I don't want to have kids. Does that make me a bad person?

[ibaghdadi]

I'm 33 and have been married (happily) 3 and half years. I don't feel the urge or impulse to have a baby, neither does my wife. Does that make us bad people?

[Kotin]

no.. thanks for realizing that and not bringing a child into the world and then figuring this out as many many people do.

[WaltM]

in my opinion, not at all.

it makes you a thinking and responsible person.

I'm against procreation within the context of modern society.

A child in today's world is a cost to you, a cost to society, and a cost to themselves later on.

However, I am fully aware of the fact that societies cannot survive without offspring. Sadly, we do nothing to discourage people of lesser quality to reproduce, so they'll fill the gap.

I've pretty much concluded that if this world is going to be fully of idiots, I'll let them take care of themselves, not bring my child to be their servant. If the people behind me can't take care of themselves, I feel no responsibility to prolong this species.

[Baptist]

I'm 33 and have been married (happily) 3 and half years. I don't feel the urge or impulse to have a baby, neither does my wife. Does that make us bad people?

No.

[WaltM]

need help changing your mind? I recommend the movie Idiocracy

YouTube - "Idiocracy" introduction - the future of human evolution (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSROlfR7WTo)

[Kotin]

need help changing your mind? I recommend the movie Idiocracy

YouTube - "Idiocracy" introduction - the future of human evolution (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSROlfR7WTo)

+1

[ibaghdadi]

need help changing your mind? I recommend the movie Idiocracy

:D Lol

My IQ is 155, btw... I'm sure my wife's pretty smart too. So... that means... I'm gonna die childless in my 50s while giving sperm for artificial insemination... :D

[WaltM]

:D Lol

My IQ is 155, btw... I'm sure my wife's pretty smart too. So... that means... I'm gonna die childless in my 50s while giving sperm for artificial insemination... :D

giving sperm & eggs isn't a bad idea.

but if you don't believe you're the person fit for the job, DON'T DO IT (I'm talking about parenting, I got nothing against giving sperm & eggs), and even if you do, I'd think about adopting one before having one. Since after all, there's enough people who need parents.

to that end I find it very disgusting people pretend to be unselfish by having children, and then say they're opposed to abortion, knowing there are needy children starving (in this country, nevermind the world).

[ibaghdadi]

no.. thanks for realizing that and not bringing a child into the world and then figuring this out as many many people do.

Well I do notice this a lot. These people don't "want" kids, they're stuck with them.

Many of my friends who have kids are constantly complaining - they can't sleep, they can barely keep up with the expenses, the kids are brats, running and screaming at the top of their lungs breaking everything in sight...

They crave a day off and they're happiest when someone offers to babysit so they can go out. They can't work from home because the kids won't let them. They have no social life because their kids have to sleep by 7 PM.

They've lost their old friends who they've known since childhood because they have kids now and can only be "friends" with others who have kids, so they can enjoy the couple's company without worrying about the kids.

And after recounting this long list of grievances they ask me, "So when are you gonna have kids?"

No seriously, they talk about it as if it's some inevitable evil that we have to go through uncritically, like "death and taxes"...

And if I ever dare to say this - that I don't feel the urge to have kids - in front of any of them, they would boo me down as selfish. Or delusional (i.e. I deeply want to have kids but haven't realized it or admitted it to myself).

[WaltM]

Well I do notice this a lot. These people don't "want" kids, they're stuck with them.


If it were legal, I can bet they'd get rid of them.

Sadly, even though it's NOT legal, many people still do.

THAT is why I'm an advocate of prevention.



Many of my friends who have kids are constantly complaining - they can't sleep, they can barely keep up with the expenses, the kids are brats, running and screaming at the top of their lungs breaking everything in sight...


if you like to raise a kid after they're 5 years old, there's plenty to adopt.




They crave a day off and they're happiest when someone offers to babysit so they can go out. They can't work from home because the kids won't let them. They have no social life because their kids have to sleep by 7 PM.


kids are social life, no?




They've lost their old friends who they've known since childhood because they have kids now and can only be "friends" with others who have kids, so they can enjoy the couple's company without worrying about the kids.


That's because people like me dump friends when they have kids. it's mutual.




And after recounting this long list of grievances they ask me, "So when are you gonna have kids?"

No seriously, they talk about it as if it's some inevitable evil that we have to go through uncritically, like "death and taxes"...


my parents say that to me too.

they think I'll either change my mind, or somebody will force me to do it.

I'm not completely against it, but a lot is needed to change my mind about it
(same thing with marriage, by the way)




And if I ever dare to say this - that I don't feel the urge to have kids - in front of any of them, they would boo me down as selfish. Or delusional (i.e. I deeply want to have kids but haven't realized it or admitted it to myself).

I have no shame in being called selfish.

[low preference guy]

And if I ever dare to say this - that I don't feel the urge to have kids - in front of any of them, they would boo me down as selfish. Or delusional (i.e. I deeply want to have kids but haven't realized it or admitted it to myself).

There has to be a way to answer back that is funny and unabashed, or even better, makes the person who thinks you ought to have kids look ridiculous.

[low preference guy]

why is it selfish? do you get no pleasure from rising your kids? do you not enjoy spending time with them? if you do, how can it be selfish if you're enjoying it?

[WaltM]

There has to be a way to answer back that is funny and unabashed, or even better, makes the person who thinks you ought to have kids look ridiculous.

No need to, they usually know it.

[WaltM]

why is it selfish? do you get no pleasure from rising your kids?


I'm not jealous of others for it, I can tell you that.

Maybe slightly jealous of those who have enough money to do so, but still if i was in the position, unlikely for me



do you not enjoy spending time with them? if you do, how can it be selfish if you're enjoying it?

that's exactly what makes it selfish, deriving pleasure from using other human beings.

[ibaghdadi]

There has to be a way to answer back that is funny and unabashed, or even better, makes the person who thinks you ought to have kids look ridiculous.

Actually you just need to scratch a little below the surface, man. A lot of the time I feel that they're jealous - I mean, I can work from home most days, I can stay up as late as I want and sleep in as late as I want... etc.

To them, this represents an irresponsible "shirking of duties", rather than freedom.

My wife doesn't know how to answer them most of the time. When she meets someone she hasn't met for a while and they ask her if she has any kids, she says "No" and they reply with genuine pity: "Oh that's OK...", as if she's supposed to be sad, depressed or ashamed about it.

When she explains that she's not, they give her a look like she's crazy or something.

[Meatwasp]

:D Lol

My IQ is 155, btw... I'm sure my wife's pretty smart too. So... that means... I'm gonna die childless in my 50s while giving sperm for artificial insemination... :D

It will be sad for you when you are older and have no one to help you.
I have three sons and they are such a comfort to me.

[MelissaWV]

It will be sad for you when you are older and have no one to help you.
I have three sons and they are such a comfort to me.

There is no law against befriending younger people. A lot of people in the Assisted Living Facility my grandmother in do not have their kids around, either, though the kids cheerfully contribute to the bill every month so that perfect strangers can wipe their parent's behind.

If this was a major factor in having children, I have no idea what to say to you. It reeks of indentured servitude where the servant had no say in the matter.

I'll have plenty of people to "help" me if I need it :) None of them will be guilted into it.

* * *

As to the OP, I can't have kids, but I don't want them, either. It's a trap.

[Meatwasp]

[QUOTE=MelissaWV;2846783]There is no law against befriending younger people. A lot of people in the Assisted Living Facility my grandmother in do not have their kids around, either, though the kids cheerfully contribute to the bill every month so that perfect strangers can wipe their parent's behind.
]
Well that's nice to know.
Don't get me wronge I don't feel like Bagdad is a bad person at all for his choice. I was just thinking how lonely I would be without my kids.

[Meatwasp]

Melissa,
When you talk about the young folks helping the old is it in the elderly rest homes?
Man the tales I heard about going in the front door and the hearse is waiting at the back door. I pray I never have go into one of those. Ha

[Bruno]

No.

155 IQ? Wow!

[Cowlesy]

Not at all Iyad, but I have to say I hope you have a change of heart someday. The more liberty babies born, the better, in my opinion.

[tekkierich]

I have a 2 year old, and another on the way, and want more after that! I disagree with everything above!

Yes there are problems, and nothing is perfect. However the reward of watching the little one develop into a functioning human being is so very rewarding. The bonding that happens as a family unit is irreplaceable and I would have a hole in my life if it wasn't for it.

Basically I cannot imagine never having kids myself.

Also, I strongly and vehemently do not think that (on the whole) kids raised in supportive loving families are a burden on the world. These will be the future people to shoulder to burden and bring greater prosperity and comfort to others less fortunate. This is true regardless of the economic systems involved.


However, I do not criticize or condemn in anyway those who do not want children. I personally could not imagine it for myself, but I also understand that others cannot imagine that my way of life brings me great joy. Cest la vie!

[wizardwatson]

I'm 33 and have been married (happily) 3 and half years. I don't feel the urge or impulse to have a baby, neither does my wife. Does that make us bad people?

Well, you do live in Dubai. I wouldn't want my kid growing up next to the HQ of Halliburton either. Maybe its the fact that you are surrounded by satanic forces and buildings constructed from slave labor and blood money that your heart doesn't want to place a child next to that.

You might want to consider "sea-steading" I hear that's the latest libertarian fantasy land.

[Dr.3D]

I'm 33 and have been married (happily) 3 and half years. I don't feel the urge or impulse to have a baby, neither does my wife. Does that make us bad people?

If Dubai is anything like the U.S., you are wise not to want children. The state uses them to stick it's nose into your privacy. Once you have children, they believe it is their function to make sure you are taking care of them up to their standards. Of course their standards may not match your own and this is what causes the rub.

A set of arbitrary standards set by the state may not be to your liking and perhaps below your standards and thus your children become children of the state and you have no control over their upbringing.

Those who are considering having children, need to remember, what you think are your children are in fact not your children but instead belong to the state and you are just feeding and paying for them to grow into good little taxpayers.

[Son of Detroit]

If I end up never having kids I'll be pretty disappointed. I've always wanted a family of my own. I'd like to have my first kid by the time I'm 26, and have at least one more later on.

If I have a boy, I can't wait to do the same things I did with my dad. Playing catch, throwing the football around, shooting BB guns in the backyard, going to pro baseball games, etc.

If I have a girl, I can't wait to fight off all of the teenage boys wanting to get in her pants :D

[Meatwasp]

If I end up never having kids I'll be pretty disappointed. I've always wanted a family of my own. I'd like to have my first kid by the time I'm 26, and have at least one more later on.

If I have a boy, I can't wait to do the same things I did with my dad. Playing catch, throwing the football around, shooting BB guns in the backyard, going to pro baseball games, etc.

If I have a girl, I can't wait to fight off all of the teenage boys wanting to get in her pants :D

Keep that dream alive Kiddo.

[teacherone]

you are a terrible person!

you were placed on this earth to procreate.

every time you spill your seed or pack it in little latex glove an angel dies!

[Dr.3D]

you are a terrible person!

you were placed on this earth to procreate.

every time you spill your seed or pack it in little latex glove an angel dies!

Wow, is that in the Bible?

[teacherone]

page 9

[Dr.3D]

page 9

Ehh... I have a lot of Bibles, but none of them have page numbers. Care to site the book, chapter and verse?

[teacherone]

sure i read it somewhere's...

[Dr.3D]

sure i read it somewhere's...

lol

[Danke]

you are a terrible person!

you were placed on this earth to procreate.

every time you spill your seed or pack it in little latex glove an angel dies!



He's not Catholic.

[teacherone]

He's not Catholic.

God is...:D

[Baptist]

Melissa,
When you talk about the young folks helping the old is it in the elderly rest homes?
Man the tales I heard about going in the front door and the hearse is waiting at the back door. I pray I never have go into one of those. Ha

If she is, then she needs to point out which nursing home it is. I've been visiting nursing homes since 2007, and I can tell you that it's rare to see young people there. The old people mob up on mine when we go.

[Baptist]

Well I do notice this a lot. These people don't "want" kids, they're stuck with them.
My entire life I stated that I never wanted kids. But my wife and I are against any form of birth control which has the potential to interfere with things after fertilization. Alas, because this conviction prevented us from using the most reliable forms of BC, we got pregnant. When we first found out I was pissed and "stuck" with the kid. However, the second he was born every problem and fear went away and it has been nothing but awesome. I am not stuck with him-- I could give him up for adoption if I didn't want him.



Many of my friends who have kids are constantly complaining - they can't sleep, they can barely keep up with the expenses, the kids are brats, running and screaming at the top of their lungs breaking everything in sight...
"Godliness with contentment is great gain." People find a reason to complain about everything these days. My kid tried to get into a screaming phase, but that lasted less than two weeks. If you are going to let your kid run the show, then you deserve the ensuing mayhem. Keep up with the expenses? LOL most people spend more money on freaking beer and drugs than I do on my kid. You literally spend more on a stupid smart phone made by slave labor, and a monthly phone plan, than I spend on my kid. "Kids are expensive" if a myth.


They crave a day off and they're happiest when someone offers to babysit so they can go out.
We have never had a babysitter. He is over a year old.


They can't work from home because the kids won't let them.
That sucks. We are both full time students and work part time. She manages to keep A's and B's and I'm 4.0. This piled on top of 3-4 church activities a week, lots of political activism, and lots of researching the NWO, means that your friends need some serious time management improvement.



They have no social life because their kids have to sleep by 7 PM.
Depends where your priorities are. I never had a social life before I had a kid. My social life lasted from 17-19, and then I got bored of it because it was lame. Two years is all I could take of hanging out with people and engaging in small talk about non-issues that are boring and lame. If your priorities are spending multiple evenings a week in a room full of people who act like idiots, then yes kids interfere with this.



They've lost their old friends who they've known since childhood because they have kids now and can only be "friends" with others who have kids, so they can enjoy the couple's company without worrying about the kids.
I lost most of my "friends" stopped coming around when I started reading a Bible and caring about Jesus. The remaining ones bailed when I discovered the truth/liberty movement.


And after recounting this long list of grievances they ask me, "So when are you gonna have kids?"

No seriously, they talk about it as if it's some inevitable evil that we have to go through uncritically, like "death and taxes"...

And if I ever dare to say this - that I don't feel the urge to have kids - in front of any of them, they would boo me down as selfish. Or delusional (i.e. I deeply want to have kids but haven't realized it or admitted it to myself).

I understand what you are saying. Before I had a kid it always bugged me to no end when people asked "when are you going to have kids?" all whinny and smirky. Now that I have one, they ask "so when is the next one coming along?" and it bugs me just as much. I'm just honest and tell them that 1.) I didn't even want this one, 2.) I never want another one. Then, even though in my mind I am spin-kicking them, I change the subject and talk about something else.

[00_Pete]

No but you are not an hero either.

[MelissaWV]

If she is, then she needs to point out which nursing home it is. I've been visiting nursing homes since 2007, and I can tell you that it's rare to see young people there. The old people mob up on mine when we go.

Meatwasp was saying that her children would take care of her when she's older. When I talk about befriending younger people, I mean relatively younger. If you are 70, you can have friends in their 50s, no? Moreover, I wouldn't befriend someone with the desire that they take care of me when I'm too old to do so for myself.

The home my grandmother is in has young workers; many are around my age. In a way, this is a bit of a blessing and a curse to the residents, who often mistake the workers for their grandchildren. The mobbing up is terrible, and I hate it. It's only a small part of why I don't like visiting.

The ultimate point is that most of those old ladies in those nursing homes have children. They are not necessarily there in the twilight years. Their "we'll grow old together" husbands often died decades before. Saying you'll pity someone who has no children because you assume they'll be alone when they're older is silly to me, since when I see all of those elderly women, I would say far more than half had children and family, and now they are alone most of their days.

* * *

Some people enjoy parenting. I've seen people like that, and it's a joy to watch. They aren't the "I'm your best friend" types, either; they are people who seem to know when to be quiet and let their kid find out that something is dangerous, and when to swoop in and save them from real dangers. They know just what to say, and they have an inexhaustible supply of boo-boo kisses and are willing to sit and do things with their children, rather than plop them in front of the television. It's amazing. They are teachers and guardians and conspirators and disciplinarians and mean and eternally loving. They are also pretty rare, if you think about it.

Some people don't want to parent. If you know for yourself that you don't want children, you shouldn't need to justify it to anyone (except your partner, because they're kind of in on the whole situation). I go a step further, I suppose. I don't want to hold your child. I don't want to hear your kiddo's latest recital (objectively, the music is godawful). I really have no desire to ask after your mewling infant's digestive ailments. No, I don't want to know the funny story about your child using the toilet at Home Depot thinking that it would flush when they were done. I don't hate kids... I hate parents who feel they have to share each and every thing in the most inappropriate of settings. Usually this is at work, where I get to see and hear every little milestone of people I could not care less about.

Then they turn to me and ask, for the 100th time, when I'm going to have one of my own. This is usually after being told 99 times that I cannot have children and, if I did, I wouldn't want them. I tell them for the 100th time, and there's a mixture of knowing glances and shaking of heads. Then they tell me of the latest and greatest fertility treatments. I emphasize the fact I don't want a child, that being an aunt is more than enough. More head-shaking. There is this idea out there that your life is incomplete without children. It can be, or it can be more complete than anyone can imagine. It's the same way with spouses, and people ask if you're married without thinking about why they're asking, or that the response might be something unpleasant. In truth, it's the same way with most personal questions.

* Didn't finish college? When are you going back?
* Divorced? I know a really great guy around your age who's ready to get back into dating!
* No children? Oh, so-and-so had trouble, too; let me see if I can get that doctor's number.
* You don't own a house? Really? Interest rates are pretty low and I bet your credit isn't THAT bad!
* You're living with your parents? Cheer up dearie; times are tough all over. (They're actually not tough for me, as an aside, financially; I'm just helping my parents and grandmother for awhile. This, though, makes me even more alien than moving home to freeload would.)

It goes on and on. People nose into your business, and I sympathize, but don't let them change your self-appraisal.

[specsaregood]

//

[Imaginos]

How come some people want to have kids?
Kids suck!
:eek:
Alright, just kidding.
Regarding your question, the answer is NO, it does not make you a bad person.
It just makes you a person who doesn't want to have kids.
It has nothing to do with morality.

[Imaginos]

Having kids (and marriage) is highly overrated.
And what exactly makes the people who want to have kids morally superior than the people who don't?
Logically, that does not make sense at all.

[Son of Detroit]

Think of the logistical reasons for the liberty movement.

-25,000 members on RPF
-Every member on RPF has 15 kids each

That's 375,000 new liberty voters! HUZZAH! RON PAUL!

[MelissaWV]

Think of the logistical reasons for the liberty movement.

-25,000 members on RPF
-Every member on RPF has 15 kids each

That's 375,000 new liberty voters! HUZZAH! RON PAUL!

Assuming that those 375,000 new liberty voters all make it to 18, and do not decide to rebel against their parents by becoming Democrats, of course. It's also assuming every member of RPF has that much child-bearing time left. It's also assuming none of the RPF members do one another to create those kids ;) It's also assuming that every member on RPF is going to birth American citizens.

I know your tongue was firmly planted in cheek, but I just HAD to :p

[Kotin]

I will be having at least 4-5 kids hopefully.. love kids, can't get around it.. babies are some of the coolest people I have met.

[ARealConservative]

I think you are missing out on the best aspects of living, but that doesn’t make you a bad person.

I assume you love people in your life? I honestly believe until you have children, you can’t really fully fathom the depth of the word. The feeling you have for your parents, your siblings, and even your spouse may well be love, but it is also shallow and insignificant compared to the feelings you have for your children. This is an aspect of life you are blocking form yourself. And because life is so special, why would you not want to live your life to its fullest?

That’s how I view it anyway.

[Meatwasp]

Meatwasp was saying that her children would take care of her when she's older. When I talk about befriending younger people, I mean relatively younger. If you are 70, you can have friends in their 50s, no? Moreover, I wouldn't befriend someone with the desire that they take care of me when I'm too old to do so for myself.

The home my grandmother is in has young workers; many are around my age. In a way, this is a bit of a blessing and a curse to the residents, who often mistake the workers for their grandchildren. The mobbing up is terrible, and I hate it. It's only a small part of why I don't like visiting.

The ultimate point is that most of those old ladies in those nursing homes have children. They are not necessarily there in the twilight years. Their "we'll grow old together" husbands often died decades before. Saying you'll pity someone who has no children because you assume they'll be alone when they're older is silly to me, since when I see all of those elderly women, I would say far more than half had children and family, and now they are alone most of their days.

* * *

Some people enjoy parenting. I've seen people like that, and it's a joy to watch. They aren't the "I'm your best friend" types, either; they are people who seem to know when to be quiet and let their kid find out that something is dangerous, and when to swoop in and save them from real dangers. They know just what to say, and they have an inexhaustible supply of boo-boo kisses and are willing to sit and do things with their children, rather than plop them in front of the television. It's amazing. They are teachers and guardians and conspirators and disciplinarians and mean and eternally loving. They are also pretty rare, if you think about it.

Some people don't want to parent. If you know for yourself that you don't want children, you shouldn't need to justify it to anyone (except your partner, because they're kind of in on the whole situation). I go a step further, I suppose. I don't want to hold your child. I don't want to hear your kiddo's latest recital (objectively, the music is godawful). I really have no desire to ask after your mewling infant's digestive ailments. No, I don't want to know the funny story about your child using the toilet at Home Depot thinking that it would flush when they were done. I don't hate kids... I hate parents who feel they have to share each and every thing in the most inappropriate of settings. Usually this is at work, where I get to see and hear every little milestone of people I could not care less about.

Then they turn to me and ask, for the 100th time, when I'm going to have one of my own. This is usually after being told 99 times that I cannot have children and, if I did, I wouldn't want them. I tell them for the 100th time, and there's a mixture of knowing glances and shaking of heads. Then they tell me of the latest and greatest fertility treatments. I emphasize the fact I don't want a child, that being an aunt is more than enough. More head-shaking. There is this idea out there that your life is incomplete without children. It can be, or it can be more complete than anyone can imagine. It's the same way with spouses, and people ask if you're married without thinking about why they're asking, or that the response might be something unpleasant. In truth, it's the same way with most personal questions.

* Didn't finish college? When are you going back?
* Divorced? I know a really great guy around your age who's ready to get back into dating!
* No children? Oh, so-and-so had trouble, too; let me see if I can get that doctor's number.
* You don't own a house? Really? Interest rates are pretty low and I bet your credit isn't THAT bad!
* You're living with your parents? Cheer up dearie; times are tough all over. (They're actually not tough for me, as an aside, financially; I'm just helping my parents and grandmother for awhile. This, though, makes me even more alien than moving home to freeload would.)

It goes on and on. People nose into your business, and I sympathize, but don't let them change your self-appraisal.

Ha ha I can feel your pain. I never bragged about my kids but since they were homeschooled and their father was very intelligent people alway admired them. I would laugh and say I see faults in them.

[James Madison]

No, it doesn't make you a bad person. An evolutionary enigma, perhaps, but not a bad person. But you're only 33; my dad was 42 when I was born, and I'm an only child. I hope I get to have children one day. If not, oh well.

[M House]

Why is there only dudes in this thread and Melissa? My only suggestion is if you don't want kids please don't have them...damn. If you actually want kids and find yer-self a decent willing female. I mean rock on!? It's weird how complicated we've made very basic elements of life. There's absolutely nothing wrong with not having them either. Single men have it rough though...lol. We have sorta lifespans and not even a tax break.

[MelissaWV]

Why is there only dudes in this thread and Melissa? ...

It isn't :p

[Meatwasp]

Why is there only dudes in this thread and Melissa? My only suggestion is if you don't want kids please don't have them...damn. If you actually want kids and find yer-self a decent willing female. I mean rock on!? It's weird how complicated we've made very basic elements of life. There's absolutely nothing wrong with not having them either. Single men have it rough though...lol. We have sorta lifespans and not even a tax break.

I am not a dude.At least the last I looked I didn't have balls. Ha!

[M House]

Sorry, owned um carry on haha.

[ibaghdadi]

155 IQ? Wow!

Well it's based upon my SAT scores. You can see the conversion table here (http://bit.ly/cedeAl). Actually the estimate is somewhere between 154 and 158.

I scored 1500 cumulative (710 maths and 790 verbal). I didn't really know that's considered "pretty darn good" until a few years ago. If I did back when I took the test you'd bet I would have applied for some badass scholarships.

I believe until 1994 SAT scores were sufficient to join Mensa.

[M House]

That's seriously inflated I ain't that brite.

[ibaghdadi]

Not at all Iyad, but I have to say I hope you have a change of heart someday.

Well I almost did have a change of heart shortly after I got married. I saw this cute little boy in the elevator, gave him a sweet smile and asked him his name. Then he kicked me in the shin, elbowed me in the nuts, ran out of the elevator and that was that :D

But don't get me wrong, I'm not opposed to the idea of having kids and do want to have some... some day. I just don't feel any deep overbearing urge to do so right away and I don't feel my life "lacks something" without them. At least not now.

[WaltM]

It will be sad for you when you are older and have no one to help you.
I have three sons and they are such a comfort to me.

how much do I save not having to pay for your 3 sons?

I think for the thousands I save a year, I can afford to hire a person to take care of me when I'm old.

[ibaghdadi]

If Dubai is anything like the U.S., you are wise not to want children. The state uses them to stick it's nose into your privacy. Once you have children, they believe it is their function to make sure you are taking care of them up to their standards. Of course their standards may not match your own and this is what causes the rub.

Well my political status is "Palestinian refugee", so I'm officially stateless, so will my kids be. Both a blessing and a curse they say, but over my life I've found it more a blessing than a curse.

Government here is pretty hands off about kids and there's nothing like what you mention there. They're considered the responsibility of their parents. I'd imagine that would be quite suffocating if the state treats your child as their business. My sister in law is in London and that's how things are there.

To me, Dubai wouldn't be such a bad place to raise kids, it's pretty safe, there's no compulsory education so I'm free to homeschool, no much of a drug problem and no problems with gangs or violence or whatnot.

Also many different cultures and nationalities so kids would grow up exposed to many viewpoints and not close minded claustrophobic idiots like I see in some neighboring countries.

But that's when I decide to have any. Haven't yet.

[Natalie]

I want at the very least four kids. Ideally, five.

[WaltM]

I have a 2 year old, and another on the way, and want more after that! I disagree with everything above!


So you feel you have the money and time to have children, but would rather let the children already born and in need of parents to continue waiting their luck, while you produce your own?




Yes there are problems, and nothing is perfect. However the reward of watching the little one develop into a functioning human being is so very rewarding.


I can watch other kids, thanks.



The bonding that happens as a family unit is irreplaceable and I would have a hole in my life if it wasn't for it.


How many kids does it take to fill your hole?



Basically I cannot imagine never having kids myself.


No kids at all, or just none of your own?

[ibaghdadi]

People find a reason to complain about everything these days.
Yeah, that's true. And I admit that simply because people I mentioned don't handle their kids well, doesn't mean they can't be managed well. I've always thought that if I were to have kids, I'd at least fare better than those people.

[Danke]

You're young and have time. Maybe your second or third wife will want them.

[ibaghdadi]

Having kids (and marriage) is highly overrated.

Well this guy on this website called "NoMarriage.com (http://www.nomarriage.com)" certainly agrees with you...

But I'm very happy to be married and would certainly feel like something's missing if I weren't. I knew my wife since KG, became friends in highschool, became best friends in college, and after college started our company together (with a bunch of other friends). Seven years later we got married.

I guess it depends upon finding the right person.

[ibaghdadi]

I assume you love people in your life? I honestly believe until you have children, you can’t really fully fathom the depth of the word. The feeling you have for your parents, your siblings, and even your spouse may well be love, but it is also shallow and insignificant compared to the feelings you have for your children. This is an aspect of life you are blocking form yourself. And because life is so special, why would you not want to live your life to its fullest?

This is a beautiful description. If anything may change my mind, it's something like this. (I'm not being sarcastic.)

But in all honesty a friend of mine did give me such a poetic description of his feelings towards his kids and while it did make me all warm and fuzzy inside, it didn't take for long...

[WaltM]

If Dubai is anything like the U.S., you are wise not to want children. The state uses them to stick it's nose into your privacy. Once you have children, they believe it is their function to make sure you are taking care of them up to their standards. Of course their standards may not match your own and this is what causes the rub.

A set of arbitrary standards set by the state may not be to your liking and perhaps below your standards and thus your children become children of the state and you have no control over their upbringing.

Those who are considering having children, need to remember, what you think are your children are in fact not your children but instead belong to the state and you are just feeding and paying for them to grow into good little taxpayers.

glad we agree on something.

[WaltM]

Having kids (and marriage) is highly overrated.
And what exactly makes the people who want to have kids morally superior than the people who don't?
Logically, that does not make sense at all.

survival and prolongation of the human species, or ethnicity, assuming you believe that's a good thing. But even if you do, there's enough people breeding that I don't need to assist with that.

[WaltM]

Think of the logistical reasons for the liberty movement.

-25,000 members on RPF
-Every member on RPF has 15 kids each

That's 375,000 new liberty voters! HUZZAH! RON PAUL!

Democrats and illegal immigrant already win you on that HANDS DOWN.

You just gave a great argument against democracy, it's ultimately a numbers game, quantity rather than quality.

If your goal is to get voters on your side, you should import immigrants that agree with you. If your goal is to win in politics, learn to steal votes or lie.

[WaltM]

I will be having at least 4-5 kids hopefully.. love kids, can't get around it.. babies are some of the coolest people I have met.

but how long do they remain babies?

you can be a day carer if you like babies so much.

[youngbuck]

Badbaghdad! Badbaghdad!

[Nobexliberty]

For some reason I am going to put this age old thread back to life. And I can not wait to get married and have atleast 6 children, preferbly 12. In other words uncontrolled mating with my future wife.

[MelissaWV]

For some reason I am going to put this age old thread back to life. And I can not wait to get married and have atleast 6 children, preferbly 12. In other words uncontrolled mating with my future wife.

I certainly hope she has a say in whether or not she wants to stretch, contort, and risk herself a dozen times to fulfill your goal.

[Nobexliberty]

I certainly hope she has a say in whether or not she wants to stretch, contort, and risk herself a dozen times to fulfill your goal. If a women is unwillingly to have many children I would not even think of marrying her. And now I am a sexist to everyone where I live but I am proud of it. They can label me as much as they wan't if the feminist wants me to change my mind then labeling will not work.

[otherone]

I certainly hope she has a say in whether or not she wants to stretch, contort, and risk herself a dozen times to fulfill your goal.

She'll have to do all that MANY times more than twelve to conceive a dozen children.....

[Nobexliberty]

She'll have to do all that MANY times more than twelve to conceive a dozen children..... But I am very fertile, 4 times at minimum beacause to reach 12 I mean who does not love triplets!

[otherone]

If a women is unwillingly to have many children I would not even think of marrying her. And now I am a sexist to everyone where I live but I am proud of it. They can label me as much as they wan't if the feminist wants me to change my mind then labeling will not work.

Before you get sold on marital bliss, I advise you witness about forty hours of local divorce court, my youthful friend.

[Nobexliberty]

Before you get sold on marital bliss, I advise you witness about forty hours of local divorce court, my youthful friend.I am going to slap divorce away from modern society way before my marriage, nothing will stand in my way. Even if I need to become king of the world. Everyone would be free until my future son takes over, I make sure the house of Nobex respects liberty for everyone so my decendents will make sure you are free too.