EXTREMELY DANGEROUS BILL! - This needs your calls to all your senators now! S. 3081

[Reason]

Dear god...

Where are we going America?

I called my senators and neither of the offices were aware of this bill and were both very disturbed upon looking it up while I spoke with them.

BILL PDF ~ (RIGHT CLICK - SAVE AS) (http://assets.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/politics/ARM10090.pdf)

Co-Sponsors (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3081/show#)



Sen. Scott Brown [R, MA] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/412384)
Sen. Saxby Chambliss [R, GA] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300021)
Sen. James Inhofe [R, OK] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300055)
Sen. George LeMieux [R, FL] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/412380)
Sen. Joseph Lieberman [I, CT] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300067)
Sen. Jefferson Sessions [R, AL] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300088)
Sen. John Thune [R, SD] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/400546)
Sen. David Vitter [R, LA] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/400418)
Sen. Roger Wicker [R, MS] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/400432)






CALL YOUR SENATORS AND DEMAND THEY TAKE A POSITION ON THIS BILL

S.3081: Enemy Belligerent, Interrogation, Detention, and Prosecution Act of 2010 - U.S. Congress - OpenCongress (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3081/show)

The “Enemy Belligerent, Interrogation, Detention, and Prosecution Act of 2010,” introduced by Senators John McCain and Joseph Lieberman on Thursday with little fanfare, “sets out a comprehensive policy for the detention, interrogation and trial of suspected enemy belligerents who are believed to have engaged in hostilities against the United States by requiring these individuals to be held in military custody, interrogated for their intelligence value and not provided with a Miranda warning,”

The bill does not distinguish between U.S. citizens and non-citizens, and states that “suspected belligerents” who are “considered a “high-value detainee” shall not be provided with a Miranda warning.”

A person is considered a “high value detainee” if they fulfill one of the following criteria.

(1) poses a threat of an attack on civilians or civilian facilities within the U.S. or U.S. facilities abroad; (2) poses a threat to U.S. military personnel or U.S. military facilities; (3) potential intelligence value; (4) is a member of al Qaeda or a terrorist group affiliated with al Qaeda or (5) such other matters as the President considers appropriate.

Now that the Southern Poverty Law Center and the federal government, via the MIAC report and innumerable other leaked documents, now consider virtually anyone with a dissenting opinion against the state as “posing a threat,” millions of peaceful American citizens could be swept up by this frightening dragnet of tyranny.

However, according to the bill, an individual doesn’t even have to pose a threat to be snatched, detained and interrogated – they can merely be deemed to be of “potential intelligence value” or come under the vague and sweeping mandate of “such other matters as the President considers appropriate”.

This last designation hands Obama dictator powers to have any American citizen kidnapped, detained, and interrogated on a whim.

The only proviso that even hints at some form of check or balance is the measure that states, “The High-Value Detainee Interrogation Team must make a preliminary determination whether the detainee is an unprivileged enemy belligerent within 48 hours of taking detainee into custody.”

“The High-Value Detainee Interrogation Team must submit its determination to the Secretary of Defense and the Attorney General after consultation with the Director of National Intelligence, the Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Director of the Central Intelligence Agency. The Secretary of Defense and the Attorney General make a final determination and report the determination to the President and the appropriate committees of Congress. In the case of any disagreement between the Secretary of Defense and the Attorney General, the President will make the determination,” states the bill.

The ACLU has expressed its vigorous opposition to the legislation, labeling it nothing less than a “direct attack on the Constitution”.

“Indefinite detention flies in the face of American values and violates this country’s commitment to the rule of law,” states Laura W. Murphy, Director of the ACLU Washington Legislative Office.

Of course, such positions from the ACLU as well as Amnesty International will only be used as grist for the neo-con propaganda mill about how the bill ought to be passed in order to avoid being “soft on terrorists,” a piece of spin still being swallowed whole by millions of conservatives who are blissfully unaware of the fact that the apparatus of the war on terror is now being aimed squarely at politically active American citizens.

“Torture, indefinite imprisonment, secret trials and limited staged hearings are the stuff of cheap dictatorships,” writes Ian McColgin. “They are the sort of idiocy we scorned in the Soviets, the Koreans and the Vietnamese. It is astonishing that we have senators and citizens even discussing this bill which is not a capitulation to terrorism – it’s the triumph of terrorism.”

[jkr]

Traitors!

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

We are so close to midnight it isn't even funny...what do we do if they pass this thing? What is crossing the line?

[driege]

If they amend it to only apply to non-citizens I would be fine with it. I don't think we owe non-citizens the right to civilian trials in a jurisdiction they have never entered. With that said, I think they have a right to due process and should not be held indefinitely without a trial.

[jkr]

can we fire or impeach these "people"?

[Reason]

Co-Sponsors (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3081/show#)


Sen. Scott Brown [R, MA] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/412384)
Sen. Saxby Chambliss [R, GA] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300021)
Sen. James Inhofe [R, OK] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300055)
Sen. George LeMieux [R, FL] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/412380)
Sen. Joseph Lieberman [I, CT] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300067)
Sen. Jefferson Sessions [R, AL] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/300088)
Sen. John Thune [R, SD] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/400546)
Sen. David Vitter [R, LA] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/400418)
Sen. Roger Wicker [R, MS] (http://www.opencongress.org/person/show/400432)

[micahnelson]

If they amend it to only apply to non-citizens I would be fine with it. I don't think we owe non-citizens the right to civilian trials in a jurisdiction they have never entered. With that said, I think they have a right to due process and should not be held indefinitely without a trial.

Incarceration with representation!

[Old Ducker]

Im surprised Imhofe is co-sponsoring this, he hates McCain.

[BuddyRey]

We've GOT to get the word out!!!

http://digg.com/political_opinion/A_Detention_Bill_You_Ought_to_Read_More_Carefully_ 4

[Cowlesy]

So, this is saying that U.S. citizens can be detained and transferred to the military system without due process for (3) potential intelligence value or (5) such other matters as the President deems appropriate. What are hostilities? Is us being pissed off at being squashed by taxes and regulation, "hostilities" as defined by Senators McCain and Lieberman?

Well then, I hope...

1.) Judge Napolitano does not have a seizure.

2.) Liberals actually give a shit and realize what heinous legislation this is (but I doubt it).

[pcosmar]

This is UnAmerican in concept and philosophy. Contrary to everything the Founders worked and fought for.
I honestly don't know what else to say. :mad:

[mediahasyou]

The government already will kidnap you if they deem you a terrorist. Ask any gitmo detainee.

If there is another terrorism law, that doesn't change anything.

[BuddyRey]

John McCain and Joe Lieberman should be CENSURED for this!!!

[pcosmar]

Im surprised Imhofe is co-sponsoring this, he hates McCain.

I'm not. I watched him at the Iran Contra hearings. That man covers up some heavy shit, and is no doubt personally involved in it.

edit. Oops, wrong guy (post clouded by anger). I was thinking of Inouye .
This guy is still a serious warmonger.

[Bruno]

It was completely against the intention of our founders to provide the power to the president to arrest people that "he deems appropriate" to be arrested.

[Cowlesy]

Alien & Sedition Acts?

[pacelli]

Thank you for the heads-up.

I left a polite but firm voicemail on Senator Burr's voicemail. Will post here if I receive a reply back.

[Reason]

spread this like wildfire!

[Mach]

Traitors!

Damn Straight!

They should be the ones detained.

[pcosmar]

On this.

http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/Xaeon/passnot.jpg

They need to hear a resounding NO. :mad:

[LibForestPaul]

If they amend it to only apply to non-citizens I would be fine with it. I don't think we owe non-citizens the right to civilian trials in a jurisdiction they have never entered. With that said, I think they have a right to due process and should not be held indefinitely without a trial.

All people are born with natural rights. They do gain nor lose them simply by not being a citizen of a particular country.

p.s. Who defines your citizenship?

[jdmyprez_deo_vindice]

well... guess I will be seeing you guys at some federal detention facility because you know they are aiming this crap at people like us.

[pcosmar]

well... guess I will be seeing you guys at some federal detention facility because you know they are aiming this crap at people like us.

I doubt you will see me, but,,

Article III

If I am captured I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and to aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy

[tpreitzel]

This bill is simply another sign that the establishment realizes they're running out of time. They're desperate as they almost saw Medina throw a wrench in their finely crafted machinery. The elections of 2010 don't forebode well for the establishment at all.

Sure, this bill is very dangerous just like McCain's bill to regulate access to supplements.

[rancher89]

No more rhetoric about enemy combatants, now it's down to enemy belligerents.

We are so royally screwed.

I have blasted to all my email lists. How did this not get picked up until today? He introduced this on Thursday????

This is a scary scary bill.

[Legend1104]

I am ashamed that my senator (wicker) is co-sponsoring this. I have contacted him with a very stern message. He also refused to support my requests for the senato audit the fed bill.

[andrewh817]

It's the fifth one that worries me the most...... but there's nothing any of us can do to stop this.

[Cowlesy]

I mean this thing is so ridiculous, I can't see how it could possibly be deemed Constitutional.

What I do not get is this. If you are plotting something to harm fellow citizens and the gov't catches wind of it, then go arrest him and then try him! What is all this cloak'n dagger shit? That's what bothers me. THey have carte-blanche to just snatch people they don't like, and no one will ever know about it.

Yes it is an extreme example, but this is $@(#ing America.

[micahnelson]

Liberals will understand this one.

Solidarity!

[Reason]

spreading this as far and wide as I can, I hope all of you are as well

[rancher89]

as fast as I can type and I'll be on it all day tomorrow too.

[Cowlesy]

Liberals will understand this one.

Solidarity!

Yeah I don't know...I've barely heard boo out of them about the reauthorization of the Patriot Act. Civil Liberties supporters my ass.

[micahnelson]

I have liberal voting friends, one of whom you may know from his previous postings here, who are fit to be tied over the patriot act extension.

For those who are not seeing past Obama's "For the People" facade, this is a great way to illustrate the truth.

[Anti Federalist]

We are so close to midnight it isn't even funny...what do we do if they pass this thing? What is crossing the line?

Some well crafted letters of disapproval and the formation of a peaceful political action committee will stop that in it's tracks, by god.

:mad::rolleyes::mad::rolleyes::mad::rolleyes:

[Reason]

http://news.google.com/news/search?aq=f&pz=1&cf=all&ned=us&hl=en&q=%22Enemy+Belligerent%2C+Interrogation%2C+Detenti on%2C+and+Prosecution+Act+of+2010%22

[Anti Federalist]

I mean this thing is so ridiculous, I can't see how it could possibly be deemed Constitutional.

And that has stopped them before, when, exactly?


What I do not get is this. If you are plotting something to harm fellow citizens and the gov't catches wind of it, then go arrest him and then try him! What is all this cloak'n dagger shit? That's what bothers me. THey have carte-blanche to just snatch people they don't like, and no one will ever know about it.

Tyrants wear the black masks.

They are the ones who have to hide the evil deeds in the dark, buried under mountains of legal obsfuscation.

And there's wondering of why government cops are getting shot and tax collectors getting "kamikazied" and Fed buildings getting "graffittioed"?

Frankly, with shit like this coming down the pike, I'm amazed it isn't happening a hundred times a day.

:mad:

[bunklocoempire]

Of course, such positions from the ACLU as well as Amnesty International will only be used as grist for the neo-con propaganda mill about how the bill ought to be passed in order to avoid being “soft on terrorists,” a piece of spin still being swallowed whole by millions of conservatives who are blissfully unaware of the fact that the apparatus of the war on terror is now being aimed squarely at politically active American citizens.


An opportunity to use fear of Obama/Dems to our advantage.

Those millions of "conservatives" were cheering for this crap when Bush was dishing it out. When confronted with the fact that Bushs policies would soon be wielded by a Democrat, they would change the subject and scream "stop those terrorists".

Now they can see what screaming terrorist can turn into. Or do the "conservatives" trust Obama on this one?

Opportunity.



Bunkloco

[Paulitical Correctness]

Contact Numbers

Scott Brown - R (MA)

317 Russell Senate Office Building
Washington D.C. 20510
(202) 224-4543

2400 JFK Federal Building
55 New Sudbury Street
Boston, MA 02203
(617) 565-3170

Saxby Chambliss - R (GA)

East Georgia Office
3633 Wheeler Road
Suite 270
Augusta, GA 30909
Main: 706-650-1555
Fax: 706-650-7985

Middle Georgia Office
300 Mulberry Street
Suite 502
Macon, GA 31201
Main: 478-741-1417
Fax: 478-741-1437
Tollfree: 800-234-4208

North Georgia Office
100 Galleria Parkway
Suite 1340
Atlanta, GA 30339
Main: 770-763-9090
Fax: 770-226-8633

South Georgia Office
585 South Main Street
P.O. Box 3217
Moultrie, GA 31776
Main: 229-985-2112
Fax: 229-985-2123

Washington D.C. Office
416 Russell Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510
Main: 202-224-3521
Fax: 202-224-0103

James Inhofe - R (OK)

Washington, DC Office:
453 Russell Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510 -3603
Main: (202) 224-4721
Fax: (202) 228-0380

Tulsa, OK Office:
1924 S. Utica Avenue
Suite 530
Tulsa, OK 74104 -6511
Main: (918) 748-5111
Fax: (918) 748-5119

Oklahoma City, OK Office:
1900 NW Expressway St
Suite 1210
Oklahoma City, OK 73118
Main: (405) 608-4381
Fax: (405) 608-4120

McAlester, OK Office:
215 E Choctaw Ave
Suite 106
McAlester, OK 74501
Main: (918) 426-0933
Fax: (918) 426-0935

Enid, OK Office:
302 N Independence
Suite 104
Enid, OK 73701
Main: (580) 234-5105
Fax: (580) 234-5094

George LeMieux - R (FL)

Orlando:
201 S. Orange Ave., Suite 350
Orlando, FL 32801
Tel: (407) 254-2573
Fax: (407) 423-0941
Toll-Free in FL: (866) 630-7106

Fort Myers:
2120 Main Street, Suite 200
Fort Myers, Florida 33901
Tel: (239) 332-3898
Fax: (239) 332-3447

Jacksonville:
1650 Prudential Drive, Suite 220
Jacksonville, FL 32207
Tel: (904) 398-8586
Fax: (904) 398-8591

Miami:
8669 NW 36th St., Ste 355
Miami, FL 33166
Tel: (305) 418-8553
Fax: (305) 594- 4014

Fort Lauderdale:
642 N. Federal Hwy.
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33304
Tel: (954) 760-4124
Fax: (954) 760-4598

Pensacola:
1 N. Palafox Street, Suite 159
Pensacola, FL 32502
Tel: (850) 433-2603
Fax: (850) 433-2554

Tampa :
3802 Spectrum Boulevard, Suite 106
Tampa, FL 33612
Telephone: (813) 977-6450
Fax: (813) 977-6593

Washington:
United States Senate
356 Russell Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510
Telephone: (202) 224-3041
Fax: (202) 228-5171

Joseph Lieberman I - (CT)

Connecticut Office
One Constitution Plaza
7th Floor
Hartford, CT 06103
860.549.8463 (Voice)
800.225.5605 (In CT)
866.317.2242 (Fax)

Washington DC Office
706 Hart Office Building
Washington, DC 20510
202.224.4041 (Voice)
202.224.9750 (Fax)

Jeff Sessions - R (AL)

Washington, D.C.
326 Russell Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510 -0104
Main: (202) 224-4124
Fax: (202) 224-3149

Huntsville
200 Clinton Avenue NW
Regions Center, Suite 802
Huntsville, AL 35801 -4932
Main: (256) 533-0979
Fax: (256) 533-0745

Birmingham
1800 5th Avenue North
341 Vance Federal Building
Birmingham, AL 35203 -2171
Main: (205) 731-1500
Fax: (205) 731-0221

Montgomery
7550 Halcyon Summit Drive
Suite 150
Montgomery, AL 36117
Main: (334) 244-7017
Fax: (334) 244-7091

Mobile
41 West I-65 Service Road North
Colonial Bank Centre, Suite 2300-A
Mobile, AL 36608 -1291
Main: (251) 414-3083
Fax: (251) 414-5845

John Thune - R (SD)

Washington Office
Senator John Thune
United States Senate SR-493
Washington, DC 20510
Phone: (202) 224-2321
Fax: (202) 228-5429
TollFree: 1-866-850-3855

Sioux Falls Office
320 North Main Avenue
Suite B
Sioux Falls, SD 57104
Phone: (605) 334-9596

Rapid City Office
1313 West Main Street
Rapid City, SD 57701
Phone: (605) 348-7551

Aberdeen Office
320 South 1st Street
Suite 101
Aberdeen, SD 57401
Phone: (605) 225-8823

David Vitter - R (LA)

Washington, D.C. Office
516 Hart Senate Office Building
Washington, DC 20510
Main: (202) 224-4623
Fax: (202) 228-5061

Central Louisiana Office
2230 S. MacArthur Dr., Suite 4
Alexandria, LA 71301
Main: (318) 448-0169
Fax: (318) 448-0189

Northeast Louisiana Office
1217 N. 19th St.
Monroe, LA 71201
Main: (318) 325-8120
Fax: (318) 325-9165

Northwest Louisiana Office
920 Pierremont Road, Suite 113
Shreveport, LA 71106
Main: (318) 861-0437
Fax: (318) 861-4865

Southeast Louisiana Office
2800 Veterans Blvd., Suite 201
Metairie, LA 70002
Main: (504) 589-2753
Fax: (504) 589-2607

Southwest Louisiana Office
3221 Ryan St., Suite E
Lake Charles, LA 70601
Main: (337) 436-0453
Fax: (337) 436-3163

Acadiana Office
800 Lafayette St.
Suite 1200
Lafayette, LA 70501
Main: 337-262-6898
Fax: 337-262-6373

Baton Rouge Office
858 Convention St.
Baton Rouge, LA 70802
Main: 225-383-0331
Fax: 225-383-0952

Roger Wicker - R (MS)

Washington, D.C. Office
555 Dirksen Senate Office Building
Washington , DC 20510
Main: 202-224-6253
Fax: 202-228-0378

Jackson Office
245 E. Capitol St.
Suite 226
Jackson, MS 39201
Main: (601) 965-4644
Fax: (601) 965-4007

Gulfport Office
452 Courthouse Road
Suite F
Gulfport, MS 39507
Main: (228) 604-2383
Fax: (228) 896-4359

Pascagoula Office
3118 Pascagoula St.
Suite 179
Pascagoula, MS 39567
Main: (228) 762-5400
Fax: (228) 762-0137

Tupelo Office
2801 West Main Street
Tupelo, MS 38801
Main: (662) 844-5010
Fax: (662) 844-5030

Hernando Office
321 Losher Street
PO Box 385
Hernando , MS 38632
Main: (662) 429-1002
Fax: (662) 429-6002

[osan]

Dear god...


Well, yes... but before you all get your undies in a knot, bear in mind that this legislation just went to committee, where it stands a very good chance of dying. I'm not suggesting we not keep an eye on it, but letter campaigns are not quite yet called for. I would wait until the committee reports their findings.

[TheBlackPeterSchiff]

Man, I'vve been all over the net letting some of my liberal and independent friends know about this shit and they are stunned. They cant believe this shit isnt even being picked up by the media.

WTF is going on with America????

"What's goin on?" - Marvin Gaye

[Kylie]

Here are the people on the committee.


http://judiciary.house.gov/about/members.html


Let these in particular know that you are pissed.

[Reason]

Here are the people on the committee.


http://judiciary.house.gov/about/members.html (http://judiciary.house.gov/about/members.html)


Let these in particular know that you are pissed.

thx

[GunnyFreedom]

Shared on FB -- this is the most disgusting act to be considered since the Alien and Sedition Acts, IMHO THIS is pure black oily oozing evil. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

[GunnyFreedom]

John McCain and Joe Lieberman should be CENSURED for this!!!

CENSURED? hell no -- try TRIED FOR FUCKING TREASON!!!

[Inkblots]

This kind of thing makes me heartsick.

That ain't my America, it just ain't.

[RM918]

Ah, Scott Brown, conservative hero! He'll stop ObamaCare, then throw us all in jail!

[GunnyFreedom]

My Facebook is literally EXPLODING over this -- I need need need a link to the full text of this bill something AWFUL. And all the sources seem broken right now -- does ANYBODY have a cached copy of the text of this bill PLEASE?

[Pauls' Revere]

came across this definition:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawful_combatant

An unlawful combatant or unprivileged combatant/belligerent is a civilian who directly engages in armed conflict in violation of International Humanitarian Law (IHL) and may be detained or prosecuted under the domestic law of the detaining state for such action.[1]

Reuters covered it:
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62358O20100304

[V4Vendetta]

well... guess I will be seeing you guys at some federal detention facility because you know they are aiming this crap at people like us.

you are correct. but me go to something like that? LMAO i think not

[Reason]

does ANYBODY have a cached copy of the text of this bill PLEASE?

BILL PDF ~ (RIGHT CLICK - SAVE AS) (http://assets.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/politics/ARM10090.pdf)

[Reason]

uploaded to https://secure.wikileaks.org/ for safe keeping as well

[GunnyFreedom]

uploaded to https://secure.wikileaks.org/ (https://secure.wikileaks.org/) for safe keeping as well

Thank you!

[GunnyFreedom]

twitter hash #S3081

[Reason]

anyone have contacts @ the oathkeepers?

only I saw on their site was

sam.porter@oathkeepers.org

[Reason]

//

[Bergie Bergeron]

//

[GunnyFreedom]

The #S3081 hash is starting to pick up on Twitter. If you wanted to build cred on Twitter, a good way is to get in on the ground floor of a trending topic. I've picked up 20 followers in the last 10 hrs just on retweets and the #S3081 hash.

[Dojo]

Strange Media silence.... even for the internet

GOOGLE search results for "Enemy Belligerent Interrogation, Detention and Prosecution Act of 2010".

NEWS 16 hits

Web 2,730 hits

Blog 208 hits



I watched news stories grow before, and this one is dead on google, message boards are buzzing tho whats going on?

[GunnyFreedom]

I made a new DIGG link with the New American article (the other DIGG link has The Atlantic) and I embedded the already-in-use Twitter hash for easy retweeting. Please digg the hell out of this one too:

http://digg.com/politics/NewAmerican_reviews_S3081_Belligerent_Detention_Ac t

[DapperDan]

Getting this out to friends and family, etc.


"Belligerent"....not "Combatant"
http://captionsearch.com/pix/thumb/2rub7eoeem-t.jpg

[A. Havnes]

Man, I'vve been all over the net letting some of my liberal and independent friends know about this shit and they are stunned. They cant believe this shit isnt even being picked up by the media.

WTF is going on with America????

"What's goin on?" - Marvin Gaye

Hardly anything important is getting picked up by our media! That's why I seldom watch American news and read American papers. We blow the tiniest things into these huge reports while completely ignoring the stuff that is actually important! Not that we're the only country that does that, but you get the idea.

[jmdrake]

Yeah I don't know...I've barely heard boo out of them about the reauthorization of the Patriot Act. Civil Liberties supporters my ass.

They are too busy worrying about passing healthcare. The only good thing about this bill is that McCain and Lieberman are both on the left's crapper list at the moment. Also it looks like all of the co-sponsors are republican including the "beloved" Scott Brown. Folks this is what we have to look forward too if we don't win crucial republican primaries! It can't just be putting the same GOP back in power!

[Bergie Bergeron]

Sent this to a few people that write on DailyKos, hopefully they'll read it. Anyone sent this to Ron Paul and the Judge?

[PBrady]

Didn't read the entire thread yet...but has anyone seen the actual text of the bill in full? Searched briefly online and neither govtrack nor opencongress had it. Just want to make sure I have the actual text to back up the original article.

Thanks!

[Reason]

Didn't read the entire thread yet...but has anyone seen the actual text of the bill in full? Searched briefly online and neither govtrack nor opencongress had it. Just want to make sure I have the actual text to back up the original article.

Thanks!

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showpost.php?p=2586677&postcount=50

[Pennsylvania]

I shudder to think what this country would be like without allies like the ACLU in cases like this.

[PBrady]

Ah! Thanks!

Fox News Facebook page here I come!

[Bruno]

came across this definition:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawful_combatant

An unlawful combatant or unprivileged combatant/belligerent is a civilian who directly engages in armed conflict in violation of International Humanitarian Law (IHL) and may be detained or prosecuted under the domestic law of the detaining state for such action.[1]

Reuters covered it:
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62358O20100304

they closed comments after one comment. Nice.

[GunnyFreedom]

LOL I lost 5 Facebook "friends" over this one. :rolleyes: Some people I guess just really hate everything that America is supposed to stand for.

[Bergie Bergeron]

Spread !

[GunnyFreedom]

Spread !

Help !

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=235084

;)

[devil21]

Changing the active word from "combatant" to "belligerent" just moved this into the Thought Crime realm.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/belligerent


1.warlike; given to waging war.
2.of warlike character; aggressively hostile; bellicose: a belligerent tone.

The first two definitions don't say anything about actually waging war or violent actions, rather simply character/personality traits. So one can be imprisoned and interrogated without due process under the Constitution, regardless of citizenship, for being "warlike". Of course in this context, "warlike" means loud, persistent and disobedient.

Has anyone done a good blog write up on this yet? If not, we need one (accurate tho!!) that can be spread quickly, particularly the part about it including US citizens. This is "end game" type stuff to round up dissenters with legal justification.

[BuddyRey]

LOL I lost 5 Facebook "friends" over this one. :rolleyes: Some people I guess just really hate everything that America is supposed to stand for.

No way dude! How could anybody who claims to love liberty think that this bill is a good idea?

[New2Libertarianism]

I'm kind of scared! This could end up getting me

[GunnyFreedom]

No way dude! How could anybody who claims to love liberty think that this bill is a good idea?

I have 1260 FB friends, and probably just under half of them are "us." Remember I am running for office, and behind Ron Pauls 2007 advice, I am hooked up pretty deep into the Republican Party now. Enough for me personally to be known and discussed by the State House and Senate GOP minority leadership...

[Brian4Liberty]

BILL PDF ~ (RIGHT CLICK - SAVE AS) (http://assets.theatlantic.com/static/mt/assets/politics/ARM10090.pdf)

So, the US Constitution doesn't apply, but an international treaty does? Can't imagine where that will lead...


10 SEC. 5. DETENTION WITHOUT TRIAL OF UNPRIVILEGED
11 ENEMY BELLIGERENTS.
12 An individual, including a citizen of the United
13 States, determined to be an unprivileged enemy belligerent
14 under section 3(c)(2) in a manner which satisfies Article
15 5 of the Geneva Convention Relative to the Treatment of
16 Prisoners of War may be detained without criminal
17 charges and without trial for the duration of hostilities
18 against the United States or its coalition partners in which
19 the individual has engaged, or which the individual has
20 purposely and materially supported, consistent with the
21 law of war and any authorization for the use of military
22 force provided by Congress pertaining to such hostilities.

[Slutter McGee]

I think the first order of business is to push for clarification in the Bill and the exclusion of US citizens from it. If we can get that done, then we start pushing against the entire bill itself.

Sincerely,

Slutter McGee

[Aratus]

i'd rather slam dunk it without playing the game of lets tweak!
i can go to barney frank's office and say things in a polite manner!
obama wants a bi-partisan issue, then well doggy... this one's a beaut!
lets get dennis kucinich on board before we waltz this one over to mitch McC!
if we all sit back, we get SCREwWwEd MOST TOTALLY! Auld Ben Franklin was correct!

[jbrace]

I posted this on my facebook and A friend responded with this:

Caleb Oldziewski If Adam Gadahn were captured in Virginia, for example, trying to carry out an attack on a Catholic School... Would you want him arrested and given Miranda rights or in the custody of military intelligence?

Im at work and on my iphone and don't have time to respond. Any care to give me something to copy and paste? I don't want this to be undefended till I get off work. Gunny if you read this, I'm friends with you on facebook. Jeremy brace is my name, u can respond on there if you like.

[Aratus]

worse... picture some poor bloke's vest wired via C-4 like an episode out of 24
and if you call in military intellegence, things happen in a bad way anyway. why
should we frag our Bill of Rights as we try to detain briefly the nicer of the crazies?
if a mass media propaganda posterboy like he is in auld virginny, we must ask shelf
life questions, were he to be on a "one way ticket" aspected task for the terrorists!!!

[Aratus]

last nite we had a "24" episode where a guy wired into a vest set himself off in a holding cell...

[Aratus]

S. 8031 is deceptively simplistic. it does not solve or resolve worse case scenarios.

[GunnyFreedom]

I posted this on my facebook and A friend responded with this:

Caleb Oldziewski If Adam Gadahn were captured in Virginia, for example, trying to carry out an attack on a Catholic School... Would you want him arrested and given Miranda rights or in the custody of military intelligence?

Im at work and on my iphone and don't have time to respond. Any care to give me something to copy and paste? I don't want this to be undefended till I get off work. Gunny if you read this, I'm friends with you on facebook. Jeremy brace is my name, u can respond on there if you like.

Sorry, I saw this a half hour after you posted it. I just got finished posting my response to his wallpost.

[The Patriot]

I just wrote my senators. I think Senator Boxer might vote with us on this. Not sure about Feinstein.

[Fozz]

I just wrote my senators. I think Senator Boxer might vote with us on this. Not sure about Feinstein.

Feinstein will support this horror of a law. I can tell.

I will never forget her despicable arrogance at the time of the Wall Street bailouts. I could easily sense from there that she cares nothing about liberty or the Constitution.

[The Patriot]

I posted this on my facebook and A friend responded with this:

Caleb Oldziewski If Adam Gadahn were captured in Virginia, for example, trying to carry out an attack on a Catholic School... Would you want him arrested and given Miranda rights or in the custody of military intelligence?

Im at work and on my iphone and don't have time to respond. Any care to give me something to copy and paste? I don't want this to be undefended till I get off work. Gunny if you read this, I'm friends with you on facebook. Jeremy brace is my name, u can respond on there if you like.

I would want him arrested and given miranda rights. If he is guilty of conspiring to kill citizens, he will be tried and convicted. And this isn't all the bill is about. It violates the 5th and 7th Amendments and gives the Executive unconstitutional powers to deem people guilty and hold them indefinitely.

[rancher89]

self serving bump

[GunnyFreedom]

self serving bump

and if we are serious about launching this story:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=235084

[Bergie Bergeron]

bump

[fj45lvr]

Lieberman must be taking tips from Likud and Israel where they can nab people off the street and they just disappear for 2 years without their family even knowing where they are.

[Kylie]

bump


Been cross-posting to other sites. Don't have a digg account though.

[DapperDan]

"If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy." -James Madison

[Bergie Bergeron]

bump


Been cross-posting to other sites. Don't have a digg account though.
You can login with a Facebook account, take a a few seconds.

[Bergie Bergeron]

Looks like someone here is a Global Moderator on HF Boards :)

[Bergie Bergeron]

//

[devil21]

Any links to good blog posts on this yet???

[anaconda]

I just contacted all ten of these Senators' offices to express my disgust. Lieberman's voicemail was full. His fax is (202) 224-9750.

[GunnyFreedom]

Seems like only a minority even of Paulers are upset about this. 8-/

[anaconda]

Seems like only a minority even of Paulers are upset about this. 8-/


See post directly above yours....:D

[rancher89]

Anybody hear anything new?

[GunnyFreedom]

Anybody hear anything new?

Yeah, RPF's is behind the conniption-fit curve on this one:

http://www.naplesnews.com/blogs/observation_post/2010/mar/09/mccainbillentry/ (http://www.naplesnews.com/blogs/observation_post/2010/mar/09/mccainbillentry/)


THE SLOUCHING BEAST
The Observation Post
naplesnews.com

* By Vicki Crawford
* Posted March 9, 2010 at 12:55 p.m.

And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?
-- W.B. Yeats

Possibly the child of Joe Stack's attack on the IRS building in Austin, Texas, at 12:06 p.m. on 04 March 2010 the "Enemy Belligerent Interrogation, Detention, and Prosecution Act of 2010" (S.3081) came into being. The proud father who introduced this bill into the Senate is John McCain of Arizona.* The baby was still wet behind the ears when a few hours later (6:40 p.m.) shooter John Bedell opened fire at the Pentagon.

Just as the Patriot Act presented infringements on civil rights S.3081 gives an equally painful punch to the writ of habeas corpus.

On page 2 we have:http://www.salem-news.com/articles/march092010/no-america-tk.php (http://www.salem-news.com/articles/march092010/no-america-tk.php)


No Longer America
What First Amendment?
Tim King Salem-News.com
Mar-09-2010 20:55

The "Enemy Belligerent, Interrogation, Detention, and Prosecution Act of 2010" is a reincarnation of the failed, freedom stripping political acts of the Bush era.

(SALEM, Ore.) - Two of the most jaded, misdirected and agenda driven politicians in America, Joe Lieberman and John McCain, have introduced a bill to further the non-humanitarian arrest, detention and prosecution of individuals suspected to be 'enemy belligerents' who are believed to have engaged in hostile activity toward the United States.

But what exactly is hostile activity?

One stated target in the act is a person who, "has purposely and materially supported hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners."

Maybe McCain forgets that North Vietnam pulled this trick on humanity. U.S. pilots and ground forces captured during that war were considered 'war criminals' and in the view of the Communists, they did not deserve to be viewed as Prisoners of War, who under the Geneva Convention, are to be afforded numerous rights. North Vietnam was a signatory of the Third Geneva Convention of 1949.

Instead of just violating the rule for POW's, they classified them as something else. Our term for that today is "enemy belligerent". Of course don't forget "terrorist". One unique aspect of the McLieberman burger is that the likely arrest candidates will be Arab or American. The daily terrorism of Israel toward Palestine is apparently still A-OK.

An endless list of informational links and other data is sent to me all day every day. Some of the information we publish compromises the weak and illegal members of the U.S. government; like the story of Marine Col. Jim Sabow whose murder in 1991 was and still is passed off as a suicide. His fatal error? Discovering that illegal drugs were being funneled through his base, and threatening to bring down the house over it.

Right now, at this moment, the federal government is trying to figure out what to do about things like this getting out on the Internet. They know we are connected with major sources of information. Will we be a target of the McCain/Lieberman "Enemy Belligerent, Interrogation, Detention, and Prosecution Act of 2010"?

Could this new legislation by the Israeli Senator and the one who made movies for the North Vietnamese really be a sign of the worst possible kind?

I believe the answer is yes. Americans are guaranteed certain rights under the Constitution, but not under the "new program" by McCain and Lieberman.http://beforeitsnews.com/news/23730/Torture_to_be_Visited_Upon_Americans_by_Americans. html (http://beforeitsnews.com/news/23730/Torture_to_be_Visited_Upon_Americans_by_Americans. html)


Torture to be Visited Upon Americans by Americans
Contributed by Anonymous (Editor)
Wed Mar 10 12:11
Before It's News

Since the days of 9/11, I have had many heated debates, on the subject of torture. Anyone, my age, or older, should have learned the lessons from Vietnam, and Korea, on torture.

During Korea, there were many horrific things done to American POWs, such as, freezing their feet, in buckets of water. More than 1,200 American POWs, confirmed by the Red Cross, held in Communist China, were never returned. Those that came home; forgotten.

The stories of the treatment, by the North Vietnamese, of American POWs is well documented. The survivors, still living, suffer from their abuse today, many years later.

All of the captives, held at the Hanoi Hilton, broke from their torture, made confessions of war crimes, and made propaganda movies, for the North Vietnamese. The reason they broke isn’t because they were weak, or cowardly. The purpose of torture isn’t to get information from people, but to punish, and to make the victim say whatever is required of him, by the torturers.

And now, a survivor, of the Hanoi Hilton, is doing the unthinkable. Senator John McCain, and Joe Lieberman, are introducing legislation to torture American, on American soil, or anywhere, of government choosing.

The New York Post is reporting, in this article;
McCain, Lieberman to introduce bill to ban civilian trials for enemy combatants (A misleading title)

[Paulitical Correctness]

I just contacted all ten of these Senators' offices to express my disgust. Lieberman's voicemail was full. His fax is (202) 224-9750.

:D

[Anti Federalist]

Yeah, RPF's is behind the conniption-fit curve on this one

Gunny, I am long, long, long past conniption fit phase.

Watching it all play out like a bad dream has me conniptioned out.

[Reason]

//

[Reason]

the tracking on opencongress is good lol...

0%

Users Support Bill
0 in favor / 44 opposed

[rancher89]

Sean Hannity forums

http://forums.hannity.com/showthread.php?p=69842701#post69842701

[pcosmar]

Gunny, I am long, long, long past conniption fit phase.

Watching it all play out like a bad dream has me conniptioned out.

Full agreement.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_FOFW191IvNA/StqM0b6SOJI/AAAAAAAABx8/EoV7c4Q8Lnc/s640/Sign+ANGER.jpg

[Bergie Bergeron]

//

[Anti Federalist]

Full agreement.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_FOFW191IvNA/StqM0b6SOJI/AAAAAAAABx8/EoV7c4Q8Lnc/s640/Sign+ANGER.jpg

The meter shows all

http://www.mattresspolice.com/images/rage_scale.jpg

[A. Havnes]

What the heck?

[Reason]

//

[Reason]

http://www.campaignforliberty.com/article.php?view=698 (http://www.campaignforliberty.com/article.php?view=698)

[Erazmus]

I'm glad everyone is jumping on this Bill. It really makes the PATRIOT Act look tame.

I always knew McCain was bad, but sheesh, I didn't think he was at the 1939 Germany level.

[Erazmus]

Hey Reason, you should have your banner link to the text of the bill.

[The Patriot]

I'm glad everyone is jumping on this Bill. It really makes the PATRIOT Act look tame.

I always knew McCain was bad, but sheesh, I didn't think he was at the 1939 Germany level.

I emailed Dianne Feinstein and Barbara Boxer on this bill and didn't even get the usual automated response. They really must want to keep this bill under wraps and pass it under the cover of night.

[Reason]

Hey Reason, you should have your banner link to the text of the bill.

Good idea! :)

[Reason]

The Most Tyrannical Legislation in Modern U.S. History?

http://ih.constantcontact.com/fs073/1102236309048/img/334.jpgOn March 4 Senators John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Joseph Lieberman (I-Conn.) introduced one of the most tyrannical bills in modern American history: "The Enemy Belligerent Interrogation, Detention and Prosecution Act of 2010."

"It's probably the single most extremist, tyrannical and dangerous bill introduced in the Senate in the last several decades, far beyond the horrific, habeas-abolishing Military Commissions Act," says (http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1103227020399&s=85131&e=001Xm0mFNkOarGM2l7OAf66zhKo-xJ56trd-ks-6IRJKRA5dGAjMz8vPpf4Y8GweCG6ORfZZcoxuw5GI9QdrHxUAK 9ZjM_kPrOGeoL3jadEOGX3DNlSva-Ybm4VWLwTcuhT_THkfdx9XH2g3PEZShidDAfulk12gGJQmFDnq OkDrEZsG059jVAyOw3FWyhP_Nn6Naqa6UvGdbAeeTuTdX4FKQ= =) former constitutional lawyer and bestselling author Glenn Greenwald.

"It literally empowers the President to imprison anyone he wants in his sole discretion by simply decreeing them a terrorist suspect -- including American citizens arrested on U.S. soil.

"The bill requires that all such individuals be placed in military custody, and explicitly says that they 'may be detained without criminal charges and without trial for the duration of hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners,' which everyone expects to last decades, at least," Greenwald says.

Similarly Marc Ambinder, politics editor of The Atlantic magazine and chief political consultant to CBS News, notes (http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1103227020399&s=85131&e=001Xm0mFNkOarFY2XETusR4TxaPxCZnU7aq8Xfv-4BF9587GYVMgcIUWcNsenXbtG6tYvTC1nPpiquPYU7Cl1Gop2a PQYyiCelD0BOBBYnlISIGibZ4dJh4LxBkEFeNvPqr5NuNUfGdj r3BXiZPdePYImUyO4R7iM0icg1GXoy6BvTcQPFIxgiyPGrhKaI rmDaJ_DyptPS7H0Y7wPY9mBf1_ClnEOcGEMnvxSahQQsBNxmDJ XWXvz6PSg==) that: "A close reading of the bill suggests it would allow the U.S. military to detain U.S. citizens without trial indefinitely in the U.S. based on suspected activity,"

Forget due process, the right to a trial, habeas corpus, and other Bill of Rights niceties. This is legalized lynching, legislated disappearing.

The language of the bill (http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1103227020399&s=85131&e=001Xm0mFNkOarEbtMPptJA6m74_IsrcRWRSoVBhogcOOt6aU 7OlI6PNaw3NjdZ4YFGK_lld08zum4ZRpXRufeznKXyWg0g2uoJ 4kIDDWm2b--UvevuSBr07MaZQ6pT25gj07v4ZObWp5IP5roLNbNdRVLwkhWpt 1zYl) is murky in parts (which is not a good thing). Dan Scott of the left-wing Bay Area Indymedia warns (http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1103227020399&s=85131&e=001Xm0mFNkOarFgMPgVJZipziPOpftLK48nUQv0-Cr1d_lD3hgT_TZLpQkQveQGpvSLtD5_aqTe6-KejV48CVSDPk8Lilb0vFymcLTVPN_hMf9vjftU_T-xqUwAdRZi9Zhg1tyev6BV68Czjg2_3N25uWWhF4oHp1C8FquSc 3Fs6Xc=) that the bill "is so broadly written, it appears any 'individual' who writes on the Internet or verbally express an opinion against an entity of [the] U.S. Government or its coalition partners might be detained on the basis he or she is an 'unprivileged enemy belligerent', 'supporting hostilities against [the] U.S. Government.'"

Is Scott's assessment farfetched? Maybe. Or maybe not. Do we want to find out?

Laura W. Murphy, Director of the ACLU Washington Legislative Office, describes (http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1103227020399&s=85131&e=001Xm0mFNkOarG4lQ_uHMF6dmGtP2AWf2oETQ7yrt8Ei_bX5 nZVaI-5UhrLkhGNzbE_pn5B6hU62-jUfVeJAkFkT9VRt6zKjfx6Pe0JqfIIQ4uO74jzTDox2QzlSE6A s-xGKlO5ma05SqBibdPhpHLhGpsByQYdPA0VUdGL9M7LZRh5bBfN A84DToyt6TG9XaNVSCRG4BKAnxuV6Ba6aSlpyGCXezxEtow1Lh 9JnPp9wQU=) the bill as "a direct attack on the Constitution."

She's right. This bill gives the president and federal government the powers of a military dictatorship, and erases any constitutional protection citizens have to protect themselves against such power.

Thus far eight Senators -- including recently-elected Tea Party darling Scott Brown (R-Massachusetts) -- have joined McCain and Liebermann as proud cosponsors (http://r20.rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1103227020399&s=85131&e=001Xm0mFNkOarH21GrdYHXfSVgxEnCxPSUUm30mGjNjVaLbM yYgJOffimGvnxaYKF71_AE2mG6U07-4Q2uswnZnRUI0i9R0bgYpAHKBWpiNM3X3q4zG8PqvoLzdKqlSj-A4t0Hsi43sY8k8eHWmkYMAQzYOIku2vSZX-am3ZqWiQdQF33SOqC1yBA==) of this monstrosity.

The fact that U.S. Senators would even dream of introducing and supporting something like this speaks volumes about American politics today. Could it become law? The Patriot Act did. The Military Commission Act did.

Perhaps one day you will be considered an "unprivileged enemy belligerent" and secretly grabbed and whisked away to some high-tech federal dungeon for making inflammatory statements like this one:

"No person shall be ... deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law ... In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense."

That, of course, is from the Fifth and Sixth Amendments to the U.S. Constitution.

And it's something that a shocking number of U.S. lawmakers no longer believe in.

---------------------------------------------

[Aratus]

ADMiN --- PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE MAKE THIS THREAD "STICKY" A.S.A.P


i'm going offline before folks think i've gone lamentably internet motormouth

[Erazmus]

ADMiN --- PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE MAKE THIS THREAD "STICKY" A.S.A.P

Agreed.

[pacelli]

I emailed Dianne Feinstein and Barbara Boxer on this bill and didn't even get the usual automated response. They really must want to keep this bill under wraps and pass it under the cover of night.

Still no word from Burr (NC). I called and left a message.

[pacelli]

Called Senator Burr just now. Office closed, left a polite but firm statement asking him to please oppose the bill.

[MN Patriot]

Read the bill here:
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3081/text

Looks like a valuable website to track and discuss proposed legislation.

[tremendoustie]

No more rhetoric about enemy combatants, now it's down to enemy belligerents.

We are so royally screwed.

I have blasted to all my email lists. How did this not get picked up until today? He introduced this on Thursday????

This is a scary scary bill.

Belligerence doesn't even imply violence, it just implies non-cooperation. If they don't like you, they can kidnap you and interrogate torture you.