Should Liberty Advocates actively SEEK POWER?

[MN Patriot]

What is the best approach to ending oppression and advancing individual liberty?

G. Edward Griffin has a video that has been posted several times in other threads. Griffin argues that libertarians must become politically active, to seek power by getting elected to office and taking control of the institutions that control society. The link to his video An Idea Whose Time has Come is here: http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/ along with other information about his organization Freedom Force International.

Do you agree with him? Or do you think seeking power is inherently bad? Or is power irrelevant?


Actively engage in the political process by seeking power.
Tyrants actively seek power, and cannot be persuaded to change. Those of us who value freedom must become active in the political system, vote out the tyrants so we can change government for the better. BUT, we still must be eternally vigilant so we aren't corrupted by power ourselves.
Avoid politics and try to advance the ideas and principles of liberty.
Anyone who seeks power can't be trusted. Everyone knows power corrupts. We need to shun power and peacefully change people's minds about the nature of government. When enough people support freedom, government will be changed.
There is another approach that has nothing to do with power.
There are other ways of advancing freedom.


Vote and post your ideas about this topic.

[Lovecraftian4Paul]

I choose the first option. I don't think a purely grassroots effort to win hearts and minds would be successful against a blizzard of tyrannical legislation and propaganda via mass media. Liberty advocates must seek power, even if it is strictly confined to the lowliest tiers of local government.

[MN Patriot]

Did anybody watch the video by Griffin? Do we need to challenge the taboo against power, so that more of us get involved in politics?

[BuddyRey]

Power over oneself, yes. Power over others, no. And this is probably the only point on which Griffin and I disagree.

Power, however virtuous the people are who hold it at first, will always and inevitably move into the hands of people of the lowest possible virtue.

[LibertyEagle]

You cannot dismantle that which you find distasteful, unless you get in a position from which to do so.

[silverhandorder]

I choose 1 and 3. I respect both people who work outside the system and people who work inside the system. As long as you are principled and don't want to rule over me I will support you and work with you.

I voted option one on the poll.

[Romulus]

Power over oneself, yes. Power over others, no. And this is probably the only point on which Griffin and I disagree.

Power, however virtuous the people are who hold it at first, will always and inevitably move into the hands of people of the lowest possible virtue.

I disagree. Griffin is right on the money. The great thing about liberty candidates is that they (are supposed to) serve humanity. I have good faith that anyone with the ideals of a libertarian will be pretty much prone to corruption. RP and many others here reinforce that belief.

[Stary Hickory]

At this point seeking office is merely practicing self defense. Even Libertarians understand the value of self defense.

[Ethek]

Good to see a semi solid, consensus here. A philosophy of liberty has the concept that you have the right to persuade others to voluntarily help with your protection.

The Key from Griffins concepts is that there is a framework, even in the absence of a working constitution, that guarantees everyone's rights under natural law. Griffin goes so far as to say that this 'creed' be recited out-loud to anyone who is participating in a function associated with those principles.

It garantees nothing. All liberty organizations will seek power and influence for themselves. My take is that there should be an independent auditor that looks for a series of best practices (to be determined) to organizations proclaiming to promote freedom... like the ISO 9000 process. Any group at any point is vulnerable to being co-opted by an agenda no true to Grifins creed unless that creed is front and center in everyones mind and way of doing business.

I support Griffins work.

[Travlyr]

You cannot dismantle that which you find distasteful, unless you get in a position from which to do so.

Who will be powerful enough to put an end to socialism? It is a gargantuan task.

[torchbearer]

You cannot dismantle that which you find distasteful, unless you get in a position from which to do so.

like it.
those without power cannot defend freedom.

[Elwar]

Seek power so that you can get rid of that power.

Run for an office that your first act in that office will be to dissolve that position.

[squarepusher]

seeking power -> getting elected -> winning peoples votes -> compromise


So, maybe you could pretend to think one way to get elected, then act how you really feel once you are elected.

[MelissaWV]

Power over others is going to exist for a long, long time in the systems we have in place.

1.) You could win hearts and minds, but so long as someone who disagrees with you is in power, they potentially have the power to silence you, and demand many of those hearts and minds back. At the very least, power allows one to interject various other issues into the lives of those people you were trying to reach. Theories and discussion are great, but people want to eat and have shelter, and can't always see the longterm view.

2.) Climb into power, and at least block the position from someone who'll abuse it. No one said you have to use your power. In fact, repealing a whole bunch of laws might be worse for the longterm, because if something goes wrong, the pendulum will swing. Hard. Right now it tends to swing between home and abroad (or the perception of it). Programs abroad are failing? Then we shall spend at home. Those fail? Then we should spend on the military (abroad). Back, forth. Democrat, Republican. More and more debt. Imagine if someone could just stop NEW idiotic programs? It's a start. THEN work on getting rid of the crap we already have. THAT is the rough stuff.

[SevenEyedJeff]

There are alternatives to power.

This reminds me of advice from a great man, Obi-Wan Kenobi.

[Bucjason]

Let's stage a Coup-d'etat instead....

[MN Patriot]

Thanks for your thoughtful comments. I was surprised to see the poll results. Unless someone deleted their cookies and voted multiple times, it looks like people here are solidly behind the idea of seeking power to promote freedom.

The Campaign for Liberty is a good organization to start the revolution, I'm sure there are others. Griffin's Freedom Force International looks like a good one. Action is the key. Political campaigns probably do more for us to promote freedom than blogs and forums.

Ultimately there are no guarantees about anything; eternal vigilance is needed to keep tyrants at bay.