I have a very bad feeling.....

[BLS]

Call me crazy...

But today ALONE I have had numerous people in my meetup (supposed Leaders) try to dissuade me from helping in a GOP Convention by bringing in a local news crew to cover us during this. (I know the reporter personally).

Not to mention that these two 'leaders' have tried to get us to not do the "paint the town Ron" event, even calling it a 'waste' or just 'fun'.

We put out over 300 signs in one night. 90% were gone BEFORE RUSH HOUR TRAFFIC. How do 250+ signs get removed on a Sunday night/Monday morning before Rush hour when all the signs were posted after midnight on a rainy night.
It was a terrible, terrible night. Everybody was wet, tired and sick after doing it.

Now today I have posted a video about Ron Paul's 5 Million...
And I have 10x as many replies as I have EVER had. Most negative...saying the music is dumb, etc.

Maybe the music is too loud...maybe it's not their choice.
But hey, it's my video. Regardless, I've NEVER had 6 pages of replies before on any video I've done.

This coupled with the meetup 'leaders' dissuading us from doing stuff is starting to make me REALLY wonder.

Have we been infested with moles?? Is it possible it's a grand plan, put into place LONG ago?

I'm not a 9/11 truther...I'm not a conspiracy guy.
But I can't deny the wall I just ran into....all right after Ron raised a ton of money.

Thoughts??

[JosephTheLibertarian]

who are these people? kick them out

[Paul4Prez]

I think people just have different ideas about the best way to help. Do it your way, and don't get discouraged.

There has been a noticeable uptick in anti-Ron Paul posting on YouTube and elsewhere. It just means the neocons and uber-liberals are worried about him now.

[born2drv]

why don't you tell them you're going to put up some more signs and do it... and watch from a distance to see what happens?

then if it's them beat their ass!!! :)

[BLS]

I can't get into it....one of them posts here.

[McDermit]

I wouldn't doubt it.

HQ wants us to keep making banners. TONS of banners. A staffer even gave us stencils just over 24 hours ago. Your "leaders" are dead wrong.

And question.. are your group leaders involved with Ron Paul Friends USA or any other group?

[OptionsTrader]

Maybe your video just sucked.

Don't take it personally :D

[JosephTheLibertarian]

Only pussies resort to being moles

[thomaspaine23]

BLS,

the beauty of liberty, do your own thing. Find another meetup group or start another one. My only advice would be to think before you act, and to ask yourself if the good doctor would be PROUD of your actions.

[orenbus]

The Leaders probably just have different ideas on strategy. For a period of time some people that will rename nameless from the official campaign had told us to stop the revolution banners, however off the record have said they love it and we should continue. Think about it this way, the new slim jim uses the word revolution in the copy and has images of the banners all over. Of course the campaign will never tell us directly to do them, if anything they will say don't *wink* *wink*, but some will take it literal and for some people thats fine for others they will do something else and thats also fine.

Everyone needs to play to their strengths, there will be alot of differing competing voices but all in all in the end it makes us stronger, we can fight the same battle using different tactics, strategy and approaches using our talents and skills.

It's all good BLS, for ever mole there is 10,000 Ron Paul supporters that have different ideas on what to do. Together tho we will overcome, and win! :D

[BLS]

What I will tell you is that one of our members is a very well connected, and well organized grassroots 'pro' if you will.

She seems very intelligent and really knows her stuff..so I am struggling trying to understand what the F is going on. She has since been promoted to actually work for the campaign, so she cannot be involved in the grassroots stuff.

Her and another guy seem to be the only 2 on one page which is 'pass out slim jims', 'don't do the signs, they are a waste of time', etc.

And it's even gotten to the point where I called this guy out tonight.
email wars ensued, and now with the youtube video comments that are insane, I'm starting to worry the 'switch has been flipped' and it's full blown 'anti Ron' time, and I'm not sure who to trust.

[BLS]

Maybe your video just sucked.

Don't take it personally :D

Maybe it did. But 822 views and over 80 comments is WAY more than I've ever gotten.

[Man from La Mancha]

I like the idea of setting a trap for the moles. Don't tell any body in your group about, just use some trusted friends to watch. Some one had to be following you as the signs went up.

.

[UCFGavin]

I'm not sure who to trust.

trust yourself and others like you. if you need to disassociate yourself with your meetup, then fuck them. you guys do your own thing. the passion you guys have should not be stopped by some stuffy "leader".

you're a good american doing what you can for our country, don't stop because of them.

[McDermit]

Yeeeep. Do a banner blitz again ASAP. Promote it through the meetup, and then get some people to keep an eye out to see who is taking your signs down.

[ctb619]

I like the idea of setting a trap for the moles. Don't tell any body in your group about, just use some trusted friends to watch. Some one had to be following you as the signs went up.

.

I love this idea....get some countersurveillance up

[lucius]

Call me crazy...

But today ALONE I have had numerous people in my meetup (supposed Leaders) try to dissuade me from helping in a GOP Convention by bringing in a local news crew to cover us during this. (I know the reporter personally).

Not to mention that these two 'leaders' have tried to get us to not do the "paint the town Ron" event, even calling it a 'waste' or just 'fun'.

We put out over 300 signs in one night. 90% were gone BEFORE RUSH HOUR TRAFFIC. How do 250+ signs get removed on a Sunday night/Monday morning before Rush hour when all the signs were posted after midnight on a rainy night.
It was a terrible, terrible night. Everybody was wet, tired and sick after doing it.

Now today I have posted a video about Ron Paul's 5 Million...
And I have 10x as many replies as I have EVER had. Most negative...saying the music is dumb, etc.

Maybe the music is too loud...maybe it's not their choice.
But hey, it's my video. Regardless, I've NEVER had 6 pages of replies before on any video I've done.

This coupled with the meetup 'leaders' dissuading us from doing stuff is starting to make me REALLY wonder.

Have we been infested with moles?? Is it possible it's a grand plan, put into place LONG ago?

I'm not a 9/11 truther...I'm not a conspiracy guy.
But I can't deny the wall I just ran into....all right after Ron raised a ton of money.

Thoughts??

Keep doing what you are doing; it is your revolution! Sorry to hear about the signs, much work. :(

[NewEnd]

I love this idea....get some countersurveillance up
sounds like it.

but dont tell anyone in the group, or assign anyone.

Instead, ask a friend, or kid, pay him 50 bucks to patrol.... or do it yourself

of course, bring a camera

[McDermit]

The whole paranoia factor sucks. But go with your gut. No harm in running a little counter surveillance op.

[Lord Xar]

I suspect my meetup has some moles... They tried early on to disrupt things... but it was stomped out immediately..

I have a question for you..

WHAT HAVE YOUR MEETUP LEADERS coordinated?

[TheIndependent]

Call me crazy...

But today ALONE I have had numerous people in my meetup (supposed Leaders) try to dissuade me from helping in a GOP Convention by bringing in a local news crew to cover us during this. (I know the reporter personally).

Not to mention that these two 'leaders' have tried to get us to not do the "paint the town Ron" event, even calling it a 'waste' or just 'fun'.

We put out over 300 signs in one night. 90% were gone BEFORE RUSH HOUR TRAFFIC. How do 250+ signs get removed on a Sunday night/Monday morning before Rush hour when all the signs were posted after midnight on a rainy night.
It was a terrible, terrible night. Everybody was wet, tired and sick after doing it.

Now today I have posted a video about Ron Paul's 5 Million...
And I have 10x as many replies as I have EVER had. Most negative...saying the music is dumb, etc.

Maybe the music is too loud...maybe it's not their choice.
But hey, it's my video. Regardless, I've NEVER had 6 pages of replies before on any video I've done.

This coupled with the meetup 'leaders' dissuading us from doing stuff is starting to make me REALLY wonder.

Have we been infested with moles?? Is it possible it's a grand plan, put into place LONG ago?

I'm not a 9/11 truther...I'm not a conspiracy guy.
But I can't deny the wall I just ran into....all right after Ron raised a ton of money.

Thoughts??

Did the patriots in the beginning of the U.S. give up to the British? No. We fought. We won. Keep it up, and don't ever feel like you have to stop.

Learn from mistakes and improve yourself for the next go-around.

[McDermit]

What's with people using aliases for Ron Paul campaign related activities?

On a forum, fine. I don't want some of the assanine shit I say online attributed to me. But I certainly donate using my real name. And I use my real name on meetup, and for any communications with the campaign.

[mdh]

Who cares if these guys post here? All the more reason to call them out in public if they *can* answer for their actions in public. I assume you're talking about meetup #55, since we all know Marianne works for the campaign now, yadda yadda...

Why don't you tell us a little more about who specifically said what, and we can ask them to address why in this forum which will provide transparency - if they are moles, they will be afraid of transparency and will become offensively over-defensive right off the bat, or will refuse to cooperate. If they are not, they will not, and will want to continue in a spirit of cooperation.

You said they tried to dissuade you, etc - but didn't say what reasons they gave as to why.

[Drknows]

Call me crazy...


We put out over 300 signs in one night. 90% were gone BEFORE RUSH HOUR TRAFFIC. How do 250+ signs get removed on a Sunday night/Monday morning before Rush hour when all the signs were posted after midnight on a rainy night.
It was a terrible, terrible night. Everybody was wet, tired and sick after doing it.



Sunday night 300 signs were taking down?!?!?! Yeah you have someone bad amongst you. I wouldnt start accusing people but you should do some investigating.

[LibertyEagle]

What I will tell you is that one of our members is a very well connected, and well organized grassroots 'pro' if you will.

She seems very intelligent and really knows her stuff..so I am struggling trying to understand what the F is going on. She has since been promoted to actually work for the campaign, so she cannot be involved in the grassroots stuff.

Her and another guy seem to be the only 2 on one page which is 'pass out slim jims', 'don't do the signs, they are a waste of time', etc.

And it's even gotten to the point where I called this guy out tonight.
email wars ensued, and now with the youtube video comments that are insane, I'm starting to worry the 'switch has been flipped' and it's full blown 'anti Ron' time, and I'm not sure who to trust.

I think I know one of the people you are referring to. I worked on some ads with her and she is no mole. This is probably only a difference in opinion of what is the best strategy to get the word out, BLS.

I am another person who thinks signs are good, but believes we had better do a lot more of getting campaign literature into the hands of people. The reason I think that is that it seems people are willing to hang signs, but very few seem to be willing to hand out campaign literature, or attend events such as gun shows. See, here's the thing, BLS, I don't think people are going to vote for someone just because they saw a few signs with Ron Paul on it. Even if they saw a ton of such signs. So, while I think signs are important, I think it's critical that we do more than that and get more information about his message, into people's hands.

But, that's just my personal opinion. To each their own.

[CodeMonkey]

My group put up over 400 signs last Saturday night and a good number of them were removed on Sunday morning... now you know it wasn't city workers driving around Sunday morning picking up signs...

There may be moles, or random people driving by who hate Ron Paul's message enough to stop and take the signs down. On Monday morning even more of our signs were gone but I think that had a lot to do with businesses not wanting them in front of their store/office.

I've got a mixed feeling about the signs at this point. We still need name recognition but the signs consume a lot of time and they disappear so quickly I'm not sure if they're worth the effort. Plus, as much as we'd like them to, most people who see the signs aren't going to go home and look into the details of Ron's platform. I'm starting to think distributing more in-depth literature would be a lot more effective use of time (leafleting, door-to-door, direct mailings, etc).

[deedles]

We do overpass signs and banner holds. We don't post signs. I like having humans with the banners in high traffic areas, that way we can talk to people when they are interested in our message.

I'm a meetup organizer. Even if I may not think a particular effort is the best, I would never dissuade a member of my meetup from getting out there, as long as they aren't doing something illegal.

I say take action! Be visible! Get out there!

[Pedro TT]

We've had a couple of kooks at our meetup group with underlying ambitions. (mainly the reason I no longer attend them)

[FluffyUnbound]

My group put up over 400 signs last Saturday night and a good number of them were removed on Sunday morning... now you know it wasn't city workers driving around Sunday morning picking up signs...

There may be moles, or random people driving by who hate Ron Paul's message enough to stop and take the signs down. On Monday morning even more of our signs were gone but I think that had a lot to do with businesses not wanting them in front of their store/office.

I've got a mixed feeling about the signs at this point. We still need name recognition but the signs consume a lot of time and they disappear so quickly I'm not sure if they're worth the effort. Plus, as much as we'd like them to, most people who see the signs aren't going to go home and look into the details of Ron's platform. I'm starting to think distributing more in-depth literature would be a lot more effective use of time (leafleting, door-to-door, direct mailings, etc).

The signs coming down could have been ONE cop with nothing to do, depending on the part of the country you're in. During the really lonely hours around here, the staties drive around looking for disabled motorists and/or drunks. That activity probably would take them to the very roads you'd want to put signs up on. As the video from Green Bay and the written reports from other areas show, some cops are real sticklers about signs going up on the roadside, or even being held on overpasses.

With regard to the video thing, as the Paul movement gets bigger the "range" of tastes and outlooks will also get bigger. Some people will like what you do, some people will like something else. For example, I'm in the northeast. When people up here hear some of the more "country and western" Ron Paul songs, they wrinkle their nose and say, "That's so hokey!" But then when they hear the reggae song with Ron Paul speaking in the background, they say, "That's cool!" I'll bet there are parts of Texas where you'd get the reverse reaction from most people. There's no right or wrong answer for taste.

[Original_Intent]

I watched your video and gave it 5 stars and favorited it.

(The music did make it hard to hear the dialog though :D )

[BillyDkid]

I have always said and still believe that "they" will do anything to stop us. Of course they will infiltrate and of course they will try to undermine. They do in here and I'm sure they have joined meetup groups specifically to cause problems.

[max]

Call me crazy...

But today ALONE I have had numerous people in my meetup (supposed Leaders) try to dissuade me from helping in a GOP Convention by bringing in a local news crew to cover us during this. (I know the reporter personally).

Not to mention that these two 'leaders' have tried to get us to not do the "paint the town Ron" event, even calling it a 'waste' or just 'fun'.

We put out over 300 signs in one night. 90% were gone BEFORE RUSH HOUR TRAFFIC. How do 250+ signs get removed on a Sunday night/Monday morning before Rush hour when all the signs were posted after midnight on a rainy night.
It was a terrible, terrible night. Everybody was wet, tired and sick after doing it.

Now today I have posted a video about Ron Paul's 5 Million...
And I have 10x as many replies as I have EVER had. Most negative...saying the music is dumb, etc.

Maybe the music is too loud...maybe it's not their choice.
But hey, it's my video. Regardless, I've NEVER had 6 pages of replies before on any video I've done.

This coupled with the meetup 'leaders' dissuading us from doing stuff is starting to make me REALLY wonder.

Have we been infested with moles?? Is it possible it's a grand plan, put into place LONG ago?

I'm not a 9/11 truther...I'm not a conspiracy guy.
But I can't deny the wall I just ran into....all right after Ron raised a ton of money.

Thoughts??

if your meetup group is anyway affiliated with clifton coalition or dr. stevens....i suspect they are infiltrators...

i cant imagine anyone being opposed to sign hanging....

break away with some like minded members and do your own thing...

i know we have been infiltrated

[LibertyEagle]

I am sure we have moles, but for any of you guys to think that Marianne is a mole, is pure craziness. She has done more to promote Ron Paul than just about anyone in this campaign!

I worked with her on creating the grassroots ads we ran in Iowa. There were 3 of us. Many times we worked well into the night.

I will stake my reputation on this fact. She is not a mole. If you still question this, I suggest you talk to Lord Xar, or to Marianne directly.

[LibertyEagle]

if your meetup group is anyway affiliated with clifton coalition or dr. stevens....i suspect they are infiltrators...

i cant imagine anyone being opposed to sign hanging....

break away with some like minded members and do your own thing...

i know we have been infiltrated

Max, I'm sorry, but you also thought Anita was some kind of infiltrator, didn't you?

I am sure we have some, but before you guys start throwing darts, please do a little checking on your own.

I am shocked that any of you could possibly think Scribbler is a mole. Many of you have worked shoulder-to-shoulder with her in Iowa. How on earth could you think she was anything but a dedicated supporter?

Please stop this crap. It will tear us apart.

[Chester Copperpot]

Is Scribbler affiliated with the Clifton Coalition?

[LibertyEagle]

Is Scribbler affiliated with the Clifton Coalition?

NO. And recently she was asked by the campaign to be the Minnesota campaign coordinator.

I cannot BELIEVE you guys. :(

[mdh]

I am sure we have some, but before you guys start throwing darts, please do a little checking on your own.

I am shocked that any of you could possibly think Scribbler is a mole. Many of you have worked shoulder-to-shoulder with her in Iowa. How on earth could you think she was anything but a dedicated supporter?

Errr, no one made specific accusations. Marianne's name only came up because I was pointing out that the OP was referring to group #55 because he said one of the leaders went on to work for the campaign, which would obviously be Marianne, etc...

Anyways, the owner of that group is Corey Stern, and he's not a mole either (he's the liberty cards guy, and he's been around the liberty movement and the LP before this campaign).

Could some of the other leadership be moles? Well, I don't know them, so it's possible. I asked the OP for more information regarding just who said just what, but no response there yet, so it's hard to say any more...

[LibertyEagle]

What I will tell you is that one of our members is a very well connected, and well organized grassroots 'pro' if you will.

She seems very intelligent and really knows her stuff..so I am struggling trying to understand what the F is going on. She has since been promoted to actually work for the campaign, so she cannot be involved in the grassroots stuff.

Her and another guy seem to be the only 2 on one page which is 'pass out slim jims', 'don't do the signs, they are a waste of time', etc.

And it's even gotten to the point where I called this guy out tonight.
email wars ensued, and now with the youtube video comments that are insane, I'm starting to worry the 'switch has been flipped' and it's full blown 'anti Ron' time, and I'm not sure who to trust.


Well, I guess I'm a mole too then. Because I too think that instead of spending all our time hanging signs, we need to rapidly start getting campaign literature distributed. This is why. No one is going to vote for someone, because they saw his name on a banner. It's good for name recognition, but that is it. This was critical in the early going and still needs to be done. But, instead of putting all our effort on making and hanging signs, we need to go to Phase 2 and start getting more information out there. They need to get more information about his stances on the issues, don't you think? Many on here seem to think that everyone will just go look him up on the internet, if they see his name. Some will and some will not. Even QuickMike has told you that and has run into plenty that have seen the signs, but don't even know that Paul is running for President of the United States. Is he a mole too in your eyes? What about those people who don't even use the internet? I know you may think they don't exist, but you are wrong. There are plenty of people who do not and even others who only use it to check their emails. Do we just write-off these people? Because if we don't do something to get out INFORMATION about him, that is exactly what we are doing. Think about it.

Get real, people. We assuredly have some moles. But, just because they think we need to do something besides hang frickin' signs, does not make them a mole.

[Chester Copperpot]

Its real simple.. the people that are motivated to hang signs, well let them hang signs... The people who are motivated to hand out literature..; hand out literature.. do it all people.. no reason to fight over it... Hit the opposition EVERYWHERE

[Chester Copperpot]

What the signs ARE good for.. is when people see him on TV, on a debate or in the news.. they say"Ron Paul.. yeah Ive heard of him before....." or "Ive seen his signs.."

The literature works right now.. the signs work too it just takes longer for people to sink in.. but we need them both no doubt

[reduen]

I am certainly no mole and I believe that the signs projects everyone has been doing is a waste of time and money. (Not to mention illegal.)

I decided not to participate in my local meetup groups sign thing, simply because it is illegal. If we are willing to break the law for our cause, then what makes us any different than our current government?

In fact I started my own meetup and I intend to just invite people to see some of Dr. Pauls speeches that I have taped, hand them some literature and let them make up their own mind.. :)

[LibertyEagle]

Errr, no one made specific accusations. Marianne's name only came up because I was pointing out that the OP was referring to group #55 because he said one of the leaders went on to work for the campaign, which would obviously be Marianne, etc...

Anyways, the owner of that group is Corey Stern, and he's not a mole either (he's the liberty cards guy, and he's been around the liberty movement and the LP before this campaign).

Could some of the other leadership be moles? Well, I don't know them, so it's possible. I asked the OP for more information regarding just who said just what, but no response there yet, so it's hard to say any more...

You mentioned her name, but it was obvious who he was talking about from what he already said.

[LibertyEagle]

Its real simple.. the people that are motivated to hang signs, well let them hang signs... The people who are motivated to hand out literature..; hand out literature.. do it all people.. no reason to fight over it... Hit the opposition EVERYWHERE

Agreed. But, we need to do BOTH. And to this point, the vast majority of what has been done is only to hang signs. Please don't get me wrong. Signs are great. I'm just suggesting that we have to do the other too.

[nullvalu]

Its real simple.. the people that are motivated to hang signs, well let them hang signs... The people who are motivated to hand out literature..; hand out literature.. do it all people.. no reason to fight over it... Hit the opposition EVERYWHERE

I agree whole-heartidly.. Do what you feel is best for you and the region you live in.. This campaign has been successful for only one reason.. us.. the grassroots supporters.. We must have been doing something right.. Don't let someone else tell you what to do, tyranny is what we're fighting against..

[LibertyEagle]

I agree whole-heartidly.. Do what you feel is best for you and the region you live in.. This campaign has been successful for only one reason.. us.. the grassroots supporters.. We must have been doing something right.. Don't let someone else tell you what to do, tyranny is what we're fighting against..

Yeah, that 2% is hard to beat. I'm not so sure that it is enough to win the nomination though.

[erowe1]

these two 'leaders' have tried to get us to not do the "paint the town Ron" event, even calling it a 'waste' or just 'fun'.

We put out over 300 signs in one night. 90% were gone BEFORE RUSH HOUR TRAFFIC.

Wow. Looks like those 2 leaders were right. It was a waste of time.

[nullvalu]

Yeah, that 2% is hard to beat.

Ouch..

[erowe1]

Excuse the following very long post. This is copied and pasted from something someone in our Meetup group sent all of us. It originally comes from a person involved in the Republican Liberty Caucus. I think the ideas it contains are very germane to the issue of the effectiveness of posting signs on light poles, etc.--long story short it's not effective.


We don't need to debate the most effective means of campaigning and use of our scarce volunteer & financial resources. Political science is a, well... *science*... with principles which have been proven through years of experience with winning (and losing) elections. - Campaign yard signs on public roads are much less effective than yard signs posted by home owners. (People tend to be most influenced by their friends and neighbors.) I would hold off on any mass distribution of yard signs along public highways until shortly before the election (when they are helpful for boosting name ID among theretofore disengaged voters). Meanwhile, we should try to get a yard sign in the yard of every Ron Paul supporter... And better still, a large sign on the property of every supporter with land near a heavily traveled highway. - What goes for yard signs also goes for bumper stickers. (Peer pressure works!)- Letters to the editor and calling in to C-Span & radio talk shows are both cost-effective tactics. Keep it up!- Radio and especially newspaper advertising are much less cost effective and are generally utilized only by campaigns with excess cash or in specific, well-targeted cases. Any money we may be tempted to spend on such advertising should be contributed directly to the campaign for them to spend, perhaps, on such advertising in places like Cedar Rapids, IA and Concord, NH where it might actually be worthwhile. If you've already reached the $4600 per person contribution limit ($2300 to be returned to you if Ron doesn't win the nomination), maxed out on contributions to friendly PACs, etc., *then* you might consider directly paying for advertising for Ron in an early primary state. - The most effective campaign tactic is one-on-one contact, e.g., door-to-door drives and chance conversations. Wear your Ron Paul button everywhere to stimulate such conversations. Go to every GOP and other conservative organization meeting you can find (where you can be assured of meeting a high concentration of "likely GOP primary voters", experienced campaigners, and financial contributors) to spark such conversations and demonstrate that Ron's support is real. Go consistently and become a *peer* of the GOP rank and file. (Peer-influence works!) The ideal door-to-door drive would be to push the doorbell and meet with every voter on a "likely GOP primary voter" walk list. In a state-wide or even Congressional district-wide race, this is impractical, so substitute a "literature drop" door-to-door drive instead -- again, preferably with a likely GOP voter walk list. Our "slim-jim" cards are ideal for this, but they should be augmented with mail-in volunteer sign-up cards which solicit addresses, e-mail addresses, and contributions and which include "interested in helping with..." check off boxes. Your personal campaign business card or a Meetup group business card (hand signed with a personal note such as "Sorry I missed you!") would also be good to include in that it suggests that it is a neighbor who is providing the information rather than an impersonal campaign worker. A well-tuned door-to-door campaign would coordinate the door-to-door contact with a series of carefully timed contacts through other means, e.g., follow-up "thank you" phone calls, mailed campaign literature, timely placement of a yard sign for anyone volunteering to have one placed on their yard, etc. Evidence shows that some people are more influenced by emotive persuasion whereas others are more influenced by factual arguments. Libertarians (little "L") are disproportionately in the latter group. Unfortunately, most voters are in the former. Therefore, it is imperative that we recognize this and learn to *listen* and appeal to voters in the appropriate way. In any one-on-one contact:-- *Listen* more than talk-- Smile (A simple thing but amazingly effective!)-- Dress appropriately-- Avoid mentioning Ron's opponents by name-- Try to stick to Ron's personal qualities [e.g., integrity, commitment to freedom and constitutional government, *consistent* adherence to *traditional* GOP values (e.g., as evidenced by the fact that he was one of only four U.S. congressmen to have endorsed Ronald Reagan in 1976), and the fact that he has returned a portion of his congressional office budget to the taxpayer every year, has never taken a tax payer-funded junket, and has not enrolled in the congressional retirement program] -- Offer quantitative evidence of Ron's *electibility* (e.g., his amazing performance in straw polls and post-debate polls, his cash-on-hand ranking, his appeal to the all-important swing voter, his dominance of the YouTube & Meetup, etc.)-- Avoid any reference to his appeal to some Democrats, at least around Republicans.-- **Don't** debate issues (after listening, dwell on areas of agreement rather than disagreement)-- To the extent that issues must be mentioned, emphasize *positive* ones (e.g., pro-Freedom, pro-Constitutionalism, pro-tax cuts, pro-free enterprise, pro-individual, pro-"*Traditional* Republican values") -- Avoid *negative* issues (e.g., anti-government, anti-war, anti-Federal Reserve, anti-NAU)-- Try to avoid divisive issues within the GOP (e.g., abortion, immigration, War in Iraq)-- Avoid non-mainstream issues (e.g., the gold standard, the federal reserve, the NAU)-- Prefer quantitative statements over qualitative statements (e.g., "Ron has *never* been ranked less than *3rd* in the National Taxpayers Union's annual rating of congressmen." is better than "Ron believes in lower taxes and limiting government spending.") -- Offer any prospective volunteer identified a range of opportunities to assist the campaign including some that are just fun and social. Give them something to so soon.-- Follow up *any* tangible volunteer or financial support with repeated "thank you" contacts.Again, *listening* is more important than talking... Classic psychological studies on persuasion have shown that peoples' opinions are most influenced by people whose views are only slightly differing from their own. For illustration, if you encounter someone whose views on some issue would be a "4" on a scale of 0 to 10 and you are a "10", present yourself as a "5" on that issue to nudge that person in your direction. Presenting yourself as a "10" will actually push the person the other way. (If inviting newbies to a Meetup group, *make sure* your Meetup group conveys a friendly, positive, mainstream Republican image!) In another classic psychology study on perceived credibility, it was found that in a group setting, the person who speaks most is perceived negatively. It is the person who speaks second most who is perceived as the most authoritative. Again... *Listen*, smile, make friends, set aside your personal pet issues, and be an effective representative for Ron. Ron's campaign includes many long-time GOP veterans with invaluable experience with *winning* elections. Let's use it! Jeff Palmer - jap1@peoplepc.com Republican Liberty Caucus - www.rlc.org "Pursuing libertarianism within the GOP since 1990"* * *

[mdh]

Yeah, that 2% is hard to beat. I'm not so sure that it is enough to win the nomination though.

Don't tell us you honestly believe these bogus 2% stats........

Those polls that give us 2% neglect to count what amounts to the vast majority of Ron Paul supporters. People who were not Republicans before, or who have never voted at all or not voted in a very long time. If we do not get those people, we will not win. We have 0% chance to win the primary by way of past Republicans alone.

[LibertyEagle]

Don't tell us you honestly believe these bogus 2% stats........

Those polls that give us 2% neglect to count what amounts to the vast majority of Ron Paul supporters. People who were not Republicans before, or who have never voted at all or not voted in a very long time. If we do not get those people, we will not win. We have 0% chance to win the primary by way of past Republicans alone.

No, but we're sure as hell not winning. We all know that, or should. I'll say this yet again. Run your own poll. Go to the mall, the coffee shop, wherever and ask 20 people (that you don't know) if they know who Ron Paul is. You will have your answer. I have done this several times and the result was not pretty. Suffice it to say, we have a hell of a lot of work to do and it's going to take much more than just hanging banners.

[nullvalu]

No, but we're sure as hell not winning. We all know that, or should. I'll say this yet again. Run your own poll. Go to the mall, the coffee shop, wherever and ask 20 people (that you don't know) if they know who Ron Paul is. You will have your answer. I have done this several times and the result was not pretty. Suffice it to say, we have a hell of a lot of work to do and it's going to take much more than hanging banners.

Well, to be honest that's not a good way to judge our chances, since many people don't vote and especially not in the primaries.. That's basically a name recognition poll..

[mdh]

No, but we're sure as hell not winning. We all know that, or should. I'll say this yet again. Run your own poll. Go to the mall, the coffee shop, wherever and ask 20 people (that you don't know) if they know who Ron Paul is. You will have your answer.

Oh, I guess you guys aren't working hard enough where you're at. We're doing pretty well for name recognition here. Still lots of stupid college kids voting for Obama because they don't know any better, but even most of them know who Paul is.

Are we winning? Not yet, but it's doable. Focusing on bogus polls with bogus and downright incorrect numbers won't get us any closer. Focusing on only one demographic - the sole demographic that these polls use - which turns out to be one of our most difficult demographics to win with is a sure way to lose.

[mdh]

Well, to be honest that's not a good way to judge our chances, since many people don't vote and especially not in the primaries.. That's basically a name recognition poll..

No it isn't, those polls only look at people who have voted in recent GOP primaries. The vast majority of our supporters here are either disenfranchised Republicans who haven't voted in GOP primaries of late (many Republicans I've met who are now Paul supporters haven't in over 20 years now...) or Libertarians or Independents who likewise have not voted in GOP primaries. Very few of the Paul supporters I know did actually vote in one or both of the past two GOP primaries - maybe only some 2%. :p

[nullvalu]

Oh, I guess you guys aren't working hard enough where you're at. We're doing pretty well for name recognition here. Still lots of stupid college kids voting for Obama because they don't know any better, but even most of them know who Paul is.

Are we winning? Not yet, but it's doable. Focusing on bogus polls with bogus and downright incorrect numbers won't get us any closer. Focusing on only one demographic - the sole demographic that these polls use - which turns out to be one of our most difficult demographics to win with is a sure way to lose.

Yep.. We have to keep up our activities - but we're going to suprise the hell out of this country, just like we did with the Q3 fundraising.

[LibertyEagle]

Oh, I guess you guys aren't working hard enough where you're at. We're doing pretty well for name recognition here. Still lots of stupid college kids voting for Obama because they don't know any better, but even most of them know who Paul is.

Doesn't Spirit of 76 live in your state? If that's right, you probably should tell him that then, because he seems to think there is little to no support of Ron Paul in your state.

[LibertyEagle]

Ok guys... delude yourselves all you want.

[mconder]

If you having trouble with your meetup membership, start a second meetup in your area. That's what happened in Salt Lake City and now there are two good size groups doing RP stuff. Both groups opperate differently and get different things accomplished. I think it's a positive thing when some of these larger meetups break up into smaller groups...far more effective.

[mdh]

Doesn't Spirit of 76 live in your state? If that's right, you probably should tell him that then, because he seems to think there is little to no support of Ron Paul in your state.

Kent is a good buddy of mine in this campaign. It's difficult to get hardcore activist types, but that's a universal truth. On the other hand, all I was speaking to was name recognition.

[syborius]

why don't you tell them you're going to put up some more signs and do it... and watch from a distance to see what happens?

then if it's them beat their ass!!! :)

an air rifle to the ass might do the trick :D

[LibertyEagle]

Name recognition alone is not going to win us the primary.

People aren't going to vote for someone whose name they've only seen on some signs. They need to know more about his stances on the issues. Do you agree?

In your opinion, what is the best way to get that done?

[syborius]

I am certainly no mole and I believe that the signs projects everyone has been doing is a waste of time and money. (Not to mention illegal.)

I decided not to participate in my local meetup groups sign thing, simply because it is illegal. If we are willing to break the law for our cause, then what makes us any different than our current government?

In fact I started my own meetup and I intend to just invite people to see some of Dr. Pauls speeches that I have taped, hand them some literature and let them make up their own mind.. :)

"illegal" ayyy...that is just LAME!!! we would not be in position to "restore" constitutional government if not for those signs. Grow a brain. Anyone dissuading people from spreading the message anyway they can, especially against all the odds we are facing should re-evaluate why we are here. FOR LIBERTY!!

[mdh]

Name recognition alone is not going to win us the primary.

People aren't going to vote for someone whose name they've only seen on some signs. They need to know more about his stances on the issues. Do you agree?

In your opinion, what is the best way to get that done?

Well, there are a lot of good ways to get that done. Which works best varies from individual to individual, both on the part of the person doing the activism, and the person on the receiving end. Some people hate receiving cold calls, some people don't - and likewise, some people have great phone manner for making cold calls, while others don't. There are so many ways to use our own individual talents to support the campaign.

When it comes to signs though, Just don't break the law while you're doing it!!!

[nullvalu]

The point of the signs if placed along a road is that it will reach more peope than handing out literature.. If they see the signs, they start to wonder, Who is Ron Paul? and go to the website.. I've read a ton of stories how the signs HAVE worked and gotten people involved. How can you ignore that?

[LibertyEagle]

"illegal" ayyy...that is just LAME!!! we would not be in position to "restore" constitutional government if not for those signs. Grow a brain. Anyone dissuading people from spreading the message anyway they can, especially against all the odds we are facing should re-evaluate why we are here. FOR LIBERTY!!

Bullshit. They were trying to refocus people to get them to go further than solely hanging up signs. We have to start using our brains in how we campaign. Some signs are still very important, but we have to move beyond that. It's time.

[LibertyEagle]

The point of the signs if placed along a road is that it will reach more peope than handing out literature.. If they see the signs, they start to wonder, Who is Ron Paul? and go to the website.. I've read a ton of stories how the signs HAVE worked and gotten people involved. How can you ignore that?

Yes, that is why some signs are still good. We can't completely stop that. Not at all. But up to this point, the vast majority of what has been done, is signs and not much anything else. Surely you can see that.

[nullvalu]

I think most of us HAVE been doing both.. god.. I'm saying the so called "leaders" of these groups don't have to treat the rest of us like children.

[LibertyEagle]

Well, there are a lot of good ways to get that done. Which works best varies from individual to individual, both on the part of the person doing the activism, and the person on the receiving end. Some people hate receiving cold calls, some people don't - and likewise, some people have great phone manner for making cold calls, while others don't. There are so many ways to use our own individual talents to support the campaign.

When it comes to signs though, Just don't break the law while you're doing it!!!

What "cold-calling skills"? The reality is that all you really have to say is ..

Hi. I'm a grassroots supporter of Ron Paul. I'd like to give you some literature about him.

Then hand it to them. Thank them and walk away.

If that is too scary, go put the Slim Jims in their doors while they are at work.

Are we such a pack of chickens, that we will let our fear keep us from achieving our goal of getting Ron Paul elected? I'm starting to wonder. :(

[ghemminger]

Welcome to burn out...take a few days off....your video ROCKED....form yur own MEETup I will form 3 this weekend...dropped out of mine last week because of poor leadership.......

[LibertyEagle]

I think most of us HAVE been doing both.. god.. I'm saying the so called "leaders" of these groups don't have to treat the rest of us like children.

Yeah, you're right. You should do what you want to do. I'm just assuming that everyone wants to do what will be the most effective. Maybe I am wrong and they don't.

[mdh]

What "cold-calling skills"? The reality is that all you really have to say is ..

Hi. I'm a grassroots supporter of Ron Paul. I'd like to give you some literature about him.

There are other campaign strategies than handing people literature, as well. Telephone calls are critical, but I can't say more because of NDA etc.

Some people just have better phone manner than others. Individuals have different strengthes and weaknesses.

[LibertyEagle]

There are other campaign strategies than handing people literature, as well. Telephone calls are critical, but I can't say more because of NDA etc.

Some people just have better phone manner than others. Individuals have different strengthes and weaknesses.

LOL! Ok. I'm with you there though. :)