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JohnEngland
06-13-2010, 03:55 PM
... really are "progressives", aren't they? Bush's daughter now praising Obamacare:

http://www.mediaite.com/online/president-bushs-daughter-barbara-glad-health-care-reform-passed/

I know Glenn Beck has spoken about Bush being a "progressive" but I hope the others, like Limbaugh, make a deal out of this and get their followers to understand that so much of what Bush did was what the "progressives" would have done.

Conservatives should throw George Bush under the bus and not buy his forthcoming book, too!

awake
06-13-2010, 03:56 PM
Progressive toward what?

nate895
06-13-2010, 04:01 PM
We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case, the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive.
C. S. Lewis

akforme
06-13-2010, 04:05 PM
I look at it more as a pro-active government. Pre-emptive war is a pro-active move. A re-active government would fight only after being attacked.

nate895
06-13-2010, 04:14 PM
I look at it more as a pro-active government. Pre-emptive war is a pro-active move. A re-active government would fight only after being attacked.

I don't like the language "only after being attacked." It is reasonable to strike preemptively if in imminent danger of being invaded so that we can maintain the element of surprise. I don't think this is a likely scenario, but say China sent a fleet off of the West Coast that was clearly ready for invasion, then the Navy and Air Force should strike that fleet since it was China who made the aggressive move. They didn't attack, but China still clearly would be the aggressor. Similar to the situation at Ft. Sumter. The Confederates were the ones who "attacked" the Fort, but it was the Union's refusal to withdraw from sovereign South Carolina soil and attempts at resupplying the Fort that made the clash necessary. It is not who attacks or fires the first shot, in other words, but the one who makes that action a necessity who is the real aggressor.

rprprs
06-13-2010, 04:35 PM
I don't like the language "only after being attacked." ...<snip>

Very much agree. And it is thrown around much too freely. I have even heard Judge Napolitano wrongly use this phrase when characterizing Ron Paul's position against preemptive wars.

JohnEngland
06-13-2010, 05:00 PM
Progressive toward what?

Well exactly. This is what their movement calls themselves - and why I put the word "progressive" in quotation marks, since it is a subjective term.

Their "progress" is more government, more power and control. So with the Bushes, they like federal-run healthcare, federal-run education, federal-run spying on citizens etc. This is what the "progressive" movement loves - more government! Regardless of what economic and social reality tells them.

Of course, real progress would be less government, freer markets, respect for life and property and an adherence to the Constitution.

jkr
06-13-2010, 05:15 PM
they are all the same, they're all the F'n same...

awake
06-13-2010, 05:17 PM
Controllers..

ctiger2
06-13-2010, 05:42 PM
Watchout for Georg P Bush. He'll be running 2016, 2020, 2024. Jeb is his father and his mother is hispanic.

http://estrip.org/content/users/joshua/0607/Georgepbush0613.jpg