LORD Stern: Copenhagen Conference will soar price of Meat and other goods

[Cowlesy]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article6891362.ece

You read the title and you think this guy is a watchdog, but you would be wrong.


People will need to turn vegetarian if the world is to conquer climate change, according to a leading authority on global warming.

In an interview with The Times, Lord Stern of Brentford said: “Meat is a wasteful use of water and creates a lot of greenhouse gases. It puts enormous pressure on the world’s resources. A vegetarian diet is better.”


Lord Stern, the author of the influential 2006 Stern Review on the cost of tackling global warming, said that a successful deal at the Climate Change Conference in Copenhagen in December would lead to soaring costs for meat and other foods that generate large quantities of greenhouse gases.


He predicted that people’s attitudes would evolve until meat eating became unacceptable. “I think it’s important that people think about what they are doing and that includes what they are eating,” he said. “I am 61 now and attitudes towards drinking and driving have changed radically since I was a student. People change their notion of what is responsible. They will increasingly ask about the carbon content of their food.”

I really hate these elitist fuckwads. How about you?

[Light]

The worst tyrants in history have been idealists who did "what was best for the people".

[Cowlesy]

Lord Stern, a former chief economist of the World Bank and now I. G. Patel Professor of Economics at the London School of Economics, warned that British taxpayers would need to contribute about £3 billion a year by 2015 to help poor countries to cope with the inevitable impact of climate change.

Where's the line? If Britain is going to contribute $4.5 billion, what in heaven's name is the U.S. contribution (payoff) going to be?

[Yieu]

Sure, eating that way is better for you and it is a better use of resources, but governments should not force people to do it. It is a personal choice, and it is better not to judge anyone else based on their decision on what they eat.

Those bits about "climate change" are ridiculous though. All food has carbon in it, carbon is not a bad thing.

[pcosmar]

Just saw this too.
Barack Obama must attend Copenhagen climate summit, says Lord Stern
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article6891287.ece

Lord Stern, who was chief economist at the World Bank and is the author of the landmark 2006 study on the economics of climate change, was speaking after The Times disclosed on Saturday that Mr Obama was unlikely to be there, adding to concerns that Copenhagen is unlikely to yield a workable agreement amid continued deadlock between the US, China and India over pledges to cut their greenhouse gas emissions.

[dannno]

The truth is that most people would be much more healthy if they lowered their meat intake significantly.

This shouldn't be done by force, but through education as well as providing alternatives through the free market.

In a free market, meat would be more expensive and vegetables would be much less expensive. A veggie burger should be on the $.99 cent menu at McDonalds, not a double cheeseburger or whatever.. instead most places charge almost double for the veggie alternative. Government subsidies have made meat an extremely cheap source for nutrients by subsidizing the farmers who produce food for animals.

Unfortunately it's a very unhealthy source for nutrients when eaten on a regular basis (several times a day) for long periods of time, for about 2/3 of the population. The rest of the population (generally blood type 'O'), requires meat in order to sustain normal energy levels. The healthiest kind of meat are various organs and things that are usually thrown away. These contain the most nutrients, gamey and fatty meats are best. Muscle meat is actually what causes much of the health problems generally associated with red meat.

[manny229]

I wonder if they plan to tax people who own/raise chickens?

[Yieu]

The rest of the population (generally blood type 'O'), requires meat in order to sustain normal energy levels.

I agree with the rest of your post for the most part, but no human needs meat to be healthy. It is 100% optional for all humans. I'm not saying everyone "should stop", I'm just saying that no one "needs" it.

[Cowlesy]

I wonder if they plan to tax people who own/raise chickens?

If they do try and tax you, ignore it.

I am going to meat every day this week --- lots of tasty beef and pork. If I ever meet Lord Stern, I am going to fart in his general direction.

[Bruno]

I agree with the rest of your post for the most part, but no human needs meat to be healthy. It is 100% optional for all humans. I'm not saying everyone "should stop", I'm just saying that no one "needs" it.

It is not optional for those that rely on meat for their protein. In developed countries, we have choices, in underdeveloped countries, they do not always have the option.

[JeNNiF00F00]

I would starve.

[Yieu]

It is not optional for those that rely on meat for their protein. In developed countries, we have choices, in underdeveloped countries, they do not always have the option.

Save a few exceptions such as places where there is no vegetation (extreme north), there is no necessity beyond personal choice to rely on meat for protein. Underdeveloped countries do not need it -- some parts of India and rural China are good examples of this. It is not difficult to find other sources of protein.

I do not like how they are tieing this issue in with "climate change" and authoritarian control though -- because it may cause some people to have a negative backlash against vegetarianism rather than the real culprit: authoritarianism, which has nothing to do with vegetarianism. This is unfortunate, because it is not so pleasant in such situations where one could end up being attacked when the issue is actually something else.

Edit: For clarity, vegetarianism is the scapegoat here -- the real problem is authoritarianism. I hope this does not result in attacks against vegetarianism.

[jmdrake]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/environment/2009-08-19-forest_N.htm

http://www.infowars.com/cap-and-trade-calls-for-productive-u-s-farmland-to-be-converted-to-forests/

WASHINGTON — New forests would spread across the American landscape, replacing both pasture and farm fields, under a congressional plan to confront climate change, an Environmental Protection Agency analysis shows.

About 18 million acres of new trees — roughly the size of West Virginia — would be planted by 2020, according to an EPA analysis of a climate bill passed by the House of Representatives in June.

That's because the House bill gives financial incentives to farmers and ranchers to plant trees, which suck in large amounts of the key global-warming gas: carbon dioxide.

The forestation effort would be even larger than one carried out by the Civilian Conservation Corps during the Great Depression, says the U.S. Forest Service's Ralph Alig. The CCC, which lasted from 1933 to 1942, planted 3 billion trees, says the Civilian Conservation Corps Legacy, an alumni group for workers and family members.

The environmental benefits are clear. More trees would not only lower carbon dioxide levels, but they would improve water quality, because they need lower levels of pesticides and fertilizers, says agricultural economist Bruce McCarl of Texas A&M University, who contributed to the EPA analysis.

The plan would, however, be hard on ranchers and farmers and potentially food prices, says American Farm Bureau chief economist Bob Young.

In the Senate, which is likely to consider a similar bill this fall, there are some who worry the loss of farmland would lead to increases in food prices worse than those seen in mid-2007, when costs spiked 7% to 8% above 2006 levels.

If those food prices seemed high, "wait till you start moving agricultural acres into climate-change areas," warns Sen. Mike Johanns, R-Neb., Agriculture secretary for President George W. Bush.

McCarl says food costs would stay roughly the same.

The latest EPA analysis does not say where the farmland would be lost. However, an EPA study done in 2005 that analyzed climate-change policies similar to the House bill found that trees would overgrow farms primarily in three areas:

•Great Lake states: Michigan, Minnesota and Wisconsin.

•The Southeast: Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia and Florida.

•The Corn Belt: Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Missouri and Ohio.

Forests once grew there, says study author Brian Murray of Duke University, so trees would sprout quickly in those areas if farmers got financial incentives. The House climate bill would allow landowners who reduce carbon dioxide to sell carbon permits to polluters, such as power plants.

Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack last week hailed the possibility that climate-change action could help forests. "We have our own deforestation problem right here in the U.S. of A," he said. "Just keeping forest as forest is a significant challenge."

Roughly 1 million acres of forests every year were flattened to make way for homes and other development in the 1990s, Alig says. Without a climate bill, a net total 26 million acres of forest will be lost to development by 2050, he says.

[Dieseler]

They fully intend to kill us and rewild the Earth.
Believe it or not.

[emazur]

We can put aside greenhouse gas produced by the meat industry it hasn't been proven to cause global warming, but the meat industry certainly is a major cause of pollution, especially water pollution:
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/The+real+cost+of+your+burger.-a0178712678

In the U.S, where much of the grain production goes to feed cattle, agriculture contributes to nearly three quarters of all water-quality problems in the nation's rivers and streams, according to the Environmental Protection Agency Environmental Protection Agency (EPA)
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=113927993

An estimated one in 10 Americans have been exposed to drinking water that contains dangerous chemicals, parasites, bacteria or viruses, or fails to meet federal health standards. Part of the problem, says journalist Charles Duhigg, is that water-pollution laws are not being enforced.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/1999/04/27/MN13651.DTL

In terms of water pollution, said Leon, beef is 17 times more damaging than all that goes into making pasta. This is because of water pollution from manure, as well as the amount of electrical energy, fuel, fertilizer and pesticides needed to raise cattle fodder.

``The contamination to the nation's waterways from manure run- off is extremely serious,'' he said. ``Twenty tons of livestock manure are produced for every household in the country. We have strict laws governing the disposal of human waste, but the regulations are lax, or often nonexistent, for animal waste.''

[Yieu]

They fully intend to kill us and rewild the Earth.
Believe it or not.

If so, that would be related to jmdrake's post (which is a somewhat different topic), but not the original post this thread was about.

[heavenlyboy34]

Being vegan wouldn't be so bad if there were more non-soy protein sources available. 1) soy is a common allergen 2) soy protein as commonly used in food is a phyto-estrogen-not good for guys

[awake]

You can see the monumental PR operation underway everywhere.. Protests , activists storming parliaments, marches and shows of eco religious fever. One thing is for sure, socialism is alive and thriving in the environmental movement. Too bad they they can not see the glaring contradiction of their whole movement.

The government is the biggest waster of resources, hence the largest emitter of C02 needlessly. The most efficient method of resource allocation, the Free Market, is purposely being sabotaged by government and its allies in the environmental movement revealing what the true motive:They wish to replace it with a complete top to bottom government controlled market. It is a fraud movement and an unworkable plan...


The Copenhagen treatie will cause what the 'Lord' is fear-mongering about. Regulation paralysis will displace producers of certain goods out of the market while making it much more difficult for others; creating higher prices and shortages. Cap and trade really means cap on production through energy controls. Green energy sounds romantic but it needs to pass the market test without the government propagandists deceiving consumers and investors on its viability.

The free market - a truly free market, can provide humanity with all the ability and resources it needs to combat any adverse conditions. It always has.

[Dieseler]

If so, that would be related to jmdrake's post (which is a somewhat different topic), but not the original post this thread was about.

Yeah, its relevant here and there.

[pcosmar]

Being vegan wouldn't be so bad if there were more non-soy protein sources available. 1) soy is a common allergen 2) soy protein as commonly used in food is a phyto-estrogen-not good for guys

Vegetables would be great if they had some meat in them. ;)

[dannno]

I agree with the rest of your post for the most part, but no human needs meat to be healthy. It is 100% optional for all humans. I'm not saying everyone "should stop", I'm just saying that no one "needs" it.

Checkout "Eating Right for Your Blood Type"

I don't subscribe to everything in the book, but I've found that what the general idea is generally true just by talking to people about their diets.

I'm type 'A' which means I thrive on a vegetarian diet. When I eat meat, it slows my metabolism down and I have very little energy.

For many people with type 'O' blood, it is the opposite. When they don't eat meat, they feel sluggish and their metabolism slows down. They often gain weight, as well..

[dannno]

Save a few exceptions such as places where there is no vegetation (extreme north), there is no necessity beyond personal choice to rely on meat for protein.


People from these climates often have type 'O' blood. There are other regions where type 'O' blood is also common.





I do not like how they are tieing this issue in with "climate change" and authoritarian control though -- because it may cause some people to have a negative backlash against vegetarianism rather than the real culprit: authoritarianism, which has nothing to do with vegetarianism. This is unfortunate, because it is not so pleasant in such situations where one could end up being attacked when the issue is actually something else.

Edit: For clarity, vegetarianism is the scapegoat here -- the real problem is authoritarianism. I hope this does not result in attacks against vegetarianism.


I agree, I hate that vegetarianism is tied in with authoritarianism. So many people will not consider the idea of being vegetarian due to the social stigmas as well.

[Arklatex]

Wow Danno I didn't realize this.. the different blood type thing. I love fruits and vegetables... eat way more than the average person probably but I could never be a vegetarian because when I skip meat I feel very weak and sluggish and I'm type O blood type.


thanks for bringing this to my attention =)

[jmdrake]

The truth is that most people would be much more healthy if they lowered their meat intake significantly.

This shouldn't be done by force, but through education as well as providing alternatives through the free market.

In a free market, meat would be more expensive and vegetables would be much less expensive. A veggie burger should be on the $.99 cent menu at McDonalds, not a double cheeseburger or whatever.. instead most places charge almost double for the veggie alternative. Government subsidies have made meat an extremely cheap source for nutrients by subsidizing the farmers who produce food for animals.

Unfortunately it's a very unhealthy source for nutrients when eaten on a regular basis (several times a day) for long periods of time, for about 2/3 of the population. The rest of the population (generally blood type 'O'), requires meat in order to sustain normal energy levels. The healthiest kind of meat are various organs and things that are usually thrown away. These contain the most nutrients, gamey and fatty meats are best. Muscle meat is actually what causes much of the health problems generally associated with red meat.

It's not just the price of meat that's going to be more expensive. Check the thread title again. Meat and OTHER GOODS. See the article I posted in this thread. Farmland in general will be taken out of production for the sake of "crap and trade". Everything's going to be more expensive including the vegeburgers.

[pcosmar]

It's not just the price of meat that's going to be more expensive. Check the thread title again. Meat and OTHER GOODS. See the article I posted in this thread. Farmland in general will be taken out of production for the sake of "crap and trade". Everything's going to be more expensive including the vegeburgers.

I see it.
I was beginning to wonder if everyone was completely missing the point, or if the thread was being derailed deliberately.

Hard to tell.

[Arklatex]

Also,

why isn't the answer to green house gases to plant trees? They filter the air. Seems like I never see that one thrown out and it's the only answer that makes sense to me. An increase in C02 levels would be a natural and good response by mother nature to counteract the depletion of her forests. Put a C02 tank next to a houseplant and you'll see what i mean, It'll grow healthier and twice as much foliage.


If I'm president I'll pass a law, plant 15 trees you are exempt from any income tax that year. Don't you know there'd be a lot of trees planted ;) No not really I just get rid of the income tax all together but if we must have socialist laws they should make sense.

[heavenlyboy34]

Checkout "Eating Right for Your Blood Type"

I don't subscribe to everything in the book, but I've found that what the general idea is generally true just by talking to people about their diets.

I'm type 'A' which means I thrive on a vegetarian diet. When I eat meat, it slows my metabolism down and I have very little energy.

For many people with type 'O' blood, it is the opposite. When they don't eat meat, they feel sluggish and their metabolism slows down. They often gain weight, as well..

I have a copy of the blood type diet book, and it's pretty good. It's worth a try, IMO. I too am type A, but I find that poultry and fish don't bother me as much as beef. I definitely feel better when I go heavy on veggies. :cool:

[Cowlesy]

Well, the whole diet talk aside, I am far, far more concerned about Authoritarianism and Supranational Authority.

[jmdrake]

Also,

why isn't the answer to green house gases to plant trees? They filter the air. Seems like I never see that one thrown out and it's the only answer that makes sense to me. An increase in C02 levels would be a natural and good response by mother nature to counteract the depletion of her forests. Put a C02 tank next to a houseplant and you'll see what i mean, It'll grow healthier and twice as much foliage.


If I'm president I'll pass a law, plant 15 trees you are exempt from any income tax that year. Don't you know there'd be a lot of trees planted ;) No not really I just get rid of the income tax all together but if we must have socialist laws they should make sense.

That's part of the plan. Again read the story I posted. Part of the plan is to plow under productive farmland and plant freakin trees! Oh I bet planting trees that actually produce food won't count because you need "biodiversity". Never mind the fact that much of America's farmland was grassland (as opposed to forest) in the first place!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/environment/2009-08-19-forest_N.htm

Or what about Africa? There the savannahs (grasslands) are kept "tree free" by elephants who push the trees over. So will ObamaGore push for culling (killing) off all the elephants in order to save the trees in Africa in order to save the planet? :(

[Arklatex]

We shouldn't plow over crops to plant trees, we should plow over Washington DC. Then all the resulting cherries and apples will be sent to all the food stamp dependent. :p

[Dieseler]

We shouldn't plow over crops to plant trees, we should plow over Washington DC. Then all the resulting cherries and apples will be sent to all the food stamp dependent. :p
Good idea except for one thing.
Let them pick it for themselves.

[Icymudpuppy]

Inuit suffer from diabetes a lot because they have for thousands of years adapted to an all meat diet.

Mediterranean people suffer from heart disease a lot because they have for thousands of years adapted to an all grain diet.

Tropical people suffer from obesity because they have for thousands of years adapted to an all fruit diet.

Think about your genetic makeup when you choose the best diet for you, and don't neglect exercise.

I am a very physically active male of northern European scandinavian descent. Meat (particulary fatty meat) is necessary in my diet, and without it I feel hungry, weak, tired, and cannot concentrate. I have a high metabolism and can't put on weight even if I try.

[manny229]

We shouldn't plow over crops to plant trees, we should plow over Washington DC. Then all the resulting cherries and apples will be sent to all the food stamp dependent. :p

I'm sure there's enough BS in that place to grow enough food to feed the world :D

[jack555]

Sure, eating that way is better for you and it is a better use of resources, but governments should not force people to do it. It is a personal choice, and it is better not to judge anyone else based on their decision on what they eat.

Those bits about "climate change" are ridiculous though. All food has carbon in it, carbon is not a bad thing.


Eating a 100 % vegetarian diet is not necessarily healthier than eating a mixed diet. Please stop spreading ignorance.

Small portions of salmon and other meats are very healthy and provide
beneficial nutrients, fatty acids, etc.

[pcosmar]

Again

http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0903/derailed-train-derailed-thread-demotivational-poster-1237346157.jpg

[evilfunnystuff]

cool info on the type o stuff danno i never heard that and it seems to jive with my experiance

[Rael]

Go fuck yourself Stern, I'll eat what I want

[Dionysus]

Ok, here's my two cents. Lord Skeletor does not come out and recommend that people raise chickens for more meat/eggs, which is very efficient. Instead, he wants all of the sheeple to eat grass, so their brains wilt and shrink, and they will be more pliant and weak. They will also be cleaner meat for when Lord Killgar and his vampire posse want to chow down on some human flesh. This is all true, even if I have taken a minor modicum of poetic license. All true.
--
Far as meat eating goes, I agree that people should cut back on McDonald's meat, which is just chemical and shit injected disease burger shipped in from a disease rampant nightmare of a factory farm in Mexico. But meat can be very healthy. It's full of the things that your body needs, cause it's a body too. Notice that plant-eating animals have to eat constantly all day to get enough nutrients.

[BenIsForRon]

They fully intend to kill us and rewild the Earth.
Believe it or not.

Don't fool yourself, you're talking about the same people who give subsidies to coal companies to do this:

http://blogs.wvgazette.com/coaltattoo/files/2009/03/mtr9.jpg

[awake]

Let's not kid ourselves here... Socialists want to play god. They wish all exclusive power to guide over the human race, even though it will wipe out most of humanity if they manage to gain it.

[Dieseler]

Don't fool yourself, you're talking about the same people who give subsidies to coal companies to do this:

http://blogs.wvgazette.com/coaltattoo/files/2009/03/mtr9.jpg

Don't fool yourself either.
It's not about the money and it never really was to begin with, it's about the power. They can continue to do that with 6 billion less of us still here and those resources will last a lot longer.
Useless eaters and consumers threaten the future of their unholy spawn.

[eOs]

Interesting times ahead.

[dannno]

It's not just the price of meat that's going to be more expensive. Check the thread title again. Meat and OTHER GOODS. See the article I posted in this thread. Farmland in general will be taken out of production for the sake of "crap and trade". Everything's going to be more expensive including the vegeburgers.

I completely disagree with using government intervention to raise the price of meat, or anything for that matter, but at the same time, in a free market the price of meat would be higher relative to the price of vegetables.. maybe both prices would go down if we had a free market, that would be optimal, I'm just saying that right now meat is high subsidized and much cheaper relative to vegetables than it should be.

[dannno]

Let's not kid ourselves here... Socialists want to play god. They wish all exclusive power to guide over the human race, even though it will wipe out most of humanity if they manage to gain it.

+1

[amy31416]

Guess they'll have to confiscate fishing poles, nets, rifles, slingshots, chicken farms, wild rabbits, turkeys, etc., if they truly want to impose such bullshit on us. Good luck with that.

Our brains are mostly composed of cholesterol, and it's necessary for it's development:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/10/091002093757.htm

Cholesterol-reducing drugs may reduce brain function:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090223221430.htm
http://www.biologynews.net/archives/2009/10/03/cholesterol_necessary_for_brain_development.html

I've also done some research in the past about cholesterol and fats being the precursor of hormones, specifically those related to fertility in both men and women. There is a possible correlation there, but not a lot of research into it.

[constituent]

I If I ever meet Lord Stern, I am going to fart in his general direction.

Why wait to meet the guy when the trade winds are already acting in your favor?

Let 'er rip!

[dannno]

Guess they'll have to confiscate fishing poles, nets, rifles, slingshots, chicken farms, wild rabbits, turkeys, etc., if they truly want to impose such bullshit on us. Good luck with that.

Our brains are mostly composed of cholesterol, and it's necessary for it's development:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/10/091002093757.htm

Cholesterol-reducing drugs may reduce brain function:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090223221430.htm
http://www.biologynews.net/archives/2009/10/03/cholesterol_necessary_for_brain_development.html

I've also done some research in the past about cholesterol and fats being the precursor of hormones, specifically those related to fertility in both men and women. There is a possible correlation there, but not a lot of research into it.


Because the human body can make cholesterol on its own, we do not need to eat any dietary cholesterol.

I believe it can be converted from fats from things like avocados and peanuts ( i use peanut oil to cook ).


Though I do also eat eggs, it is possible to be vegan, intelligent and have good cholesterol levels.

[jmdrake]

I completely disagree with using government intervention to raise the price of meat, or anything for that matter, but at the same time, in a free market the price of meat would be higher relative to the price of vegetables.. maybe both prices would go down if we had a free market, that would be optimal, I'm just saying that right now meat is high subsidized and much cheaper relative to vegetables than it should be.

Well a lot of stuff is subsidized. (Corn, soybeans, wheat, peanuts, etc.) I'm not sure that an artificially processed substitute meat product like a vegeburger would end up being as cheap relatively or otherwise that you might think. I agree with getting rid of subsidies for the sake of getting rid of subsidies. Ultimately the healthiest stuff is what you grow your self or what is grown by a farmer you know. And the best way to have cheap veggie burgers is to make them yourself. (Lots of recipes on the net).

[amy31416]

Because the human body can make cholesterol on its own, we do not need to eat any dietary cholesterol.

I believe it can be converted from fats from things like avocados and peanuts ( i use peanut oil to cook ).


Though I do also eat eggs, it is possible to be vegan, intelligent and have good cholesterol levels.

I wasn't implying that vegetarians are dumb, some are and some aren't. Although many vegans I've met are more than a bit nutty and want to try to force their pet cats to be vegans too. I find that hilarious.

However, if you think you can feed a developing child avocados and peanuts and expect they'll be able to make enough cholesterol from it--you're taking a chance that I never would. Not to mention that those are both products that do not grow around here, and the price would likely be similar to meat.

[LittleLightShining]

They fully intend to kill us and rewild the Earth.
Believe it or not.I believe it.


Guess they'll have to confiscate fishing poles, nets, rifles, slingshots, chicken farms, wild rabbits, turkeys, etc., if they truly want to impose such bullshit on us. Good luck with that.

Our brains are mostly composed of cholesterol, and it's necessary for it's development:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/10/091002093757.htm

Cholesterol-reducing drugs may reduce brain function:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090223221430.htm
http://www.biologynews.net/archives/2009/10/03/cholesterol_necessary_for_brain_development.html

I've also done some research in the past about cholesterol and fats being the precursor of hormones, specifically those related to fertility in both men and women. There is a possible correlation there, but not a lot of research into it.
THANK YOU, amy! I have done no research on this at all but I've had a gut feeling about this since my first pregnancy.

[Ninja Homer]

All they have to do is stop subsidizing corn, and meat prices will go up to where they should be. Almost all animals are currently being fed crappy subsidized corn just because it's so damn cheap. Then the prices on grass fed beef will be looking pretty good.

Ending corn subsidies will take care of at least a couple other problems as well, like high fructose corn syrup and the failed experiment that is corn ethanol. Allow the former corn growers to grow hemp and it would be a huge step in turning this country around.

[dannno]

All they have to do is stop subsidizing corn, and meat prices will go up to where they should be. Almost all animals are currently being fed crappy subsidized corn just because it's so damn cheap. Then the prices on grass fed beef will be looking pretty good.

Ending corn subsidies will take care of at least a couple other problems as well, like high fructose corn syrup and the failed experiment that is corn ethanol. Allow the former corn growers to grow hemp and it would be a huge step in turning this country around.

PreCISELY!!!!

[Original_Intent]

Couldn't we just bio-engineer the alfalfa to produce bean-o? Methane problem solved and everyone can have a cheeseburger.

[amy31416]

I believe it.


THANK YOU, amy! I have done no research on this at all but I've had a gut feeling about this since my first pregnancy.

You're welcome. A woman who I used to work with who's a physicist, got into a conversation with me about how she studied it intensively (because she and her husband couldn't get pregnant), and she claims that when she changed her diet to all organic, with lots of high-natural fat foods including butter, eggs, bacon, etc. that she was able to get pregnant. She runs marathons and had to take it easy there too and fatten up a bit.

I'm sure you can find some things about it on the 'net if you snoop around. She mentioned that she first learned of this from a naturopath.

[Yieu]

I wasn't implying that vegetarians are dumb, some are and some aren't. Although many vegans I've met are more than a bit nutty and want to try to force their pet cats to be vegans too. I find that hilarious.

However, if you think you can feed a developing child avocados and peanuts and expect they'll be able to make enough cholesterol from it--you're taking a chance that I never would. Not to mention that those are both products that do not grow around here, and the price would likely be similar to meat.

I too read that the body can produce it's own cholesterol, but if not that's what we have dairy for. Dairy is a wonderful substance, and it's great for developing children as well.

[JeNNiF00F00]

I agree with the rest of your post for the most part, but no human needs meat to be healthy. It is 100% optional for all humans. I'm not saying everyone "should stop", I'm just saying that no one "needs" it.

I eat raw red meat. I'd drink blood if I could. I need it. If I go without meat, I get violent.

[Yieu]

I eat raw red meat. I'd drink blood if I could. I need it. If I go without meat, I get violent.

It's great that you are able to make such a personal choice, and that no outside force is preventing you from doing so. No human needs it though -- that is all personal choice. If you get violent without it, it sounds like there may be some level of dependence on the substance. I'm not saying that's good or bad, just that it is not necessary for human survival, but rather is a matter of personal taste. I fully support your ability to chose what you eat at your personal discretion, regardless of whether it is out of necessity or personal taste.

I hope that they do not add some sort of tax to "meat and other goods" in the name of "climate change prevention" in some sort of effort to control what we consume. I would like to see subsidies be dropped, though -- as I am sure we all would, for the same reasons.