PA town silences church's bell

[Anti Federalist]

Too loud too early for Manayunk church bell, neighbor complains

By Sam Wood

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/homepage/20100909_Too_loud_too_early_for_Manayunk_church_be ll__neighbor_complains.html?viewAll=Y&text=#comments

Inquirer Staff Writer

For 104 years, the bell at St. John the Baptist Roman Catholic Church in hilly, blue-collar Manayunk has joyfully summoned the faithful to prayer, celebrated marriages, and marked the ends of wars.

Now, in a city whose many sacred symbols include a cracked bell, someone has filed a complaint to silence St. John's 5,000-pound bronze casting.

Not completely. Just in the morning. At 7. That's when it rings 18 times for the Angelus.

The official reason: It's too loud.

The Rev. James A. Lyons, pastor of St. John's, received a warning letter last week from the city Health Department.

The missive threatened the 179-year-old church with fines of up to $700 per day if the pealing bell is found to violate the city's 2006 noise law.

"Air Management Services (AMS) has received citizen's complaints of loud amplified sounds from the above premises every day at 7 a.m. AMS would like to advise you that amplified sound and all other noise . . . shall not exceed five decibels above background level measured at the property boundary of the nearest occupied residential property," states the letter, signed by Roger M. Fey, the city's enforcement officer for air and noise pollution.

[Kregisen]

It's too bad it's such an old bell and apparently has been going off for decades, but on the other hand, if I was being woken up by this every morning and it exceeded the number of decibels allowed, I would want it to stop too.

This isn't an infringement on rights, it's protecting the rights of others.

[Maximus]

If it has been happening for 100+ years, you would think any potential residents should have been alerted to this fact, and if they didn't want to deal with it they could move else where.

It's kind of like the people who complain about parties and noise and live within a few blocks of a university... I'll never get those people

[Icymudpuppy]

I'm siding with Maximus on this one. Complainant is lacking common sense. If they didn't like the bell, why did they move there? Next their going to outlaw waterfalls for making too much noise where somebody built their house and now they want it quiet. We'll have to build a damn and lock system to tame the water flow....

[BlackTerrel]

I'm kind of 50/50 on this. If I was woken up every day I wouldn't be that happy either.

From the Church's perspective - is this really all that big a deal. So you stop ringing your bell. So what?

I've never been to a Church that had a bell to be honest but I'm guessing hundreds of years ago there purpose was to tell people when it was time to go to Church. In the age where we all have watches, and clocks on cell phones and a billion other communication devices is the bell really necessary? Who suffers by silencing it?

[Danke]

The new airport in Denver (DIA) was built far out from the city in farm land. But shortly afterwards developers started building, creating surrounding neighborhoods. I can't wait till the noise complaints starts someday and special noise abatement flight procedures are enacted.

[Bman]

I'm siding with Maximus on this one. Complainant is lacking common sense. If they didn't like the bell, why did they move there? Next their going to outlaw waterfalls for making too much noise where somebody built their house and now they want it quiet. We'll have to build a damn and lock system to tame the water flow....

Reminds me of an idiot couple who moved in next door to my fraternity house and then wanted to complain about noise.

Hello!!! You moved in next door to a fraternity house you moron.

[Maximus]

I'm kind of 50/50 on this. If I was woken up every day I wouldn't be that happy either.

From the Church's perspective - is this really all that big a deal. So you stop ringing your bell. So what?

I've never been to a Church that had a bell to be honest but I'm guessing hundreds of years ago there purpose was to tell people when it was time to go to Church. In the age where we all have watches, and clocks on cell phones and a billion other communication devices is the bell really necessary? Who suffers by silencing it?

I believe the bells were used to mark the passing of time. In the Catholic tradition there is something called to Liturgy of the Hours, it is prayed by all priests and religious, as well as by many lay people (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liturgy_of_the_hours) Anyways bells were used to mark the hours. Time was seen as something that was a gift from God to man (also why charging interest was considered sinful for a long time). The Hours were a means of sanctifying the passing of time. When people worked outside in the fields, the midday bell and others would sound, and people could stop and pray the Angelus or some form of prayer.

Of course bells have also marked weddings, a call to Mass, and other festive events.

Considering all the "noise pollution" in our society, a Church bell is one of the nicer "distractions" in life IMO

[Kludge]

I've heard of this a few other times in the past years. Church bells are no longer necessary and at this point, are a somewhat offensive display of excess.

In my time with Christianity, I was very proud to be of (Ana-leaning)Baptist churches which shunned dedicated buildings, bells, and asking for donations (except in contributing toward specific charities). It's a shame to Christ that so many churches continue building monstrous facilities and hold time-sucking church activities essentially unrelated to spreading Christianity.

Aside from that, it's just asinine to continue making unnecessary noise when people around you are complaining.

... But - OTOH, why am I responding to this? -- Asshole should close his windows and put a pillow over his head instead of complaining to gov't.

[oyarde]

I'm siding with Maximus on this one. Complainant is lacking common sense. If they didn't like the bell, why did they move there? Next their going to outlaw waterfalls for making too much noise where somebody built their house and now they want it quiet. We'll have to build a damn and lock system to tame the water flow....

Correct , Maximus is right .

[JK/SEA]

Every sunday morning i back my race car out of the garage to start it up. It has open headers. I rev it up a few times, let it idle for a few minutes, rev it up again a few times, let it idle again. Then...i yell out FREEDOM! as loud as i can after i'm done. Drowns out the church bell which annoys me....lol

[phill4paul]

Wish I could have found Bob for this. I'll leave it to Heart and Layne Stanley...

YouTube - Heart Feat. Layne Staley - Ring Them Bells (Bob Dylan Cover) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k94gC9_Y5vY)

[xd9fan]

so is it fredom of religion or freedom from religion

the church should make it an issue....dont stop....be bold.....what the hell are they going to do.....have military come in to take to bell away........let them and let the cameras roll.......

its time to be bold and shut the whiners up.

How God damn fragile are we????

[invisible]

so is it fredom of religion or freedom from religion

the church should make it an issue....dont stop....be bold.....what the hell are they going to do.....have military come in to take to bell away........let them and let the cameras roll.......

its time to be bold and shut the whiners up.

How God damn fragile are we????


If the church did that, they'd need to have funds in place for their legal defense, right? For a cause like that (defending yourself against neighbors who hate "offensive noise"), they could probably get Motorhead to play a benefit show. Hold it on their back lawn at 7AM, and none of the neighbors would hear that bell!

[nate895]

If the Pope was worth anything at all, he'd send the money.

[Dr.3D]

Reminds me of the people who bought a house next door to a pig farm and then complained about the smell.

[phill4paul]

Reminds me of the people who bought a house next door to a pig farm and then complained about the smell.

Hey we just got a taxpayer funded overhaul of a sewer treatment facility for just that reason. People moved near then demanded that the rest of the county and state should have to fix the problem.:rolleyes:

[Maximus]

If the Pope was worth anything at all, he'd send the money.

Haha, doesn't quite work that way. Vatican budget has been in the red for two years. The Pope is the Bishop of Rome, he won't interfere in the affairs of a Church under the jurisdiction of a different bishop.

The Pope is "first among equals" with the bishops, unlike the popular view of him in the media, he can't just do anything

[tjeffersonsghost]

If it has been happening for 100+ years, you would think any potential residents should have been alerted to this fact, and if they didn't want to deal with it they could move else where.

It's kind of like the people who complain about parties and noise and live within a few blocks of a university... I'll never get those people

Or the people who complain about airplane noises who live next to an airport or train noises for those who live next to a train track....

[KCIndy]

Reminds me of the people who bought a house next door to a pig farm and then complained about the smell.

LOL you beat me to it, 3D.

Here in Indiana we've had cases in the past where people have done exactly that. A farm has been in the same location for 100+ years, then someone moves in next door "to get away from the city" and then files suit to force the farm to shut down due to the smell.

I frankly don't have much sympathy.

In the case of the church - if the bell ringing has been a constant for over a century, I have little sympathy for the idiot who moves next door and then bitches about the noise. The solution? Close the window. Buy some earplugs. Or... MOVE!

[Kludge]

Don't want your children molested, don't move near registered child molesters. And if your child is raped, don't complain to me!

People who were there first have license to do as they please, even if it violates others natural rights. Clearly, nobody has the right to tell the child molester to stop molesting children - it's in his nature.

[Cowlesy]

Screw the tradition of this church and its community. Stop ringing that bell so this awesome person can sleep in every morning past 7am!