View Full Version : Matt Taibbi: Dishonest? Stupid? Both?
lester1/2jr
05-02-2010, 11:03 AM
Yeah I saw that too. He's going down the michael moore road to irrelevency already. freakin ayn rand wrote popular fiction like 50 years ago and she's resposible for the sub prime debacle? hello!
mczerone
05-02-2010, 01:30 PM
That's a shame, coming from a guy who has been spot-on in calling out the hypocrisy in the system for some time.
It seems to be a vast departure from his previous work, calling GS a "free market" entity that was unruled by any economic 'regulations'. And further setting up Rand as the figurehead for these corporatists, these moochers, seems out of place and just plain ignorant on Taibbi's part.
This debate is going to be crystallised in the Goldman case. Much of America is going to reflexively insist that Goldman's only crime was being smarter and better at making money than IKB and ABN-Amro, and that the intrusive, meddling government (in the American narrative, always the bad guy!) should get off Goldman's Armani-clad back. Another side is going to argue that Goldman winning this case would be a rebuke to the whole idea of civilisation – which, after all, is really just a collective decision by all of us not to screw each other over even when we can. It's an important moment in the history of modern global capitalism: whether or not to move forward into a world of greed without limits.
This last paragraph really shows that he's a little of both: Stupid and Dishonest. There is a view point that Taibbi left out: that the govt shouldn't be favoring the likes of GS to begin with!
A couple side notes: It is currently not the popular American narrative that "the govt is always the bad guy", as evidenced by those who love the state and their particular spend-happy pet projects. And if civilization is the "collective decision not to screw each other over", then what is govt? Lastly, it is obvious that he has corrupted capitalism to mean corporatism, which is unbridled greed given the direct proceeds from the goose that lays golden eggs: state taxation and industry regulation.
There certainly should be a limit on greed, but this prosecution of GS is a lateral fight between two groups that have both overstepped that limit: the prohibition of "screwing each other over". Both sides already lost, but both sides continue to win, no matter the outcome of this show-trial.
BillyDkid
05-02-2010, 03:42 PM
That's a shame, coming from a guy who has been spot-on in calling out the hypocrisy in the system for some time.
It seems to be a vast departure from his previous work, calling GS a "free market" entity that was unruled by any economic 'regulations'. And further setting up Rand as the figurehead for these corporatists, these moochers, seems out of place and just plain ignorant on Taibbi's part.
This last paragraph really shows that he's a little of both: Stupid and Dishonest. There is a view point that Taibbi left out: that the govt shouldn't be favoring the likes of GS to begin with!
A couple side notes: It is currently not the popular American narrative that "the govt is always the bad guy", as evidenced by those who love the state and their particular spend-happy pet projects. And if civilization is the "collective decision not to screw each other over", then what is govt? Lastly, it is obvious that he has corrupted capitalism to mean corporatism, which is unbridled greed given the direct proceeds from the goose that lays golden eggs: state taxation and industry regulation.
There certainly should be a limit on greed, but this prosecution of GS is a lateral fight between two groups that have both overstepped that limit: the prohibition of "screwing each other over". Both sides already lost, but both sides continue to win, no matter the outcome of this show-trial.
Greed and envy are part of the human makeup (as well as other more admirable attributes) and you can't limit what people are. The problem lies with a system that is rigged in such a way that they can exploit the rest of us - whether through welfare entitlement or through the legal theft of central banking and the corporatist system. You can't change what people are, but you can have a system that empowers no one to exploit others and is not rigged in a way to give select group an advantage no one else has.
Brian4Liberty
05-02-2010, 04:02 PM
A lot of apologists for Wall St criminals do rely on Rand or her influence. I agree with Matt on that.
But as people have already said, he tends to ignore the government/corporate partnerships that make it all possible. And he leaves out the fact that the most important initial motivator for the large Tea Party movement (post the initial Ron Paul Tea Parties) was the government bailout of Goldman Sachs (TARP) .
A Son of Liberty
05-02-2010, 04:04 PM
Taibbi has always been a leftist. Why is this surprising/disappointing?
Cowlesy
05-02-2010, 04:43 PM
Taibbi has always been a leftist. Why is this surprising/disappointing?
I agree. This is par for Taibbi.
Everyone loves to hate on Goldman Sachs, and I certainly have no love for them as a lot of their P&L is generated from pitting people against each other, not growing the economy, but they're not foolish enough to go outside the letter of the law. It's too easy to make money within the law if you're big enough like GS.
Liberty Stud
05-02-2010, 05:40 PM
This guy is clueless. I guess he thinks the Founding Fathers must have been reading "Atlas Shrugged" before they wrote the Constitution?
What a total idiot.
Brian4Liberty
05-02-2010, 08:19 PM
Please elaborate and demonstrate the link.
I may also point out that nobody has, as yet, been proven a criminal. I will further point out that if I package up shit and out a for-sale sign out and people buy it, it is not a criminal act on mine or anyone's part. If people want to buy shit, that is their right to do so. If they do not exercise the responsibility to research what it is they are buying, that is too bad for them, all else equal.
Well, it looks like you can explain that better than me. How did you derive your opinion on selling "shit"? Of course we are talking about "shit" that was advertised as AAA quality.
lester1/2jr
05-03-2010, 07:39 AM
he is one of those financial analysts who never thinks about the federal reserve. he just can't fathom that they could be complicit because he thinks it is some honorable government position
buck000
05-03-2010, 07:46 AM
Maybe Taibbi can do a follow-up article to explain why the "risky mortgages" were so risky. I guess people making 15k/yr trying to flip 500-700K houses are not greedy, they're just 'hard-working folks' or 'entitled to be as rich as rich people are'... ;)
Brian4Liberty
05-03-2010, 11:24 AM
Not much of an answer. Rand and her philosophy has nothing to do with any of this per se. The one possible link I see lies in a misunderstanding of what she wrote. I can readily see some people substituting their understanding of "selfishness" for the definition she would have used.
Yes, many people have boiled it down to "greed is good". And people like Bernie Madoff, Lloyd Blankfein and Al Greenspan are usually quick to giver their variation on the same theme. How can you say that Rand has nothing to do with any of this? She is one of the top philosophers in that area.
Ayn Rand influenced Ron Paul, and so did Thomas Jefferson. Yes, Ron is his own person (an individual), but you can't say that those people didn't have an influence on his opinions or thinking in some way, especially if he quotes or paraphrases them.
You are mixing two different horses here. Selling shit and answering all customer questions honestly is one thing. Selling it as "AAA quality" as you put it, is another. It is FRAUD, which happens to be a crime.
The subject is Goldman Sachs. And I agree, what they did sounds a lot like fraud.
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