I want to move to Arizona. Who's coming with me?

[tnvoter]

Seriously, I would join the FSP in NH, but it's cold... and an uphill battle.. I want to go where it's warm and surrounded by people who apparently have the same heart for liberty.

Gimme 2 yrs I'm going

ok i'm going the easy way.. but still... I wanna

[puppetmaster]

I am going to move my business somewhere.......need good business tax breaks and good Liberty leaning gov.....which state is best??? hmmmmmm

[FrankRep]

http://www.cbsnews.com/election2010/state.shtml?state=az&tag=el2010states;el2010statesDropDown

1.) Arizona just rejected ObamaCare (Nullification).
2.) Jan Brewer is standing up to the Federal Government.

Sounds like a fun place! :)

[Suzu]

I lived in AZ for 9+ years. It was a lot colder than I thought it would be. In AZ, it's all about your elevation. But even the lowest areas have cold winter nights. In the higher elevations, -0 temps. are common, along with FIERCE winds, which makes it feel much, much colder than it really is.

[heavenlyboy34]

[/URL][URL]http://www.cbsnews.com/election2010/state.shtml?state=az&tag=el2010states;el2010statesDropDown (http://www.cbsnews.com/election2010/state.shtml?state=az&tag=el2010states;el2010statesDropDown)

1.) Arizona just rejected ObamaCare (Nullification).
2.) Jan Brewer is standing up to the Federal Government.

Sounds like a fun place! :)

Yeah, it's not too bad, depending on where ya live. North and Central Phoenix are pretty nice, and pretty affordable. The south side is pretty slummy, in my experience. Scottsdale is "upscale" and pretty pricey on just about everything. Paradise Valley is sort of like Scottsdale, but not so expensive. Phoenix is a College town, and so is Tempe (moreso Tempe because of ASU), so there's just about always something to see/do.

Some areas are difficult to navigate if you don't speak Spanish, but not too many. There's plenty of gambling (especially on the Indian reservations) and cultural things. I avail myself of the museums and concert halls when I can afford it (not very often).

The MCCD, the maricopa community college district, has some excellent performing arts programs as well-and they're usually free or cheap.

I live in North Phoenix, so you may have the good fortune and honor of meeting me live and in person. I will autograph your various body parts if you so desire. :D

If you have any specific questions about AZ, just PM me. :)

P.S. it's kind of hard to find hardcore libertarian types, but they're here if you look. Unfortunately, the GOPers tend to dominate the media, so ya have to find alternate sources, like the bars, taverns, restaurants, etc.

[heavenlyboy34]

I lived in AZ for 9+ years. It was a lot colder than I thought it would be. In AZ, it's all about your elevation. But even the lowest areas have cold winter nights. In the higher elevations, -0 temps. are common, along with FIERCE winds, which makes it feel much, much colder than it really is.


Very true. This is because of the surrounding mountains. The wind gets cool on the mountains and blows through the valley. I never need my blankie till winter.

Also, Arizona is endowed with one of the 7 wonders of the world-the Grand Canyon. :cool: (don't go past the rail if you go there. You definitely don't want to fall in!) OP, if you come here, you should definitely see that, the painted desert, and the petrified forest. Avoid the tourist traps on the roadsides, tho. ;)

[Kregisen]

I lived in AZ for 9+ years. It was a lot colder than I thought it would be. In AZ, it's all about your elevation. But even the lowest areas have cold winter nights. In the higher elevations, -0 temps. are common, along with FIERCE winds, which makes it feel much, much colder than it really is.

It reached 89 degrees today in the Phoenix area. ;)

[Suzu]

The worst thing about Phoenix, in my humble opinion, is the humidity. I didn't expect it. There are tons of golf courses being watered constantly, and gazillions of fountains, canals and swimming pools, and deciduous trees and bluegrass lawns planted by snowbirds. And it's subject to temperature inversions. Which all adds up to muggy, miserable summers, and because the summers are so very hot, the nights do not cool down enough for comfort. Plus it's a megalopolis, which I hate (even though the shopping and restaurants are nice).

The happy medium between the super-hot Phoenix (and Tucson, to a slightly lesser extent) and frigid Flagstaff and such areas, would be the Verde Valley/Sedona area, and some of the southeastern part of the state, like Safford (where there are some awesome hot springs).

[Kregisen]

^lol, sorry but Phoenix is probably the driest place in the nation. If it was humid when you came, you must've come during monsoon season when it rains.

[Suzu]

I didn't just "visit" Phoenix, I lived there for a spell, and was in and out frequently when I lived elsewhere in the state. The monsoons only make it that much MORE muggy!

[LibertyEagle]

Seriously, I would join the FSP in NH, but it's cold... and an uphill battle.. I want to go where it's warm and surrounded by people who apparently have the same heart for liberty.

Gimme 2 yrs I'm going

ok i'm going the easy way.. but still... I wanna

I hate to rain on your parade, but these great people elected John McCain again. :(

[FrankRep]

I hate to rain on your parade, but these great people elected John McCain again. :(
Who else are they going to elect? Rodney Glassman?

[Suzu]

Just as an aside, let me tell ya I can never forgot my shock the first time I visited Arizona, back in February of '77. I was passing through, in a car, en route to California on I-40, and the snow was piled up too high for me to see over when I stood on the bumper of my car!

It snowed a LOT while I was living in the state. Will never forget the deep snows in November of '90, '91 and '92. More than 4' fell in less than 24 hours one year. People in my neighborhood were being airlifted out.

[tremendoustie]

Seriously, I would join the FSP in NH, but it's cold


No, it's beautiful! I've talked with many people from the south who've moved, they love it. When it's cold out, you just turn on the heat, same as you turn on the AC here.

There are four real seasons, three of which are nicer than any season here, IMO, and the fourth has skiing!



... and an uphill battle.. I want to go where it's warm and surrounded by people who apparently have the same heart for liberty.

Are you kidding?! NH has the largest liberty activist community anywhere.

At least 10 FSP participants are now state reps, and numerous pro-liberty natives.

[Kregisen]

Who else are they going to elect? Rodney Glassman?

Tea-party endorsed Jim Deakin in the primary, and LP founder David Nolan in the general.

[sevin]

Haha, well don't go to Tucson or you're in for a rude awakening. Tucson is as liberal as California. You're better off in Phoenix or somewhere north of there.

[LibertyVox]

Isn't half of Tempe, Phoenix and Tucson dejected California anyways? Many of whom moved there before the bubbles burst?

[qh4dotcom]

I am going to move my business somewhere.......need good business tax breaks and good Liberty leaning gov.....which state is best??? hmmmmmm

Florida just elected a pro-business governor...Rick Scott says he's going to phase out the business tax and cut property taxes 19%

[WRellim]

http://www.cbsnews.com/election2010/state.shtml?state=az&tag=el2010states;el2010statesDropDown (http://www.cbsnews.com/election2010/state.shtml?state=az&tag=el2010states;el2010statesDropDown)

1.) Arizona just rejected ObamaCare (Nullification).
2.) Jan Brewer is standing up to the Federal Government.

Sounds like a fun place! :)

OTOH, they also just re-elected that certifiably insane, uber-corrupt, skin-on-a-skeleton John McCain.

Also... Sheriff Joe Arpaio won't be dead & gone for quite a few years and I'm sure he has half a dozen "mini-me" understudy-thugs just itching for the chance to take his place and once ensconced, to be even MORE "Arpaio" that Arpaio himself.

[Baptist]

http://www.cbsnews.com/election2010/state.shtml?state=az&tag=el2010states;el2010statesDropDown

1.) Arizona just rejected ObamaCare (Nullification).
2.) Jan Brewer is standing up to the Federal Government.

Sounds like a fun place! :)

3.) They just elected John McCain instead of a liberty candidate in the primary.
4.) They voted down medical ganja.
5.) They rejected the right to hunt, which shows a hostility towards guns & hunting.
6.) If Jan Brewer was truly standing up to the feds, instead of "enforcing federal laws" she would push her state to abandon public eduction, welfare, and freebies to illegal aliens.

[Vessol]

2.) Jan Brewer is standing up to the Federal Government.


Rick Perry "stood up" against the Federal Government as well. Does that make him pro-liberty?

[heavenlyboy34]

I hate to rain on your parade, but these great people elected John McCain again. :(

I always thought it to be suspicious that McShame always wins. A few years ago, he ran against a much more popular and much more "conservative" (by popular definition) fellow-JD Hayworth-and still won. Makes me wonder...perhaps the oldsters are bought off. I seem to recall that the NRA also endorsed McShame. :p
He's always doing things to piss people off, but still gets reelected. Perhaps it's a CONSPIRACY!! :eek:

[FrankRep]

Rick Perry "stood up" against the Federal Government as well. Does that make him pro-liberty?

Rick Perry is not Jan Brewer.

[Liberty_Mike]

Although it is good AZ passed the health care proposition, it looks like the medical marijuana prop will probably not pass.

[FrankRep]

Although it is good AZ passed the health care proposition, it looks like the medical marijuana prop will probably not pass.
SO damn close! sad.

[TNforPaul45]

Seriously, I would join the FSP in NH, but it's cold... and an uphill battle.. I want to go where it's warm and surrounded by people who apparently have the same heart for liberty.

Gimme 2 yrs I'm going

ok i'm going the easy way.. but still... I wanna


tn you cannot leave. It says so in the State ByLaws. And the Corn will stop you as well.

Sincerely,

TN.

[Acala]

3.) They just elected John McCain instead of a liberty candidate in the primary.
4.) They voted down medical ganja.
5.) They rejected the right to hunt, which shows a hostility towards guns & hunting.
6.) If Jan Brewer was truly standing up to the feds, instead of "enforcing federal laws" she would push her state to abandon public eduction, welfare, and freebies to illegal aliens.

Yes, Arizona re-elected Meathead McCain. Sadly. No excuse sir.

I think the medical MJ is too close to call. We passed it twice before. It is struggling this time because so many fossil Republicans got off the couch to pour hate on the Demoncrats and at the same time decided to reiterate their idiotic habit of trying to force their personal morality on others.

I voted AGAINST the hunting bill because it proclaims that all game belongs to the state. No, it damn well does not! And anyone who says Arizonans have a hostility toward guns doesn't know what they are talking about. Nobody has better gun laws than Arizona.

Jan Brewer will pretty much sign whatever the Republican legislature sends her - and they have been sending her some good stuff.

The Republicans here have a libertarian streak. Remember, although this is the home of Meathead McCain, it is also the home of Barry Goldwater.

We just passed the Obamacare nullification and made affirmative action illegal. Add that to the already passed firearms freedom nullification and I would say that puts Arizona around the top for nullification.

[Acala]

Anyone interested in moving to Tucson, let me know. I'll help all I can. It isn't as hot or crowded as Phoenix. But the government is more socialist.

[Tyr]

Seriously, I would join the FSP in NH, but it's cold... and an uphill battle.. I want to go where it's warm and surrounded by people who apparently have the same heart for liberty.

Gimme 2 yrs I'm going

ok i'm going the easy way.. but still... I wanna


First post but i've been lurking and reading for quite awhile.

Arizona is a bigger uphill battle than NH honestly. There are plenty of Liberty minded individuals, but there are also alot that are the opposite of that and THAT is the side that's growing, largely thanks to limp wristed, jelly spined, hybrid car driving Californians bent on relocating here and forcing Pelosi styled politics on the rest of us. I'd also venture to say the heat has gotten to enough people as well considering all the genuine Liberty candidates were easily defeated in the primaries by the status quo.

We are afterall the state known for keeping John McCain in office and for electing socialist party member Janet Napolitano into office. Not to mention the latest, Janet "Tax & Spend" Brewer, a rubber stamp for the neocons when she isn't increasing our tax rates to pay the teachers unions. But if that doesn't deter you here's the pro's and cons of Arizona....

Pros:
The winter weather is pleasant.
If you feel nostalgic for snow you can drive two hours north of Phoenix and see some.
It isn't yet a leftist stronghold(although it's going in that direction).
In the summers you can suffer 110-120 degree heat or drive the same two hours north and enjoy 85-90 degree weather.
If you enjoy sports we have football, baseball, hockey and basketball. We also hold spring training for about 15 baseball teams, have a minor league team in Tucson and also have arena football.
The northern half of the state is beautiful.
Our gun laws are awesome.

Cons:
Good luck trying to enjoy that winter weather. We also have these things called snowbirds. If you don't know what that is it's a sinister cabal of retired old people who spend their winters here. As they have nothing to do but drive around doing 20mph under whatever the posted speed limit is or hang out at restaurants drinking coffee all day good luck getting anywhere in a reasonable time frame or going out to eat between the hours of 4AM-6PM.

It isn't a leftist stronghold however it is a neocon RINO stronghold.

As stated above in the pros, the summers are over 100 degrees in a large part of the state. Btw summer is from April-November here on average. December through February is winter, spring is in March. Also good luck getting away from the heat up north and having anything to do. Yes, everyone here knows about it and they have that same destination in mind.

Alot of our other laws are horrible.


While we don't have alot of rain storms in comparison to elsewhere we DO have a fair share of dust storms. Especially outside of the major cities.

The color brown. Get used to it. Our mountains are brown, the ground is brown, our buildings are usually brown and the houses are usually brown. You're going to see alot of that color. To break up the monotony with an equal amount of monotony you'll get to see plenty of the color white. If a house or building isn't brown chances are it's white. We don't have alot of lawns here instead we have rocks in our yards. Brown, reddish brown or white. As it is the desert the hottest selling car color? White. There's little deviation from those two base colors.

I'm not sure what your industry is but be forewarned we really don't have one here. Our industry is predicated on the snowbirds showing up and blowing money in the service sectors pretty much. Our secondary means of industry was tossing up boring, bland cookie cutter neighborhoods for the California expats, retirees and white flight from the older neighborhoods but that ones all dried up.

Taxes- We have them and thanks to the Brewers and McCains they're not decreasing, they're increasing.

Last(for now!) but certainly not least, the water here. There isn't alot of it. We ARE afterall the desert which is naturally dry. The more people that move here obviously the less water we have, which btw is allotted to us by Colorado. They're not going to put themselves out because of population explosion.


Now that that's outa the way, onto neighborhoods....

The Peoples Republic of Tucson- Just as it sounds. Socialist Central in AZ which is weird 'cause it's a smaller-ish city in the middle of nowhere. Nice city actually, pretty laid back and slow going for a city. Oro Valley and Marana aren't bad suburbs if you're looking for that laid back easy going atmosphere. They're pricey though and as I and others have said you'll have to contend with ALOT of socialists as well as La Raza types. In fact the socialists just shunned the Tea Party candidate, a physicist and reelected a half braindead Communist La Raza member. Yeah it's THAT bad there.

Phoenix- I don't recommend ANYONE moves there. There's a few nice pockets but it's mostly a dump. No offense to anyone living in PHX, that's my honest view on it. Like I said there are a FEW good areas.

Scottsdale- Pricey. Also filled to the brim with leftists now. Once a rural community now it's where Californians as well as others live off credit cards putting on an air of wealth. It's a nice clean town, just full of idiots.

Mesa- It's okay but don't waste your time voting locally there. Mesa is a Mormon town and it's a guarantee as solid as death befalling every life form, the same establishment neocon Mormons WILL be reelected until they decide to stop running or move on.

Flagstaff, Sedona, Prescott, Show Low- Awesome areas. It does get cold and it does snow in those areas however if you can land a job in any of the above? Nice places to live.

Glendale, Peoria, Avondale, Goodyear, Paradise Valley, Fountain Hills, Cave Creek, Chandler, Gilbert, Surprise and Buckeye- The 'Burbs of Phoenix. Take your pick. They all have good areas and bad areas and I can't really recommend one over the other. All have their good and not so good.

Casa Grande, Maricopa, Black Canyon City, Wickenburg ect- All smaller towns within an hours drive to Phoenix. If you want small town living yet to remain close enough to a major city those are the places. Casa Grande and Maricopa are also an hours drive from Tucson, so you get your choices of which major city to hit up.

Hope that helps! ;)

[tremendoustie]

And here's 101 reasons to move to NH: http://www.freestateproject.org/101Reasons (http://www.freestateproject.org/101Reasons)

:cool:

[Acala]

First post but i've been lurking and reading for quite awhile.

Arizona is a bigger uphill battle than NH honestly. There are plenty of Liberty minded individuals, but there are also alot that are the opposite of that and THAT is the side that's growing, largely thanks to limp wristed, jelly spined, hybrid car driving Californians bent on relocating here and forcing Pelosi styled politics on the rest of us. I'd also venture to say the heat has gotten to enough people as well considering all the genuine Liberty candidates were easily defeated in the primaries by the status quo.

We are afterall the state known for keeping John McCain in office and for electing socialist party member Janet Napolitano into office. Not to mention the latest, Janet "Tax & Spend" Brewer, a rubber stamp for the neocons when she isn't increasing our tax rates to pay the teachers unions. But if that doesn't deter you here's the pro's and cons of Arizona....

Pros:
The winter weather is pleasant.
If you feel nostalgic for snow you can drive two hours north of Phoenix and see some.
It isn't yet a leftist stronghold(although it's going in that direction).
In the summers you can suffer 110-120 degree heat or drive the same two hours north and enjoy 85-90 degree weather.
If you enjoy sports we have football, baseball, hockey and basketball. We also hold spring training for about 15 baseball teams, have a minor league team in Tucson and also have arena football.
The northern half of the state is beautiful.
Our gun laws are awesome.

Cons:
Good luck trying to enjoy that winter weather. We also have these things called snowbirds. If you don't know what that is it's a sinister cabal of retired old people who spend their winters here. As they have nothing to do but drive around doing 20mph under whatever the posted speed limit is or hang out at restaurants drinking coffee all day good luck getting anywhere in a reasonable time frame or going out to eat between the hours of 4AM-6PM.

It isn't a leftist stronghold however it is a neocon RINO stronghold.

As stated above in the pros, the summers are over 100 degrees in a large part of the state. Btw summer is from April-November here on average. December through February is winter, spring is in March. Also good luck getting away from the heat up north and having anything to do. Yes, everyone here knows about it and they have that same destination in mind.

Alot of our other laws are horrible.


While we don't have alot of rain storms in comparison to elsewhere we DO have a fair share of dust storms. Especially outside of the major cities.

The color brown. Get used to it. Our mountains are brown, the ground is brown, our buildings are usually brown and the houses are usually brown. You're going to see alot of that color. To break up the monotony with an equal amount of monotony you'll get to see plenty of the color white. If a house or building isn't brown chances are it's white. We don't have alot of lawns here instead we have rocks in our yards. Brown, reddish brown or white. As it is the desert the hottest selling car color? White. There's little deviation from those two base colors.

I'm not sure what your industry is but be forewarned we really don't have one here. Our industry is predicated on the snowbirds showing up and blowing money in the service sectors pretty much. Our secondary means of industry was tossing up boring, bland cookie cutter neighborhoods for the California expats, retirees and white flight from the older neighborhoods but that ones all dried up.

Taxes- We have them and thanks to the Brewers and McCains they're not decreasing, they're increasing.

Last(for now!) but certainly not least, the water here. There isn't alot of it. We ARE afterall the desert which is naturally dry. The more people that move here obviously the less water we have, which btw is allotted to us by Colorado. They're not going to put themselves out because of population explosion.


Now that that's outa the way, onto neighborhoods....

The Peoples Republic of Tucson- Just as it sounds. Socialist Central in AZ which is weird 'cause it's a smaller-ish city in the middle of nowhere. Nice city actually, pretty laid back and slow going for a city. Oro Valley and Marana aren't bad suburbs if you're looking for that laid back easy going atmosphere. They're pricey though and as I and others have said you'll have to contend with ALOT of socialists as well as La Raza types. In fact the socialists just shunned the Tea Party candidate, a physicist and reelected a half braindead Communist La Raza member. Yeah it's THAT bad there.

Phoenix- I don't recommend ANYONE moves there. There's a few nice pockets but it's mostly a dump. No offense to anyone living in PHX, that's my honest view on it. Like I said there are a FEW good areas.

Scottsdale- Pricey. Also filled to the brim with leftists now. Once a rural community now it's where Californians as well as others live off credit cards putting on an air of wealth. It's a nice clean town, just full of idiots.

Mesa- It's okay but don't waste your time voting locally there. Mesa is a Mormon town and it's a guarantee as solid as death befalling every life form, the same establishment neocon Mormons WILL be reelected until they decide to stop running or move on.

Flagstaff, Sedona, Prescott, Show Low- Awesome areas. It does get cold and it does snow in those areas however if you can land a job in any of the above? Nice places to live.

Glendale, Peoria, Avondale, Goodyear, Paradise Valley, Fountain Hills, Cave Creek, Chandler, Gilbert, Surprise and Buckeye- The 'Burbs of Phoenix. Take your pick. They all have good areas and bad areas and I can't really recommend one over the other. All have their good and not so good.

Casa Grande, Maricopa, Black Canyon City, Wickenburg ect- All smaller towns within an hours drive to Phoenix. If you want small town living yet to remain close enough to a major city those are the places. Casa Grande and Maricopa are also an hours drive from Tucson, so you get your choices of which major city to hit up.

Hope that helps! ;)

I would say this is very one-sided.

As for the natural environment, I think it is awesome. The desert is beautiful in its harshness. The mountains are spectacular with plenty of trout fishing and even some pretty good skiing. The widlife is amazing. There are animals that live here that most people have never even heard of. More species of birds, bees, and ants than any other state. More record largest trees than any state other than Florida and California. And the wilderness is highly accessible, unless you live in Phoenix. In fifteen minutes from my house I can be in the mouth of a canyon where bald eagles breed. Fifteen minutes in the other direction and I am at my office. If you like outdoor activites, I can't think of a better place to live. Is it hot in the summer in the desert? Sure. But I would take the hottest day in Tucson over a hot day in Washington D.C., Chicago, or any other place with that dreadful humidity. The only time it is really uncomfortable is when the humidty rolls in with the monsoon. But that is my favorite time of year because the storms are great!

The scarcity of water is a problem. That is why I advise harvesting rain water. For the independent types on this list, that would be preferable anyway. But if you think you don't have water problems where you live, you might want to check into what is coming out of that tap.

Politically, it is a mix. It isn't liberty heaven, but it is better than most states. We have among the very best gun laws. We have the most open regulations of naturopathic doctors. We have enacted firearms, obamacare, and immigration nullification, and medical mj is down to the wire while they count the last precincts. We have outlawed affirmative action. We have charter schools. We have elected both Barry Goldwater and the first openly gay congressman (who was a Republican and a pretty good rep). And we just re-elected Jeff Flake, probably the second best rep in the U.S. House. Yes, taxes are too high. Where are they not? And the La Raza socialist that was just re-elected was a local machine politician running in what was considered a safe district and he just had the run of his life from a total newcomer. Amazing! On balance I think Arizona compares well with ANY state on liberty issues.

Arizona has PLENTY of industry. Arizona is huge in mining (mostly copper), has plenty of agriculture, tourism from around the world, and some high-tech industry that spins off of the major universities.

Yes, Tucson is a socialist town, but it is inept and unfunded. So it really doesn't have the tools to make the dream (nightmare) come true. So it remains a sleepy, poorly run, but relatively free small city.