For those who think Malcolm X was racist.....

[BamaFanNKy]

you will hear in the Bullet or Ballot Box why he was assassinated. This speech is pretty principled.

I love the part where he says at 4:56, "the time when white people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone." No wonder they demonize him on the left.

YouTube - Malcolm X - Ballot or Bullet (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRNciryImqg)

[BamaFanNKy]

Great article.
http://www.startribune.com/yourvoices/85477167.html?elr=KArksi8cyaiUjc8LDyiUiD3aPc:_Yyc: aUU

[silus]

Just to be factual, he was indeed a racist at one point.

[BamaFanNKy]

I was a child once. I am no more. I love this speech. I am listening again and he kills the democrats!

[revolutionisnow]

you will hear in the Bullet or Ballot Box why he was assassinated. This speech is pretty principled.

I love the part where he says at 4:56, "the time when white people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone." No wonder they demonize him on the left.


Sounds pretty racist to me. Imagine the outrage there would be if someone said "the time when black people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone."

[silus]

BTW, good speech.

[youngbuck]

He was really racist, and then slowly came to his senses in his latter years.

[coyote_sprit]

Sounds pretty racist to me. Imagine the outrage there would be if someone said "the time when black people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone."
That used to happen, it's not racist to state fact.

[silus]

Sounds pretty racist to me. Imagine the outrage there would be if someone said "the time when black people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone."
The problem with words like "racist" is that it encourages people to stop thinking. As if throwing out the word negates any need for further examination. As if something can be understood the same way regardless of context. Thats why you will see many people like this defend their argument with a pathetic 'double standard' argument. Another word that people can't seem to think past.

[johngr]

I'm more interest in whether he had cooties....

Seriously, this thread is in defense against an inquistion. A better respond to the Trotskyist smear term is to laugh in the face of anyone who dares use it.

BTW as my analysis of the PC trumps shows


PC Trumps

Race
Jewish (no other trump comes into play, unless it's a "self-hating Jew") > black/hispanic > oriental > white

Religion
Jewish (no other trump comes into play) > Hindu/Buddhist = Muslim (only if living in the West) > Christian > Muslim (in their own homelands (except for Bosnian Muslims, who are just below Jewish))

Sex Gender
women > men (but keep in mind that race, religion, sexual orientation and politics can come into play here -- if a black rapes a white woman, no big deal but if (in a man-bites-dog scenario in the real world) a white rapes a black, it's a hate crime of the worst kind. Similarly, when a white christian woman tells a "******" to keep away from her son)

Sexual Preference Orientation
Homosexual/Trangender/Bi-sexual > Heterosexual (keep in mind again that other trumps may come into play for instance, when West Hollywood *****s called straight blacks who voted overwhelmingly against gay marraige, "*******" -- hard one to call. Also, the gender card between a gay and a lesbian loses almost all its value)

Politics
Liberal (communist) > Conservative (except when the liberal is anti-zionist or against any ME war or "war on terror") > Libertarian


Also, the general prevalence of the cards themselves (keep in mind, this is my estimation and quite variable, depending on the situation)

Race > Sexual Orientation = Religion (except for Jewish, which trumps Sexual Orientation) > Gender

Politics is one that has variable trump value, depending on the circumstances but never trumps Jewish race or religion (except for "self-hating Jews").

the only reason such a PC word is employed against him is that he ignored PC trump card precedence:

YouTube - Malcolm X Exposes White Liberal Jews (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp1yfWT9d6M)

[johngr]

The PC trump game is quite complex, as these examples illustrate:

The general rules of the PC trump game are very simple. Race > sexual orientation > gender. For example, if a white christian mother of five says that the chairman of Act Up is living an evil lifestyle and will be judged by God, she is clearly in the wrong (sexual orientation trumps gender).

But if she says that a philandering heterosexual man is living an evil lifestyle, then politics can come into play. If she's talking about David Duke, then her criticism will be totally valid on its face and not judged according to the usual anti-Christian bias. If she's talking about Bill Clinton, then again, she's in the wrong.

There are even cases where race is no shield for gender/sexual preference. If Jesse Jackson calls the Act Up chairman a "**** on the down low", that is acceptable -- there would be an outcry from the gays but no mea culpa necessary.

But imagine a debate between Alan Keyes and Catherine Mackinnon (the law professor that holds that all heterosexual sex is rape). Keyes slips up and says during a break, within earshot of the microphone, "that dyke biyotch should get her a husband, stay in the kitchen and leave politics to men". First of all, Mackinnon has three trumps (lesbian, feminist, woman) and Keyes attacked all three. But that's not the important thing here. Keyes, because of his Uncle Tom, shill for the rich politics loses nearly all of his race trump value. His political career (insofar as having a podium on the national stage) would be over.

But let's say Keyes is debating another lesbian separatist feminist and makes the same gaffe. But this one the week before spoke an an international conference on racism and lambasted Israel as a "racist apartheid state" and pointedly criticized Israel for their immigration policies toward the Ethiopian Jews (Israel no longer allows Falasha Jews to immigrate and uses coercion to give them long-acting birth control drugs), bringing such policies to wide public knowledge. In addition, she went to Iran and was seen paling around with Armedinejad.

In this case, partly because of his loyalty to Israel/War on Terror, and partly because the remark in the vernacular would play to blacks' biases and somewhat mitigate the outrage in the black community about Israel's immigration policies, Instead of the remark ending his political career, it would actually enhance it.

Muslims/Arabs are a special case when it comes to trumps. If they're "over there" (i. e. in the Middle East), they are lower on the scale than European white people, if you can imagine that. It's even acceptable to express a desire to "bomb those sand monkeys back into the stone age". (Note that the usual PC trump rules apply to Bosnian Muslims regardless of where the live (Muslim > Christian) and Bosnian Muslims can't be terrorists, but rather freedom fighters.) But if they live in the West, the usual race trump rules apply. So if an Imam from Iraq living in Denmark calls for stoning homosexuals it's dismissed as a "cultural difference" and no big deal is made of it. If he says that in Iraq that's not acceptable and such "homophobia" is another example of why "we" need to "fight them over there".

[jkr]

mommy, whats a cracker?

[Uncle Emanuel Watkins]

The PC trump game is quite complex, as these examples illustrate:

The general rules of the PC trump game are very simple. Race > sexual orientation > gender. For example, if a white christian mother of five says that the chairman of Act Up is living an evil lifestyle and will be judged by God, she is clearly in the wrong (sexual orientation trumps gender).

But if she says that a philandering heterosexual man is living an evil lifestyle, then politics can come into play. If she's talking about David Duke, then her criticism will be totally valid on its face and not judged according to the usual anti-Christian bias. If she's talking about Bill Clinton, then again, she's in the wrong.

There are even cases where race is no shield for gender/sexual preference. If Jesse Jackson calls the Act Up chairman a "**** on the down low", that is acceptable -- there would be an outcry from the gays but no mea culpa necessary.

But imagine a debate between Alan Keyes and Catherine Mackinnon (the law professor that holds that all heterosexual sex is rape). Keyes slips up and says during a break, within earshot of the microphone, "that dyke biyotch should get her a husband, stay in the kitchen and leave politics to men". First of all, Mackinnon has three trumps (lesbian, feminist, woman) and Keyes attacked all three. But that's not the important thing here. Keyes, because of his Uncle Tom, shill for the rich politics loses nearly all of his race trump value. His political career (insofar as having a podium on the national stage) would be over.

But let's say Keyes is debating another lesbian separatist feminist and makes the same gaffe. But this one the week before spoke an an international conference on racism and lambasted Israel as a "racist apartheid state" and pointedly criticized Israel for their immigration policies toward the Ethiopian Jews (Israel no longer allows Falasha Jews to immigrate and uses coercion to give them long-acting birth control drugs), bringing such policies to wide public knowledge. In addition, she went to Iran and was seen paling around with Armedinejad.

In this case, partly because of his loyalty to Israel/War on Terror, and partly because the remark in the vernacular would play to blacks' biases and somewhat mitigate the outrage in the black community about Israel's immigration policies, Instead of the remark ending his political career, it would actually enhance it.

Muslims/Arabs are a special case when it comes to trumps. If they're "over there" (i. e. in the Middle East), they are lower on the scale than European white people, if you can imagine that. It's even acceptable to express a desire to "bomb those sand monkeys back into the stone age". (Note that the usual PC trump rules apply to Bosnian Muslims regardless of where the live (Muslim > Christian) and Bosnian Muslims can't be terrorists, but rather freedom fighters.) But if they live in the West, the usual race trump rules apply. So if an Imam from Iraq living in Denmark calls for stoning homosexuals it's dismissed as a "cultural difference" and no big deal is made of it. If he says that in Iraq that's not acceptable and such "homophobia" is another example of why "we" need to "fight them over there".

As Europeans talk about politics when fishing, Americans should talk about fishing when politicking. Why does it have to be this complicated? Don't you realize that, because Americans have already arrived at the Truth, we don't need any further manipulation? Just leave us alone. Let's close down all we can in Washington, close down all we can at the state level, and then close down all we can at the city level returning our local governments back to when they did a great job of picking up the garbage.

[dannno]

Just to be factual, he was indeed a racist at one point.

Can you provide said facts with context?

[Goldhunter27]

Listening to leaders like Nasser, Ben Bella, and Nkrumah awakened me to the dangers of racism. I realized racism isn't just a black and white problem. It's brought bloodbaths to about every nation on earth at one time or another.
Brother, remember the time that white college girl came into the restaurant—the one who wanted to help the [Black] Muslims and the whites get together—and I told her there wasn't a ghost of a chance and she went away crying? Well, I've lived to regret that incident. In many parts of the African continent I saw white students helping black people. Something like this kills a lot of argument. I did many things as a [Black] Muslim that I'm sorry for now. I was a zombie then—like all [Black] Muslims—I was hypnotized, pointed in a certain direction and told to march. Well, I guess a man's entitled to make a fool of himself if he's ready to pay the cost. It cost me 12 years.
That was a bad scene, brother. The sickness and madness of those days—I'm glad to be free of them.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malcolm_X#In_the_United_States

[revolutionisnow]

Can you provide said facts with context?



"Born Malcolm Little in 1925, Malcolm X’s career involved being arrested in New York for drug dealing, gambling, racketeering, robbery, and pimping prostitutes in the 1940s.

When he was examined in 1943 for the draft, military physicians classified him as “mentally disqualified for military service.”

He later recalled that he put on a display to avoid the draft by telling the examining officer that he could not wait to “steal us some guns, and kill us [some] crackers.” (Crackers is derogatory black slang for white people.)

In late 1945, Little’s criminal career resumed when he and a group of associates began a series of burglaries which deliberately targeted the residences of wealthy white families in Boston.

On January 12, 1946, Little was arrested for burglary while trying to pick up a stolen watch he had left for repairs at a jewellery shop. He was sentenced to eight to ten years in Massachusetts State Prison.

While in jail, Little converted to Islam and upon his release, joined the Nation of Islam organisation and changed his surname to “X”.

In his autobiography, Malcolm X explained the “X”: “The Muslim’s ‘X’ symbolized the true African family name that he never could know. For me, my ‘X’ replaced the white slavemaster name of ‘Little’ which some blue-eyed devil named Little had imposed upon my paternal forebears.”

The FBI opened a file on Malcolm X in March 1953 after hearing from an informant that Malcolm X described himself as a Communist. Soon the FBI turned its attention from concerns about possible Communist Party association to Malcolm X’s rapid ascent in the Nation of Islam.

Malcolm X proudly promoted the Nation of Islam’s teachings. He taught that black people were the original people of the world, and that white people were a race of devils. In his speeches, Malcolm X said that black people were superior to white people, and that the demise of the white race was imminent.

Malcolm X also rejected the civil rights movement’s strategy of nonviolence and instead advocated that black people use “any necessary means.”"

[AuH20]

This whole Malcolm X gotcha racism card is childish. By the same token, if we want to play this petty card, we can play it with Thomas Jefferson, George Washington and Abraham Lincoln. What's most remarkable when I analyze Malcolm X's life is that he started off as petty criminal, gradually made something of himself, while constantly evolving in his quest for knowledge. I can totally understand why he learned to loathe the white power structure and mistakenly held white individuals accountable for the sins of the oligarchy. But in the end, he finally realized he was mistaken. This evolution can also be applied to Washington who discarded some of his more callous views of slaves in his later life. I certainly don't hate George Washington and I certainly don't hate Malcolm X. It's a complicated world and I'm glad to see that both these legendary men arrived at the right conclusions at the ends of their lives.

[BamaFanNKy]

"Born Malcolm Little in 1925, Malcolm X’s career involved being arrested in New York for drug dealing, gambling, racketeering, robbery, and pimping prostitutes in the 1940s.

When he was examined in 1943 for the draft, military physicians classified him as “mentally disqualified for military service.”

He later recalled that he put on a display to avoid the draft by telling the examining officer that he could not wait to “steal us some guns, and kill us [some] crackers.” (Crackers is derogatory black slang for white people.)

In late 1945, Little’s criminal career resumed when he and a group of associates began a series of burglaries which deliberately targeted the residences of wealthy white families in Boston.

On January 12, 1946, Little was arrested for burglary while trying to pick up a stolen watch he had left for repairs at a jewellery shop. He was sentenced to eight to ten years in Massachusetts State Prison.

While in jail, Little converted to Islam and upon his release, joined the Nation of Islam organisation and changed his surname to “X”.

In his autobiography, Malcolm X explained the “X”: “The Muslim’s ‘X’ symbolized the true African family name that he never could know. For me, my ‘X’ replaced the white slavemaster name of ‘Little’ which some blue-eyed devil named Little had imposed upon my paternal forebears.”

The FBI opened a file on Malcolm X in March 1953 after hearing from an informant that Malcolm X described himself as a Communist. Soon the FBI turned its attention from concerns about possible Communist Party association to Malcolm X’s rapid ascent in the Nation of Islam.

Malcolm X proudly promoted the Nation of Islam’s teachings. He taught that black people were the original people of the world, and that white people were a race of devils. In his speeches, Malcolm X said that black people were superior to white people, and that the demise of the white race was imminent.

Malcolm X also rejected the civil rights movement’s strategy of nonviolence and instead advocated that black people use “any necessary means.”"

Thanks for the cut and paste from "Blackout Europe." The British Isolationist group who has a problem with the EU and has no clue about the history of Malcolm X.

[low preference guy]

why is this in general politics? it should probably go to philosophy or something else. i don't recall malcolm x being an issue in any campaign.

[AuH20]

YouTube - Malcolm X - A Person's Deeds (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsuaFmN2O98)

[revolutionisnow]

Thanks for the cut and paste from "Blackout Europe." The British Isolationist group who has a problem with the EU and has no clue about the history of Malcolm X.

Actually it was from wikileaks, if you would like to refute points or debunk quotes feel free to attempt to do so.

[BamaFanNKy]

Actually it was from wikileaks, if you would like to refute points or debunk quotes feel free to attempt to do so.

Well, that's where they got it from. It's from their site.

Also, if you listen above.... that was in Malcolm's last year. I know it's easier to put people in boxes. It's like calling Ron Paul an Isolationist. It makes it easier than to understand their point.

[revolutionisnow]

It's nothing like that, one is correct and one is not. Sorry, I'm not interested in having my tax dollars fund education glorifying someone who referred to whites as blue eyed devils and crackers for their entire life, nor having my or my peer's childrens minds polluted with such garbage. Should we also educate them about Tookie Williams? Sure he founded the crips and murdered a few people, but later in life he saw the light and preached anti-gang and anti-violence. What a swell guy.

As far as people being justified for outright hatred and using derogatory slurs every other word if they are oppressed, let's talk about some current oppressions and ask if they would be justified. How about in South Africa where white farmers are being slaughtered and their property and businesses stolen. Does that justify them to declare that every black person is the things Malcolm X referred to whites as? Or how about if a Palestinian was ranting about how every Israeli is guilty of all the things Malcolm accuses whites of? If someone wants to discuss race relations that is fine, but lets keep the discussion based in facts and reality vs wild accusations and derogatory slurs.

[BamaFanNKy]

It's nothing like that, one is correct and one is not. Sorry, I'm not interested in having my tax dollars fund education glorifying someone who referred to whites as blue eyed devils and crackers for their entire life, nor having my or my peer's childrens minds polluted with such garbage. Should we also educate them about Tookie Williams? Sure he founded the crips and murdered a few people, but later in life he saw the light and preached anti-gang and anti-violence. What a swell guy.

As far as people being justified for outright hatred and using derogatory slurs every other word if they are oppressed, let's talk about some current oppressions and ask if they would be justified. How about in South Africa where white farmers are being slaughtered and their property and businesses stolen. Does that justify them to declare that every black person is the things Malcolm X referred to whites as? Or how about if a Palestinian was ranting about how every Israeli is guilty of all the things Malcolm accuses whites of? If someone wants to discuss race relations that is fine, but lets keep the discussion based in facts and reality vs wild accusations and derogatory slurs.
Difference in Tookie and Malcolm. Tookie was killed on a timetable while Malcolm was assassinated by the people he once aligned with. I know it's easy to develop opinions based on Wikipedia and other cliff notes version of history but, if you listen to the man's words he was talking about the governmental power known as "The White Devil." Good job.

So, in your logic we need to not teach about the Third Reich either? They actually were violent with their racism where Malcolm never committed one violent action.

[michaelwise]

I don't see any criminal police reports of racism in the country.

[BuddyRey]

What I want to know is, who killed Brother Malcolm, and why did they do it just as he was beginning to embrace all of mankind, preach inclusiveness, and realize that government, not the white race in general, was the real enemy?

Hmmm....

[revolutionisnow]

Difference in Tookie and Malcolm. Tookie was killed on a timetable while Malcolm was assassinated by the people he once aligned with. I know it's easy to develop opinions based on Wikipedia and other cliff notes version of history but, if you listen to the man's words he was talking about the governmental power known as "The White Devil." Good job.

So, in your logic we need to not teach about the Third Reich either? They actually were violent with their racism where Malcolm never committed one violent action.

Actually I can find quotes showing how Hitler wasn't really that racist either, and then if you disagree accuse you of only researching wikipedia. Then we could also talk about how this didn't happen in a vacuum and the Germans were being oppressed.


"In saying this, I promise you I am quite free of all racial hatred: It is, in any case, undesirable that one race should mix with other races. Except for a few gratuitous successes, which I am prepared to admit, systematic cross-breeding has never produced good results. Its desire to remain racially pure is a proof of the vitality and good health of a race. Pride in one's own race - and that does not imply contempt for other races - is also a normal and healthy sentiment. I have never regarded the Chinese or the Japanese as being inferior to ourselves. They belong to ancient civilizations, and I admit freely that their past history is superior to our own. They have the right to be proud of their past, just as we have the right to be proud of the civilization to which we belong. Indeed, I believe the more steadfast the Chinese and the Japanese remain in their pride of race, the easier I shall find it to get on with them." - Adolf Hitler; The Political Testament of Adolf Hitler

[jmdrake]

Should we also educate them about Tookie Williams? Sure he founded the crips and murdered a few people, but later in life he saw the light and preached anti-gang and anti-violence. What a swell guy.


Should Christians still teach their children about the thief on the cross? Sure he stole and probably killed people and was getting the punishment he deserved, but he recognized who Jesus was at the end.

Or if you don't believe the Bible, how about Oscar Schindler? Sure he started the whole "list" thing just to make money, but in the end he was really trying to save lives.

If you were working at a school plagued by gang violence would you not use the protocol Tookie developed which has shown success in abating gang violence just because you didn't like the person who developed it? Would you use it and just not give him any credit?

By the way, it's a bit hypocritical for you to complain about Malcolm X considering all of the support you've shown for David Duke.

[revolutionisnow]

Should Christians still teach their children about the thief on the cross? Sure he stole and probably killed people and was getting the punishment he deserved, but he recognized who Jesus was at the end.

Or if you don't believe the Bible, how about Oscar Schindler? Sure he started the whole "list" thing just to make money, but in the end he was really trying to save lives.

If you were working at a school plagued by gang violence would you not use the protocol Tookie developed which has shown success in abating gang violence just because you didn't like the person who developed it? Would you use it and just not give him any credit?

By the way, it's a bit hypocritical for you to complain about Malcolm X considering all of the support you've shown for David Duke.

Sure you can teach your children that, public schools shouldn't though.

Personally not a fan of Schindler's propaganda or holocaust education. Jewish suffering is not unique and it is used as as way to justify their actions in the Middle East. The whole idea that Hitler disliked them because of their different religion is nonsense also, right up there with the terrorists who "hate us for our freedoms".

Haven't really studied his books or any others regarding gang violence so can't comment.

That's the thing, people whine, moan and yell hot topics whenever DD is quoted or shown presenting factual content, and I have yet to see a quote from him being even a tenth as racist as Malcolm X. Outright hatred from minorities for whites gets a free pass, meanwhile any and every person who sticks up for white rights is demonized. Every other group is allowed to organize but whites can not. Quite the double standard.

If we are looking for more black leaders to educate the youth about, why not Marcus Garvey?

YouTube - Marcus Garvey speech 1/1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDtc7uIygIY&)

[BamaFanNKy]

Actually I can find quotes showing how Hitler wasn't really that racist either, and then if you disagree accuse you of only researching wikipedia. Then we could also talk about how this didn't happen in a vacuum and the Germans were being oppressed.


"In saying this, I promise you I am quite free of all racial hatred: It is, in any case, undesirable that one race should mix with other races. Except for a few gratuitous successes, which I am prepared to admit, systematic cross-breeding has never produced good results. Its desire to remain racially pure is a proof of the vitality and good health of a race. Pride in one's own race - and that does not imply contempt for other races - is also a normal and healthy sentiment. I have never regarded the Chinese or the Japanese as being inferior to ourselves. They belong to ancient civilizations, and I admit freely that their past history is superior to our own. They have the right to be proud of their past, just as we have the right to be proud of the civilization to which we belong. Indeed, I believe the more steadfast the Chinese and the Japanese remain in their pride of race, the easier I shall find it to get on with them." - Adolf Hitler; The Political Testament of Adolf Hitler

Yeah, Hitler never committed violence against a groups or set up genocide of a people. Now you try to compare Malcolm who told his people to get off government assistance, start their own businesses, be peaceful but if a man lays hands on you respond in kind..... really, you are clueless and the Hitler argument proves it.

[jmdrake]

Sure you can teach your children that, public schools shouldn't though.

Personally not a fan of Schindler's propaganda or holocaust education. Jewish suffering is not unique and it is used as as way to justify their actions in the Middle East. The whole idea that Hitler disliked them because of their different religion is nonsense also, right up there with the terrorists who "hate us for our freedoms".

Haven't really studied his books or any others regarding gang violence so can't comment.

That's the thing, people whine, moan and yell hot topics whenever DD is quoted or shown presenting factual content, and I have yet to see a quote from him being even a tenth as racist as Malcolm X. Outright hatred from minorities for whites gets a free pass, meanwhile any and every person who sticks up for white rights is demonized. Every other group is allowed to organize but whites can not. Quite the double standard.

If we are looking for more black leaders to educate the youth about, why not Marcus Garvey?

YouTube - Marcus Garvey speech 1/1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDtc7uIygIY&)

Marcus Garvey? You think Malcom X is racist but you like Marcus Garvey? You realize Garvey tried to form an alliance with the KKK right? (Maybe that's why you like him). Anyway Garvey was in my U.S. history book (they left out the KKK thing. I found that out later on my own.) and I'm glad for it. I don't think there needs to be some perfection litmus test for who children learn about.

[JustinTime]

I love the part where he says at 4:56, "the time when white people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone." No wonder they demonize him on the left.

I dont get it... whats so great about that quote? If I said I didnt want black or Hispanic would-be politicians campaigning "my neighborhood", God forbid, being elected to office, Id be called a racist right quick.

I have no problem with Mr. X, or even the Nation of Islam, Im just trying to get some clarification on where youre coming from here.

[JustinTime]

Yeah, Hitler never committed violence against a groups or set up genocide of a people. Now you try to compare Malcolm who told his people to get off government assistance, start their own businesses, be peaceful but if a man lays hands on you respond in kind..... really, you are clueless and the Hitler argument proves it.

Both were racial separatists, "collectivists", something that a lot of people supposedly dislike intensely. I guess its like always, they only dislike it if its being done by whites.

[AuH20]

I dont get it... whats so great about that quote? If I said I didnt want black or Hispanic would-be politicians campaigning "my neighborhood" Id be called a racist right quick.

I have no problem with Mr. X, or even the Nation of Islam, Im just trying to get some clarification on where youre coming from here.


He's essentially saying that once election time comes around, these white liberal vultures come into Harlem and other black locales trawling for votes, and immediately dismiss the concerns of the community afterwards. Basically, the same scenario plays out today. Aside from an increase in home ownership and some minor gains in social mobility, blacks are not that much better off than they were in the 60s. Incarceration rates are through the roof, education levels are poor and the state of their families are generally in disarray. Liberals have permanently planted the vile seeds of victimization in their psyche in such a disastrous manner, that some don't know who they are. It's ironic that X and later Bill Cosby got roundly ridiculed for basically stating , "F the white man, and concentrate on getting our own house in order."

[BamaFanNKy]

I dont get it... whats so great about that quote? If I said I didnt want black or Hispanic would-be politicians campaigning "my neighborhood", God forbid, being elected to office, Id be called a racist right quick.

I have no problem with Mr. X, or even the Nation of Islam, Im just trying to get some clarification on where youre coming from here.

Because like every other black leader he saw through the liberal B.S. where they told black people to cling to the government power. To cling to social welfare. He is calling Liberals just as racist.

[jmdrake]

He's essentially saying that once election time comes around, these white liberal vultures come into Harlem and other black locales trawling for votes, and immediately dismiss the concerns of the community afterwards. Basically, the same scenario plays out today. Aside from an increase in home ownership and some minor gains in social mobility, blacks are not that much better off than they were in the 60s. Incarceration rates are through the roof, education levels are poor and the state of their families are generally in disarray. Liberals have permanently planted the vile seeds of victimization in their psyche in such a disastrous manner, that they don't who they are.

^This

[JustinTime]

He's essentially saying that once election time comes around, these white liberal vultures come into Harlem and other black locales trawling for votes, and immediately dismiss the concerns of the community afterwards. Basically, the same scenario plays out today. Aside from an increase in home ownership and some minor gains in social mobility, blacks are not that much better off than they were in the 60s. Incarceration rates are through the roof, education levels are poor and the state of their families are generally in disarray. Liberals have permanently planted the vile seeds of victimization in their psyche in such a disastrous manner,

Well-meaning but naive (mostly) white liberals handed out the seeds, and the black community themselves planted them.

Yes, government aide breeds a sense of reliance, over time its become modus vivendi, but just because handouts are offered it doesnt mean you have to take them. Want to get your house in order? Just fucking get it in order. Stop bitching about lack of help, then bitching about the help, its the bitching and the blame that is largely black America's problem today, and even here it hasnt gone away.

[BamaFanNKy]

Well-meaning but naive (mostly) white liberals handed out the seeds, and the black community themselves planted them.

Yes, government aide breeds a sense of reliance, over time its become modus vivendi, but just because handouts are offered it doesnt mean you have to take them. Want to get your house in order? Just fucking get it in order. Stop bitching about lack of help, then bitching about the help, its the bitching and the blame that is largely black America's problem today, and even here it hasnt gone away.

Naive is what you should call yourself. Malcolm was talking about getting the house in order and he didn't blame white people he blamed the "House" people for bringing the black person down. It's sad to see how people were not educated on the message that Malcolm talked about.

YouTube - MALCOLM X: THE HOUSE NEGRO AND THE FIELD NEGRO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znQe9nUKzvQ)

[JustinTime]

Naive is what you should call yourself. Malcolm was talking about getting the house in order and he didn't blame white people he blamed the "House" people for bringing the black person down. It's sad to see how people were not educated on the message that Malcolm talked about.

YouTube - MALCOLM X: THE HOUSE NEGRO AND THE FIELD NEGRO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znQe9nUKzvQ)

Oh yeah? Well what was all that "white people" talk in your OP about? Need I remind you of your quote?

"the time when white people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone."

You think its any different from the politicians who ask for my vote then tell me what to do and what not to do? Yeah, they have a similar skin color (well usually they do, the current president is a notable exception), as I have.

What Malcolm X is saying there is he wants black people in control of black destinies. A racial separatist community. Thats 100% a-ok in my book.

[BamaFanNKy]

Oh yeah? Well what was all that "white people" talk in your OP about? Need I remind you of your quote?

"the time when white people can come into our community and get us to vote for them so they can be our political leaders and then tell us what to do and what not to do is long gone."

You think its any different from the politicians who ask for my vote then tell me what to do and what not to do? Yeah, they have a similar skin color (well usually they do, the current president is a notable exception), as I have.

What Malcolm X is saying there is he wants black people in control of black destinies. A racial separatist community. Thats 100% a-ok in my book.

Wait. Your last line sounds like you want to get rid of black people. That explains the rest of your misunderstanding.

[JustinTime]

Wait. Your last line sounds like you want to get rid of black people. That explains the rest of your misunderstanding.

But if I oppose black separatism then Im still a racist?

Hmmmm, what can a white guy do... <taps fingers> what to do, what to do?

How about this... be pro freedom.

If a bunch of religious nuts want to toddle off to a mountain valley and live according to their religious rules, fine by me. If the Gay UFO Abductee Society of America wants to build a compund on the Great Plains, alrighty. If racial separatists want to do the same, I have no problem with them.

Thats all Im saying.