Airplane has crashed into TX IRS Building

[GunnyFreedom]

Per Fox new alerts: Small plane crashes into Texas office building containing IRS field office.

at 220N-US183 near SL 360

damage looks pretty bad.

[Bruno]

2 missing according to the report. Man, that's just horrible. Looks like a lot of damage.

http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/blotter/entries/2010/02/18/report_plane_has_crashed_into.html?srcTrk=RTR_2408 39

CNN has live footage now. they are saying it is next door to the FBI building, that it was not the FBI building that was hit. Hopefully just a horrible accident and not intentional.

[roho76]

It's not the FBI building. It's next to the FBI building. But FOX still keeps saying "small airplane crashes near FBI building" like that matters. They gotta put some controversy in there some where.

[wgadget]

There was also a train derailment in Santa Fe, TX.

[Reason]

YouTube - Dramatic Look (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8Kyi0WNg40)

[roho76]

There was also a train derailment in Santa Fe, TX.

Was it NEAR a CIA building. Or no let me guess it was a school. This is all because Medina is a 9/11 truther. :p:p

[MelissaWV]

Is there some reason you needed THAT MANY YouTubes to make your point?

[UtahApocalypse]

Live Police/Fire Scanner:

http://www.radioreference.com/apps/audio/?feedId=1700

[Reason]

Is there some reason you needed THAT MANY YouTubes to make your point?

YouTube - Dramatic Olbermann vs. Dramatic Chipmunk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNpoJ8W53D8)

[Bruno]

Live Police/Fire Scanner:

http://www.radioreference.com/apps/audio/?feedId=1700

From the site:

Small plane crashes into Texas office building containing FBI field office (10:31 CST)

Lots of conflicting info

[MelissaWV]

From the site:

Small plane crashes into Texas office building containing FBI field office (10:31 CST)

Lots of conflicting info

When I worked for a newspaper, we had our scanner on to listen for things happening in real time. If someone called in "Plane crashed into 123 FBI Building," or "Plane crash... I'm calling from 123 FBI Building" it would explain the conflicting information. Someone might have been observing from a bit of distance and thought it crashed into the other building, or the dispatcher might have mixed up their information. Either way, the visuals should have cleared this up pretty fast.

[dannno]

Has it collapsed at near free-fall speed into it's own footprint yet? I heard that's what happens :rolleyes:

[GunnyFreedom]

My guess is that it's just a terrible accident. Clearly Fox is trying to make the FBI building link to stoke the terror flames and "put butts into seats" so to speak. Time will tell if it's anything different, and I will be approaching anything Fox gives me with a jaundiced eye.

My concern, and the reason I posted it to general Politics, is that this will somehow, through some incredible leap of faulty logic, be used to reignite protectionist fervor ahead of some kind of Patriot2 Act.

[GunnyFreedom]

anyhew, back to slimjims. :D

[Reason]

/yawn

let me know when hamster ninjas come parachuting out of the plane and infiltrate the FBI office and then I MIGHT go find a TV to turn on....

[youngbuck]

Has it collapsed at near free-fall speed into it's own footprint yet? I heard that's what happens :rolleyes:

Yea, unless this happens, I won't believe it was a plane that hit it. Maybe a bomb blew up there or something.

[GunnyFreedom]

/yawn

let me know when hamster ninjas come parachuting out of the plane and infiltrate the FBI office and then I MIGHT go find a TV to turn on....

Sorry for boring you, CR, but I think it's a good idea to keep an eye on anything that could potentially be used to further erode liberty in the US. The more eyes on this up front, the harder it will be later to twist into something that it's not. Feel free to go back to chipmunk pr0n while I continue to fine-tune my campaign literature. :)

[dannno]

Damn, that is some damage:

http://alt.coxnewsweb.com/shared-blogs/austin/blotter/upload/2010/02/report_plane_has_crashed_into/cam.jpg


Are there a lot of expected fatalities?

[Bruno]

When I worked for a newspaper, we had our scanner on to listen for things happening in real time. If someone called in "Plane crashed into 123 FBI Building," or "Plane crash... I'm calling from 123 FBI Building" it would explain the conflicting information. Someone might have been observing from a bit of distance and thought it crashed into the other building, or the dispatcher might have mixed up their information. Either way, the visuals should have cleared this up pretty fast.

Yep. And when they rush to get the story out first , it is easy to get it wrong

[Immortal Technique]

get recording

[RJB]

I think I heard Glenn Beck say that Medina was seen parachuting out of the plane just before it hit the building.

[Bruno]

live video

http://www.whotv.com/videobeta/?watchLive=sns-texas-plane-crash-tivid-live

[GunnyFreedom]

press conference 30 seconds out

http://interactive.foxnews.com/livestream/live.html?chanId=1

[Immortal Technique]

I think I heard Glenn Beck say that Medina was seen parachuting out of the plane just before it hit the building.

i think i heard the same thing

[paulitics]

I think I heard Glenn Beck say that Medina was seen parachuting out of the plane just before it hit the building.

She had a "911 was an inside job" t shirt on too. Robocalls are already being made by the Perry campaign.

[GunnyFreedom]

Press questioners are pushing the fire chief to say it was an intentional attack, fire chief refuses to speculate.

[pcosmar]

Echelon building?

stirring in the corn starch

[Immortal Technique]

The IRS was located within the building, a witness interview said she delivered packages to it everyday

[GunnyFreedom]

The IRS was located within the building, a witness interview said she delivered packages to it everyday

That was my suspicion based on the press conference. Interesting to hear it confirmed.

[CGeoffrion]

Yup, reporting now that the pilot set his own home on fire, then flew his plane into the IRS building....

[rancher89]

great, IRS related = field day for MSM.....

[Immortal Technique]

Yup, reporting now that the pilot set his own home on fire, then flew his plane into the IRS building....

where did you see or hear that?

[Immortal Technique]

where did you see or hear that?
NM i hear FOX is pushing that story

[CGeoffrion]

....I guess the pilot never heard of Ron Paul...

[Krugerrand]

Yup, reporting now that the pilot set his own home on fire, then flew his plane into the IRS building....

I'm betting the house and plane losses aren't deductible.

[idirtify]

where did you see or hear that?

CNN just reported it.

[idirtify]

Wow, this guy did it on purpose! I bet the IRS had tried to seize his house.

[rancher89]

probably end up being a teaparty person...

[Baptist]

I just went to Drudge like I normally do throughout the day. The page loaded and all I saw was the top half of the picture-- a roofline and smoke coming up. I had this nervous feeling in my stomach and was thinking, "this is it! Crap is hitting the fan!" Then I scrolled down, saw headline, read article, and it found out that crap is probably not hitting the fan today.

[GunnyFreedom]

I'm betting the house and plane losses aren't deductible.


Wow, this guy did it on purpose! I bet the IRS had tried to seize his house.

he probably shorted the IRS $ 0.50 on his 2008 return. I hear the IRS hands out the death penalty for that now. Gotta use those fancy new shotguns for something.

[paulitics]

I just went to Drudge like I normally do throughout the day. The page loaded and all I saw was the top half of the picture-- a roofline and smoke coming up. I had this nervous feeling in my stomach and was thinking, "this is it! Crap is hitting the fan!" Then I scrolled down, saw headline, read article, and it found out that crap is probably not hitting the fan today.

Right before 911, there were several incidents like these during the 90s. Lots of lone wolves.

[GunnyFreedom]

probably end up being a teaparty person...

Maybe a Glenn Becker. Who hated Medina just because Beck told him to.

[Dr.3D]

Right before 911, there were several incidents like these during the 90s. Lots of lone wolves.

So does this mean every private pilot will have to have an expensive background investigation in order to keep their license to fly a small plane?

[idirtify]

they just said his name. I think it was "john andrew stack".

edit: JOSEPH Andrew Stack

[itshappening]

Drudge says it's targeting the IRS??

FALSE FLAG TO BOOST PERRY ?

[rancher89]

the dreaded three name application.....

[ctiger2]

http://www.tvchannelsfree.com/watch/5585/Fox-News.html

[theclip]

what they are upto, this time ?

[dealerjim]

Has it collapsed at near free-fall speed into it's own footprint yet? I heard that's what happens :rolleyes:
Been cleaning coffee off my laptop for about 5 minutes now. lol

[rancher89]

small plane, single engine, no flight plan, probably stolen

question from talking head:

"How can we protect ourselves from someone stealing a plane and flying it into a building?"

[yokna7]

they just said his name. I think it was "john andrew stack".

edit: JOSEPH Andrew Stack

Sounds like an Al Qaeda operative:rolleyes: How in the world do you steal a plan?

[rancher89]

one person missing, two to hospital

"people do crazy things..."

[lester1/2jr]

"JOSEPH Andrew Stack"

so much for racial profiling!

""How can we protect ourselves from someone stealing a plane and flying it into a building?""

so much for the TSA!

[rancher89]

there sure is a lot of damage---my goodness!

[angelatc]

he probably shorted the IRS $ 0.50 on his 2008 return.

Yes, he probably shorted the IRS some miniscule amount through an honest mistake, and with fines and penalties now owed them more than his plane and house combined were worth.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

small plane, single engine, no flight plan, probably stolen

question from talking head:

"How can we protect ourselves from someone stealing a plane and flying it into a building?"

That last bit.

[rancher89]

"even a small airplane can carry up to 50 gallons of fuel."

17,000 airfields in US, only 450 have control towers

[GunnyFreedom]

they just said his name. I think it was "john andrew stack".

edit: JOSEPH Andrew Stack


I'm getting no hits on a "Joseph Andrew Stack" outside of current news. If he was politically active, it wasn't on the 'tubes

[angelatc]

For this, they launch 2 F-16's.

[theclip]

For this, they launch 2 F-16's.

.after the crash.

[rancher89]

For this, they launch 2 F-16's.

qft

[MelissaWV]

"even a small airplane can carry up to 50 gallons of fuel."

17,000 airfields in US, only 450 have control towers

That's a little bit of a useless statistic, though, because there are also flight service centers. There isn't much the tower can do other than report it via procedures, which will generally take awhile and won't do much in this case.

In reality, there have been previous incidents like this (small plane, big building) and there's dramatic damage, little/no death.

[rancher89]

Yeah, didn't some kid fly a small plane into a high rise in Miami right after 9/11?

[DapperDan]

"How can we protect ourselves from someone stealing a plane and flying it into a building?""


Time to bend over some more while we pass useless legislation that takes away your freedoms and treats you like children.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

Time to bend over some more while we pass useless legislation that takes away your freedoms and treats you like children.

...that still does nothing to make anyone " safer "

[GunnyFreedom]

"probably stolen" only record of a Joseph A Stack I come up with owning a plane is out of Lincoln California, and the aircraft is a Piper.

N2889D JOSEPH A STACK
Individual * PIPER PA-28-236

[GunnyFreedom]

Time to bend over some more while we pass useless legislation that takes away your freedoms and treats you like children.

Exactly why I posted, hopefully we can watchdog this.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

"probably stolen" only record of a Joseph A Stack I come up with owning a plane is out of Lincoln California, and the aircraft is a Piper.

N2889D JOSEPH A STACK
Individual * PIPER PA-28-236

Way to be on top of things

If only we had people like you working in the government :D

[angelatc]

I'm getting no hits on a "Joseph Andrew Stack" outside of current news. If he was politically active, it wasn't on the 'tubes

From Austin's Yelp:

1827 DAPPLEGREY LN AUSTIN, TX 78727-4551. Thats the Joe Stack residence.... assuming the burning one. ...

[constituent]

From Austin's Yelp:

I'll be damned, that's right up the street.

[GunnyFreedom]

Way to be on top of things

If only we had people like you working in the government :D

workin on it workin on it lol

[constituent]

workin on it workin on it lol

any word on the airport he took off from?

[rancher89]

"common to have f-16's in the air when you have something like this happen now. They would not know the circumstances when they took off."

took off from Georgetown TX

[GunnyFreedom]

CNN sez:

12:32 p.m.: Preliminary information indicates that the plane was a Cirrus SR 22, the FAA said. A Cirrus SR22 is a single-engine four-seat aircraft.

12:32 p.m.: The FAA said the plane departed Georgetown Municipal Airport, north of Austin, about 9:40 a.m., and that the pilot did not file a flight plan.

[constituent]

as an aside, there's a whole foods right across the interchange... maybe we should start a rumor that he was some left wing "healthcare voter" that veered off course?

[rancher89]

talking about the other guy I mentioned, Tampa, not Miami, 26 floor bldg

[rancher89]

as an aside, there's a whole foods right across the interchange... maybe we should start a rumor that he was some left wing "healthcare voter" that veered off course?

could work....:D

[Pericles]

......... I had this nervous feeling in my stomach and was thinking, "this is it! Crap is hitting the fan!" Then I scrolled down, saw headline, read article, and it found out that crap is probably not hitting the fan today.

Maybe not for you, but I'm guessing it did for someone.

[CGeoffrion]

"Bill O'Reilly: "Tonight! Extremist fringe elements of the tea party movement have initiated an act of war against the United States with the Austin attack earlier today! Campaign for Liberty and Ron Paul 2008 campaign materials were found at the burned remains of the pilots house raising questions about this American hate group. Could this 9/11 copycat be related to all the hate mail my colleague Glen Beck has been receiving after calling out Debra Medina for being a sympathizer to the 9/11 truth movement? "

[rancher89]

someone heard a loud bang, says that he thought a bomb went off.......

[constituent]

I'm getting no hits on a "Joseph Andrew Stack" outside of current news. If he was politically active, it wasn't on the 'tubes

found a joseph a stack in plano (at some point) and an andrew stack in irving, dallas and longview (at some point) and in austin (at some point). doesn't mean anything, but that's all i could find.

[kahless]

"Bill O'Reilly: "Tonight! Extremist fringe elements of the tea party movement have initiated an act of war against the United States with the Austin attack earlier today! Campaign for Liberty and Ron Paul 2008 campaign materials were found at the burned remains of the pilots house raising questions about this American hate group. Could this 9/11 copycat be related to all the hate mail my colleague Glen Beck has been receiving after calling out Debra Medina for being a sympathizer to the 9/11 truth movement? "

Except for the last two sentances I would not be surprised that is how O"Reilly will try to spin it tonight.

[rancher89]

now a bomb threat forcing a plne to land in SLCity

[rancher89]

ratchet up the tension boys, find me something scary quick, the story in TX seems to be not much anymore.......

[American Idol]

now a bomb threat forcing a plne to land in SLCity

Link or it didn't happen. ;)

[puppetmaster]

the IRS has gotta go! those bottom feeders need new jobs

abolish fed and IRS now! Then these people won't feel the need to do this

[Immortal Technique]

so his name is Joseph Andrew Stack, he did not steal the plane he owned it and he crashed it into a building housing the irs.Oh and he set his house on fire.
That is the current story

[NoHero]

Home fire broke out at 9:30 am CST plane crashed at 9:46. Is this timeline possible? I mean to get from the home to the airport and all?

[Immortal Technique]

there is now a supposed suicide note, Jones is reading it
Sounds like a lefty
Complains about how health insurance companies are killing people and stuff ill post it as soon as i can find it

[Immortal Technique]

hotair is covering it id be careful trusting them though here it is

After my experience with the CPA world, following the business crash I swore that I’d never enter another accountant’s office again. But here I am with a new marriage and a boatload of undocumented income, not to mention an expensive new business asset, a piano, which I had no idea how to handle. After considerable thought I decided that it would be irresponsible NOT to get professional help; a very big mistake.

When we received the forms back I was very optimistic that they were in order. I had taken all of the years information to Bill Ross, and he came back with results very similar to what I was expecting. Except that he had neglected to include the contents of Sheryl’s unreported income; $12,700 worth of it. To make matters worse, Ross knew all along this was missing and I didn’t have a clue until he pointed it out in the middle of the audit. By that time it had become brutally evident that he was representing himself and not me.

This left me stuck in the middle of this disaster trying to defend transactions that have no relationship to anything tax-related (at least the tax-related transactions were poorly documented). Things I never knew anything about and things my wife had no clue would ever matter to anyone. The end result is… well, just look around…

As government agencies go, the FAA is often justifiably referred to as a tombstone agency, though they are hardly alone. The recent presidential puppet GW Bush and his cronies in their eight years certainly reinforced for all of us that this criticism rings equally true for all of the government. Nothing changes unless there is a body count (unless it is in the interest of the wealthy sows at the government trough). In a government full of hypocrites from top to bottom, life is as cheap as their lies and their self-serving laws.

I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isn’t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at “big brother” while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual won’t continue; I have just had enough.

http://hotair.com/archives/2010/02/18/ntsb-plane-crash-into-austin-office-building-may-have-been-intentional/

[paulitics]

there is now a supposed suicide note, Jones is reading it
Sounds like a lefty
Complains about how health insurance companies are killing people and stuff ill post it as soon as i can find it

Well, Bin laden complains about global warming, so you never know with these guys and what their political beliefs are.

[wgadget]

Well, Bin laden complains about global warming, so you never know with these guys and what their political beliefs are.

http://embeddedart.com/

[WaltM]

" Might Be Intentional Act"

[ctiger2]

http://embeddedart.com/


If you’re reading this, you’re no doubt asking yourself, “Why did this have to happen?” The simple truth is that it is complicated and has been coming for a long time. The writing process, started many months ago, was intended to be therapy in the face of the looming realization that there isn’t enough therapy in the world that can fix what is really broken. Needless to say, this rant could fill volumes with example after example if I would let it. I find the process of writing it frustrating, tedious, and probably pointless… especially given my gross inability to gracefully articulate my thoughts in light of the storm raging in my head. Exactly what is therapeutic about that I’m not sure, but desperate times call for desperate measures.

We are all taught as children that without laws there would be no society, only anarchy. Sadly, starting at early ages we in this country have been brainwashed to believe that, in return for our dedication and service, our government stands for justice for all. We are further brainwashed to believe that there is freedom in this place, and that we should be ready to lay our lives down for the noble principals represented by its founding fathers. Remember? One of these was “no taxation without representation”. I have spent the total years of my adulthood unlearning that crap from only a few years of my childhood. These days anyone who really stands up for that principal is promptly labeled a “crackpot”, traitor and worse.

While very few working people would say they haven’t had their fair share of taxes (as can I), in my lifetime I can say with a great degree of certainty that there has never been a politician cast a vote on any matter with the likes of me or my interests in mind. Nor, for that matter, are they the least bit interested in me or anything I have to say.

Why is it that a handful of thugs and plunderers can commit unthinkable atrocities (and in the case of the GM executives, for scores of years) and when it’s time for their gravy train to crash under the weight of their gluttony and overwhelming stupidity, the force of the full federal government has no difficulty coming to their aid within days if not hours? Yet at the same time, the joke we call the American medical system, including the drug and insurance companies, are murdering tens of thousands of people a year and stealing from the corpses and victims they cripple, and this country’s leaders don’t see this as important as bailing out a few of their vile, rich cronies. Yet, the political “representatives” (thieves, liars, and self-serving scumbags is far more accurate) have endless time to sit around for year after year and debate the state of the “terrible health care problem”. It’s clear they see no crisis as long as the dead people don’t get in the way of their corporate profits rolling in.

And justice? You’ve got to be kidding!

How can any rational individual explain that white elephant conundrum in the middle of our tax system and, indeed, our entire legal system? Here we have a system that is, by far, too complicated for the brightest of the master scholars to understand. Yet, it mercilessly “holds accountable” its victims, claiming that they’re responsible for fully complying with laws not even the experts understand. The law “requires” a signature on the bottom of a tax filing; yet no one can say truthfully that they understand what they are signing; if that’s not “duress” than what is. If this is not the measure of a totalitarian regime, nothing is.

How did I get here?

My introduction to the real American nightmare starts back in the early ‘80s. Unfortunately after more than 16 years of school, somewhere along the line I picked up the absurd, pompous notion that I could read and understand plain English. Some friends introduced me to a group of people who were having ‘tax code’ readings and discussions. In particular, zeroed in on a section relating to the wonderful “exemptions” that make institutions like the vulgar, corrupt Catholic Church so incredibly wealthy. We carefully studied the law (with the help of some of the “best”, high-paid, experienced tax lawyers in the business), and then began to do exactly what the “big boys” were doing (except that we weren’t steeling from our congregation or lying to the government about our massive profits in the name of God). We took a great deal of care to make it all visible, following all of the rules, exactly the way the law said it was to be done.

The intent of this exercise and our efforts was to bring about a much-needed re-evaluation of the laws that allow the monsters of organized religion to make such a mockery of people who earn an honest living. However, this is where I learned that there are two “interpretations” for every law; one for the very rich, and one for the rest of us… Oh, and the monsters are the very ones making and enforcing the laws; the inquisition is still alive and well today in this country.

That little lesson in patriotism cost me $40,000+, 10 years of my life, and set my retirement plans back to 0. It made me realize for the first time that I live in a country with an ideology that is based on a total and complete lie. It also made me realize, not only how naive I had been, but also the incredible stupidity of the American public; that they buy, hook, line, and sinker, the crap about their “freedom”… and that they continue to do so with eyes closed in the face of overwhelming evidence and all that keeps happening in front of them.

Before even having to make a shaky recovery from the sting of the first lesson on what justice really means in this country (around 1984 after making my way through engineering school and still another five years of “paying my dues”), I felt I finally had to take a chance of launching my dream of becoming an independent engineer.

On the subjects of engineers and dreams of independence, I should digress somewhat to say that I’m sure that I inherited the fascination for creative problem solving from my father. I realized this at a very young age.

The significance of independence, however, came much later during my early years of college; at the age of 18 or 19 when I was living on my own as student in an apartment in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. My neighbor was an elderly retired woman (80+ seemed ancient to me at that age) who was the widowed wife of a retired steel worker. Her husband had worked all his life in the steel mills of central Pennsylvania with promises from big business and the union that, for his 30 years of service, he would have a pension and medical care to look forward to in his retirement. Instead he was one of the thousands who got nothing because the incompetent mill management and corrupt union (not to mention the government) raided their pension funds and stole their retirement. All she had was social security to live on.

In retrospect, the situation was laughable because here I was living on peanut butter and bread (or Ritz crackers when I could afford to splurge) for months at a time. When I got to know this poor figure and heard her story I felt worse for her plight than for my own (I, after all, I thought I had everything to in front of me). I was genuinely appalled at one point, as we exchanged stories and commiserated with each other over our situations, when she in her grandmotherly fashion tried to convince me that I would be “healthier” eating cat food (like her) rather than trying to get all my substance from peanut butter and bread. I couldn’t quite go there, but the impression was made. I decided that I didn’t trust big business to take care of me, and that I would take responsibility for my own future and myself.

Return to the early ‘80s, and here I was off to a terrifying start as a ‘wet-behind-the-ears’ contract software engineer... and two years later, thanks to the fine backroom, midnight effort by the sleazy executives of Arthur Andersen (the very same folks who later brought us Enron and other such calamities) and an equally sleazy New York Senator (Patrick Moynihan), we saw the passage of 1986 tax reform act with its section 1706.

For you who are unfamiliar, here is the core text of the IRS Section 1706, defining the treatment of workers (such as contract engineers) for tax purposes. Visit this link for a conference committee report (http://www.synergistech.com/1706.shtml#ConferenceCommitteeReport) regarding the intended interpretation of Section 1706 and the relevant parts of Section 530, as amended. For information on how these laws affect technical services workers and their clients, read our discussion here (http://www.synergistech.com/ic-taxlaw.shtml).

SEC. 1706. TREATMENT OF CERTAIN TECHNICAL PERSONNEL.

(a) IN GENERAL - Section 530 of the Revenue Act of 1978 is amended by adding at the end thereof the following new subsection:

(d) EXCEPTION. - This section shall not apply in the case of an individual who pursuant to an arrangement between the taxpayer and another person, provides services for such other person as an engineer, designer, drafter, computer programmer, systems analyst, or other similarly skilled worker engaged in a similar line of work.

(b) EFFECTIVE DATE. - The amendment made by this section shall apply to remuneration paid and services rendered after December 31, 1986.

Note:

· "another person" is the client in the traditional job-shop relationship.

· "taxpayer" is the recruiter, broker, agency, or job shop.

· "individual", "employee", or "worker" is you.



Admittedly, you need to read the treatment to understand what it is saying but it’s not very complicated. The bottom line is that they may as well have put my name right in the text of section (d). Moreover, they could only have been more blunt if they would have came out and directly declared me a criminal and non-citizen slave. Twenty years later, I still can’t believe my eyes.

During 1987, I spent close to $5000 of my ‘pocket change’, and at least 1000 hours of my time writing, printing, and mailing to any senator, congressman, governor, or slug that might listen; none did, and they universally treated me as if I was wasting their time. I spent countless hours on the L.A. freeways driving to meetings and any and all of the disorganized professional groups who were attempting to mount a campaign against this atrocity. This, only to discover that our efforts were being easily derailed by a few moles from the brokers who were just beginning to enjoy the windfall from the new declaration of their “freedom”. Oh, and don’t forget, for all of the time I was spending on this, I was loosing income that I couldn’t bill clients.

After months of struggling it had clearly gotten to be a futile exercise. The best we could get for all of our trouble is a pronouncement from an IRS mouthpiece that they weren’t going to enforce that provision (read harass engineers and scientists). This immediately proved to be a lie, and the mere existence of the regulation began to have its impact on my bottom line; this, of course, was the intended effect.

Again, rewind my retirement plans back to 0 and shift them into idle. If I had any sense, I clearly should have left abandoned engineering and never looked back.

Instead I got busy working 100-hour workweeks. Then came the L.A. depression of the early 1990s. Our leaders decided that they didn’t need the all of those extra Air Force bases they had in Southern California, so they were closed; just like that. The result was economic devastation in the region that rivaled the widely publicized Texas S&L fiasco. However, because the government caused it, no one gave a shit about all of the young families who lost their homes or street after street of boarded up houses abandoned to the wealthy loan companies who received government funds to “shore up” their windfall. Again, I lost my retirement.

Years later, after weathering a divorce and the constant struggle trying to build some momentum with my business, I find myself once again beginning to finally pick up some speed. Then came the .COM bust and the 911 nightmare. Our leaders decided that all aircraft were grounded for what seemed like an eternity; and long after that, ‘special’ facilities like San Francisco were on security alert for months. This made access to my customers prohibitively expensive. Ironically, after what they had done the Government came to the aid of the airlines with billions of our tax dollars … as usual they left me to rot and die while they bailed out their rich, incompetent cronies WITH MY MONEY! After these events, there went my business but not quite yet all of my retirement and savings.

By this time, I’m thinking that it might be good for a change. Bye to California, I’ll try Austin for a while. So I moved, only to find out that this is a place with a highly inflated sense of self-importance and where damn little real engineering work is done. I’ve never experienced such a hard time finding work. The rates are 1/3 of what I was earning before the crash, because pay rates here are fixed by the three or four large companies in the area who are in collusion to drive down prices and wages… and this happens because the justice department is all on the take and doesn’t give a fuck about serving anyone or anything but themselves and their rich buddies.

To survive, I was forced to cannibalize my savings and retirement, the last of which was a small IRA. This came in a year with mammoth expenses and not a single dollar of income. I filed no return that year thinking that because I didn’t have any income there was no need. The sleazy government decided that they disagreed. But they didn’t notify me in time for me to launch a legal objection so when I attempted to get a protest filed with the court I was told I was no longer entitled to due process because the time to file ran out. Bend over for another $10,000 helping of justice.

So now we come to the present. After my experience with the CPA world, following the business crash I swore that I’d never enter another accountant’s office again. But here I am with a new marriage and a boatload of undocumented income, not to mention an expensive new business asset, a piano, which I had no idea how to handle. After considerable thought I decided that it would be irresponsible NOT to get professional help; a very big mistake.

When we received the forms back I was very optimistic that they were in order. I had taken all of the years information to Bill Ross, and he came back with results very similar to what I was expecting. Except that he had neglected to include the contents of Sheryl’s unreported income; $12,700 worth of it. To make matters worse, Ross knew all along this was missing and I didn’t have a clue until he pointed it out in the middle of the audit. By that time it had become brutally evident that he was representing himself and not me.

This left me stuck in the middle of this disaster trying to defend transactions that have no relationship to anything tax-related (at least the tax-related transactions were poorly documented). Things I never knew anything about and things my wife had no clue would ever matter to anyone. The end result is… well, just look around.

I remember reading about the stock market crash before the “great” depression and how there were wealthy bankers and businessmen jumping out of windows when they realized they screwed up and lost everything. Isn’t it ironic how far we’ve come in 60 years in this country that they now know how to fix that little economic problem; they just steal from the middle class (who doesn’t have any say in it, elections are a joke) to cover their asses and it’s “business-as-usual”. Now when the wealthy fuck up, the poor get to die for the mistakes… isn’t that a clever, tidy solution.

As government agencies go, the FAA is often justifiably referred to as a tombstone agency, though they are hardly alone. The recent presidential puppet GW Bush and his cronies in their eight years certainly reinforced for all of us that this criticism rings equally true for all of the government. Nothing changes unless there is a body count (unless it is in the interest of the wealthy sows at the government trough). In a government full of hypocrites from top to bottom, life is as cheap as their lies and their self-serving laws.

I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isn’t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at “big brother” while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual won’t continue; I have just had enough.

I can only hope that the numbers quickly get too big to be white washed and ignored that the American zombies wake up and revolt; it will take nothing less. I would only hope that by striking a nerve that stimulates the inevitable double standard, knee-jerk government reaction that results in more stupid draconian restrictions people wake up and begin to see the pompous political thugs and their mindless minions for what they are. Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn’t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer. The cruel joke is that the really big chunks of shit at the top have known this all along and have been laughing, at and using this awareness against, fools like me all along.

I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let’s try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well.

:eek:

[Todd]

Here we go......The first backlash against the less government crowd will begin in. 3...2....1...

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

hotair is covering it id be careful trusting them though here it is

After my experience with the CPA world, following the business crash I swore that I’d never enter another accountant’s office again. But here I am with a new marriage and a boatload of undocumented income, not to mention an expensive new business asset, a piano, which I had no idea how to handle. After considerable thought I decided that it would be irresponsible NOT to get professional help; a very big mistake.

When we received the forms back I was very optimistic that they were in order. I had taken all of the years information to Bill Ross, and he came back with results very similar to what I was expecting. Except that he had neglected to include the contents of Sheryl’s unreported income; $12,700 worth of it. To make matters worse, Ross knew all along this was missing and I didn’t have a clue until he pointed it out in the middle of the audit. By that time it had become brutally evident that he was representing himself and not me.

This left me stuck in the middle of this disaster trying to defend transactions that have no relationship to anything tax-related (at least the tax-related transactions were poorly documented). Things I never knew anything about and things my wife had no clue would ever matter to anyone. The end result is… well, just look around…

As government agencies go, the FAA is often justifiably referred to as a tombstone agency, though they are hardly alone. The recent presidential puppet GW Bush and his cronies in their eight years certainly reinforced for all of us that this criticism rings equally true for all of the government. Nothing changes unless there is a body count (unless it is in the interest of the wealthy sows at the government trough). In a government full of hypocrites from top to bottom, life is as cheap as their lies and their self-serving laws.

I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand. It has always been a myth that people have stopped dying for their freedom in this country, and it isn’t limited to the blacks, and poor immigrants. I know there have been countless before me and there are sure to be as many after. But I also know that by not adding my body to the count, I insure nothing will change. I choose to not keep looking over my shoulder at “big brother” while he strips my carcass, I choose not to ignore what is going on all around me, I choose not to pretend that business as usual won’t continue; I have just had enough.

http://hotair.com/archives/2010/02/18/ntsb-plane-crash-into-austin-office-building-may-have-been-intentional/

That last bit...

[pcosmar]

Tax Protest

Though I would not condone or recommend this action,

something in my heart goes :D

[Bruno]

Home fire broke out at 9:30 am CST plane crashed at 9:46. Is this timeline possible? I mean to get from the home to the airport and all?


could have been a time-delayed fire, or just noticed and reported to the fire department at 9:46.

[constituent]

Home fire broke out at 9:30 am CST plane crashed at 9:46. Is this timeline possible? I mean to get from the home to the airport and all?

yea, he'd of hopped on 35 from parmer, and georgetown is about six or seven minutes up the road. quick time for sure... but there's no telling how long the fire was building before it got called in, ya know?

[GunnyFreedom]

there is now a supposed suicide note, Jones is reading it
Sounds like a lefty
Complains about how health insurance companies are killing people and stuff ill post it as soon as i can find it

Sounds like a Republican disgruntled at Bush to me. :shrug:

[angelatc]

Sounds like a Republican disgruntled at Bush to me. :shrug:

No, not with all the references to health care and the widow eating cat food. He's a leftie.

Or, he was a leftie.

The media will call him a domestic terrorist and anybody who has danced with the IRS enough to sympathize with him will be called out as a terrorist sympathizer. Bend over - the small government movement is under attack.

[CGeoffrion]

That last bit...

sends shivers down my spine...

[constituent]

http://embeddedart.com/

wow, it's always some whack job from out of state has to come to austin for his last stand.

they come here looking for some myth they heard about in a commercial, run in circles, exhaust themselves, deplete their savings and

a) flip out, kill people

b) flip out (kill people?) and run home

this dude's whole life appears to have been leading to this moment.

[angelatc]

http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.embeddedart.com

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

Zero trust in this story

Maybe true

Maybe not

[CGeoffrion]

I don't like where this is going....


edit: Also gotta love how they report this saying "It is not believed to be a terrorist act". WELL WTF!? Does he have to be a Koran reading Muslim to be categorized as terrorism?

[cpike]

He sounds like an Anarchist to me.

[pcosmar]

Sounds like a Republican disgruntled at Bush to me. :shrug:


No, not with all the references to health care and the widow eating cat food. He's a leftie.

Or, he was a leftie.

The media will call him a domestic terrorist and anybody who has danced with the IRS enough to sympathize with him will be called out as a terrorist sympathizer. Bend over - the small government movement is under attack.

Righty, Lefty
Could be anyone that has just had enough.
Not an ineffective way to go out though.

[ShowMeLiberty]

Tax Protest

Though I would not condone or recommend this action,

something in my heart goes :D


If no one was killed ... if he can't be definitely linked to RP or tea parties... then me too.

[angelatc]

So he was pissed because the tax code said he had to be treated as an employee instead of an IC?

http://www.synergistech.com/ic-taxlaw.shtml

And yet the site he links to is a company that exists solely to circumvent that problem?

http://www.synergistech.com/working-w-ic.shtml

What am I missing here? Oh yeah....he was nuts.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

Right or left doesn't matter.

He is being portrayed as anti government.

[theclip]

Clearly an INSIDE JOB.

[theclip]

Isn't it the definition of insanity when you keep doing the same thing and expecting a different result?

Today I read this quote for the first time, and incidentally the attacker wrote these words in his final letter. I heard AJ reading it out from somewhere.

[DapperDan]

Dunno if I heard the TV right...

apparently pilot said violence is the only answer now? or something like that

[NoHero]

Anybody else hear Perrys statement? All i hear was "this has always been about anarchy vs. tyrrany..." then gave a goofy smile and walked off

[aravoth]

Dunno if I heard the TV right...

apparently pilot said violence is the only answer now? or something like that

that is what he said in his letter.

[LittleLightShining]

Not an ineffective way to go out though.Maybe, maybe not.


Dunno if I heard the TV right...

apparently pilot said violence is the only answer now? or something like thatThat's what he said.

Powerful letter. Very sad.

[cpike]

Yeah, here come more restrictions by the FAA!

[marc1888]

Maybe, maybe not.

That's what he said.

Powerful letter. Very sad.

Move along, nothing to see here. Apparently the guy was seen eating a falafel sandwich one time so there is an obvious Al Qaeda link there.

[cpike]

Chalk up Micheal McCraul (R) as a tyrrant. Hadn't heard of him before. The girl on Fox at least seemed to caution against over-reaction by lawmakers.

[Immortal Technique]

Anybody else hear Perrys statement? All i hear was "this has always been about anarchy vs. tyrrany..." then gave a goofy smile and walked off

yeah he said there will always be a battle between anarchy and tyranny then walked off with a grin on his face

[RyanRSheets]

He sounds like an Anarchist to me.

Anarcho-Communist

[dannno]

small plane, single engine, no flight plan, probably stolen

question from talking head:

"How can we protect ourselves from someone stealing a plane and flying it into a building?"

Stop stealing from people.

[Todd]

Yeah, here come more restrictions by the FAA!

And the more people who take actions like this get linked to being against the expansion of government the more character assassinations against those that have legitimate concerns

[LittleLightShining]

And the more people who take actions like this get linked to being against the expansion of government the more character assassinations against those that have legitimate concerns
His concerns weren't legitimate?

[cpike]

Anarcho-Communist

You hit it.

[GunnyFreedom]

Stop stealing from people.

yeah, right? It's easily as related as the Iran hostage crisis was to our CIA coup and installing the Shah.


And the more people who take actions like this get linked to being against the expansion of government the more character assassinations against those that have legitimate concerns

problem is, you can't stop a pot that's on the fire from boiling. If you try to "keep it down" by welding the lid on tight, it will eventually explode. the only way to fix it is ti take the pot off the fire (or quench the fire). that is simply an option which the government is not prepared to take.

[Todd]

His concerns weren't legitimate?

Sure they were.

Guess what happens when you express a legitimate concern and a sheeple starts making a link between what you say and an idiot who stole an airplane and drove it into a building.

[moostraks]

His concerns weren't legitimate?

They were. The letter was sad and articulate. If true he reached point break and it won't be surprising to see more such as this who feel the exasperation of doing the same thing for the same result.:(

This is what they want in the msm to portray anyone who takes a stand against government tyrants as being crackers.

[pcosmar]

His concerns weren't legitimate?

Legitimate concerns, but a questionable response.

Not unexpected though.

[Todd]

They were. The letter was sad and articulate. If true he reached point break and it won't be surprising to see more such as this who feel the exasperation of doing the same thing for the same result.:(

This is what they want in the msm to portray anyone who takes a stand against government tyrants as being crackers.

you said this better than I apparently could.

[GunnyFreedom]

Anarcho-Communist


You hit it.

agree

[constituent]

dude tried to kill his wife and kid? is that correct?

[Todd]

Has it collapsed at near free-fall speed into it's own footprint yet? I heard that's what happens :rolleyes:

Funny....I just saw video that said "some of the structure" had collapsed.

[Bruno]

dude tried to kill his wife and kid? is that correct?

hadn't heard that yet. What do you mean, tried? What happened?

[cpike]

hadn't heard that yet. What do you mean, tried? What happened?

I wouldn't doubt it, he wants a big body count.

[DaisyFL]

hadn't heard that yet. What do you mean, tried? What happened?

He set his house on fire, with his wife and daughter inside.

[Bruno]

Interesting that CNN has a pic of the Dali Lama and one of the Haiti rubble on their site with the plane crash as a side note, and Fox has a wideshot of the burning building on their front page


He set his house on fire, with his wife and daughter inside.

Damn. Thanks. I guess he blamed them for his IRS problems, too :rolleyes: :mad:

[Baptist]

Stop stealing from people.

ROFL. So simple, yet so true.

[angelatc]

The FBI pulled the letter off the www.embeddedart.com site.

[dannno]

Funny....I just saw video that said "some of the structure" had collapsed.

Definitely wasn't a plane, had to be bombs. Planes collisions always cause buildings to fall symmetrically. They can even make surrounding buildings fall symmetrically.

[dannno]

http://www.infowars.com/austin-suicide-pilot-posted-anti-irs-screed/

[constituent]

http://www.infowars.com/austin-suicide-pilot-posted-anti-irs-screed/

ask 'em if that's the same building where stanford international bank was located... that'll be fun to watch. :D

[eOs]

So this guy loves the founding fathers, but then quotes karl marx at the end?

[MsDoodahs]

After I read his letter, I thought of this...used to be my sig line...

"This book is based upon the premise that, when government turns bad, the best people ultimately become criminals. The people don't change; the laws do. Initiative, dissent, individual pleasures and exercise of one's basic rights become "crimes"....

The ideal citizen of a tyrannical state is the man or woman who bows in silent obedience in exchange for the status of a well-cared-for herd animal. Thinking people become the tyrants worst enemies.

Before their thunder roars, there is a period of anticipation, in which more occurs than the literal-minded tyrant can ever understand.

A few overt acts of sedition shatter the heavy peace.

But the greater force, unrecognized, rolls forward in near silence, as millions of individuals quietly withdraw their consent from the state.

The pundits call it apathy.

They could not be more wrong.

That time is now. And we are those people.

This book is dedicated to you, the enemy of the state."

Claire Wolf, 101 Things to Do Til the Revolution

1999

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

So this guy loves the founding fathers, but then quotes karl marx at the end?

It's strange to me too. But I think some people get to the point where anti-establishment is all that matters.

[Seanmc30]

Something is strange here. I'm not suicidal, but I find what this man wrote in his last letter to be an extremely lucid assessment of what our Government has become. Seriously, I am about 3/4 of the way thorugh and I agree with almost everything he said.

Anybody else feeling that way?

[Reason]

YouTube - Austin Police: Not act of terrorism (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1j9w4vnPOWg)

[Reason]

YouTube - Official: Plane Crash Doesn't Look to Be Terror (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-V9hMHxZZ0)

YouTube - Breaking News-Austin Plane Crash-It looked like he had full control (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLZ6XeA0s9o)

[RyanRSheets]

YouTube - Austin Police: Not act of terrorism (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1j9w4vnPOWg)

What a bunch of bullshit! This fits exactly the legal definition of terrorism! What he means to say is that the pilot was not a Muslim.



(5) the term “domestic terrorism” means activities that—
(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;
(B) appear to be intended—
(i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
(ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
(iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and
(C) occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States

[ctiger2]

Something is strange here. I'm not suicidal, but I find what this man wrote in his last letter to be an extremely lucid assessment of what our Government has become. Seriously, I am about 3/4 of the way through and I agree with almost everything he said.

Anybody else feeling that way?

Yes, I wish they would stop stealing from us too. They're thieves. I don't condone the act, but I also don't like the IRS as well.

[constituent]

What a bunch of bullshit! This fits exactly the legal definition of terrorism! What he means to say is that the pilot was not a Muslim.

lol, that's b/c half the community would jump down his throat... APD is a terrorist organization, imo.

[dannno]

YouTube - Austin Police: Not act of terrorism (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1j9w4vnPOWg)

The title of that video does not go with what was said.

[AutonomousLiberty]

The first quotation here is supposedly Joe Stack, according to Fox News.

"I’m really tired of the UAW demanding that we taxpayers finance their wellbeing. They enjoy benefits that the rest of the Americans do not have; therefore, no more money to GM and Chrysler. Let them go through bankruptcy. If they are as wonderful as they think they are–they will survive, if not, that’s their problem. Add these comments to the news today about Citigroup giving 1,900 employees a check for $5,000 because the spoiled brats couldn’t go to the Bahamas! Enough is enough."
— Joseph Stack

http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/03/09/auto-workers-rescue-them-or-not/?ref=business&apage=7

Here are more, signed with the same name. I am not sure they are the same person as above. I don't wish to smear anyone. (I will update this post to edit out any information which is found to be inaccurate.)

(I'm removed the rest for now because the location for those other names is WA, and I don't know if he's ever lived there. I'll leave up what Fox News reported as supposedly being posted by him.)

[dannno]

The first quotation here is supposedly Joe Stack, according to Fox News.

"I’m really tired of the UAW demanding that we taxpayers finance their wellbeing. They enjoy benefits that the rest of the Americans do not have; therefore, no more money to GM and Chrysler. Let them go through bankruptcy. If they are as wonderful as they think they are–they will survive, if not, that’s their problem. Add these comments to the news today about Citigroup giving 1,900 employees a check for $5,000 because the spoiled brats couldn’t go to the Bahamas! Enough is enough."
— Joseph Stack

http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/03/09/auto-workers-rescue-them-or-not/?ref=business&apage=7

Here are more, signed with the same name. I am not sure they are the same person as above. I don't wish to smear anyone. (I will update this post to edit out any information which is found to be inaccurate.)

http://community.nytimes.com/comments/www.nytimes.com/2009/11/19/world/middleeast/19iraq.html

http://community.nytimes.com/comments/www.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/business/01auto.html?permid=260

http://atwar.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/08/27/the-afghan-elections-a-postscript/

http://community.nytimes.com/comments/www.nytimes.com/2010/02/18/business/18regulate.html?permid=83

Joseph Stack
Sequim, WA
May 1st, 2009
9:41 am
Sorry to have to say it, but Pres. Obama made his first big mistake by getting so involved with the Chrysler problem and then taking sides with the UAW which will continue to act in their own selfish interests. Obama should have remained neutral and avoided accusing one side or the other for his failure to avoid bankruptcy. Actually, Chrysler is a failed business and nobody wants to admit it.
http://community.nytimes.com/comments/www.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/business/01assess.html?sort=recommended

Joseph Stack
Sequim, WA
May 1st, 2009
10:09 am
I thought Obama (whom I voted for) was trained as a lawyer. How can he ask bondholders to take a haircut when the LAW says that they have first claim on a company's assets. Perhaps he doesn't realize that many bondholders are retired people who depend on that income.
http://community.nytimes.com/comments/www.nytimes.com/2009/05/01/business/01assess.html?sort=recommended

Here is the link to look up more posts by this name:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=site:nytimes.com+%22Joseph+Stack%22&start=0&sa=N


Why does it say he's from Sequim??

Sure this is the same guy?

[Proph]

In the "suicide" letter, I don't think he said anything about moving to or from Washington.

[Reason]

There is a YT member on this video comments trying to connect this guy to Ron Paul BTW

YouTube - Raw Video: Towering Flames After Plane Hits IRS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8MG1JI5iYs)

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

Brace yourselves. Anyone who wants the IRS gone will be accused of being a terrorist like this guy, even if you don't condone the act.

[Reason]

Brace yourselves. Anyone who wants the IRS gone will be accused of being a terrorist like this guy, even if you don't condone the act.

It's so sad that this guy couldn't have realized that this was going to do his cause so much more harm than good.

[Brian4Liberty]

The guy is a crazed Obama supporter. Turns out the "change" was too much for him.

[American Idol]

It's so sad that this guy couldn't have realized that this was going to do his cause so much more harm than good.

Which makes it at least slightly suspicious.

[constituent]

It's so sad that this guy couldn't have realized that this was going to do his cause so much more harm than good.

you need to reread the letter. he said that's exactly what he thought he was doing...

[JK/SEA]

Hard to believe anyone would hate the IRS.

[brandon]

It's funny how Americans still cling to their belief that suicide attacks are only done by deranged muslims who hate freedom.

[Annihilia]

It's funny how Americans still cling to their belief that suicide attacks are only done by deranged muslims who hate freedom.

BREAKING: A damaged copy of the Qur'an was found a quarter mile from the impact site in a nearby commercial parking lot. FBI and Austin responders have determined that the book was jettisoned from the cockpit of Joseph Stack's aircraft upon collision with the IRS building.

[GunnyFreedom]

BREAKING:...

FFS don't even joke about that. And don't give those DHS monsters any ideas, either.

[Old Ducker]

I watched some video of the building with thick black smoke pouring out of all floors and thought of an old slogan from the 1960's.

"Burn, baby...Burn!"

[BlackTerrel]

What a bunch of bullshit! This fits exactly the legal definition of terrorism! What he means to say is that the pilot was not a Muslim.

I think they're saying it's isolated, rather than coordinated with a number of people and there are more on the way. It's a shoddy definition but that's what they use.

John Allen Muhammed (The Muslim Beltway sniper that killed 15 people) was also called "not terrorism" for that reason.

Any was the guys anger justified? Yes. Was this smart or productive? No. It was dumb and counterproductive and now he's dead.

[MelissaWV]

Yay another thread where people sound almost disappointed no one in the Government died, even if it was some file clerk or receptionist.

Yep they should all quit rather than work those jobs. It's their fault (not the fault of the people who make the laws, and keep them on the books, and fund these crooked agencies).

You should all be pretty happy if I die in a fire, cuz I used to work for a number of alphabet agencies :) I also currently work for a company I'm sure many people are mad at, with such blanket hate that they don't really care WHAT I do, just so long as I'm an employee of that evil corporation.

* * *

The guy seemed to go off his rocker at the end. People assume going crazy is all about being incoherent and whatnot, but often it's just life and stress and helplessness that drives people to really crack up. Faced with what he was faced with, what was his REAL recourse? What could he actually DO to change things? If you think about it, the only options are to nibble at a massive, bloated mess of Government. I sympathize with why he picked the target he did, but his methods are way over the line. I doubt his family had much to do with the IRS-hatred, if the part of the story about the fire is true.

I don't think this was orchestrated, but of course it will be twisted and spun, because no one is just a frustrated person who takes out their anger and frustration violently anymore. There has to be a "reason" and a "group" and then there have to be "regulations" to "fix" the situation. The cycle goes on and on.

[libertyjam]

He set his house on fire, with his wife and daughter inside.

Current news reports state that he did not, as in his family was not in the house, he did set it on fire.

[libertyjam]

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2010/0218102stack1.html

Full suicide letter

[Pants]

Gotta expect that. Government and banks took away millions of people's lives. There are too many people now with nothing more to lose. And all the free time in the world. At least if they go to jail they can get two meals a day and not have to live in a tent city. With Police and law enforcement being cut all over the country, it makes us more vulnerable. With so many millions losing homes and jobs, even if 1/4th of 1% snap and do something uncalled for.. That's going to be a major problem.

[GunnyFreedom]

Yay another thread where people sound almost disappointed no one in the Government died, even if it was some file clerk or receptionist.

Yep they should all quit rather than work those jobs. It's their fault (not the fault of the people who make the laws, and keep them on the books, and fund these crooked agencies).

You should all be pretty happy if I die in a fire, cuz I used to work for a number of alphabet agencies :) I also currently work for a company I'm sure many people are mad at, with such blanket hate that they don't really care WHAT I do, just so long as I'm an employee of that evil corporation.

* * *

The guy seemed to go off his rocker at the end. People assume going crazy is all about being incoherent and whatnot, but often it's just life and stress and helplessness that drives people to really crack up. Faced with what he was faced with, what was his REAL recourse? What could he actually DO to change things? If you think about it, the only options are to nibble at a massive, bloated mess of Government. I sympathize with why he picked the target he did, but his methods are way over the line. I doubt his family had much to do with the IRS-hatred, if the part of the story about the fire is true.

I don't think this was orchestrated, but of course it will be twisted and spun, because no one is just a frustrated person who takes out their anger and frustration violently anymore. There has to be a "reason" and a "group" and then there have to be "regulations" to "fix" the situation. The cycle goes on and on.

+1

NAP all the way. Some poor clerk in a fileroom had nothing to do with this man's troubles. Just because it's a predictable result of the government's abrogation of our natural right to a redress of grievance doesn't make it a good, proper, or right response. This was stupid, and will do far, far more harm than good.

Yay for more infringement. :(

[Roxi]

Today I read this quote for the first time, and incidentally the attacker wrote these words in his final letter. I heard AJ reading it out from somewhere.

okay see thats weird because, yesterday i heard that quote (not for the first time) and it applied to a letter i was writing my sister so I used it there (last night).. i heard it twice more on facebook later last night from two completely different friends who don't know each other, then heard it once today on the radio, and then on the guys suicide note earlier, now you are referencing it here... WTF. :eek:

[MelissaWV]

Current news reports state that he did not, as in his family was not in the house, he did set it on fire.

The last thing I had read is that his wife and teen daughter were pulling up while the house was on fire yelling "That's our house!" or something similar. There were also people who were taken from the house for medical treatment. It seems feasible that someone merged the two reports in their head and decided the "two people" were the mom and daughter.

This is why breaking news needs time to sort itself out.

[GunnyFreedom]

okay see thats weird because, yesterday i heard that quote (not for the first time) and it applied to a letter i was writing my sister so I used it there (last night).. i heard it twice more on facebook later last night from two completely different friends who don't know each other, then heard it once today on the radio, and then on the guys suicide note earlier, now you are referencing it here... WTF. :eek:

Am I weird because I encounter that quote pretty much every day of my life?

[Roxi]

http://ww2.cox.com/myconnection/arkansas/today/news/national/article.cox?articleId=D9DURBTO0&moduleType=apNews

[GunnyFreedom]

http://ww2.cox.com/myconnection/arkansas/today/news/national/article.cox?articleId=D9DURBTO0&moduleType=apNews (http://ww2.cox.com/myconnection/arkansas/today/news/national/article.cox?articleId=D9DURBTO0&moduleType=apNews)

(from article)


The pilot took off in a single-engine Piper Cherokee from an airport in Georgetown, about 30 miles from Austin, without filing a flight plan. He flew low over the Austin skyline before plowing into the side the hulking, seven-story, black-glass building just before 10 a.m. with a thunderous explosion that instantly stirred memories of Sept. 11.


"probably stolen" only record of a Joseph A Stack I come up with owning a plane is out of Lincoln California, and the aircraft is a Piper.

N2889D JOSEPH A STACK
Individual * PIPER PA-28-236

Guess that was him.

[puppetmaster]

Yay another thread where people sound almost disappointed no one in the Government died, even if it was some file clerk or receptionist.

Yep they should all quit rather than work those jobs. It's their fault (not the fault of the people who make the laws, and keep them on the books, and fund these crooked agencies).

You should all be pretty happy if I die in a fire, cuz I used to work for a number of alphabet agencies :) I also currently work for a company I'm sure many people are mad at, with such blanket hate that they don't really care WHAT I do, just so long as I'm an employee of that evil corporation.

* * *

The guy seemed to go off his rocker at the end. People assume going crazy is all about being incoherent and whatnot, but often it's just life and stress and helplessness that drives people to really crack up. Faced with what he was faced with, what was his REAL recourse? What could he actually DO to change things? If you think about it, the only options are to nibble at a massive, bloated mess of Government. I sympathize with why he picked the target he did, but his methods are way over the line. I doubt his family had much to do with the IRS-hatred, if the part of the story about the fire is true.

I don't think this was orchestrated, but of course it will be twisted and spun, because no one is just a frustrated person who takes out their anger and frustration violently anymore. There has to be a "reason" and a "group" and then there have to be "regulations" to "fix" the situation. The cycle goes on and on.

They choose to work for the slime....Imagine if no one would work for the IRS.....nice thought huh. I had a contract offer from them and could not do it. Nobobdy HAS to work for them

[MelissaWV]

They choose to work for the slime....Imagine if no one would work for the IRS.....nice thought huh. I had a contract offer from them and could not do it. Nobobdy HAS to work for them

And you live in Nevada. Nevada allows prostitution. Maybe someone will get angry at the whole state and start killing people at random, but that's fine, because you don't HAVE to live there.

He was also pissed off at the Catholic Church, so if he crashed his plane into one of those it'd be cool, too.

Kill, kill, kill; it doesn't matter if you're just the cleaning lady, you should know better than to clean a building with an IRS office in it. Murder, murder, murder; it doesn't matter if your the UPS guy delivering a package, you should have known better than to be there where the IRS office is.

Collateral damage. Yep. Some on this board don't seem to mind becoming the things they hate.

[RileyE104]

Yet another case of Blowback... Hopefully people read his letter and look more into the IRS. Then we can be on track to abolishing it..

EDIT: Hmm.. Looks like the Media is portraying him as a crackpot who just wanted to kill people.
*Nothing to see here folks.. Please return to your lives as free-slaves..*

[puppetmaster]

MellisaWV-ahh chill out babe....I never said it was cool. I just made the point that there are consequences to actions, including your choice of employer.

That reminds me...I live in Nevada, we have prostitutes, and they need more business!

[Athan]

youtube - dramatic olbermann vs. Dramatic chipmunk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnpoj8w53d8)

looool!

[puppetmaster]

looool!

your avitar....beck? LOL

[Reason]

YouTube - Pilot Crashes out of Anger? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNJh_uaMrs0)

YouTube - Sanchez Reads Suicide Note Left By Pilot Who Crashed Plane Into I.R.S. Building (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK5pq1tqPcI)

YouTube - Austin Crash: Disturbing Details of Pilot Emerge (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xC7iZRaoUoM)

[Reason]

PRESS CONFERENCE FOOTAGE

YouTube - Law Enforcement Press Conference On Plane Crash Into I.R.S. Building pt.1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1VAO_dcIYE)

YouTube - Law Enforcement Press Conference On Plane Crash Into I.R.S. Building pt.2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmzSt57CYkE)

[pcosmar]

I only watched pat of the clip. (as much as anger would allow)

Do the mention that he was an OBAMA Supporter??? I did't hear that.

Or do they somehow miss that part?

[Peace&Freedom]

Soooo.....

Who benefits from this event? Are there any signs this was a staged incident? Observations:

As others have suggested, it will shut down private small plane traffic (new security lockdowns), and smear the Tea Partiers and any Patriots who question the government and IRS at the same time. As a poster on the prisonplanet forum noted, "Side "benefit" to this would be that Perry gets to grandstand, Austin becomes an area of interest in the "fight against constitutional rights wackos," and so on."

Why were HAZMAT and firefighter personnel available at the scene BEFORE the plane hit?:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v484/1-stop/meganriley218.jpg

Stack's body is not accounted for, what's up with that? If you know where the plane now is, you should know where the body is. Is it all charred up, or do they have to plant it there?

Why would a politically aware 'Patriot' person do a stunt like this in AUSTIN, TEXAS at THIS POINT in time, knowing it might rebound badly on Debra Medina and Alex Jones? Who would benefit from the political blowback of this incident?

Fire at Stack's $300,000 home is called into 911 at 9:15, 9:30, Firefighters arrive in five minutes. What large $300k house burns down to a few walls in five minutes? Why are the neighbors being asked to stay mum about their neighbor?

The fire damage done to the office building appears greatly disproportional to the small plane crashing it. Was the plane packed to the gills with explosives? Or the building pre-packed? Feds swooped in and got all the security camera footage in the area---why, if it's just a 'simple crazy guy' crashing a plane?

Bottom line from Alex Jones today---"if it's big and already promoted, get ready: it's a staged event."

[phill4paul]

From everything involved, especially the letter, I am of a mind that somehow this is a phishing attempt.
So that's all I'll say on the subject.

[Anti Federalist]

+1

NAP all the way. Some poor clerk in a fileroom had nothing to do with this man's troubles. Just because it's a predictable result of the government's abrogation of our natural right to a redress of grievance doesn't make it a good, proper, or right response. This was stupid, and will do far, far more harm than good.

Yay for more infringement. :(

I disagree, completely.

That file clerk is perpetuating a system that ruins people's live, that literally enslaves them.

They are just as guilty as the armed SWAT raiders, even though they don't care to admit it.

[RyanRSheets]

I disagree, completely.

That file clerk is perpetuating a system that ruins people's live, that literally enslaves them.

They are just as guilty as the armed SWAT raiders, even though they don't care to admit it.

That file clerk probably hasn't even considered the nature of their job. They're not conscious of their errors. I suspect that most of them would quit their jobs if they were. What about a taxpayer who was visiting the office? What if the taxpayer was paying in dollar bills just to make it hard on the IRS? Would you find it okay if that taxpayer was collateral damage? Don't do wrong for the sake of doing good.

[.Tom]

It's funny how the government murders people and calls it justice, but as soon as someone defends themselves against real criminals (IRS agents), they are labeled a terrorist and the like.

Hypocrisy at its finest.

[squarepusher]

Soooo.....

Who benefits from this event? Are there any signs this was a staged incident? Observations:

As others have suggested, it will shut down private small plane traffic (new security lockdowns), and smear the Tea Partiers and any Patriots who question the government and IRS at the same time. As a poster on the prisonplanet forum noted, "Side "benefit" to this would be that Perry gets to grandstand, Austin becomes an area of interest in the "fight against constitutional rights wackos," and so on."

Why were HAZMAT and firefighter personnel available at the scene BEFORE the plane hit?:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v484/1-stop/meganriley218.jpg

Stack's body is not accounted for, what's up with that? If you know where the plane now is, you should know where the body is. Is it all charred up, or do they have to plant it there?

Why would a politically aware 'Patriot' person do a stunt like this in AUSTIN, TEXAS at THIS POINT in time, knowing it might rebound badly on Debra Medina and Alex Jones? Who would benefit from the political blowback of this incident?

Fire at Stack's $300,000 home is called into 911 at 9:15, 9:30, Firefighters arrive in five minutes. What large $300k house burns down to a few walls in five minutes? Why are the neighbors being asked to stay mum about their neighbor?

The fire damage done to the office building appears greatly disproportional to the small plane crashing it. Was the plane packed to the gills with explosives? Or the building pre-packed? Feds swooped in and got all the security camera footage in the area---why, if it's just a 'simple crazy guy' crashing a plane?

Bottom line from Alex Jones today---"if it's big and already promoted, get ready: it's a staged event."


controlled demolition obviously. I think it was thermite.

[RyanRSheets]

Considering only 2 people died, and the attacker's final lettter will likely resonate with most of America, I seriously doubt this was a false flag.

[jmdrake]

I disagree, completely.

That file clerk is perpetuating a system that ruins people's live, that literally enslaves them.

They are just as guilty as the armed SWAT raiders, even though they don't care to admit it.

Are you aware of the fact that this wasn't even an IRS building? It was a SHARED office building! For all you know some Ron Paul supporter could have died that didn't even know the IRS was in there! Also don't forget that Joe Bannister and Sherry Jackson worked for the IRS before they understood what it was all about.

[.Tom]

Are you aware of the fact that this wasn't even an IRS building? It was a SHARED office building! For all you know some Ron Paul supporter could have died that didn't even know the IRS was in there! Also don't forget that Joe Bannister and Sherry Jackson worked for the IRS before they understood what it was all about.

Well someone in the apartment next door could also die if you happen to shoot an intruder in your home. That's just the risk you have to take sometimes.

[Anti Federalist]

So, which is it:

Anti government white radicals?

Communists?

Black panthers?

Jihadists?

Or could it possibly be that people across all racial and political lines, are sick and tired of being bullied, pushed around, ordered about, raided, beaten, jailed and killed by cops that have declared a "War on Us"?

[angelatc]

So, which is it:

Anti government white radicals?

Communists?

Black panthers?

Jihadists?

Or could it possibly be that people across all racial and political lines, are sick and tired of being bullied, pushed around, ordered about, raided, beaten, jailed and killed by cops that have declared a "War on Us"?

Not very many of them. Just an occasional outlier here and there.

[Anti Federalist]

Not very many of them. Just an occasional outlier here and there.

No, not many at all, all things considered.

But I think the numbers will increase, as government pushes even harder, and I do think they are related.

I started searching and it's more than you might think however.

[angelatc]

No, not many at all, all things considered.

But I think the numbers will increase, as government pushes even harder, and I do think they are related.

I started searching and it's more than you might think however.

I hope you're right and I am wrong. But I don't feel it around me.

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

wow this piece of news was buried incredibly fast. I check what's going on a lot and this slipped by me in 2010. Wouldn't have known about it unless AF bumped it. Guy was probably going to lose his home to the IRS and took some of them with him.

[Anti Federalist]

I hope you're right and I am wrong. But I don't feel it around me.

That's the trouble...you won't.

Most people are petrified to even talk about such things.

So they put on their nonchalant face and continue with life on a day to day basis.

Get them alone, with a drink or two in them, and then the outlook changes.

[Anti Federalist]

wow this piece of news was buried incredibly fast. I check what's going on a lot and this slipped by me in 2010. Wouldn't have known about it unless AF bumped it. Guy was probably going to lose his home to the IRS and took some of them with him.

More than a few like this as well.

[Weston White]

Old article, posting for reference:

Remember When Andrew Joseph Stack Flew a Plane Into a Texas IRS Building?
That was February 18, 2010. A week later, the agency's scrutiny of the Tea Party began. Here's what happened leading up to the two events.


"What kicked off the Internal Revenue Service's targeting of Tea Party groups?"

Sean Higgins of the Washington Examiner raises an interesting question. "The Treasury Department's Inspector General apparently knows but the rest of us cannot. His report on the scandal includes three timelines of events, but in each case, the first item in the timeline has been redacted."

"The mystery date was apparently February 25, 2010," he concludes from reading the reports. "...The reference to February in both appendixes indicates something particularly noteworthy happened then in the evolution of the IRS's policy. What was it?"

On the theory that media reports might have been involved (since the agency says media reports led to the end of the special scrutiny of Tea Party and other conservative groups in February 2012), I went back and read through some of the national newspaper coverage on the Tea Party groups in mid-to-late February of 2010.

There was a big David Barstow piece in the New York Times on Feb. 12, 2010, examining the political aspirations of Tea Party and other groups: "Tea Party Lights Fuse for Rebellion on Right." Within the first five paragraphs, it mentions the Tea Party, the Sandpoint Tea Party Patriots, Friends for Liberty, Glenn Beck's 9/12 Project, the John Birch Society, and Oath Keepers, described as "a new player in a resurgent militia movement." As the Times described it:

The Tea Party movement has become a platform for conservative populist discontent, a force in Republican politics for revival, as it was in the Massachusetts Senate election, or for division. But it is also about the profound private transformation of people like Mrs. Stout, people who not long ago were not especially interested in politics, yet now say they are bracing for tyranny.
These people are part of a significant undercurrent within the Tea Party movement that has less in common with the Republican Party than with the Patriot movement, a brand of politics historically associated with libertarians, militia groups, anti-immigration advocates and those who argue for the abolition of the Federal Reserve.

Urged on by conservative commentators, waves of newly minted activists are turning to once-obscure books and Web sites and discovering a set of ideas long dismissed as the preserve of conspiracy theorists, interviews conducted across the country over several months show. In this view, Mr. Obama and many of his predecessors (including George W. Bush) have deliberately undermined the Constitution and free enterprise for the benefit of a shadowy international network of wealthy elites.

Loose alliances like Friends for Liberty are popping up in many cities, forming hybrid entities of Tea Parties and groups rooted in the Patriot ethos. These coalitions are not content with simply making the Republican Party more conservative. They have a larger goal -- a political reordering that would drastically shrink the federal government and sweep away not just Mr. Obama, but much of the Republican establishment, starting with Senator John McCain....

The ebbs and flows of the Tea Party ferment are hardly uniform. It is an amorphous, factionalized uprising with no clear leadership and no centralized structure. Not everyone flocking to the Tea Party movement is worried about dictatorship. Some have a basic aversion to big government, or Mr. Obama, or progressives in general. What's more, some Tea Party groups are essentially appendages of the local Republican Party. (emphasis added)
It's a really long and interesting piece, and worth a read as a reminder of what the Tea Party movement looked like earlier in its development, when it was a more fiery force.


What else happened in February 2010? The first National Tea Party Convention in Nashville, Tenn., featuring a major speech by Sarah Palin, the former Republican vice-presidential nominee. The New York Times lede on that story, published on Feb. 6: "As Sarah Palin left the stage at the inaugural National Tea Party Convention here Saturday night, the crowd erupted into chants of 'Run Sarah Run!'" The headline? "Palin Assails Obama at Tea Party Meeting." More suggestions of active electoral political activity.

And then this caught my eye.

On February 23, 2010, Robert Wright, writing for the Times' Opinionator blog, looked at "The First Tea Party Terrorist?" His column on the Andrew Joseph Stack incident is chilling in retrospect and in light of the IRS's subsequent decision to begin sorting exemption applications for groups with "Tea Party, "Patriot" "9/12" and other conservative buzzwords in their names for referral to a specialist.

On February 18th, Stack had flown a small airplane into an IRS office in Austin, Texas, killing himself and IRS agent Vernon Hunter and injuring 13 on the ground. Stack left behind a six-page rant against the federal government and the IRS. His conclusion: "I saw it written once that the definition of insanity is repeating the same process over and over and expecting the outcome to suddenly be different. I am finally ready to stop this insanity. Well, Mr. Big Brother IRS man, let's try something different; take my pound of flesh and sleep well."


Readers took issue with Wright's description of Stack as a Tea Party type, leading to him to update the column to note: "When I said in this column that you could in principle follow my logic to conclude that Joseph Stack was a Tea Party terrorist, I should have added the explicit reminder that this logic depended on accepting the somewhat squishy definition of 'Tea Party' ideology that, I argue, is appropriate given the still-inchoate nature of the movement." Frank Rich later took issue with Wright (who, full disclosure, blogged for TheAtlantic.com in 2012), arguing that "Stack was a lone madman, and it would be both glib and inaccurate to call him a card-carrying Tea Partier or a 'Tea Party terrorist.'" But writers from other media outlets also piled on, according to a roundup published in the National Review Online, connecting Stack and the growing Tea Party and anti-government movement.

"After reading his 34-paragraph screed, I am struck by how his alienation is similar to that we're hearing from the extreme elements of the Tea Party movement," wrote Jonathan Capeheart of the Washington Post in a blog item. According to a piece on Fox News:

Joseph Stack, the 53-year-old software engineer who crashed his small plane into a seven-story office building in Austin, Texas, was part of a growing, violent anti-tax and anti-government movement that has become increasingly alarming to law enforcement agencies.
Stack, who torched his home Thursday morning before setting out on his suicide flight, was fueled by his hatred of the Internal Revenue Service, which had offices and employed nearly 200 workers in the building.
Stack was not a member of his local group, the Austin Tea Party Patriots, as its founders repeatedly tried to make clear in February 2010.

We don't know what led the IRS to begin looking more closely at Tea Party groups and the conservative anti-government movement. But if you want to know how the Tea Party and the IRS and electoral politics were being discussed in February 2010, there's your answer.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/05/remember-when-andrew-joseph-stack-flew-a-plane-into-a-texas-irs-building/275887/

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N2889D
http://flightaware.com/resources/registration/N2889D