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View Full Version : Why do people want taxes on drugs?




ClayTrainor
08-18-2009, 06:17 PM
I don't really understand the mentality.

Everytime i find someone in favor of the legalization of drugs, outside of our movement, they tend to believe that taxing it would be necessary if it were to be legal. I would say that 75% of the people in favor of the legalization of pot also favor the taxation of it. It's pretty ironic when you think about how they want to put more money into the pockets of the same people who enforced and created the stupid laws.

I just watched brad pitt on Bill maher and when he started talking about pot he said something along the lines of, "we need to consider the legalization and taxation of it", as if they go hand in hand together.

Why do so many people think there is some sort of benefit to taxing narcotics? What benefits do we get from taxing alcohol, or cigarettes?

How can people possibly think that taxation is a better solution than allowing the market to create jobs and low prices in a competitive marketplace?

This is a very common mentality, and i really don't understand why it's so popular.

heavenlyboy34
08-18-2009, 06:21 PM
They have been indoctrinated via media and government school education to think this way. :(

muh_roads
08-18-2009, 06:21 PM
User fees are fine with me. I just wish they could replace the forceful income tax. It sucks having both.

Government just needs to stop spending so much of our god damn money.

ItsTime
08-18-2009, 06:23 PM
Trained monkeys that think they need their masters permission.

Justin D
08-18-2009, 06:26 PM
Yeah, that whole legalize, then tax mentality turns me off. If illegal drugs are taxed, then that tax money would just be wasted on stupid government projects just like all other tax money is wasted on. Just look at California's financial situation! They have one of the highest tax rates in the US. But, remember, the "Golden State" is now bankrupt. How ironic.

Instead of wasting money, we should just decriminalize, not legalize canabis and narcotics.

jmdrake
08-18-2009, 06:43 PM
Well if you have to pay tax on just about everything else you "own" (food, cars, houses, gasoline, etc) I don't see any reason to exempt drug sales should they become legal. Of course people who grow their own food aren't taxed on it so the same should happen for people who grow their own pot. Ironically if you make your own biodiesal the government wants you to self report and pay taxes on it...but then they'll give you a tax credit if you jump through a bunch of hoops. :(

Zippyjuan
08-18-2009, 06:45 PM
Perhaps we should subsidise them and hand them out for free. If everybody is high it will be easier to control them.

Kotin
08-18-2009, 06:48 PM
its kinda a mixed bag.. some are open to the taxing of drugs because to them, the thought of legalization alone is miraculous or whatever so they are willing to sacrifice to get it... without thinking of the consequences.. its a quid pro quo kinda thing.. its like were saying " you can get a shit load of tax revenue if you legalize"

the person isnt thinking clearly and only sees his/her goal..


and then the others are the people who only want to legalize drugs so the state can get more money..

of the two, you always know who your dealing with though.

amy31416
08-18-2009, 06:51 PM
I think it's also the fact that once a thing is taxed, the gov't gets used to the money and won't even think about making it illegal again.

ChooseLiberty
08-18-2009, 06:54 PM
Think of taxes on weed as a bribe to the system to stop the Drug War.

Currently there are plenty of taxes on weed - they go to ciminal cartels that murder and bribe police and corrupt the criminal justice systems in several countries.

Let them tax it, put the cartels out of business and free up prison space.

Besides, taxes on weed would not be Unconstitutional AFAIK. LOL.

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 07:09 PM
the basic thinking behind that is, folks would rather pay a tax, then court costs and jail time!

now for Colorado, marijuana is cheaper on the black market. then the regulated medical dispensers! should i pay the fees for a medical card and then pay 425-450 an ounce!

or pay 325 for marijuana and worry about a small fine of 100 bucks for having an ounce!

i will pick the later,sooner or later the state of colorado will have to lower the taxes/fees on medical marijuana or they will have a huge customer base that doesn't bother applying for a medical card or buying their over priced marijuana!! i will risk the 100 dollar fine,not cost effective for me to pay all the fees and higher prices!! the market will dictate it eventually with costs!

Bruno
08-18-2009, 07:10 PM
I don't really understand the mentality.

Everytime i find someone in favor of the legalization of drugs, outside of our movement, they tend to believe that taxing it would be necessary if it were to be legal. I would say that 75% of the people in favor of the legalization of pot also favor the taxation of it. It's pretty ironic when you think about how they want to put more money into the pockets of the same people who enforced and created the stupid laws.

I just watched brad pitt on Bill maher and when he started talking about pot he said something along the lines of, "we need to consider the legalization and taxation of it", as if they go hand in hand together.

Why do so many people think there is some sort of benefit to taxing narcotics? What benefits do we get from taxing alcohol, or cigarettes?

How can people possibly think that taxation is a better solution than allowing the market to create jobs and low prices in a competitive marketplace?

This is a very common mentality, and i really don't understand why it's so popular.

because they are outside the movement, or don't smoke/buy their own.

And worse is the high taxes they want to impose due to the "sin tax" mentality. $50 in same cases for an ounce of the good stuff?

The reason cannabis is so pricey is exactly because it is prohibited, we all know that. Were it legal, anyone could grown their own, and the cost would be near zero. Were you not to grow outdoors but indoors, you could still get down to under $20/ounce easily, intial equipment aside. All the rest is currently profit. It has the highest profitability of all illegal drugs.

The prices would have to inevitably come down if it were purely legal.

So, in effect, if you were to grown your own and sell it, theoretically your $100 investment for 10 choice seeds put in the ground and grown by mother nature for free, could cost you $50 ounce for something that you could sell for $10 and still make a great profit.

That's a helluva markup.

Arizona is closer to reality, at least. $10/ounce.

http://www.flyingbuffalo.com/gifs/license.jpg

And check out the Texas Death stamp. wicked. This site is selling the tax stamps to collectors for $15 each for an Arizona stamp that costs 35 cents for a gram. That's ridiculous.

edit: I just read the article and didn't realize they repealed the AZ law, ran out of the original stamps, and no longer offer any. They are only available to collectors. The case that went to court was an interesting one that I followed closely back in mid 1990's. The courts ruled that they couldn't tax a person for something that was illegal, which was to say that by taxing it it became legal. therefore they repealed the law.


If any Ron Paul patriots are interested and you wouldn't resell it, pm me and I would be glad to mail you a souvenier stamp for free. I have five I'd be willing to share.

http://i32.tinypic.com/2nkhsba.jpg

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.flyingbuffalo.com/gifs/license.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.flyingbuffalo.com/stamps.htm&usg=__D5dZhWI7zkm3iuu6Wj9qS_POAAk=&h=438&w=618&sz=396&hl=en&start=4&sig2=AGBInUzDzbWgsOaeXBuJig&um=1&tbnid=oFP7MUKJA8QbLM:&tbnh=96&tbnw=136&prev=/images%3Fq%3Darizona%2Bdrug%2Btax%2Bstamp%26hl%3De n%26rlz%3D1R2GPEA_en%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1&ei=l1KLSuipIIjmM_DlxLkP

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 07:15 PM
Think of taxes on weed as a bribe to the system to stop the Drug War.

Currently there are plenty of taxes on weed - they go to ciminal cartels that murder and bribe police and corrupt the criminal justice systems in several countries.

Let them tax it, put the cartels out of business and free up prison space.

Besides, taxes on weed would not be Unconstitutional AFAIK. LOL.

pretty much bribery! to be honest i careless what laws they pass on marijuana!

nothing the government has done will ever stop my love of brownies and green eggs and ham. when they outlaw common veggies like broccoli(my fav) then i might consider stop eating something safe then most common veggies:) yum yum

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 07:31 PM
We already have MASSIVE taxes on drugs - it's called "regulation".....

-t

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 07:32 PM
oops.... posted before reading - I ment on pharmaceuticals....

knee jerk reaction - sorry....

-t

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 07:39 PM
I remember when the going price was in the $30-45oz range.... guess that dates me.... :(

-t

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 07:56 PM
I remember when the going price was in the $30-45oz range.... guess that dates me.... :(

-t

yeah that sounds like a dream:) you can still get decent bud for around 275-325,(i am sure cheaper with better connections) the mexican crap sucks pretty much(it goes for 75-125 ounce but i would rather try to smoke wet cigs then try to smoke that mexican seedy crap!! (note i do not smoke cigs)

if people in colorado tried to sell the mexican pot. they would be escorted to the border and deported out of colorado:P

i feel sorry for the east coasters who get sold that mexican crap for 100 bucks a quarter in the city and are told it is killer. laughable!!

side note VAPORIZERS RULE:)
if anyone pays 100 bucks for sucky pot. then that is a hint to move to colorado or west:)

torchbearer
08-18-2009, 08:01 PM
I'd rather pay a tax than be thrown in prison.
That's a good start.

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 08:03 PM
because they are outside the movement, or don't smoke/buy their own.

And worse is the high taxes they want to impose due to the "sin tax" mentality. $50 in same cases for an ounce of the good stuff?

The reason cannabis is so pricey is exactly because it is prohibited, we all know that. Were it legal, anyone could grown their own, and the cost would be near zero. Were you not to grow outdoors but indoors, you could still get down to under $20/ounce easily, intial equipment aside. All the rest is currently profit. It has the highest profitability of all illegal drugs.

The prices would have to inevitably come down if it were purely legal.

So, in effect, if you were to grown your own and sell it, theoretically your $100 investment for 10 choice seeds put in the ground and grown by mother nature for free, could cost you $50 ounce for something that you could sell for $10 and still make a great profit.

That's a helluva markup.

Arizona is closer to reality, at least. $10/ounce.

http://www.flyingbuffalo.com/gifs/license.jpg

And check out the Texas Death stamp. wicked. This site is selling the tax stamps to collectors for $15 each for an Arizona stamp that costs 35 cents for a gram. That's ridiculous.

edit: I just read the article and didn't realize they repealed the AZ law, ran out of the original stamps, and no longer offer any. They are only available to collectors. The case that went to court was an interesting one that I followed closely back in mid 1990's. The courts ruled that they couldn't tax a person for something that was illegal, which was to say that by taxing it it became legal. therefore they repealed the law.


If any Ron Paul patriots are interested and you wouldn't resell it, pm me and I would be glad to mail you a souvenier stamp for free. I have five I'd be willing to share.

http://i32.tinypic.com/2nkhsba.jpg

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.flyingbuffalo.com/gifs/license.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.flyingbuffalo.com/stamps.htm&usg=__D5dZhWI7zkm3iuu6Wj9qS_POAAk=&h=438&w=618&sz=396&hl=en&start=4&sig2=AGBInUzDzbWgsOaeXBuJig&um=1&tbnid=oFP7MUKJA8QbLM:&tbnh=96&tbnw=136&prev=/images%3Fq%3Darizona%2Bdrug%2Btax%2Bstamp%26hl%3De n%26rlz%3D1R2GPEA_en%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1&ei=l1KLSuipIIjmM_DlxLkP

i pmed you;) love to get one of those stamps,plus didn't you mention you wanted a good ski/snowboard vacation in the co mtns;)

LibertyRevolution
08-18-2009, 08:04 PM
We are willing to exchange harassment and jail time for taxes.
Its pretty much a bribe that the pot smokers are offering to the government to re-legalize it.
Once it is legal, we will all grow our own to try and avoid the taxes.

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 08:05 PM
Wow - mention drug prices and suddenly this thread really heats up.....

-t

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 08:11 PM
Wow - mention drug prices and suddenly this thread really heats up.....

-t

haha so true. i am sitting at work. thinking dam would be nice to get 60 dollar ounces. i am for growing it as well.

i actually could be a medical provider in colorado. just deciding if the fees and cost are worth the hassle!

marijuana grows on trees around here. hehe no pun intended:)

the medical clinics have great prepared foods,so that might be the deciding factor on getting a medical card for my wife;) but the law is no threat to folks in colorado!

if your popped for marijuana in colorado. then that is probably a minor charge compared to whatever else they charge you with! i am more concerned with getting a speeding ticket. then having an ounce of pot;) things are changing for sure:)

Bruno
08-18-2009, 08:12 PM
We are willing to exchange harassment and jail time for taxes.
Its pretty much a bribe that the pot smokers are offering to the government to re-legalize it.
Once it is legal, we will all grow our own to try and avoid the taxes.

You make a good case for the necessary evil.

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 08:19 PM
haha so true. i am sitting at work. thinking dam would be nice to get 60 dollar ounces. i am for growing it as well.

i actually could be a medical provider in colorado. just deciding if the fees and cost are worth the hassle!

marijuana grows on trees around here. hehe no pun intended:)

the medical clinics have great prepared foods,so that might be the deciding factor on getting a medical card for my wife;) but the law is no threat to folks in colorado!

if your popped for marijuana in colorado. then that is probably a minor charge compared to whatever else they charge you with! i am more concerned with getting a speeding ticket. then having an ounce of pot;) things are changing for sure:)

Friend of mine got popped for possession years ago. The cop was totally cool! - in front of a scale.... "1.02 OZ - that's a felony", takes a pinch and tosses it in the trash... "0.997OZ - that's a misdemeanor...

Wish there were more cops like that....

-t

ClayTrainor
08-18-2009, 08:20 PM
Friend of mine got popped for possession years ago. The cop was totally cool! - in front of a scale.... "1.02 OZ - that's a felony", takes a pinch and tosses it in the trash... "0.997OZ - that's a misdemeanor...

Wish there were more cops like that....

-t

Yea man...

I once had a small amount (3 grams) in my glove box while a cop searched my car. She found it, grabbed the bag, looked at it, put it back and left me alone without saying a dam word about it. It was quite the relief.

Reason
08-18-2009, 08:52 PM
because most people know that the govt loves collecting taxes and they also realize that it will never be legalized without taxing it.

they are just desperate to have it legalized, so desperate they would accept taxation.

Bucjason
08-18-2009, 09:07 PM
Eliminate the income tax , and tax drugs instead .

A perfect way to get the poor to finally pay thier fair share to society:D

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 09:08 PM
Eliminate the income tax , and tax drugs instead .

A perfect way to get the poor to finally pay thier fair share to society:D

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And they would probably save tons of money too!

-t

almantimes2
08-18-2009, 09:09 PM
Eliminate the income tax , and tax drugs instead .

A perfect way to get the poor to finally pay thier fair share to society:D



I seriously hope you don't think that only poor people use drugs.

Epic
08-18-2009, 09:13 PM
they need to realize that prohibition is just a tax of infinity.

So, having a large tax on something may still create black markets and does represent a smaller prohibition.

There are cigarette black markets now because of the high taxes.

Imperial
08-18-2009, 09:16 PM
Taxing it is fine as long as it is a low tax. That way the government still gets some revenue to appease those who fear cutting too many programs and we get a greater degree of freedom.

almantimes2
08-18-2009, 09:21 PM
Taxing it is fine as long as it is a low tax. That way the government still gets some revenue to appease those who fear cutting too many programs and we get a greater degree of freedom.
I suppose I can agree.

But "drugs" is a broad term. Some of the things that are illegal should not be taxed.


And If you want to tax all drugs. Would you be in favor in taxing big macs?

If your going to tax drugs make sure it's shit like cocaine, meth, heroin.

Most certainly not stuff like Marijuana and shrooms.

But if we had a libertarian society anyway the Gov probably isn't going to need all this extra money from drugs

Bruno
08-18-2009, 09:23 PM
I suppose I can agree.

But "drugs" is a broad term. Some of the things that are illegal should not be taxed.


And If you want to tax all drugs. Would you be in favor in taxing big macs?

If your going to tax drugs make sure it's shit like cocaine, meth, heroin.

Most certainly not stuff like Marijuana and shrooms.

But if we had a libertarian society anyway the Gov probably isn't going to need all this extra money from drugs


Mmmm. Shrooms... :)

tangent4ronpaul
08-18-2009, 09:25 PM
they need to realize that prohibition is just a tax of infinity.

So, having a large tax on something may still create black markets and does represent a smaller prohibition.

There are cigarette black markets now because of the high taxes.

NO SHIT! - between state and Fed taxes the price for a pack more than doubled!

-t

BenIsForRon
08-18-2009, 09:31 PM
Friend of mine got popped for possession years ago. The cop was totally cool! - in front of a scale.... "1.02 OZ - that's a felony", takes a pinch and tosses it in the trash... "0.997OZ - that's a misdemeanor...

Wish there were more cops like that....

-t


Yea man...

I once had a small amount (3 grams) in my glove box while a cop searched my car. She found it, grabbed the bag, looked at it, put it back and left me alone without saying a dam word about it. It was quite the relief.

Stories like this give me hope for humanity.

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 09:33 PM
http://www.silversurfervap.com/

the future is now here. if any of you have not tried this. then i urge you to;) smoking marijuana will never be the same for you after you vaporize:)

justinc.1089
08-18-2009, 10:00 PM
I think most people that are in favor of legalizing pot, or a significant portion, want a situation like cigarettes. They don't want people to get in serious trouble, especially like going to jail, over things relating to drugs, but they DO want to discourage them so they want high taxes to theoretically discourage drugs.

speciallyblend
08-18-2009, 10:51 PM
I think most people that are in favor of legalizing pot, or a significant portion, want a situation like cigarettes. They don't want people to get in serious trouble, especially like going to jail, over things relating to drugs, but they DO want to discourage them so they want high taxes to theoretically discourage drugs.

people who smoke cigs need to rethink and QUIT SMOKING CIGS:) ,i mean green eggs and ham,brownies,cookies are better for you then smoking;)

As a Marijuana(Cannabis Sativa) Consumer. I try to deter folks from smoking marijuana and encourage folks to eat it(pick your food). If they legalize it .There will be no need to even smoke marijuana(Cannabis Sativa).
If people are gonna smoke Marijuana. I highly recommend this
http://www.silversurfervap.com/ eliminates 80-90% of the smoke and bad things!

Just say No to Smoking Marijuana and Yes to Vap:) of course remind everyone that marijuana aka Cannabis Sativa is 100% safe to Eat. No Argument, End of Discussion!

PS Final Blow to the anti-marijuana folks, If they truly wanted to stop outdoor growing of female marijuana plants. All they would have to do is legalize industrial hemp. the pollens from these industrial hemp plants if grown on a wide scale would contaminate the female plants and basically turn most into arkansas ditch weed aka BS!!! The Drug War folks are starting to have the rug pulled out from under them. eventually lies come back to bite folks in the ass!!

sorry at work,figured good thread to get that off my chest;)

http://www.silversurfervap.com/

what i want to see is marijuana food at a legal outlet! Kennys Bakery:) mmmmmGOOD;) my first batch would be called RPSP COOKIES RPSP=Ron Paul Special Cookies:)

PS, special note to the gop. Run on Ending the Drug War and stop the lies!!

Brian4Liberty
08-18-2009, 11:06 PM
pretty much bribery!

Exactly.

Bucjason
08-19-2009, 06:28 AM
I seriously hope you don't think that only poor people use drugs.

No...only that it's the only way you'll ever get them to contribute anything to society , lol.

tangent4ronpaul
08-19-2009, 06:54 AM
what i want to see is marijuana food at a legal outlet! Kennys Bakery:) mmmmmGOOD;) my first batch would be called RPSP COOKIES RPSP=Ron Paul Special Cookies:)



Next time RP visites Colo, someone might want to warn RP to give Speciallyblend's chocolate chip cookies a wide birth.... :)

-t

speciallyblend
08-19-2009, 04:37 PM
Next time RP visites Colo, someone might want to warn RP to give Speciallyblend's chocolate chip cookies a wide birth.... :)

-t

when i first met Ron Paul in a wyoming visit. i was so tempted to give him a special cookie,but i also didn't want him to freak out on good cookies:) could you imagine, sorry ron paul had to cancel his republican speaking event, a ron paul supporter gave him a special cookie!

i couldn't live with myself if i made Ron Paul high with cookies:) of course one bite of the cookie and i think Ron paul would of figured it out;)

i was so tempted:)

me and my wife and my friend Kevin were sign waving later in the day by the republican event. guess who stopped and waved to us? Ron Paul . that made my day we were the only ones sign waving to all the republicans at the speaking engagement! we sure were not expecting a van to stop and windows to roll down and have Ron Paul waving at us:) it made our day:)

Ron Paul 2012

Objectivist
08-19-2009, 04:39 PM
They have been indoctrinated via media and government school education to think this way. :(

+1.00

Brainwashing 101

speciallyblend
08-19-2009, 04:43 PM
+1.00

Brainwashing 101

i disagree,most folks would rather pay a small tax. then bs court fees or bs jails!

of course in colorado not as bad as the east coast!! in colorado the fines for marijuana possession are cheaper then the taxes on legal medical marijuana haha!

go figure

marijuana is cheaper on the black market ,then in legal medical dispensaries

marijuana is legal pretty much in colorado. the feds are not going to spend 1000's to get a 100 dollar fine:) eventually it will be legal if they plan to tax it. they will have to drop the price lower then the black market or many will not buy it!!