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muh_roads
08-29-2009, 08:13 AM
In-laws from PA in town (who were very receptive to Ron Paul and voted for him over McCain) yet they still aren't on board fully with the anti-war message or various other libertarian things.

So I'm wondering, what is your advice to best indoctrinate? :D

Freedom to Fascism first?

Then EndGame?

I kinda wanna show Zeitgeist (not addendum)

not sure how close I want to flirt with the edge of the 9/11 stuff though... thinking I should maybe avoid some of that...

pcosmar
08-29-2009, 08:20 AM
Show them this,

YouTube - Two Ron's make a right (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z79T2veZy0Q)

FrankRep
08-29-2009, 08:23 AM
I found this video to be the most effective.

Overview of America

Overview of America - Public Service - DVD (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6732659166933078950)


Buy the CDs. $1.00
http://www.shopjbs.org/index.php/videos/overview-of-america-public-service.html

Golding
08-29-2009, 08:26 AM
Waterboard them. :]

Just realize that some people aren't going to be converted overnight. I recently talked a neoconservative into libertarianism after nearly a year of debates. My parents are Democrats that are receptive to the anti-war and fiscal responsibility principles, but have difficulty accepting that federal regulation isn't nearly as effective as it's touted. Patiently talk about your philosophy when the time is right, offer support for your claims, and they will come around.

The funny thing is that it's actually tougher to talk sense to modern Republicans than it is to modern Democrats. Most Democrats I run into are really conservatives that have no quarter after Bush did such a terrible job.

amy31416
08-29-2009, 08:27 AM
War is a Racket. The video's a bit cheesy, but it gets the point across.

YouTube - War is a Racket by Smedley Butler (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3_EXqJ8f-0)

muh_roads
08-29-2009, 08:33 AM
Waterboard them. :]

Just realize that some people aren't going to be converted overnight. I recently talked a neoconservative into libertarianism after nearly a year of debates. My parents are Democrats that are receptive to the anti-war and fiscal responsibility principles, but have difficulty accepting that federal regulation isn't nearly as effective as it's touted. Patiently talk about your philosophy when the time is right, offer support for your claims, and they will come around.

The funny thing is that it's actually tougher to talk sense to modern Republicans than it is to modern Democrats. Most Democrats I run into are really conservatives that have no quarter after Bush did such a terrible job.

This has been my experience too. Dems were more receptive during the Bush era, but not so much now. I'm finding it easier to convert neocons at the moment because the republicans are dead and they'll embrace anything new.

So when a Dem is in power, go after the republicans. When a republican is in power, go after the dems. You may be able to pick up a few disaffected within the same party of power along the way.

How Paul people won that one Iowa county during their caucus 08 was interesting. It should be observed by all as a method of strategy. They targeted only democrats and ignored neocons.

amy31416
08-29-2009, 08:47 AM
This has been my experience too. Dems were more receptive during the Bush era, but not so much now. I'm finding it easier to convert neocons at the moment because the republicans are dead and they'll embrace anything new.

So when a Dem is in power, go after the republicans. When a republican is in power, go after the dems. You may be able to pick up a few disaffected within the same party of power along the way.

How Paul people won that one Iowa county during their caucus 08 was interesting. It should be observed by all as a method of strategy. They targeted only democrats and ignored neocons.

I find that fiscally conservative Dems are easiest to talk to, especially the few that are pro-2nd Amendment and believe in personal responsibility.

I have a such a hard time talking to most neocons and I believe that's because of my own bias and anger about what they did to our military and our country. So these days I just avoid them because I think I'd do more to alienate them. I'm trying to focus on the Dems who are aware that Obama is screwing them over on all fronts.

max
08-29-2009, 08:51 AM
In-laws from PA in town (who were very receptive to Ron Paul and voted for him over McCain) yet they still aren't on board fully with the anti-war message or various other libertarian things.

So I'm wondering, what is your advice to best indoctrinate? :D

Freedom to Fascism first?

Then EndGame?

I kinda wanna show Zeitgeist (not addendum)

not sure how close I want to flirt with the edge of the 9/11 stuff though... thinking I should maybe avoid some of that...

Try "The Obama Deception" and http://www.TomatoBubble.com

jsu718
08-29-2009, 08:58 AM
Socialized meals. Go out to eat somewhere, order like $500 of food and alcohol, then "split the check". It starts the conversation because they would already see that THAT is ridiculous... then go out in the parking lot and start a fight and make them finish it.

krazy kaju
08-29-2009, 10:10 AM
My question is why would you believe in these absurd conspiracy theories yourself?

If you truly are against the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, why don't you use legitimate arguments, not half-truth conspiracy theories?

If you want to defend Ron Paul's position on foreign interventionism, why don't you investigate Ron Paul's reason for holding the positions he does, not Alex Jones's reasons for supporting Ron Paul?

nayjevin
08-29-2009, 10:15 AM
Videos All Humans Should Watch: http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=CEF643DB141AE35A

Dreamofunity
08-29-2009, 10:59 AM
My question is why would you believe in these absurd conspiracy theories yourself?

If you truly are against the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, why don't you use legitimate arguments, not half-truth conspiracy theories?

If you want to defend Ron Paul's position on foreign interventionism, why don't you investigate Ron Paul's reason for holding the positions he does, not Alex Jones's reasons for supporting Ron Paul?

This. I'd stick with more politics and legitamate/provable reasons for your beliefs and not go with conspiracy theories.

Chieftain1776
08-29-2009, 01:47 PM
In-laws from PA in town (who were very receptive to Ron Paul and voted for him over McCain) yet they still aren't on board fully with the anti-war message or various other libertarian things.

So I'm wondering, what is your advice to best indoctrinate? :D


I'm finishing up Imperial Hubris by Scheuer and Dying to Win by Pape off this list (http://www.campaignforliberty.com/edu/foreign-policy.php) but they're pretty lengthy for an intro. I'd go with Chapter 2 of Revolution for an intro to foreign policy and definately make them aware of the C4L list I linked for future research. Also point them to this video:

YouTube - Unpatriotic Sean Hannity by the Southern Avenger (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYJjdQ3AEGU)

and these quotes (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/2/3/202851/3778) showing how the "conservatives" of today are just b.s.-ing them with their hawkishness now and have turned into total hypocrites. Also inform them of what neocons are (http://www.antiwar.com/orig/lind1.html) and how they opposed (http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/11/opinion/how-reagan-beat-the-neocons.html) Republican stalwarts like Reagan.

On other issues show how someone like Glenn Beck is moving in the libertarian direction (http://www.miamiherald.com/213/story/859624.html) and is all for legalizing pot and is calling himself a libertarian.

YouTube - Glenn Beck: Marijuana Legalized & Taxed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZR0IkyAz8w)

Reason
08-29-2009, 11:49 PM
The most profound and powerful video's you could show them IMO

Part One
http://video.google.com/ (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2798679275960015727)videoplay?doci d=2798679275960015727

Part Two
http://video.google.com/ (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4602171665328041876)videoplay?doci d=4602171665328041876

Part Three
http://video.google.com/ (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2081592330319789254)videoplay?doci d=2081592330319789254

Imperial
08-30-2009, 12:32 AM
Ron Paul's A Foreign Policy of Freedom got me really to jump ship to the crazy side :P

Of course, I had already been anti-war and just hadnt admitted it to myself.

TinCanToNA
08-30-2009, 12:39 AM
Try "The Obama Deception" and http://www.TomatoBubble.com

Yes, The Obama Deception will work :rolleyes:

If you really wish to convert them into some form of liberty-mindedness, show them some Constitutional literature. Either that, or just call everything in the world evil, communist, and all the other exaggerations that go on around here.

Conza88
08-30-2009, 01:07 AM
Socialized meals. Go out to eat somewhere, order like $500 of food and alcohol, then "split the check". It starts the conversation because they would already see that THAT is ridiculous... then go out in the parking lot and start a fight and make them finish it.

Haha... ;)



My question is why would you believe in these absurd conspiracy theories yourself?

Because they are not absurd. And Ron Paul actually does. *If you want to challenge that, please do... I haven't had to post my rebuttals to the coincidence theorists for quite some time. Please note, it's all primary sources... Ron Paul's own words.* ;)


If you truly are against the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, why don't you use legitimate arguments, not half-truth conspiracy theories?

If you want to defend Ron Paul's position on foreign interventionism, why don't you investigate Ron Paul's reason for holding the positions he does, not Alex Jones's reasons for supporting Ron Paul?

This. The media blackout made it as clear as day. The move towards world government is clear as day. But what I realised is, instead of the conspiracies presentation which makes you look like a nut...

You can use the Austrian School of Economics, which is doused in logic and you have 'proof' that is attainable. And you don't sound like a nut when you do. (Depends on presentation, I guess.. lol. Get rid of the state? "You're a nut" :eek: lol...)

Different angles work on different people... just because you came down one path doesn't mean all others are wrong.


In-laws from PA in town (who were very receptive to Ron Paul and voted for him over McCain) yet they still aren't on board fully with the anti-war message or various other libertarian things.

What other things exactly? Need more info, If I'm going to be helpful. :)

Objectivist
08-30-2009, 01:39 AM
I have an outstanding list game you can play with them.

Have them tell you which political ideology or political party is best represented by this list. Don't answer until everyone has had a chance to answer.

Free Healthcare
Racial Quotas
Organic Farming
Gun Control
Abortion
Pensions For The Elderly
Guaranteed Jobs
Alternative Medicine
Big Spending On Education
Remove Religion From Public Policy
Euthanasia
Anti Smoking
Spirituality
Politically Correct Speech
Confiscation Of Inherited Wealth (Taxes)
Animal Rights
Government Authority and Oversight In All Areas Of Life.

Now let them read thru the list and take their answers, on paper preferably.

Conza88
08-30-2009, 02:09 AM
I have an outstanding list game you can play with them.

Have them tell you which political ideology or political party is best represented by this list. Don't answer until everyone has had a chance to answer.

Free Healthcare
Racial Quotas
Organic Farming
Gun Control
Abortion
Pensions For The Elderly
Guaranteed Jobs
Alternative Medicine
Big Spending On Education
Remove Religion From Public Policy
Euthanasia
Anti Smoking
Spirituality
Politically Correct Speech
Confiscation Of Inherited Wealth (Taxes)
Animal Rights
Government Authority and Oversight In All Areas Of Life.

Now let them read thru the list and take their answers, on paper preferably.

National socialism? :confused:

:p

Objectivist
08-30-2009, 02:22 AM
National socialism? :confused:

:p

Stupid people think Democrats usually, but you are not a stupid person.

You'd be correct on that answer Conza.

Conza88
08-30-2009, 02:32 AM
Stupid people think Democrats usually, but you are not a stupid person.

You'd be correct on that answer Conza.

lol thanks. I've got the benefit of not being around for a lot of the propaganda. :o

Anyway, per this thread... these may be helpful.

YouTube - How to Sell Liberty (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_shEnY_lcQI&NR=1)


YouTube - How to Sell Liberty -- Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLFGjeXQuE8)


YouTube - How to Sell Liberty -- Part 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEqVHxZmkNc)

emazur
08-30-2009, 03:36 AM
"Why We Fight"
Documentary – “Why we fight?” (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9219858826421983682)

muh_roads
09-01-2009, 08:56 AM
That JBS video on the front page was a huge success. Freedom to Fascism worked well too. (they could envision RFID as a plausible attempt) The dad is totally on board with the evil federal reserve. I sorta like Zeitgiest because it links the fed reserve to war but i don't know if I want to show that yet.

My biggest hurdles now lie with them still thinking we should support Israel to the fullest and that we still must finish the job in Iraq, we should still go after Iran. They think all of them muslims are just crazy and want to kill us because we're rich and free, etc...

They can't be arsed to read...so any videos out there that use arguments from Imperial Hubris? That would be helpful.

acptulsa
09-01-2009, 09:00 AM
So when a Dem is in power, go after the republicans. When a republican is in power, go after the dems. You may be able to pick up a few disaffected within the same party of power along the way.

I disagree with all but the last part. Everyone's disaffected right now. Everyone. Took 'till they got their asses handed to them for many Republicans to finally see it. Many Democrats needed only the end of Obama's first hundred days.

Everyone's receptive, and getting more so. Go for it!

As for imperialism, I find the best thing for it is to try to get them into our victims' shoes. 'So, they're stealing from us and giving to the rich. Does that mean Putin should invade us and restructure our economy for us? Or would you rather we take care of our own problems?'

Conza88
09-01-2009, 10:22 AM
That JBS video on the front page was a huge success. Freedom to Fascism worked well too. (they could envision RFID as a plausible attempt) The dad is totally on board with the evil federal reserve. I sorta like Zeitgiest because it links the fed reserve to war but i don't know if I want to show that yet.

My biggest hurdles now lie with them still thinking we should support Israel to the fullest and that we still must finish the job in Iraq, we should still go after Iran. They think all of them muslims are just crazy and want to kill us because we're rich and free, etc...

They can't be arsed to read...so any videos out there that use arguments from Imperial Hubris? That would be helpful.

Don't do Zeitgiest. Cus it's wrong and full of fallacies.

Do they do audiobooks?