Great post at Reason about the "Scandanavian Socialism" debaters

[Brian Defferding]

Give it a look:

http://reason.com/blog/2010/03/08/so-why-is-the-swedish-welfare

The comments below the blog, while they get snarky (and funny) at times, I found was just as informative as the blog itself. Some Norwegians posted in there and gave some good insight on their country.

I think many liberals who champion Scandanavian socialism as a utopia for their ideals seem to look at the country with rose colored glasses. Norway's government is running on a natural resource will eventually run dry, and soon they will have little left to redistribute with.

Just thought I would share it here.

[Brian Defferding]

Bump!

[Pennsylvania]

First thing to do is just have them define socialism (they usually can't nail down just what it actually is). I don't imagine most serious socialists would claim those countries as such, unless they were being intellectually dishonest. After all, most of the industries are still in private hands, they're just rather regulated.

[Brian Defferding]

First thing to do is just have them define socialism (they usually can't nail down just what it actually is). I don't imagine most serious socialists would claim those countries as such, unless they were being intellectually dishonest. After all, most of the industries are still in private hands, they're just rather regulated.

That is true. They usually don't prefer socialism in its most purest form, it's more of a "socialist lite" government I've come to encounter most often in debates on liberal message boards. Whatever the case, they love to champion the Scandinavian countries, and (to a certain degree) France when it comes to health care.

[MN Patriot]

If the income tax is present, the country is socialist, in my opinion. When the Norwegians run out of oil, their welfare state will go bankrupt.

Here is a racist Scandinavian joke with sort of a political theme:
A Swede, a Norwegian and a Dane were arrested in France during the French revolution. They each got to choose which way they would die. The Norwegian chose the guillotine, because he saw it as the latest fashion. His head went under, but the blade stopped 1 inch from his neck. The French saw this as a sign from God and decided to let him go. The same thing happened to the Dane. Then they asked the Swede how he wanted to die. "I think I'll die by hanging, that guillotine doesn't work anyway," he said.

[silus]

Socialism can work in a small group of citizens who feel obligated to the other. Immigration without assimilation is what is breaking down the viability of socialism in Scandinavia, imo.

I personally don't have this visceral reaction to socialism as some do here. Its definitely not part of U.S. tradition and principle and would not work with such a massive and diverse population. But that does not mean basic components of socialism are not real and exist within all political systems to some degree, nor does it mean socialism could not work within a given place and time for a given group of people.

Bottom line, you don't need to disprove the viability of socialism in Sweden to disprove it for the U.S.

[osan]

Bottom line, you don't need to disprove the viability of socialism in Sweden to disprove it for the U.S.

That is one of the most intelligent comments I have ever encountered on the topic.

I will add that "socialism" per se is not the problem. The problem lies in the application of force or the threat of it in order to make people accept something they do not want. I don't give a rat's ass if 50 million Americans want to be socialists. Let them be. Just leave me out of it. You live as you see fit and I will do the same. Let us agree to disagree and respect each other enough to leave each other alone. But that is not how it is done. Force, force, always force. No wonder the world sucks as badly as it does - people are assholes.

[emazur]

'The Socialist Utopia' - a documentary made by a Swede who has posted on Ron Paul forums before (that's how I found it):
http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4938945/The_Socialist_Utopia
has some dry spots but good info within. The Swedish prison system was pretty shocking