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View Full Version : 76 YO man's tasering nearly causes a riot.




Anti Federalist
09-07-2009, 07:40 PM
This is an update to a story I posted a while back.

Town seethes after cops shock man in parade

Police use Taser on 76-year-old in a dispute about where to end procession

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32662315/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

GLENROCK, Wyo. - Bud Grose seemed like the last person who should attract the attention of police when the 76-year-old retiree hopped on his antique tractor and rumbled through the annual parade in this small Wyoming town.

But what was supposed to be a day of fun at an end-of-summer festival ended abruptly when police shot Grose with a Taser in a dispute about where to end the parade route.

The incident nearly incited a riot as outraged neighbors rushed to his defense. Now residents of this tight-knit town of 2,400 are seething over what they see as police brutality, and town officials are scrambling to ease the tension.

The Glenrock Police Department has placed two of its seven officers on paid administrative leave and hired a consultant to conduct an internal review that began last week. Prosecutors have decided against filing any charges in the Aug. 1 confrontation, and Police Chief Tom Sweet acknowledged the situation has "highly inflamed the community."

‘We're taught to respect the law, not fear it’

"To me it doesn't matter if this was a town of Glenrock's size or New York City. This kind of stuff can't go on," said Grose's son, Mike. "It doesn't matter if there's 10 officers or a thousand, this is just totally unacceptable. We're taught to respect the law, not fear it."

The fracas at the annual Deer Creek Days arose from confusion over whether members of the tractor club could deviate from the parade route shortly before it ended.

Grose wanted to head directly to the town park for a tractor pull like in previous years. But the police department had a different plan, which apparently was not communicated to the tractor drivers.

As a result, Grose encountered a Glenrock officer attempting to direct the tractors along the regular parade route. Grose said he drove around the officer. The officer said he was struck by the tractor and injured his wrist, according to a state review of the incident.

"He, for some reason, said no, and I, for some reason, thought to myself yes," Grose recounted.

The police chief said the officer then chased Grose on foot until a fellow officer joined the pursuit in a police SUV and caught up to Grose's tractor. The police pulled in front of the tractor, and the tractor came to a stop as it bumped the SUV.

That is when the officer shocked Grose with the Taser. Grose eventually managed to pull the tractor around the police SUV and to a parking area down the road. An angry crowd formed as police kept ordering Grose off the tractor. Police did not arrest Bud Grose because of the tension at the scene, Sweet said.

"At the time, it was very close to having a riot right there, and that probably would have created a full-scale riot," Sweet said.

Grose's son, Mike, agreed. "There was some very good people there ready to make some bad choices that would have affected them for the rest of their lives," he said. "That's the point it had gotten to."

‘He should not be regarded as a folk hero’
A lawyer for the two officers issued a statement Monday saying the officer who fired the Taser did so only after Grose "slammed" his tractor into the police SUV, resisted police commands and kept driving.

"They ultimately de-escalated a volatile situation created by Mr. Grose's actions. If anyone violated the law that day, it was Mr. Grose," Casper attorney John Robinson said. "He should not be regarded as a folk hero."

Police fired the Taser five times, according to a state review.

Residents are not letting the matter fade quietly. Mike Grose and his wife have printed T-shirts with a cartoonish drawing of a police officer using a Taser on a tractor driver. The caption reads "If you missed Deer Creek Days 2009, you missed a shocking experience."

The police chief acknowledges that the situation could have been handled differently.

"I think there were some contributing factors on both sides, from the law enforcement side and from Mr. Grose's side that maybe could have prevented some of the problem," Sweet said. "There probably was some better judgment that could have been used by everybody involved."

An estimated 2,000 people were on hand for the parade, which is part of a festival offering cookouts, an art show, street dances, sports tournaments, car races and a Christian revival.

Mike Grose was driving a tractor following his father and managed to catch up to see an officer about to shoot his father with a Taser. Mike Grose said he yelled at the officer not to shock his father because of a heart condition. Bud Grose underwent heart bypass surgery in 2000.

"It hurt like hell," said Bud Grose, who suffered bruising on his left upper body but no serious injuries.

‘It didn't have to come to that’

Brad Jones' 9-year-old son was riding with Bud Grose in the parade, helping steer the tractor. An officer removed the boy from the tractor before Grose was shocked with a Taser.

"I mean this guy's a senior citizen with heart problems, driving a tractor. Whether or not he disobeyed, it didn't have to come to that," Jones said. "If the town don't do something with the officers, I think it's going to be really bad for the town. Our last two council meetings, the whole town is in an uproar."

After reviewing the state Division of Criminal Investigation's report, Converse County Attorney Quentin Richardson said last week that prosecution was not warranted for "any individual involved in the incident."

Bud Grose, who has retained an attorney, said he was relieved by that decision. He said he hopes the police internal investigation comes to the "correct decision."

"I'm a back-row person. I'm not enjoying the attention that I'm getting. It's totally out of character for me," said Grose. "I'm getting a tremendous amount of support from people I've never met before."

Sweet, who joined the Glenrock police in February, said communication will be key to settling the town's nerves.

"There's a lot of distrust now, and I'm relatively new here, but I'm going to have to build that trust back up," Sweet said. "At some point in time, people are just going to have to trust that we are going to do the right thing and take it for what it's worth."

lynnf
09-07-2009, 08:09 PM
tasers = torture


lynnf

Kylie
09-07-2009, 09:22 PM
"At some point in time, people are just going to have to trust that we are going to do the right thing and take it for what it's worth."



UH.....I don't fucking think so. :mad:



If you really feel you are doing the right thing, then you'd better be prepared for the backlash. And trust me....there will be a backlash.

Pericles
09-07-2009, 09:57 PM
This is the core problem in micro.

Big city police departments get away with that because there is too much insulation from a small group of outraged citizens. Not so in a small town.

At most a couple hundred votes (and that is what an incident like this really is politically) changes a small town council and gets the policy that the citizens want.

As you go up the food chain, there are other groups that negate your group, and at most somebody might have to listen to you, but there is some kind of "cover" for not taking actions - gets referred to a commission, or committee, or hide behind some sort of law that they pass to give themselves immunity for "official" actions.

Take it to a national level, and the laws and policies under which we must live are decided by people far away, over which we have no influence.

Lafayette
09-07-2009, 10:26 PM
"There was some very good people there ready to make some bad choices that would have affected them for the rest of their lives," he said. "That's the point it had gotten to."


Sounds to me their some very good people, willing to stand up and do the right thing, weither in affected them for the rest of their lives or not.


Sweet said. "At some point in time, people are just going to have to trust that we are going to do the right thing and take it for what it's worth."

Im gonna taser you in the balls Mr sweet, your just gonna have to trust that im doing the right thing.

PaulaGem
09-07-2009, 10:38 PM
No town council minutes posted since July 13

http://www.glenrock.org/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC={50839642-2075-4210-9492-082E800BDF4F}

No News Releases..

http://www.glenrock.org/index.asp?Type=B_PR&SEC={C97E1B55-500C-415D-A72B-D0D7C34E6BA6}


The Mayor has made a statement...

http://www.glenrock.org/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC={145ACDE9-2EFF-4AD3-89C5-A8D72D1B1513}



Mayor's Statement
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The Town of Glenrock is not taking the incident of August 1, 2009 lightly, however, we cannot take a stand until the state has completed its investigation. No one at the town is happy about the use of a taser on a 76-year old man, nor will we take disciplinary action against a town employee until all facts are in and they have been found guilty of a violation of state law or municipal policy. The town did not call in the state to hide from our responsibility, but to ensure that a proper investigation has been made and that no one can accuse the town of covering up the facts of the case.

I would encourage all citizens of Glenrock to bear with us during this time, and rest assured that we will divulge all facts of this case once it has been finalized."

Steve Cielinski, Mayor

tpreitzel
09-07-2009, 10:58 PM
If you really feel you are doing the right thing, then you'd better be prepared for the backlash. And trust me....there will be a backlash.

100% agreed. Blindly trusting a human is dangerous. Blindly trusting an organization of humans is dangerously foolhardy.

jmdrake
09-07-2009, 11:29 PM
*sarcasm on*

But we don't have all the facts. This could have somehow been justified. Let's hold off saying anything too emotional until the police have done their whitewash...I mean their proper investigation. We wouldn't want one of the family members of the perps...I mean officers to stumble across this forum and be offended.

*sarcasm off*

PaulaGem
09-07-2009, 11:35 PM
*sarcasm on*

But we don't have all the facts. This could have somehow been justified. Let's hold off saying anything too emotional until the police have done their whitewash...I mean their proper investigation. We wouldn't want one of the family members of the perps...I mean officers to stumble across this forum and be offended.

*sarcasm off*

Hon, I just posted a few facts. No judgement - just facts.

On the other thread I was discussing judgement absent facts.

There needs to be a consistent relationship between the two to approach the concept called "justice".

Conza88
09-07-2009, 11:36 PM
This is the type of service you get when you have a government imposed monopoly.

What else did you expect?

Reason
09-08-2009, 12:04 AM
the tazers need to be taken away.

it's too bad, in a perfect world they would only be used in an officers defense,

it's just too easy and too convenient to taze someone,

we all have to admit that it would be tempting even for us to use a tazer in situations that don't fully warrant it,

why get sweaty wresting around with someone when you can just taze em EZ mode,

it all comes down to power corrupting, and absolute power corrupting absolutely,

it's just too much power to put in their hands, they have proven they don't have the responsibility to control themselves

acptulsa
09-08-2009, 06:48 AM
The guy hit a cop in the wrist with an antique tractor? Even assuming that was deliberate, and wasn't a case of the cop being stupid (and I think it's safe to assume this Barney Fife was stupid) how the hell can a LE officer be incapable of outmaneuvering an antique freaking tractor?

And how closely did they whip in in front of it when they cut it off? Something tells me the old man didn't damage his beloved parade piece on purpose. Why do cops just assume anything and everything the public buys them is expendable? Too much Hollywood?

This is a tempest in a teapot, yet it certainly is symptomatic of the ills afflicting the whole nation. And if I were a citizen of that town, I, too, would be very upset that I was paying Barney Fife to sit on his butt in front of a desk. Although, since he's so damned fond of torture, I could see paying him to be waterboarded in the town square until everyone's satisfied he remembers who the boss is...

PaulaGem
09-08-2009, 07:01 AM
the tazers need to be taken away.

it's too bad, in a perfect world they would only be used in an officers defense,

it's just too easy and too convenient to taze someone,

we all have to admit that it would be tempting even for us to use a tazer in situations that don't fully warrant it,

why get sweaty wresting around with someone when you can just taze em EZ mode,

it all comes down to power corrupting, and absolute power corrupting absolutely,

it's just too much power to put in their hands, they have proven they don't have the responsibility to control themselves


Definitely - somehow the cops are getting the idea that it's ok to use them casually - marketing?

I hope Taser is keeping a file of these incidents and trying to cut back on abuse, otherwise there will be an incident at some point that will really get people against them, not to mention the wrongful death lawsuits. The woman in Lafayette who lost her son is suing them.

pcosmar
09-08-2009, 08:39 AM
I hope Taser is keeping a file of these incidents and trying to cut back on abuse, otherwise there will be an incident at some point that will really get people against them, not to mention the wrongful death lawsuits. .

They have a very aggressive legal team. They know how many deaths occurand they cover up every one of them.
It is ALWAYS found to be some other cause than electrocution.

That is how they market it as safe. :(

Anti Federalist
09-08-2009, 10:56 AM
I couldn't get this story off my mind this morning.

If the media report is, in any way, accurate, this is both very encouraging and very cautionary at the same time.

Consider for minute, these people are small town, middle America: they are not some pre-agitated, media ready, rent-a-mob; nor are they a perpetually aggrieved protest class or a bunch of student leftists.

These folks are Mom, apple pie, God Bless the USA, the troops and the boys in blue, gathered together for an antique tractor parade, for fuck's sake.

And if this report is to be believed, these same folks were within inches of stringing these stupid cops right up by their Doc Martens.

You people in law enforcement, you lose this demographic, and you've lost your grip completely. The cautionary tale is addressed to you, keep pushing and you're going to find yourself in an untenable situation very soon.

It's encouraging on my part, that maybe, while I'm continually paraphrasing Capt. John Parker at Lexington Green, "I will not fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin with me", perhaps I'm not alone after all.

Brian4Liberty
09-08-2009, 11:45 AM
tasers = torture


also:

tasers = random death penalty

catdd
09-08-2009, 12:06 PM
I think the cops are being trained to think of us as farm animals like cattle and sheep.
I honestly believe that they have stopped thinking of the public as human beings.
"They get out of line - zap em with the cattle prod."
"If they show signs of being mad - put em down."

Freedom 4 all
09-08-2009, 01:07 PM
There better be some kind of discipline from the state. Rural tight-knit community backlash could mean BIG trouble as it's far harder to politically sweep under the rug than dumbass anarcho-communist college kid backlash. To be quite honest, there's a part of me that kind of hopes it comes to that in this case.

Dark_Horse_Rider
09-08-2009, 01:54 PM
I think the cops are being trained to think of us as farm animals like cattle and sheep these days.
I honestly believe that they have stopped thinking of the public as human beings.
"They get out of line - zap em with the cattle prod."
"If they show signs of being mad - put em down."

Certainly seems that way.

phill4paul
09-08-2009, 02:06 PM
It's encouraging on my part, that maybe, while I'm continually paraphrasing Capt. John Parker at Lexington Green, "I will not fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin with me", perhaps I'm not alone after all.

Far from it Anti-Fed...far from it.

yokna7
09-08-2009, 02:17 PM
The "comfort zone" created by the "non-lethalness" of the taser is frightening. Give a cop a gun and they're not trigger happy, but give a cop an assumed "non-lethal" weapon and it will be used quite frequently. Taser Happy.

constituent
09-08-2009, 04:57 PM
Consider for minute, these people are small town, middle America: they are not some pre-agitated, media ready, rent-a-mob; nor are they a perpetually aggrieved protest class or a bunch of student leftists.

These folks are Mom, apple pie, God Bless the USA, the troops and the boys in blue, gathered together for an antique tractor parade, for fuck's sake.

And if this report is to be believed, these same folks were within inches of stringing these stupid cops right up by their Doc Martens.

You people in law enforcement, you lose this demographic, and you've lost your grip completely. The cautionary tale is addressed to you, keep pushing and you're going to find yourself in an untenable situation very soon.


A good sign, imo.

Great find, thanks.

kahless
09-08-2009, 05:12 PM
Whether this is an incident where the cop just could not let a simple matter go (you are dealing with a 76 old man at parade) or it was simply an accident when the cop over reacted by placing his car in front of the tractor it does not matter. The over reaction was completely uncalled for and criminal. The fact that the cop still has not been placed on suspension means someone is not doing the job like the mayor or police chief who should be removed from those positions at the ballot box.

Amazing that fellow cops or civil servants like the mayor are not outraged by such an over reaction.

Anti Federalist
09-08-2009, 05:38 PM
Far from it Anti-Fed...far from it.

It just seems that way sometimes, I know it's not so.

I'm standing by...;)

Anti Federalist
09-09-2009, 11:13 AM
bump

PaulaGem
09-09-2009, 11:23 AM
They have a very aggressive legal team. They know how many deaths occurand they cover up every one of them.
It is ALWAYS found to be some other cause than electrocution.

That is how they market it as safe. :(

I don't think that will be an option in the Lafayette case. Healthy adult male, early 20's, tasered in the head. Gross abuse, weapon proven to be lethal.

They tried the "heart attack" routine in the early news reports but the lawsuit has been going on for a year or two and they are still a defendant.

I just hope to God the city isn't able to get the case sealed.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2009, 07:47 AM
final bump

Pericles
09-10-2009, 10:41 AM
The story does give us hope - there is a healthy percentage of the population that have a sense of justice and will act on it with proper leadership.

The leadership is the key element - hesitation to be the first to act, but will join right in when it happens.