that's down?

[FunkBuddha]

whats the link to the mastercard site that's down?

http://www.mastercard.com/

[tremendoustie]

I hear you. How rude of those patriots to destroy the private property of the East India Trade Co. just because they were the sole authorized importer of tea, and sold it at the government approved price and collected the tax on that article for the benefit of the government that granted them the monopoly.;)

And that's the crux of the issue. For all practical purposes, the East India Trade company was a wing of the government, and continuously used aggressive coercion as their business model.

Does mastercard meet that criteria? That's the question. I certainly don't think they meet it to the extent the EITC did.

[HOLLYWOOD]

whats the link to the mastercard site that's down?
Welcome to MasterCard Worldwide (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CC8QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mastercard.com%2F&rct=j&q=master%20card&ei=wtX_TI3HFoH0swOiltCvCw&usg=AFQjCNF8Ongb1tjmOVOVawQaCNEOgfj00Q)

MasterCard Worldwide manages a family of well-known, widely accepted payment cards brands including MasterCard , Maestro and Cirrus and serves financial ... Show stock quote for MA (http://www.google.com/#)


[/URL]www.mastercard.com/ (http://www.mastercard.com/)


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The connection has timed out


The server at [url]www.mastercard.com (http://www.mastercard.com) is taking too long to respond.

# The site could be temporarily unavailable or too busy. Try again in a few
moments.

# If you are unable to load any pages, check your computer's network
connection.

# If your computer or network is protected by a firewall or proxy, make sure
that Firefox is permitted to access the Web.
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

[Pericles]

http://www.mastercard.com/ (http://www.mastercard.com/)

I can't seem to get to it. Is there an alternate link?:D

[FunkBuddha]

I can't seem to get to it. Is there an alternate link?:D

Just keep clicking refresh til it loads.

[Agorism]

http://rlv.zcache.com/free_julian_assange_tshirt-p235260091196391479q6iv_152.jpg

[chudrockz]

Still doesn't work. Though I honeslty don't even know what one DOES on mastercard.com . Can't say I've ever been to the site before (trying) today.

[jmdrake]

Hehe .. well, I'm definitely shedding no tears for them.



Is shopping at a store a violating of property rights? No. Is filling the store with a crowd of clones so nobody else can shop there an infringement of property rights? Yes.


Only if you don't leave if the property owner tells you to. Anyway I could care less about this "are we being libertarian" stuff. This ain't a libertarian movement. Libertarians are certainly welcome though.

[JVParkour]

I would guess that you can't access your online banking through mastercard.com. Not sure, but seems like it makes sense.

[jmdrake]

And that's the crux of the issue. For all practical purposes, the East India Trade company was a wing of the government, and continuously used aggressive coercion as their business model.

Does mastercard meet that criteria? That's the question. I certainly don't think they meet it to the extent the EITC did.

I disagree. If Mastercard and Visa have joined in an economic boycott of a private individual for exercising his first amendment rights they have become worse than the EITC.

[RideTheDirt]

http://soundcloud.com/lazorshark84/mastercard-prank-call/s-eBHAZ#play

lolz

[Agorism]

YouTube - Anonymous, Wikileaks, Scientology, and Me (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaRXsy6cszM)

[Agorism]

If any of you want to know there i a channel called /b/ in 4chan where they organize. It's kind of a cesspool though so caution is advised.

[tremendoustie]

I disagree. If Mastercard and Visa have joined in an economic boycott of a private individual for exercising his first amendment rights they have become worse than the EITC.

No. That is COMPLETELY false. A person or business owner has a right to boycott whomever they want for whatever reason they want. We don't own their property, and have no right to force them to do business with people we like.

It's instances of aggressive government force on behalf of Mastercard and Visa that would make them like the EITC -- forced monopoly, taxpayer funding, etc.

[dannno]

???

So if your local government pressured your neighbor to do something, you'd be justified in taking action against your neighbors property? How does that make sense at all? Because the government is involved in someway, it automatically becomes libertarian to interfere with their property and business?

I could at least understand the logic behind the excitement if they hacked the government representative's website who pressured Mastercard to block wikileak donations. Still, the whole hacking thing is pretty immature.

Hah, no, they are much more intertwined with the government than my neighbor. Sorry if I don't feel sorry for the banking establishment that steals all of our shit.

[dannno]

No. That is COMPLETELY false. A person or business owner has a right to boycott whomever they want for whatever reason they want. We don't own their property, and have no right to force them to do business with people we like.

It's instances of aggressive government force on behalf of Mastercard and Visa that would make them like the EITC -- forced monopoly, taxpayer funding, etc.

I think he's just adding that into the equation, like I was with my statement earlier in the thread that got attacked.

The banks rule our government, but they have a private aura to them.

[FunkBuddha]

If any of you want to know there i a channel called /b/ in 4chan where they organize. It's kind of a cesspool though so caution is advised.

There's also an irc server here: irc.anonops.net

It's probably got spooks and G-men all over it, though.

[tremendoustie]

I think he's just adding that into the equation, like I was with my statement earlier in the thread that got attacked.

The banks rule our government, but they have a private aura to them.

I agree. Point of information: Are visa and mastercard like banks, in that they get money from the Fed, bailouts, favorable regulations, etc -- or do they simply loan money at interest?

[amy31416]

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9200521/MasterCard_others_hit_by_DDoS_attacks_over_WikiLea ks?taxonomyId=82


Computerworld - The main Web site of MasterCard was knocked offline today in a large distributed denial of service (DDoS) attack apparently launched in retaliation for the credit card company's decision this week to cut off services to WikiLeaks.

Similar, much smaller attacks have also been detected against numerous other sites, including those belonging to U.S. Sen. Joseph Lieberman (I-Conn.) and former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, according to security researcher Sean-Paul Correll of PandaLabs. Correll has been maintaining a frequently updated blog on the unfolding attacks.

(cont'd at link)

Looks like they need more soldiers....

[Pericles]

No. That is COMPLETELY false. A person or business owner has a right to boycott whomever they want for whatever reason they want. We don't own their property, and have no right to force them to do business with people we like.

It's instances of aggressive government force on behalf of Mastercard and Visa that would make them like the EITC -- forced monopoly, taxpayer funding, etc.

Which brings us to the point of corporations and their charters. Such charters should limit the corporation to owning property and executing contracts. Filtering money to politicians and political parties is not a legitimate form of business activity. It leads to attempts to limit the actions of competitors by using government to write laws to the benefit of the corporation. And corporations can't vote either ............

[Acala]

I agree. Point of information: Are visa and mastercard like banks, in that they get money from the Fed, bailouts, favorable regulations, etc -- or do they simply loan money at interest?

I don't know the answer to this question, but they are getting the money from somewhere and it isn't from savings. So I think they must be loaning money they don't have thereby profiting from special privileges to expand the money supply at interest.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Some of you people are fucking pitiful. We could be in the middle of the trenches and you would start questioning whether it was "libertarian enough" to use your 2nd amendment right. I'm starting to think this place has been infiltrated by shills. Whoever is sticking up for MasterCard really should consider getting off their payroll and checking yourself into a psychiatric ward.

[tremendoustie]

Some of you people are fucking pitiful. We could be in the middle of the trenches and you would start questioning whether it was "libertarian enough" to use your 2nd amendment right. I'm starting to think this place has been infiltrated by shills. Whoever is sticking up for MasterCard really should consider getting off their payroll and checking yourself into a psychiatric ward.

Average people interested in only their personal benefit or the benefit of their cause, and failing to stop and consider the morality of their methods is what got us into this mess, and keeps us here, I'll remind you.

If master-card and visa were legitimate businesses who obtained their money by voluntary trade, then decided to refrain from trading with a certain individual, to respond with violence against their property would be absolutely immoral.

[jmdrake]

No. That is COMPLETELY false. A person or business owner has a right to boycott whomever they want for whatever reason they want. We don't own their property, and have no right to force them to do business with people we like.

It's instances of aggressive government force on behalf of Mastercard and Visa that would make them like the EITC -- forced monopoly, taxpayer funding, etc.

Only using your definition of right and wrong. Did Mastercard's contract with Assange say "We reserve the right to cut you off when you're dependent on us for any arbitrary reason"? No? Then by contract they are violating his rights. Further there is aggressive force on behalf of MC and Visa (maybe you missed the lobbying post). Further, credit card companies have been exempted from usury laws giving them an unfair competitive advantage. Either usury laws for everyone, or no usury laws at all.

Last point. This is a fight for self defense. It's not some libertarian debating club. (And as I've said multiple times, this ain't a libertarian movement). If your neighbor is giving his bat dung to the government knowing they're using it to make gun powder to kill your children with...

[Fredom101]

Average people interested in only their personal benefit or the benefit of their cause, and failing to stop and consider the morality of their methods is what got us into this mess, and keeps us here, I'll remind you.

If master-card and visa were legitimate businesses who obtained their money by voluntary trade, then decided to refrain from trading with a certain individual, to respond with violence against their property would be absolutely immoral.

Yes but this is not the case. They are locked in with government, there is nothing "free market" about either company.

[jmdrake]

I agree. Point of information: Are visa and mastercard like banks, in that they get money from the Fed, bailouts, favorable regulations, etc -- or do they simply loan money at interest?

Have you never seen one of those "Citibank Visa" commercials?

YouTube - Citibank Credit Card Commercial (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXBfcvgKxjk)

And yes, Citibank did get bailout money.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/107514-citibank-bailout-300-billion-doesn-t-sound-like-a-lot-anymore

[tremendoustie]

I don't know the answer to this question, but they are getting the money from somewhere and it isn't from savings. So I think they must be loaning money they don't have thereby profiting from special privileges to expand the money supply at interest.

Fractional reserve lending is unwise, but not inherently coercive - so long as it's not backed by government guarantees, or operating under a government granted monopoly, and so long as its not fraudulent. As you say, "special privileges" is the key.

I just checked though -- the major credit cards are owned by the banks, except for VISA (which was founded by Bank of America, but spun off) -- and they act as a facilitator of bank loans. The money is coming from the major banks.

That's a big strike against the legitimacy of credit card companies.

[tremendoustie]

Yes but this is not the case. They are locked in with government, there is nothing "free market" about either company.

Right. I'm just saying, it's good to stop and consider, not just "praise the lord and pass the ammunition".

[Slutter McGee]

Despite the anarchist nature of 4chan, I would advise people to stay away from the armpit of the internet. Especially /b/. I may support some of what they stand for, but that place aint for the weak of heart.

Slutter McGee

[Feeding the Abscess]

Despite the anarchist nature of 4chan, I would advise people to stay away from the armpit of the internet. Especially /b/. I may support some of what they stand for, but that place aint for the weak of heart.

Slutter McGee

/b/ is pretty mild compared to what else can be found on the site.

[cswake]

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/12/08/wikileaks/index.html

If you listen to the above discussion, the implication is that they are attacking the transaction network for Mastercard.

[FunkBuddha]

Mastercard.com seems to be back up.

[tremendoustie]

Only using your definition of right and wrong. Did Mastercard's contract with Assange say "We reserve the right to cut you off when you're dependent on us for any arbitrary reason"? No? Then by contract they are violating his rights.


I doubt there was a contract obligating Mastercard to continue to trade with Assange. If there was, than this is breach of contract, which is indeed aggression.



Further there is aggressive force on behalf of MC and Visa (maybe you missed the lobbying post).


Yes, that's true, and no I didn't miss it. I was simply responding to your argument that their decision to cut him off made them like EITC. It is rather these other aspects, if anything, that make them like EITC.

I think danno's analysis was correct -- you were not trying to say that this alone would make them like EITC.



Further, credit card companies have been exempted from usury laws giving them an unfair competitive advantage. Either usury laws for everyone, or no usury laws at all.

That's a fair point (and I'd go with no usury laws).



Last point. This is a fight for self defense.


Yes, so long as we're legitimately going after those who are attacking us, and not innocent bystanders who don't do what we like.

The latter would make us the tyrants.



It's not some libertarian debating club.


No, but if we do not stop and hold ourselves to moral standards, we are no better than they.

Visa and Mastercard seem to be the banks, effectively. This makes the DOS attack much more defensible.



(And as I've said multiple times, this ain't a libertarian movement).


What is it then, an anti-liberty movement? Do we not believe in property rights?

[Acala]

Fractional reserve lending is unwise, but not inherently coercive - so long as it's not backed by government guarantees, or operating under a government granted monopoly, and so long as its not fraudulent. As you say, "special privileges" is the key..

I think it is a fraud if it involves lending money that depositors are lead to believe is available to them on demand. But this is not the thread for that discussion.


I just checked though -- the major credit cards are owned by the banks, except for VISA (which was founded by Bank of America, but spun off) -- and they act as a facilitator of bank loans. The money is coming from the major banks.

That's a big strike against the legitimacy of credit card companies.

Thanks for checking. I'm glad not everyone is as lazy as me!

So screw mastercard, visa and the horses they road in on.

[angelatc]

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9200521/MasterCard_others_hit_by_DDoS_attacks_over_WikiLea ks?taxonomyId=82



(cont'd at link)

Looks like they need more soldiers....

I would love to see them take eBay down. This week is probably the biggest shopping week there.

[tremendoustie]

I would love to see them take eBay down. This week is probably the biggest shopping week there.

Because they own Paypal, I suppose.

Palin and Leiberman are certainly fair game. It looks like the credit card companies could be considered fair game as well.

But ebay would be way over the line in my opinion. Both paypal and ebay are absolutely legitimate businesses, and they have a right to contract with whomever they choose.

[FunkBuddha]

http://pandalabs.pandasecurity.com/tis-the-season-of-ddos-wikileaks-editio/


Update – 12/8/2010 – 8:24 AM
Mastercard.com is still selected as the main target and has not came back online since our last report. 7 hours of downtime and counting.
The amount of participants in the attackers chat room have soared to over 2200 people and there are currently over 1,700 computers in the voluntary botnet.

There were 500 computers involved in the attack yesterday. There are now over 1700!

[Acala]

Because they own Paypal, I suppose.

Palin and Leiberman are certainly fair game. It looks like the credit card companies could be considered fair game as well.

But ebay would be way over the line in my opinion. Both paypal and ebay are absolutely legitimate businesses, and they have a right to contract with whomever they choose.

You make a pretty good case. Kudos.

[FunkBuddha]

Looks like they will be attacking Visa within the hour.

http://twitter.com/Anon_Operation

[Acala]

I hope they follow the trail past the credit card companies through the banks and right up to the Central Banking cartel.

Reminds me of Fight Club.

Or in Total Recall when they turn on the oxygen machine.

Hey! I'm an optimist!

[tremendoustie]

I hope they follow the trail past the credit card companies through the banks and right up to the Central Banking cartel.

Reminds me of Fight Club.

Or in Total Recall when they turn on the oxygen machine.

Hey! I'm an optimist!

:D

[libertygrl]

Uh oh cyber warfare. Here comes government control to save us all. =/


You got that right! How do we know that this whole affair with Wikileaks and now this thing with M.C. isn't just another problem, reaction, solution scenario? I'm telling you this whole things smells rotten and soon we can all kiss internet freedom goodbye. :mad:

Read on:

Whether the new liberal cult hero Julian Assange is in fact a “useful idiot” helping to propagate fake leaks for the Establishment, or is a bona fide covert intelligence operative, remains to be seen. His recent detention in the UK for alleged sexual abuse in Sweden is providing endless media columns which will focus on the international legal circus of these charges, and further propel the cult of personality forward. One thing is fairly certain though, that Wikileaks is a corrupt oracle putting out a mix of light-to-middleweight intelligence and outright misinformation, in order to direct public opinion on a variety of issues. One needs only to look at the initial George Soros-type funding vessels and early support for Wikileaks, and tie these association together to trace its genealogy. This is complexed and not for amateurs, but utterly fascinating for those willing to look deeper into this virtual off-shore Conintelpro organ of the 21st century.

http://www.infowars.com/wikileaks-corrupted-oracle-or-a-cointelpro-asset-of-the-establ

YouTube - Alex Jones & Webster Tarpley: The Hidden Agenda Behind WikiLeaks - Alex Jones Tv Sunday Edition 3/5 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mg5Nc0USdKQ&feature=player_embedded)

[FrankRep]

Here we go! The Government will destroy the Internet!


H.R. 4061: Cybersecurity Enhancement Act of 2010 (http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h111-4061)


Sponsor: Rep. Daniel Lipinski [D-IL3]

Cosponsors:
Vernon Ehlers [R-MI3]
Barton Gordon [D-TN6]
Ralph Hall [R-TX4]
Eddie Johnson [D-TX30]
Ben Luján [D-NM3]
Michael McCaul [R-TX10]
Steven Rothman [D-NJ9]
Adrian Smith [R-NE3]
David Wu [D-OR1]

[libertygrl]

YouTube - Wayne Madsen Report: Assange Set Up By CIA Operative? Alex Jones Tv (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1vYajkZHrY&feature=player_embedded#!)

[crazyfacedjenkins]

You got that right! How do we know that this whole affair with Wikileaks and now this thing with M.C. isn't just another problem, reaction, solution scenario? I'm telling you this whole things smells rotten and soon we can all kiss internet freedom goodbye. :mad:

Read on:

Whether the new liberal cult hero Julian Assange is in fact a “useful idiot” helping to propagate fake leaks for the Establishment, or is a bona fide covert intelligence operative, remains to be seen. His recent detention in the UK for alleged sexual abuse in Sweden is providing endless media columns which will focus on the international legal circus of these charges, and further propel the cult of personality forward. One thing is fairly certain though, that Wikileaks is a corrupt oracle putting out a mix of light-to-middleweight intelligence and outright misinformation, in order to direct public opinion on a variety of issues. One needs only to look at the initial George Soros-type funding vessels and early support for Wikileaks, and tie these association together to trace its genealogy. This is complexed and not for amateurs, but utterly fascinating for those willing to look deeper into this virtual off-shore Conintelpro organ of the 21st century.

http://www.infowars.com/wikileaks-corrupted-oracle-or-a-cointelpro-asset-of-the-establ

YouTube - Alex Jones & Webster Tarpley: The Hidden Agenda Behind WikiLeaks - Alex Jones Tv Sunday Edition 3/5 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mg5Nc0USdKQ&feature=player_embedded)

Are you kidding me? These assholes have been debunked, half the time they spend bashing his character and the other half they say the information leaked is useless. You think the CIA wants this shit leaked: Wikileaks cable: USA Funding Child Sex Parties In Afghanistan (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=271863)?????????

These buffoons are so jealous it's ridiculous. If you really think the government needs a false flag to filter the internet, you need to wake up because they've been filtering and spying for years!!! The government will do what it wants, ironically wikileaks proves that.

[ItsTime]

Now Mastercard is back up and the government is in FULL attack on the internet.

Good job, way to lose a battle.

[eOs]

Now Mastercard is back up and the government is in FULL attack on the internet.

Good job, way to lose a battle.

Now visa is down. None of this is halting transactions online or offline though. And yea, I have a feeling after this, we're gonna need to get TSA'd before we can even step near a computer.

[specialkornflake]

Looks like they will be attacking Visa within the hour.

http://twitter.com/Anon_Operation

Visa.com is now down!

[One Last Battle!]

Anons just released thousands of VISA credit card numbers. Visa's security has been breached in a major way. Their credit card systems are also apparently acting funky.

[Feeding the Abscess]

Anons just released thousands of VISA credit card numbers. Visa's security has been breached in a major way. Their credit card systems are also apparently acting funky.

Source?

[reduen]

Anons just released thousands of VISA credit card numbers. Visa's security has been breached in a major way. Their credit card systems are also apparently acting funky.

Are you telling me that my credit card info might be going out everywhere? How does that hurt the company?

[cswake]

Visa and the banks will be liable for the fraud charges. (Costs will still ultimately roll down to the cardholders though)

[dannno]

Are you telling me that my credit card info might be going out everywhere? How does that hurt the company?

+1

I was really hoping they wouldn't release customer information, unless they were politicians who co-sponsored the Internet Security Enhancement Act..

[tremendoustie]

Visa and the banks will be liable for the fraud charges. (Costs will still ultimately roll down to the cardholders though)

That's true

[cswake]

http://twitter.com/MasterCard


Recent rumors of a security breach are false & cardholder numbers that were published are fictional. Your info is secure

[dizi24]

Who would have thought that the type of people who would hack a banks website would release individuals credit card numbers?

[Heimdallr]

This was on our local CBC radio.


It's always amusing when Anonymous is mentioned. :)

[Imaginos]

Sweeeeeet!
Can they hack the Fed as well?
I want to see his majesty Bernanke in jail!

[Feeding the Abscess]

These guys are small time, probably teenagers doing it. The "over 9000" meme in the videos give it away.

Still, I'm sure there are a few who could get in and do some actual damage. Probably won't happen, though. I suppose it occasionally pays to have SOME organization.

[dannno]

Sweeeeeet!
Can they hack the Fed as well?
I want to see his majesty Bernanke in jail!

YouTube - Ron Paul: What We Need Is More WikiLeaks On The Federal Reserve (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgkoTIyuElY)

[ericsnow]

To people of the industrial world, dismiss your #Mastercard now!!! #ddos #payback Leaked Credit Cards http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=u783eBzc

http://twitter.com/anon_operation

Why is this guy leaking the credit card numbers?
http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=u783eBzc

[FunkBuddha]

Anon_Operations Twitter account suspended.

[RonPaulFanInGA]

Are you telling me that my credit card info might be going out everywhere? How does that hurt the company?

Oh, but this is all good. Totally deserve it. :rolleyes:

Are people here still going to defend this nonsense?

They're after Palin now too:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2010/12/exclusive-palin-under-cyber-attack-from-wikileaks-supporters-in-operation-payback.html

Not a fan of her, but I guess one isn't entitled to a political opinion anymore either?

[JVParkour]

I know that they were planning to spread dis-info on obtaining credit card info. My guess is that it is simply a lie.

[Acala]

Oh, but this is all good. Totally deserve it. :rolleyes:

Are people here still going to defend this nonsense?

Too early to panic.


They're after Palin now too:

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2010/12/exclusive-palin-under-cyber-attack-from-wikileaks-supporters-in-operation-payback.html

Not a fan of her, but I guess one isn't entitled to a political opinion anymore either?

She is a seeker of government power to make her opinions law. If she espouses tyrannical opinions and seeks for them to become law, to hell with her.

But I would rather see them really dig into the banks.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Now Mastercard is back up and the government is in FULL attack on the internet.

Good job, way to lose a battle.

That's right Rosa Parks, sit down and shut up!

You spam bots are so easy to spot. Who programmed you, Visa or Mastercard?

[One Last Battle!]

A little wall of ideas I found on them:

http://piratepad.net/SDt0w4bxHe

[Agorism]

Surprise is how they got the upper hand most likely.

[pcosmar]

A little wall of ideas I found on them:

http://piratepad.net/SDt0w4bxHe

Ha haa he he :D



Please less Obama hating, we know the republican alternative is way worse. They all suck. Except possibly Ron Paul.

They are us.
:cool:

[pcosmar]

Oh, but this is all good. Totally deserve it. :rolleyes:

Are people here still going to defend this nonsense?

They're after Palin now too:


Yup, and I'll encourage it. and more.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=271899

Call their frickin' Bluff. Shut the internet down. DO IT.

It will inconvenience some of us, It will seriously hurt them.

:mad:

[pcosmar]

Multiple posts on these threads. Spread this.

YouTube - anon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcpTyrW8yJY)

Text

Greetings.
These days have been interesting for all of us, and especially for every dictator, and every authoritarian regime. The one and only protector of the freedom of speech has devolved into one of its worst. Yes, U.S.A. We are looking at you. We became very disappointed when we saw how you treated not only our fellow anon, but one of the greatest defenders of free speech in the modern world.

The earthly world may be your domain, but we can assure you, and never forget, that the web belongs to us, and we will protect it by all means necessary. You have, over the last few days, gotten a taste of what we are able to do with small resources. Over these few days, however, we have grown several hundred percent, and we will grow further as the news spreads.

We have taken down several of your servers with DDoS attacks. We have defaced your websites. We have raped your bandwidth to such an extent that you may face problems when paying your bills. And most of all, we have shown the world how exposable you really are.

We are the author of the hjoly book of "dirty tricks."
We do not only know every single "dirty trick" in the book; we are the inventors of them.

Many have tried to defeat us before and failed. Miserably. Go ask the church of Scientology if they are up for a new fight. Some of us may fall, but on the way, all of you will fall. You may get one or five convicted. Ten or twenty arrested. On the way, you will not only lose all pride, but also money.

Your world needs our world to work.
You are here as our guests.
Behave as such.
Your time here is limited.

We demand that you leave Julian Assange and Wikileaks alone. Open his bank accounts. Arrest the lying Swedish tramps.

Don't disappoint us again.
Consequences will NEVER be the same.

We are anonymous. We are legion.
We do not forget.
We do not forgive.

Expect us.

[idirtify]

Multiple posts on these threads. Spread this.

YouTube - anon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcpTyrW8yJY)

Text

Wow. Stephen Hawking is pissed. :)

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

What are you ideas? Care to share what illegal activity you have planned on a public message board? :rolleyes:

I personally have no illegal activity planned. Ive been working in the system to change it. What have YOU done?

Can you please change your avatar? You are a disgrace to the Sons of Liberty who did not follow tyrannical and criminal laws. Thanks. If you want to follow orwellian, legal plunder, and tyrannical laws, then be my guest, but this is the exact opposite of what the Sons of Liberty did.