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YumYum
10-05-2009, 05:40 PM
Is there a name for Libertarians who are atheist? It would be nice if Christians and atheist would identify themselves, so Christian Libertarians wouldn't be offended. I am an agnostic and had a horrible experience in a cult, so I tend to be negative where religion is concerned, even though I do believe in freedom of worship. Joking about "God" doesn't bother me, but it may bother others. I thought that Libertarians were mostly atheist/agnostic, but I am finding out otherwise.

Uriel999
10-05-2009, 05:41 PM
Why do we need labels?

Acala
10-05-2009, 05:42 PM
Libertarianism is a political philosophy. Christianity is a religion. Trying to link the two makes no more sense than asking people to identify themselves as vegetarian libertarians.

scoot87
10-05-2009, 05:44 PM
Any Libertarian Satanists in the forum?

ForLiberty-RonPaul
10-05-2009, 05:46 PM
Any Libertarian Satanists in the forum?

Kludge

Kludge
10-05-2009, 05:49 PM
Kludge

You're thinking of JosephTheLibertarian. Kind of an offensive comparison, but whatever.

ForLiberty-RonPaul
10-05-2009, 05:53 PM
my bad. teal makes me crazy.

hugolp
10-05-2009, 05:55 PM
Any libertarian with foot fetish in the forum? IDENTIFY YOURSELF!!!

Kludge
10-05-2009, 05:55 PM
Any libertarian with foot fetish in the forum? IDENTIFY YOURSELF!!!

S'up?

sevin
10-05-2009, 06:15 PM
Libertarianism is a political philosophy. Christianity is a religion. Trying to link the two makes no more sense than asking people to identify themselves as vegetarian libertarians.

This.

Let's not divide ourselves unnecessarily and let's keep religious issue to the religion subforum.

Flash
10-05-2009, 06:21 PM
What's the name for Libertarians who believe shapeshifting reptilians did 9/11? I am in that club.

Brett
10-05-2009, 07:16 PM
I like the term "Paleo-Libertarian" for a family/Christian-value Libertarian. It's what I consider myself.

heavenlyboy34
10-05-2009, 07:25 PM
Libertarianism is a political philosophy. Christianity is a religion. Trying to link the two makes no more sense than asking people to identify themselves as vegetarian libertarians.

by necessity, libertarianism covers a number of areas beyond politics-such as social organization, crime/punishment, etc. I consider small l libertarianism more of a worldview/philosophy. :cool:

tonesforjonesbones
10-05-2009, 10:26 PM
Tones is a Christian Libertarian. tones

heavenlyboy34
10-05-2009, 10:48 PM
Tones is a Christian Libertarian. tones

Good to hear :cool:-I was under the impression that you were a "conservative".

Andrew-Austin
10-05-2009, 10:54 PM
Is there a name for Libertarians who are atheist? It would be nice if Christians and atheist would identify themselves, so Christian Libertarians wouldn't be offended. I am an agnostic and had a horrible experience in a cult, so I tend to be negative where religion is concerned, even though I do believe in freedom of worship. Joking about "God" doesn't bother me, but it may bother others. I thought that Libertarians were mostly atheist/agnostic, but I am finding out otherwise.

I think people call them libertatheists. :p :confused: :eek:

I Have no idea what the athiest/agnostic to theist ratio is among libertarians. We might have slightly more atheists than other political factions, but still overall be mostly theists. Since you know most people in America are theists..

Dr.3D
10-05-2009, 11:27 PM
Aren't atheist libertarians called anarchists? :D

Kludge
10-06-2009, 12:18 AM
Aren't atheist libertarians called anarchists? :D

Would you believe Josh_LA is a paleo-conservative?


I think people call them libertatheists. :p :confused: :eek:

I Have no idea what the athiest/agnostic to theist ratio is among libertarians. We might have slightly more atheists than other political factions, but still overall be mostly theists. Since you know most people in America are theists..

Religion
(old (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=60623)) (new (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=200936))

youngbuck
10-06-2009, 12:28 AM
YumYum doesn't like Christians, and would like to know who they are so he/she can properly direct his/her rudeness. Ok, that's probably not the case, but I bet it's something close to that.

Kludge
10-06-2009, 12:33 AM
YumYum doesn't like Christians, and would like to know who they are so he/she can properly direct his/her rudeness. Ok, that's probably not the case, but I bet it's something close to that.

In chat, we determined, through very scientific means, that YumYum is, in fact, mining data to report to the Illuminati.

Don't worry, we took care of it: YumYum now knows we're a violent & unstable personality cult armed to the teeth with weapons (explosives included) we were trained to produce, maintain, and alter thanks to our Canadian leader, Dr. Steven G. Parent. Our racist cult (so racist we only eat vanilla ice cream) acts as a giant militia, and to be accepted, due to the crackdown on militias by federal lapdogs, one must kill a census worker and leave a mark which easily identifies the person. Furthermore, our cult is seeking to bring down the United States federal government by cutting taxes, ignoring the national debt, and ending the Federal Reserve.

Danke
10-06-2009, 06:29 AM
In chat, we determined, through very scientific means, that YumYum is, in fact, mining data to report to the Illuminati.

Don't worry, we took care of it: YumYum now knows we're a violent & unstable personality cult armed to the teeth with weapons (explosives included) we were trained to produce, maintain, and alter thanks to our Canadian leader, Dr. Steven G. Parent. Our racist cult (so racist we only eat vanilla ice cream) acts as a giant militia, and to be accepted, due to the crackdown on militias by federal lapdogs, one must kill a census worker and leave a mark which easily identifies the person. Furthermore, our cult is seeking to bring down the United States federal government by cutting taxes, ignoring the national debt, and ending the Federal Reserve.

KLUDGE!! :mad:

http://z.about.com/d/painting/1/0/w/7/2/obj015-cat-out-bag-300.jpg

Nirvikalpa
10-06-2009, 11:14 AM
I have a vagina :( truth's out.

I heard that's pretty bad.

Feenix566
10-06-2009, 11:28 AM
As long as religion is voluntary, there's no reason for it to be a divisive issue among libertarians. Anyone who would want it to be involuntary wouldn't be a libertarian.

Theocrat
10-06-2009, 11:29 AM
Is there a name for Libertarians who are atheist? It would be nice if Christians and atheist would identify themselves, so Christian Libertarians wouldn't be offended. I am an agnostic and had a horrible experience in a cult, so I tend to be negative where religion is concerned, even though I do believe in freedom of worship. Joking about "God" doesn't bother me, but it may bother others. I thought that Libertarians were mostly atheist/agnostic, but I am finding out otherwise.

The real question is how can "atheists" justify the necessity for libertarianism, in general. More importantly, why should anyone be libertarian in an "atheist" universe of random order and purposelessness? We live, we die, and that's it, according to them. Relatively speaking, both liberty and tyranny are equal in an "atheist" worldview, since there is no absolute and objective standard of morality for them. Some people like to be free from authority, and some people like to impose authority upon others. "Atheism" doesn't make it necessary for us to choose one over the other, especially given their claim that we're nothing more than material agents from nature.

Interestingly enough, there are more "atheists" on the political Left than there are on the Right. It seems their worldview tends to gravitate towards more allegiance and power towards the State as god than not.

Feenix566
10-06-2009, 11:32 AM
The real question is how can "atheists" justify the necessity for libertarianism, in general. More importantly, why should anyone be libertarian in an "atheist" universe of random order and purposelessness? We live, we die, and that's it, according to them. Relatively speaking, both liberty and tyranny are equal in an "atheist" worldview, since there is no absolute and objective standard of morality for them. Some people like to be free from authority, and some people like to impose authority upon others. "Atheism" doesn't make it necessary for us to choose one over the other, especially given their claim that we're nothing more than material agents from nature.

Interestingly enough, there are more "atheists" on the political Left than there are on the Right. It seems their worldview tends to gravitate towards more allegiance and power towards the State as god than not.

I would explain to you why you're wrong, but since I don't go to church, nothing matters to me at all, my life is completely pointless, and it doesn't matter if I tell you how wrong you are or not.

ClayTrainor
10-06-2009, 06:46 PM
I don't prescribe to any kind of philosophical doctrine in terms of my religious / spiritual views.

I believe we are all a part of something. 1 thing. Whatever it is, it is me, it is you, it is the earth, it is the universe, It is us, we are it, it is everything. It always has been, and it always will be. It very simply, is. We were the dinosaurs, we were the big bang, we were whatever existed before the big bang, in the multi-verse. We are it, and for some reason it intends us to be individuals to explore it from within. I don't really like using the word "god", but i suppose the above could be interpreted as a godly concept.

Carl Sagan tends to sum up my views quite well.

"The idea that God is an oversized white male with a flowing beard who sits in the sky and tallies the fall of every sparrow is ludicrous. But if by God one means the set of physical laws that govern the universe, then clearly there is such a God. This God is emotionally unsatisfying... it does not make much sense to pray to the law of gravity." - Carl Sagan

dannno
10-06-2009, 06:51 PM
So.... are you gonna tell us about that Cult experience you had or what??

Dr.3D
10-06-2009, 06:53 PM
I have a vagina :( truth's out.

I heard that's pretty bad.

Is it as bad as having a penis?
/* looks down */

:confused:

heavenlyboy34
10-06-2009, 07:15 PM
I have a vagina :( truth's out.

I heard that's pretty bad.

Let me have a looksee and I'll tell you how bad it is. ;) lolz

emazur
10-06-2009, 07:16 PM
The real question is how can "atheists" justify the necessity for libertarianism, in general.

We don't want the government interfering in our lives. Simple as that.


More importantly, why should anyone be libertarian in an "atheist" universe of random order and purposelessness?

The universe may have a random order, but that doesn't mean the life of the individual should be - each atheist wants to bring to his life the kind of order that he desires. That cannot be done with an intrusive government, that can be done under a libertarian one.


Relatively speaking, both liberty and tyranny are equal in an "atheist" worldview,
:rolleyes:


since there is no absolute and objective standard of morality for them.

What is the absolute and objective standard of morality that you share with Jews, Hindus, Catholics, Buddhists, Mormons, Seventh Day Adventists, Muslims, Rastafarians, and practitioners of native African religions ? Are there standards of morality that you don't agree with? If so, I'd say theists have no absolute and objective standard of morality.


Some people like to be free from authority, and some people like to impose authority upon others. "Atheism" doesn't make it necessary for us to choose one over the other, especially given their claim that we're nothing more than material agents from nature.
Interestingly enough, there are more "atheists" on the political Left than there are on the Right. It seems their worldview tends to gravitate towards more allegiance and power towards the State as god than not.
O RLY?

http://freedomdemocrats.org/files/2006%20Nolan%20Chart.GIF
http://www.freedomdemocrats.org/node/812

Looks pretty authoritarian to me.

heavenlyboy34
10-06-2009, 07:17 PM
Not necessarily. Some Christian libertarians are anarchists, so there's no clear definition, other than obvious things, such as the non-aggression axiom.
Aren't atheist libertarians called anarchists? :D

Kludge
10-06-2009, 07:23 PM
KLUDGE!! :mad:

http://z.about.com/d/painting/1/0/w/7/2/obj015-cat-out-bag-300.jpg

What was the cat doing in the bag to begin with and why do we care that it's out?

Annihilia
10-06-2009, 07:27 PM
The real question is how can "atheists" justify the necessity for libertarianism, in general. More importantly, why should anyone be libertarian in an "atheist" universe of random order and purposelessness? We live, we die, and that's it, according to them. Relatively speaking, both liberty and tyranny are equal in an "atheist" worldview, since there is no absolute and objective standard of morality for them. Some people like to be free from authority, and some people like to impose authority upon others. "Atheism" doesn't make it necessary for us to choose one over the other, especially given their claim that we're nothing more than material agents from nature.

Interestingly enough, there are more "atheists" on the political Left than there are on the Right. It seems their worldview tends to gravitate towards more allegiance and power towards the State as god than not.

How ignorant. Do you live in a fortified compound?

LibertyRevolution
10-06-2009, 09:20 PM
The real question is how can "atheists" justify the necessity for libertarianism, in general. More importantly, why should anyone be libertarian in an "atheist" universe of random order and purposelessness? We live, we die, and that's it, according to them. Relatively speaking, both liberty and tyranny are equal in an "atheist" worldview, since there is no absolute and objective standard of morality for them. Some people like to be free from authority, and some people like to impose authority upon others. "Atheism" doesn't make it necessary for us to choose one over the other, especially given their claim that we're nothing more than material agents from nature.

Interestingly enough, there are more "atheists" on the political Left than there are on the Right. It seems their worldview tends to gravitate towards more allegiance and power towards the State as god than not.

#1) I believe in personal property rights. Whats mine is mine, and I can do with it what I will, as long as I don't harm your property.

#2) Why do you believe that just because we do not worship a god, that our lives are purposeless. Personally, I live my life to better myself and to help other that are in need. Why? Because I like the way it makes me feel about myself. I do not need a god to enforce my moral code.

#2.5) How are you going to speak about what we believe, there is no book of atheism. All atheism means is that I do not believe in a god. What happens to me when I die? I am unsure. I would like to believe that my thoughts, my consciousness, are just energy, and after this body fails me, I would exist in a non-corporeal state. But I am also perfectly comfortable with the fact that when I die, it will be just like before I was born, a period of nonexistence. Either way, good luck convincing me that I am going to burn in eternal hell for not worshiping some invisible being.

#3) Sorry you need a god to threaten you with eternal hell so that you can know the difference between right and wrong. Some of us are just raised to respect others and their property, its called parenting. Your parents chose to get their morals from church, mine chose to get theirs from how they wish to be treated.

#4) Of course there are more of us on the Left. You bible thumping, Jesus spouting, Christian sheep are bat-shit crazy. We do not want to be in the same party as you. Do you not understand that religion is one of the early forms of control? Your fallowing a book written 2000 years ago that was meant to keep the surfs in check. Please do the world a favor and go mix yourself a punch bowl.

:mad::mad::mad:

YumYum
10-07-2009, 11:23 AM
So.... are you gonna tell us about that Cult experience you had or what??

My parents raised me to become one of Jehovah's witnesses. Some argue that they are not a cult but a ridgid mind control group. I say they are a cult because they obediently follow every word of a group of old men in Brooklyn. They disfellowship memebers who disagree on any of their teachings and they forbid their members to have whole blood transfusions. My father did extensive research on the net and found out the religion was a cult and help get my family out, otherwise I would be right now working at their factory in New York, 5 and 1/2days a week, making $116 a month. When you talk to witnesses about religion they have a glaze in their eyes. That is because they are not listening to what you are saying, they are thinking about what they are going to say to you. This is one of the reasons I love college; it has taught me critical thinking, and I am reseaching everything I can about the Libertarian movement to come to my own conclusions. So far, so good. Witnesses frown on college and they are against critical thinking. I am glad I do not belong to that religion anymore.

ClayTrainor
10-07-2009, 11:30 AM
My parents raised me to become one of Jehovah's witnesses. Some argue that they are not a cult but a ridgid mind control group. I say they are a cult because they obediently follow every word of a group of old men in Brooklyn. They disfellowship memebers who disagree on any of their teachings and they forbid their members to have whole blood transfusions. My father did extensive research on the net and found out the religion was a cult and help get my family out, otherwise I would be right now working at their factory in New York, 5 and 1/2days a week, making $116 a month. When you talk to witnesses about religion they have a glaze in their eyes. That is because they are not listening to what you are saying, they are thinking about what they are going to say to you. This is one of the reasons I love college; it has taught me critical thinking, and I am reseaching everything I can about the Libertarian movement to come to my own conclusions. So far, so good. Witnesses frown on college and they are against critical thinking. I am glad I do not belong to that religion anymore.

Interesting, i'm glad you were able to break out of the brainwashing with your family. I used to have Witnesses constantly coming to my door trying to convert me, back at my old house.

Is it true that they are told that they are reserved a seat in heaven or something if they can convert enough people to the cult?

YumYum
10-07-2009, 12:09 PM
Interesting, i'm glad you were able to break out of the brainwashing with your family. I used to have Witnesses constantly coming to my door trying to convert me, back at my old house.

Is it true that they are told that they are reserved a seat in heaven or something if they can convert enough people to the cult?

They teach that only 144,000 Jehovah's witnesses go to heaven and the rest will live on a restored, paradise Earth. They believe that Jehovah's government, which is a Theocarcy, headed by Christ, rules from heaven and directs the Watchtower and Bible Tract Society. Witnesses do not have quotas when recruiting, but they do demand of their followers to put in at least 9 or 10 hours a month banging on doors. If you don't recrute, then you will not be saved at Armaggedon. Only witnesses will survive the coming Great Tribulation and Armaggedon, everybody else will be destroyed by Jehovah, a Jewish God.