What is the best way to effect change? (The movement after Ron Paul)

[ibaghdadi]

In this thread (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=257981), sevin asks the important (and scary) question: What if Ron Paul does not run in 2012? What would be of the movement if he retires?

While the movement in an intellectual sense will not disappear, in a political/organization sense it may suffer a blow because there are few that Ron Paul can pass the baton to.

But more importantly, many in the movement aren't convinced that political means will bring about the necessary change at all. Some feel it's already too late. In this thread (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=257258&highlight=ron+save), cindy25 asks "Is it too late even for Ron Paul to save us?"

My question is whether we're looking in the right direction at all. What is the best way to bring about radical change?

(1) Through the political process. The government's own political institutions are the way to change it. We must infiltrate them and turn them from within. Education is noble but not direct enough, while military force is counterproductive since it will force the government to move against the movement and snuff it out.

(2) Through education/intellectual development. Political means will fail because the political establishment will not allow us on their turf, and military means are inherently immoral and counterproductive, so what we must do is educate people, and future generations at the right opportunity will effect the change.

(3) Through military force. The government will never be dislodged through its own institutions. Education is a noble endeavor, but useless when counter-education and pure dumbing down is taking place on a large scale by a government that has tremendous power. When SHTF, it'll be down to the guns, and a new revolution.

(4) Through principled opportunism and preparation. The government will collapse economically under its own weight in the not too far future, and new forces will attempt to consolidate tyrannical power. That will be the opportunity for a new revolution for the ready in spirit, mind, and guns.

(5) Through some other means: State below

[Romulus]

Both 1 and 2. We need to become power seekers. In doing so, educating others is important.

[Kludge]

Workers' strike in opposition to all oppressive regimes. At the very least, tax resistance.

[YumYum]

Keep abreast of what is taking place and educate others. Other than that, find a collective that is focused on survival and hope for the best.

[phill4paul]

2 to affect change in 1. 3 if all else fails.

2 starts at the local level and rises upwards. Support your state candidates. If your district is fully in the hands of someone in the anti-liberty camp then perhaps there is a candidate within driving distance that you can support. Every candidate counts. Again, start at the state level where the most change can be effected.

[FrankRep]

Nullification: How to Resist Federal Tyranny in the 21st Century (https://www.amazon.com/dp/1596981490?tag=nullifynow-20&camp=213381&creative=390973&linkCode=as4&creativeASIN=1596981490&adid=0F58YNSVEP6CYX3YAZ4Q&)

http://testchapter.tenthamendmentcenter.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/nullification-cover-195x300.jpg (https://www.amazon.com/dp/1596981490?tag=nullifynow-20&camp=213381&creative=390973&linkCode=as4&creativeASIN=1596981490&adid=0F58YNSVEP6CYX3YAZ4Q&)



http://www.thenewamerican.com/images/stories/US_12-2009/2605-coverstory.jpg (http://www.shopjbs.org/index.php/tna/subscriptions.html)

State vs. Federal: The Nullification Movement
http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/usnews/constitution/2957-state-vs-federal-the-nullification-movement

Nullification in a Nutshell
http://www.thenewamerican.com/index.php/history/american/2971-nullification-in-a-nutshell




States Can Nullify Unconstitutional Federal Laws!


YouTube - Thomas Woods : States Can Nullify Unconstitutional Federal Laws! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9cyGproZGQ&feature=player_embedded)

[paulitics]

1 and 2. And they both go hand in hand. Ron Paul through the political processes has woken up millions of people to his ideas. If he was not in Congress, this could not have happened.

Having liberty minded people in state and local politics would likely throw a monkey wrench into the complete federalization and unconstitutional laws being passed in congress. At the very least, it will slow things down greatly, so that we have more time to educate people before SHTF.

The educational process will ensure that people are ready for the right change when either SHTF, or the right political candidates come along. But, it is not enough to educate. If you are educating people to embrace apathy, you are part of the problem.

[Stary Hickory]

We need to hit them in every concieveable way, through the political process, through intellectual debates, through tenacity in spreading the message, through determination and courage with civil disobedience, by under mining the government via states rights, you do it all and you NEVER STOP.

There is no way to stop a movement like this, just have to be motivated. The world found liberty during the enlightenment and it helped the common man attain new levels of prosperity and opportunity we cannot just sit back and let society backslide into Tyranny and despotism.

[Travlyr]

1,2,4 & participate at the local level... counties, townships, city, etc.

[AlexMerced]

Long Term: Only by educating people will we really change the debate and have world that can approach where we're getting to.

Short Term: We need to participate in the corrupt political system to slow it's growth while we educate people enough to stab the damn thing in the heart and kill it.


The Revolution is of the Mind, but we can buy ourselves sometime to put that revolution together by well placed people in political power to throw wrenches

[ChaosControl]

Education.

Education is how the corrupt have managed to brainwash the masses to become so dependent, it is also the only way to undo it.

Look at how all the "information" effects people. Look how well most people fit into these little partisan boxes. Things like tv news or talk radio. Listen to how the people just repeat the same nonsense nearly word for word from these sources. I know some people who are big on talk radio and their views mirror it and they repeat it, it is essentially what tells them to believe. I know others who rely on one or two tv shows for their news and it has so influenced their views as well. The only way to undo that damage is to educate people over time.

There are of course different ways you can educate people and different messages that work better than others, but in the end that is the one long term way to effect changes. Participating in the electoral system can help things, but unless we change minds through education nothing we do will matter in the long term.

[SevenEyedJeff]

What is the best way to effect change? (The movement after Ron Paul)

Secession. Until the Federal government is brought in line there is no other option that will work IMHO.:mad:

[RileyE104]

definitely through education.

although in order for that to work we need tons more of actual educated TEACHERS in the public school system. :(

[thehunter]

My suggestion is to look at how the previously successful movements got their big leap. In the 60s it was barbecues and parties that conservatives would host in order to share a local frustration with an issue involving government taxation/spending; the progressives fifty years prior held town halls. Social networking's the key -- these days, that might mean Facebook, Youtube videos and, yes, in-person interaction. That's how you win the hearts and minds!

[Fredom101]

Through better parenting.
It all starts with the family and having massive respect for children.

[fj45lvr]

If you want liberty and freedom in your lifetime then those that want it move to the same state and leave the tyranny of central government:

http://www.patriotdepot.com/images/products/detail/Secede.jpg

[jake]

all of the above.

[kahless]

Secession. Until the Federal government is brought in line there is no other option that will work IMHO.:mad:

+1

Unless one state leads by example through secession then will have much of the same for the next 50-100 years. I and I am sure others want to experience freedom in our life time.

The younger people here probably think educating and working through the political process is basically a new thing. This has been going on long before you were born and things have only gotten worse. You really think you can over come the years of public school indoctrination and mass media propaganda that has successfully demonized our views?

As I see it the only thing that will change the current path is:

1. State or states leading by example through secession or regional successionist movements.

2. Alternative to mass media to educate the masses. For example, a Libertarian news channel to compete against Foxnews, CNN and MSDNC. Also, alternatives to Hollywood entertainment that portray Libertarians and patriots in a positive light. This unlike the current Hollywood culture that demonizes us and puts Communists and Socialists on a pedistal.

3. An economic collapse.

[Vessol]

Education is our best tool.

[Imaginos]

Both 1 and 2. We need to become power seekers. In doing so, educating others is important.
+1

[ibaghdadi]

Maybe I should have allowed more than one answer on the poll.

Anyway, interesting so far.

[Stary Hickory]

Maybe I should have allowed more than one answer on the poll.

Anyway, interesting so far.

Yes like I said you hit them everywhere and you never stop. There is not just one avenue to success it requires efforts and RESISTANCE at all levels in every conceivable way.

[Daamien]

All of the above...

[ibaghdadi]

Yes like I said you hit them everywhere and you never stop. There is not just one avenue to success it requires efforts and RESISTANCE at all levels in every conceivable way.
Well I agree that ultimately any movement will be using an orchestration of various methods. What I was going after is the PRIMARY method.

[Gaius1981]

Education (the war of ideas), coupled with a very healthy dose of civil disobedience, and leading by good example.