Ron Paul: Barack Obama is Not a Socialist

[RonPaulFanInGA]

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2010/04/10/ron-paul-barack-obama-is-not-a-socialist/

[Anti Federalist]

He's not.

He's a puppet for the corporate/military/government complex that runs the country.

If anything he's a fascist, if you use the strict economic definition of the term.

Same as W.

Same as BC

Same as HW.

[kahless]

The Texan’s supporters often descend on political gatherings to vote for him in 2012 straw polls.

Just like supporters of every other candidate which means if he wins it is an accurate representation of party support. They had to put that in there to negate the straw poll win so the sheeple will dismiss the win. Fuck the Wall Street Journal.

[Old Ducker]

He's not.

He's a puppet for the corporate/military/government complex that runs the country.

If anything he's a fascist, if you use the strict economic definition of the term.

Same as W.

Same as BC

Same as HW.

Keep going. Stop when you reach CC.

[justinc.1089]

That was a good short article. :)

[Anti Federalist]

Keep going. Stop when you reach CC.

WW.

That would be my stopping point.

Although Silent Cal tried, no doubt.

[Depressed Liberator]

Obama, like his many of his predecessors, is a corporatist.

[South Park Fan]

This seems to be more of a semantics issue than anything else. Government ownership of the means of production (socialism) versus government control over the means of production (corporatism/fascism)

[silus]

Ron Paul doesn't use single words to define people. We should take notes.

[Stary Hickory]

Obama, like his many of his predecessors, is a corporatist.

I find this to be extremely inaccurate. Obama is a Socialist, he is doing as much as he can get away with. The Public Option - Socialized medicine has always been his goal. What he has done is to try to nudge things in that direction.

The HC Bill will destroy private health care as we know it. This is not accidental. The notion that he is not a socialist because he cannot seem to ram it through congress is silly. Lenin himself could not get such legislation through.

[roho76]

Gadfly: A person who upsets the status quo.

Damn straight.

[Depressed Liberator]

I find this to be extremely inaccurate. Obama is a Socialist, he is doing as much as he can get away with. The Public Option - Socialized medicine has always been his goal. What he has done is to try to nudge things in that direction.

The HC Bill will destroy private health care as we know it. This is not accidental. The notion that he is not a socialist because he cannot seem to ram it through congress is silly. Lenin himself could not get such legislation through.

Stary Hickory, I have read over your posts for a while now, and I am not surprised to hear you say this. You are likely the most partisan person here, sorry.

[specsaregood]

I find this to be extremely inaccurate. Obama is a Socialist, he is doing as much as he can get away with. The Public Option - Socialized medicine has always been his goal. What he has done is to try to nudge things in that direction.

No, the "public option" was the distraction used to get you to breathe a sigh of relief when you ended up with the corporate option. It was misdirection. It was the democrat side that nixed the public option, many polls showed people in favor of a "public option" but you weren't ever gonna get it. They simply used it to scare you.



The HC Bill will destroy private health care as we know it. This is not accidental.
LOL, that is the narrative being used by the right wing talking heads isn't it. It is simply untrue. The left is saying how they have "taken the insurance companies out of the drivers seat" and the right is saying how "this is the death of the insurance companies" The truth is what neither is saying! The insurance companies helped write the bill alongside the pharmaceutical companies. Now you telll me, would those 2 entities write legislation that would kill them? No. You are being lied to and buying it.

[paulitics]

I disagree. It is a joint venture between socialism and corporitism. Obama most certainly is a socialist on many fronts, as well as being a corportist. His rhetoric is certainly more socialist than anything else.

[JeNNiF00F00]

Its national socialism or fascism. Its all the same. Run by statists, for statists.

[TriangleGuy]

Technically, Obama is not a socialist. But because he is moving the country in that direction to a greater degree than most Americans are comfortable, he often gets that label (and it seems to stick). The word "Liberal" just isn't bad enough to describe him.

[ChaosControl]

I agree, I've been calling him a corporatist for a long while now.

[sofia]

obama is a communist.

ron should call him out as a socialist......the talk radio crowd would love him for it.

[Depressed Liberator]

obama is a communist.

ron should call him out as a socialist......the talk radio crowd would love him for it.

He isn't trying to pander to radio, and thank God he isn't. Get a clue.

[sofia]

He isn't trying to pander to radio, and thank God he isn't. Get a clue.

yes...he's playing to thinking people only...

that should get us about 10% of the GOP primary vote.....great:rolleyes:

[.Tom]

I agree with Dr. Paul.

Obama is a corporate whore. All these neocons calling him a socialist should understand that the insurance companies authored this fucking health care bill.

[silentshout]

He's very much a corporatist, I agree. They all are, this is why Ron Paul scares them.

[virgil47]

Obama is a Marxist with fascist leanings. He and his politburo want total and unconditional control of every man, woman and child in the U.S.A.

[silus]

yes...he's playing to thinking people only...

that should get us about 10% of the GOP primary vote.....great:rolleyes:
Maybe you should find another candidate then...:shrug

[Jack Bauer]

Maybe you should find another candidate then...:shrug

Maybe you should find a sense of humor. :rolleyes:

[Stary Hickory]

Stary Hickory, I have read over your posts for a while now, and I am not surprised to hear you say this. You are likely the most partisan person here, sorry.

Oh bite me, please show me how I am partisan. Really. I tell it like it is. Put up or shut up. Really you want to make claims like this then prove it. Little drive by absurdity thanks for the nonsense.

As if classifying Obama as a socialist/marxist is a partisan thing. It's called simple observation...what does he say and what does he do. He is a public figure pretty darn easy to get clips of him saying exactly what he means.

[silus]

Maybe you should find a sense of humor. :rolleyes:
She's not joking about this issue, newbie. Learn before you assert yourself.

[Stary Hickory]

Obama is a Marxist with fascist leanings. He and his politburo want total and unconditional control of every man, woman and child in the U.S.A.

He is a Socialist Marxist, just because there was significant compromise on the HC bill means nothing. I love how people here are ignoring what Obama has said and what he has said he wants to do.

He took as much as he could towards socialized medicine. Calling him a corporatist is not even accurate. He is restrained to a large extent.

[Stary Hickory]

No, the "public option" was the distraction used to get you to breathe a sigh of relief when you ended up with the corporate option. It was misdirection. It was the democrat side that nixed the public option, many polls showed people in favor of a "public option" but you weren't ever gonna get it. They simply used it to scare you.
If Obama could have gotten a public option he would have. I mean why even pretend like this is not the case? What is the deal?

skip to 1:02
YouTube - SHOCK UNCOVERED: Obama IN HIS OWN WORDS saying His Health Care Plan will ELIMINATE private insurance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-bY92mcOdk)



LOL, that is the narrative being used by the right wing talking heads isn't it. It is simply untrue. The left is saying how they have "taken the insurance companies out of the drivers seat" and the right is saying how "this is the death of the insurance companies" The truth is what neither is saying! The insurance companies helped write the bill alongside the pharmaceutical companies. Now you telll me, would those 2 entities write legislation that would kill them? No. You are being lied to and buying it.

I am not buying anything...what is with you? This is incredibly naive. He will take anything he can get. He has publicly and privately stated public option was on his agenda many times. And he said this knowing that he had to try and moderate what he wanted for political reasons. I mean what world do you live in?

Obama was none to happy to have all the compromises. This is getting downright silly, sometimes it makes sense to look at the facts and make a logical conclusion rather than some crazy roundabout conspiracy angle.

[silus]

I don't see the point in trying to isolate one or two words to identify someone. You think Ron Paul worries about these things? If you want accuracy, use sentences.

[sevin]

Ron Paul is right. Of course Obama is not really a socialist. He's a fucking corporatist. This is not news.

The republicans are using the word "socialist" on Obama to scare voters into voting Republican this fall.

[hugolp]

He's not.

He's a puppet for the corporate/military/government complex that runs the country.

If anything he's a fascist, if you use the strict economic definition of the term.


Obama, like his many of his predecessors, is a corporatist.

And what it is the real difference between facist, corporativist and socialist? Because they all seem awfully simillar to me. Diferent rethorics, same results.

[nayjevin]

This seems to be more of a semantics issue than anything else. Government ownership of the means of production (socialism) versus government control over the means of production (corporatism/fascism)

this here

[hugolp]

If we assume this to be the valid definitions:


This seems to be more of a semantics issue than anything else. Government ownership of the means of production (socialism) versus government control over the means of production (corporatism/fascism)

Then there is a problem with what you guys are saying:


Ron Paul is right. Of course Obama is not really a socialist. He's a fucking corporatist. This is not news.

The republicans are using the word "socialist" on Obama to scare voters into voting Republican this fall.


this here

Its not only the republicans. Because when "liberals" use the word socialism they dont mean goverment ownership of the means of production. When they say we want european socialism they are not saying they want the goverment ownership of the means of production.

What they mean is that they want more regulations and more granted services. So in fact when "liberals" say they want more socialism they mean they want more goverment control over the economy (not ownership). So basically you are saying is that liberals are mis-using the name socialism too and what they really want is more corporativism/fascism.

So wich one is it?

[itshappening]

anyone know how liberals reacted to this? what are their sites and comments from them?

[ctiger2]

YouTube - Ron Paul Agrees with Max Keiser and BJ Lawson that Obama is not a socialist (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C34DP4lNAxE)

[angelatc]

I find this to be extremely inaccurate. Obama is a Socialist, he is doing as much as he can get away with. The Public Option - Socialized medicine has always been his goal. What he has done is to try to nudge things in that direction.

The HC Bill will destroy private health care as we know it. This is not accidental. The notion that he is not a socialist because he cannot seem to ram it through congress is silly. Lenin himself could not get such legislation through.

You're exactly right.

[Rylick]

One thing that always comes on my mind on this issue is Senator McCarthy

[Bruno]

Its brilliant in the sense that every other Republican is getting lumped together and called to the carpet for using fear mongering and the Socialist label, but Ron Paul stands alone calling him a Corporatist. This verbiage gets people thinking ( we hope), and actually sounds less "conpiracy theorist and fear mongering" than does saying someone is in bed with corporations - as his actions clearly show. (see Healthcare Bill)

[silentshout]

anyone know how liberals reacted to this? what are their sites and comments from them?

Mainly crickets. Honestly, most people on the left are too obsessed with Sarah Palin right now to even notice anything about Ron Paul.

[hugolp]

anyone know how liberals reacted to this? what are their sites and comments from them?

Reddit r/politics had a mixed reaction. Some liked it, others tried to defend Obama and atack Paul.

[QueenB4Liberty]

If Obama could have gotten a public option he would have. I mean why even pretend like this is not the case? What is the deal?

skip to 1:02
YouTube - SHOCK UNCOVERED: Obama IN HIS OWN WORDS saying His Health Care Plan will ELIMINATE private insurance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-bY92mcOdk)



I am not buying anything...what is with you? This is incredibly naive. He will take anything he can get. He has publicly and privately stated public option was on his agenda many times. And he said this knowing that he had to try and moderate what he wanted for political reasons. I mean what world do you live in?

Obama was none to happy to have all the compromises. This is getting downright silly, sometimes it makes sense to look at the facts and make a logical conclusion rather than some crazy roundabout conspiracy angle.


Well, actions speak louder than words. He's a corporatist much more than a socialist. If he was a socialist then he wouldn't have signed a bill the insurance companies wrote.

[brandon]

I wonder if RP reads ronpaulforums...http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=236803

If so I feel flattered. :)

[Vessol]

I've been saying this for a long time.

Obama is not a socialist. Socialism is ineffective, corrupt and downright stupid, but Obama follows a much more insideous agenda.

He is a Corporatist. He works for the banks and corporations, not for the people.

Anyone who is using the socialist dogma in my opinion is just another right-winger Fox-nut. Ready to vote in another Corporatist in the guise of a "conservative".

[heavenlyboy34]

I agree with RP on this one, but I think "fascialist" is a better word. JMHO.

[ctiger2]

YouTube - Ron Paul: Obama is NOT a Socialist. Obama is a Corporatist! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2FLCQuuHn9o)

[Depressed Liberator]

And what it is the real difference between facist, corporativist and socialist? Because they all seem awfully simillar to me. Diferent rethorics, same results.

You really do not know what those words mean, that is the problem.

[CUnknown]

Yeah, there is actually a pretty significant difference between Socialism and Fascism. Socialism wishes to expand state power at the expense of corporate power, whereas Fascism wishes to expand state power in order to expand corporate power. They both want to expand state power, so they are similar at least in that respect.

Now, Corporatism is just another word for Fascism, to me. It's a "nicer" word to use that doesn't conjure up images of the Holocaust.

Fascism was called "National Socialism," but back then socialism was popular and everyone wanted to be called a socialist. That's why the Nazis used that name, more or less.

Bernie Sanders, Ralph Nader, and Dennis Kucinich are basically socialists, but they are certainly not Corporatists. Pretty much every other politician is a Corporatist, lol. And of course Ron Paul is an example of a conservative, one of the few.

[Stary Hickory]

Well, actions speak louder than words. He's a corporatist much more than a socialist. If he was a socialist then he wouldn't have signed a bill the insurance companies wrote.

He signed it because it gives government much more control. He is pushing towards socialized medicine. If he had signed nothing he would be no where at all, whereas this bill gives government control over the health care industry and American lives. It was a compromise that had to be done.

The HC bill must be killed. I don't even refer to it as a law...I don't consider it a law.

[TroySmith]

Using "The New Fascism: Rule by Consensus" as a source:

Socialism - theory of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production, capital, land, in the community as a whole.

Fascism - a system with strong centralized power, permitting no opposition or criticism, controlling all affairs of the nation.

Statism - the principle or policy of concentrating extensive economic, political, and related controls in the state at the expense of individual liberty.

Now, this would mean that socialism and fascism are two different branches of statism. Obama is clearly a statist, but after some thought I think he is closer to a fascist than a socialist (although the end result is very similar) in that he is doing all he can to silence any and all opposition and criticism of him. To me, that part seems ok. In theory, although often not in practice, socialist will permit criticism or opposition.

[awake]

He is a Obamalist. Half non-socialist, half Harry Potter.

[alaric]

I find this to be extremely inaccurate. Obama is a Socialist, he is doing as much as he can get away with. The Public Option - Socialized medicine has always been his goal. What he has done is to try to nudge things in that direction.

The HC Bill will destroy private health care as we know it. This is not accidental. The notion that he is not a socialist because he cannot seem to ram it through congress is silly. Lenin himself could not get such legislation through.

Socialist is just a word people use to describe obamayomama to avoid calling him a communist. I think traitor is a better description. Of course, he would have to be a citizen to be a traitor. hmmmmm, where does that leave me.:p