We are so screwed...

[Scofield]

Seriously, I am just now understanding the magnitude of our problems.

I remember growing up (90's) thinking I could be whatever I wanted, that my future had unlimited potential. Now, here I am on the brink of college graduation, and my future is bleak to the point it's hard to picture it without getting depressed.

No longer is America (or the world) that seemingly good place, where people are happy and friendly, where anyone can do anything. Today, the world is very dark and gloomy, people are unhappy and unfriendly, and more people are poor than ever before.

I honestly believe this to be the fault of the government and technology. I've had a short existence, but from my perception, life looked so much easier and fulfilling in the past. People had wealth, they had time, they didn't have to face all the violence that is prevalent in today's society. I feel people were generally nicer and life wasn't some super-competitive game where it is everyone vs. everyone like it is today.

Maybe my perception of early America is different than the reality of America back then. Maybe life was just as hard, just as cut-throat, just as violent, just as dark. Maybe life isn't all that different today than compared to back then.

Has American changed? Have people changed? Or is life the same as it has been since the dawn of time?

[sevin]

I know exactly what you mean. But don't let it make you so depressed. Even if it is harder to do what you want for a living, life is always worth living. There is always room for love and joy. Chin up, man.

[ronpaulhawaii]

Seriously, I am just now understanding the magnitude of our problems.

I remember growing up (90's) thinking I could be whatever I wanted, that my future had unlimited potential. Now, here I am on the brink of college graduation, and my future is bleak to the point it's hard to picture it without getting depressed.

No longer is America (or the world) that seemingly good place, where people are happy and friendly, where anyone can do anything. Today, the world is very dark and gloomy, people are unhappy and unfriendly, and more people are poor than ever before.

I honestly believe this to be the fault of the government and technology. I've had a short existence, but from my perception, life looked so much easier and fulfilling in the past. People had wealth, they had time, they didn't have to face all the violence that is prevalent in today's society. I feel people were generally nicer and life wasn't some super-competitive game where it is everyone vs. everyone like it is today.

Maybe my perception of early America is different than the reality of America back then. Maybe life was just as hard, just as cut-throat, just as violent, just as dark back then as it is today.

Has American changed? Have people changed? Or is life the same as it has been since the dawn of time?

Change is the only constant :eek:

You have been born into the saying, "May you live in interesting times", as have I. Whether good or bad, it is what it is and people are best off who make the best of it. For me that means using everything at my disposal to confront "the crisis of our generation" in the sure knowledge that if I die tomorrow I'll know that I did the right thing and attempted to maximize the opportunities I've had to leave the world a better place than I found it. Success is in the final moment.

The world has been much more brutal and unforgiving in the past. It is easy to look back on :the good old times", but rest assured the denizens of that age were probably doing the same thing.

It is what it is. Press On!

[Spike]

There were no good ol days. Americans were paying an unconstitutional tax in 50s, 60s, 70s. There was crime and violence in the 70s. There were wars and inflation before either of us were born. Our situation is unique because more people are aware of the corruption of the American government, and the nature of the fraudulent wars that the American people are involved in.

The American people are feeling what it's like for the first time to live in an impoverished country led by looters and cowards, like much of the third world nations. This is a good thing..because for too long Americans believed they were separate from the rest of the world, and thought that their country was free, and because of that thinking they got lazy and stupid. But no more of that. For the first time in a long time the American people are become incredibly angry, revolution-level angry, and if cooler heads prevail, then Americans can turn this crisis into an opportunity for the world.

It is an entirely hopeful time, so be lucky were alive, and let's fight for freedom.

[Scofield]

I know exactly what you mean. But don't let it make you so depressed. Even if it is harder to do what you want for a living, life is always worth living. There is always room for love and joy. Chin up, man.

Yeah, it's just depressing to think about (seeing as I am about to leave college, I now have to enter this "real world").

I just feel things were so much easier and just overall more pleasant in the past, and that we are a generation that will only ever have a world of anguish and corruptness. I truly don't believe our generation will see a simple, good-hearted world like past generations experienced.

There is no more morality and sense of right and wrong in this country anymore. Like I previously said, it's each man for himself now in a world where "might makes right." Things have changed, and they have changed for the worse, and I don't know if we can get it back to how it was.

http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/05/04/con05122.html

This Article is very relevant to the discussion. I would only disagree with the author in that he/she seems more optimistic for the future than I am.

[James Madison]

Hey, man. I'm in a similar position--grew up in the 90s, in college right now, feeling pretty bleak about the future. Really, the only thing you can do is keep on fighting; we'll be with ya the entire way.

[Oyate]

Of course it's different. I've seen the first generation of our male children to go to school unarmed.

For balance however, somebody told me "things never were the way they used to be".

[gls]

YouTube - The Eagles - Take It Easy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vy9PXfs3cLg&feature=related)

[Oyate]

Hey, man. I'm in a similar position--grew up in the 90s, in college right now, feeling pretty bleak about the future. Really, the only thing you can do is keep on fighting; we'll be with ya the entire way.

OK look: you never had success therefore you won't miss it. There are those who say 'tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all and this applies well to the love of other humans. It doesn't describe stuff well because it's just always a freaking shame to loose the bikes and quads and other toys. Even worse than when you were a kid. And I do mean even worse than when YOU were a kid because now that we had to sell all our shit, we're coming after yours and if you don't have any cool shit we're gonna wedgee and chocolate swirley you every day of your lives just like the bullies we were then but, and repeat after me, "even worse than when I was a kid".

Suck it up worms! Worry about the economy all you want but FEAR ME PUNKS.

[Kludge]

You're on the wrong forum if you're looking for a positive outlook.

The United States citizens are armed, well-educated (often far over-educated), and relatively free. Violent crimes have nearly HALVED since the early 90s while population has exploded and while arrests for those crimes have decreased by only ~15%. There are no violent riots, nor risk of such riots. Race relations are strained, but better than ever: racism's dying. Neoconservatism is on its way out. Technology has advanced to such a point where labor is extremely rewarding and relatively easy. Today's babies are likely to live past 100 years of age. Transparency is all around us thanks to advances in recording technology. Controlled news sources are becoming unprofitable and left behind while the Internet connects billions of people.

Anything the government can do will be temporary, because the government's power comes from those it is alleged to enslave. These slaves are only as oppressed as they believe themselves to be and, at any time, may rise up and overthrow their tyrants. The will of the people can never be crushed. I can't imagine any other time I'd rather live in, except maybe the future. There's a lot to look forward to.

[sparebulb]

You've got plenty of reasons to be depressed about our current state, however, a bit of perspective is in order.

First, a side note. TCM has been showing movies from the Great Depression all month long. There is some wisdom to glean from these movies. There are plenty of parallels to draw from the 30's to today: greed, corruption, bail-outs, socialism, poverty, evictions, jackbooted cops, etc. A great many people thought the American way of life and freedom was in danger of ending back then. There was even an attempted corporate/elite/military coup of the US government by the Elites. (google Smedley Butler). My personal theory is that this coup was actually successful, much like the JFK "removal".

The poverty period did eventually end after the depression although a lot of people were badly hurt. Others just carried on as usual with a simple way of life in relative happiness.

Now the bad news. I believe that the wild card is that the Federal Government now, for the first time, has the capability to quell all dissent in this country. If we can keep the Elites/globalists/corporatists in check, we can get through this in time.

One last thought. Scofield, I prescribe that you rent The Grapes of Wrath this weekend and then we can discuss.

[Oyate]

what kludge said

My what a positive outlook Kludge.

[gls]

I just feel things were so much easier and just overall more pleasant in the past,

I think you're romanticizing the past. Throughout history most have had short, miserable existences. We're all quite lucky to live in this time (20th century) and place (first world country).

[kahless]

There is a bright side that at least you are not forced into sacraficing your your life in some foreign land. I might be a little older than those posting here but include myself when saying we should be thankful we did not grow up in the 60s and were drafted to die in Vietnam.

US Vietnam casualties from wikipedia:

More than 3 million Americans served in Vietnam. By war's end, 58,193 soldiers were killed, more than 150,000 were wounded, and at least 21,000 were permanently disabled.[191] Approximately 830,000 Vietnam veterans suffered symptoms of posttraumatic stress disorder. An estimated 125,000 Americans fled to Canada to avoid the Vietnam draft,[192] and approximately 50,000 American servicemen deserted.

[Scofield]

I think you're romanticizing the past. Throughout history most have had short, miserable existences. We're all quite lucky to live in this time (20th century) and place (first world country).

I may be looking at the past with rose-colored glasses, I don't know.

Life just looked to be so much easier back then. People were generally "better" (morally) people back then, and cared for one another. There was a sense of community and helping your fellow man, whereas today it seems like it is everyone out for themselves and only help the little guy if it is beneficial to their aspirations. The sense of community is gone.

Maybe people haven't changed, and society is still the same as it was back then. But, from what I perceive, we are living in a time where morality and right/wrong have been distorted or removed all together. The moral consciousness and sense of right and wrong seems different today than it did in the past, and not a good different either.

I look at my life in the 90's (yes, I was a kid, so my perception again was distorted), and that sense of community is now absent in comparison to what it used to be. If I can sense a difference in just 10 years, I imagine there must be a difference between today and the beginning/flourishing of America.

[James Madison]

You've got plenty of reasons to be depressed about our current state, however, a bit of perspective is in order.

First, a side note. TCM has been showing movies from the Great Depression all month long. There is some wisdom to glean from these movies. There are plenty of parallels to draw from the 30's to today: greed, corruption, bail-outs, socialism, poverty, evictions, jackbooted cops, etc. A great many people thought the American way of life and freedom was in danger of ending back then. There was even an attempted corporate/elite/military coup of the US government by the Elites. (google Smedley Butler). My personal theory is that this coup was actually successful, much like the JFK "removal".

The poverty period did eventually end after the depression although a lot of people were badly hurt. Others just carried on as usual with a simple way of life in relative happiness.

Now the bad news. I believe that the wild card is that the Federal Government now, for the first time, has the capability to quell all dissent in this country. If we can keep the Elites/globalists/corporatists in check, we can get through this in time.

I believe you're right. In the 20s and 30s, most of the country was agrarian/self-sufficient not to mention skilled with firearms. Today, people are totally dependent on Wal-Mart and McDonalds for the meals; in short, most of the US population would starve to death without government intervention. This is extremely important. The population won't have a choice but to go along with the government's policies. Unfortunately, this is were things could get very, very ugly.:(

[Dieseler]

I believe you're right. In the 20s and 30s, most of the country was agrarian/self-sufficient not to mention skilled with firearms. Today, people are totally dependent on Wal-Mart and McDonalds for the meals; in short, most of the US population would starve to death without government intervention. This is extremely important. The population won't have a choice but to go along with the government's policies. Unfortunately, this is were things could get very, very ugly.:(

Yes, and at that point you must decide what Zombies look like to you. It will be the most important decision you ever make.

[Oyate]

OK so there is a positive outlook. First of all, the basic new pastime coming to the USA is starvation and fortunately almost anybody can do it. So you are basically guaranteed of being "normal" in the statistical sense of normative social profile.

Next, being educated, you won't simply whitness the destruction of your former society, you'll be able to understand it in very complex terms. You'll also be able to understand and identify the degradation of your physiology in very in depth terms.

Next, being very literary and well-read young people, you will be able to write impassioned prose about your condition, possibly even setting this to music and subconsciously reverting to the archaic form of poetry and eventually even the written word (as opposed to typed word) which you will scrawl into old bricks using rusty nails.

Perhaps as the tents and remnants of store-bought camping equipment are slowly refashioned into your postmodernist world you will turn the gold coins we left stashed for you again and again as you wonder what in the world we liked so much about them. You will discover they make good fishing weights.

Then eventually one of you will stumble upon some dude in an underground cellar who got cryogenically frozen and ask him "due bu chi, ni hao?" and he'll be like "awesome they got waiters, I want general tsao's chicken and a Budweiser chop chop" and you won't understand a word he says. But you will quickly discover he's a total gauzaizi and throw him off a cliff, thus severing your last connections to us sons of bitches.

Now there's a positive.

[Carole]

Scofield said: (excerpt)

"I honestly believe this to be the fault of the government and technology. I've had a short existence, but from my perception, life looked so much easier and fulfilling in the past. People had wealth, they had time, they didn't have to face all the violence that is prevalent in today's society. I feel people were generally nicer and life wasn't some super-competitive game where it is everyone vs. everyone like it is today."

I totally understand how you must feel. Don't forget to blame the corporatist-shadow government also. :) Yes, America has changed, but there were puppeteers behind the curtain pulling the strings and setting us all up for what you see today. What you see around you is no accident. :)

A little while ago I watched the first half of "Fall of the Republic". It made me so sad and angry at the same time that I had to shut it off for tonight.

Fall of the Republic Full Length DVD
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=217012
Fall of the Republic HQ full length version
YouTube - Fall of the Republic HQ full length version (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VebOTc-7shU&feature=player_embedded)

Yet, it makes me feel better knowing that a bunch of pretty smart people in the film get it also.
For a long time, I had felt alone because I was so afraid that no one else got it, no one understood, but me. I just could not believe I was the only one. One of my children does not get it; my mother does not get it. It is like talking to a wall or empty suit of clothes. They put up their disbelieving walls, follow the pied piper, and are in denial. So frustrating.

Thank goodness I discovered Dr. Ron Paul and people who come to this board. Thank goodness for the internet and so many people posting in so many places online the truth.

That gives me hope and I hope it gives you hope as well. If I were your age, I would be making some big adjustments about my life as you must likely do. It is not easy, but you have the advantage of understanding some of what is wrong. It took me years to figure it out and deal with it, because I had no lifeline and certainly no internet. Now, if you go to the right places online, you at least, know what is going on and find others who share your plight.

We need not to send troops overseas, but to bring them home. We are going to need them one day.

Please do not let your disallusion with life get you down. We all surround you with empathy and understanding. :)

[sofia]

There were no good ol days. Americans were paying an unconstitutional tax in 50s, 60s, 70s. There was crime and violence in the 70s. There were wars and inflation before either of us were born.


not entirely true..

go back 30 years and most families were still intact and all you needed to make a decent living was a desire to work...

[Oyate]

So if I turn serious here, I already spent all credibility right?

In a way, every generation has had it's challenges. In a way, my generation's challenge was in some way to help prepare for now (never knew when it was gonna come) but now that it's here, our whole accumulated body of knowledge is here for you. You aren't walking into this one blind and in every possible realm of issue, we have at least a head start for you. It's practically all online for the time being, take down what you will need to know in the future. As it's practically all online now it's time for you to take it down and put it into practice.

[Dieseler]

Ahh, but if you could go back to my childhood.
Things were so much simpler then.
I feel so bad for you kids. ( I know you're not all kids and the ones of you that are I mean no disrespect) I love the tech but good gracious you don't know what you missed.
Freedom is what you missed.

[Carole]

I am the past generation and I can recall feeling the same as you beginning very young. It was not nearly so bad as now (crime), but I remember my father not allowing me to go anywhere alone without my brother, being overprotective in many ways. It was stifling and made me grow up more fearful than I might have.

I discovered corruption around me in junior high school and it broke my heart in ways I dread even now to recall. It hurt to see the corrupted to get a slap on the wrist, then elected to the Honor Society.

Life was certainly more simple then, but television was just coming on the scene. Maybe that is when things began to change.

We grew up with threats of communism and threats of war and hiding under desks in practice air raids. It robbed me of my innocence too young.

Now I know that it was all planned-a ruse to keep the sheep scared and obedient and enslaved. But at the time it was sometimes scary. Then Vietnam came along and the rest of my youth and early adulthood played out amidst this tragic so-called "war". It was so much worse than Iraq and Afghanistan. It totally robbed me of any happiness to see it televised daily on the small screen, to hear it spoken of so much, to see the vivid pictures of bodies and the dreaded, awful heavy body count. I will never forget what it did to me. And I was just a spectator from a great distance.

Our "leaders" and the vermin behind the scenes and not behind the scenes are the villains today, as then. Do not let them win. Keep strong and believe in the right things. They cannot win so long as your mind is free and your heart is free and you keep putting one foot in front of the other and try to do the right thing.

You are not alone.

[Oyate]

A little harsh reality might dispel a lot of unnecessary grief to the youth. There have always been hard times and people who have risen in all times. Youth is served by vigour, energy and the freedom of experience which drags some of us down. Youth has fresh eyes and frankly, you don't find better youth than we have here in this movement.

Self-reliance as a concept will steer them well. Inter-reliance will become a key to their survival but they are better suited to non-traditional family formats (did I hint at tribal formats?) as a means of maximizing resources and security. There are some things they will find that we have lost. The potential still exists for them to have very full and rewarding lives (albeit challenging) but there's enough of us oldersters around to impart not only the perfection of the know-how but the tools and equipment to do it with. Because what the hell do you think is gonna happen to it when we die? We'll pass it all onto them.

It might be a shit-storm but these kids are about as best prepared informationally as we can get them. It'll be hands-on learning from here.

[Oyate]

Young people, you might not have your pick of the profession you schooled for but you will be more necessary than ever. And there are a number of ways to think about getting by.

One of my favorite thoughts is one of you young patriot couples finding an elderly person in your community that needs help just getting through daily life. The scenario these days is often these folks have their houses 100% paid for but they can't afford expensive in-home professional care all the time. Dudes and dudesses, what a match! Freaking ask them to let you move in and you will help them with basic stuff like making sure the bills get paid and they get their meds and their mail and they don't starve to death. I'm telling you now a lot of these elderlies fall through the cracks and end up as wards of the court and their lives turn sad real fast.

That's just one example of how you can save lives and help yourself with some kind of start.

Growing stuff to eat is another. There's several intitiatives going (like since the 1960's) in urban agriculture, some recent folks in MO are doing 1000 Gardens and other community feed-yourself programs just so everybody has something to eat.

Vehicles are going to be a problem, as in how to obtain and maintain one, fixing things of every different sort be it combustion, pneumatic, hydraulic, all of this affords increasing value in a post-consumer scenario.

I think in many ways the young people, if they simply get their heads around to working for survival and self-reliance, will be better off than the general population, that's for damn sure.

[Dark_Horse_Rider]

Scofield, believe in yourself.

We are going through a period of what will be intense change.

Keep your eyes and ears keen. Sincerely, ask your ancestors for guidance.

Concern yourself with what is yet to be, instead of yearning for the past.

[James Madison]

Growing stuff to eat is another. There's several intitiatives going (like since the 1960's) in urban agriculture, some recent folks in MO are doing 1000 Gardens and other community feed-yourself programs just so everybody has something to eat.



I've been putting out gardens since I was ten years old (with help from my dad, of course). It's a great way to get of the grid and learn basic survival skills. It's also a great way of spending time with your family. I feel that so many parents today don't know their children and vice versa.

If you guys need some help with agriculture I'll do what I can.

[Spike]

not entirely true..

go back 30 years and most families were still intact and all you needed to make a decent living was a desire to work...


A desire to work? lol...let's not forget that unemployment was high then too, and there were a lack of well paying jobs, certainly less than today though, but nonetheless, modern man's various problems were evident in the 70's too. But I was talking about the state of indebtedness to government and paying for government ills. 30 years ago stagnation was at its highest, so technically Americans were being robbed then just as they're being robbed now. 30 years ago it was inflation, today it is bailouts and unemployment. Its true, though, the middle class was very healthy 30 years ago. But the general feeling that society was good and America was extremely decent wasn't that high, so its wrong to assume that all the world's ills arrived when we came of age..as the author of this post was saying. I guess in a way he has a point, because the economic crisis, the ecological degradation, and overt government tyranny, are all happening under our watch, and in this century......but the bomb was ticking a long while ago.

[Carole]

Ahh, but if you could go back to my childhood.
I love the tech but good gracious you don't know what you missed.
Freedom is what you missed.

^ This :) Yes, at least we had freedom. :D

[Dieseler]

^ This :) Yes, at least we had freedom. :D

I remember walking down county roads with a shotgun over one shoulder and a rifle over the other. If I met a Deputy Sheriff along the way I'd adjust one or the other to throw a hand up without a worry in the world.
I wish I could give that to all of you.
Those were indeed the days.

If I were to retrace those same steps today in the same way, I would likely come home in a pine box.

[Carole]

The positive aspect is that you are going to face challenges that will demand of you what you are not yet aware you have in you.

You will "be all that you can be" so to speak, only you won't be wearing a uniform. You will face totally unexpected challenges and you will deal with them and grow and mature into a much stronger person than you might have if life had been easy or cushy. The things you learn along the way will build your character and make you stronger than the zombies.

Life is like that; the unexpected enters your life and you put one foot in front of the other and meet the obstacles head on. I know it is not what you had planned, but in the real world, not many people's lives turned out the way they had planned or hoped. That is a luxury.

The sooner you get past the grief and get on to acceptance, the better. It may sound trite, but:

God, grant me the
SERENITY
to accept the things
I cannot change ~
COURAGE
to change the
things I can;
and
WISDOM
to know the difference.

I am not especially religious, more spititual really, but I sort of like this poem/prayer.


Living one day at a time;
Enjoying one moment at a time;
Accepting hardship as the
pathway to peace.
Taking this
sinful world as it IS,
not as I would have it.
Trusting that He will make
all things right if I
surrender to His Will;
That I may be reasonably happy
in this life, and supremely
happy forever in
the next.
By Reinhold Neibuhr


Hope this does not offend. Everything is going to be okay because too many people are WITH you.

Take advantage of opportunities to speak with older mentors. The bad guys want us all gone so you have no history and we will not be in the way of their indoctrinating the young. Store up all the practical and historical knowledge you can find. It could save you one day.
:)

Lots of good advice in this thread. :)

[Danke]

I think maybe you should move to a small town. People generally know and look after each other.




YouTube - Life Of Brian - Ending (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1loyjm4SOa0)

[fj45lvr]

these times are probably much more subdued than earlier times in man's history.

There are still places you can choose to go and ways you can live your life and not be under total control but your choices are LIMITED and not "infinite" in doing so.

it's just getting more difficult to side-step and escape all the snares/webs out there.