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View Full Version : Would You Consider This Protected Free Speech?




clb09
08-13-2009, 04:07 PM
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/politics/Death-to-Obama-Sign-Holder-Detained-53134147.html

http://media.nbcwashington.com/images/Death_Sign2.jpg


"Death to Michelle and her two stupid kids."

Mandrik
08-13-2009, 04:08 PM
I'm no lawyer, but that seems to cross the line.

clb09
08-13-2009, 04:09 PM
If you look at the guys hair and the shape of the top of his head...

y'know, I think its...its...GLENN BECK!

__27__
08-13-2009, 04:10 PM
Yes. Do you believe in pre-crime? The person there, while monumentally stupid, has done nothing wrong, has harmed no one. Punishing pre-crime is the fastest slope to loss of liberty.

MsDoodahs
08-13-2009, 04:20 PM
Whether it is legally crossing the line or not, I have no idea. That probably involves whether it is considered a direct threat or not.

As far as my personal view - it isn't a direct threat, and it is protected free speech.

Speech that requires protection is speech that no one (much) agrees with.

If you're saying what everyone else is saying, your speech doesn't require protection.

Mandrik
08-13-2009, 04:25 PM
Like I said, I'm no lawyer. It's a terrible thing to say, but I'm all for protecting the minority view. I just wasn't sure if that's protected speech or not.

Standing Like A Rock
08-13-2009, 04:29 PM
I am no lawyer, but I do not think that it is illegal to wish somebody to die.

He is not saying "I am going to kill Obama" or "We need to kill Obama," but rather that he wants Obama to die. Murder is only one or millions of ways a person can die.

Kregener
08-13-2009, 04:30 PM
He does not say HE wants to kill them...and since we ALL die...eventually...

dr. hfn
08-13-2009, 04:30 PM
anything goes for me. it's like revolutionary iran.

DEATH TO THE TYRANT!

clb09
08-13-2009, 04:37 PM
If you hold up a sign at a rally that says, "Ron Paul For President" It doesn't mean that you will make Ron Paul president.

But it could mean that you will do what you can to make it happen quickly.

InterestedParticipant
08-13-2009, 04:39 PM
I'm going to stand up for this guy's inalienable right to say whatever he wants. As soon as we start to draw lines, we end up quickly moving down a slippery slope on the way toward political correctness.

The way our Constitution is written, the US Government simply does NOT have the power to address an individuals speech in any way. The people simply never gave it to the gov't. There are no limits.

This is something only another individual can address, and they can not do anything that infriinges on this guy's inalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

Flash
08-13-2009, 04:44 PM
The way our Constitution is written, the US Government simply does NOT have the power to address an individuals speech in any way. The people simply never gave it to the gov't. There are no limits.

I always thought laws against slander were kind of violating this.

BillyDkid
08-13-2009, 04:59 PM
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/politics/Death-to-Obama-Sign-Holder-Detained-53134147.html

http://media.nbcwashington.com/images/Death_Sign2.jpgI think ALL speech is protected speech, but that is just me. We should get in trouble for what we do and not what we might do or what we say however attrocious. I think this guy is an asshole, but that is beside the point. I might add that this idea that threatening speech is a crime is a fairly recent development in my lifetime. There is the additional danger of making speech or thought equivalent to action which it simply is not. It tends to make saying someone should die roughly more equivalent to actually killing someone, which they are not.

InterestedParticipant
08-13-2009, 05:02 PM
I always thought laws against slander were kind of violating this.
Slander is infringing on another individuals inalienable right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. So, the gov't steps-in as an arbitrator if the damaged individual takes action against the slanderer. It's a civil matter.

This guy hasn't damaged a public official in any way. What harm has his done by holding up a sign.

You know, when I visited Princeton University one of the professors gave me a little tour, and he showed me the building where the Continental Congress (I think?) barricaded themselves while unpaid solders shot at them because they wanted to get paid. Just look how far we've come.

InterestedParticipant
08-13-2009, 05:04 PM
I think ALL speech is protected speech, but that is just me. We should get in trouble for what we do and not what we might do or what we say however attrocious.
I want to make sure everyone is clear here, but when the term "protected" speech is used, you are using to mean protect by God, right?

For there is no speech that is unprotected. The reason I bring this up is because I want people to be aware of the semantic deception that is used to alter the meaning of various concepts.

Philmanoman
08-13-2009, 05:13 PM
I have no problem with this...

Someone can use their free speech if it bothers them enough and stand next to the guy with a sign that reads

"I hope this man next to me dies"

pcosmar
08-13-2009, 05:21 PM
Hmmm,
A quickly scrawled sign, and a Photo opp,
Mans name not released. Hell the "guy with a gun" was known faster.

We'll see.
I suspect,,,,,,,,:

pcosmar
08-13-2009, 06:04 PM
Ah,
It was a Townhall event.
http://washingtonindependent.com/54885/death-to-obama-sign-pops-up-at-cardin-town-hall

in Hagerstown, Md., where Sen. Ben Cardin (D-Md.) sought to sell the reform strategy for a second straight day.

Greenhouse effect???

RideTheDirt
08-13-2009, 06:11 PM
Doesn't seem to be a direct threat. If it was, Obama has the right to defend himself and should do so.

Son of Freedom
08-13-2009, 06:34 PM
30 hours and counting since his arrest and still no name, smells fishy. Can anyone remember anything of this sort where a name was so long to surface or maybe even never surface? Again, sounds like they're getting ready to use this to set something else up.

SL89
08-13-2009, 07:03 PM
As to answer the OP's question: Short answer yes, long answer yyeess. No direct threat was made nor implied. Wishing or willing a negative fate is NOT a crime.

pcosmar
08-13-2009, 07:05 PM
As to answer the OP's question: Short answer yes, long answer yyeess. No direct threat was made nor implied. Wishing or willing a negative fate is NOT a crime.

Agreed,
Second question. Is this real??

or is it more Greenhouse effect?

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=205306
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=911911&page=1

TER
08-13-2009, 07:18 PM
Is what he did illegal? no.

Should he be watched closely by the federal government and local police authorities? Resounding yes.

pcosmar
08-13-2009, 07:20 PM
Should he be watched closely by the federal government and local police authorities? Resounding yes.

What if he works for that same government and was told to get a photo with that sign? ;)

TER
08-13-2009, 07:25 PM
What if he works for that same government and was told to get a photo with that sign? ;)

Then I would feel even more sorry for this administration if they were aware of this. It's only a matter of time before such skeletons burst open the doors of the closet. Especially when millions around you are starving for work.

pcosmar
08-13-2009, 07:30 PM
Gotta wait for more to come out on this, like the mans Name and who he is.
But with so many "plants"around Obama that "organic gardening" must be paying off.

TER
08-13-2009, 07:32 PM
Gotta wait for more to come out on this, like the mans Name and who he is.
But with so many "plants"around Obama that "organic gardening" must be paying off.

Especially with all the socialist dung he's filling it with...

pcosmar
08-13-2009, 08:08 PM
http://your4state.com/content/fulltext/?cid=75771


This photo was sent to NBC25 by an anonymous source
Really,,

Mullendore says the man was brought to the Sheriff's Department by deputies, but he was never handcuffed at any point to his knowledge.
Curious,,


According to Blackford, the man was not arrested. He was interviewed at the sheriff's office and was allowed to leave after being questioned.

Well, that story raises more questions than it answers.

amy31416
08-13-2009, 08:29 PM
I think that, just like us, if Obama feels threatened, he should call on the local law enforcement or file a suit against him.

I think that people keep forgetting that the president is a person, just like us, and while I recognize that he needs more protection, nobody should have their rights violated in order to allegedly protect someone else, even if that person is the president. Obama should file a restraining order, just like any of us would if someone were carrying a similar threatening sign toward us and our family. He should also consider learning to use a gun if he truly wants protection.