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View Full Version : Putting all political nonsense aside, let's narrow down to what did in Obama.




Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-20-2010, 03:01 PM
Though it might not appear like it, the United States is a moderate nation supported by moderate people. Obama made the political mistake of supporting extremism. In other words, though a ruler would never be elected supporting the Natural Law declared by our Founding Fathers and the self evident and unalienable Truth that our nation was established on, American rulers make a mistake when they support the kind of political extremism that happens over in the tyrannies of Europe and the rest of the world.
That is why I always content that we need necessary tyrants ruling over us as a necessary tyranny, while our true leaders are invisible shepherds ruling us from the middle of the flock. In this way, he or she can deal with those strong ones leading us at the front while tending to those weak stragglers falling behind at the back.

surf
01-20-2010, 03:13 PM
"did in" is a little extreme imo right now.

we all know what King O could have done to minimize the depression.

but what hurt him the most was instilling a belief in the electorate that voting for him would allow him to wave a wand that would end all of the systemic problems inherent in government.

no one really points out that his war lust is hurting the country - Ds like it because he's their guy and Rs like it because he's continuing the war machine.

i think Ds are primarily disappointed that the big-government wand-waving hasn't worked out for them personally. it's really that simple.

it's not about extremism or broken promises, it's about unfulfilled unrealistic dreams the candidate Obama espoused.

Stary Hickory
01-20-2010, 03:59 PM
Obama has been hurt badly by misinterpreting the publics rejection of the Republican party. The country was not rejecting limited government it was rejecting the phonies that said they were for limited government. But thanks to a two party system the only recourse was to stay at home and not vote or vote Democrat.

Obama seized on this as an opportunity to marshall in unconstitutional leftist extremism. He is now getting some blow back from his power grabs.....which are numerous and ruinous for our country. I really don't know what this will accomplish, we will get back Republicans, who will what increase size and the scope of government even more?

And to tell you the truth I don't think either party has a damn clue how to deal with the coming currency failures.

sofia
01-20-2010, 04:02 PM
And to tell you the truth I don't think either party has a damn clue how to deal with the coming currency failures.


To solve the problem created by their money printing....they will print more money.....

Brian4Liberty
01-20-2010, 04:28 PM
What is hurting Obama?:

- Expanding the wars instead of ending them.
- Spending more money (Stimulus) after the people were already enraged over TARP.
- Continuing the Bush policy of Geithner/Bernanke/Wall St. back room deals.
- Forcing health care down our throats, once again in dark backrooms with Nancy Pelosi.
- A host of campaign promises that have been ignored.
- An overall feeling of slimy backroom deals, massive insider payouts, congressional bribes, and corruption.
- Creeping from socialism towards communism.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2010, 04:41 PM
"did in" is a little extreme imo right now.

we all know what King O could have done to minimize the depression.

but what hurt him the most was instilling a belief in the electorate that voting for him would allow him to wave a wand that would end all of the systemic problems inherent in government.

no one really points out that his war lust is hurting the country - Ds like it because he's their guy and Rs like it because he's continuing the war machine.

i think Ds are primarily disappointed that the big-government wand-waving hasn't worked out for them personally. it's really that simple.

it's not about extremism or broken promises, it's about unfulfilled unrealistic dreams the candidate Obama espoused.

As a Texan, I am conservative on the local level and moderate on the Federal level. Actually, I don't really care about the Federal level as those in Washington D.C. could care less about me. If someone were to start pulling my fingernails out demanding that I tell the whole truth and nothing but, then I'd have to admit that I think of the Federal government in Washington D.C. as serving as the local government for the interests of those who live close by in the northeast and midwest states. The rest of us way out here in the wilderness have had to learn how to live in the shambles which makes us more individualistic.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2010, 04:53 PM
What is hurting Obama?:

- Expanding the wars instead of ending them.
- Spending more money (Stimulus) after the people were already enraged over TARP.
- Continuing the Bush policy of Geithner/Bernanke/Wall St. back room deals.
- Forcing health care down our throats, once again in dark backrooms with Nancy Pelosi.
- A host of campaign promises that have been ignored.
- An overall feeling of slimy backroom deals, massive insider payouts, congressional bribes, and corruption.
- Creeping from socialism towards communism.

In short, president Obama, like many of us, thought that massive amounts of change were needed. He lost his soul as an American, not listening to his conscience. I say he wasn't listening to his conscience because it is impossible to misunderstand or misconstrue that which is a self evident and unalienable truth.
As our Founding Fathers altered events ever so slightly building on a foundation already established by our ancestors, a chaotic president Obama is attempting to lead our nation away from the natural law it was founded on.
His action isn't just an offense to the people who have long suffered, but an offense to the Almighty.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2010, 05:06 PM
To solve the problem created by their money printing....they will print more money.....

As the people are, by nature, at a disadvantage, Tyranny needs no money. They will get what they need by passing legislation. It is the people who need money as well as need for its spending to be controlled.
Yet, by legal-precedence, any amount of money can be printed and deemed official by tyranny. But we as Americans don't have a usual tyranny ruling over us, but a "more perfect government" or, to be more precise, a "necessary tyranny." This means, in the United States anyway, that the people's Civil Purpose should always supercede the legal precedence of past traditions and any future happenings yet to occur.
Therefore, because our use of necessary tyranny will only lead to greater tyranny, counterfeit can only be stopped in regards to the people's Civil-Purose by holding those responsible to God's judgement.

parocks
01-21-2010, 05:07 PM
The United States is
40% Conservative
36% Moderate
20% Liberal

Obama didn't look at those numbers closely enough.
Obama won in 2008 because people were tired of Bush and the Republicans
and wanted a change. They didn't analyze closely Obama's policies. They just said "not Bush" and voted for Obama. Once he was elected, it was on Obama to come up with stuff that the people would support. The 80% of the people who aren't liberal don't support all the liberal stuff.

Pretty much 1994 / Clinton all over again. The Democrats always think that they're getting elected because the people want their crazy liberal schemes, but really they just are a little bit tired of the Republican for whatever reason.

It's a lot easier for the Republicans, because they have a base of 40% to work with and the Democrats only have 20%. The Republicans don't get smacked down so quick. It usually takes quite a few years of the media hammering them for the Republicans to lose favorability. The Democrats really just have to start doing what they want to do.



In short, president Obama, like many of us, thought that massive amounts of change were needed. He lost his soul as an American, not listening to his conscience. I say he wasn't listening to his conscience because it is impossible to misunderstand or misconstrue that which is a self evident and unalienable truth.
As our Founding Fathers altered events ever so slightly building on a foundation already established by our ancestors, a chaotic president Obama is attempting to lead our nation away from the natural law it was founded on.
His action isn't just an offense to the people who have long suffered, but an offense to the Almighty.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2010, 05:12 PM
Obama has been hurt badly by misinterpreting the publics rejection of the Republican party. The country was not rejecting limited government it was rejecting the phonies that said they were for limited government. But thanks to a two party system the only recourse was to stay at home and not vote or vote Democrat.

Obama seized on this as an opportunity to marshall in unconstitutional leftist extremism. He is now getting some blow back from his power grabs.....which are numerous and ruinous for our country. I really don't know what this will accomplish, we will get back Republicans, who will what increase size and the scope of government even more?

And to tell you the truth I don't think either party has a damn clue how to deal with the coming currency failures.

I agree. The "more perfect government," the "necessary tyranny," established by our Founding Fathers does not exclude either party of the two party system. It is not Democrats versus Republicans but "We the people . . . " ruled by a "necessary tyranny" for the betterment of our nation.

Minlawc
01-21-2010, 05:18 PM
Putting all his eggs in one basket. Having just one health care bill was not a good idea. Heck putting that much in one bill is never a good idea.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2010, 05:19 PM
The United States is
40% Conservative
36% Moderate
20% Liberal

Obama didn't look at those numbers closely enough.
Obama won in 2008 because people were tired of Bush and the Republicans
and wanted a change. They didn't analyze closely Obama's policies. They just said "not Bush" and voted for Obama. Once he was elected, it was on Obama to come up with stuff that the people would support. The 80% of the people who aren't liberal don't support all the liberal stuff.

Pretty much 1994 / Clinton all over again. The Democrats always think that they're getting elected because the people want their crazy liberal schemes, but really they just are a little bit tired of the Republican for whatever reason.

It's a lot easier for the Republicans, because they have a base of 40% to work with and the Democrats only have 20%. The Republicans don't get smacked down so quick. It usually takes quite a few years of the media hammering them for the Republicans to lose favorability. The Democrats really just have to start doing what they want to do.

It perplexes me how people are wrong not because they misunderstand complexity but because they don't appreciate the simple things. Look, Aristotle established the "golden mean" of politics in hopes of combating extremism and establishing a more moderate sanity.
As Europe has advanced way beyond the tyranny of ancient Greece, the United States has advanced way beyond the tyranny of Europe. So, why do we continue using Aristotle's golden mean when discussing American politics? Our nation really is unalienable or moderate when compared to European ones.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2010, 05:29 PM
Putting all his eggs in one basket. Having just one health care bill was not a good idea. Heck putting that much in one bill is never a good idea.

I really think president Obama is attacking corporations for long going beyond what is equal. Corporations have long usurped the principle of "a day's worth of pay for a day's worth of work" by inventing things like "benefits," "bonuses," and "perks."
Just what do you think the Lord meant when He referred to "workers of inequity?" He certainly wasn't refuting those who do work. He was referring to those who work at causing inequity. In a nation of "we the people," we should just have a day's worth of pay for a day's worth of work and no other type of payment. If tyrants living here don't like it, then they have a choice like going to live in Mexico where tyranny has always had the upper hand.

Aratus
01-22-2010, 08:39 AM
scott brown beams in d.c and looks aging boytoy
as barack obama reads biographies about teddy
and franklin delano roosevelt & wants to trust bust
banks and hold hearings on huge corperations...

Elwar
01-22-2010, 08:45 AM
In all reality, people wanted "change". But to everyone, that meant something else. They had Bush and his policies and they knew that they didn't like that. They voted for Obama because he pretty much promised that he would give them something that was not Bush.

Instead, he continued most of Bush's policies. He has basically changed nothing and instead of going back and dismantling Bush's mistakes, he decides to keep all of Bush's stuff in play and put all of his focus on a mystical health care plan that nobody really cares about nor do they really understand what the implications might be.

We got Obama because of Bush. But all we're seeing is Bush-lite.

klamath
01-22-2010, 09:54 AM
Pretty much everything bush did wrong Obama has made even bigger. The only thing I see about Obama is he doesn't shoot off his mouth talking smack like Bush but all his action are as bad or worse.

Lastly he may very well rally and get reelected in a landslide. Even by the end of this year he might have rallied enough to keep the status the same in congress. As can be seen from the BrownCoakey race two weeks can be a lifetime in politics.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-23-2010, 02:43 PM
scott brown beams in d.c and looks aging boytoy
as barack obama reads biographies about teddy
and franklin delano roosevelt & wants to trust bust
banks and hold hearings on huge corperations...

How is a bank never a part of the government? Those who run it know that they run a business that has a special exemption beyond the typical free enterprise. During the Great Depression the government had a choice of bailing out the banks or bailing out the farmers. Since the banks are part of the "necessary tyranny" set up to rule over the people, they bailed them out. Come on. Think about it. This is why bank executives shouldn't be paid bonuses. They work for an aristocracy set up by the government.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-23-2010, 02:48 PM
In all reality, people wanted "change". But to everyone, that meant something else. They had Bush and his policies and they knew that they didn't like that. They voted for Obama because he pretty much promised that he would give them something that was not Bush.

Instead, he continued most of Bush's policies. He has basically changed nothing and instead of going back and dismantling Bush's mistakes, he decides to keep all of Bush's stuff in play and put all of his focus on a mystical health care plan that nobody really cares about nor do they really understand what the implications might be.

We got Obama because of Bush. But all we're seeing is Bush-lite.

Gee. It isn't like our ancestors died for nothing. They lived, worked, and pained to leave us with an inheritance. It is still there for us. We just need to revere what they left us and wisely add onto it by the slightest of tweaking so that future generations might also enjoy a "good life."

surf
01-23-2010, 02:51 PM
In all reality, people wanted "change". But to everyone, that meant something else. They had Bush and his policies and they knew that they didn't like that. They voted for Obama because he pretty much promised that he would give them something that was not Bush.

Instead, he continued most of Bush's policies. He has basically changed nothing and instead of going back and dismantling Bush's mistakes, he decides to keep all of Bush's stuff in play and put all of his focus on a mystical health care plan that nobody really cares about nor do they really understand what the implications might be.

We got Obama because of Bush. But all we're seeing is Bush-lite.

bingo. if King O is one-termer it will be because the Rs find a candidate that can convince people that he/she is the "change" candidate. we are in a vicious circle here - that is unless we can effectively find a libertarian candidate that can win.

squarepusher
01-23-2010, 02:55 PM
Obama may not be popular now, but the election isn't for 3 years nearly, so it doesn't matter if he is popular or not.

Expect his ratings to go up somehow near his reelection time.

-squarepusher

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-23-2010, 02:58 PM
Pretty much everything bush did wrong Obama has made even bigger. The only thing I see about Obama is he doesn't shoot off his mouth talking smack like Bush but all his action are as bad or worse.

Lastly he may very well rally and get reelected in a landslide. Even by the end of this year he might have rallied enough to keep the status the same in congress. As can be seen from the BrownCoakey race two weeks can be a lifetime in politics.

Dorothy (the lowly and the meek) was misled into thinking she had to travel to the Wizard of Oz (Washington) to solve her problems. However, tTo deal with the Wizard, she had to go to war and kill the enemy (the wicked witch). In the end, though, Dorothy's real solution was on the local level back in munchkin land (we the people . . .). Still, if Dorothy hadn't gone on her adventure, she wouldn't have met her three friends, the scarecrow (no education), the tin man (no conscience), and the lion (no courage).
And what about the dog Totto (who represents a dog)?

BlackTerrel
01-23-2010, 03:56 PM
but what hurt him the most was instilling a belief in the electorate that voting for him would allow him to wave a wand that would end all of the systemic problems inherent in government.

I agree with this.

Even if President Ron Paul were elected we would be in deep shit right now economically. You can't just make a couple changes and boom everything is better - nothing is ever that easy.

I would probably even argue that with President Ron Paul we would be in a worse situation RIGHT NOW. The difference is Obama is trying to delay the pain, which will make it that much worse when the shit really hits the fan. Paul would give us pain now, but fix the system. It would be a one time pain followed by a recovery. We need that pain, but let's not be naive - it is going to suck for a lot of people.

And that doesn't play well with an electorate that wants now now now.