View Full Version : Reuters talks to grandfather of Ft Hood shooter in Palestinian town in Israel
Liberty Star
11-07-2009, 01:54 PM
Israeli paper Haaretz has a report today on response from family of Army psychiatrist involved in Ft Hood shooting living in Palestinian town of al-Bireh:
07/11/2009
Fort Hood gunman's family: America made him what he is
By Reuters
The grandfather of a U.S. Army psychiatrist accused of shooting dead 13 people and wounding 30 others at a base in Texas said on Saturday he found it impossible to believe his grandson had committed the act.
"He is a doctor and loves the U.S.," Ismail Mustafa Hamad said in an interview at his home in the Palestinian town of al-Bireh. "America made him what he is."
U.S.-born Major Nidal Malik Hasan, 39, the son of immigrant parents, was shot during the attack and is being held at a hospital in San Antonio, Texas.
"Whether he became angry or something else, I don't know... What I do know is that it is impossible that he would do something like that," Hamad, 88, said.
Hasan, who had spent years counseling wounded soldiers, many of whom had lost limbs fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan, last visited him in the West Bank some 10 years ago. Hamad said he had since visited his grandson in the United States.
Hamad appeared to rule out a political motive.
Hamad said his nephew was harassed by other soldiers because of his Muslim faith but that he was not angry.
Another cousin, Mohammed Hasan from al-Bireh, said the shooting may have been motivated by what he said was the U.S. Army's refusal to allow him to leave the armed forces.
"About a week before the incident, he hired a lawyer in order to leave the army, get married and live his life. But they rejected his request, and asked him to go to Afghanistan.
"This was the biggest shock for him. So there is another reason why he did what he did, not just because of the harassment of the soldiers, there is another reason," Mohammed Hasan said.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1126442.html
According to early reports, he was Iraq bound but this suggests he was being sent to Afghanistan.
Dionysus
11-07-2009, 02:38 PM
What a nutcase. What is he even doing in the military if he doesn't want to be in the military? Secondly, if he is determined not be deployed, can't he just refuse to go and suffer the consequences? That seems a lot better than killing other people and ending your life, effectively. So stupid. And how is somebody this unstable and militant not noticed? This whole situation is tragic for the victims.
virgil47
11-07-2009, 04:06 PM
What a nutcase. What is he even doing in the military if he doesn't want to be in the military? Secondly, if he is determined not be deployed, can't he just refuse to go and suffer the consequences? That seems a lot better than killing other people and ending your life, effectively. So stupid. And how is somebody this unstable and militant not noticed? This whole situation is tragic for the victims.
He very likely could not simply leave the Army as the Army had payed for all of his schooling and internship. He most likely was faced with deployment or jail time. If he was not prepared to perform his duty as a soldier he should not have enlisted. It appears as though he wanted a free education and bet that he would never be required to deploy. He should never enlisted.
raiha
11-07-2009, 04:33 PM
He very likely could not simply leave the Army as the Army had payed for all of his schooling and internship. He most likely was faced with deployment or jail time. If he was not prepared to perform his duty as a soldier he should not have enlisted. It appears as though he wanted a free education and bet that he would never be required to deploy. He should never enlisted.
I kind of agree but seems also he did alot of good work working with trauma. Be wary of the superficial analysis..you are dealing with appalling unconscious forces at work when you constantly work with the murderous psyche. You sometimes become what you fear the most.
What a nutcase. What is he even doing in the military if he doesn't want to be in the military? Secondly, if he is determined not be deployed, can't he just refuse to go and suffer the consequences? That seems a lot better than killing other people and ending your life, effectively. So stupid. And how is somebody this unstable and militant not noticed? This whole situation is tragic for the victims.
People generally are not born nut cases. They become nut cases with years and years of dealing with trauma. I know the feeling, working with PTSD much of the time. Sometimes i get murderous impulses and I am able to identify it and take it to supervision and we track it back to some appalling patient story. If stress gets too bad i take a holiday. My heart goes out to all the people involved. The whole thing is a horrible tragedy and more care needs to be taken when stress symptoms become apparent.
BlackTerrel
11-07-2009, 05:17 PM
He very likely could not simply leave the Army as the Army had payed for all of his schooling and internship. He most likely was faced with deployment or jail time. If he was not prepared to perform his duty as a soldier he should not have enlisted. It appears as though he wanted a free education and bet that he would never be required to deploy. He should never enlisted.
All that is all well and good. You don't want to deploy, your life sucks - go ahead and do everyone a favor and shoot yourself and be done with it.
I have no sympathy for this guy. Your hate your life put a bullet to your head and end it - don't take it out on others.
revolutionisnow
11-07-2009, 07:25 PM
Couldn't he just say he was gay or smoke some pot or something and they would kick him out?
virgil47
11-07-2009, 07:32 PM
Couldn't he just say he was gay or smoke some pot or something and they would kick him out?
That is a possibility. However if he wished to continue to practice medicine it would be the kiss of death. A dishonorable discharge does lasting damage to your career and life in general.
pcosmar
11-07-2009, 07:47 PM
All that is all well and good. You don't want to deploy, your life sucks - go ahead and do everyone a favor and shoot yourself and be done with it.
I have no sympathy for this guy. Your hate your life put a bullet to your head and end it - don't take it out on others.
That is assuming that the "official story" is true.
I am not convinced of that.
this whole story has a "stink" on it.
I reserve my judgment.
ICBCINTERGER2
11-07-2009, 07:53 PM
That is a possibility. However if he wished to continue to practice medicine it would be the kiss of death. A dishonorable discharge does lasting damage to your career and life in general.
http://www.photosnag.com/img/4713/n09x0302vnsn/clear.gif
Liberty Star
11-07-2009, 07:55 PM
What a nutcase. What is he even doing in the military if he doesn't want to be in the military? Secondly, if he is determined not be deployed, can't he just refuse to go and suffer the consequences? That seems a lot better than killing other people and ending your life, effectively. So stupid. And how is somebody this unstable and militant not noticed? This whole situation is tragic for the victims.
Ofcourse mentally he cannot be healthy but I think his desire to get out and not get shipped to Aghanistan would be only one of the components in understanding his mental makeup, at least from what I have learnt of this story.
All the facts have not come out yet so all exaplanations currently have an element of speculation to them. But if I had to speculate based on what is made public so far, following few factors would be likely explanation in understanding this. His case is probably closest to that of asian Virginia Tech shooter student who killed 30-40 students of all the recent famous such cases, his profile seems nothing like that of another disgruntled army veteran Timothy McVeigh as some in media had speculated.
- Nedal was US born son of Palestinian refugees and was having some hard time adjusting at least since he joined the military. There was one CNN report today that he was harassed for being an arab or muslim and his car was vandalized by fellow soldiers at one point. He did not seem to have good support network of close friends and both his parents were deceased, his coping mechanisms probably failed despite him being a medical psychiatrist himself who counseled troops returning from war zones.
- He was an honor student when he got into medical school at Virginia Tech, there are some reports that he could noy stand sight of blood and fainted at one point in the hospital. He had some issues working at the WR hospital and reportedly hired a lawyer once.
- He came from a family that was not very religious but at some point he became vocally religious, he was reportedly vocally opposed to US foreign policy and was conflicted about being sent to Afghanistan. He had made a trip to Palestinian town of West Bank about 10 years ago to visit some family but was not particularly close to them
This incidence would certainly open some internal debate on adjustment/role of muslim and arab members in US armed forces in active conflicts. At the same time, we should keep in mind that there are thousands of muslims serving honorably in US forces, many have died defending this country. There are many muslim translators that US military heavily depends currently on active war fronts. US military does not require religion disclosure but from what I have read there are 3500-20,000 muslims currently serving in US military.
virgil47
11-07-2009, 08:00 PM
That is a possibility. However if he wished to continue to practice medicine it would be the kiss of death. A dishonorable discharge does lasting damage to your career and life in general.
http://www.photosnag.com/img/4713/n09x0302vnsn/clear.gif
Nice cut and paste dude.
BlackTerrel
11-07-2009, 09:12 PM
That is assuming that the "official story" is true.
I am not convinced of that.
this whole story has a "stink" on it.
I reserve my judgment.
I don't think you'd ever believe it.
pcosmar
11-07-2009, 09:27 PM
I don't think you'd ever believe it.
I believe many things. I have walked down some unholy roads, and I am skeptical of many things as well.
There are a lot of ways to provoke a reaction in someone. And there are many inconsistencies in this story.
I was not there.
I reserve judgment. but my nose doesn't like it.
klamath
11-07-2009, 09:38 PM
That is a possibility. However if he wished to continue to practice medicine it would be the kiss of death. A dishonorable discharge does lasting damage to your career and life in general.
Yeaw so shooting 40 people isn't going to hurt his career:rolleyes:
pcosmar
11-07-2009, 09:47 PM
Yeaw so shooting 40 people isn't going to hurt his career:rolleyes:
Ah, but he didn't shoot 40,
We do not know who or how many he shot and how many were shot by "friendly" fire.
Too many conclusions being jumped to.
klamath
11-07-2009, 09:55 PM
Ah, but he didn't shoot 40,
We do not know who or how many he shot and how many were shot by "friendly" fire.
Too many conclusions being jumped to.
Yes I know the whole story isn't out but the point of the argument is if he did kill the people he was forced to because he was being deployed against his will and couldn't get out without causing problems in his life:rolleyes:
pcosmar
11-07-2009, 10:01 PM
Yes I know the whole story isn't out but the point of the argument is if he did kill the people he was forced to because he was being deployed against his will and couldn't get out without causing problems in his life:rolleyes:
Only if that IS the reason.
He may have thought his life was in danger. He may have thought someone else was a enemy and he was doing right. He may have had other reasons.
We DO NOT KNOW why.
That is all spoonfed speculation.
klamath
11-07-2009, 10:12 PM
Only if that IS the reason.
He may have thought his life was in danger. He may have thought someone else was a enemy and he was doing right. He may have had other reasons.
We DO NOT KNOW why.
That is all spoonfed speculation.
In reallity it will never be known as we aren't in the shooters mind. All of this is just discussing hypotheticals. In the end everyone will believe whatever the heck the want.
pcosmar
11-07-2009, 10:15 PM
In reallity it will never be known as we aren't in the shooters mind. All of this is just discussing hypotheticals. In the end everyone will believe whatever the heck the want.
No, most people will believe what the Talking Heads tell them to believe. :(
Zippyjuan
11-08-2009, 12:50 AM
It was my understanding that the guy was a shrink in the military- not a soldier. He was effected by trying to deal with the PTSD and problems the other soldiers who were really fighting were going through and developed a deep disliking towards the war (can't blame him on that). Other potential factors include his own issues with being harrased based on his religion. There was most likely more than one reason he did what he did.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/11/05/national/main5541916.shtml
Did somebody say the Talking Heads?
YouTube - Talking Heads - Live in Rome 1980 - 08 Life During War Times (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MYp0VIbwZk&feature=related)
fj45lvr
11-08-2009, 12:56 AM
That is a possibility. However if he wished to continue to practice medicine it would be the kiss of death. A dishonorable discharge does lasting damage to your career and life in general.
wow...
on one hand a dishonorable discharge.....on the other hand a psycho killing spree....
He isn't playing with a full deck obviously.
Liberty Star
11-08-2009, 12:50 PM
wow...
on one hand a dishonorable discharge.....on the other hand a psycho killing spree....
He isn't playing with a full deck obviously.
That is obvious.
Can someone in that circusmstnce get out with a dishonorable discharge without paying back for $500K worth of free education?
klamath
11-08-2009, 02:40 PM
That is obvious.
Can someone in that circusmstnce get out with a dishonorable discharge without paying back for $500K worth of free education?
Absolutely. All he had to do is hint this was on his mind and he would have been out. The Army lost a lot more the 500k with this shooting.
BlackTerrel
11-08-2009, 06:24 PM
I believe many things. I have walked down some unholy roads, and I am skeptical of many things as well.
There are a lot of ways to provoke a reaction in someone. And there are many inconsistencies in this story.
I was not there.
I reserve judgment. but my nose doesn't like it.
This lady was there. Reserve judgment until when?
http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/fort-hood-shooter-maj-nidal-malik-hasan-shot/story?id=9018559
Survivors of the Fort Hood massacre described today how Major Nidal Malik Hasan allegedly gunned down unarmed soldiers, and then shot them again as they lay wounded on the floor.
Investigators believe more than 100 shots were fired from Hasan's gun in a matter of minutes. He was described as calm and methodical in his attack, pausing only to reload. Soldier Keara Bono survived the onslaught although she was wounded slightly in the back and grazed in the head.
Bono told "Good Morning America" today that she initially thought the scene of Hasan standing up, praising Allah and starting to fire was a drill. She didn't believe it was real even when she felt her own blood, she said.
pcosmar
11-08-2009, 07:49 PM
This lady was there. Reserve judgment until when?
http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/fort-hood-shooter-maj-nidal-malik-hasan-shot/story?id=9018559
Survivors of the Fort Hood massacre described today how Major Nidal Malik Hasan allegedly gunned down unarmed soldiers, and then shot them again as they lay wounded on the floor.
Investigators believe more than 100 shots were fired from Hasan's gun in a matter of minutes. He was described as calm and methodical in his attack, pausing only to reload. Soldier Keara Bono survived the onslaught although she was wounded slightly in the back and grazed in the head.
Bono told "Good Morning America" today that she initially thought the scene of Hasan standing up, praising Allah and starting to fire was a drill. She didn't believe it was real even when she felt her own blood, she said.
And you think that is the whole story?
She just waited for him to fire a hundred rounds, reloading several times before she returned fire.
How many rounds did she fire?
What about the other (MP/Civilian Contractor)? Were they the only other guns there?
What of the other "suspects"?
No, She doesn't answer my questions.
klamath
11-08-2009, 09:23 PM
And you think that is the whole story?
She just waited for him to fire a hundred rounds, reloading several times before she returned fire.
How many rounds did she fire?
What about the other (MP/Civilian Contractor)? Were they the only other guns there?
What of the other "suspects"?
No, She doesn't answer my questions.
I sorry you are so busy with your mind made up that it is an inside job you didn't even listen of read the report. She wasn't armed. She was reading a book It is awfully hard to return fire without a weapon.:rolleyes:
pcosmar
11-08-2009, 10:23 PM
I sorry you are so busy with your mind made up that it is an inside job you didn't even listen of read the report. She wasn't armed. She was reading a book It is awfully hard to return fire without a weapon.:rolleyes:
I have read several "eye witness "accounts. They don't add up.
In my own case the Eye witnesses were wrong about every point but my eye color.
height weight and the gun I had, All Wrong.
I was convicted on my own testimony.
This is why I check facts and stories and don't jump to conclusions.
I have not posted my theories or suspicions, only my skepticism.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.