Continental Congress Live Web Stream

[rmcc4444]

In session now.. (http://freedom.tv/live)

[NoHero]

In session now.. (http://freedom.tv/live)

They're talking about God too much. Actually they're discussing comments like mine they've been getting, but they're point is "we must acknowledge god.'" and that this is the reason the constitution party was formed because of libertarian comments like this.

Not everyone believes in the god they do or no god at all. Many founding fathers were deists, and Thomas Paine was an atheist. The country was NOT founded as a christian nation. It was founded on religious freedom for all. I wish they'd leave the religion out of it altogether. No one is going to stop these people from worshipping who they want... and I really don't mind them mentioning god... I just hope they don't use god as platform.

Separation of church and state is the only way to have a free nation.

[dannno]

Religious freedom should mean freedom from religion as well.

I don't know why any good Christian would want Christianity foisted on people through government force. If you haven't learned yet, that isn't the point of Christianity.

[nate895]

They're talking about God too much. Actually they're discussing comments like mine they've been getting, but they're point is "we must acknowledge god.'" and that this is the reason the constitution party was formed because of libertarian comments like this.

Not everyone believes in the god they do or no god at all. Many founding fathers were deists, and Thomas Paine was an atheist. The country was NOT founded as a christian nation. It was founded on religious freedom for all. I wish they'd leave the religion out of it altogether. No one is going to stop these people from worshipping who they want... and I really don't mind them mentioning god... I just hope they don't use god as platform.

Separation of church and state is the only way to have a free nation.

Thomas Paine was a Deist. All the other founders believed God was active in the universe, and the vast majority were Christians.

As for separation of church and state, you apparently have no idea what that means in historical context. It originally meant that the state and church have separate roles in society. Also, in the Baptist context where the phrase is mentioned in a Thomas Jefferson letter, it alludes to a famous sermon by Roger Williams where he described church and government as two separate kingdoms of God with a wall of separation between the two.


Religious freedom should mean freedom from religion as well.

I don't know why any good Christian would want Christianity foisted on people through government force. If you haven't learned yet, that isn't the point of Christianity.

It isn't that we want to force Christianity down people's throats, it is that if God really is God, that means he rules over the government as well. It isn't like we can just arbitrarily separate politics from religion. God has things to say about government and no one can be neutral about the Gospel.

[RM918]

It isn't that we want to force Christianity down people's throats, it is that if God really is God, that means he rules over the government as well. It isn't like we can just arbitrarily separate politics from religion. God has things to say about government and no one can be neutral about the Gospel.

It's those people that claim to speak for God that worry me.

[NoHero]

Thomas Paine was a Deist. All the other founders believed God was active in the universe, and the vast majority were Christians.

As for separation of church and state, you apparently have no idea what that means in historical context. It originally meant that the state and church have separate roles in society. Also, in the Baptist context where the phrase is mentioned in a Thomas Jefferson letter, it alludes to a famous sermon by Roger Williams where he described church and government as two separate kingdoms of God with a wall of separation between the two.

Just saying that you're right on everything... I personally would not vote for anyone who was going to use their religion while governing, because that would go against my own feelings about government. But, Thomas Jefferson, was definitely of the deist philosophy.

Jefferson's church state letter, meant exactly what it says. He believe religion should be left out of government and that freedom of religion should be guaranteed. You can't very well have religious freedom if Christianity is used to base laws on.He was writing to a preacher in that letter, and I'm glad that he wrote it. It was the early 19th century, and you couldn't well go about being president, while claiming not to believe in God. You can't even do that today. It's still that ingrained in our culture. Jefferson said, "Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear."

Many founders were also Unitarian, who believe all religions are equally viable.

And, yes, many of our laws since the founding of this country have had christian overtones, but I believe that this type of thing has been fading in the last century. Like the silly Blue Laws they still had in the south a couple of decades ago, where you couldn't purchase certain items on Sunday. To the religious these laws may have seemed okay, but to anyone else, they're just regular old tyranny by majority consensus.

[nate895]

It's those people that claim to speak for God that worry me.

God speaks for Himself in His word. I am just the messenger.

[NoHero]

It isn't that we want to force Christianity down people's throats, it is that if God really is God, that means he rules over the government as well. It isn't like we can just arbitrarily separate politics from religion. God has things to say about government and no one can be neutral about the Gospel.

But if there is no God, then we just have extra laws that are useless. Like not being able to get a pair of underwear or a sundae on a Sunday. Sundae on a Sunday... heh

I believe Jefferson meant, we had to be protected from religious laws in the same way that Sharia law shouldn't be in place. And, I'm sure you're totally against Sharia law, but that would sort of be like hypocrisy on your part, because what if Allah is really here watching ruling over us? Shouldn't he be ruling over government too?

I'm not muslim, just making a point.

[nate895]

Just saying that you're right on everything... I personally would not vote for anyone who was going to use their religion while governing, because that would go against my own feelings about government. But, Thomas Jefferson, was definitely of the deist philosophy.

Jefferson's church state letter, meant exactly what it says. He believe religion should be left out of government and that freedom of religion should be guaranteed. You can't very well have religious freedom if Christianity is used to base laws on.He was writing to a preacher in that letter, and I'm glad that he wrote it. It was the early 19th century, and you couldn't well go about being president, while claiming not to believe in God. You can't even do that today. It's still that ingrained in our culture. Jefferson said, "Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blind-folded fear."

Many founders were also Unitarian, who believe all religions are equally viable.

And, yes, many of our laws since the founding of this country have had christian overtones, but I believe that this type of thing has been fading in the last century. Like the silly Blue Laws they still had in the south a couple of decades ago, where you couldn't purchase certain items on Sunday. To the religious these laws may have seemed okay, but to anyone else, they're just regular old tyranny by majority consensus.

Thomas Jefferson, while I agree that he was almsot certainly not a Christian (well, at least not an orthodox one), he also couldn't be a true Deist. Deists basically believe that some distant "god" initially setup the universe, creating scientific natural laws, and, depending on the Deist, the first living things. After that, the scientific laws took effect and "god" had nothing further to do with the universe. A true Deist could never write, as Jefferson did, "We are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights," or "Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just: that his justice cannot sleep for ever . . . ."

Of Thomas Jefferson's letter meant exactly what it says, but you are not correctly interpreting it because you are not incorporating traditional Baptist theology. You have to understand the letter the way people at the time would have read it, not what you think it means. For example, let's say I wrote a letter, or an e-mail, to one of my friends, and I told him that it was "raining cats and dogs," when I really mean that it is pouring down rain at a very heavy rate. Then, let's say, this term goes out of favor over the next 200 years, and someone grabs hold of this letter and thinks I am insane because, quite clearly, I state that animals are falling from the sky like rain. They are not interpreting the passage correctly because they don't understand the idiom. You are doing the same thing with Jefferson's letter. The point Jefferson was making in the letter was that the government was there to enforce certain laws, while the Church "enforced" others. He was basically saying that it was the church's job to keep doctrine straight, not the state's, and therefore the church didn't have to worry about persecution from the government. He didn't mean that God and government having nothing to do with one another.

As for some founders that might have been Unitarian, you once again are being anachronistic in your terminology. Back then, a Unitarian was someone who denied the Trinity and only affirmed the Father's deity, which, albeit, is a heresy that puts you outside the realm of orthodoxy, and therefore Christianity. What you are thinking up is the modern Unitarian Universalist church, which didn't even exist in the 1700's. Furthermore, I doubt that what you are saying is true because the first Unitarian ministers didn't come over until 1815.

"Blue laws" should be enforced by the Church, not the government. That doesn't mean that the government isn't under God's laws and bound to enforce that law when it follows under their purview.

[rmcc4444]

They're talking about God too much. Actually they're discussing comments like mine they've been getting, but they're point is "we must acknowledge god.'" and that this is the reason the constitution party was formed because of libertarian comments like this.

Not everyone believes in the god they do or no god at all. Many founding fathers were deists, and Thomas Paine was an atheist. The country was NOT founded as a christian nation. It was founded on religious freedom for all. I wish they'd leave the religion out of it altogether. No one is going to stop these people from worshipping who they want... and I really don't mind them mentioning god... I just hope they don't use god as platform.

Separation of church and state is the only way to have a free nation.


Only 3 people voted to keep the word GOD in the document. Religion had very, very, very little to do with this. I would suggest watching more and view the strong resolutions coming out of CC2009.