Why are most of the youth brainwashed socialists?

[Light]

See topic title.

Also, do you think they will ever wake up?

[TGGRV]

Yes. The facts of life are conservative by nature. Unless they will end on welfare.

Anyway, the problem is the educational system that brainwashes them. All these "intellectuals" have no problem in selling information for ideology.

[torchbearer]

Public Drone factories are working.

[brandon]

Because they haven't had a real job yet and don't understand the relationship between taxation and social programs.


The ones that graduate college or learn a trade and get real jobs will eventually become free market thinkers (Likely of the Keynesian variety though.) The rest will never learn how to take care of themselves, depending on the "safety net" until the day they die. They won't change.

[Light]

Because they haven't had a real job yet and don't understand the relationship between taxation and social programs.


The ones that graduate college or learn a trade and get real jobs will eventually become free market thinkers (Likely of the Keynesian variety though.) The rest will never learn how to take care of themselves, depending on the "safety net" until the day they die. They won't change.

Does working for the public sector count as part of the "safety net"? :D

[torchbearer]

Does working for the public sector count as part of the "safety net"? :D

yes. a person who gets their money from the government will most likely continue to support that system.
If ObamaCare passes, it could add several million people to the government payroll.

[ARealConservative]

public schools and pop culture

[eOs]

I asked myself this very same question this morning. I was looking through the political imagery on deviantart.com and a good 60% is communist, che guvera bullshit. The other 40% seems to be Israel/Palestine related.

[KAYA]

yes. a person who gets their money from the government will most likely continue to support that system.
If ObamaCare passes, it could add several million people to the government payroll.

And thus the real reason for their obsession with having a government option. Not because they care about our health or fixing the problem. If they cared about that, they could have worked out a bill in a few days that would have the peoples support. But this is about increasing government dependence and further increasing their share of the voter base.

[awake]

Easy answer: Their parents introduce the system then the schools reinforce it. The parents give money, free cars , free education and bailout after bailout to their children, without the child ever realizing the labor that went into those expected privileges and more importantly realizing the full consequences of their own actions - junior is to precious to fail, so we must subsidize their lifestyle. The idea of of getting a job and learning the realities of working for money is wholy lost on whole segments of society. They then either stay at home to keep the gravy train, or move out looking for the same system to hand it to them...the government is willing and able to take them in.

[squarepusher]

Easy answer: Their parents introduce the system then the schools reinforce it. The parents give money, free cars , free education and bailout after bailout to their children, without the child ever realizing the labor that went into those expected privileges and more importantly realizing the full consequences of their own actions - junior is to precious to fail, so we must subsidize their lifestyle. The idea of of getting a job and learning the realities of working for money is wholy lost on whole segments of society. They then either stay at home to keep the gravy train, or move out looking for the same system to hand it to them...the government is willing and able to take them in.

this seems very likely, but I have to ask, why would the parents, who in their youth experiences very little government (compared to today), raise their children with such an irresponsible manner?

[pcosmar]

See topic title.

Also, do you think they will ever wake up?

Public Schools and Propaganda.

Some will wake up, when presented with logical evidence and truth. Some are intelligent, but misguided.
Some will not. Some will never think for themselves. Hence the term "sheep".

[Jordan]

As a youth, I think I may be able to shed some light into this.

I grew up to a very poor family. I couldn't ever ask my family for money, knowing that many times they just didn't have it. I learned to be a very independent person, and out of necessity, I started my first business at 12 years old to be able to support myself.

When I look at my friends, many love the typical democratic ideals. Most grew up in a wealthy family, they got their first luxury car at 16 years old, work for their parents for $12/hr when anywhere else they'd get minimum wage. Today, all of them are unemployed, their parents take out loans from the government to pay their way through $30k/year schools and they rely considerably on their parents. For them, success comes from the top, handed to them just for being born.

My mom always said she never gave us anything "because she loved us." And that couldn't be more true. Looking back, the best gift my parents ever gave me was nothing. I'm a better person for it, and I'll be sure to put these same ideals in each of my children.

You can look at any of today's youth and see which had the best life in the world growing up and those that didn't. Interestingly enough, those that had the easy life growing up find successful employment in the status quo of big government or corporatism, while those who didn't go on to be successful in their own way.

Personally, I'd rather take the "path less traveled" even if it means I have to work harder to get to the same place. Because, for me, its not where you end up, but how you get there that counts.

[JeNNiF00F00]

Yep, its a bunch of kids with entitlement issues, and also there is an arrogance about these kids that give them these entitlement issues. My my parents are kind of like Jordan's parents. We grew up middle class but I knew my parents didnt have the money to really give me so I had to WORK for it. If I found work in something or could make some $$ out of it, I would not mind working because I knew that was something that I could save and it would go into my piggy bank for something I really wanted like a nintendo game or something bigger....A CAR! I would save save save. That was also taught to me by my parents.

[kahless]

See topic title.

#1 The kids are continually programmed through the American entertainment industries such as music and Hollywood movie industry, subtle propaganda in most TV shows, blatant propaganda through MTV Networks (MTV, Nick, etc) and radio DJ's.

#2. Exposure to the mainstream media.

#3. The public school system.


Also, do you think they will ever wake up?

Some young people are wise to it, will eventually reject being programmed and rebel against it. Some will wake up when they enter the work force. But I am afraid there will be a majority that will be hard core supporters of Socialism.

[squarepusher]

As a youth, I think I may be able to shed some light into this.

I grew up to a very poor family. I couldn't ever ask my family for money, knowing that many times they just didn't have it. I learned to be a very independent person, and out of necessity, I started my first business at 12 years old to be able to support myself.

When I look at my friends, many love the typical democratic ideals. Most grew up in a wealthy family, they got their first luxury car at 16 years old, work for their parents for $12/hr when anywhere else they'd get minimum wage. Today, all of them are unemployed, their parents take out loans from the government to pay their way through $30k/year schools and they rely considerably on their parents. For them, success comes from the top, handed to them just for being born.

My mom always said she never gave us anything "because she loved us." And that couldn't be more true. Looking back, the best gift my parents ever gave me was nothing. I'm a better person for it, and I'll be sure to put these same ideals in each of my children.

You can look at any of today's youth and see which had the best life in the world growing up and those that didn't. Interestingly enough, those that had the easy life growing up find successful employment in the status quo of big government or corporatism, while those who didn't go on to be successful in their own way.

Personally, I'd rather take the "path less traveled" even if it means I have to work harder to get to the same place. Because, for me, its not where you end up, but how you get there that counts.

well spoken

[Matthew Zak]

As a school bus driver, I occasionally get to overhear highschool students argue their politics. It's really fascinating to see them get worked up over issues they only know little about, such as how "Obama's spending is going to bankrupt the country." Of course that argument is coming from a conservative standpoint, as the student probably didn't realize how big the government got in the previous 8 years under Bush, but he mentioned nothing of it. It was then I had the fortunate opportunity to ask the student what he knows about the Federal Reserve. This was his response: "I don't know how that's doing." So I asked, "Do you know what it is?" And he said, "Yeah, it's the place where they keep the money and regulate the dollar in the world."

At this point I figured I should cut to the chase, so I asked him if he knew what the dollar was worth now compared to 1913. He said, "Umm, like HALF!" And I said, "Lower." He goes, "No... it's like a third." "Lower." "Whhhhat?"

When I told him it was worth about a nickle he was speechless. I said, "How's that for regulating the dollar? If you want to know why the country is going bankrupt, look no further than the federal reserve." Then I explained in as simple terms as I could what a central bank is, why it's dangerous, and how it aids in the fall of empires like rome, and of course the united states. I told him how the united states wanted to use their own currency in this country and that the british didn't appreciate that, which was a major pretext for the american revolution and the declaration of independence. I told him how, by adopting a central bank in our country, we were going back on many of the words in our declaration of independence. He said that's really sad. It's amazing that this kid had all this put into context for him for the first time by his school bus driver.

[ClayTrainor]

As a school bus driver, I occasionally get to overhear highschool students argue their politics. It's really fascinating to see them get worked up over issues they only know little about, such as how "Obama's spending is going to bankrupt the country." Of course that argument is coming from a conservative standpoint, as the student probably didn't realize how big the government got in the previous 8 years under Bush, but he mentioned nothing of it. It was then I had the fortunate opportunity to ask the student what he knows about the Federal Reserve. This was his response: "I don't know how that's doing." So I asked, "Do you know what it is?" And he said, "Yeah, it's the place where they keep the money and regulate the dollar in the world."

At this point I figured I should cut to the chase, so I asked him if he knew what the dollar was worth now compared to 1913. He said, "Umm, like HALF!" And I said, "Lower." He goes, "No... it's like a third." "Lower." "Whhhhat?"

When I told him it was worth about a nickle he was speechless. I said, "How's that for regulating the dollar? If you want to know why the country is going bankrupt, look no further than the federal reserve." Then I explained in as simple terms as I could what a central bank is, why it's dangerous, and how it aids in the fall of empires like rome, and of course the united states. I told him how the united states wanted to use their own currency in this country and that the british didn't appreciate that, which was a major pretext for the american revolution and the declaration of independence. I told him how, by adopting a central bank in our country, we were going back on many of the words in our declaration of independence. He said that's really sad. It's amazing that this kid had all this put into context for him for the first time by his school bus driver.

That's why they always say. Do not let school get in the way of your education.

That was an awesome story, by the way, thanks for sharing. :)

[awake]

this seems very likely, but I have to ask, why would the parents, who in their youth experiences very little government (compared to today), raise their children with such an irresponsible manner?

This has not happened over night, it has slowly progressed over many generations.

Not long ago most people did not trust nor need the government. Since then we are more dependent on it then ever before. I beleive, it goes hand in hand with currency debasement and the quality of money. Look at the attitudes of people in this day and age; easy money, little or no morality, a political system of lies deceit and theft. All of it based on currency debasement.

Unsound money will eventually destroy civilization; sound money, free from monopoly will rebuild it.

Side point: As well, those who have served in the military have experienced what full and total communism is. They live it. When they leave the military they take with them the ideas of this system back into society and advocate, build and sow this systematic approach to molding human actions in their civilian careers.

Military service is the highest and most potent form of indoctrination and molding of the free man into a mindless serf.

[TGGRV]

Jean Francois Revel - Flight From Truth will explain you why this happens from a mass-media/education point of view.

Also, my parents pushed me to try hard. This is something my mother told me that I will never forget: if you want to have success in life, just being good isn't enough, you have to be twice as good as everyone else. We were talking about how others get privileges and shit.

[Andrew-Austin]

As a school bus driver, I occasionally get to overhear highschool students argue their politics. It's really fascinating to see them get worked up over issues they only know little about, such as how "Obama's spending is going to bankrupt the country." Of course that argument is coming from a conservative standpoint, as the student probably didn't realize how big the government got in the previous 8 years under Bush, but he mentioned nothing of it. It was then I had the fortunate opportunity to ask the student what he knows about the Federal Reserve. This was his response: "I don't know how that's doing." So I asked, "Do you know what it is?" And he said, "Yeah, it's the place where they keep the money and regulate the dollar in the world."

At this point I figured I should cut to the chase, so I asked him if he knew what the dollar was worth now compared to 1913. He said, "Umm, like HALF!" And I said, "Lower." He goes, "No... it's like a third." "Lower." "Whhhhat?"

When I told him it was worth about a nickle he was speechless. I said, "How's that for regulating the dollar? If you want to know why the country is going bankrupt, look no further than the federal reserve." Then I explained in as simple terms as I could what a central bank is, why it's dangerous, and how it aids in the fall of empires like rome, and of course the united states. I told him how the united states wanted to use their own currency in this country and that the british didn't appreciate that, which was a major pretext for the american revolution and the declaration of independence. I told him how, by adopting a central bank in our country, we were going back on many of the words in our declaration of independence. He said that's really sad. It's amazing that this kid had all this put into context for him for the first time by his school bus driver.


He undoubtedly found that more intriguing than whatever his teachers had been telling him all day.

[aravoth]

When I told him it was worth about a nickle he was speechless. I said, "How's that for regulating the dollar? If you want to know why the country is going bankrupt, look no further than the federal reserve." Then I explained in as simple terms as I could what a central bank is, why it's dangerous, and how it aids in the fall of empires like rome, and of course the united states. I told him how the united states wanted to use their own currency in this country and that the british didn't appreciate that, which was a major pretext for the american revolution and the declaration of independence. I told him how, by adopting a central bank in our country, we were going back on many of the words in our declaration of independence. He said that's really sad. It's amazing that this kid had all this put into context for him for the first time by his school bus driver.

That kid learned more on that bus ride than he will for the rest of the year.

[MelissaWV]

Besides the entitlement concept, I think the other factor cannot be ignored: children and young adults who do not work can still develop ideas in a vacuum.

The notion that no one should starve, no one should be homeless and everyone should have an "awesome" life... that tends to develop very early. Children, when they're still innocent, are big fans of the idea. The trouble comes as we grow up and figure out the "how" of those big ideas. Suddenly we're confronted with our first paycheck, which is likely exempt from some taxation so it's not even the full brunt of the blow. The Government needs HOW MUCH?!? And people are still starving?!? Outrageous! Then, hopefully, comes some awareness of just how much is wasted, and just how many things the Government shoves its nose into.

Of course, here is where you lose some people. Some of them are going to think, stubbornly, that confiscating money and spending it on those programs is all for the greater good, and it's making such a positive difference that people should be happy to pay their share (especially the rich... they should pay way more... sort of like in the Middle Ages when the rich paid the churches in order to try to buy a spot in heaven, to make up for their immoralities).

However, back to the first group. There is also at some point a realization that making everyone equal just causes stagnation. There's not really much incentive to develop new things, because you are putting your time and energy into something that will really give no tangible return other than its utility. Why share this with people outside of your immediate sphere of influence? Or, from the second group's standpoint, why innovate, when you can wait around for one of billions of other people to innovate, and then demand/whine and get the idea for yourself?

Okay, so let's just make the poor a little richer, right? Raise the minimum wage! Unfortunately, there's always going to be a smallest amount someone's making. That person will be relatively poor compared to the person who's making the most. Even if it's a few dollars, that disparity will exist and people will gripe about it eternally. The fact is that making us all rich seldom happens. Making us all poor (compared to the rest of the world) can happen, though, once we spend our resources on wealth redistribution and have nothing much else to offer the world.

[DirtMcGirt]

I really don't think anyone teaches them the concepts of money and taxes. I recently took my microeconomics requirement in school from a professor from Ghana who was outstanding.

When he started to bash cash for clunkers and how its ridiculous to say health care is a right b/c its a supply, a 1/4 of the class looked like their head would explode, another 1/4 would raise their hands and mangle some Dem talking points.

[eOs]

I really don't think anyone teaches them the concepts of money and taxes. I recently took my microeconomics requirement in school from a professor from Ghana who was outstanding.

When he started to bash cash for clunkers and how its ridiculous to say health care is a right b/c its a supply, a 1/4 of the class looked like their head would explode, another 1/4 would raise their hands and mangle some Dem talking points.

exactly man, the fundamental concepts are not being taught, you're immediately thrown into the fire, and then you've already lost because you're now basing logic off of it.

[Andrew-Austin]

This has basically already been said but let me put it in my own words:

public schools shield them from reality for the entirety of their young lives, and the same applies to college if their parents are paying for the bulk of it. History turns in to propaganda, political science is purely propaganda, the field of sociology is mostly comprised of marxists and socialists, and most other social/philosophic type classes are highly in favor of government violence as a solution to societies problems.

And I'm 20 for the record.

[Conza88]

Itunes -> search: freedomain radio (podcast)

1460 Statism and Early Education - I let rip.
85. Public Schools (Part 4 - Alternatives) Some possible alternatives to 14 years in jail
84. Public Schools (Part 3 - Vouchers) The moral and practical effects of school vouchers
83. Public Schools (Part 2) Zoo biology - we don't see no stinkin' cages!
82. Public Schools (Part 1) Zoo biology - we don't see no stinkin' cages!

Haven't got to them yet, but I'd imagine they are worthwhile. :)

[YumYum]

You're stereotyping. Youth are no more socialist than older adults. Ron Paul answers why anybody, young and old, would like socialism, on page 56 of his book "End The Fed." He states: "Of course, the ideology of welfare and socialism is easier to sell since it is based on the majority getting something for free." And he further claims: "But when the people recognize that's only a tempoary situation they will become more open to the suggestion that freedom offers more, once the bankruptcy of statism is acknowledged. Such a condition is becoming more apparent every day." And young people are much more keen at realizing this and changing their thinking than adults.

How do we make the youth aware that socialism is wrong? In the preceding paragraph Dr. Paul asserts: "..education is the key to political change." And the youth are responding. When Dr. Paul spoke at the University of Michigan in October 2007, 4,000 students took up the chant "End The Fed! End The Fed! End The Fed!", and they burnt dollar bills in protest because they care about their future. I didn't see any brianwashed socialist youth there. The youth are a major contributor in making Ron Paul's message become a reality. I know, because I am one of them.

[JeNNiF00F00]

You're stereotyping. Youth are no more socialist than older adults. Ron Paul answers why anybody, young and old, would like socialism, on page 56 of his book "End The Fed." He states: "Of course, the ideology of welfare and socialism is easier to sell since it is based on the majority getting something for free." And he further claims: "But when the people recognize that's only a tempoary situation they will become more open to the suggestion that freedom offers more, once the bankruptcy of statism is acknowledged. Such a condition is becoming more apparent every day." And young people are much more keen at realizing this and changing their thinking than adults.

How do we make the youth aware that socialism is wrong? In the preceding paragraph Dr. Paul asserts: "..education is the key to political change." And the youth are responding. When Dr. Paul spoke at the University of Michigan in October 2007, 4,000 students took up the chant "End The Fed! End The Fed! End The Fed!", and they burnt dollar bills in protest because they care about their future. I didn't see any brianwashed socialist youth there. The youth are a major contributor in making Ron Paul's message become a reality. I know, because I am one of them.

Yes but what the older people are seeing is that these kids are becoming less and less as time moves on. I'm 32 years old. I can see a MAJOR difference in how kids have changed since when I was in school. People used to have more pride about making it on their own. Something is very different, and it STINKS.

[torchbearer]

You're stereotyping.


If that is directed at the OP- in his defense, he said "most" not "all" youth.
Ron Paul has a huge youth army and YAL is kicking ass, but if you look at Obama's sheep, many more youth are falling for his lies.
You are right, the best time to reach someone is in their youth.
That is why YAL is so important.

[YumYum]

Yes but what the older people are seeing is that these kids are becoming less and less as time moves on. I'm 32 years old. I can see a MAJOR difference in how kids have changed since when I was in school. People used to have more pride about making it on their own. Something is very different, and it STINKS.

I would like to point out what stinks about the older generation. It is because of your generation and older generations that we're in this stinking mess. Who are you going to blame the National Debt on? Today's youth? Who are you going to blame for putting an idiot like Bush in office? Today's youth? Who are you going to blame the Iraq war on? Todays youth? Who are you going to blame for our politicians selling out to special interest like AIPAC? Todays youth? Who are you going to blame for all the video games and other elecronic gadgets that kids are addicted to? Today's youth? This world is fucked up, so we are going to blame the youth? Give me a break!!

[torchbearer]

I would like to point out what stinks about the older generation. It is because of your generation and older generations that we're in this stinking mess. Who are you going to blame the National Debt on? Today's youth? Who are you going to blame for putting an idiot like Bush in office? Today's youth? Who are you going to blame the Iraq war on? Todays youth? Who are you going to blame for our politicians selling out to special interest like AIPAC? Todays youth? Who are you going to blame for all the video games and other elecronic gadgets that kids are addicted to? Today's youth? This world is fucked up, so we are going to blame the youth? Give me a break!!

i don't think she is blaming the youth. just disappointed in what she is seeing.
The national debt has been going on for hundreds of years.
Before anyone on this forum was born.

For myself personally, I've always been a libertarian- from birth.
At 18 I started my political career in the Libertarian Party fighting against big government... this was 1996.. when it wasn't "cool" to be libertarian. in fact, people would ask me if that was like communist. no one even knew what libertarian was...
I couldn't have done anymore to fight against the ills of this country. Didn't change anything until Ron ran for President.
I think people who haven't been fighting this battle for decades couldn't appreciate what we have really achieved in the last 3-4 years. It has been awesome.

[Light]

Yes but what the older people are seeing is that these kids are becoming less and less as time moves on. I'm 32 years old. I can see a MAJOR difference in how kids have changed since when I was in school. People used to have more pride about making it on their own. Something is very different, and it STINKS.

Exactly, I am in the same generation as these people, and quite simply they think the government should take care of them their entire lives. They view Europe as what America should be.

Here is an article that paints a scary picture of the future:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columns/Millenials-are-the-coming-statist-generation_-7965773-50645727.html

[Andrew-Austin]

People used to have more pride about making it on their own. Something is very different, and it STINKS.

Perhaps it is a lot harder to make it on one's on today. What with our purchasing power being perpetually robbed, jobs going overseas and disappearing, and the government in general ravaging the economy.



In fact, people would ask me if that was like a communist.

Oh wow, that would be quite an awkward question to get.

[torchbearer]

Perhaps it is a lot harder to make it on one's on today. What with our purchasing power being perpetually robbed, jobs going overseas and disappearing, and the government in general ravaging the economy.

Reminds me of a Harry Browne quote-

“Government is good at only one thing. It knows how to break your legs, hand you a crutch, and say, ‘See if it weren’t for the government, you couldn’t walk.’” – Harry Browne

[torchbearer]

Oh wow, that would be quite an awkward question to get.

It was very frustrating, the level of ignorance.
The answer was easy- Libertarian is the opposite of Communism. You could debate the fine points of that answer, but for most people- it was good enough.

[CoreyBowen999]

There are still a bunch of kids that I know that are extremely libertarian like I am. In fact I know atleast 10 people that are in my grade. The thing is I have no clue how many others there are cause I notice most of the people that have same views as me are the quietest in the grade.

[torchbearer]

There are still a bunch of kids that I know that are extremely libertarian like I am. In fact I know atleast 10 people that are in my grade. The thing is I have no clue how many others there are cause I notice most of the people that have same views as me are the quietest in the grade.

that is awesome. You can have a huge influence on your friends.
Be a leader, not a follower- You can change the future of this country if you can influence your classmates.

[tonesforjonesbones]

I guess the saying goes: "If you are not a liberal in your 20's you have no heart, If you are still a liberal in your 40's you have no money." TONES

[Live_Free_Or_Die]

nt

[JeNNiF00F00]

Perhaps it is a lot harder to make it on one's on today. What with our purchasing power being perpetually robbed, jobs going overseas and disappearing, and the government in general ravaging the economy.



Oh wow, that would be quite an awkward question to get.

Dood, you are talking to someone who is currently without job living with their parents, and did I mention, im 32? I know exactly how hard it is to make it on your own. However I am not advocating any socialism or communism. It makes me work just that much harder. There is a difference, the younger adults I see today are much softer and less resilient or something. This may not include you or yumyum but it accounts for a lot of these little punks out there thinking they are entitled to part of my paycheck. The jobs are going over seas because of government. Why would anyone who understands what is happening, be in their right mind to vote for more.

Look at how government is working for these libs and commies at the G20 riots. These are the same people who want big govt, yet they are surprised when the gd cops start shooting gas grenades and using excessive force so they cannot protest. What do they expect? Well, from what I can gather, they think that under THEIR style government that nothing would ever get the way it is in PA right now. Naive, fools.

[Andrew-Austin]

Dood, you are talking to someone who is currently without job living with their parents, and did I mention, im 32? I know exactly how hard it is to make it on your own. However I am not advocating any socialism or communism. It makes me work just that much harder. There is a difference, the younger adults I see today are much softer and less resilient or something. This may not include you or yumyum but it accounts for a lot of these little punks out there thinking they are entitled to part of my paycheck. The jobs are going over seas because of government. Why would anyone who understands what is happening, be in their right mind to vote for more.

Look at how government is working for these libs and commies at the G20 riots. These are the same people who want big govt, yet they are surprised when the gd cops start shooting gas grenades and using excessive force so they cannot protest. What do they expect? Well, from what I can gather, they think that under THEIR style government that nothing would ever get the way it is in PA right now. Naive, fools.

I'm wasn't saying their faith and reliance in government is justified. Suffice it to say they haven't been allowed to see what a truly free market would look like, and they have only heard from sources/influences that favor government intervention growing up.

Instead of just calling them lazy, selfish, control freak retards; I am trying to understand what circumstances they were raised in that encouraged their faith in government. The circumstances that were after all, created for them by previous generations.

[JeNNiF00F00]

I'm wasn't saying their faith and reliance in government is justified. Suffice it to say they haven't been allowed to see what a truly free market would look like, and they have only heard from sources/influences that favor government intervention growing up.

This is true. All they know is Clinton, and Bush...and now the messiah. IMO this is part of what has made them soft and spoiled.

[YumYum]

There are still a bunch of kids that I know that are extremely libertarian like I am. In fact I know atleast 10 people that are in my grade. The thing is I have no clue how many others there are cause I notice most of the people that have same views as me are the quietest in the grade.

Thanks for sharing Corey. I do believe that there are more kids that support Ron Paul's message than we realize. Kids today are listening because they know that the propects of a third world war and financial collapse are a reality. Today's youth are lot more sharper than adults give them credit.

[tonesforjonesbones]

well..i agree ...the older generation has been at fault..that is why I became active..to try to help as much as I can before I leave the planet. BUT...todays youth had a lot to do with electing that idiot Obama. Tones

[squarepusher]

Dood, you are talking to someone who is currently without job living with their parents, and did I mention, im 32? I know exactly how hard it is to make it on your own. However I am not advocating any socialism or communism. It makes me work just that much harder. There is a difference, the younger adults I see today are much softer and less resilient or something. This may not include you or yumyum but it accounts for a lot of these little punks out there thinking they are entitled to part of my paycheck. The jobs are going over seas because of government. Why would anyone who understands what is happening, be in their right mind to vote for more.

Look at how government is working for these libs and commies at the G20 riots. These are the same people who want big govt, yet they are surprised when the gd cops start shooting gas grenades and using excessive force so they cannot protest. What do they expect? Well, from what I can gather, they think that under THEIR style government that nothing would ever get the way it is in PA right now. Naive, fools.
Jen, hi-5! im 30 and live with my parents, not my ideal situation but its hard to get ahead while draining money to rent, separate utilities etc every month.

[JeNNiF00F00]

Jen, hi-5! im 30 and live with my parents, not my ideal situation but its hard to get ahead while draining money to rent, separate utilities etc every month.

Exactly. Its the smart thing to do imo. This is why family and community is so important.

[Andrew-Austin]

Well good I don't have to feel weird about living with my parents at age 20. As long as I'm not living off of others who are forced to support me involuntarily. Though I pay my share of rent and utilities anyways its just a lot lower.

[Endgame]

College is a big part of the problem. Its the ultimate source of the leftist idiots that run the public schools. Its also a massive scam and the majority of people I knew from high school that went have dropped out after incurring enough debt to buy a small house, and the degrees they were sort of pretending to go after were worthless anyway. When we had a healthy economy with a natural amount of manufacturing, there were trades or even plenty of menial jobs these people could do. Now, these dropouts are lucky to be working fast food. Growing up in the suburbs, we were told eeeeeeveryone has to go to college, and that this is somehow desirable and that a country's workforce can be composed of nothing but college grads. It seems all anyone wants to do is play XBOX, smoke weed, and fantasize about screwing women as old as their mothers (MILFS! hurrrr). Something is definitely fucked up here. Rampant illiteracy doesn't help either. Hell, I find it almost impossible to communicate with most college students in plain English. They stare at me dumbfounded when I use any word that wasn't in a 90's sitcom.

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

If their life depends on the system, they will fight to protect it.

[anaconda]

The 60's pop culture's method of being "anti-establishment" was to be communist. Since the U.S. was "capitalist" and we were in a hugely unpopular war, the socialist/communist hippy commune idea was the norm of the counterculture. WHEN IN REALITY it could have been, and should have been, a anti-big-government hippy movement. An anti-Fed anti-income tax anti- bureaucracy hippy movement. That would have been way more countercultural. But that was a bit too complicated at the time plus there appears to have been some CIA/Ford Foundation type involvement in assisting the leftist subculture. How much of this may have been significant I don't know.

[Light]

The 60's pop culture's method of being "anti-establishment" was to be communist. Since the U.S. was "capitalist" and we were in a hugely unpopular war, the socialist/communist hippy commune idea was the norm of the counterculture. WHEN IN REALITY it could have been, and should have been, a anti-big-government hippy movement. An anti-Fed anti-income tax anti- bureaucracy hippy movement. That would have been way more countercultural. But that was a bit too complicated at the time plus there appears to have been some CIA/Ford Foundation type involvement in assisting the leftist subculture. How much of this may have been significant I don't know.

Oh well.

I kind of wish that new a counterculture would arise that would rebel not only the government, but as well as what was taught in the schools (the leftist propaganda) and the immorality decadence pushed on by Hollywood and pop culture. That would be a true counterculture.

Does anyone think this can happen?

Also, I remember reading somewhere, that contrary to popular belief, people rarely change their political ideology as they get older.

If this is true... kiss your gun rights, free speech, and most of your economic rights goodbye

[Pericles]

this seems very likely, but I have to ask, why would the parents, who in their youth experiences very little government (compared to today), raise their children with such an irresponsible manner?

I found my ex-GF instructive as an example. She grew up in very modest circumstances and did well economically as an adult. She spoiled here kids so they would not grow up having to do without the things she lacked. The kids, not knowing the difference, all became self absorbed a-holes. I attributed that to not every having to have to earn success. when the money ran out, the kids couldn't adjust to living a normal or more modest life and trouble resulted.

[anaconda]

Oh well.

I kind of wish that new a counterculture would arise that would rebel not only the government, but as well as what was taught in the schools (the leftist propaganda) and the immorality decadence pushed on by Hollywood and pop culture. That would be a true counterculture.

Does anyone think this can happen?

Also, I remember reading somewhere, that contrary to popular belief, people rarely change their political ideology as they get older.

If this is true... kiss your gun rights, free speech, and most of your economic rights goodbye


As a Ron Paul supporter I am OK with Hollywood immoral decadence. That's freedom of speech. But I imagine that a United States without big government interference would find that the free market would demand different types of movies and entertainment from Hollywood, and they would surely respond through the profit motive.

[JeNNiF00F00]

College is a big part of the problem. Its the ultimate source of the leftist idiots that run the public schools. Its also a massive scam and the majority of people I knew from high school that went have dropped out after incurring enough debt to buy a small house, and the degrees they were sort of pretending to go after were worthless anyway. When we had a healthy economy with a natural amount of manufacturing, there were trades or even plenty of menial jobs these people could do. Now, these dropouts are lucky to be working fast food. Growing up in the suburbs, we were told eeeeeeveryone has to go to college, and that this is somehow desirable and that a country's workforce can be composed of nothing but college grads. It seems all anyone wants to do is play XBOX, smoke weed, and fantasize about screwing women as old as their mothers (MILFS! hurrrr). Something is definitely fucked up here. Rampant illiteracy doesn't help either. Hell, I find it almost impossible to communicate with most college students in plain English. They stare at me dumbfounded when I use any word that wasn't in a 90's sitcom.

There is nothing wrong with smoking weed, & playing xbox. This is not just a "Lefty" or a "Loser" thing to do. A considerable amount of people on these boards do it, and if it wasnt for the weed, I never would have come across RP or opened my mind to that extent to even do the research about his philosophy. Just something you may want to rethink before you start pointing fingers at who is causing problems.

[JeNNiF00F00]

Oh well.

I kind of wish that new a counterculture would arise that would rebel not only the government, but as well as what was taught in the schools (the leftist propaganda) and the immorality decadence pushed on by Hollywood and pop culture. That would be a true counterculture.

Does anyone think this can happen?

Also, I remember reading somewhere, that contrary to popular belief, people rarely change their political ideology as they get older.

If this is true... kiss your gun rights, free speech, and most of your economic rights goodbye

When you start talking about "immorals" you're standing on a slippery slope because you are going into neocon territory there. People should have liberty to choose how they want to live their own lives without having someone telling them they are being immoral. Thats 1 problem I have with the current GOP now. The gun rights free speech and economic rights are only a portion of liberty.

Secondly I think that peoples ideologies change all the time. The problems we have now, is that its 'cool' to be a commie. Kids are being indoctrinated in schools, and spoiled at home.

[Deborah K]

Because the progressives have been dumbing down the curriculum for decades. Sorry if this is redundant - haven't read the thread. Just my 2

[Light]

When you start talking about "immorals" you're standing on a slippery slope because you are going into neocon territory there. People should have liberty to choose how they want to live their own lives without having someone telling them they are being immoral. Thats 1 problem I have with the current GOP now. The gun rights free speech and economic rights are only a portion of liberty.

Secondly I think that peoples ideologies change all the time. The problems we have now, is that its 'cool' to be a commie. Kids are being indoctrinated in schools, and spoiled at home.

I believe people have a right to be "immoral", however, what I don't like is when immorality is state subsidized (meaning that the government will pick up the tab for your bad decisions). When people make bad decisions, they expect others to bail them out. The lack of self-responsibility is a big reason why government is as big as it is today.

You can smoke all the pot you want, however, it would immoral for a smoker to have me pay for their healthcare as a result of the poor decisions they made.

Second, It has been cool to be a commie for the past 50 years. Commies are the status quo. When are we going to see a challenge to this?

[tangent4ronpaul]

The public fool system.

-t

[JeNNiF00F00]

I believe people have a right to be "immoral", however, what I don't like is when immorality is state subsidized (meaning that the government will pick up the tab for your bad decisions). When people make bad decisions, they expect others to bail them out. The lack of self-responsibility is a big reason why government is as big as it is today.

You can smoke all the pot you want, however, it would immoral for a smoker to have me pay for their healthcare as a result of the poor decisions they made.

Second, It has been cool to be a commie for the past 50 years. Commies are the status quo. When are we going to see a challenge to this?

Why do you think some of us are so against the health care system they are trying to implement? Do you think it will stop there with weed? How about soft drinks? How about the amount of sugar you ingest daily? What about Carb intake? You don't take your vitamins like you should so we are going to take your healthcare away. Lets also not forget sex and breeders out there with like 15 kids.

Lets flip it around. What about going to a fast food restaurant and being turned down for a greasy burger because you have high cholesterol and the govt wont let you eat one, like on Freedom to Fascism. You can have a sprout sandwich tho.

Commies have been cool for 50 years? I think that just recently that communism has become more of a "cool" thing. I say in the past 10 years. Before that, people had no clue really what communism was except that it was anti american.

[Bucjason]

Most people , when they're young , are much more idealistic and emotional about politics. Spreading the wealth to help others sounds like a noble cause.

Then , when you grow up and enter the real world , and see your pay-stubs and how much the government STEALS from you every week with no results to show for it , you tend to change your mind.

It's like the Winston Churchhill qoute: " If you're not a liberal when you're young , you're heartless. If you're not a conservative when you're old , you're brainless"

[Light]

Why do you think some of us are so against the health care system they are trying to implement? Do you think it will stop there with weed? How about soft drinks? How about the amount of sugar you ingest daily? What about Carb intake? You don't take your vitamins like you should so we are going to take your healthcare away. Lets also not forget sex and breeders out there with like 15 kids.

Lets flip it around. What about going to a fast food restaurant and being turned down for a greasy burger because you have high cholesterol and the govt wont let you eat one, like on Freedom to Fascism. You can have a sprout sandwich tho.

Commies have been cool for 50 years? I think that just recently that communism has become more of a "cool" thing. I say in the past 10 years. Before that, people had no clue really what communism was except that it was anti american.

I was using smoking as an example. I was not singling it out.

Yes, I realize when socialized healthcare comes, no doubt the fools in the government will start banning certain foods in futile attempts from keeping it from bankrupting us. The sad thing is that socialized healthcare is a matter of when, not if.

Also, commies have been cool with pseudo-intellectuals since the 60's, hence the "50 years".

[JeNNiF00F00]

I was using smoking as an example. I was not singling it out.

Yes, I realize when socialized healthcare comes, no doubt the fools in the government will start banning certain foods in futile attempts from keeping it from bankrupting us. The sad thing is that socialized healthcare is a matter of when, not if.

Also, commies have been cool with pseudo-intellectuals since the 60's, hence the "50 years".

Yes, but those were hippies mainly. Now its like "normal" kids falling under this.

[youngbuck]

Why? Because that's what they're taught to be on TV and in school. That's why when I have kids, they will watch very little TV and will not step foot into a government indoctrination center.

[TGGRV]

The state of the educational system actually makes me consider homeschooling. I mean, I'm not the type of woman that will enjoy staying at home and being a housewife. I will feel unfilled. But, I'd rather do that than have my kids brainwashed. I have really mixed feelings about what I should do. :(

[torchbearer]

The state of the educational system actually makes me consider homeschooling. I mean, I'm not the type of woman that will enjoy staying at home and being a housewife. I will feel unfilled. But, I'd rather do that than have my kids brainwashed. I have really mixed feelings about what I should do. :(

if you have a mate, perhaps your mate could teach your children while you work.

[SimpleName]

Probably from brainwashing. Just my guess. lol. Really, though, kids have no spine. Their parents obviously don't expose them to principled thinking. In my AP Economics course, the kids would challenge something, the teacher would refute it (right or wrong) and the kids would back down to a point of eventually agreeing. That may be the biggest problem. Nobody relies on their gut anymore. "Obama is tied to communists, has communists advising him, has sworn to change the country, offered stimulus bills, cap & trade, and universal healthcare....NAH! He can't be a communist. He is our president. No way." That kindda thinking is historically the absolute worst possible way to think. When something instinctively feels bad, it usually is. And speaking of history, I think it is also a total lack of real history being taught. I don't remember any of my teachers pointing out how Hitler/Stalin progressively increased their tyranny and didn't just pour it on all at once. They'd find some crazy justification, people would be unsure, but then eventual go along until the Holocaust. And THERE IT IS again! People's lack of spine allowed them to eventually accept something that they knew was probably horrible. What a heinous circle this is.

[TGGRV]

if you have a mate, perhaps your mate could teach your children while you work.
That's impossible because if I'd have a couple of kids, I would earn less when I get back in the workforce than he would if he works. I mean, I have no problem in sacrificing my desires for my future children(I don't have any now :P), but it's pathetic that it lead to this.

[torchbearer]

That's impossible because if I'd have a couple of kids, I would earn less when I get back in the workforce than he would if he works. I mean, I have no problem in sacrificing my desires for my future children(I don't have any now :P), but it's pathetic that it lead to this.

There are ways you can earn more than a man.
Selling insurance for instance... not hard to do. Pays a lot.

[andrewh817]

easy answer: Their parents introduce the system then the schools reinforce it. The parents give money, free cars , free education and bailout after bailout to their children, without the child ever realizing the labor that went into those expected privileges and more importantly realizing the full consequences of their own actions - junior is to precious to fail, so we must subsidize their lifestyle. The idea of of getting a job and learning the realities of working for money is wholy lost on whole segments of society. They then either stay at home to keep the gravy train, or move out looking for the same system to hand it to them...the government is willing and able to take them in.

nailed it!

[Wampy]

There are still a bunch of kids that I know that are extremely libertarian like I am. In fact I know atleast 10 people that are in my grade. The thing is I have no clue how many others there are cause I notice most of the people that have same views as me are the quietest in the grade.

This is a longstanding trend and you are not alone in this. Most people are not a big fan of having people glower and bitch at them all day. If you are in a very baptist crowd, you don't really mention that you are gay. If you are in school, you don't really mention that you are anything other than liberal (socialist). You are just trying to get through your day. Who wants the extra aggravation?

I know this will get groans from some here, but this is a good parallel. I was watching Beck last night. He had a little town hall of sorts made of of moms who were involved with the 9/12 protests. One woman commented that she had felt this way (worried about government and feeling a little conservative or libertarian) for quite some time, but felt all alone. She felt uncomfortable expressing her disagreement with her child's school on potentially political issues.

Then she screwed up the courage to go to the protests. She was surprised to see other mothers from the school there. Suddenly she was not alone. She discovered that there were others who felt the same way, but who were also similarly quiet. Now they have a little group that gets together apparently. Good for her!

It's kinda like guns. You may not like them, but if you don't have one, only the government and the crooks do. Similarly we have political ideas. You may not like them, but if you are silent, only the socialists and special interests are implementing them.

This is how a country that polls generally describe as "center-right" has had such a successful socialist movement. The folks paying the bills, doing the work, abiding the law, etc., do not speak up often. They are too busy, or feel all that shouting and protest stuff is for the crazies. This is why I am very hopeful that the election of an avowed Marxist will end up being the ultimate footbullet for the socialist movement in this country. The people involved are so blatantly radical, marxist, and their proposals so over the top, that the regular folks will finally raise a voice. I feel the town halls, 9/12 and tax day protests, and a growing interest in independents and 3rd parties are all great signs of this.

It's the only thing that will change anything. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Until now, that squeak has been almost exclusively socialist.

Gotta squeak baby! Gotta squeak!


Two words that are ingrained into youth:

Equal Opportunity

That may be, but what is really being ingrained is "equal outcomes". This is an unachievable lie though, and that is the key. If it can't be achieved, the government has a perpetual blank check to do what ever it wants in the name of "fixing it".

Certainly, universities are a great place to go to see what the near future looks like, if the socialists have their way. Where you are only allowed "free speech" if you are espousing the correct ideology. Maybe you can have some if you stick to the approved "free speech zone" and have written permission to engage in your speech in that zone.

Some links for some good reading in relation to these issues:

http://www.thefire.org/ A wonderful organization fighting for constitutional rights in education. What the ACLU could have been.

University of Delaware: Students Required to Undergo Ideological Reeducation. Be sure to check out the video listed under the article in the "case materials" section. http://www.thefire.org/case/752.html

Breitbart.tv Covers Mysterious 'Sexual Harassment' Case at East Georgia College http://www.thefire.org/article/11112.html

Bucks County Community College: Ideological Loyalty Oath for Professors http://www.thefire.org/case/63.html

Columbia University: Ideological Litmus Tests at Teachers College http://www.thefire.org/case/725.html

Hampton University: Gay and Lesbian Student Group Denied Recognition Without Explanation http://www.thefire.org/case/736.html

Hamline University: Student Suspended after Advocating Concealed Carry on Campus http://www.thefire.org/case/750.html

West Virginia University: Limit on Speech to Campus "Free Speech Zones" http://www.thefire.org/case/30

[andrewh817]

this seems very likely, but I have to ask, why would the parents, who in their youth experiences very little government (compared to today), raise their children with such an irresponsible manner?

That's a great question. My take on this is that the parents are not necessarily raising their kids with socialist ideals but rather the parents are not raising their kids at all. In most households both parents are working full-time to support them and in turn find it easier to let the mainstream media and the child's peers raise them.

[awake]

That's a great question. My take on this is that the parents are not necessarily raising their kids with socialist ideals but rather the parents are not raising their kids at all. In most households both parents are working full-time to support them and in turn find it easier to let the mainstream media and the child's peers raise them.

This too is a good point. And I have seen, far to many times, that guilt spending is a substitute for parental time. This is where the idea of the subsidized life style begins.

This is where the phrase 'Spoiling them' originates.

[LibForestPaul]

Because they haven't had a real job yet and don't understand the relationship between taxation and social programs.


The ones that graduate college or learn a trade and get real jobs will eventually become free market thinkers (Likely of the Keynesian variety though.) The rest will never learn how to take care of themselves, depending on the "safety net" until the day they die. They won't change.

Just say it, pussies...
Soft easy life... no wondering if you are going to starve, freeze, get shot or bombed, living high off of debt( FRN). We'll see after the dollar is collapsed, NAFTA is in full swing, and most Americans standard of living drops 25%. Oh, and high youth unemployment as in Europe.

[squarepusher]

Just say it, pussies...
Soft easy life... no wondering if you are going to starve, freeze, get shot or bombed, living high off of debt( FRN). We'll see after the dollar is collapsed, NAFTA is in full swing, and most Americans standard of living drops 25%. Oh, and high youth unemployment as in Europe.

so, your making the point that this type of behavior is inevitable as society progresses with technologies that allow for food and basic survival resources to be non issues anymore?

[Endgame]

There is nothing wrong with smoking weed, & playing xbox. This is not just a "Lefty" or a "Loser" thing to do. A considerable amount of people on these boards do it, and if it wasnt for the weed, I never would have come across RP or opened my mind to that extent to even do the research about his philosophy. Just something you may want to rethink before you start pointing fingers at who is causing problems.

I'm sure a lot of people here do and I've got no problem with what other people want to put in their bodies. But the problem is, that's ALL most people I know do. That just isn't very conducive to getting anywhere in life, or realizing what's going on around you. I feel like I'm surrounded by dumb cattle every day. There's just no getting through to them.

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

yes. a person who gets their money from the government will most likely continue to support that system.
If ObamaCare passes, it could add several million people to the government payroll.

Eh, I wouldn't say this about the military. We have a lot of traditional conservatives (Old Right, Pat Buchanan, Robert Taft, Charles August Lindbergh, types) and Libertarians.

[Lisle16]

The public school system is full of bureaucrats and teachers who indoctrinate youth with their statist propaganda. And the colleges are even worse.

[JeNNiF00F00]

I'm sure a lot of people here do and I've got no problem with what other people want to put in their bodies. But the problem is, that's ALL most people I know do. That just isn't very conducive to getting anywhere in life, or realizing what's going on around you. I feel like I'm surrounded by dumb cattle every day. There's just no getting through to them.

lol You are ignorant then. Those dumb cattle would be dumb cattle no matter what. In fact I think if anything cannabis opens your eyes to whats going on around you. At least it did me. It makes you question EVERYTHING. I don't consider myself a loser either. I have a college education, had a good job up until I got laid off, and am in the process of starting my own business. Don't put everyone in a collective box based on stereotypes and assumptions.

[YumYum]

I feel like I'm surrounded by dumb cattle every day. There's just no getting through to them.

You will never get through to cows high on weed.

[YumYum]

lol You are ignorant then. Those dumb cattle would be dumb cattle no matter what. In fact I think if anything cannabis opens your eyes to whats going on around you. At least it did me. It makes you question EVERYTHING. I don't consider myself a loser either. I have a college education, had a good job up until I got laid off, and am in the process of starting my own business. Don't put everyone in a collective box based on stereotypes and assumptions.

Everyone reacts differently to weed. Some people do well and some don't. It can destroy motivation in some people, and according to my dad who has smoked it, heavy use affects short term memory. I would rather be around someone who is high on pot than someone who is drunk.

[Bman]

Because they haven't had a real job yet and don't understand the relationship between taxation and social programs.


http://janeheller.mlblogs.com/hammer-and-nail_web.jpg

[Vessol]

I'll answer as someone whom was a ignorant socialist youth themselves.

Basically when one first looks at all the political ideologies, it's pretty easy to tell which one is the best when you understand little of history. Socialism plays off of egalitarianism which is easy for any uninformed idiot to fall behind.

This is the simplest reason.

It's not brainwashing by the media or anything. It's just inexperienced kids skimming over politics and finding something that sounds equal and is counterculture.

[TGGRV]

I'll answer as someone whom was a ignorant socialist youth themselves.

Basically when one first looks at all the political ideologies, it's pretty easy to tell which one is the best when you understand little of history. Socialism plays off of egalitarianism which is easy for any uninformed idiot to fall behind.

This is the simplest reason.

It's not brainwashing by the media or anything. It's just inexperienced kids skimming over politics and finding something that sounds equal and is counterculture.
The problem is that the media and educational system isn't explaining what it really is - which is their purpose and the purpose of any person that has any legitimacy to call themselves an intellectual. So yes, it is the media and educational system too because it propagates this system as good and egalitarian, when it is the contrary.

Great post Wampy.

[constituent]

Why are most of the youth brainwashed socialists?

It's because of their parents.

Here's lookin' at you kid.

[eOs]

The problem is that the media and educational system isn't explaining what it really is - which is their purpose and the purpose of any person that has any legitimacy to call themselves an intellectual. So yes, it is the media and educational system too because it propagates this system as good and egalitarian, when it is the contrary.

Great post Wampy.

That's because that is not in the states best interest. This is why the state makes such a bad stakeholder in the education community.

[constituent]

Side point: As well, those who have served in the military have experienced what full and total communism is. They live it. When they leave the military they take with them the ideas of this system back into society and advocate, build and sow this systematic approach to molding human actions in their civilian careers.

Military service is the highest and most potent form of indoctrination and molding of the free man into a mindless serf.

Not that some don't break free, but it's important to note that many of those you mention raise their children the same way.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like children whose parents are/were in the military receive free or reduced medical care, etc. on the bases, correct?

[constituent]

The 60's pop culture's method of being "anti-establishment" was to be communist. Since the U.S. was "capitalist" and we were in a hugely unpopular war, the socialist/communist hippy commune idea was the norm of the counterculture.

Or so reproductions of televised events from the era would have you believe.

Beware Walt Hippyland, it doesn't really exist.



WHEN IN REALITY it could have been, and should have been, a anti-big-government hippy movement. An anti-Fed anti-income tax anti- bureaucracy hippy movement. That would have been way more countercultural.

All the old hippies I knew growing up were exactly as you describe. Of course, I grew up in Texas which might have had something to do with it.

Really, it was the war on drugs that lost the counter-culture. Until the "conservatives" begin to make repealing drug legislation their crusade, the "anti-establisment" crowd will continue to vote with the democrats.

It really is that simple.




But that was a bit too complicated at the time plus there appears to have been some CIA/Ford Foundation type involvement in assisting the leftist subculture. H

Hell, that's what's been going on through almost the entirety of the last decade. Who here remembers "color of change?" What a scam.

[wesguitar23]

I'll answer as someone whom was a ignorant socialist youth themselves.

Basically when one first looks at all the political ideologies, it's pretty easy to tell which one is the best when you understand little of history. Socialism plays off of egalitarianism which is easy for any uninformed idiot to fall behind.

This is the simplest reason.

It's not brainwashing by the media or anything. It's just inexperienced kids skimming over politics and finding something that sounds equal and is counterculture.

I too called myself a socialist, especially during my freshman year of high school (I am a freshman in college now). I was very ignorant of politics and history in general, and was supporting what I thought was "cool".

Sadly, I remember how my mind worked back then; refusing to accept simple historical facts and despising the "evils" of capitalism. I didn't even realize what capitalism really was...

[squarepusher]

ok, im trying to get a good summary of this thread, but dont seem to be getting any big picture ideas. There seems to be a lot of "parents pass it down to children," but we should remember 150 years ago, this socialist mentality certainly didn't exist in this country (to be passed on to the next generation). So what was the ripple that caused the change?

one posted suggested the increase in technology made people not worry about food or shelter, so they got lazy. Is that it?

[anaconda]

ok, im trying to get a good summary of this thread, but dont seem to be getting any big picture ideas. There seems to be a lot of "parents pass it down to children," but we should remember 150 years ago, this socialist mentality certainly didn't exist in this country (to be passed on to the next generation). So what was the ripple that caused the change?

one posted suggested the increase in technology made people not worry about food or shelter, so they got lazy. Is that it?

But I don't think there was much socialist infrastructure breathing down their necks. You wouldn't be finding a trapper and a small farmer discussing the Dept. of Homeland Security or their Federal income tax rates.

[MsDoodahs]

Have not read the thread.

When did the shift start?

In the area where I lived, it seemed to get going in the public schools in the 1980s. Why would this be? Hmmm. Let's see.

60's hippy kids got their degrees, got into positions in the colleges where they could pass on their views to the next generation. At first, their views were tempered by professors who did not share their more left wing, socialist PoV. But slowly, over time, those folks retired and pretty soon - say by about 1980? - those who DISagreed with the liberal socialist agenda were pretty much all retired out of the colleges. Which left the colleges dominated by those with the left wing socialist PoV, and they began passing it on to the kids with zero competition from those who DISagreed with them.

So now you have a scenario where colleges are dominated by left wing social professors who pass their views on to the next group with zero challenge.

Think about what happens when kids that were taught the left wing view with zero disagreement presented get out of college and start looking for work.

They got into every aspect of society - they're in the colleges sure, but they're teaching in the high schools and in the elementary schools - they're in your local government and in your state government and ... on and on it goes.

Now, remember that a teacher cannot teach what a teacher does not know.

Once you have indoctrinated three generations, the opposition is damn near forgotten.

This is where we are today.

We're the damn near forgotten opposition.

[awake]

And when you are born into it... it is pretty hard to see through it.

[awake]

Communism/Socialism is the parental model.Think about it, most every action of a child is manged by the parent(s), all laws that the child is subject to are first created by the parent. As the child grows and learns about the consequences of actions, more freedom is awarded and taken. At a certain age, the child is granted full liberty to stand in the world with his own abilities. From complete control to liberty. Even if the parents are complete tyrants and do not allow this process to take place; time and age eventually forces liberty regardless. So you see, it does begin here, the government wishes to prevent liberty that otherwise would be bestowed naturally.

Once this parental system is taken beyond the family unit, and adopted as a system of societal management, it eventually turns into a prison system.

[YumYum]

Have not read the thread.

When did the shift start?

In the area where I lived, it seemed to get going in the public schools in the 1980s. Why would this be? Hmmm. Let's see.

60's hippy kids got their degrees, got into positions in the colleges where they could pass on their views to the next generation. At first, their views were tempered by professors who did not share their more left wing, socialist PoV. But slowly, over time, those folks retired and pretty soon - say by about 1980? - those who DISagreed with the liberal socialist agenda were pretty much all retired out of the colleges. Which left the colleges dominated by those with the left wing socialist PoV, and they began passing it on to the kids with zero competition from those who DISagreed with them.

So now you have a scenario where colleges are dominated by left wing social professors who pass their views on to the next group with zero challenge.

Think about what happens when kids that were taught the left wing view with zero disagreement presented get out of college and start looking for work.

They got into every aspect of society - they're in the colleges sure, but they're teaching in the high schools and in the elementary schools - they're in your local government and in your state government and ... on and on it goes.

Now, remember that a teacher cannot teach what a teacher does not know.

Once you have indoctrinated three generations, the opposition is damn near forgotten.

This is where we are today.

We're the damn near forgotten opposition.



The socialist movement of the 60's was a backlash to the conservative movement of the 50's. Do you remember the "Ozzie and Harriet Show", and "Leave it to Beaver", and host of other goopy, non-realistic TV shows that portrayed American households as model citizens; devoid of any disfunctionalism? At the same time Americans were being spoon-fed this crap, children were being beaten and molested by alcoholic parents who committed adultery at will. American adults were hypocrites, putting on a phony front in public and being their true selves behind closed doors. Folk singers were quick to point out such hypocrisy, like Bob Dylan, who once said on National TV in the early 60's: "Its lies, man, everything is a lie." Our government banned Rock and Roll by 1960, and gave American youth Annette Funacello and Frankie Avalon, thus compressing freedom of expression and thought. The restricted, plaid skirt wearing, crew cut shaved American youth needed a release from such a strict environment that was enforced by fanatical conservatives out of fear of communism. Black rhythm and blues was off limits to white kids in America, but not in England, and when the Beatles came to America, the suppressed youth of America found their release; in poorly imitated black music performed by young musicians from another land. The Beatles refreshing honesty gave kids the courage to tell their parents to go to Hell.

[awake]

And to further reinforce that this slide into socialism has been married directly to currency debasement; Note the following quote:

"Lenin was certainly right. There is no subtler, no surer means of overturning the existing basis of society than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose." J.M. Keynes

Lenin would be proud to see his proven theroy used and applied with such precision.

[kahless]

The socialist movement of the 60's was a backlash to the conservative movement of the 50's. Do you remember the "Ozzie and Harriet Show", and "Leave it to Beaver", and host of other goopy, non-realistic TV shows that portrayed American households as model citizens; devoid of any disfunctionalism? At the same time Americans were being spoon-fed this crap, children were being beaten and molested by alcoholic parents who committed adultery at will. American adults were hypocrites, putting on a phony front in public and being their true selves behind closed doors. Folk singers were quick to point out such hypocrisy, like Bob Dylan, who once said on National TV in the early 60's: "Its lies, man, everything is a lie." Our government banned Rock and Roll by 1960, and gave American youth Annette Funacello and Frankie Avalon, thus compressing freedom of expression and thought. The restricted, plaid skirt wearing, crew cut shaved American youth needed a release from such a strict environment that was enforced by fanatical conservatives out of fear of communism. Black rhythm and blues was off limits to white kids in America, but not in England, and when the Beatles came to America, the suppressed youth of America found their release; in poorly imitated black music performed by young musicians from another land. The Beatles refreshing honesty gave kids the courage to tell their parents to go to Hell.

^^ was this all sarcasm? "Our government banned Rock and Roll?" Huh?

Maybe some American adults were hypocrits. I grew up in a household much like Leave it to Beaver as well as most of my friends. As far as the hypocrits there is something to be said about those that kept it behind closed doors rather than publicly flaunt their immorality.

Perhaps it is worse now than it was then due to the cultural shift you describe. Today it all depends on the neighboorhood. I know some areas that are still very much like Leave it to Beaver.

[MsDoodahs]

The socialist movement of the 60's was a backlash to the conservative movement of the 50's. Do you remember the "Ozzie and Harriet Show", and "Leave it to Beaver", and host of other goopy, non-realistic TV shows that portrayed American households as model citizens; devoid of any disfunctionalism? At the same time Americans were being spoon-fed this crap, children were being beaten and molested by alcoholic parents who committed adultery at will. American adults were hypocrites, putting on a phony front in public and being their true selves behind closed doors. Folk singers were quick to point out such hypocrisy, like Bob Dylan, who once said on National TV in the early 60's: "Its lies, man, everything is a lie." Our government banned Rock and Roll by 1960, and gave American youth Annette Funacello and Frankie Avalon, thus compressing freedom of expression and thought. The restricted, plaid skirt wearing, crew cut shaved American youth needed a release from such a strict environment that was enforced by fanatical conservatives out of fear of communism. Black rhythm and blues was off limits to white kids in America, but not in England, and when the Beatles came to America, the suppressed youth of America found their release; in poorly imitated black music performed by young musicians from another land. The Beatles refreshing honesty gave kids the courage to tell their parents to go to Hell.

:rolleyes:

Sound as though Yum approves of the slide into socialism...

[YumYum]

:rolleyes:

Sound as though Yum approves of the slide into socialism...

No, but I love the Beatles!:D

[Carson]

The thing that fuels it is fiat money.

When the government wants to manipulate you with an education program, or with guns, they fire up the presses. They print up what ever it takes to get things their way no matter how long it takes.

Not only do they get what they want done but they also stiff you with the bill. Not only are you stiffed with the bill you also get a hidden tax when the money is devalued because of the increased supply.

It has been happening at an accelerated rate for decades.

See the little line go up as the value of the money goes down.


http://photos.imageevent.com/stokeybob/newbegining/2508h-inflationgraph.jpg

In essence they beat us with our own stick.

It has priced us right out of earning a living. We just can't keep up with the zealots.



P.S. Check out what a trillion dollars looks like. (http://www.ptm.org/uni/resources/ptmupdate/032309/conclusion.html)

[constituent]

:rolleyes:

Sound as though Yum approves of the slide into socialism...

Oh get bent. You're "scaring off teh activists," and alienating potential "converts."

[revolutionisnow]

Because the public education system and colleges are full of communists.

[Brett]

Blind faith in authority, listening to their equally dumb parents.

I for one survived a year of US History indoctrination. We learned plenty about how Hoover was an evil free-marketeer and FDR pulled us out of the recession by spending. No mention of the 1920's depression that wasn't, and my teacher seemed like a cheerleader for Teddy's massive expansion of the government.

With our current education system (in Maryland at least) it takes diligent outside reading to correct the wrongs of our schools.