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teacherone
11-01-2009, 02:50 PM
E-Mail Not Protected by 4th Amendment, Judge Says

The Fourth Amendment's protection against unreasonable searches and seizures does not apply to e-mail, a federal judge has ruled. The judge's reasoning would seem to sound a warning bell for anyone -- lawyers in particular -- not only who use Web-based e-mail accounts, but also who store documents of any kind online in "the cloud."

Orin Kerr, professor at George Washington University Law School, highlights the ruling and quotes from it at The Volokh Conspiracy, even though he says he disagrees with it.

The ruling from U.S. District Judge Michael W. Mosman in Oregon addresses the question of whether the government must notify someone when it obtains a search warrant to access the person's Web-based e-mail account. This case appears to have involved Google's Gmail.

The Fourth Amendment, Mosman writes, creates a "strong privacy protection for homes and the items within them in the physical world." But e-mail, he says, resides outside a person's home.

When a person uses the Internet, however, the user’s actions are no longer in his or her physical home; in fact he or she is not truly acting in private space at all. The user is generally accessing the Internet with a network account and computer storage owned by an ISP like Comcast or NetZero. All materials stored online, whether they are e-mails or remotely stored documents, are physically stored on servers owned by an ISP. When we send an e-mail or instant message from the comfort of our own homes to a friend across town the message travels from our computer to computers owned by a third party, the ISP, before being delivered to the intended recipient. Thus, "private" information is actually being held by third-party private companies.

Acknowledging that the law is unclear on the question of whether and to what extent the Fourth Amendment protects Internet communications, Mosman ties his decision to Google's privacy policy, which makes clear that Gmail users have no expectation of privacy, he concludes.

Here, the defendants voluntarily conveyed to the ISPs and exposed to the ISP’s employees in the ordinary course of business the contents of their e-mails. The Google privacy policy explicitly states that Google will share personal information of its subscribers when it has "a good faith belief that access, use, preservation or disclosure of such information is reasonably necessary to ... satisfy any applicable law, regulation, legal process or enforceable governmental request." Google Privacy Policy, http:// www.google.com/privacypolicy.html (last visited May 13, 2009). The court understands that other ISPs have similar privacy policies. ... Thus subscribers are, or should be, aware that their personal information and the contents of their online communications are accessible to the ISP and its employees and can be shared with the government under the appropriate circumstances. Much of the reluctance to apply traditional notions of third party disclosure to the e-mail context seems to stem from a fundamental misunderstanding of the lack of privacy we all have in our e-mails. Some people seem to think that they are as private as letters, phone calls, or journal entries. The blunt fact is, they are not.

Kerr disagrees with the decision. "I think e-mails are protected under the Fourth Amendment despite the third-party doctrine," he says, point to an article he wrote for the Stanford Law Review in which he makes this case.

The judge's reasoning would seem to extend beyond e-mail to any documents stored online. If there is no protection for an e-mail stored on the Gmail servers, it follows that there would be no protection for a document stored on the Google Docs servers. We can only hope that the case is appealed and that the appellate panel sides with Kerr.

http://legalblogwatch.typepad.com/legal_blog_watch/2009/10/e-mail-not-protected-by-4th-amendment-judge-says.html



the ruling....


When a person uses the Internet, however, the user's actions are no longer in his or her physical home; in fact he or she is not truly acting in private space at all. The user is generally accessing the Internet with a network account and computer storage owned by an ISP like Comcast or NetZero. All materials stored online, whether they are e-mails or remotely stored documents, are physically stored on servers owned by an ISP. When we send an e-mail or instant message from the comfort of our own homes to a friend across town the message travels from our computer to computers owned by a third party, the ISP, before being delivered to the intended recipient. Thus, “private” information is actually being held by third-party private companies.

This feature of the Internet has profound implications for how the Fourth Amendment protects Internet communications-if it protects them at all. The law here remains unclear and commentators have noted that there are several reasons that the Fourth Amendment's privacy protections for the home may not apply to our “virtual homes” online. First, it is uncertain whether we have a reasonable expectation of privacy in information sent through or stored by ISPs because the Fourth Amendment does not protect information revealed to third parties...

read the entire ruling here (http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/062309mosman.pdf)

dannno
11-01-2009, 02:56 PM
The ISPs and email providers should have 4th amendment rights to be able to hold their customer's emails in privacy.

teacherone
11-01-2009, 02:56 PM
agreed

IPSecure
11-01-2009, 03:13 PM
Can we then read the Judge's emails?

Matt Collins
11-01-2009, 03:31 PM
This makes sense.


We don't own our land (property taxes / allodial title), we don't own our bodies (drug laws), we don't own the fruits of our labor (income tax), and we don't own our possessions (subject to confiscation).

So why would we think that we own our e-mail? :rolleyes:

Dionysus
11-01-2009, 03:46 PM
The dirty secret of many judges and lawyers, the law is whatever you need it to be and gives outright corruption and self-interested policies the veneer of justice.

Brian4Liberty
11-01-2009, 04:48 PM
Did the 4th Amendment apply to standard snail-mail? It certainly applied to telephone conversations at one time. E-mail is simply a combination of the two.

Ricky201
11-01-2009, 05:05 PM
Does this mean we can hack into this guys e-mail? It's not his property after all!

CCTelander
11-01-2009, 05:17 PM
Simple solution - PGP. Problem solved.

Austrian Econ Disciple
11-01-2009, 06:44 PM
This Judge is a baffoon and doesn't understand Natural Law one bit. Don't you love how one person can arbitrarily decide the law for everyone....without consent, without consideration for Natural Law, and in direct violation of the very reason for this country; the Declaration of Independance. Fuck off Monopolistic State Judges. FUCK OFF.

Liberty Star
11-01-2009, 07:35 PM
Unbelievable that we have judges like this guy.

Live_Free_Or_Die
11-01-2009, 07:51 PM
nt

CCTelander
11-01-2009, 07:53 PM
Encryption... use it.

Unless of course you trust your government to protect you then you don't need it.

^This^ Times about a million.

Rael
11-01-2009, 08:35 PM
can someone hack this guys emails and post them on the web? lol

ronpaulhawaii
11-01-2009, 08:49 PM
Author states faulty reading

http://volokh.com/2009/10/29/opinion-on-fourth-amendment-and-e-mail/


I blogged yesterday about a new opinion on e-mail and the Fourth Amendment. I received a few requests for a copy of the opinion, so I formatted a version of it and have posted it here.

In the course of re-reading the opinion to post it, I recognized that I was misreading a key part of the opinion. As I read it now, Judge Mosman does not conclude that e-mails are not protected by the Fourth Amendment. Rather, he assumes for the sake of argument that the e-mails are protected (see bottom of page 12), but then concludes that the third party context negates an argument for Fourth Amendment notice to the subscribers. I missed this because the reasoning closely resembles the argument for saying that the Fourth Amendment doesn’t apply at all, and I didn’t read the earlier section closely enough. That’s obviously a much narrower position, and I apologize for misunderstanding it the first time in the quick skim I gave it. Sorry about that: The fault is entirely mine.

Reason
11-01-2009, 09:09 PM
Encryption... use it.

Unless of course you trust your government to protect you then you don't need it.

Yeah, the NSA is completely fucked when you download your free encryption software programs...

NOT.

Go watch this
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=209280

awake
11-01-2009, 09:11 PM
What! a judge favored the interests of the government who grants his authority? How could this happen!

Live_Free_Or_Die
11-01-2009, 10:48 PM
nt