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ericsnow
10-13-2010, 12:47 PM
News article with updates: http://www.philipbrennan.net/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-evidence-of-neglect-or-abuse-in-care/


Update (13:48 CST)
There is significant bleeding and swelling around the private parts of Baby Cheyenne and the child is being referred to a paediatrician who specialises in the medical and forensic evidence of abuse.
Baby Cheyenne is under the jurisdiction of the police while in hospital, not the CPS, and unconfirmed reports are that the deputy now has the foster parents in custody for questioning regarding the injuries sustained to Baby Cheyenne.
Only the foster parents are in the frame for this, as there is a sheriff as a witness to the discovery. The sheriff is very unlikely to perjure himself after a full disclosure was made of the facts on national radio via the Alex Jones Radio Show on GCNLive.com (http://www.gcnlive.com/).
Jonathan and Stephanie are still at the hospital and are believed to be with their daughter.
Update (14:00 CST)
Baby Cheyenne has been taken to a sexual assault speciality Doctor under police escort. The sheriff is with the baby. Stephanie and Jonathan are following them, along with CPS. Baby Cheyenne is 'fussy', going in and out of consciousness, and when she is awake doesn't want any one touching her, which shows the level of her injuries and distress.
Update (14:16 CST)
Baby Cheyenne has been taken out of CPS custody by the sheriff, who has taken over the whole case. She is being seen by a sexual abuse specialist. There were also abrasions on her vaginal area.



The New developments in the Cheyenne Irish CPS kidnapping case are going to blow this wide open.

John Irish called into the live show on Alex's cell phone at about 12:40CT.

When the mother and father were given visitation due to public pressure, and the baby arrived she was lethargic... they decided to change the baby's diaper since that will usually rouse the child... when the diaper came off their was blood all over her vaginal area.

The DHHS worker that was there to supervise the visitation mumbled..."We're screwed." overheard by Irish.

YouTube - John Irish with an Emergency update on The Alex Jones Show - Wed 10.13.2010 part-10 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abk5W5nRf28&feature=player_embedded)

YouTube - John Irish with an Emergency update on The Alex Jones Show - Wed 10.13.2010 part-11 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8z5Md4wOcs&feature=player_embedded)

Reason
10-13-2010, 12:55 PM
wtf...?

amy31416
10-13-2010, 12:57 PM
If it's true...Jesus Christ. If it's not...it's blatant manipulation to get us "crazy people" out and about and using violence on the government.


And that probably won't end well.


....


ETA: Changing a baby's diaper rouses them when they're lethargic? That seems odd.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 12:59 PM
This just might piss people off. Maybe this time.
If not it will be one more sad story.

:mad:

FrankRep
10-13-2010, 01:00 PM
Baby Cheyenne reportedly “Bleeding from Private Parts” in Government Care (http://freekeene.com/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-repordely-bleeding-from-private-parts-in-government-care/)


Free Keene
October 13, 2010


There is troubling news on this story. Johnathan and Stephanie went to visit their child today. Details are a bit sketchy at this point, but Cheyenne is reportedly loosing consciousness, bleeding out of her private parts, and has not gained weight.
...


Update (2:30 p.m.) Baby Cheyenne is currently being transported by sheriff’s deputies from the hospital to a sexual abuse specialist on the recommendation of the ER doctor. The baby has regained consciousness, and the sheriff has taken custody of the child from DCYF.

Kylie
10-13-2010, 01:01 PM
ETA: Changing a baby's diaper rouses them when they're lethargic? That seems odd.

Yes.

A cold wet wipe to the ass will wake anyone up, ya know.



CPS or whatever they're called better hope to God that this is not true. Because there will be hell to pay, both monetarily and(I'm afraid) physically.

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-13-2010, 01:01 PM
Has this been confirmed through any statements by a member of the Sheriff's department or a released statement from a physician at the hospital. If this is the real deal (and as a Father myself, I pray it is not) than shit is about to get real ugly, real fast.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:02 PM
The worker mumbled "we're screwed" ? Give me a break! This seems shady.

Bruno
10-13-2010, 01:02 PM
omg, poor child if this is true! :(

UtahApocalypse
10-13-2010, 01:03 PM
Baby Cheyenne reportedly “Bleeding from Private Parts” in Government Care (http://freekeene.com/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-repordely-bleeding-from-private-parts-in-government-care/)


Free Keene
October 13, 2010

Update (2:30 p.m.) Baby Cheyenne is currently being transported by sheriff’s deputies from the hospital to a sexual abuse specialist on the recommendation of the ER doctor. The baby has regained consciousness, and the sheriff has taken custody of the child from DCYF.

Can this be confirmed at all??? if so things just changed a crap load.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 01:04 PM
I had just gotten back online and saw this,
http://www.philipbrennan.net/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-evidence-of-neglect-or-abuse-in-care/
Baby Cheyenne: Evidence of Neglect or Abuse in Care

Confirmed reports have come to our attention that Baby Cheyenne is either being neglected or abused in the care of foster parents.

When Jonathan and Stephanie arrived at at scheduled visit the baby would not wake up. They decided to change the diaper as that will wake up a baby. As they did, they discovered blood in her diaper and was found to be coming from her privates. The sheriff is a witness to this fact and the baby has been rushed to hospital by the sheriff as this discharge is not within the normal levels expected due to hormonal changes in a new born baby girl.


These foster parents also have Stephanie's other two children in their care from her former relationship.

From FB,

Free Baby Cheyenne via Laurie Bethel "Update: The Dr. at the hospital has recommended
that the baby be examined by a sexual abuse specialist. The family is
in route to the specialist right now."

http://www.facebook.com/freebabycheyenne

Kotin
10-13-2010, 01:04 PM
......


If this is true, i have no words.

angelatc
10-13-2010, 01:05 PM
It's not abnormal for infant girls to have vaginal bleeding for the first week or so.

http://www.freemd.com/vaginal-bleeding-in-infants/

Bern
10-13-2010, 01:06 PM
This does not make sense.

http://www.teamteabag.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/0330chewbacca.jpg

amy31416
10-13-2010, 01:06 PM
Yes.

A cold wet wipe to the ass will wake anyone up, ya know.



CPS or whatever they're called better hope to God that this is not true. Because there will be hell to pay, both monetarily and(I'm afraid) physically.

Well sure, a cold wipe to the ass would wake anyone up, but I'm talking about how, when looking at a lethargic child who was stolen from you, you'd say to yourself "I know how to relieve this lethargy with a good diaper change!"

Rather than, uh, these hostile strangers have had my baby, and I'm going to examine her to make sure she's okay, to the best of my ability.

And yeah, the "we're screwed" comment is also weird.

Seems contrived.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 01:06 PM
ETA: Changing a baby's diaper rouses them when they're lethargic? That seems odd.

As the father of two children I can tell you that changing a newborns diaper wakes them up instantly. They don't like being exposed to cold air, and are much more content to be wrapped up in a blanket "burrito".

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:07 PM
Think about this people! Baby Cheyenne is high profile!!! Why would they abuse her?? If she is hemorrhaging then she has a health issue that needs to be addressed !! But it doesn't necessarily mean she's being abused.

Kregisen
10-13-2010, 01:08 PM
Can anyone summarize the full story of this whole incident to someone who hasn't been paying attention and is too lazy to go find it himself?

dannno
10-13-2010, 01:08 PM
Wow, they are giving that baby waaaayyy too many hormones or something..

FrankRep
10-13-2010, 01:08 PM
Think about this people! Baby Cheyenne is high profile!!! Why would they abuse her?? If she is hemorrhaging then she has a health issue that needs to be addressed !! But it doesn't necessarily mean she's being abused.

In either case, she needs a medical check up.

amy31416
10-13-2010, 01:08 PM
It's not abnormal for infant girls to have vaginal bleeding for the first week or so.

http://www.freemd.com/vaginal-bleeding-in-infants/

How many days old is the baby?


What are the symptoms of vaginal bleeding in infants?
Symptoms of normal vaginal bleeding in infants include a few drops of blood per day, for less than 3 days. Symptoms of abnormal vaginal bleeding in infants include bleeding for more than 2 days, bleeding that starts after 1 week of age, fever, fussiness, vomiting, or weight loss.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 01:08 PM
It's not abnormal for infant girls to have vaginal bleeding for the first week or so.

http://www.freemd.com/vaginal-bleeding-in-infants/

apparently the volume is far greater than expected, The sheriff has actually removed the child from the foster home and placed it in the hospital.

Thats the rumor anyway.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:09 PM
In either case, she needs a medical check up.

Yes, as I mentioned.

amy31416
10-13-2010, 01:10 PM
As the father of two children I can tell you that changing a newborns diaper wakes them up instantly. They don't like being exposed to cold air, and are much more content to be wrapped up in a blanket "burrito".

I'll take your word for it...makes sense. :)


Think about this people! Baby Cheyenne is high profile!!! Why would they abuse her?? If she is hemorrhaging then she has a health issue that needs to be addressed !! But it doesn't necessarily mean she's being abused.

Yeah...that.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 01:12 PM
Think about this people! Baby Cheyenne is high profile!!! Why would they abuse her?? If she is hemorrhaging then she has a health issue that needs to be addressed !! But it doesn't necessarily mean she's being abused.

no no,

apparently this happened outside the hospital in the care of the foster parents.

The baby was removed from foster care, brought back to the hospital, where the biological parents are enroute to now.

Also apparently, a physician is assessing for sex abuse.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:15 PM
no no,

apparently this happened outside the hospital in the care of the foster parents.

The baby was removed from foster care, brought back to the hospital, where the biological parents are enroute to now.

Also apparently, a physician is assessing for sex abuse.

Regardless, she's high profile, not likely they would abuse her with all the attention focused on her. I pray it's a fixable medical condition and that's all.

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-13-2010, 01:16 PM
As the father of two children I can tell you that changing a newborns diaper wakes them up instantly. They don't like being exposed to cold air, and are much more content to be wrapped up in a blanket "burrito".

I have to agree with Aravoth here. A diaper change would wake up all three of mine in an instant and they were usually none too happy about it either.

JoshLowry
10-13-2010, 01:16 PM
I hope the baby is ok.

:(

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:18 PM
I have to agree with Aravoth here. A diaper change would wake up all three of mine in an instant and they were usually none too happy about it either.

If she's sick, she's not going to respond to a diaper change. If she's got an abnormal amount of blood, then she's sick. Hopefully it's fixable. I highly doubt it's abuse. At least I pray to God it isn't.

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-13-2010, 01:18 PM
If this is confirmed than nothing good will come of it.

If it turns out to be hyperbole than nothing good will come of it.

Either way this is a terrible situation and I just hope the baby is o.k.

MikeStanart
10-13-2010, 01:19 PM
I fear a tsunami is approaching.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:19 PM
Can I please ask everyone to pray for this baby right now? And if you're an atheist, please send positive thoughts her way right now?

MikeStanart
10-13-2010, 01:20 PM
If this is confirmed than nothing good will come of it.

If it turns out to be hyperbole than nothing good will come of it.

Either way this is a terrible situation and I just hope the baby is o.k.

This.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 01:21 PM
Poor girl, She has had a rough few days.

:(

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-13-2010, 01:21 PM
Can I please ask everyone to pray for this baby right now?

Already doing it

and I second this request.

Kylie
10-13-2010, 01:21 PM
Regardless, she's high profile, not likely they would abuse her with all the attention focused on her. I pray it's a fixable medical condition and that's all.

You would think not, but there are some truly sick fucks out there. Blame it on the parents, ya know?

I would think they would pull her other two children out of this foster home, since the mere idea of that baby being touched is reason to check the others.

I would be losing my mind right now if I were these parents.

angelatc
10-13-2010, 01:22 PM
apparently the volume is far greater than expected, The sheriff has actually removed the child from the foster home and placed it in the hospital.

Thats the rumor anyway.

Yes, but it is just as likely that the exam is to protect the state as it is the baby. (And that's obviously the outcome I'm hoping for.)

I would bet you that if the hospital report(s) comes back with the determination that the blood is entirely from natural causes, it won't matter. It will instantly be deemed part of a conspiracy.

angelatc
10-13-2010, 01:24 PM
As the father of two children I can tell you that changing a newborns diaper wakes them up instantly. They don't like being exposed to cold air, and are much more content to be wrapped up in a blanket "burrito".

Swaddling for the win! We need to get Amy a baby now.

I'm not sure any of my babies could ever have been described as "lethargic" though. That troubled me more than the blood.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 01:24 PM
Yes, but it is just as likely that the exam is to protect the state as it is the baby. (And that's obviously the outcome I'm hoping for.)

I would bet you that if the hospital report(s) comes back with the determination that the blood is entirely from natural causes, it won't matter. It will instantly be deemed part of a conspiracy.
This will depend on the Sheriff and what kind he is.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 01:25 PM
Yes, but it is just as likely that the exam is to protect the state as it is the baby. (And that's obviously the outcome I'm hoping for.)

I would bet you that if the hospital report(s) comes back with the determination that the blood is entirely from natural causes, it won't matter. It will instantly be deemed part of a conspiracy.

Yeah, but there are certain things you just can't hide. Laboratory test results are one of those.

heavenlyboy34
10-13-2010, 01:25 PM
:eek:

tangent4ronpaul
10-13-2010, 01:26 PM
How incredibly bizarre that CPS would hand over the kidnapped children to foster parents so soon and especially before custody had been worked out. Normally they like to keep them close at hand - presumably as human shields to keep the number of car and truck bombs at bay...

The life expectancy of a CPS thug is not stellar...

-t

aravoth
10-13-2010, 01:29 PM
Update 19:48 BST (14:48 CST)

There is significant bleeding and swelling around the private parts of Baby Cheyenne and the child is being referred to a paediatrician who specialises in the medical and forensic evidence of abuse.

Baby Cheyenne is under the jurisdiction of the police while in hospital, not the CPS, and unconfirmed reports are that the deputy now has the foster parents in custody for questioning regarding the injuries sustained to Baby Cheyenne.

Only the foster parents are in the frame for this, as there is a sheriff as a witness to the discovery. The sheriff is very unlikely to perjure himself after a full disclosure was made of the facts on national radio via the Alex Jones Radio Show on GCNLive.com.

Jonathan and Stephanie are still at the hospital and are believed to be with their daughter.

Update 20:00 BST (15:00 CST)

Baby Cheyenne has been taken to a sexual assault speciality Doctor under police escort. The sheriff is with the baby. Stephanie and Jonathan are following them, along with CPS. Baby Cheyenne is 'fussy', going in and out of consciousness, and when she is awake doesn't want any one touching her, which shows the level of her injuries and distress.

Update 20:16 BST (15:16 CST)

Baby Cheyenne has been taken out of CPS custody by the sheriff, who has taken over the whole case. She is being seen by a sexual abuse specialist. There were also abrasions on her vaginal area.

Looks like the sherriff pulled the plug on CPS. I work in a hospital, and I can tell you, that normally when a sex abuse specialist is called in, it's usually for a good reason.

Thomas
10-13-2010, 01:31 PM
Wtf! >:{

amy31416
10-13-2010, 01:31 PM
Swaddling for the win! We need to get Amy a baby now.



:eek:

UtahApocalypse
10-13-2010, 01:33 PM
This seems like the state knows the have a keg full of powder and WANT to light the fuse.

JoshLowry
10-13-2010, 01:34 PM
That's terrible news aravoth.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:34 PM
Looks like the sherriff pulled the plug on CPS. I work in a hospital, and I can tell you, that normally when a sex abuse specialist is called in, it's usually for a good reason.

"Abrasions" ??????? This had better be hype. I'm getting sick.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:36 PM
They need to pull her other children away from those parents until the truth is known. Why should they be given the benefit of the doubt when the biological parents weren't even given it?

Cowlesy
10-13-2010, 01:36 PM
This is just terrible news. Please pray for this child.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 01:37 PM
They need to pull her other children away from those parents until the truth is known. Why should they be given the benefit of the doubt when the biological parents weren't even given it?

Because foster parents are state certified, biological parents are not.

amy31416
10-13-2010, 01:38 PM
They need to pull her other children away from those parents until the truth is known. Why should they be given the benefit of the doubt when the biological parents weren't even given it?

The foster parents in charge of this infant also have the other children?

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 01:39 PM
First and foremost I pray and send thoughts of love for this child.
I hope and pray that this is a medical condition, and medical condition only, that can be healed and healed quickly.
I also pray that the parents may find some measure of spirit to get them through these difficult times.

aGameOfThrones
10-13-2010, 01:42 PM
YouTube - The Dominos Fall (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OxQX9fYf2aI)

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 01:43 PM
The foster parents in charge of this infant also have the other children?

From what I've read in the other thread, yes.

roho76
10-13-2010, 01:44 PM
I hope they are taking the baby to a different hospital than the one she was Kidknapped from. And I hope this Sherriff has any brains what so ever and is in the process of arresting everyone involved at all levels. This is one of the most disturbing things I have ever heard of in my life.

/hugs children

bossman068410
10-13-2010, 01:46 PM
Was the baby just recently Vaccinated?

Modern_Matthew
10-13-2010, 01:48 PM
I hope every police officer, judge, social worker, and foster parent involved in this case are locked up never to see the light of day again. :mad:

Actually, I hear there's a cell opening in a Chilean mine. Send them there to rot.

Inkblots
10-13-2010, 01:48 PM
How is it possible that every time I check in on this case, things have gotten worse? Never before have I hoped something is a hoax this much.

My prayers are with the baby.

Cowlesy
10-13-2010, 01:52 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.

TonySutton
10-13-2010, 01:55 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.

I didn't know your name was Prudence :p

brandon
10-13-2010, 02:00 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 02:02 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.

Quite so. From what I have read on medical sites and from two mothers that I just called it would seem that vaginal bleeding in infants is a normal occurrence.
It is often considered a sign that the infants system is working as the level of the mother's hormones in the baby's system gradually decreases.
As a male that knows nothing regarding this my blood pressure went through the roof when I read this.
Let us just pray that the situation is the normal one regarding infants and that she will remain healthy.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 02:04 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.

I have been posting news as it presents itself from the beginning of this story.
It seemed odd, and was confirmed. I have posted video and news as it has been posted.
I would hope that folks will get behind the Oath Keepers, And pray for this little girl at the center of this shitstorm.

Vessol
10-13-2010, 02:05 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?

This. I'm saving any thoughts until more comes out.

MRoCkEd
10-13-2010, 02:05 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.
+1

On the other side, Baby Cheyenne's Grandfather is on the side of CPS, saying the only thing they did wrong was list his son's Oathkeepers affiliation.

YouTube - "Oath Keeper Baby" granddad backs CPS (DCYF) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=knFeIyeuSy8&feature=sub)

aravoth
10-13-2010, 02:05 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.

You're right. This case has a soft spot for me as I am a father of two small children, and got accused of abuse by a physician that misdiagnosed my son multiple times.

I know the horror of the state first hand. In my case my son does have a very serious condition, and, because I work in the medical field, I had an edge over the situation managed to get all charges dropped, the case dismissed, and physician is about to lose it all.

I was also lucky that the CPS worker wasn't totally stupid, and he even told us at one point that it seemed as if the entire situation was created by the physician to take notice off of my son's mis-diagnosis.

I used to think that anyone charged with a crime this horrendous had to be guilty, because charges of child abuse do not just get thrown around.

I'm here to tell you, that they do just get thrown around. My son is living proof of that.

Meatwasp
10-13-2010, 02:09 PM
Let's keep in mind this is an internet forum.

Often times, the first breaking news we get of things is false. In Rand's primary race, a precinct reported that had Rand far out of favor, and people started spinning.

Nine times out of ten, things reported in a hurry on the internet are wrong, slanted or exaggerated.

This is an extremely important case, because it concerns a new-born's well-being. Reports like this immediately raise the hackles of not just all the Moms and Dads on the forums, but those who care about our fellow man.

Just be prudent in spreading information around, and make sure it is accurately sourced. There are also a lot of unscrupulous people who see every crisis as an opportunity to promote their pet cause/point of view or even to cause damage.

Please keep that in mind as the situation unfolds, and conflicting information is brought to light.

Prudence.
Your are so right as usual

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 02:16 PM
+1

On the other side, Baby Cheyenne's Grandfather is on the side of CPS, saying the only thing they did wrong was list his son's Oathkeepers affiliation.

YouTube - "Oath Keeper Baby" granddad backs CPS (DCYF) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=knFeIyeuSy8&feature=sub)

Oh boy, this is getting uglier by the minute.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 02:16 PM
+1

On the other side, Baby Cheyenne's Grandfather is on the side of CPS, saying the only thing they did wrong was list his son's Oathkeepers affiliation.

]
Excuse me but that guy was just quoting SPLC position.
They a have Hit list that includes Ron Paul and other Patriots as well as the OathKeepers.
The MIAC Report proved their connection and ideology.

I don't know who coached this guy, but he hit their talking points.
:(

Bruno
10-13-2010, 02:18 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?

Some sick bastard who can't control himself and thinks they can get away with it?

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 02:24 PM
Some sick bastard who can't control himself and thinks they can get away with it?

That is possible. It is also possible that the conditions are natural, that the foster parents really believe they are doing a good thing by looking after this child and are doing this the best they can.
Just as we should not jump to conclusions regarding Irish and Taylor then so should we not jump to conclusions regarding the foster parents.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 02:24 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?

Is there evidence that is what happened?

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 02:25 PM
Some sick bastard who can't control himself and thinks they can get away with it?

Damn. That sounds familiar.

MKUltra
Franklin savings Sex Scandal
FamTrak

The sick bastards have had control for a long time.

PatriotOne
10-13-2010, 02:25 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?

If pedophiles had any self control they wouldn't be pedophiles. There are people within CPS who take babies to give to pedophiles/satanists. It is part of the MK Ultra program (or whatever they are calling it these days) to begin their abuse as a baby to create Multiple Personallity Disorders so each personality could be programmed.

I don't know if that is the case this time....but if she is found to of been sexually abused then she was probably taken for specifically this purpose.

PatriotOne
10-13-2010, 02:26 PM
Damn. That sounds familiar.

MKUltra
Franklin savings Sex Scandal
FamTrak

The sick bastards have had control for a long time.

I see we are on the same wave link. I posted MK Ultra at exactly the same time. I'm getting a sick feeling in my stomach :(

UtahApocalypse
10-13-2010, 02:27 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?

Someone or something wanted to light the fuse on this powder keg.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 02:30 PM
Someone or something wanted to light the fuse on this powder keg.

Or more than one "line in the sand" converging on the same point.

Baptist
10-13-2010, 02:31 PM
Seems fishy. Who would intentionally damage the vagina of a week old baby when they know the circumstances surrounding the baby are extremely high profile?


Foster Parents. Foster homes attract pedophiles and perverts. If you want to guarantee that your child gets raped before they are a teenager, send them to a foster home. Anything is possible with sick humans these days. There are no limits to evil. Men in South Africa rape babies all the time because they think it will cure them of AIDS. Us normal people sit here on this forum saying "why would they harm such a high profile baby?" Perverts are not normal so they do not think this way. Even if the foster parents did not do anything to the child, another foster child in the home could have. Foster kids bounce from home to home getting molested left and right. It should be no surprise if they themselves play house or doctor with other foster kids.

This is shocking but not surprising. CPS is of the devil and should not exist.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 02:31 PM
Excuse me but that guy was just quoting SPLC position.
They a have Hit list that includes Ron Paul and other Patriots as well as the OathKeepers.
The MIAC Report proved their connection and ideology.

I don't know who coached this guy, but he hit their talking points.
:(

The SPLC position is that the DCYF was wrong in mentioning Johnathan's affiliation with Oath Keepers, Oath keepers is non violent, and Oath Keepers is a noble organization?

ronpaulhawaii
10-13-2010, 02:31 PM
Someone or something wanted to light the fuse on this powder keg.

3VOL will conquer all

Slutter McGee
10-13-2010, 02:33 PM
If pedophiles had any self control they wouldn't be pedophiles. There are people within CPS who take babies to give to pedophiles/satanists. It is part of the MK Ultra program (or whatever they are calling it these days) to begin their abuse as a baby to create Multiple Personallity Disorders so each personality could be programmed.

I don't know if that is the case this time....but if she is found to of been sexually abused then she was probably taken for specifically this purpose.

Oh brother. Can we please not use this horrible situation for the purpose of promoting ridiculous conspiracy theories about satanists.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

shoshanshopon
10-13-2010, 02:34 PM
Oh boy, this is getting uglier by the minute.

This audio seems to have all the uncensored details (starts at about 8:20 in):

http://archives2010.gcnlive.com/Archives2010/oct10/CalltoDecision/101210.mp3

aravoth
10-13-2010, 02:35 PM
This entire thing is just bullshit.

Baby taken away @ 16 hours old, because of bruising, that could have easily happened during delivery.

CPS putting the child in Foster Care only days old.

The fucking Grandfather thinks CPS is doing everything right, when he himself could have claimed rights over the child because he is the baby's grandparent and cared for the kid himself!

Now the Kid may have been abused in foster care. A rumor that is quickly bearing more and more truth. Why would the Sheriff take custody away from CPS if there wasn't something fucked up going on?

I don't care what your feeling are with regard to the parents, if this days old child was sexually abused in foster care then fault rests squarely on the State. Period.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 02:37 PM
The fucking Grandfather think CPS is doing everything right, when he himself could have claimed right because he is the baby's grandparent and cared for the kid himself!
.

Johnathan is not the legal father and his dad is not the legal grandfather.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 02:38 PM
Oh brother. Can we please not use this horrible situation for the purpose of promoting ridiculous conspiracy theories about satanists.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

Do you have some reason to be defending satanists?
Innocent till proven guilty I understand. But,,,

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 02:38 PM
This entire thing is just bullshit.

Baby taken away @ 16 hours old, because of bruising,

Source?

fisharmor
10-13-2010, 02:39 PM
I don't care what your feeling are with regard to the parents, if this days old child was sexually abused in foster care then fault rests squarely on the State. Period.

And it took three pages for someone to mention it.

Dr.3D
10-13-2010, 02:40 PM
Do you have some reason to be defending satanists?
Innocent till proven guilty I understand. But,,,

But, but.... it's a religion.

Can't have religion bashing on these forums can we? :rolleyes:

Arklatex
10-13-2010, 02:40 PM
if anyone knew the truth of what is going on on this planet you'd be mortified and livid beyond anger.

What PatriotOne said is true.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 02:41 PM
Johnathan is not the legal father and his dad is not the legal grandfather.

Yes, but the legal father is not the biological father, and wants nothing to do with the child. If the State can't figure out who the goddamn father is based off of a simple DNA test then you can add that to the list of retarded State policies that don't fucking work.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 02:46 PM
Yes, but the legal father is not the biological father, and wants nothing to do with the child. If the State can't figure out who the goddamn father is based off of a simple DNA test then you can add that to the list of retarded State policies that don't fucking work.

No law is going to cover situation. When the state considers a law they can not anticipate every possible out come. In a situation where a guy is having children with some one else's there are bound to be complications.
law is a man and there fore can not contain sovereign knowledge.

Dr.3D
10-13-2010, 02:48 PM
if anyone knew the truth of what is going on on this planet you'd be mortified and livid beyond anger.

What PatriotOne said is true.

You just said a mouthful. If only people knew what was really going on.
Truth really is stranger than fiction.

Bruno
10-13-2010, 02:48 PM
And it took three pages for someone to mention it.

Probably because we all knew it, goes without saying

Anti Federalist
10-13-2010, 02:50 PM
Johnathan is not the legal father and his dad is not the legal grandfather.

Jonathan Irish is listed in the court documents as the father.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 02:50 PM
Update: FFWD to 4:20 to hear from Jonathan Irish

YouTube - John Irish with an Emergency update on The Alex Jones Show - Wed 10.13.2010 part-15 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=odYaVsyA9qc)

PatriotOne
10-13-2010, 02:53 PM
Oh brother. Can we please not use this horrible situation for the purpose of promoting ridiculous conspiracy theories about satanists.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

It is a fact not a theory. Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable.

Slutter McGee
10-13-2010, 02:57 PM
It is a fact not a theory. Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable.

No. What makes me uncomfortable is the situation that this thread is about. But not speculating too much is a good thing. And that includes speculation that CPS workers are planning on selling the baby to a satanic cult for ritual sacrifice or whatever the hell you are talking about.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

squarepusher
10-13-2010, 02:58 PM
maybe we can change this thread title?

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:01 PM
No. What makes me uncomfortable is the situation that this thread is about. But not speculating too much is a good thing. And that includes speculation that CPS workers are planning on selling the baby to a satanic cult for ritual sacrifice or whatever the hell you are talking about.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

Perhaps you are unfamiliar with other documented and publicized cases. Or with the long history of abuse within this system.
You might educate yourself.

ericsnow
10-13-2010, 03:01 PM
YouTube - Baby Cheyenne Abused/Assaulted Under The Custody of New Hampshire Social Services Goons!!! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unYGlVeLzcA)

SEND THIS VIDEO TO DRUDGE

drudge@drudgereport.com

teacherone
10-13-2010, 03:01 PM
can't we get a thread title change up in here-- something less anatomical.

makes me sick every time it pops up.

brandon
10-13-2010, 03:01 PM
maybe we can change this thread title?

Seriously.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 03:02 PM
Perhaps you are unfamiliar with other documented and publicized cases. Or with the long history of abuse within this system.
You might educate yourself.

I have yet to watch Conspiracy of Silence.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:02 PM
maybe we can change this thread title?
Why?
:confused:

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:03 PM
can't we get a thread title change up in here-- something less anatomical.

makes me sick every time it pops up.

good, It should.

Kylie
10-13-2010, 03:03 PM
maybe we can change this thread title?

To what?

This is what it is. Making it look pretty isn't going to change it.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 03:04 PM
can't we get a thread title change up in here-- something less anatomical.

makes me sick every time it pops up.

Seriously, Oh it's done.



THANKS MODS!

Kylie
10-13-2010, 03:04 PM
good, It should.


Word.

brandon
10-13-2010, 03:05 PM
Why?
:confused:


To what?

This is what it is. Making it look pretty isn't going to change it.

Out of respect for the people involved. In all likely hood this is going to turn out to be nothing.

Slutter McGee
10-13-2010, 03:05 PM
good, It should.

Yes...because what the situation needs is more emotionally charged reactions.

Whatever,

Slutter McGee

Bruno
10-13-2010, 03:06 PM
"health crisis"?

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 03:06 PM
Think about this people! Baby Cheyenne is high profile!!! Why would they abuse her?? If she is hemorrhaging then she has a health issue that needs to be addressed !! But it doesn't necessarily mean she's being abused.

It may not be a health issue. It is pretty normal for newborn baby girls to menstrate during the first week or two. I think it is more common in children that bottle fed.
It has to do with them getting used to not having their mothers hormones in the same concentration as when they are in the womb.

Stuff like this separates the rational from the irrational.

Danke
10-13-2010, 03:06 PM
I fear a tsunami is approaching.

Wrong thread.


Anyone else find it curious that a cold wipe to her ass won't disturb Amy's rest?

aravoth
10-13-2010, 03:07 PM
Anyone else find it curious that a cold wipe to her ass won't disturb Amy's rest?

yes I do.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:09 PM
"health crisis"?

http://www.facebook.com/freebabycheyenne

Slutter McGee
10-13-2010, 03:10 PM
Perhaps you are unfamiliar with other documented and publicized cases. Or with the long history of abuse within this system.
You might educate yourself.

Seriously, what is your issue? Is this thread about the CPS connection with satanism and other conspiracy theories? Im not going to respond anymore on that issue, even if you do. I see no need to sidetrack this thread into a debate on on such a subject.

Slutter McGee

Bruno
10-13-2010, 03:13 PM
http://www.facebook.com/freebabycheyenne

thanks, but I was referring to the thread title change.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:16 PM
thanks, but I was referring to the thread title change.

yeah that is much more politically correct.
Th possibility of baby rape offends some people.
:mad:

Bern
10-13-2010, 03:19 PM
...Anyone else find it curious that a cold wipe to her ass won't disturb Amy's rest?

proof or GTFO

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 03:20 PM
Why would the Sheriff take custody away from CPS if there wasn't something fucked up going on?

Because it would be the right thing to do or also to cover their ass?


I don't care what your feeling are with regard to the parents, if this days old child was sexually abused in foster care then fault rests squarely on the State. Period.

Damn straight.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:20 PM
It may not be a health issue. It is pretty normal for newborn baby girls to menstrate during the first week or two. I think it is more common in children that bottle fed.
It has to do with them getting used to not having their mothers hormones in the same concentration as when they are in the womb.

Stuff like this separates the rational from the irrational.

I see your still posting on FB too Jeff.


Jeff Cambeis M wife is a pediatric nurse, she has infomred me that it is very common for baby girls to menstruate in the first week or two after birth. It has to do with the hormones she received from her mother in the womb building up her uterus

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 03:21 PM
Truth

http://www.youngparents.com.sg/qa/i-heard-most-girls-get-%E2%80%9Cbaby-menstruation%E2%80%9D-some-point-during-first-two-months.-why-does-happen%3F

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 03:22 PM
I see your still posting on FB too Jeff.

I see you still jumping at the wind

Kylie
10-13-2010, 03:23 PM
Out of respect for the people involved. In all likely hood this is going to turn out to be nothing.

Touche'.

Slutter McGee
10-13-2010, 03:24 PM
yeah that is much more politically correct.
Th possibility of baby rape offends some people.
:mad:

You remind me of a Democrat, trying to get people emotionally charged so they won't think things through and use reason. That doesn't mean you might not be right. But the key word in your post is "possibility".

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:24 PM
I see you still jumping at the wind

No , but I am out of the way when the shit hits the fan.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:29 PM
You remind me of a Democrat, trying to get people emotionally charged so they won't think things through and use reason. That doesn't mean you might not be right. But the key word in your post is "possibility".

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

The children abused By high ranking government officials in the Franklin scandal were real people.
The children used for experimentation in MK Ultra were also real people.

The people that set up FamTrak were real people and had a very good reason to do so.
Google FamTrak,
The folks involved are mostly dead or missing. It was shut down.

Emotional, no, I'm well past that.
:mad:

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 03:33 PM
yeah that is much more politically correct.
Th possibility of baby rape offends some people.
:mad:

I'm sure when she gets older and bing's her name online, she'd be proud to read about her vagina bleeding and dozens of unknown people talking about it.

brandon
10-13-2010, 03:33 PM
Google FamTrak,
:mad:


I just did. The only matches that came up were some half-assed blog and your posts on this forum.

JoshLowry
10-13-2010, 03:35 PM
I see you still jumping at the wind

Google has only one other result in the world that uses the phrase "jumping at the wind" in the same context as you.

I've never heard of it. Is it like pissing in the wind? Are there any harmful effects if one were to jump at the wind?

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 03:36 PM
I've never heard of it. Is it like pissing in the wind? Are there any harmful effects if one were to jump at the wind?

Jumping at the wind sounds like a good way to fall down.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:38 PM
Google has only one other result in the world that uses the phrase "jumping at the wind" in the same context as you.

I've never heard of it. Is it like pissing in the wind? Are there any harmful effects if one were to jump at the wind?

Birds do it all the time. when the launch into flight.

I jump into the wind on a motorcycle.

Pericles
10-13-2010, 03:42 PM
Google has only one other result in the world that uses the phrase "jumping at the wind" in the same context as you.


That was enlightening + Rep for you.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:42 PM
I just did. The only matches that came up were some half-assed blog and your posts on this forum.

An overview of what it was.
http://apatriotsmanifest.com/oct08/index08102501.html

More from Old Warrior.
http://www.awrm.org/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=print_topic;f=43;t=000102

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 03:42 PM
nvm possible derail......

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 03:52 PM
No news since this,
http://freekeene.com/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-repordely-bleeding-from-private-parts-in-government-care/comment-page-1/

Update (2:30 p.m.) Baby Cheyenne is currently being transported by sheriff’s deputies from the hospital to a sexual abuse specialist on the recommendation of the ER doctor. The baby has regained consciousness, and the sheriff has taken custody of the child from DCYF.


Update 20:16 BST (15:16 CST)

Baby Cheyenne has been taken out of CPS custody by the sheriff, who has taken over the whole case. She is being seen by a sexual abuse specialist. There were also abrasions on her vaginal area.

squarepusher
10-13-2010, 03:56 PM
To what?

This is what it is. Making it look pretty isn't going to change it.

lets get our facts straight first, in the case that no wrong doing was done, in hindsight it would be pretty alarmist to have the title as it was.

I want the state/CPS to pay as much as anyone, but it may discredit us if we act too soon, another poster posted a link that possible this type of incident can be normal for the first 2 weeks of life, and there was no wrongdoing by the caretakers. The Dr will be able to give a decision, and if we question his integrity on the conclusion that's another matter.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 04:00 PM
Live Radio Update: http://www.thewatchmen.biz/Live.html

Show is ending. Stephanie and Jonathan were on.

Kylie
10-13-2010, 04:01 PM
lets get our facts straight first, in the case that no wrong doing was done, in hindsight it would be pretty alarmist to have the title as it was.

I want the state/CPS to pay as much as anyone, but it may discredit us if we act too soon, another poster posted a link that possible this type of incident can be normal for the first 2 weeks of life, and there was no wrongdoing by the caretakers. The Dr will be able to give a decision, and if we question his integrity on the conclusion that's another matter.

I understand.


I've had close dealings with situations like this, so I am not the most logical person when it comes to hurting babies. That happens when you're too young to do anything about someone hurting your family.

I'm a mom too. When it comes to hurting ours, or anyones, babies, I see red. Is it reasonable? No.

But it is what it is.

TC95
10-13-2010, 04:02 PM
http://www.facebook.com/freebabycheyenne

From the Facebook page:


they found a hair near the baby's genitals. They aren't charging anyone, and gave John the hair in a plastic bag, didn't want to look at any evidence and basically had them leave. I'm just absolutely speechless at this point


:mad:

Bruno
10-13-2010, 04:04 PM
^ Why would they give the hair to John? Why wouldn't the authorities keep it for analysis?

MelissaWV
10-13-2010, 04:08 PM
A hair near an infant's privates...

Doesn't it seem like that could have fallen off of any number of person's scalps as they were changing the baby?

Perhaps someone else was trying to "rouse" the child earlier.

And yeah... I've never heard the thing about changing a diaper to rouse a child, either. That's kind of strange, that it's the first thing someone would think of.

osan
10-13-2010, 04:09 PM
Looks like the sherriff pulled the plug on CPS. I work in a hospital, and I can tell you, that normally when a sex abuse specialist is called in, it's usually for a good reason.


Holy hell - that poor child. Barely comes into the world and this happens?

I will tolerate much but this is way beyond the pale. The child has my prayers as does anyone meting out justice for the guilty parties.

Time to fashion waxen dolls.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 04:10 PM
And yeah... I've never heard the thing about changing a diaper to rouse a child, either. That's kind of strange, that it's the first thing someone would think of.

It's common and normal. Often taught in hospitals and in private by lactation consultants and pediatricians.

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 04:10 PM
No news since this,
http://freekeene.com/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-repordely-bleeding-from-private-parts-in-government-care/comment-page-1/

Honestly Pete, given the situation I would not expect, nor hope for less, these actions being taken.
It seems they are covering their six and it should be expected without implying anything.
I will reserve judgment for now.
Yes I am aware of foster parents that take on their role for nefarious ends.
I personally know some that do it as a commitment for their faith and good nature. They are constantly under scrutiny and walk a very thin line. Many of the kids that are placed with them come with some serious shit attached. They deal with it far better than I ever could.
Let's not pronounce judgment on the foster parents until we know more facts.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:10 PM
^ Why would they give the hair to John? Why wouldn't the authorities keep it for analysis?
Perhaps for independent analysis and investigation.
Perhaps the Sheriff had reason. Still waiting on news.

But there will be a Rally tomorrow at the Courthouse.

Instant-K9
10-13-2010, 04:13 PM
A hair near an infant's privates...

Doesn't it seem like that could have fallen off of any number of person's scalps as they were changing the baby?


That's too logical Melissa.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:14 PM
Let's not pronounce judgment on the foster parents until we know more facts.

No, The foster parents are not my focus , The CPS is. The Police State is. And they are both well connected.

Dr.3D
10-13-2010, 04:16 PM
Perhaps for independent analysis and investigation.
Perhaps the Sheriff had reason. Still waiting on news.

But there will be a Rally tomorrow at the Courthouse.

The chain of custody of the evidence has been broken. I seriously doubt there will be any analysis or investigation as to the source of that hair. As it is now, any hair could be used to replace the one in the plastic bag and thus it is no longer evidence.

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 04:17 PM
No, The foster parents are not my focus , The CPS is. The Police State is. And they are both well connected.

Thanks for clarity and I agree.

squarepusher
10-13-2010, 04:18 PM
^ Why would they give the hair to John? Why wouldn't the authorities keep it for analysis?

i have to say, its not often police would simply give out evidence in an ongoing investigation ... ?

Bruno
10-13-2010, 04:19 PM
i have to say, its not often police would simply give out evidence in an ongoing investigation ... ?

That's what I was thinking

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:20 PM
I am hoping for the Sheriff to be an honest man and insulated from the "system".
He has custody now according to reports.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 04:21 PM
If your baby is sleepy here are some suggestions to help keep the baby awake and interested:

Burp and change diaper.

http://www.mother-2-mother.com/cc-baby-A.htm#SleepyBabies

susano
10-13-2010, 04:22 PM
OMFG. OH NO!!!!!

Just saw this on GLP and came here.

This is surreal.

Does this show you state defending assholes HOW FUCKING WRONG YOU WERE?

Have these psychos retaliated against the baby?

Dr.3D
10-13-2010, 04:23 PM
OMFG. OH NO!!!!!

Just saw this on GLP and came here.

This is surreal.

Does this show you state defending assholes HOW FUCKING WRONG YOU WERE?

Have these psychos retaliated against the baby?

We really don't know very much about the situation right now.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:26 PM
We really don't know very much about the situation right now.

We really don't know very much about this situation right now.
All we can go on is previous actions of those involved.
:(

tangent4ronpaul
10-13-2010, 04:39 PM
We really don't know very much about this situation right now.
All we can go on is previous actions of those involved.
:(

uh - yeah - if you are talking about all of CPS's crimes (Kidnapping being their primary M.O.) and cases of child abuse in their care, that would take months, if not years to itemize....

But it is sort of amazing that the original thread has 120 pages of posts, this one has 16 pages of posts and there are 2 more on the same topic when "we really don't know what's going on". Slow news week guys?

If someone can figure out what is really going on and then publicize it - a lot of pissed off people might make a diff. Right now, a handfull of pissed off people doesn't really help. I don't see this as that "high profile" - lotta people don't even know who Alex Jones is and many of them would discount it just because he's reporting on it if they did.

There are Senate and House debates every day on C-SPAN and the election is just around the corner. If you are in a state with a liberty candidate some door knocking or phone banking might make a difference right now.

just sayin...

-t

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:45 PM
uh - yeah - if you are talking about all of CPS's crimes (Kidnapping being their primary M.O.) and cases of child abuse in their care, that would take months, if not years to itemize....

But it is sort of amazing that the original thread has 120 pages of posts, this one has 16 pages of posts and there are 2 more on the same topic when "we really don't know what's going on". Slow news week guys?

If someone can figure out what is really going on and then publicize it - a lot of pissed off people might make a diff. Right now, a handfull of pissed off people doesn't really help. I don't see this as that "high profile" - lotta people don't even know who Alex Jones is and many of them would discount it just because he's reporting on it if they did.

There are Senate and House debates every day on C-SPAN and the election is just around the corner. If you are in a state with a liberty candidate some door knocking or phone banking might make a difference right now.

just sayin...

-t

There is a Rally tomorrow. And this will break as a major civil rights story.
The Oath Keepers are going to press the Freedom Of Association charges.
They have a legitimate case.

Anti Federalist
10-13-2010, 04:45 PM
I see your still posting on FB too Jeff.

Prolific troll is prolific.

He's stinking up the comment section at OKs as well.

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2010/10/11/confirmed-court-did-rely-on-oath-keeper-association-to-take-baby/

LOL, got banned, upon further reading.




A Reader (Jeff's post ban name)

So, I find it interesting my comments are deleted, when the point out the inaccuracies of Stewart’s claims — but the kinds of behavior on OK which show dangerous tendencies are ignored.

If I didn’t know better, I would think Stewart WANTS people to act up.

That nails it for me.

Prolific troll is a cop or a Fed.

tangent4ronpaul
10-13-2010, 04:48 PM
There is a Rally tomorrow. And this will break as a major civil rights story.
The Oath Keepers are going to press the Freedom Of Association charges.
They have a legitimate case.

Some national media coverage would be good (and I mean TV news, not AJ) - has there been any?

A rally might work - hopefully....

-t

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:50 PM
Some national media coverage would be good (and I mean TV news, not AJ) - has there been any?

A rally might work - hopefully....

-t

I only saw one story on MSNBC. State sided spin, but obviously uncomfortable.
Was posted ,,,somewhere here.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 04:54 PM
The chain of custody of the evidence has been broken. I seriously doubt there will be any analysis or investigation as to the source of that hair. As it is now, any hair could be used to replace the one in the plastic bag and thus it is no longer evidence.

Correct, that hair will never be used for analysis other than for Johnathan's piece of mind.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 04:58 PM
Prolific troll is prolific.

He's stinking up the comment section at OKs as well.

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2010/10/11/confirmed-court-did-rely-on-oath-keeper-association-to-take-baby/

LOL, got banned, upon further reading.



That nails it for me.

Prolific troll is a cop or a Fed.

BHAHAHAAHAHAA.
You admit to trolling forums in your evidence to show that I am a troll. Hysterical. Especially because I am not who you claim I am.

This is why nutters never get any credibility. They always know beyond a shadow of doubt that their secret truth is fact. It is a evangelical cultish belief that is held to aggressively.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 04:59 PM
There are a few vocal folks that keep trying to shift the discussion to the personalities rather than the Civil Rights Abuse.
They pick at small obscure laws and unfounded allegations and ignore the Violations to 1st ,2nd and 4th amendments. Damn,likely the whole bill of rights at some point.

The Oath Keepers are going to focus on the huge 1st Amendment violation.
If everyone else piles on we can gang kick this beast .

amy31416
10-13-2010, 05:02 PM
Wrong thread.


Anyone else find it curious that a cold wipe to her ass won't disturb Amy's rest?


yes I do.


proof or GTFO

Shaddap, the whole lot of ya...!


A hair near an infant's privates...

Doesn't it seem like that could have fallen off of any number of person's scalps as they were changing the baby?

Perhaps someone else was trying to "rouse" the child earlier.

And yeah... I've never heard the thing about changing a diaper to rouse a child, either. That's kind of strange, that it's the first thing someone would think of.

Alleged satanists aside, I'm not willing to lose my shit yet, but if it is true? Ohh man, they've got a huge mess on their hands.

Never heard of it changing the diaper as a way of rousing a child either, but I guess I'll go with what many others have said, like the following...


It's common and normal. Often taught in hospitals and in private by lactation consultants and pediatricians.

MelissaWV
10-13-2010, 05:05 PM
It's common and normal. Often taught in hospitals and in private by lactation consultants and pediatricians.

Someone brings you your baby that was nabbed and away from you for some time. She seems lethargic, on the verge of losing consciousness, etc.. Your first thought is "let's change her diaper"? It seems odd to me. It's not odd in the "oh they're just making it up" way, or the "I bet they did something to their baby" way, but it's still very odd.

* * *

What's critical is to find originals of the documentation that lists Oath Keepers affiliation as a negative, and demonstrate that the authorities used that as even a sliver of the basis for their decision to remove the infant. What is also critical is to line up a nice group of experts who will point out that the hospital could have been kept secure enough for the infant's safety to be assured while the mother could administer care, bond, and breastfeed, and how crucial such things are to a child's development.

If all of those things can be done, there's a cause to rally and there are cases that can be brought. If that documentation doesn't exist, or if the family is found to be "shady" (ie - allegations surrounding this "hair" don't pan out and the family looks like crazies, or maybe the blood is part of a medical problem and not some strange sign of sexual abuse and the family cried wolf on that), then it will not be an uphill battle, because it won't be a battle at all.

Sola_Fide
10-13-2010, 05:05 PM
It this is true, this is the kind of thing that will cause a war....and the government knows it.

Anti Federalist
10-13-2010, 05:07 PM
It this is true, this is the kind of thing that will cause a war....and the government knows it.

Which is why you got cops trying to defuse the whole mess by throwing FUD.

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 05:07 PM
The Oath Keepers are going to press the Freedom Of Association charges.
They have a legitimate case.

Wouldn't this be a case you would hope the ACLU would be willing to join in on?

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 05:10 PM
STFU, cop.

BAHAHAHAHHAAA @ you

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 05:12 PM
Someone brings you your baby that was nabbed and away from you for some time. She seems lethargic, on the verge of losing consciousness, etc.. Your first thought is "let's change her diaper"? It seems odd to me. It's not odd in the "oh they're just making it up" way, or the "I bet they did something to their baby" way, but it's still very odd.


Newborns sleep a lot. What would have been my first choice is to take my shirt and bra off and the baby's clothes and get skin to skin and breast feed. Does that seem odd to you too?

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 05:13 PM
It this is true, this is the kind of thing that will cause a war....and the government knows it.

I do hope they are not pushing for that, but the thought crossed my mind.

There are several "lines in the sand" here. And Armed and Open Carrying folks are not unknown there.
Oath Keepers, have always kept distance from the Militia, but the Militia supports the stand of the Oath Keepers. The Sons of Liberty will be there to. John was a member there too.
It would be unwise to provoke there tomorrow.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 05:13 PM
Newborns sleep a lot. What would have been my first choice is to take my shirt and bra off and the baby's clothes and get skin to skin and breast feed. Does that seem odd to you too?

That seems like the right and proper thing to do.

This is Jonathan's first kid, I use to freak out with my first kid too.

MelissaWV
10-13-2010, 05:14 PM
Newborns sleep a lot. What would have been my first choice is to take my shirt and bra off and the baby's clothes and get skin to skin and breast feed. Does that seem odd to you too?

Only given your avatar photo :p

That would actually have been a great reaction given the circumstances surrounding this case. Again, I'm not talking about the reaction they did have being so strange as to cast some kind of suspicion on them. It's just... more... strange. If this turns out to be caused by abuse or neglect, it will be serendipitous for the parents to have caught it.

squarepusher
10-13-2010, 05:14 PM
Someone brings you your baby that was nabbed and away from you for some time. She seems lethargic, on the verge of losing consciousness, etc.. Your first thought is "let's change her diaper"? It seems odd to me. It's not odd in the "oh they're just making it up" way, or the "I bet they did something to their baby" way, but it's still very odd.

* * *

What's critical is to find originals of the documentation that lists Oath Keepers affiliation as a negative, and demonstrate that the authorities used that as even a sliver of the basis for their decision to remove the infant. What is also critical is to line up a nice group of experts who will point out that the hospital could have been kept secure enough for the infant's safety to be assured while the mother could administer care, bond, and breastfeed, and how crucial such things are to a child's development.

If all of those things can be done, there's a cause to rally and there are cases that can be brought. If that documentation doesn't exist, or if the family is found to be "shady" (ie - allegations surrounding this "hair" don't pan out and the family looks like crazies, or maybe the blood is part of a medical problem and not some strange sign of sexual abuse and the family cried wolf on that), then it will not be an uphill battle, because it won't be a battle at all.

agree Meli, it seems really odd, even if the foster family was a satanic abusing family, I don't know if they would risk it on such a high profile case. The documents with Oath Keepers associations is up in full on their website. It lists several reasons that are blacked out, but on reason #7, it lists the Oath Keepers and non attendance of an anti-violence class, as well as firearms purchases.

my instinct is that something is fishy with these charges, of course we should see them out and have them investigated

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 05:15 PM
Newborns sleep a lot. What would have been my first choice is to take my shirt and bra off and the baby's clothes and get skin to skin and breast feed. Does that seem odd to you too?

Only if you weren't planning on breastfeeding. :) That's pretty much what is advised by lactation consultants and pretty much mainstream belief nowadays aint it?

MelissaWV
10-13-2010, 05:16 PM
agree Meli, it seems really odd, even if the foster family was a satanic abusing family, I don't know if they would risk it on such a high profile case. The documents with Oath Keepers associations is up in full on their website. It lists several reasons that are blacked out, but on reason #7, it lists the Oath Keepers and non attendance of an anti-violence class, as well as firearms purchases.

my instinct is that something is fishy with these charges, of course we should see them out and have them investigated

I know why the documents would (and should) be blacked out on websites... my points were more about what they need to be doing to have a case in court(s). If the documents are copies of copies, and the originals don't add up to the discrimination being alleged, then there's simply nothing there but the "same old same old" abuse CPS has been handing out like candy for many years and, sadly, the courts are not going to go and reverse that right yet.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 05:17 PM
This is the mother's 3rd baby as far as I know.

The hormones of both the mother and newborn are probably really out of whack from being separated. The mother is being watched close by strangers during visitation, and they haven't really had much time to bond.

susano
10-13-2010, 05:27 PM
Prolific troll is prolific.

He's stinking up the comment section at OKs as well.

http://oathkeepers.org/oath/2010/10/11/confirmed-court-did-rely-on-oath-keeper-association-to-take-baby/

LOL, got banned, upon further reading.



That nails it for me.

Prolific troll is a cop or a Fed.


"Jeff", "A Reader", "Doc Bernard" and a few others there have been trolling and shilling since day one. Some of them have seriously bad grammar which made me wonder if they aren't people hired by the SPLC to spam OK.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 05:37 PM
"Jeff", "A Reader", "Doc Bernard" and a few others there have been trolling and shilling since day one. Some of them have seriously bad grammar which made me wonder if they aren't people hired by the SPLC to spam OK.

What is truly puzzling, is who keeps giving these ___________ +rep.
And why are they not banned.

:confused:
:(

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 05:39 PM
And why are they not banned.
:confused:
:(

What forum rules have they broken? And have you alerted the mods to their violations?

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 05:44 PM
What forum rules have they broken? And have you alerted the mods to their violations?
Insulting forum members, and yes,, one of the rare occasions that I have reported.
Also that they just show up, and are on other forums pushing the Character Assassination angle.
Obvious troll is obvious.

susano
10-13-2010, 05:47 PM
What is truly puzzling, is who keeps giving these ___________ +rep.
And why are they not banned.

:confused:
:(


Where do you see this "rep" thing?

yes, I don't understand why obviouls trolls aren't banned. Their agenda is as plain as day.

__________________________


regarding changing a diaper: Did it ever to you, Melissa, that they may have thought Cheyenne was just sleepy? Not until the screaming and bloody diaper would they have realized something much worse was going on. CPS also has a repuation for drugging their child victims.

Lets not forget that Nancy Schaefer and husband were MURDERED for exposing the criminal racket that is CPS. They've been busted over and over for fraud, falsifying evidence to steal children, taking "orders" for children, and putting children in homes with known abusers.

I'm appalled at all of the benefit of the doubt being given to this criminal syndicate and not the parents who have NOT been criminally charged or convicted of any abuse against any child.

What will wake you people up? A murdered Cheyenne?

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 05:48 PM
Insulting forum members, and yes,, one of the rare occasions that I have reported.
Also that they just show up, and are on other forums pushing the Character Assassination angle.
Obvious troll is obvious.

Fair enough. I hadn't noticed as I just put em on ignore long ago. Works for me. I'd recommend just not engaging them.

aravoth
10-13-2010, 05:49 PM
this giving the hair thing to the dad makes zero sense. Does anyone actually have confirmation of this?

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 05:50 PM
Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
Insulting forum members, and yes,, one of the rare occasions that I have reported.
Also that they just show up, and are on other forums pushing the Character Assassination angle.
Obvious troll is obvious.

Gotta love irony

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 05:51 PM
this giving the hair thing to the dad makes zero sense. Does anyone actually have confirmation of this?

Nope. But the Sheriff stepping in and overruling CPS is rare also. Still waiting for more news. Hopefully the videographers will have some.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 05:53 PM
this giving the hair thing to the dad makes zero sense. Does anyone actually have confirmation of this?

The article on freekeen said the police took no evidence and that the evidence was gathered by Irish.

Unless it was pubic hair, if it belonged to the foster parents I dont see it being much use.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 05:56 PM
Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
Insulting forum members, and yes,, one of the rare occasions that I have reported.
Also that they just show up, and are on other forums pushing the Character Assassination angle.
Obvious troll is obvious.

Gotta love irony

Are you saying that I have been trolling this forum since 2007 ?

Please elaborate
post any "credentials" you have.

I am known. Many know my name, where I live, what I have been doing.
My "education" Criminal history, and family life.

And I have a Hatonhelmet.

Who are you?
:(
and just what are you doing here?

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 06:02 PM
Are you saying that I have been trolling this forum since 2007 ?

Please elaborate
post any "credentials" you have.

I am known. Many know my name, where I live, what I have been doing.
My "education" Criminal history, and family life.

And I have a Hatonhelmet.

Who are you?
:(
and just what are you doing here?

I am just asking if name calling is considered character assassination.
You have my FB page I am sure with your criminal history education you have investigated me.

Dr.3D
10-13-2010, 06:10 PM
I am just asking if name calling is considered character assassination.
You have my FB page I am sure with your criminal history education you have investigated me.

Ha, ha, ha.... I know his "education" and his criminal history.


As for name calling... if the name he called you is true, it isn't considered character assassination. Was the name true?

susano
10-13-2010, 06:12 PM
I have yet to watch Conspiracy of Silence.

Make sure you do.

In that case, the Frankin Cover Up, the vitims were put in prison for their testimony against the perps (the political, law enforcement and church establishment).

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 06:14 PM
I am just asking if name calling is considered character assassination.
You have my FB page I am sure with your criminal history education you have investigated me.
Yeah,puzzles me why some guy from California would be smearing a kid in NH.

squarepusher
10-13-2010, 06:20 PM
Where do you see this "rep" thing?

yes, I don't understand why obviouls trolls aren't banned. Their agenda is as plain as day.

look at the bottom of a persons box, and there is a scale icon you can click to change someoens reputation


The article on freekeen said the police took no evidence and that the evidence was gathered by Irish.

Unless it was pubic hair, if it belonged to the foster parents I dont see it being much use.

so this is Irish's private investigation? :o

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 06:24 PM
Update 00:00 BST (19:00 CST)
Johnathan's lawyer left him in the dust because he feels that he does not have enough time to prepare a professional defense. Johnathon is preparing to go into that courtroom tomorrow and defend himself. If you know a lawyer that might take this case let Watchman Noyes know. Or it's pretty much all over but the crying. http://www.philipbrennan.net/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-evidence-of-neglect-or-abuse-in-care/

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 06:26 PM
so this is Irish's private investigation? :o
I have no Idea about that, but there are likely people in the area capable of such investigation.

How do you think july4patriot was cleared of the "grenade Launcher"?

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 06:33 PM
Update 00:00 BST (19:00 CST)
Johnathan's lawyer left him in the dust because he feels that he does not have enough time to prepare a professional defense. Johnathon is preparing to go into that courtroom tomorrow and defend himself. If you know a lawyer that might take this case let Watchman Noyes know. Or it's pretty much all over but the crying. http://www.philipbrennan.net/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-evidence-of-neglect-or-abuse-in-care/

Motion to delay.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 06:37 PM
Update 00:00 BST (19:00 CST)
Johnathan's lawyer left him in the dust because he feels that he does not have enough time to prepare a professional defense. Johnathon is preparing to go into that courtroom tomorrow and defend himself. If you know a lawyer that might take this case let Watchman Noyes know. Or it's pretty much all over but the crying. http://www.philipbrennan.net/2010/10/13/baby-cheyenne-evidence-of-neglect-or-abuse-in-care/

Doesn't he have a right to court appointed legal defense?

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 06:47 PM
Doesn't he have a right to court appointed legal defense?

Only in a legitimate criminal trial.
:(

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 06:50 PM
Then he should file a motion to delay, like Phill said. He should let the judge know that his lawyer bailed on him. :(

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 06:51 PM
Doesn't he have a right to court appointed legal defense?

Maybe you mean that he has the right to a journeyman attorney that might be swayed by the DA to provide a less than stellar defense if that public defender ever chose to become a public prosecutor?

Edit: And that is no poke at you DK. Just my belief about "public" defenders.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 06:53 PM
Maybe you mean that he has the right to a journeyman attorney that might be swayed by the DA to provide a less than stellar defense if that public defender ever chose to become a public prosecutor?

Sorry but I don't believe that all court appointed defense lawyers won't try their hardest to defend their clients. If nothing else, it looks good on the resume.

tropicangela
10-13-2010, 06:54 PM
Ridley reports that DCYF have disconnected their phone number.
7 minutes ago

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 06:59 PM
Sorry but I don't believe that all court appointed defense lawyers won't try their hardest to defend their clients. If nothing else, it looks good on the resume.

You're correct and I don't believe that all court appointed attorneys behave in this manner. My statement was a generalization. That generalization comes from experience through friends and family.
A "public" defender is just that.
A plea deal to a lesser charge also looks good on a resume.
And that is how it works.
For the most part. There are always exceptions.

Jcambeis
10-13-2010, 07:04 PM
Doesn't he have a right to court appointed legal defense?

I dont believe in NH family court. This is an factual outrage. The idea that you have to become a potential criminal to have a lawyer is beyond the description of four letter words.
The idea that some guy that confesses to rape and murder can get an attorney paid for by the people he raped and murdered but DCYF can bring a baseless charge against a poor family and leave the family with out defense.
I do not know how this can be. If you have some ones kid basically held hostage how can you expect them to be able to produce a rational case.

This is a bad situation if Irish is a not abusive. He has the possibility that his little girl was abused given to him the night b4 he has to petition the court to get her back from the place she was abused.

If that was me, if I was not violent b4 I would be violent now.

Mini-Me
10-13-2010, 07:07 PM
You're correct and I don't believe that all court appointed attorneys behave in this manner. My statement was a generalization. That generalization comes from experience through friends and family.
A "public" defender is just that.
A plea deal to a lesser charge also looks good on a resume.
And that is how it works.
For the most part. There are always exceptions.

It almost doesn't matter though, because public defenders are notoriously overworked and understaffed. Even especially gifted attorneys would find themselves fighting an uphill battle against better-prepared opponents in that kind of environment. I guess all of that is moot though, since this isn't a criminal trial anyway...which of course is part of the reason why the "family courts" get away with being so lawless in the first place.

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 07:08 PM
I dont believe in NH family court. This is an factual outrage. The idea that you have to become a potential criminal to have a lawyer is beyond the description of four letter words.
The idea that some guy that confesses to rape and murder can get an attorney paid for by the people he raped and murdered but DCYF can bring a baseless charge against a poor family and leave the family with out defense.

YouTube - Atari Pong Gameplay (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpRzQx9lcXo)

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 07:13 PM
Why did JCambeis get banned??

susano
10-13-2010, 07:14 PM
Ridley reports that DCYF have disconnected their phone number.
7 minutes ago

I read that. Good news.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 07:15 PM
You're correct and I don't believe that all court appointed attorneys behave in this manner. My statement was a generalization. That generalization comes from experience through friends and family.
A "public" defender is just that.
A plea deal to a lesser charge also looks good on a resume.
And that is how it works.
For the most part. There are always exceptions.

How does a plea look good on a resume? I would never hire a defense attorney of a record of plea bargaining.

susano
10-13-2010, 07:17 PM
YouTube - Atari Pong Gameplay (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpRzQx9lcXo)

hahaha

My sentiments as well

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 07:21 PM
How does a plea look good on a resume? I would never hire a defense attorney of a record of plea bargaining.

Sure you would, if they were getting good plea deals for their clients.

speciallyblend
10-13-2010, 07:21 PM
Why did JCambeis get banned??

maybe his use of word violent? seemed ok to me in context of his post so i am not sure!

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 07:21 PM
Why did JCambeis get banned??

Banned, really.
;)

newbitech
10-13-2010, 07:23 PM
Why did JCambeis get banned??

If I had to guess, I'd say he got a little too emotionally invested in the story and is showing signs of an alternate agenda for being in here posting about it. Its like he created an account to push his version of what is going on. Not sure what his motivations are, but if he wants to participate in the forum, I am sure its a temp ban and he will be more than welcome back to discuss other topics once this topic cools a little.

I have been following this thread, and really the only thing that I find interesting is the state agencies trying to link oath keepers as a reason for taking custody. It sounds like part of the MIAC agenda and seeing this notion of domestic terrorist threats spread this far in to common things like child custody battles is concerning to me.

I am sure that this little girl will have to live this time in her life down one day. I am not sure she is safe in the hands of people who would deliver her to her parents with a bloody diaper, no matter what the cause.

If the parents are such a threat, why aren't they being tried for criminal prosecution? If they have no crimes, then why are they and their children being punished?

Too many questions, not enough answers, and certainly not enough facts for a forum noob to get into a mini flame war with a regular poster.

People should learn some forum etiquette. Its not like RPF is some new technology. Forums have been around since the internet, and one thing you don't do as a new member on a forum is make your presence known by insulting regulars. You say what you have to say and go back to reading.

That's my take. I am sure I would have liked to see a warning first, but, I consider temp bans a warning anyways. Its not like he can't go back to doing whatever he has been doing all this time that he hasn't been posting on RPF, right?

I hope he comes back to discuss other topics. I doubt he will.

susano
10-13-2010, 07:24 PM
If Irish is left w/o an atty at the hearing, I wll be thoroughly disgusted with the constitution/liberty movement. Surely, there must be a lawyer in the vicinity, who is pro liberty, who could be there. In the Free State Project, perhaps. Also, what about Rhodes? Does one have to have a license to practice in NH, or it a professional courtesy kind of thing? Bottom line, he can't be w/o a lawyer and i doubt he knows anything about motions.

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 07:25 PM
How does a plea look good on a resume? I would never hire a defense attorney of a record of plea bargaining.

For a "public" defender a plea looks good. If it is a murder first charge and you get them off with a manslaughter you are perceived as winning.
If you don't have the time or the resources to prove them innocent and you convince the client that a plea to a lesser charge is within his best interest then you are assured the reputation of "working within the system." You would save the county time, resources and funds.
Especially if you have a talk with the DA over McAllistars and water over his invite at the local CC.
Shit happens. It happens all the time. History is replete.

Mini-Me
10-13-2010, 07:25 PM
Why did JCambeis get banned??

I don't know, but my best guess would be for the bottom line here:

This is a bad situation if Irish is a not abusive. He has the possibility that his little girl was abused given to him the night b4 he has to petition the court to get her back from the place she was abused.

If that was me, if I was not violent b4 I would be violent now.
He's a new poster, and several regulars have accused him of being a trolling cop or a fed/agent provocateur. I get the feeling a mod construed the last line as promoting violence and decided to ban him "just in case." I didn't see JCambeis post anything ban-worthy, so my best guess is that it was a kneejerk reaction to that bottom line from a mod on high alert for shills. Then again, the mods do have IP information that I don't too, and I haven't followed his posts that closely either.

newbitech has a pretty insightful guess a few posts back, too.

Pericles
10-13-2010, 07:27 PM
BHAHAHAAHAHAA.
You admit to trolling forums in your evidence to show that I am a troll. Hysterical. Especially because I am not who you claim I am.

This is why nutters never get any credibility. They always know beyond a shadow of doubt that their secret truth is fact. It is a evangelical cultish belief that is held to aggressively.

So, why do you feel compelled to show up here in this thread only and set us nutters straight?

PatriotOne
10-13-2010, 07:29 PM
These people need someone to protect them now and make sure no funny business is going on with evidence. Looks like John DeCamp of "Conspiracy of Silence" fame is still practicing. He's 69 yrs old. Maybe he could help or recommend someone he trusts.

http://www.decamplegal.com/attorneys/

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 07:31 PM
So, why do you feel compelled to show up here in this thread only and set us nutters straight?

No worries. Looks like this poster is gone for awhile. Sabbaticals are good cause for reflection.

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 07:36 PM
For a "public" defender a plea looks good. If it is a murder first charge and you get them off with a manslaughter you are perceived as winning.
If you don't have the time or the resources to prove them innocent and you convince the client that a plea to a lesser charge is within his best interest then you are assured the reputation of "working within the system." You would save the county time, resources and funds.
Especially if you have a talk with the DA over McAllistars and water over his invite at the local CC.
Shit happens. It happens all the time. History is replete.

Okay, well if I was innocent of the crime, I sure as hell wouldn't want my attorney plea bargaining.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 07:36 PM
I am just hoping that there is a large crowd of Peaceful and concerned citizens at the courthouse to impress upon the Judge the gravity of this situation.

;)

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 08:03 PM
Okay, well if I was innocent of the crime, I sure as hell wouldn't want my attorney plea bargaining.

Well certainly. And all of us shouldn't. But beliefs and life hit like a watermelon on pavement after a five story fall in court rooms across America.

Your public attorney won't admit that he doesn't have the resources that private attorneys do.
The state will not allow him to check into the lives of your accusers through private investigators to throw doubt on states witnesses testimony.

The justice system is what it is and it favors those that have the means to defend themselves.

In most cases the BEST that a public defender will get you is a lesser plea.

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 08:05 PM
I am just hoping that there is a large crowd of Peaceful and concerned citizens at the courthouse to impress upon the Judge the gravity of this situation.

;)

Is NH open carry? First and second together as it should be?

aravoth
10-13-2010, 08:13 PM
Okay, well if I was innocent of the crime, I sure as hell wouldn't want my attorney plea bargaining.

Either you would, or your husband would.

What the DA and the police do in these situations tell the couple that either the dad will have to take the heat, or the mom will, if neither admits to harming thier child, they will try to remove the child from your custody, and you will never see the baby again. At least that is what they say.

I know this, because this is exactly what they did to me and My wife. The fact that my son has congenital indifference to pain did not concern them in the slightest. They just wanted to hang someone.

We took door number two, and made all of them look stupid, but none of them ever received punishment for putting my kids through it.

Nothing ever happened to my accusers. They accused my wife and I of abuse because my son has an extremely rare genetic disorder, nothing is beyond these people.

newbitech
10-13-2010, 08:16 PM
Well certainly. And all of us shouldn't. But beliefs and life hit like a watermelon on pavement after a five story fall in court rooms across America.

Your public attorney won't admit that he doesn't have the resources that private attorneys do.
The state will not allow him to check into the lives of your accusers through private investigators to throw doubt on states witnesses testimony.

The justice system is what it is and it favors those that have the means to defend themselves.

In most cases the BEST that a public defender will get you is a lesser plea.

Public defenders have no pull with the State Attorneys and judges because of the disparity in class and pay scale.

People become PD's for 2 reasons. They couldn't get a job anywhere else to pay off their huge GovEd debt that was required to study "the law", or 2 they really want to help people who can't afford to help themselves.

I'd imagine that the second option is still pretty rare, because if that was the motivation, one could still start a private practice and do pro-bono work.

Anti Federalist
10-13-2010, 08:16 PM
Mrs. AF went down to the hospital that they had taken the baby to after discovering the bleeding.



http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=189341.40

Okay I am back...

I have some pictures in my phone, if I can ever figure how to put them into my photobucket from my phone.

At any rate, I saw a sheriff's car parked at the 'Emergency Entrance' and a Fire Truck (EMT) vehicle. I went into to the hospital and tried to snoop around for someone talking about this particular incident. I got there after they left, unfortunately.

I saw a nurse (who wished remain anonymous), and asked her very quietly about the Cheyenne Irish. The nurse reiterated what Jonathon Irish told Alex earlier, the baby girl was bleeding in her genital area, and was sent to be examined by an expert. The baby was in the Stafford County Sheriff's custody when they left. Customarily, the Foster Parents will be questioned by the Sheriff's office.

The nurse said, I hope the parents get their baby back!!

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o37/xsfx/1013101614-1.jpg

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 08:22 PM
Thank you.
If we get past "is the story a hoax" mentality and on to what do we do about it, we may be able to have some effect. That or the Beast will come unglued.

Either way.
:cool:

Kylie
10-13-2010, 08:23 PM
That or the Beast will come unglued.

Either way.
:cool:

I'm cool with that.


Fucking bring it.

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 08:29 PM
//

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 08:36 PM
I'm sure glad the nurse was willing to talk about another patient's medical status to some random person. I mean, hell no need for any bit of confidentiality. I hope if I'm ever in the hospital and bleeding out my anus the entire hospital staff is willing to post on facebook about it. :rolleyes:

never lived in a small town huh?

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 08:40 PM
Either you would, or your husband would.

What the DA and the police do in these situations tell the couple that either the dad will have to take the heat, or the mom will, if neither admits to harming thier child, they will try to remove the child from your custody, and you will never see the baby again. At least that is what they say.

I know this, because this is exactly what they did to me and My wife. The fact that my son has congenital indifference to pain did not concern them in the slightest. They just wanted to hang someone.

We took door number two, and made all of them look stupid, but none of them ever received punishment for putting my kids through it.

Nothing ever happened to my accusers. They accused my wife and I of abuse because my son has an extremely rare genetic disorder, nothing is beyond these people.

Good on you Avaroth! You may not have received justice over the accuser, much the shame, but at least you kept your family intact.
That is a win. A win many do not get to have.
Thanks for sharing your personal battle.
You have your own personal fortitude, a wife that shares the same beliefs and a child that all live under the same household.
You seem to use this experience for positive progression.
+rep for you.

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 08:42 PM
//

Son of Detroit
10-13-2010, 08:46 PM
Wow, what a fucking irresponsible nurse.

If that was my hospital she'd be canned in an instant.

speciallyblend
10-13-2010, 08:46 PM
Quite a few actually. So you are saying that a small town negates any professionalism in regards to patient confidentiality? I think the nurse should be fired. esp. since it involves a minor.

if your anus had a kid involved i hope she gets fired for letting us know;) especially on FB!! sarcasm

phill4paul
10-13-2010, 08:49 PM
Public defenders have no pull with the State Attorneys and judges because of the disparity in class and pay scale.

People become PD's for 2 reasons. They couldn't get a job anywhere else to pay off their huge GovEd debt that was required to study "the law", or 2 they really want to help people who can't afford to help themselves.

I'd imagine that the second option is still pretty rare, because if that was the motivation, one could still start a private practice and do pro-bono work.

I agree.

The best defenders have always been non-profit defenders. Not that they didn't make a profit by defending. Just that they weren't part of the largest for-profit organization ever created.
One has to ask themselves why the full investigative powers afforded by the state to prosecute are not afforded to the accused if both the prosecution and the defense are practicing members of the state.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 08:50 PM
Wow, what a fucking irresponsible nurse.

If that was my hospital she'd be canned in an instant.

She confirmed what was known in the news. How is that irresponsible?
Seems that some witnesses might be found in the immediate vicinity to a crime.
Imagine that.
;)

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 08:55 PM
She confirmed what was known in the news. How is that irresponsible?

It's against the law and unprofessional. If you can't see how that is irresponsible then you really are looking with tunnel vision. I have half a mind to send a link to that to the hospitals administration.

Mach
10-13-2010, 08:56 PM
Here is a list in case anyone is interested and hasn't seen them yet...

Betty A. Keegan, DCYF Case Technician Trainee
115 Hansonville Rd, Rochester, NH 03839 (home)
603-335-3461 (home)
603-332-9120 (work) bkeegan@dhhs.state.nh.us

Concord Hospital, 250 Pleasant St., Concord, NH, 03301
603-225-2711 866-349-2790 (direct VP)

603-227-7000 (to dial extenion #s) patient relations 603-230-1902
Admin 3000, general info 4099, maternity 4110, president 4111,
public affairs 4215, security 3999, social services 3013
www.ConcordHospital.com/contact/feedback.php
www.concordhospital.com/contact/phone.php

Dana J. Bickford, Strafford Co DCYF CPS case worker
603-332-9120 (work) dbickford@dhhs.state.nh.us
This is who wrote about guns and Oathkeepers in affidavit! ;)

Dennis M. May, DCYF attorney
603-332-9120 (work) dmay@dhhs.state.nh.us

Francine Carter, DCYF Supervisor V (Dana Bickford's boss)
603-332-9120 (work) fcarter@dhhs.state.nh.us

John Charron, Concord Hospital, Head of Security
not sure which is the right listing-either 18 Pratt St, Nashua, NH, 03060 (home)
603-595-0226 (home)
or 75 Swan Point Rd, Rindge, NH, 03461 (home)
603-899-6171 (home)




District Special Judge Susan W. Ashley
Rochester District Court
76 N. Main St., Rochester, NH, 03867-1905
603-332-3516 (work)

Dover Family Division
25 St. Thomas St.
Dover, NH 03820
603-743-5760

Rochester Family Division, Strafford County Justice and Administration Building
259 County Farm Road/PO Box 799
Dover, NH 03820-0799
(603) 742-5341

Scott D. Overbeck, CASA/GAL
2 Clocktower Place #432 (home)
Nashua, NH, 03060
603-889-5204 (home)

Deborah K
10-13-2010, 09:18 PM
Either you would, or your husband would.

What the DA and the police do in these situations tell the couple that either the dad will have to take the heat, or the mom will, if neither admits to harming thier child, they will try to remove the child from your custody, and you will never see the baby again. At least that is what they say.

I know this, because this is exactly what they did to me and My wife. The fact that my son has congenital indifference to pain did not concern them in the slightest. They just wanted to hang someone.

We took door number two, and made all of them look stupid, but none of them ever received punishment for putting my kids through it.

Nothing ever happened to my accusers. They accused my wife and I of abuse because my son has an extremely rare genetic disorder, nothing is beyond these people.

Wow! hugs

susano
10-13-2010, 09:20 PM
It's against the law and unprofessional. If you can't see how that is irresponsible then you really are looking with tunnel vision. I have half a mind to send a link to that to the hospitals administration.

And, yet you have never called for any of the DCYF goons to be fired or prosecuted, nor for due process for the parents.

Interesting.

pcosmar
10-13-2010, 09:25 PM
It's against the law and unprofessional. If you can't see how that is irresponsible then you really are looking with tunnel vision. I have half a mind to send a link to that to the hospitals administration.

That is how you learn things, You talk to people involved.
I would also have some one with the ability talk to local cops. (Off duty)
But then I have been known to get a government agent drunk, and talkative.
;)

ghengis86
10-13-2010, 09:28 PM
It's against the law and unprofessional. If you can't see how that is irresponsible then you really are looking with tunnel vision. I have half a mind to send a link to that to the hospitals administration.

"The nurse reiterated what Jonathon Irish told Alex earlier, the baby girl was bleeding in her genital area, and was sent to be examined by an expert."

Is the Alex above anyone other than Alex Jones? I apologize if I missed another one in this thread; haven't read it all.

But how is it against medical privacy laws if the nurse reiterated something that the father voluntarily told to a national radio show? Was the information not already in the public domain?

On another note; WTF?!?! This situation is seriously FUBAR

specsaregood
10-13-2010, 09:31 PM
//

ghengis86
10-13-2010, 09:43 PM
It wasn't the nurses job. She should have said: no comment and wtf are you and why are you asking me this?
Confirming or reiterating is still disclosing information.

I'm inclined to agree with you on this, even if the information is already disclosed. But I'm still wondering...I guess in an ideal world the state and its laws wouldn't force this sort of 'don't tell anybody anything, even if it's already been on national media' privacy laws (since when has the state been adept at keeping things private?). there would be privacy policies of differing degrees put in place by hospital owners/administators and people would chose the level of security they wished for the records, information etc.

anyhow...not trying to derail, just musing while we wait for updated information.

susano
10-13-2010, 09:46 PM
On the contrary, I said early on that the person who added the oath keepers to the affidavit needs to be punished. I'm not quite sure it is against the law, so I wouldn't call for them to be fired/prosecuted without knowing that, but I did say they should be reprimanded.

Whereas I know for a fact that disclosing medical information on a patient such as this is illegal, the nurse should be fired and prosecuted. It is particularly disgusting because it is an underage patient.



It wasn't the nurses job. She should have said: no comment and wtf are you and why are you asking me this?
Confirming or reiterating is still disclosing information.

You have chosen to ignore the criminal history of CPS, the fact that the accused do not get due process in family court, and you can't even figure out that the mention of OK and guns was a punishable offence, but by God you want that nurse fired!


-CITE-
18 USC Sec. 241 02/01/2010

-EXPCITE-
TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
PART I - CRIMES
CHAPTER 13 - CIVIL RIGHTS

-HEAD-
Sec. 241. Conspiracy against rights

-STATUTE-
If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or
intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth,
Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any
right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of
the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same;
or
If two or more persons go in disguise on the highway, or on the
premises of another, with intent to prevent or hinder his free
exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege so secured -
They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in
violation of this section or if such acts include kidnapping or an
attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit
aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, they shall be fined
under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life,
or both, or may be sentenced to death.

susano
10-13-2010, 09:49 PM
On the contrary, I said early on that the person who added the oath keepers to the affidavit needs to be punished. I'm not quite sure it is against the law, so I wouldn't call for them to be fired/prosecuted without knowing that, but I did say they should be reprimanded.

Whereas I know for a fact that disclosing medical information on a patient such as this is illegal, the nurse should be fired and prosecuted. It is particularly disgusting because it is an underage patient.



It wasn't the nurses job. She should have said: no comment and wtf are you and why are you asking me this?
Confirming or reiterating is still disclosing information.



Perhaps you can find extra work with Homeland Security in their snitch program.