Do you really think Ron Paul can fix us if he was prez?

[keepitlow]

Or is the writing on the wall for America no matter who we have?

[Stary Hickory]

If people have the mindset that some 70 year old white guy can fix their "problems" they are doomed to suffer eternally. The problem with America is it thinks that people who do not know them at all, who are no smarter than anyone of us, can somehow "fix" us.

When people stop asking questions like the one you posted we might have a serious chance to improve things. Ron Paul is great and getting good people in government is a good goal, however we must make things different, we have to fix us ourselves.

I am just concerned with getting the government out of the way, this is where Ron Paul can do us some good. But he will face a political machine, a real beast of special interests. No one man can take that on not even Ron Paul, we have to help and fight ourselves not depend on politicians.

[RM918]

It's less about him fixing us, it's more about what it would MEAN if Paul actually won the presidency. All the factors that led to it could only be enormous boons to the cause even if he accomplishes nothing in office.

If he won the Republican nomination, let alone the presidency, it'd mean a lot of the public would've tossed aside a whole crapload of propaganda. That's the only way things will ever get 'fixed'.

[Kludge]

Ron as president is just a milestone in the unlikely scenario the U.S. survives long enough to be turned around. There is and was a lot of hero worship going on, as though RP's a superhero (similar to criticisms many of those same people would lobby against "The One"), but in reality, a RP presidency won't bring about the radical change many seem to expect. No president has ever run this country.



If the US doesn't survive, future politicians will still probably be strongly influenced by RP's presidency (as many already are by RP's past/current achievements). ... Or the government may collapse around (or during) the time Ron's in and everyone will blame him as they did with Hoover.

[specsaregood]

Isn't this like the 3rd thread with this same topic/subject in the past couple weeks?
I'm detecting a meme, almost seems organized.....

[libertybrewcity]

his would-be veto power is enough of a win for me.

[Elwar]

Let's give it a try and find out.

[MelissaWV]

Isn't this like the 3rd thread with this same topic/subject in the past couple weeks?
I'm detecting a meme, almost seems organized.....

I was about to post the same thing.

Luckily, we didn't go and make two threads about it ;)

But seriously... there's already a thread about this, and it has pages and pages of responses, and over 1,000 views.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=257258&highlight=Save

[YumYum]

He could get a lot accomplished if he would be willing to abuse "Executive Orders". Otherwise, he would have an impossible fight with Congress.

[Pericles]

If people have the mindset that some 70 year old white guy can fix their "problems" they are doomed to suffer eternally. The problem with America is it thinks that people who do not know them at all, who are no smarter than anyone of us, can somehow "fix" us.

When people stop asking questions like the one you posted we might have a serious chance to improve things. Ron Paul is great and getting good people in government is a good goal, however we must make things different, we have to fix us ourselves.

I am just concerned with getting the government out of the way, this is where Ron Paul can do us some good. But he will face a political machine, a real beast of special interests. No one man can take that on not even Ron Paul, we have to help and fight ourselves not depend on politicians.

+1 It is unrealistic to think that the President can fix it all. He can provide leadership and have a great deal of influence, but it takes a number of citizens making it happen to make it work - just as the founders intended. When the citizens elect "false and designing men" to office, and then don't fix it in the next election, you have what we have today.

[erowe1]

The reason I want him to be president is because I know he won't try to fix me.

[specsaregood]

I was about to post the same thing.

GMTA.

A better topic would be, if Dr. Paul thinks the majority of those in power in DC are committing treason by violating their oaths of office......how far would he go to restore the balance of power?

[keepitlow]

If people have the mindset that some 70 year old white guy can fix their "problems" they are doomed to suffer eternally. The problem with America is it thinks that people who do not know them at all, who are no smarter than anyone of us, can somehow "fix" us.

When people stop asking questions like the one you posted we might have a serious chance to improve things. Ron Paul is great and getting good people in government is a good goal, however we must make things different, we have to fix us ourselves.

I am just concerned with getting the government out of the way, this is where Ron Paul can do us some good. But he will face a political machine, a real beast of special interests. No one man can take that on not even Ron Paul, we have to help and fight ourselves not depend on politicians.

Why was my question a bad one?

Fixing ourselves? What does that entail in your eyes?

Getting the gov out of the way? Without gov you'd be speaking Chinese or Russian.Do you mean having an honest gov in place?

How do you plan to fight?

[keepitlow]

I was about to post the same thing.

Luckily, we didn't go and make two threads about it ;)

But seriously... there's already a thread about this, and it has pages and pages of responses, and over 1,000 views.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=257258&highlight=Save

Thanks. Did not see it. Will check it out. This thread can be combined if the mod thinks its is best.

[dannno]

He can help stop the government from doing damage to us.

[keepitlow]

The reason I want him to be president is because I know he won't try to fix me.

When I speak of fix us...I am talking about the USA.

As our country moves to legalize being doped up 24 / 7 (so they can tax it) and making homosexual marriage as normal as apple pie. (To get the gay vote or just from an I don't care, anything goes attitude of the younger generation.) We can see that a 'declining of standards' is the norm for our new world.

This declining of standards is backed by the full faith and overextended credit of our politicians. What else could they do to keep the Ponzi scheme from collapsing, but to water down accepted accounting standards and remove 'mark to market' accounting. It is Enron accounting standards that rule nowadays. S & P, Moody's...have enuf $ and you can buy your ratings.

Recently this issue of declining of standards was driven home in a purchase I made. I needed some thermometers for 2 first aid kits. The old fashioned mercury thermometers are long extinct. What is sold now are digital thermometers. I bought two of them and tested their accuracy. Besides the lack of consistent readings, they were ALL off 1 to 2 degrees and never could reach an accurate reading after dozens of tests. I bought 3 more of another brand and tests showed the same results. All from China of course.

On a trip to Target I checked out about 20 aisles of general merchandise. Lamps, tables, furniture, household items, kitchen etc.. 99.9% from China .01% from Germany, 0% made in the USA.

Went over to cameras, electronics, TV, videos...Same thing, 100% oriental made, 0% US made.

Clothes dept? 0% from the US.

When I was discussing this with someone he pointed out everything I had on from head to foot and even in my pockets and arms and face came from China. (Well, he wasn't exactly right, my underwear came from Honduras.)

Much of our life depends on China selling us cheap items. If products had to be made it in the US instead of China, inflation would really skyrocket. And some items we can't even make, as we lost the technology to make it.

Well, even made in the US of A does not go very far nowadays. Go into any supermarket and pick up a peach. 99% chance it will not have any fuzz on it. It is a capitalist peach. It is made to sell only and not to eat. They have no fragrance, they never ripen but rot first. The reason the peaches have no fuzz is they are picked green, buffed to remove the fuzz and coated with anti-fungals and chemicals. Don't believe me? Soak one in a bowl of water and see the rainbow of colors that comes from the crap coated on it.

Sad state of affairs in the US of A....not a pretty picture of the world that awaits us.

[georgiaboy]

There sure seems to be a concerted effort by the establishment party types to keep him from ever getting there, that's for sure. Wonder why they try so hard to keep him out?

[MN Patriot]

When I speak of fix us...I am talking about the USA.

As our country moves to legalize being doped up 24 / 7 (so they can tax it) and making homosexual marriage as normal as apple pie. (To get the gay vote or just from an I don't care, anything goes attitude of the younger generation.) We can see that a 'declining of standards' is the norm for our new world.

This declining of standards is backed by the full faith and overextended credit of our politicians. What else could they do to keep the Ponzi scheme from collapsing, but to water down accepted accounting standards and remove 'mark to market' accounting. It is Enron accounting standards that rule nowadays. S & P, Moody's...have enuf $ and you can buy your ratings.



Ron Paul supports legalization of drugs, did you know that? Obviously you miss the point of why the War on Drugs is a failure and needs to be ended. NOT to allow people to be doped up 24/7, but to end the gang warfare, imprisonment of millions of nonviolent people, and wasting of billions of dollars to stop something that is unstoppable.

Declining standards are what STARTED the war on drugs: no respect for the Constitution. At least during alcohol prohibition Congress still respected the Constitution. Not any more, Conservatives respect the Constitution as much as Liberals.

I'm not comfortable with the idea of marijuana/cocaine drug stores, but we DO have liquor stores, and legally they can't sell to minors. I would rather have them legalized and regulated, rather than the current situation where any criminal can sell drugs to our kids.

[Jordan]

It would serve as a great way to legitimize libertarian's "wacky" ideas.

[libertybrewcity]

When I speak of fix us...I am talking about the USA.

As our country moves to legalize being doped up 24 / 7 (so they can tax it) and making homosexual marriage as normal as apple pie. (To get the gay vote or just from an I don't care, anything goes attitude of the younger generation.) We can see that a 'declining of standards' is the norm for our new world.

This declining of standards is backed by the full faith and overextended credit of our politicians. What else could they do to keep the Ponzi scheme from collapsing, but to water down accepted accounting standards and remove 'mark to market' accounting. It is Enron accounting standards that rule nowadays. S & P, Moody's...have enuf $ and you can buy your ratings.

Recently this issue of declining of standards was driven home in a purchase I made. I needed some thermometers for 2 first aid kits. The old fashioned mercury thermometers are long extinct. What is sold now are digital thermometers. I bought two of them and tested their accuracy. Besides the lack of consistent readings, they were ALL off 1 to 2 degrees and never could reach an accurate reading after dozens of tests. I bought 3 more of another brand and tests showed the same results. All from China of course.

On a trip to Target I checked out about 20 aisles of general merchandise. Lamps, tables, furniture, household items, kitchen etc.. 99.9% from China .01% from Germany, 0% made in the USA.

Went over to cameras, electronics, TV, videos...Same thing, 100% oriental made, 0% US made.

Clothes dept? 0% from the US.

When I was discussing this with someone he pointed out everything I had on from head to foot and even in my pockets and arms and face came from China. (Well, he wasn't exactly right, my underwear came from Honduras.)

Much of our life depends on China selling us cheap items. If products had to be made it in the US instead of China, inflation would really skyrocket. And some items we can't even make, as we lost the technology to make it.

Well, even made in the US of A does not go very far nowadays. Go into any supermarket and pick up a peach. 99% chance it will not have any fuzz on it. It is a capitalist peach. It is made to sell only and not to eat. They have no fragrance, they never ripen but rot first. The reason the peaches have no fuzz is they are picked green, buffed to remove the fuzz and coated with anti-fungals and chemicals. Don't believe me? Soak one in a bowl of water and see the rainbow of colors that comes from the crap coated on it.

Sad state of affairs in the US of A....not a pretty picture of the world that awaits us.

And the United States keeps dragging itself down. The Republican congress, Bush, the democratic congress starting in 2006, and Obama have messed up this country by expanding and continuing occupations overseas that waste trillions of dollars that should be spent here and kept our people's pockets.

Thanks to the lovely NAFTA agreement, higher taxes, and other nonsense, jobs are being outsourced.

Lastly, when we wake up to the fact that the Federal Reserve is ransacking this country, devaluing our currency, ruining our savings, and creating disastrous bubbles will we begin to return to our standards.

When we read books, educate ourselves, think for ourselves, stop watching Glenn Beck, Fox News, and all the other channels, will we really wake up and change what is happening.

As for gays and standards, who cares? You don't have to be gay or follow them.

[keepitlow]

Ron Paul supports legalization of drugs, did you know that? Obviously you miss the point of why the War on Drugs is a failure and needs to be ended. NOT to allow people to be doped up 24/7, but to end the gang warfare, imprisonment of millions of nonviolent people, and wasting of billions of dollars to stop something that is unstoppable.

Declining standards are what STARTED the war on drugs: no respect for the Constitution. At least during alcohol prohibition Congress still respected the Constitution. Not any more, Conservatives respect the Constitution as much as Liberals.

I'm not comfortable with the idea of marijuana/cocaine drug stores, but we DO have liquor stores, and legally they can't sell to minors. I would rather have them legalized and regulated, rather than the current situation where any criminal can sell drugs to our kids.

The US is already the biggest dope user in the world. No use promoting it.

RP also said he would abolish SS and Medicare and all the rest of the fed handouts of taxpayer $$.

Sounds good, yes it it what we need to return to financial stability of sorts. Except our country has been built on handouts. Seems a lot of deaths would come about from people dependant on that stuff having it ripped out from under them.

If we continue the handouts disaster.

If we cut the handouts disaster.

Good reason to keep the people doped up... to ease their pain.

[keepitlow]

There sure seems to be a concerted effort by the establishment party types to keep him from ever getting there, that's for sure. Wonder why they try so hard to keep him out?

Bad for biz...

[keepitlow]

And the United States keeps dragging itself down. The Republican congress, Bush, the democratic congress starting in 2006, and Obama have messed up this country by expanding and continuing occupations overseas that waste trillions of dollars that should be spent here and kept our people's pockets.

Thanks to the lovely NAFTA agreement, higher taxes, and other nonsense, jobs are being outsourced.

Lastly, when we wake up to the fact that the Federal Reserve is ransacking this country, devaluing our currency, ruining our savings, and creating disastrous bubbles will we begin to return to our standards.

When we read books, educate ourselves, think for ourselves, stop watching Glenn Beck, Fox News, and all the other channels, will we really wake up and change what is happening.

As for gays and standards, who cares? You don't have to be gay or follow them.


I got nothing againt gays. Sure, give them equal rights, but when we crack a dictionary open it defines marriage.

But again if stadards such as marriage and the rest keep going down hill...the trend keeps going down. And down is not good.

We're doing something near to impossible, which is to predict the future. Tons of IF's, AND's and BUT's that could happen. We just don't know.

As futurists we try to anticipate future events and the direction the world is headed in and as survivalists we try to prepare for those circumstances.

Whenever you are confused, always look at the trend.

Things can go in 3 directions...get better...get worse...stay frozen.

Lets look at the trend in our diet.

Who would ever have thought finding real, honest food would be so tough nowadays. I have to drive 125 miles to buy raw milk and grass fed beef. If I don't get lost, I can make the round trip in just under 3 hours.

As far as costs?

Raw milk $9.60 a gal. Grass fed beef for stew cheapest cut $8 a pound. Tack on the $24 gas for the car. (Only have 1 source left for the raw milk...when they are closed down can't buy raw milk any place in driving distance.)

Now, I don't eat or drink much of it cause of the cost and distance. (mostly distance issue) But our food chain keeps decomposing like hell and it is getting harder to feed oneself these days if one is looking for basic untreated natural foods. Here is a rundown on grass fed beef for those that may not know.

The beef and poultry are force fed unnatural diets high on genetically modified corn. (proudly advertised as an 'all-vegetarian diet' on the packaging.) The all grain diet, coupled with growth hormones make the cattle outgrow grass fed cattle more than two to one.

The animals are packed like sushi into confined animal feeding operations and wade though oceans of their own manure. This close quarter confinement and loss of roaming ability also makes the cattle put on weight much faster than grass fed cattle.

The unnatural diet raises hell with their digestion and they have to be given loads of antibiotics to not die. Their digestive tracts culture drug resistant e.coli thanks to the antibiotics and it gets into / onto the meat when they are slaughtered.

As a bonus, a lot the good omega 3 fatty acids have been taken out of grain fed cattle's meat as well as cows milk, cheese, yogurt, butter etc, since they are not fed their natural diet of grass.

Pick up a half gal of organic milk that advertises omega 3. It most likely will be fortified with algae oil. What is left in grain fed meat is an imbalance of too much omega 6 fat that fuels our heart disease problems in the US and not enough omega 3.

The grain fed meat has to be radiated to kill the e.coli but the manure is still high in e.coli and gets into our other food products such as vegetables / spinach / almonds / apple juice etc. These have to be radiated / pasteurized / steam heated / chlorine bathed to try and kill the e.coli as well.

But the antibiotics still make their way into our diet through eating the grain fed meat, drinking the milk, eating the cheese, yogurt, butter. As well as our water supply from people taking the antibiotics as medicine and eating the tainted meat. As humans excrete waste it gets into the water and we drink or bath in it and absorb it up...what a mess!

http://www.foodandwaterwatch.org

Here is a good vid on the water issue...get it from your library.

http://www.amazon.com/Flow-handful-corporations-steal-water/dp/B001EUSYHQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1266073070&sr=1-1

Here is a source on food podcasts to keep up with what is killing us off.

http://www.metrofarm.com/mf_Food_Chain_Radio.php

[Todd]

My concern with Ron Paul as POTUS isn't that he wouldn't be able to effect massive changes. It has more to do with what William Bloom suggested would happen.


If I were the president, I could stop terrorist attacks against the United States in a few days. Permanently. I would first apologize -- very publicly and very sincerely -- to all the widows and the orphans, the impoverished and the tortured, and all the many millions of other victims of American imperialism. I would then announce that America's global interventions -- including the awful bombings -- have come to an end. And I would inform Israel that it is no longer the 51st state of the union but – oddly enough – a foreign country. I would then reduce the military budget by at least 90% and use the savings to pay reparations to the victims and repair the damage from the many American bombings and invasions. There would be more than enough money. Do you know what one year of the US military budget is equal to? One year. It's equal to more than $20,000 per hour for every hour since Jesus Christ was born. That's what I'd do on my first three days in the White House. On the fourth day, I'd be assassinated.

[Flash]

Why was my question a bad one?

Fixing ourselves? What does that entail in your eyes?

Getting the gov out of the way? Without gov you'd be speaking Chinese or Russian.Do you mean having an honest gov in place?



Not exactly.
http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:YDuO-bgOcqMJ:www.freedomainradio.com/free/books/FDR_5_PDF_Practical_Anarchy_Audiobook.pdf+privatiz ed+roads+site:freedomainradio.com&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESjZgo0P_h0TWYCZ3Yo2b6B9jlxdUoIsqK5JD5qG pijVrC8ElEwVc0vrUXNzCskjDLAOeXM0jvlKO_NnxznOI83aur 85GpI2pMC8r_WknxITF0tP5ZiVO8a785Q5ZRJ0mNywR5IM&sig=AHIEtbQRLLhuYA-Qc0JCweg6LqNKWdW5QQ

[specsaregood]

My concern with Ron Paul as POTUS isn't that he wouldn't be able to effect massive changes. It has more to do with what William Bloom suggested would happen.

Oh look, it only took till post 24 to get the "they would assassinate dr. paul" meme. :mad:

Apparently nobody here has enough faith that Dr. Paul recognize the potential threat and able to pick out enough true believers to guard him. Hell, I'd imagine his first 100 days in office could be waged bunker style. If Dr. Paul said it was time to go to the mattresses, a great many would be ready to do just that.

[TheTyke]

The OP seems to challenge many of Dr. Paul's ideas in the first place. Nonetheless, for the sake of explanation:

As Commander and Chief of the U.S. Military, Ron could begin bringing our troops home as quickly as their safety would allow. The president does have control over military deployment during declared wars (which we don't have) so he would definitely start bringing them home. This would dramatically reduce spending, provide better border defense here, and provide a small amount of economic growth.

Furthermore, he would veto any bill that's unconstitutional - no more spending, "stimulus," etc. to keep this recession going. Most of these bills pass with a narrow enough margin (especially with all the good people we're getting elected) that the economy would have a chance to correct itself.

He could use his position to push for an audit/end of the Fed, and awaken millions to free market principles and following the Constitution.

The ultimate point is he could do one heck of a lot of good as president. But one man can't fix everything, and it will be Rand Paul, Mike Lee, Justin Amash and the whole crew of new people who start changing policy in congress. Behind them, thousands of young people will have to rise to the occasion on the campuses, in city councils and state legislatures to start backing him up.

Are we up to the challenge? I think it sounds pretty awesome. :D

[georgiaboy]

Do you really think Ron Paul can fix [America] if he was prez? Or is the writing on the wall for America no matter who we have?

OP is some kinda logical misconstruction there - non sequitor or something.

That said,

Hope is never, ever completely lost.

According to Ron Paul himself, it's not him that's needed, it's the principles he espouses. Anybody can implement the changes needed.

And yes, absolutely, if the right people get into office supporting the correct principles/policies - sizing the fed gov't to within constitutional limits, sound money, ending the empire, then of course we can get the country on the right path. Else, why are we here?

[nobody's_hero]

It's less about him fixing us, it's more about what it would MEAN if Paul actually won the presidency. All the factors that led to it could only be enormous boons to the cause even if he accomplishes nothing in office.

If he won the Republican nomination, let alone the presidency, it'd mean a lot of the public would've tossed aside a whole crapload of propaganda. That's the only way things will ever get 'fixed'.

I agree. If ron paul won it would mean that the American people's attitude has changed for the better. They'll have stopped looking for politicians to fix problems and started fixing them on their own. The only difference is that Ron Paul wouldn't prohibit the people from finding their own solutions, as our current "problem solving" presidents do.

[libertybrewcity]

I just don't see how a decline in "traditional" social values will lead to the end of the world.

[YumYum]

I just don't see how a decline in "traditional" social values will lead to the end of the world.

That is a good observation. I guess its because they would be too busy laying around and having sex to get anything done.

[keepitlow]

I just don't see how a decline in "traditional" social values will lead to the end of the world.

I explained in detail my point about declining of standards.

Do you think the homosexual lifestyles and being doped up all the time as much as you want is what a flourishing society is built on?

In short, if your for homosexual marriage and legal dope, then you must take corrupt politicians, a bankrupt US, poisonous food and world as well.

But, you must take the good with the bad once you go in that direction. You can't pick and choose, no matter how you try. If you like declining standards then go in the direction of an 'anything goes' world.

Watch this short movie. Showcases how people used to live in the 1940s.

http://www.archive.org/details/victory_garden

They didn't have to worry about explaining to their kids how the 2 men next door French kissing on their porch are married and they have anal sex with each other. And it is perfectly OK if you want to marry a man and have anal sex too son.

Like I said. Sure give homosexuals equal rights. They can have legal unions. But destroying marriage is just another one of the declining standards that are bringing us down.

I am an atheist / agnostic. But even in the bible it says to kill homosexuals. So, what do some of the Christian religions do? They make them Bishops!

Kill Homosexuals: "If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Now, I'm not for killing em...live and let live. But I bring it up to illustrate how standards can decline...just from human ego.

You may not like what I'm saying, but I wont lie to you...I just speak the truth.

[MelissaWV]

I never knew the Bible had such awful grammar.

Suffice to say, the above poster is operating under at least one false premise, but likely more. I'll leave it at that.

[heavenlyboy34]

I explained in detail my point about declining of standards.

Do you think the homosexual lifestyles and being doped up all the time as much as you want is what a flourishing society is built on?

In short, if your for homosexual marriage and legal dope, then you must take corrupt politicians, a bankrupt US, poisonous food and world as well.

But, you must take the good with the bad once you go in that direction. You can't pick and choose, no matter how you try. If you like declining standards then go in the direction of an 'anything goes' world.

Watch this short movie. Showcases how people used to live in the 1940s.

http://www.archive.org/details/victory_garden

They didn't have to worry about explaining to their kids how the 2 men next door French kissing on their porch are married and they have anal sex with each other. And it is perfectly OK if you want to marry a man and have anal sex too son.

Like I said. Sure give homosexuals equal rights. They can have legal unions. But destroying marriage is just another one of the declining standards that are bringing us down.

I am an atheist / agnostic. But even in the bible it says to kill homosexuals. So, what do some of the Christian religions do? They make them Bishops!

Kill Homosexuals: "If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Now, I'm not for killing em...live and let live. But I bring it up to illustrate how standards can decline...just from human ego.

You may not like what I'm saying, but I wont lie to you...I just speak the truth.

You have an overly idealized vision of life in the 1940s. Individual liberty was under assault then just as it is now.

[newbitech]

I don't think its so much as Ron Paul being able to fix the country as it is the attitude adjustment that this country needs in order to have Ron Paul win that will fix this country.

[lucius]

Or is the writing on the wall for America no matter who we have?

No, but he has already saved us...just look at this fire of liberty burning around you. :)

[Mach]

One of the first things he should do is take the whole Patriot Act out onto the Whitehouse lawn and burn it in front of thousands of news cameras.... with a smile.

[treyfu]

As much as I love Dr. Paul, his winning the presidency only beats the dead horse that represents government as a morally viable option. When people begin to understand that statism in any form is the polar opposite of a moral good, then we will begin to be free. Until then, the best we can hope for is that Dr. Paul is a catalyst toward that enlightenment.