Liberty Movement needs a Dynamic Black Leader [Archive]

AuH20

11-10-2009, 10:25 AM

This a spillover from the VDARe thread. It got me thinking.

I'm talking about a charismatic individual who would be the antithesis to Obama in every way. One that can articulate the principles of liberty and the free market to all in a relative manner. If I could the build the next messiah, he would be one-third Walter Williams, one-third Thomas Sowell, & one-third Malcolm X. Someone who could shatter the politics of division and actually shine the light on the deep, dark subject matter the political class dare not discuss.

ClayTrainor

11-10-2009, 10:27 AM

What about that guy who caused some controversy for carrying a rifle to a rally? He was very well articulated, and carried the message well.

YouTube - 4409 -- Brother carries AR-15 Rifle at Obama Rally (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63GiXzpfGhA)

bobbyw24

11-10-2009, 10:29 AM

I think that our movement could really grow if we got more people of color involved. I know there are a lot of middle class people of color who think like we do. They are my neighbors--many are in the US Navy.

ravedown

11-10-2009, 10:33 AM

Kludge

11-10-2009, 10:40 AM

Worked for the GOP! Well.... not really. Admittedly, I still get embarrassingly excited when a minority seems interested in liberty.
http://chattahbox.com/images/2009/08/michael-steele-2.jpg
The person will immediately be recognized by smear sites as a token minority. Minorities are, very unfortunately, a rarity in libertarian and conservative movements. If a minority presents himself or herself with enough merit to lead this movement, it will happen, but we can't force it with a leadership quota system.

AuH20

11-10-2009, 10:40 AM

i am more interested in a movement that puts ideas and principles ahead of petty
bullshit like charisma and catering to a specific social demographic. i wish people would leave the cultural/ethnic dispersions to the media and move past that shit already-its so tired.

Until we take over the media, having an individual who would be insulated against the favorite tricks of the lib playbook would be extremely beneficial.

Theocrat

11-10-2009, 10:40 AM

2young2vote

11-10-2009, 10:41 AM

ClayTrainor

11-10-2009, 10:41 AM

Just did a search on youtube... We have plenty of support from this demographic. We are a diverse group of people.

YouTube - RON PAUL: Why Blacks & People Of Color Should Vote For Him (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ji_Ft23BDw&feature=PlayList&p=C69AAB44CB97F605&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=1)

YouTube - Ron Paul Support From Young Black Males Part II (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaFaOfiOWtI)

YouTube - An African American view on Ron Paul for President not obama (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EuNgqIiz60)

LibertyEagle

11-10-2009, 10:41 AM

The person will immediately be recognized by smear sites as a token minority. Minorities are, very unfortunately, a rarity in libertarian and conservative movements. If a minority presents himself or herself with enough merit to lead this movement, it will happen, but we can't force it with a leadership quota system.

+1

rpfan2008

11-10-2009, 10:43 AM

http://www.sovlit.com/sisters/trotsky1.jpg

is this man in your avatar, Kludge?

AuH20

11-10-2009, 10:45 AM

If you need people of a specific race to promote the message, then the message is hopeless to begin with. The message needs to be believed because it is true, not because the person says it relates to you physically.

In a perfect world, where a man's deeds outweigh his complexion. But that's not the environment we live in. Unfortunately, we have to play by their darned rules and we're rapidly running out of time.

apropos

11-10-2009, 10:52 AM

In a perfect world, where a man's deeds outweigh his complexion. But that's not the environment we live in. Unfortunately, we have to play by their darned rules and we're rapidly running out of time.

Letting your opponent determine the grounds of the debate guarantees failure, particularly when that opponent's tactics revolve around stifling debate.

This is a terrible idea.

erowe1

11-10-2009, 10:55 AM

What's to stop us from calling Ron Paul black? The whole idea is a made up construct anyway. Your race is only whatever you say it is.

AuH20

11-10-2009, 10:59 AM

Letting your opponent determine the grounds of the debate guarantees failure.

This is a terrible idea.

Not the debate. The very climate and the psychosis behind race. Do you know how many republicans I had to set straight about Ron Paul's newsletter? And these were republicans, the supposed insensitive bunch. It is such a toxic environment at the moment when a fascist president (yes, I said fascist. fascists coalesce private industry with the government and vice-versa) garners close to 90 percent approval of all African Americans. It's the 1500 pound elephant in the room. We've lost the culture war, in large part due to the subversion in the educational system. The left and the Neocons are vile, relentless enemy that have perfected diversionary class and race tactics. And I'm not about to sit about in my ideological,self-righteous bubble and let them hold us over a barrel.

apropos

11-10-2009, 10:59 AM

What's to stop us from calling Ron Paul black? The whole idea is a made up construct anyway. Your race is only whatever you say it is.

Sickle cell disease is a construct?

ravedown

11-10-2009, 11:01 AM

the message sells itself-
i joined this forum to avoid the common political practices and games that determine current candidates that pander to uninformed demographics. if the message is strong enough-it shouldnt matter what census category you fit in-you get it or you don't-if you don't, then im not interested in selling it to you.

erowe1

11-10-2009, 11:05 AM

Sickle cell disease is a construct?

No. The OP didn't say we need a leader with sickle cell disease. It said we need a black one.

georgiaboy

11-10-2009, 11:06 AM

Disclaimer - I disagree with quota systems based on skin pigment. MLK had it right.

That said, anyone know about John Monds? Running for Gov. of Georgia.

http://www.votemonds.com/index.html

AuH20

11-10-2009, 11:10 AM

Disclaimer - I disagree with quota systems based on skin pigment. MLK had it right.

That said, anyone know about John Monds? Running for Gov. of Georgia.

http://www.votemonds.com/index.html

I'm not advocating a quota system. I'm wishing for a black Ron Paul to emerge from the shadows. I don't want someone who is not qualified,

apropos

11-10-2009, 11:12 AM

No. The OP didn't say we need a leader with sickle cell disease. It said we need a black one.

I was more curious about your statement that it's all a construct, when science has shown that diseases - sickle cell, for example - affect one demographic and not another. That seems to contradict your assertion.

paulitics

11-10-2009, 11:23 AM

Ron Paul attracts plenty of minorities, although I agree not enough. I would love to have a black leader emerge that will unite all blacks and whites together to break of the big daddy pimp called the federal government. I know we shouldn't force a quota, but there is nothing wrong with the recruitment of blacks and other minorities into the liberty movement.

http://chelm.freeyellow.com/black_index.html

This site lists Chris Rock, and Sir Mix alot as libertarians. I'm not sure if this is true, but I always loved Chris Rock, and well who doesn't love "baby's got back". That should be our new anthem.

As far as a true leader, how about Walter E Williams for RNC chairman. He is certainly as qualified as anyone else, black or white, and runs intellectual circles around the slippery Michael Steele who has some sort of identity crisis going on.

apropos

11-10-2009, 11:45 AM

And I'm not about to sit about in my ideological,self-righteous bubble and let them hold us over a barrel.

But they already hold you over a barrel, apparently. Your entire argument here is motivated by the commands they specify for how you will behave.

Don't get mad at me for that.

But in the interest of this argument, let's consider the numbers side of your stated goal. Blacks comprise 13% of the total population. A small bloc to begin with, you would agree? And voter apathy there is worse than most almost every election, yes? Now add to that they are no longer the largest minority.

Why a "dynamic black leader"? If you want a real shot at success, why don't we try to get an illegal alien to head up the Liberty Movement, since the influx of illegals fuels the fastest growing demographic in the country? At least get in on the ground floor.

Since there are 20 million illegals currently in country now and roughly 5.5 billion potential illegal immigrants in the world (there are only about 300 million legal Americans), this seems like a sensible way to get the most out of your stated goals. We could also start bringing in as many of those 5.5B to further cement our success.

Romulus

11-10-2009, 11:51 AM

Letting your opponent determine the grounds of the debate guarantees failure, particularly when that opponent's tactics revolve around stifling debate.

This is a terrible idea.

this.

and that's why we need more minorities to get involved in liberty.

AuH20

11-10-2009, 11:54 AM

But they already hold you over a barrel, apparently. Your entire argument here is motivated by the commands they specify for how you will behave.

Don't get mad at me for that.

You are going to deny the situtation the ground? Look at the mockery which was the beer summitt. Think of the countless hours the media devoted to that triviality. People for some reason are conditioned to be more offended by perceived racial slights than outright fraud and tyranny. It's frankly amazing how the dumbed down public becomes enamored with the truly inane.

But in the interest of this argument, let's consider the numbers side of your stated goal. Blacks comprise 13% of the total population. A small bloc to begin with, you would agree? And voter apathy there is worse than most almost every election, yes? Now add to that they are no longer the largest minority.

Why a "dynamic black leader"? If you want a real shot at success, why don't we try to get an illegal alien to head up the Liberty Movement, since the influx of illegals fuels the fastest growing demographic in the country? At least get in on the ground floor.

Since there are 20 million illegals currently in country now and roughly 5.5 billion potential illegal immigrants in the world (there are only about 300 million legal Americans), this seems like a sensible way to get the most out of your stated goals.

Hispanic would be a homerun as well. Let me reiterate that I don't want to see some pre-packaged robot but an authentic believer. They have to be out there somewhere. We just have to find them.

Havax

11-10-2009, 12:01 PM

Walter E. Williams

YouTube - Walter E Williams - Economics of Liberty (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUL152yGVGI)

ForLiberty-RonPaul

11-10-2009, 12:15 PM

YouTube - Ron Paul responds to racist remarks on CNN 01/10/2008 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PrCXJyWACw&feature=related)

johnrocks

11-10-2009, 12:49 PM

Larry Elder would have been a good one had he not locked his lips around the neo conservative foreign policy.

johnrocks

11-10-2009, 12:50 PM

Walter Williams is the best in my opinion although he is getting on up in years.

apropos

11-10-2009, 12:52 PM

You are going to deny the situtation the ground? Look at the mockery which was the beer summitt. Think of the countless hours the media devoted to that triviality.

I wouldn't base my strategies around the puppet show.

The one thing that (has) made this movement so effective is precisely the fact that it does not cater to the fads, biases, and frivolities of the day. It's based on the hard won knowledge of human experience, and ultimately that's something you either accept or reject. For those that reject it, nothing can be done.

If a potential supporter judges the messenger on his appearance instead of his message, can you seriously rely on that person to fight when the message is unpopular? When it's been a bad year and the benefits we promised are a long way off?

Because make no mistake, what this movement wants to do to the financial system is going to be nothing short of pure upheaval if it succeeds. Those are going to be some rough times there that make 2008 look like a fond memory - "they only called us kooks back then".

This movement will not survive with a bunch of fairweather fans. Any progress would be short-lived. And if this or that demographic isn't there for the message (one that by itself is in their own self-interest), it isn't there. A politically correct candidate is not our missing silver bullet. There is no silver bullet. We can't "buy off" people with PC when other parties already have the PC and have the federally-funded treats to go with it.

This movement lives or dies by the message alone, and whether people still believe in it. Once upon a time they did. If they do not believe, nothing can be done.

johnrocks

11-10-2009, 01:02 PM

Black Libertarians are on Facebook
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=44164793928&v=wall#/group.php?gid=44164793928&ref=search&sid=1448863783.3707312018..1

might be a great place to cultivate some supporters.

CapitalistRadical

11-10-2009, 01:04 PM

Janice Rogers Brown (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janice_Rogers_Brown)! Although I do think it's best not to cynically pander. As a “Person of Color”, I would rather 600 white male libertarians in Congress than a pile of collectivists that were racially diverse or that looked like me.

Dieseler

11-10-2009, 01:06 PM

We have one such man right here on Ron Paul Forums...
It would be up to him to speak up or for someone else to recognize who I am talking about.
It might not be a burden he would wish to take upon himself.

YumYum

11-10-2009, 01:07 PM

It's not about the color nor ethnicity of any individual, AuH20, which makes the liberty movement successful. It is the character of the heart and verity of ideas which determine its success. If anything, the liberty movement needs Jesus, not a dynamic Black leader.

Have you ever wondered how Jesus feels about politics? The Jews wanted Jesus to be the leader of their movement. It says at John 6:15:

"Therefore Jesus, knowing they were about to come and seize him to make him king, withdrew again into the mountain all alone."

Later on, it says at John 18:36:

"Jesus answered: 'My kingdom is no part of this world. If my kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be delivered up to the Jews. But as it is, my kingdom is not from this source.' "

It doesn't look like Jesus would get involved.

CapitalistRadical

11-10-2009, 01:10 PM

Have you ever wondered how Jesus feels about politics? The Jews wanted Jesus to be the leader of their movement. It says at John 6:15:

"Therefore Jesus, knowing they were about to come and seize him to make him king, withdrew again into the mountain all alone."

Later on, it says at John 18:36:

"Jesus answered: 'My kingdom is no part of this world. If my kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be delivered up to the Jews. But as it is, my kingdom is not from this source.' "

Wow. Is that the same Jesus they worship at the C Street compound?

AuH20

11-10-2009, 01:14 PM

Lil Wayne in 2012! :D

http://media.dailyprogress.com/dailyprogress/gfx.php?max_width=300&imgfile=images/uploads/Grammy-Nominations-Li_Rose.jpg

jmdrake

11-10-2009, 02:52 PM

Mitt Romneys sideburns

11-10-2009, 03:02 PM

I nominate Theocrat

andrewh817

11-10-2009, 03:02 PM

In a perfect world, where a man's deeds outweigh his complexion. But that's not the environment we live in. Unfortunately, we have to play by their darned rules and we're rapidly running out of time.

WHY?! Ron Paul has been involved in politics as a career for 30 years and how many of his bills have been passed? How many times did his often lone vote of NO decide the fate of a bill? How much can you really change working within the system when you are outnumbered 50 to 1? And even if we "took back" Congress and the Senate, how long would it take to get honest politicians to be the majority? A hell of a lot longer than this country is going to be stable for.