Cosmetic Surgery Questions

[mello]

I was watching the 8/5/09 edition of Freedom Watch & there was something that Peter
Schiff said that maybe we could bring attention to when talking about getting
healthcare back to the free market model where it belongs. Here's the link & the part
with Peter is 30 seconds into it:

YouTube - Part 4: 08/05/2009 Freedom Watch 26 w/ Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Daniel Hannan, Peter Schiff, more (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkB4ZDWEOLA&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Ffreedomwatchonfox%2Ecom%2F2009%2 F08%2F05%2F08052009%2Dfreedom%2Dwatch%2D26%2Dw%2Dr on%2Dpaul%2Drand%2Dpaul%2Ddaniel%2Dhannan%2Dpeter% 2Dschiff%2Dlew%2Drockwell&feature=player_embedded)

He talks about how the prices for cosmetic surgeries like Lasik, breast implants, lypo, etc.
compared from 30 years ago to today are the same or lower & the quality is better. The
reason being is that you can choose the doctor & you have to pay for it since those types
of surgery are not covered by medical insurance.

I was checking online trying to find some info (I started with Lasik) & found this at
Wikipedia:

The LASIK concept was first introduced by Dr. Palliakaris in 1992 to the group of ten surgeons who were selected by the FDA to test the Visx laser at 10 centers in the U.S.
Dr. Palliakaris theorized the benefits of performing PRK after the surface was raised in a layer to be known as a flap performed by the Mikrokeratome developed by Barraquer in 1950. The blending of a flap and PRK became known as LASIK, which is an acronym. It quickly became very popular, since it provided immediate improvements in vision and involved much less pain and discomfort than PRK.

Today, faster lasers, larger spot areas, bladeless flap incisions, intraoperative pachymetry, and wavefront-optimized and -guided techniques have significantly improved the reliability of the procedure compared to that of 1991.

I've been trying to find out how much it cost to get Lasik back in 1991 & today
without much luck. Have any members of the forum had this procedure? If yes, when
did you get it & how much did you pay?

I think it would be a strong talking point for liberty candidates when they talk about
the free market & healthcare.

[max]

I was watching the 8/5/09 edition of Freedom Watch & there was something that Peter
Schiff said that maybe we could bring attention to when talking about getting
healthcare back to the free market model where it belongs. Here's the link & the part
with Peter is 30 seconds into it:

YouTube - Part 4: 08/05/2009 Freedom Watch 26 w/ Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Daniel Hannan, Peter Schiff, more (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkB4ZDWEOLA&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Ffreedomwatchonfox%2Ecom%2F2009%2 F08%2F05%2F08052009%2Dfreedom%2Dwatch%2D26%2Dw%2Dr on%2Dpaul%2Drand%2Dpaul%2Ddaniel%2Dhannan%2Dpeter% 2Dschiff%2Dlew%2Drockwell&feature=player_embedded)

He talks about how the prices for cosmetic surgeries like Lasik, breast implants, lypo, etc.
compared from 30 years ago to today are the same or lower & the quality is better. The
reason being is that you can choose the doctor & you have to pay for it since those types
of surgery are not covered by medical insurance.

I was checking online trying to find some info (I started with Lasik) & found this at
Wikipedia:

The LASIK concept was first introduced by Dr. Palliakaris in 1992 to the group of ten surgeons who were selected by the FDA to test the Visx laser at 10 centers in the U.S.
Dr. Palliakaris theorized the benefits of performing PRK after the surface was raised in a layer to be known as a flap performed by the Mikrokeratome developed by Barraquer in 1950. The blending of a flap and PRK became known as LASIK, which is an acronym. It quickly became very popular, since it provided immediate improvements in vision and involved much less pain and discomfort than PRK.

Today, faster lasers, larger spot areas, bladeless flap incisions, intraoperative pachymetry, and wavefront-optimized and -guided techniques have significantly improved the reliability of the procedure compared to that of 1991.

I've been trying to find out how much it cost to get Lasik back in 1991 & today
without much luck. Have any members of the forum had this procedure? If yes, when
did you get it & how much did you pay?

I think it would be a strong talking point for liberty candidates when they talk about
the free market & healthcare.

wow...great point by schiff..

i work in the hair transplant field as a consultant.....for as little as $5000 a guy with thinning hair can do wonders!....and the prices keep falling as the techniques improve

[mello]

wow...great point by schiff..

i work in the hair transplant field as a consultant.....for as little as $5000 a guy with thinning hair can do wonders!....and the prices keep falling as the techniques improve

Do you know how much hair transplants cost when they first started doing them?

[mello]

I found some price info of Lasik surgery from the late 90's & 2009:

The first LASIK patients in the late 1990s were in the upper class, or upper middle class, and in their early 30s to mid-40s. The market was limited for the elective procedure that at first could range as expensive as $5,000 per eye. The number of younger patients receiving LASIK (in their early to mid-20s) was expected to rise in 2003 and beyond. The number of procedures also was expected to increase as prices continued to stabilize, and surgery centers and physicians offered payment plans.

And Price ranges in 2009:

A report commissioned by AllAboutVision.com from a leading industry analyst was based on results of a survey of refractive surgeons conducted during the first quarter of 2009. Average LASIK costs were:

$2,140 for all laser-based vision correction procedures (including LASIK) in which a single price is quoted.
$1,748 for non-customized LASIK using a bladed instrument (microkeratome) and excimer lasers that are not guided by wavefront analysis.
$2,314 for wavefront-guided LASIK using a laser-created flap.

[TonySutton]

I would not look at Lasik since it is fairly new so it is normal for the price to fall. I would look at breast augmentation and hair transplants. These are 2 procedures which have been around for quite a while and there should be good data on them. You could throw in Lasik at the end and say we are seeing similar improvements.

[mello]

I would not look at Lasik since it is fairly new so it is normal for the price to fall. I would look at breast augmentation and hair transplants. These are 2 procedures which have been around for quite a while and there should be good data on them. You could throw in Lasik at the end and say we are seeing similar improvements.

I found prices for hair transplantations but only current prices, not from the 1950s when
they started to do that procedure:

The cost of hair transplants and hair implants varies depending on the location of the clinic and the expertise of the surgeon. Most hair implant clinics have been located in large US cities but like other medical procedures many other countries are now developing aggressive programs at reduced prices. Prices range from $3 to $7 a graft with 1500 to 4000 individual grafts the norm. This gives a total package cost of $4500 to $20,000 in the US for this hair transplant procedure.

[Mani]

I believe my lasik cost around $4500, that was in 2001. The equipment was still new and the Dr's had to pay for it, and the number of Dr's who had it was limited.

I remember a few years later people were getting it done for as cheap as $800 - $1000 per eye and a bunch of places offered it and nowadays the technology is even better.

Yes, cosmetic surgery is a fantastic example of the free market making things better and less expensive.

Also you'll notice the people at those places are VERY friendly and customer oriented. Unlike some Dr offices where the staff grumbles at you and force you to wait for 2-3 hours.

Hmmm...I wonder why? You think anyone is going to take abuse like that when they are about to spend $5,000- $20,000 on an elective surgery?

No, they will have a nice waiting area, friendly service, and pamper you and make you feel safe and in good hands.

My brother in laws wife had cosmetic surgery done, she was very happy and recommended that surgeon to 2 other people. You don't think that Dr. was happy to have another $10K - $20K in his pocket because of that referral?

It's a totally different ballgame.

[Icymudpuppy]

I had LASIK with the full bladeless flap etc with the latest eye mapping correction instead of the older prescription correction.

It was $1200/eye so $2400 total in April 2005.

Took about 2 minutes for the whole procedure.

I was corrected to 15/20 vision, and never experienced any side effects once the healing was complete which took about 2 weeks.

[mello]

Currently Breast Augmentation cost:

Cost Range: $5,000-$10,000

Average Total Cost : $7,100
Surgeons fee: $4,000
Anesthesiologist: $800
Facility fee: $1,000
Implant fee: $1,300

I haven't been able to find out how much they charged back in 1962 for breast augmentation.

[fr33domfightr]

The fact that insurance companies didn't cover those procedures could by why the prices dropped. With insurance companies in the mix, you have an entity with deep pockets who can AFFORD larger costs. Since they can AFFORD the larger costs, they can AFFORD increases. I think this eventually leads to higher costs.

It would imply we need to do away with insurance companies and let people pay for care out-of-pocket.



FF

[Isaac Bickerstaff]

You do not save any money on health care costs with insurance. Some people will come out ahead because they have health insurance, but that only means that someone else will pay more into the insurance company than he will ever get out. Then there is the money that the company keeps to pay its employees and overhead and CEO bonuses and private jets etc.
If insurance actually helped you, it would not be such a big business. I met one former insurance guy who was able to retire as a millionaire several times over after only five years in the business. The house always wins.

We have found that physicians are willing to work with you if you do not have insurance but are willing to pay, even for procedures that would be otherwise covered by insurance. The people tend to be much nicer, honest, and careful, and the whole staff seems to have fun trying to save you money.:)